Question about the Indian Archers

**russia almighty** · 08-01-2007, 02:13

What social class would they have been in ? They have there two handed iron swords which tells me they have either have some money to spend or was the warrior class in India even the poorer members pampered ?

**abou** · 08-01-2007, 02:20

Don't ask questions. It's unpatriotic.

Heh, just kidding. That's a really good question, actually. We just got an Indian historian on our team recently, but he had to take leave for a few days due to personal reasons. He would know, but offhand I think we based our version on a relief. Keravnos would probably know, but he has been busy lately. Let me see if I can find something within the deep bowels of EBH.

**Spurius Brontosaurus** · 08-01-2007, 05:20

Originally Posted by abou

We just got an Indian historian on our team recently, but he had to take leave for a few days due to personal reasons.

Yeah, but luckily I still have net access

Originally Posted by Russia Almighty

What social class would they have been in ? They have there two handed iron swords which tells me they have either have some money to spend or was the warrior class in India even the poorer members ...

I've just been mucking around trying to help the team for a few days, so Kervanos or someone more knowledgeable may come in with a more reasoned reply. In the mean-time, here's my unofficial 5c.

The Indian armies during the Maurya period had multiple "layers". The core of the army was a professional standing force that was paid from the state treasurey and equipped by the armoury. The second layer were 'sreni' or guilds of professional soldiers (essentially mercenaries) who were also paid by the treasury and had access to top quality equipment. Neither of these two groups had to worry about availability of equipment.

A third layer were 'allied' troops provided by client states or neighbouring tribal areas. These were typically comprised of warriors (ksatriyas or their equivalent social class), who would have to provide for their own weapons (which were often hereditary).

It was only the fourth layer, the territorial levy, who would have come from a spectrum of social classes (including the vysyas = merchants) and had difficulty procuring good equipment. So the vast majority of the army (except during exceptional times when a full strength force of 200,000-600,000 was called up) would be well equipped.

So, to answer your question, two-handed metal swords were more common than you would think. And the archer units formed the core of the infantry. The noble/warrior class (Ksatriyas) believed that archery was the noblest form of warfare and spent a lifetime training in archery.

One more factor to take into account is that good quality metal items were in abundant supply in India during the EB time period (far more so than in Europe). Magadha (modern Bihar/Jarkhand), the capital of the Mauryan empire, was extremely rich in iron ore and had highly sophisticated metallurgical technology. Alexander was presented high quality steel swords when he arrived in India, and Asoka was inscribing some of his edicts on 70 ton (EDIT: That should read 7 tons. Sorry) cast iron pillars that have not rusted in 2,000 years.

Sorry that the explanation is a bit generic, but I don't have my books with me right now

**russia almighty** · 08-01-2007, 08:42

I know , anyone in that period that could have perfected the plate of the Greeks at that time would have been them . I went to a Museum in NY and they had a Tabar from the early Mughal period that looks like it has never rusted .

I know mughal period way out there but I'm commenting on the metallurgy in general .

**Thaatu** · 08-01-2007, 08:51

Holy s##t I got a heart attack the first time I charged those buggers with my general. They flipped out their two-handed machetes and proceeded to hack down the cavalry... and it was the time to "run to de hillz!".

**russia almighty** · 08-01-2007, 09:17

I've got an indian neighbor with a machete like there swords . Loves taking out over grown brush with it .

**Slim_Ghost** · 08-01-2007, 14:39

One more factor to take into account is that good quality metal items were in abundant supply in India during the EB time period (far more so than in Europe). Magadha (modern Bihar/Jarkhand), the capital of the Mauryan empire, was extremely rich in iron ore and had highly sophisticated metallurgical technology. Alexander was presented high quality steel swords when he arrived in India, and Asoka was inscribing some of his edicts on 70 ton (EDIT: That should read 7 tons. Sorry) cast iron pillars that have not rusted in 2,000 years.

EXACTLY!!!That is the point I am making a few posts ago. The Indians have plenty of iron, but why am I not seeing any Indian units with chain mail armor, riding horses and elephants clad in iron?

**keravnos** · 08-01-2007, 14:49

From Bharrut Stuppa in India, approx 150 BCE.

**Foot** · 08-01-2007, 17:18

Originally Posted by Slim_Ghost

EXACTLY!!!That is the point I am making a few posts ago. The Indians have plenty of iron, but why am I not seeing any Indian units with chain mail armor, riding horses and elephants clad in iron?

Because they are not a real faction. We've made indian units who would be available as regionals to factions such as AS and Baktria, but filling out an indian roster is very low down in the list of priorities. EB is still a work in progress.

Foot

**russia almighty** · 08-01-2007, 18:25

I was gonna say I would love to see an armored Indian unit but there are hella important units that are not in that deserve the space more .

Though you got to admit an Archer that could go toe-to-toe with a Marian or Imperial legion would be kickass .

**deuterium_1** · 08-03-2007, 00:08

Originally Posted by russia almighty

What social class would they have been in ? They have there two handed iron swords which tells me they have either have some money to spend or was the warrior class in India even the poorer members pampered ?

This is my first post I would just like to help

I think that the Indian archers were most probably the Kshatriyas(the warrior class in the traditional Indian caste system).Kshatriyas are of a high social class for the traditional ruling class of Hindu kingdoms in India would often also be drawn from this caste.The caste system dates back to the Vedic age.

Also the type of steel that was used in Indian armour from 300BCE onwards was called wootz steel which was prized for its quality and it was also used in monuments such as Ashoka's pillar