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Stories like this make my blood boil. The concept of sending a troubled child to a boot camp is a little iffy in the first place, especially when such camps are not regulated in any meaningful way.

Here's the ugliness:


Here's the camp's web site, which may or may not crash your browser.

A couple of questions for my fellow Orgahs: Is it possible my tax dollars went to support this camp? I'm worried about the Faith Based Initiatives, and the haphazard way the money's been sloshed about. I would be outraged if this group received Federal money.

Secondly, is there any mechanism for keeping an eye on these boot camps for kids? In theory, they sound fine, but the potential for abuse is so high, I just don't know about them. Troubled, misbehaving kids, taken away from all parental supervision, put under the care of adults who may or may not be psychotic ... I just don't know.

I rather doubt those places get Fed money, although Texas state might contribute - and the original source of tHAT money could be Federal. I pulled this quotation from another camp website:

So if it's an overnight/resident camp, a Texas bureau does monitor it. Most of the websites I've visited for Texas summer camps (Man, there are lots of faith-based ones) proudly proclaim their licensed, state-monitored status. Not so "Love Demonstrated Ministries" camp website.

Another local report "http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20219073/, addresses LDM camp's parental consent form, including the phrase:

Who would sign such a document?

edit: crap; that link went 404 just after I wrote this. Maybe it'll be up again later. Sorry.

The whole idea of a "Christian" boot camp sounds dangerous, sounds like an Al-Qaida training camp to me.
So true

It bothers me as well, as I'm not keen on religion. Faith? Yes. Belief? Yes. Religion? No.

The idea of religious camps is not one I'm fond of, for social and theological religions.

That said, "Brat Camp" is a television show over here where troubled teenages are sent to a "Boot Camp" in America for eight weeks or so to straighten them out. It seems to work, but then so would national service.

They showed Brat Camp here in the U.S. as well. It certainly looked effective, but everyone would be on their best behavior for the TV cameras, now wouldn't they? I'm still ambivalent about boot camps for kids. All it would take is one psycho to make the whole thing a nightmarish exercise in child endangerment.

True, but there's also a thing "Bad Lads Army" where some undesirables are put through 12 weeks of 1950's National Service training. At the end of that a lot of them join straight up. One guy actually said he had to get into the army before he slipped back into his old ways.

Of course, there were also a couple of guys who beat up their fellow recruits and were ejected after a stay in the guard room.

Btw, Lemur, comiserations. The new avater is freaky as well.

My guess is that the girl is just fine, suffered no real injuries, and is a crybaby.

EDIT: That said, who would drag a trainee behind a truck on a rope? There are easier ways to break someone's will.

It sounds like an oxymoron (not much room for forgiveness in a boot camp), but I can't see why it sounds like a terrorist training camp. Is it the Christian bit or the boot camp bit or just a prejudice that all religious people are the same?

Seems doubtful at the moment. Unless you were using sarcasm, and forgot your [sarcasm] tag ...

It's outrageous that such people call themselves Christians.

And I don't like the idea of bootcamps either.

Lemur's a moderator? Woah! When did this curse fall upon us? Congrats!

Just because a few rogue employees are criminals does not mean all outreach programs are crooked.

Your reservations are reasonable. Sometimes these programs can be incredible helpful, and other times they can be sheer horror if the program is not properly ran.

I would agree with standards of oversight on this for sure. I am personally familiar with an incident at North Star that ended in a students death.

No cause for worry, my purview is far from the Backroom, so I can go on posting outrageous stories back here for the foreseeable future. I might have to chill a little if they ever asked me to moderate the Backroom, but with any luck that won't happen.
When I used the word "haphazard," I wasn't trying to imply that every faith-based initiative is a crooked op with a P.O. Box at Kinkos. But after reading David Kuo's account of how the Religious Right Placation Program was run in the White House, I'm painfully aware of how little oversight and accountability there is in that honey pot.
I guess that gets to the root of my reservations. Without some sort of oversight, however onerous that might prove, these boot camps seem like a disaster waiting to happen. Adults can say "no" to an unreasonable request, whatever the setting. Teens are subject to in loco parentis, and that means they have no real protection from an insane boot camp counselor. Just seems ... dangerous. More than the usual run-of-the-mill dangerous.

Some parents are at the end of their ropes with kids.
They can't deal with them and the idea of a
Christian (good moral values) + Boot Camp (rough and disciplined) is an appealing option.

While I am not defending the camp counselors. I'm saying that this is the last option to resurrect their bad parenting and it is boot camp. They figure that anything with that kinda clause is simply for protection and not so that camp counselors can drag a girl behind the car.

The parents should have done a simple search to see if there was oversight, or some form of governmental review. It is bad parenting and no review of their options. To me it seems like a 'Trojan Horse' scam. They slap 'Christian' and 'Boot Camp' onto a camp, run them like a gulag, then collect for the intense workout.

If her injuries were so serious, then how come they aren't listed? I'll tell you why-- because they are boo-boos. Light to mid-grade boo-boos.

Not that this excuses the dragging behind a truck in general.

The combination of the two. Muslim Terrorist Training Camps are nothing more than Muslim Boot Camps.

It's amazing how far some people will go to defend something this bad just because it has "Christian" tagged on it.

Jesus Christ (pun intended), what's wrong with you people?

Not according to the accepted definition of boot camps they aren't. Muslim Training camps are attended volutarily by all sorts of young Muslim men often well-behaved ones whose later involvement in atrocities baffles friends and family. Boot camps have an element coercion and correction. Or putting it another way, the people in the camp mentioned in the article may be un-Christian and cruel and unfit to woark with children but I doubt they are training the inmates to participate in terrorists attacks.

You don't have to be a terrorist to be dangerous.
Personally I think fundamentalistic Christians are more dangerous than suicide bombers. I see fundamentalists every day, I've never seen a suicide bomber.

What exactly is a boot camp in this context? I thought boot camp had to do with the military?

Horrible that anyone can get the idea to drag someone behind a car, the potential for serious or lethal injury is huge, not to mention that it's almost certain it will cause aesthetical damaged with ruined skin in the face and on the body. The dangerous and deep skin damages that can occur can likely give huge scars or prevent the skin from ever growing out again, or cause cancer. So this was supposed to be done to a little girl by grown up human beings, if we can call them that, who were entrusted to take proper care of this girl?

And this is the part of the article that made me most shocked: the enforcing of cadavre discipline and blind obedience on a 15 year old girl , calling her disobedient when she's not physically strong enough to run as fast as they order her to! To punish the girl for that is pure sadism, to break her down mentally, and turning an innocent little girl into a mindless obedient zoombie, a mental slave who thinks of herself as useless, both the prerequisite for dictatorship and psychological despotism, and very similar to the methods employed by violent husbands in breaking down their wives.

Is the purpose of this boot camp to brainwash little girls into blind obedience towards whatever group leads these camps, and low self-esteem and fear, and/or push her into a career of crime? It's purpose surely can't be to bring any positive things or help to these girls in any way Whichever groups control these camps probably should be monitored by the FBI or similar, as such type of brainwashing camps might very well behind them have political bodies with an ambition to claim power through a coup.

This ''camp'' looks diplorable if that is what they do to those who fall behind, the very idea of ''punishing'' people is counter christian

I agree, such a camp isn't Christian. A Christian would not send a way an own child to a sadist camp for "undesirables" because the child doesn't live up to the parents' (often too high) expectations, but instead:
1. think of how to become a better parent
2. not demonize the own child as undesirable or evil, but analyze what his/her faults are, and try to lead the child off those paths, while also rewarding the child for the things the child does well
3. making the child feel content and satisfied about being morally neutral (i.e. neither good nor evil), as that's better than most human beings ever become anyway during a lifetime. Not just punishing "sins", but also forgiving them, and rewarding neutral and good behaviors. Especially rememeber to reward neutral behavior. A child that feels content with moral neutrality, tends to eventually manage go further than neutrality, as opposed to children who feel stressed and insufficient when merely being capable of making up for all his/her evilness by good, who often descend into evilness when they come to the realization that nothing they can do will ever make them good enough.
4. not show double moral standards
5. show love to the child

This camp represents the opposite of this in all ways: conveniently for the parents explaining away all the faults of the parent as being errors of the child, demonizing the child as undesirable and evil, and punishing moral neutral actions and other things which are not sins, showing double standards by committing brutal sins towards the child (as the car dragging) and still expecting the child to not become sinful, and replacing love for the child by contempt and hate.

You make it sounds as if a Muslim or a Hindu would do that

Oh yes, those nuts telling us the end of the world is coming are far more dangerous than the one's that are actually trying to end the world. You're a real mental giant.

There are a few posters defending the camp because it sets a bad name to Christianity.
While many of you may scoff about Christianity and how bad it is, ruining teen minds and all that, sometimes these things are fringe elements.

Suicide bombers aren't a trend in Islamic studies. Not everyone appreciates or approves of suicide bombing. To say that all Muslim Boot Camps are 'Islamic training grounds' is ridiculous to the extreme. Some might be but on the whole most religious camps try to provide an enlightening and faith-filled experience.

You shouldn't kill a herd because one injured the farmer. Or because the cow had 'Foot and Mouth' (except in UK of course.)

Is the point to make disruptive children responsable citizens? Or, to torture them into being good christians?

A better idea:
http://www.youthranches.org/

Give them honest-hard work and responsability - that works. Harassment serves no purpose, except to punish.

That is what the parents probably thought they were doing. They expected a hard-working, god-loving, faith and work oriented work camp. They didn't research or read the fine print, and this is the result.

Long Live Texas? ...hmmmmm *scratches goatee*

How big is the chance a suicide bomber will hit me? About as big as the world ending tomorrow I think.

What did christian fundamentalists ever do to you?

You see? Christianity is evil


Anyway, I concur with most what Legio said.

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