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  1. #1
    Member Member geala's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2 Greek questions

    In MTW the speed of troops can be changed in the export_descr_unit file (somewhere near the end of the lines). I don't know wether this is the same for RTW/EB.

    Iphikrates did not give spears to peltasts but lightened some equipment of hoplites and gave them longer spears (Diodoros and Nepos said so). One modern theory I have read argues that first he had marines for naval warfare in mind; during landing operations the new hoplites performed well, so were used on land too (sounds interesting but I'm not sure wether I'm convinced).

    Iphikratic hoplites should be able to stand against normal hoplites because of the longer spears. I doubt a bit that they should be able to chase hoplites however; it was certainly not so easy to run with a spear of perhaps 3,5 metres lenght.
    Last edited by geala; 08-16-2007 at 12:21.
    The queen commands and we'll obey
    Over the Hills and far away.
    (perhaps from an English Traditional, about 1700 AD)

    Drum, Kinder, seid lustig und allesamt bereit:
    Auf, Ansbach-Dragoner! Auf, Ansbach-Bayreuth!
    (later chorus -containing a wrong regimental name for the Bayreuth-Dragoner (DR Nr. 5) - of the "Hohenfriedberger Marsch", reminiscense of a battle in 1745 AD, to the music perhaps of an earlier cuirassier march)

  2. #2
    (cmlax999) Member adishee's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2 Greek questions

    First, I think* the Iphilkrates Hoplitai have better stamina, would this not be a reflection of their lighter equipment? I doubt they could chase much with that unwieldy spear... keep some Ekdromoi around for that.

    Second, seems to me that an official reform is unnecessary. EB has provided a contingency to go either way! For example, you can revert to a totally classical Hoplite/skirmisher setup, or go the completely opposite way and hire out an all Philangate/Thessalonian army (you can buy them anywhere in the Greek world). Or you can mix and match with anything in between, with the multitude of late-Greek military concepts that were never fleshed out (Greek legionary imitations, Thorakitai, etc). The Spartan philangates you are referring to, I believe, were absolutely nothing to behold, as Spartan military prowess had by that time declined to nothing, so really, why have a reform for it? You can already build any kind of Greek army you could ever imagine, and role-play it too.

  3. #3
    Member Member Puupertti Ruma's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2 Greek questions

    Quote Originally Posted by cmlax999
    First, I think* the Iphilkrates Hoplitai have better stamina, would this not be a reflection of their lighter equipment? I doubt they could chase much with that unwieldy spear... keep some Ekdromoi around for that.
    Actually, according to Arkatredes' unit cards, classical hoplites have better stamina than Iphikratous hoplitai.

    I personally think IHs' description is a little contradicting, as they are said to be made lighter and thus more agile and manoeuvarable compared to classical hoplites, but in gameterms they use vanilla phalanx formation which is slow as hell and have less stamina too.

    Quote Originally Posted by geala
    In MTW the speed of troops can be changed in the export_descr_unit file (somewhere near the end of the lines). I don't know wether this is the same for RTW/EB.
    I think I read from somewhere that you had to edit the skeletons of a unit to make it move faster. So in otherwords it would be a bit bigger undertaking than just little text editing.
    Call me Ruma. Puupertti Ruma.

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    Member Member Thaatu's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2 Greek questions

    Didn't "classical hoplites" go through a reform of their own, or was that before Iphicrates?

  5. #5
    (cmlax999) Member adishee's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2 Greek questions

    Quote Originally Posted by Puupertti Ruma
    Actually, according to Arkatredes' unit cards, classical hoplites have better stamina than Iphikratous hoplitai.

    I personally think IHs' description is a little contradicting, as they are said to be made lighter and thus more agile and manoeuvarable compared to classical hoplites, but in gameterms they use vanilla phalanx formation which is slow as hell and have less stamina too.
    Hmm. That is a bit annoying, maybe that should be clarified. I agree with their decision for vanilla Phalanx setting, though. Historically there were a sort of precursor to Phalangates, Philip could have copied them from Thebes, he was certainly at least influenced. I don't think RTW can illustrate a lance/sarrisa effect without the Phalanx setting, and as to their slow movement, you can always take them out of Phalanx mode and chase. Wish they did add some more stamina, but perhaps they have less than a classical because the Phalanx effect also seems to cause the formation to conserve HUGE amounts of stamina if it is left completely defensive.
    Can a dev enlighten us?

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