No Macedonian Reforms

[darkangel87]

In my Macedonian Campaign I´m now in the year 221BC and still no reforms regarding the Hysteroi Pezhetairoi have occurred. Is this a bug? What can I do to bring the reforms on the way?

Regards Marcel

[MarcusAureliusAntoninus]

They occur when a non-Roma city in Italia upgrades to a Huge City. This happens at different rates depending on what is going on in Italia.

[darkangel87]

The Romans and the Epirotes are battling for the Italian peninsula for many years now and all the cities changed their “owner” several times. I think, that one of these cities must be presently big enough for my reforms.

Regards Marcel

[Bonny]

The Romans and the Epirotes are battling for the Italian peninsula for many years now and all the cities changed their “owner” several times. I think, that one of these cities must be presently big enough for my reforms.

Regards Marcel

that they have changed their owner many times means that there inhabitants had been put to the sword or selled to slavery at least once. Take a spy and look how they are doing. If you want to aktually puch the reforms to happen conquer the region and build up the city on your own, or kill one of the factions involved in the stuiggle (romans / Epirotes) and leave this place, giving the remaining faction a breath to build up theri settlements. I choosed the last one (only accidantely, i wanted to revange my faction heir who was killed by some Epirotian soldiers, and weaked them enough to get conquered by the romans)
and had the Reform happen between 200 and 210 bc. The Hysteroi Unit isn't much better than the Pezhatairoi but has alot bigger recruitment zone.

[gran_guitarra]

So the bid advantage of the Makedonian Reforms is a bigger recruitment zone for your main infantry unit? Sweet!!
Anyway, does the city have to be your own, or can it be any faction's? Are they really worth it, or should I just use Argyraspidai for that (since I'm playing on medium I can recruit a whole bunch of them for my Ten Thousand Bodyguard)?

Oh, did the Saka Reforms get fixed? I've heard that no one has managed to get them to work really. (btw, which other reforms are there? I know the Celts get them, but the only pre-reqs are 220 and 120 BC right?)

EB Team, why did you not make the pre-req for the Makedonian reforms a Huge City in Northern Greece?

[LordCurlyton]

They didn't because they had to tie it to the vanilla Marian Reforms, ergo you're stuck with a non-Roma Italian city reaching Huge size before the Mak reform hits. Though I have a couple of those in my Mak campaign I have shelved away, and as yet I can't seem to find any Hysteroi.

[Swordmaster]

Because the reformed phalanxes were a response to the Roman style of warfare.

[LordCurlyton]

Well that too, and in my case with Rome being dead I guess it might be no Hysteroi for me. Meh, we'll see. I intend on getting back to it eventually.

[Centurio Nixalsverdrus]

Are they really worth it, or should I just use Argyraspidai for that (since I'm playing on medium I can recruit a whole bunch of them for my Ten Thousand Bodyguard)?

They are worth it. They have defence and attack +1, and most notably +2 armour because they wear chain mail instead of a Linothorax.

I think that they are more efficient than Argyraspidai, because these cost almost double as the HysPez and have only +1 in defence. I keep about 20% of my Pezzies Argyraspidai though because of Role Play.

[Tiberius of the Drake]

I was unaware that there are Mak reforms
are they only limited to Maks or can epirotes get them also as Pyrros was Mak king once.

BTW i stillthink their should be Carthaginian reforms.

[AntiochusIII]

I was unaware that there are Mak reforms
are they only limited to Maks or can epirotes get them also as Pyrros was Mak king once.

It's not really a sweeping reform like the Romans' or Celtic ones though. You just get one new unit to "replace" the Pezhetairoi as your main phalanx unit. (Argyraspidai, though great, aren't exactly numerous historically...so spamming them is rather out of the game's spirit even if you could and usually have to do it). The new phalanx unit, the Hysteroi Pezhetairoi, is slightly better than the normal Pezhetairoi but with a much, much bigger recruitment zone. You can recruit them just about everywhere.

I think the unit is Macedonian-exclusive.

Of Carthage's reform...does the EB team intend to do the same thing (using vanilla Marian triggers and all) for certain high-end Carthaginian units like the "Hannibal" ones (African infantry et al)? It's quite curious that Carthaginian Polybian-like troops would run around hunting down the poor Romans stuck in the Camillan military era still (though I like it, poetic justice ha!).

[The Errant]

I was unaware that there are Mak reforms
are they only limited to Maks or can epirotes get them also as Pyrros was Mak king once.

BTW i stillthink their should be Carthaginian reforms.

No they are currently limited to the Maks.

It's not like the Epirotes need them. The Chaenion Agema is one of the few units already in the game that can take a Marian Legion head on. Combine that with some elephants charging the Marians in the back and nothing will stand in the way of Epirote domination.

The next build of EB will give them access to some interesting troops. Including some reagionals that will turn Marians into mincemeat.

[Ludens]

IIRC there was an error in the Hysteroi pezhetairoi armour value, making it somewhat less effictive than it should be. The correct armour value is 12. They are are only available to Macedon.

Of Carthage's reform...does the EB team intend to do the same thing (using vanilla Marian triggers and all) for certain high-end Carthaginian units like the "Hannibal" ones (African infantry et al)? It's quite curious that Carthaginian Polybian-like troops would run around hunting down the poor Romans stuck in the Camillan military era still (though I like it, poetic justice ha!).

IIRC the team planned to include a Carthaginian reform, but I am not entirely sure. A similar reform would make Hysteroi pezhetairoi and thorakitai argyraspidai available.

[Liberator]

1.When will reforms occure? At the point when there is a huge city or when the romans had polybian reforms?

2.Do I have to upgrade recruitment buildings, too?

3.Is there no reform if the romans would be eliminated? (a more theoretical question )

[MarcusAureliusAntoninus]

Yes.
No.
As long as somebody (even the rebels) upgrades to Huge City in Italy, then the reforms will come.

[russia almighty]

Does the city in Italy have to be roman controlled or can you be Make , own a city there and get the reforms anyway?

[Foot]

Does the city in Italy have to be roman controlled or can you be Make , own a city there and get the reforms anyway?

is answered by:

As long as somebody (even the rebels) upgrades to Huge City in Italy, then the reforms will come.

Foot

[Morte66]

Do Patavium/Mediolanum/Bononia (which start with barbarian culture) and Rhegion/Taras (Greek) count as "Italia" for the purposes of this reform trigger?

[MarcusAureliusAntoninus]

I just checked and was suprised. Taras and Rhegion aren't even part of it. You need a imperial palace in Arretium, Ariminum, Capua, Arpi, or Roma. (And Roma may not work.) So, it will probably be Capua, unless Epirus conquers and exterminates it, as they often do.

[Morte66]

You need a imperial palace in Arretium, Ariminum, Capua, Arpi, or Roma. (And Roma may not work.) So, it will probably be Capua, unless Epirus conquers and exterminates it, as they often do.

Or one could conquer Italy and grow those cities...

Hmm, so my Arverni's diligent management of their new territories in Italia will gift the Maks a recruiting enhancement. And they'll probably be the next bunch of optimists to attack me (unprovoked) once I deal with the Epeirote aggression. I don't know what it is with these daft southerners, a spot of sensible Gallic government will do them good.

[Liberator]

I just checked and was suprised. Taras and Rhegion aren't even part of it. You need a imperial palace in Arretium, Ariminum, Capua, Arpi, or Roma. (And Roma may not work.) So, it will probably be Capua, unless Epirus conquers and exterminates it, as they often do.

I think Roma doesn't work. Its huge since 240 in my campain and I still had no reforms (220 now!); looks like I have to do this on my own as I conquered Taras and Arpi now. But reforms may still come "too late" for me as I have already 38 regions