Let us speculate on the subject of fantasy units...

[Sheogorath]

Yes that was what the French noticed at Borodino etc, but the myth about Russian forces in many eras is they were basically peasants herded into line to be shot down until the enemy ran out of bullets and then froze.

Its true at times this was the Russian approach, but not vs Napoleon when they fought extremely bravely and took a lot of killing.



More like chariot mounted ballistae, but yeah, you get the picture.

I've heard them described more as 'Too stupid to run away' than that. Which is kinda true. Russia probably had the worst officer corps in Europe.
Oh! Theres a good fantasy unit. The Russian Flamethrower. Its a swarm of drunken Russian officers with matches. They run up to enemy units and spit/breath on them, then set them all on fire.

[Cyclops]

I've heard them described more as 'Too stupid to run away' than that. Which is kinda true. Russia probably had the worst officer corps in Europe.

I think the Russians were the only opponent that regularly faced the Grand Armee and didn't run like rabbits. Dunno if the officer corps was inept, arguably they were the best outside France, although they were definitely alcoholic. Apparently at 5 pm during the battle of Borodino Kutusov was doing vodka shots with his boys at HQ.

Oh! Theres a good fantasy unit. The Russian Flamethrower. Its a swarm of drunken Russian officers with matches. They run up to enemy units and spit/breath on them, then set them all on fire.

I think thats a bit unrealistic. Surely they would use didgeridoos as a delivery system to give a bit more range to their flaming breath?

[Sheogorath]

Hey, Kutusov is a special case. Alcahol fueled his creative proccesses!
But yeah, Russia was most famous for its artillery. Russian gunners were widely regarded as the best out there, and Russian artillery was some of the best in the world until the Austrians suprassed them some time in the 1830/40's. Their gunners were famous for almost never abandoning a gun for the enemy, and fighting to the death to defend their pieces.
In fact, the artillery was regarded, in Russia, as the 'aristocratic' branch of the army. Young nobles went into the artillery, unlike the rest of Europe where they became cavalry officers. Too bad THAT ended up biting the Russians in the butt when they tried to update their artillery and none of the dandy officers wanted to learn how to work the newfangled guns.

From what I've seen, their cavalry was regarded as fairly average, although it DID defeat the French cavalry on several occasions.

Their infantry is generally the subject of a lot of speculation. Napoleon, as I said, seems to have been a bit of a Russophile. He's been quoted as saying that if the Russians could give their infantry the 'electric enthusiasm' of the French soldiers then they wouldnt have had any problem taking over Europe. But the problem was that Russian infantry were basically battlefield robots. They cold stand in a line and take fire like nobody and were adequate musketeers (although the Russians didnt bother training their men to AIM, which cost them once rifles became common). They excelled at close-in fighting, and their Grenadiers were probably some of the most feared in Europe, right up there with the Old Guard.

But their offers were widely regarded as the worst in Europe, unless you count the Ottomans as European. They were drunks, and tended to follow the same line as their men in their total lack of flexibility.
Of course, their good officers tended to be VERY good, possibly to make up for all the bad ones.

Regardless of how good they were, Russia probably DID have the most expensive army in Europe. They favored parade ground pomp over actual military skill prior to Napoleons invasion, and paid for it initially. Then, as per usual, they figured out what was going on and kicked ass all the way to Berli-...I mean Paris.

Look at me, I'm rambling! Ramble ramble ramble!

[Freedom Onanist]

Hey, Kutusov is a special case. Alcahol fueled his creative proccesses!
But yeah, Russia was most famous for its artillery. Russian gunners were widely regarded as the best out there, and Russian artillery was some of the best in the world until the Austrians suprassed them some time in the 1830/40's. Their gunners were famous for almost never abandoning a gun for the enemy, and fighting to the death to defend their pieces.
In fact, the artillery was regarded, in Russia, as the 'aristocratic' branch of the army. Young nobles went into the artillery, unlike the rest of Europe where they became cavalry officers. Too bad THAT ended up biting the Russians in the butt when they tried to update their artillery and none of the dandy officers wanted to learn how to work the newfangled guns.

From what I've seen, their cavalry was regarded as fairly average, although it DID defeat the French cavalry on several occasions.

Their infantry is generally the subject of a lot of speculation. Napoleon, as I said, seems to have been a bit of a Russophile. He's been quoted as saying that if the Russians could give their infantry the 'electric enthusiasm' of the French soldiers then they wouldnt have had any problem taking over Europe. But the problem was that Russian infantry were basically battlefield robots. They cold stand in a line and take fire like nobody and were adequate musketeers (although the Russians didnt bother training their men to AIM, which cost them once rifles became common). They excelled at close-in fighting, and their Grenadiers were probably some of the most feared in Europe, right up there with the Old Guard.

But their offers were widely regarded as the worst in Europe, unless you count the Ottomans as European. They were drunks, and tended to follow the same line as their men in their total lack of flexibility.
Of course, their good officers tended to be VERY good, possibly to make up for all the bad ones.

Regardless of how good they were, Russia probably DID have the most expensive army in Europe. They favored parade ground pomp over actual military skill prior to Napoleons invasion, and paid for it initially. Then, as per usual, they figured out what was going on and kicked ass all the way to Berli-...I mean Paris.

Look at me, I'm rambling! Ramble ramble ramble!

Yes, or you could just have the real Russian winners:

Distance - Captain Middle of Nowhere

And of course

Weather - General Rainy Snow

You could also recruit Major Crap Infrastructure. That way invaders who have invested in their own countries will be completely flumoxed by how to operate in a country where nothing works.

Let's not forget, Sergeant I couldn't care a less about my men

[Sheogorath]

Actually, the Winter of 1812 wasnt that bad. The climate around and south of Moscow in Russia is fairly mild. They grow a lot of grain and such there, so it certainly cant be too hostile. If you look at a chart of the French casualties compared to the temperature, the French loses actually go UP with the temperature.
And Summer in Russia is often regarded as just as, if not more, brutal than winter. For its heat. The French and Germans both commented about how the ground would crack because it was so dry.

Distance certainly is a major factor. However, the infrastructure wasnt THAT bad. Except in Spring, when everything turns into knee-deep mud, but thats a problem for everybody. You cant really 'adapt' to knee-deep mud except to be used to it. Even then, you cant exactly march in the stuff.
But yeah...its kinda hard to have crappy infrastructure in an era when trains were an eccentric curiosity in the UK and most everybody traveled via dirt roads and the idea of machinery is limited to basics like weaving machines.

As to their NCO's...they really werent any more or less caring than anybody elses NCO's. Some of them were bastards, but most Russian NCO's were selected for seniority within their unit, which generally meant they were experienced men who actually DID care about their own men.

See, stereotyping really doesnt get you anywhere, does it?

[Freedom Onanist]

Actually, the Winter of 1812 wasnt that bad. The climate around and south of Moscow in Russia is fairly mild. They grow a lot of grain and such there, so it certainly cant be too hostile. If you look at a chart of the French casualties compared to the temperature, the French loses actually go UP with the temperature.
And Summer in Russia is often regarded as just as, if not more, brutal than winter. For its heat. The French and Germans both commented about how the ground would crack because it was so dry.

Distance certainly is a major factor. However, the infrastructure wasnt THAT bad. Except in Spring, when everything turns into knee-deep mud, but thats a problem for everybody. You cant really 'adapt' to knee-deep mud except to be used to it. Even then, you cant exactly march in the stuff.
But yeah...its kinda hard to have crappy infrastructure in an era when trains were an eccentric curiosity in the UK and most everybody traveled via dirt roads and the idea of machinery is limited to basics like weaving machines.

As to their NCO's...they really werent any more or less caring than anybody elses NCO's. Some of them were bastards, but most Russian NCO's were selected for seniority within their unit, which generally meant they were experienced men who actually DID care about their own men.

See, stereotyping really doesnt get you anywhere, does it?

Strange I always understood the retreat from Moscow to be renowned in French history as particularly horrific - due to the weather.

I do believe the infrastructure was worse than in many places (in Western Europe). Not a reflection on Russian road maintenance just based on the distances involved and the relative pverty of the areas between major towns.

I admit to stereotyping the seargent bit. Though, on a modern note, my brother married a Russian lady with a son who came over with her. He's just carried out his military service - not a happy chappy at all. He has some pretty harsh words for Russian NCO's in particular. From what he says bullying, violence, alcohol and incompetence are rife. A situation that has been endemic and traditional in the Russian forces according to him. Taking historic revisionism too far ain't that clever either.

[Sheogorath]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Winter

Specifically:

According to an American military study, the main body of Napoleon's Grande Armée, initially at least 378,000 strong, "diminished by half during the first eight weeks of his invasion, before the major battle of the campaign.

and

According to the meteorological records, the 1812-1813 winter was milder than usual.

Borodino took place in September.
French casualties were more due to the Russian use of scorched earth tactics and Cossacks than weather, although the climate probably played a part.

The Russians maintained their main roads fairly well, yes, some of the less important ones may've fallen into disrepair, but the ones that invaders typically used would've been in quite fine condition (Except, as mentioned, during spring, when ALL the roads turned into mud.) After all, trade was just as important to the Russians as anybody else,and the Russians tended to rely more on trade via land than via sea, for obvious reasons.

The modern corruption of Russian NCO's has more to do with the late/post-Soviet government corruption and simple lack of caring.
I'd say those NCO's better shape up soon, or Putin's going to have them lined up in Red Square for some free cigarettes.

[Csargo]

oh u

Do us a favor and include these guys:


Russia just isnt complete without BEAR CAVALRY

[Jacob Debroedere]

What about the three musketeers? Their unit size is limited to three, the have an awesome range attack and wen engaged in melee they will use their sabres to mow down any resistance. They are almost impossible to kill without artillery because you need to kill them all to kill one.

[Axel JD]

Skiing riflemen, Norwegian/Swiss mercenary unit. Or Sami raindeer riders, resplendent in their red and blue outfits and silly hats, waving handicraft knives.

[Sheogorath]

Skiing riflemen, Norwegian/Swiss mercenary unit. Or Sami raindeer riders, resplendent in their red and blue outfits and silly hats, waving handicraft knives.

Which can be upgraded to the infamous 'Rabid Sami Reindeer Riders', with both rider and mount foaming at the mouth and biting everything that comes within reach.

[Axel JD]

Which can be upgraded to the infamous 'Rabid Sami Reindeer Riders', with both rider and mount foaming at the mouth and biting everything that comes within reach.

By God man! What a great idea! Incidentally, just now I saw a film which included an evil Sami trying to push a guy over a cliff.

Btw. remember the War Dogs in RTW? How about War Crocodiles - they would be able to swim and infiltrate settlements through the sewers and lay in ambush at river crossings.

[Sheogorath]

By God man! What a great idea! Incidentally, just now I saw a film which included an evil Sami trying to push a guy over a cliff.

Btw. remember the War Dogs in RTW? How about War Crocodiles - they would be able to swim and infiltrate settlements through the sewers and lay in ambush at river crossings.

How about Cannonagators? Alligators mounting cannons. Even better.

[Bijo]

Terminator (T-800) who comes from the far future through a portal. You could also choose to get T-1000 who will be quick on his feet as he can shapeshift.

[russveld]

A un killable unit given to the most awsome fation. My theory is that it will be man-bear-pig.

[Barbarian]

The only unit capable of attacking square formations of infantry:

[Aldaris]

Chosen men. Riflemen who shoot accurately up to 500 yards, do not fix swords when cavalry charges, but instead club the silly buggers out of the saddle with their rifle butts, are lead by an officer who chops up pretty much everything in hand-to-hand and they all reload extremely fast. And if they are not fast enough, they can spit the bullets instead. But only up to a distance of 150 yards.

[Freedom Onanist]

Chosen men.....they can spit the bullets instead. But only up to a distance of 150 yards.

A variant would be Thai ladies (or lady-boys) shooting ping-pong balls out of their fundamentals. Deadly accurate at anything up to 200 yards.

No fantasy - I've seen them do it!!!

[Abokasee]

A variant would be Thai ladies (or lady-boys) shooting ping-pong balls out of their fundamentals. Deadly accurate at anything up to 200 yards.

No fantasy - I've seen them do it!!!

Youtube?

You could have Russian Joker, a retuine member who give 5+ command when fighting prussians due to the pun

[Fisherking]

I like the cat snipers! But more in line with the times in the game:

Germans: Baron Von Münchhausen

Brits: H. Hornblower, The Scarlet Pimpernel, Mr. Norrell & Jonathan Strange

Amis: Mel Gibson’s Patriot

I am sure someone can add to the list…

[Barbarian]

300 spartans, who work the same as chosen men, but they can reload their muskets 60 times a minute and hit three enemies with each shot.

About the defence: cannon shot is required to kill one of them, because each of them can withstand 15 standard musket shots.

[Dayve]

I'd rather speculate on which folder i have to edit to remove them as quickly as possible, just like i did with Rome.

[Bijo]

Elvis would make a good fantasy war unit.

[Aldaris]

Galloper Guns. Cannons equipped with four steam-powered legs that allow them to gallop into action on their own.

[Viking]

At one point, the swedish army supposedly experimented with elk-riding cavalry. It failed because the animals are not trainable like horses. I predict that the Swedish faction will have such a unit.

I really hope the elk cavalry gets included.

[Rhyfelwyr]

I really hope the elk cavalry gets included.

With cannons...

[Vladimir]

How about an aquatic camel unit? They would be a great way to humble those proud Spanish galleys.

[Bijo]

I still want a Terminator unit that travels from the future into the past.

[Rhyfelwyr]

Elephants with ski's with spikes on the front, and have cannons and rocket launchers on their back, with an extended platform to make room for some elks and camels to prevent boarding, and with gattling guns hanging off each side of the platform, above which riders throw flaming pigs onto the enemies.