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Thread: Goofs in HBO's Rome Season 1

  1. #1
    Βασιλευς και Αυτοκρατωρ Αρχης Member Centurio Nixalsverdrus's Avatar
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    Default Goofs in HBO's Rome Season 1

    In Germany the first season of HBO's Rome has just finished, and I wondered about a few things which seem a bit strange to me.

    1. In some of the episodes, Titus Pullo wears a grey tunica with an eagle printed on it, a bit like the t-shirts that are often worn by american soldiers saying "ARMY". I think it's highly unlikely that SPQR would have payed to fabricate such an underwear cloth for its soldiers. Am I wrong?

    2. In the penultimate episode, Pullo is obviously incarcerated (does that word exist?) in the Carcer Tullianum. Is it normal for ordinary criminals to get there?

    3. What is the tiny arena where his death-sentence is to take place? Pure fantasy?

    4. In the same episode, Pullo hacks of limbs of his opponents. This is often depicted in movies. I would imagine that it is very hard to actually cut of one's limbs with such a sword. I mean there are two massive bones inside, so isn't it a bit exaggerated? The same goes for decapitating with a shield.

    5. Lucius Vorenus jumps in and saves his friend. Why does nobody hinder him? And especially, why can he take him out of the arena without problems? There were guards standing at the entrance.

    6. To the abundance of sexuality displayed in almost all episodes (very surprising for an American tv-series, btw), was it really common that the people let their slaves stay in the room to watch them mating?

    7. How could Servilia know of Vorenus' wife's adultery?

    8. In the scenes of Caesar's triumph, there are trumpeters in the marching column. Do these trumpets really have such a strange sound? It's barely hearable.

    9. At the same triumph, there are flags all over the place. Did the Romans really use flags in such size and number? I recognized that the eagle-symbol on it resembles the Romani-symbol of EB, but with a black core. Is that historical or just some abstruse resemblance to Indiana Jones' Nazi-parade?

    Well, I'd be very glad if someone could answer some of my questions.
    Last edited by Centurio Nixalsverdrus; 08-13-2007 at 18:11.

  2. #2

    Default Re: Goofs in HBO's Rome Season 1

    Quote Originally Posted by Centurio Nixalsverdrus
    In Germany the first season of HBO's Rome has just finished, and I wondered about a few things which seem a bit strange to me.

    1. In some of the episodes, Titus Pullo wears a grey tunica with an eagle printed on it, a bit like the t-shirts that are often worn by american soldiers saying "ARMY". I think it's highly unlikely that SPQR would have payed to fabricate such an underwear cloth for its soldiers. Am I wrong?

    2. In the penultimate episode, Pullo is obviously incarcerated (does that word exist?) in the Carcer Tullianum. Is it normal for ordinary criminals to get there?

    3. What is the tiny arena where his death-sentence is to take place? Pure fantasy?

    4. In the same episode, Pullo hacks of limbs of his opponents. This is often depicted in movies. I would imagine that it is very hard to actually cut of one's limbs with such a sword. I mean there are two massive bones inside, so isn't it a bit exaggerated? The same goes for decapitating with a shield.

    5. Lucius Vorenus jumps in and saves his friend. Why does nobody hinder him? And especially, why can he take him out of the arena without problems? There were guards standing at the entrance.

    6. To the abundance of sexuality displayed in almost all episodes (very surprising for an American tv-series, btw), was it really common that the people let their slaves stay in the room to watch them mating?

    7. How could Servilia know of Vorenus' wife's adultery?

    8. In the scenes of Caesar's triumph, there are trumpeters in the marching column. Do these trumpets really have such a strange sound? It's barely hearable.

    9. At the same triumph, there are flags all over the place. Did the Romans really use flags in such size and number? I recognized that the eagle-symbol on it resembles the Romani-symbol of EB, but with a black core. Is that historical or just some abstruse resemblance to Indiana Jones' Nazi-parade?

    Well, I'd be very glad if someone could answer some of my questions.
    1. Something designed for the show i think, remember this is a show, not a history book.

    2. I only remember him being in "jail" in the first episode and that was in the camp.

    3. It's a gladiator arena, at that time period it was still on a small scale and yes criminals were sent there to fight or/and be executed.

    4. The Gladius was a great weapon for hacking off limbs and was recorded quite a few times in history.

    5. Drama.

    6. slaves were objects, not people. They had sex with their slaves just as freely.

    7. Octavian told his sister, his sister told Servillia.

    8. They were copied from archeological remains ss far as i know, there were also other instruments too. They were loud enough to be used in battle i believe to give signals (if it is the horn i think you're talking about)

    9. I'm not sure if they did have the eagle up everywhere during triumph's but it's not unbelievable since they had just about everything else and since the nazi's copied a lot from the Romans it technically wouldn't be copying the Indianna Jones scene.



    Please remember it's a show, not a history book and they have to go off into story telling to keep it enteraining for the masses.

  3. #3

    Smile Re: Goofs in HBO's Rome Season 1

    If you're watching the DVD version of the series, turn on the All Roads Lead to Rome option in the Special Features section. It'll throw out tid-bits of historical info a la Pop-Up Video. It's a fun time for a history buff.

    As a side note, one thing that the show blatantly made up was the Atia and Servilia business. The real Atia was still married and apparently a virtuous, wholesome Roman matron and Servilia, though I believe she was involved with Caesar, certainly wasn't involved in his murder.
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  4. #4
    Member Member Reno Melitensis's Avatar
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    Default Re: Goofs in HBO's Rome Season 1

    Servilia, was a mistress of Caesar and a close relative of Cato, politically against Caesar, had a great antipathy towards the dictator, and hated him a lot. He was a conspirator so in Rome series it makes sense, even if historically we know nothing, thart Servilia was among them, even her son Brutus joined.

    Cheers.


  5. #5
    Voluntary Suspension Voluntary Suspension Philippus Flavius Homovallumus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Goofs in HBO's Rome Season 1

    Quote Originally Posted by Centurio Nixalsverdrus
    In Germany the first season of HBO's Rome has just finished, and I wondered about a few things which seem a bit strange to me.

    1. In some of the episodes, Titus Pullo wears a grey tunica with an eagle printed on it, a bit like the t-shirts that are often worn by american soldiers saying "ARMY". I think it's highly unlikely that SPQR would have payed to fabricate such an underwear cloth for its soldiers. Am I wrong?

    2. In the penultimate episode, Pullo is obviously incarcerated (does that word exist?) in the Carcer Tullianum. Is it normal for ordinary criminals to get there?

    3. What is the tiny arena where his death-sentence is to take place? Pure fantasy?

    4. In the same episode, Pullo hacks of limbs of his opponents. This is often depicted in movies. I would imagine that it is very hard to actually cut of one's limbs with such a sword. I mean there are two massive bones inside, so isn't it a bit exaggerated? The same goes for decapitating with a shield.

    5. Lucius Vorenus jumps in and saves his friend. Why does nobody hinder him? And especially, why can he take him out of the arena without problems? There were guards standing at the entrance.

    6. To the abundance of sexuality displayed in almost all episodes (very surprising for an American tv-series, btw), was it really common that the people let their slaves stay in the room to watch them mating?

    7. How could Servilia know of Vorenus' wife's adultery?

    8. In the scenes of Caesar's triumph, there are trumpeters in the marching column. Do these trumpets really have such a strange sound? It's barely hearable.

    9. At the same triumph, there are flags all over the place. Did the Romans really use flags in such size and number? I recognized that the eagle-symbol on it resembles the Romani-symbol of EB, but with a black core. Is that historical or just some abstruse resemblance to Indiana Jones' Nazi-parade?

    Well, I'd be very glad if someone could answer some of my questions.
    1. It's total hogwash, completely fake.

    2. Yes that word does exist, can't comment off hand though because I don't know what he was imprisoned for and in any case it's been a few years since I studied anything to do with Roman law.

    3. Basic gladiatorial arena. Nothing special.

    4. The Gladius was an very heavy weapon for it's size and Polybius tells us it could deliver devastating cuts. Limb severing is a funny thing though, easier to do at the joints the trick, as with any cut, is to put enough force into it to carry you through.

    5. Didn't see that episode, perhaps because the crowd applauded. It's easier to let the mob have their way in Rome. Since I'm not sure what he was accused of I can't know if the punishment was realistic or not. Death by gladiatorial combat seems a very odd way to execute a citizen, though, especially in this period. A crime which caused you to be stripped of citizenship and executed usually carried a far harsher and more specific penalty.

    6. The abundance of Sex in the series is largely inaccurate. A high sex-drive was a major embarresment for Caesar, Pompey, and Antony. In the main sex was something Romans did quietly in the privacy of their own homes, and you didn't let people watch. While slaves weren't less than people they were property without any real rights. Yes, men had sex with their slaves.

    8. If you are talking about the large curved horns they're low and loud, or should be. That is if played properly.

    9. The Eagle was one symbol of Rome but it only came to the fore with Marius' reforms. Coloured flags aren't cheap but Caesar could have as many as he could pay for.
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  6. #6

    Default Re: Goofs in HBO's Rome Season 1

    Quote Originally Posted by The Internet

    7. Octavian told his sister, his sister told Servillia.




    .
    HE told his sister AFTER she seduced him on servillia's instructions.

    what a witch - she deserves to be raped by a barbarian slave with a massive cock, (oh wait that actually does happen in series two...........)

  7. #7
    Member Member Andronikos's Avatar
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    Default Re: Goofs in HBO's Rome Season 1

    Is it the same movie where was a fairytale about Caesars famous 3rd legion which routed in the battle of Bibracte against Mithradates?



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    Παιδί του ήλιου Member Anastasios Helios's Avatar
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    Default Re: Goofs in HBO's Rome Season 1

    My parents are cheap and don't get HBO, but I managed to watch an episode once...

    I liked the sex scenes alot.

    Can I buy the season on DVD or something?
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  9. #9
    The Usual Member Ice's Avatar
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    Default Re: Goofs in HBO's Rome Season 1

    Quote Originally Posted by Anastasios Garamantos
    My parents are cheap and don't get HBO, but I managed to watch an episode once...

    I liked the sex scenes alot.

    Can I buy the season on DVD or something?
    I can give your instructions on how to get it. Since I'm not sure of the legality, I'll refrain from posting it. PM me if you want to know.



  10. #10
    EB TRIBVNVS PLEBIS Member MarcusAureliusAntoninus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Goofs in HBO's Rome Season 1

    I just want to add, for #6, it isn't an American show, it was made by the BBC.

    That arena scene was kind of stupid. It was another time when Pullo and Varenus became the reincarnation of Hercules when fighting together. And Pullo suffers terrible injures thoughout the show, but always recovers...


  11. #11
    EBII Mod Leader Member Foot's Avatar
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    Default Re: Goofs in HBO's Rome Season 1

    Well it was an HBO/BBC effort. They provide the money, we provide the talent

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  12. #12

    Default Re: Goofs in HBO's Rome Season 1

    Quote Originally Posted by MarcusAureliusAntoninus
    I just want to add, for #6, it isn't an American show, it was made by the BBC.

    That arena scene was kind of stupid. It was another time when Pullo and Varenus became the reincarnation of Hercules when fighting together. And Pullo suffers terrible injures thoughout the show, but always recovers...
    I actually thought that the last death scene was one of the best ever done...
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  13. #13

    Smile Re: Goofs in HBO's Rome Season 1

    Quote Originally Posted by Reno Melitensis
    Servilia, was a mistress of Caesar and a close relative of Cato, politically against Caesar, had a great antipathy towards the dictator, and hated him a lot. He was a conspirator so in Rome series it makes sense, even if historically we know nothing, thart Servilia was among them, even her son Brutus joined.
    I agree that it's certainly historically authentic just not necessarily historically accurate.
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    Member Member sgsandor's Avatar
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    Default Re: Goofs in HBO's Rome Season 1

    I am no historian, but i think this show was incrediable! We all know that some things have to be compromised for TV. Is it 100% no, but the 85% that is the real deal is pretty cool. I think that the show was a lil over the top it showed us how much intrigue there really was in Rome. I liked that it showed Rome a city much like any other city cramped, dirty and teaming with danger (not to mention graffiti). And hey at least it isnt the "Last Legion" or that "Arthur" props to HBO and the BBC. Although it would have been nice to see atleast one american in it lol jk

  15. #15
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    Default Re: Goofs in HBO's Rome Season 1

    There were plenty of Americans in it and I'm afraid from a historical standpoint it was a complete crock, though some of the characers, particually Antony, were good.
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  16. #16

    Smile Re: Goofs in HBO's Rome Season 1

    Many specific events were largely fabricated, but the setting, the atmosphere, and many of the particular details seemed pretty spot on to me. Season 2 as well.

    At the very least, it was an undeniably enjoyable show.
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  17. #17

    Default Re: Goofs in HBO's Rome Season 1

    their main intention with the series was a fictional drama, set in a historical backdrop. so their legionaries were accurate, the fighting style, the clothes, how rome looked etc. it was just a story told with ancient rome as the back drop.

  18. #18
    American since 2012 Senior Member AntiochusIII's Avatar
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    Default Re: Goofs in HBO's Rome Season 1

    Not sure about the answers -- it's been long since I had HBO. But it sure was a great show.

    At least it paid more service to historical authenticity than just about 90% of Hollywood "historical" stuff out there, and is actually good while at it. The amount of sex kind of brought a "wah...?" reaction out of me at first but it lessens as the series go. I guess they were trying to do the opposite of whitewashing (shiny marble halls, men in toga walking around talking like they're on frickin' Olympus; no real sex ever, violence becomes just shaking the camera a lot and all that BS) and got a little carried away.

  19. #19

    Default Re: Goofs in HBO's Rome Season 1

    Quote Originally Posted by MarcusAureliusAntoninus
    I just want to add, for #6, it isn't an American show, it was made by the BBC.

    That arena scene was kind of stupid. It was another time when Pullo and Varenus became the reincarnation of Hercules when fighting together. And Pullo suffers terrible injures thoughout the show, but always recovers...
    no it was a co-production. hbo was esentially calling the shots.

  20. #20

    Default Re: Goofs in HBO's Rome Season 1

    The only goof I noticed was the "too much sex" goof. Okay, I get it its probably historical, but I don't care. I guess there wasn't enough of money to really tell about lets say Romans way of govern its regions. That would be interesting. Or more about how senators actually worked and what they did.

  21. #21
    Member Member geala's Avatar
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    Default Re: Goofs in HBO's Rome Season 1

    I don't think there was too much sex (I'm not from the USA ). Normally the Romans were quite prude so the public scenes are problematic. That does not mean that sex was not found in abundance in the city. I just read a book about nightlife in Rome (it was similar to ours). What I like with the serial is that it gives us a little glance at the different attitude to sex, marriage, slaves and so on the Romans had. The difference between some nobles (Marcus Antonius, Atia, Octavia) and the middle class (Vorenus) is not shown bad.

    On the whole the series gives a certain feeling of a real life in the past. Especially the city I like. I also appreciate that Caesar and the later Augustus are not shown as positive as common. The big killer Octavianus (as Octavius) has already given examples of his unscrupulous mind.

    But there remain many things I don't like. I do not concur with some mentions before. The soldiers and the fighting styles (a la Ars Dimicandi) are not correct. The hamata are not that bad but the cuirasses of the higher officers are utter crap. And ever seen helmets like the ones used by the legionaries? The shields are far to small. I'm very sceptical about the feminalia as a regular piece of cloth for the legionaries at that early date. The T-shirt of Pullo is as funny as the modern fighting boots had been in "Gladiator".

    Many strange incidents in the movie. Ok, that is a toll to modern mass taste. For example the robbery of one of Caesar's legions eagle, very funny.

    The main figures are not always bad but Pompeius and Cato are modelled as much too old clowns. How they have shown Kleopatra and the court at Alexandreia is an impudence.

    The last story with Pullo is annoying. He was sentenced to death for murder. It would have not been so easy to free him just by jumping in the arena and killing the gladiators. Btw although legionaries were trained in single combat it is a little bit vulgar that Pullo and Vorenus killed all the other fighters with such ease. Ok, it's cinema.

    I think "Rome" is, despite all the problems, the best historical serial about Rome we will see for a long time. That is a bit sad indeed.
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  22. #22
    Member Member Thaatu's Avatar
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    Default Re: Goofs in HBO's Rome Season 1

    None of those are actually goofs.

  23. #23
    Βασιλευς και Αυτοκρατωρ Αρχης Member Centurio Nixalsverdrus's Avatar
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    Default AW: Goofs in HBO's Rome Season 1

    First of all, thank you all for answering my questions.

    Don't get me wrong, I liked Rome very much. And I'm not totally against a bit of non-historical drama in a tv-show. I especially liked the depiction of Cleopatra. Caesar was in my opinion a very nice character in the show.

    OK, I have one question left: The Senate building was a semi-circle parliament style building. Wasn't it a very long hall with rows of seats on the sides at that time?
    Last edited by Centurio Nixalsverdrus; 08-14-2007 at 21:13.

  24. #24
    EB TRIBVNVS PLEBIS Member MarcusAureliusAntoninus's Avatar
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    Default Re: AW: Goofs in HBO's Rome Season 1

    Quote Originally Posted by Centurio Nixalsverdrus
    OK, I have one question left: The Senate building was a semi-circle parliament style building. Wasn't it a very long hall with rows of seats on the sides at that time?
    Like on RTW vanilla?

    For one thing, it is said that at the time of Ceasar taking power, the Senate was being held in a theator (a theator dedicated to Pompei) because the Senate house was having mantainance. That is why there is the story of Caesar dying at the feet of a statue of Pompei. So ROME should have had some of the Senate scenes in a theator...


  25. #25
    Krusader's Nemesis Member abou's Avatar
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    Default Re: AW: Goofs in HBO's Rome Season 1

    Well, that's what happens when a bunch of citizens get pissed and have a funeral pier for a deceased senator in the senate house.

    I have to say, if there is one thing that the Romans were undoubtedly better at than the rest of the world, it is that they knew how to throw a party.

  26. #26

    Default Re: Goofs in HBO's Rome Season 1

    I have to admit, I didn't think Rome lived up to its hype. The sex scenes were a little over-abundant, and really missed the point, if you ask me. I don't watch a TV-show about Rome just to see people mounting each other (there's a whole other genre, considerably larger, which caters to that need) so I feel a little cheated that instead of cool battles, or at least nice Roman power play and soldiering the producers decided to obsess over sex scenes. I feel sorry for poor Cleopatra, she really got a bum rep from that show, and the Egyptian court did too. It also seems like they're forcing the female power play a bit, in an attempt to copy I Claudius. I'm not saying they're completely wrong, but I get a little tired of Atia and Servilia getting more of the spotlight than Caesar or Pompey, who were not only more in the forefront of the decisions, but focusing on them means more history and less fake/"souped up" intrigue.
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  27. #27
    Voluntary Suspension Voluntary Suspension Philippus Flavius Homovallumus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Goofs in HBO's Rome Season 1

    Quote Originally Posted by pseudocaesar
    their main intention with the series was a fictional drama, set in a historical backdrop. so their legionaries were accurate, the fighting style, the clothes, how rome looked etc. it was just a story told with ancient rome as the back drop.
    Actually, all of that was pretty wrong. The Legionaries, for example, are based off Trajan's collunm which is not only more than 100 years out of time, it's also wrong in and of itself. This in an age when I can say with reasonable confidence what a Roman soldier looked like purely on the basis of archaeology.
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  28. #28

    Smile Re: Goofs in HBO's Rome Season 1

    Quote Originally Posted by Imperator
    I have to admit, I didn't think Rome lived up to its hype. The sex scenes were a little over-abundant, and really missed the point, if you ask me. I don't watch a TV-show about Rome just to see people mounting each other (there's a whole other genre, considerably larger, which caters to that need) so I feel a little cheated that instead of cool battles, or at least nice Roman power play and soldiering the producers decided to obsess over sex scenes.
    I don't think the sex was out of place honestly. The bit between the siblings was a little out there, but really what does nobility do besides inbreed.

    Spoilers

    I also thought that the stuff with Servilia and Atia, though not accurate was pretty cool: Atia the ambitious, pragmatic, and seemingly heartless one is of the two is gradually shown more loving and concerned (she has some tender and funny moments about/with Antony especially), has to choose between Antony and Octavian, and finally gets everything all her scheming was geared toward and isn't completely happy. Servilia on the other hand, the romantic, charming, and virtuous woman of the two is consumed by revenge, masterminds the plot to kill her former lover under the false pretense of tyrannicide. She even uses her well-meaning and easily manipulated son, Brutus, which eventually causes his death, which she falsely attributes to Atia's doing and dies in the street. Awesome character development whether or not its historically accurate.

    End of Spoilers

    I think it's a little much to demand great battle scenes from the show considering it was running in the red even after it was a major hit. It's not like it had the budget that Gladiator or Saving Private Ryan. Even then, the battle of Philipi in season two was pretty well done.

    There were a number of cool power plays throughout the series, especially from Octavian. I don't know what you're looking for if not that.

    As a side note, would you like it more if it was presented as a historical fiction?

    One of my biggest hang ups of the show was that the never really showed Agrippa as an able military commander. They mentioned it a couple of times, but none of his victories seemed like they could come from this kid who looked like Sam's understudy in Lord of the Rings. That said, I really liked this show and its too bad its gone.
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  29. #29

    Default Re: Goofs in HBO's Rome Season 1

    i thought rome was a great show. you have to bear in mind that they are trying to create an exciting and popular drama, not a documentry. I thought they got the balance between entertainment and accuracy about right. its was a very entertaining show, i loved it when the young octavian is taken whoring for example. and on the accuracy side of things - i think you get a fairly decent idea of what rome was like without the program sticking to facts militantly. this is even more evident in the second series which strays from the facts even further re the anthony -octavia-octavian relationship, but i think you get a fairly good feel of the mood and the personalities involved.

  30. #30

    Default Re: Goofs in HBO's Rome Season 1

    Quote Originally Posted by Rundownloser
    I don't think the sex was out of place honestly. The bit between the siblings was a little out there, but really what does nobility do besides inbreed.

    Spoilers

    I also thought that the stuff with Servilia and Atia, though not accurate was pretty cool: Atia the ambitious, pragmatic, and seemingly heartless one
    you forgot to mention that atia had great tits. deffinately a milf/yummy mummy!

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