Next-generation pointing device for PC

[Bijo]

This would apply to both gaming and non-gaming purposes.

Other than a mouse, what will or could be a significant improvement and what would this device actually be?

When using a mouse (and a keyboard simultaneously) I sometimes have the urge to lift up the mouse and hold it in the air, sometimes as close to me as possible to reduce chance of arm or hand injury and apply minimal movement for effectivity.

I think something in the direction of a Wii controller is to be developed for the PC, but perhaps the "aiming system" should maintain normal mouse movement (and possibly include specific aiming/pointing).

What I'm saying is it should not be precisely like a Wii controller in function (-- or perhaps it should --) but more like some kind of cordless "air mouse" that fits well in the hand and suits ambidextrous usage. If it regards gaming, the keyboard would be either used by the left or right hand.

[Husar]

I don't know why, I'm comfortable with a mouse, why would you want three dimensions to move a pointer on a two dimensional screen? It also sounds a bit more inaccurate than a normal mouse.

[Bijo]

Short answer: comfort.


The conventional mouse has been a splendid device, but it provides me with too much pain in the arm and hand occasionally. Silly ways are mostly ineffective in combatting these injuries while using a mouse. An improved mouse that is held in the air and which is developed for ultimate comfort and ease (naturally with freedom of movement) would make for an even greater apparatus.

Optical and laser technology are fine and dandy, but the mouse's basis is too much of the same. A cordless mouse-like apparatus that is held in the air would be a splendid improvement and would allow its users to utilize the device in a position they feel comfortable in and gives the least injury.

[Togakure]

A bit off-topic, but based on what you wrote I thought this would be worth writing:

Pain in your arm and hand is a bad sign. Placement of keyboard and mouse should be such that your arms fall naturally on them, directly in front of you, with no bend at the wrist. Your wrists should be in line with your forearms. Ignoring the pain and angle can lead to carpal tunnel syndrome--definitely not desireable for an avid computer user and gamer. For proper positioning, imagine the way pianists' arms and hands are positioned when playing.

While on the subject of ergonomics, the height of one's seat is also very important in regard to the lower back. Thighs should be parallel to the ground, and the knees level of slightly higher, not lower. That's why they make those weird swiveling things you can put on the floor to rest your feet on. I used one of those on the job and it made a huge difference.

Regarding neck pain, a monitor should be placed directly in front of you and high enough that your head does not tilt down or up. The screen should be an arms-length in front of you from a sitting position.

While employed by the government as a software applications developer, I had to attend three full days of ergonomics training (one day would have been fine, but you know how they like to waste tax payer money). I've been practicing these tips for years now, and haven't had any issues despite working on computers frequently, for extended periods of time.

[Husar]

Well, I made sure I have plenty of space on my Pc table so I can sit quite comfortably. And I think since I got my ultra sensitive Razer mouse there's not much pain anymore when moving it, probably because I hardly move my hand anymore. Also make sure to take some breaks. I think a device held in the air would have other problems like tiring your arm completely etc.

[Bijo]

I was never good at ergonomics of computer use. Thanks for the advice, Masamune.


---


Regarding the apparatus, if it is perfectly developed and obviously allows greater free movement a user can naturally decide a comfortable position. I could lay back in my chair, keep my arm and hand close to my belly, for example, and make only minimal finetuned movements to move the cursor. I could even sit and rest/hang my mouse-wielding arm over the chair's side support down and move the device in a most satisfactory manner.

So much technological advance but not yet a perfect pointing device whose creation is indeed possible. Hah. Perhaps I should await the perfection of the Wiimote on the PC.

[Somebody Else]

What about them glovey things?

[Bijo]

Fascinating. This appears like something which I had in mind. My idea was more like a ball of some sort, but a glove-like device is even better. Interesting.

[The Spartan (Returns)]

Well lot's of times I have to reposition the mouse to the middle of my pad so it doesnt get off the map.

Now if there was something that resolves this problem...

[Husar]

Higher sensitivity, like I said, needs a bit of time to get used to it, but you could also increase it in steps to get used to it. A good mouse helps of course.

[Slug For A Butt]

Unfortunately, I think playing TW for 4 hours with your arm waving in the air would be a little less comfortable than using a mouse. At least your arm is resting on the desktop when you are using a mouse, try holding your arm in the air for 15 minutes and then tell me you want to control TW like this.

[Bijo]

Unfortunately, I think playing TW for 4 hours with your arm waving in the air would be a little less comfortable than using a mouse. At least your arm is resting on the desktop when you are using a mouse, try holding your arm in the air for 15 minutes and then tell me you want to control TW like this.

It is regrettable to point out the probability of you having misunderstood the intention is high ;)

What if one is sitting back and holding the apparatus in his hand as his arm is lazily hanging down? Is it not resting too then?

[Marius Dynamite]

My arm is always rested when I use my mouse and because its a laser mouse the movements needed to get the pointer from one end of the screen to the other is minimal. Infact I barely move my wrist, mostly I can move with my pinky and thumb with the other fingers clicking - scrolling - clicking while also fine tuning the movement.

My mouse is on a mat on the computer table, my Keyboard underneath on a board which can be pulled out and my moniter on a raised section of the table, so my eyes are level with the middle of the screen. Having the mouse on the desktop on its own (except for the Router) I can put my entire elbow on the table so it's always rested. My left hand is on the keyboard. Actually, I would look like a left handed Roman soldiers, with my right hand holding the shield and my left lower down with a gladius :) It's very comfortable, but reading Masamunes post about ergonomics, well..

EDIT:

It is regrettable to point out the probability of you having misunderstood the intention is high ;)

What if one is sitting back and holding the apparatus in his hand as his arm is lazily hanging down? Is it not resting too then?

I think it's reasonable to say that the majority of people won't be sitting with their arm hanging lazily while they play a competitive game. Many people lean forward, grasp the mouse tightly and rapidly tap buttons which reveal troop movement! With a remote in 3d in a RTS, the effect is lost!

[Togakure]

Main thing is to keep wrists in line with forearms., not bent Tendons don't do well over extended periods of time if the wrist is bent. What you described doesn't sound bad.

[Slug For A Butt]

Inventive idea Bijo, but I just think it's a bad one for a PC format
The sort of games that the PC excels at are just not conducive to this sort of 3 dimensional "air" controller I think. Maybe OK if you are playing a game of Wii tennis or FPS in small doses, but I think most people would struggle with a Diablo/TW/Civ kind of game... me included.

[Stig]

What about a Nintendo DS like touchscreen for the PC.
Imo something like that would be better than a mouse anyway, especially for games

[Husar]

And how do you right click or double click on a touchscreen?
And what about holding your arm up for hours only to touch the screen?

[Stig]

Double tap, right click can be holding it down longer, properly pressing.


And the Touchscreen won't be the monitor, more like a tablet.

[Husar]

You mean like those notebook things only bigger? I hate them and holding longer for a right click is no option because then you can't make a long left click in shooters for example.

[Stig]

Well the Nintendo DS is a succes, I love it, works great

[Nakamura Lobato]

Have you seen this: http://home.novint.com/

The falcon has been used in medical/surgical simulations and now has driversfor some games. There are plansto use it for Second Life in order to make the virtual reality more immersive. The device has tactile feedback so that you can feel the edges and surface of the virtual objects. Things can be made to feel slippery or gritty.By shaping the input handle, the deice is now used to teach about intubations to med students. You gain the ability to feel things in space like the depth to reach for something or the physical dimensions of objects.

NL

[doc_bean]

Touchscreens are getting pretty good and pretty common in some 'professional' applications. They're also quite natural, since you actually touch what you want instead of using an indirect device like a mouse.

The next step is controlling a computer with just your mind of course...

[Fragony]

And what about holding your arm up for hours only to touch the screen?

Friend of mine does that 60 hours a week, no complaints. Touchscreen works great. Much better then mouse actually, faster and more intuitive.