Hellenioi

[Anastasios Helios]

Why are the regiments of the Koinion Hellenon so small compared to that of the Makedonioi, Ptolemaioi, or (sighs) the Romanioi? I have lost so many multiplayer battles because no matter how much I thin out my phalanx, I am still outflanked by my enemies, and therefore, the barbarians crush me. :(

[Megas Pyrrhos]

Then don't thin out your forces. Make them deeper, seems to work for me, and keep quality units to the flanks so that they can handle a flanking maneuver against them, and still having them like it, troops that don't care whether they get flanked or not.

[Bootsiuv]

The KH has access to some good troops, really. I agree with Megas Pyrrhos...place some light hoplites on your flanks. Their decent enough in defense to help stop a flanking maneuver, and they're fast enough to do a little flanking themselves.

[NeoSpartan]

The KH has access to some good troops, really. I agree with Megas Pyrrhos...place some light hoplites on your flanks. Their decent enough in defense to help stop a flanking maneuver, and they're fast enough to do a little flanking themselves.

Regular hoplites are very tough cookies too. I use some of them on the flanks to stop cavalry charges. Those hoplites don't fly like other units

[NeoSpartan]

One thing I will suggest:

As the KH don't expect to win a "pike vs short-pike" engagement. U are outnumbered and outreached. Focus on destroying the flanks of ur enemy quickly!

Use your iphikraptides (sp) to STOP the phezetaroi, thus "BUYING YOU TIME" to rout the flanks. Spartans and hoplites are EXTREMELY strong against cavarly since they don't suffer much when cavalry charges them. So have some in ur flanks.

[keravnos]

It is "Hellenes" not Hellenioi

[Xehh II]

What is it with everyone putting ioi on the end of words?

[Anastasios Helios]

"Hellenes" is an English word
"Ελλενιοι" is the Greek equivalent

[Tiberius Nero]

"Hellenes" is an English word
"Ελλενιοι" is the Greek equivalent

Erm, no, there is no word "Hellenios" meaning "Greek" as a national name. It is "Hellenes" in Greek. "Hellenios" is a rare poetic adjective.

It is also "Makedones" and "Romaioi", plurals of "Makedon" and "Romaios", since you seem interested.

[Centurio Nixalsverdrus]

People put "oi" to every word because they are careful readers of the EB-descriptions, of course. I wonder if Greek is a difficult language to learn (I'm not talking of the letters, I could get along with that).

[Anastasios Helios]

I study Greek in my spare time, and it's not too bad. Russian is definitely more difficult.

[keravnos]

Modern greek are quite easy, as the sounds are very much the same, (in a what-you-read-is-what-it-sounds-like) and once you know the rules, you will be able to read Greek in no time and let others understand what you mean. Now, the great difficulty seems to be (For English speakers that is) that clauses are still used in Greek. That takes some getting used to.

Still, Hellenioi is so rare, it is like it isn't used at all. "Ελληνες" or "Hellenes" on the other hand is and has been the norm since just after Homer.

(Prior to that it was Danaoi, Argeioi-Homeric names. Sellas->Hellas was a region in Epeiros, which gave its name to the whole country. Or so the legends tell us).

[Xehh II]

People put "oi" to every word because they are careful readers of the EB-descriptions, of course. I wonder if Greek is a difficult language to learn (I'm not talking of the letters, I could get along with that).

No I mean why in ancient times do most of the civs have ioi on the end.

[christof139]

So, then if there were more than 2 Pavarottis and they both died the same day we could say the Barbarioi Barotonioi Pavarottiioi just passed??

Couldn't resist, and no I am not being cruel. Never mind.

Chris

[Centurio Nixalsverdrus]

Modern greek are quite easy, as the sounds are very much the same, (in a what-you-read-is-what-it-sounds-like) and once you know the rules, you will be able to read Greek in no time and let others understand what you mean. Now, the great difficulty seems to be (For English speakers that is) that clauses are still used in Greek. That takes some getting used to.

That sounds interesting. Is there a big difference between modern Greek and ancient Greek? What do you mean with clauses?

Oh please can you tell what "King of Makedonia" means exactly in Greek? I fear it's a bit wrong what I wrote under my username.

No I mean why in ancient times do most of the civs have ioi on the end.

I think this is just the plural for Greek words ending with -os.

[abou]

Do you mean a translation? If that is the case, then probably Basileus Makedonias.

[keravnos]

That sounds interesting. Is there a big difference between modern Greek and ancient Greek? What do you mean with clauses?

Ok, let me try to explain...

"ΚΑΛΛΙΠΥΓΟΣ ΓΥΝΗ"=woman with a nice "rear end" (in ancient greek)
The pronunciation of that would be...
- [kal-li-pu(u as in "Utah")-gos gu-ne-e" (e as in "nest")]

"KΑΛΛΙΠΥΓΟΣ ΓΥΝΑΙΚΑ"=woman with a nice "rear end" (in modern greek)
- [ka-li-pi-yos (y as in "yes") yi-ne-ka]

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

"KΑΛΛΙΠΥΓΟΣ" was the colloquial name of Aphrodite in Syracuse. In fact, not many called her otherwise. This is one part of my ancestry that always makes me laugh when I think about it.

Short list (as an example) of what has changed from Ancient to modern
Double ll(λλ), gg(γγ) or pp(ππ) are pronounced as one in modern greek
ai=e in pronounciation
eu=ef or av in pronounciation
au=af or av in pronounciation.

Clause=mistake of mine. Declension/inflection is the word. It is the different ways in which every word can be written/pronounced according to different uses of the word. An example, the singular of "ANHΡ"=man in all clauses in ancient, modern greek, and an attempt of parallels between that and modern english. Notice that most modern languages have done away with it entirely. Modern greek has them (declensions), but they are vastly simplified from the Ancient greek, and also dotiki (one of them) has been abolished. Ancient Indian (Sanskrit) has 8.

Ancient Greek--------------Modern Greek-----------Modern English
-------------------------------------------------------------------
Ο ΑΝΗΡ----------------------Ο ΑΝΔΡΑΣ------------------Man
ΤΟΥ ΑΝΔΡΟΣ----------------ΤΟΥ ΑΝΔΡΑ-----------------Man's
ΤΩΙ ΑΝΔΡΙ----------------------------------------------------
ΤΟΝ ΑΝΔΡΑ-----------------ΤΟΝ ΑΝΔΡΑ-----------------------
Ω ΑΝΕΡ---------------------Ω ΑΝΔΡΑ-----------------------

-> Note that this is a very short response. Just a "heads up" if you will of the whole thing. A lot more can be spoken/written etc.

-> There are many things that illiterate catholic priests/ or vengeful Romani have blamed us Greeks over the years, and the fact that Greek language is difficult is one of them. Modern Greek isn't difficult, as a former girlfriend of mine who wasn't greek had been able to learn them in about a year. She was smart, true, but I honestly think that the difficulty of Greek language is vastly overestimated.

[Tiberius Nero]

Do you mean a translation? If that is the case, then probably Basileus Makedonias.

Yes, although basileus Makedonon ("King of the Macedonians") is probably how it would be phrased by the ancients (one is king of a people, not of a territory).

[Teleklos Archelaou]

Great to hear strategy problems arising from playing a lot of EB multiplayer battles. Good to know you guys are getting something extra out of it - we members really never play multiplayer battles though.

Anastasios - those signature banners like the one you are using are just for EB team members.

[Centurio Nixalsverdrus]

@keravnos:

Thank you for the explanation. We have that cases in German as well, so this is not a too big problem.

I'll change my usertitle to Basileus Makedonias then.

[Anastasios Helios]

*groans*

[antisocialmunky]

Another Greek Thread Turns Ugly(TM) *sigh*

The only greek unit that can hope to defeat Pezheteroi(sp) are those uber elite Phalanx. You set them into a square and set them on attack and they'll be able to split a long pike phalanx. When you split it, and your phalanx is almost all the way through, take them off phalanx and tell them to attack the long pike unit(there's a order cancel bug). Your opponent will either keep them in phalanx at which point they'll die horribly but be able to fend off frontal attacks or take them off phalanx at which point some hoplites you held in reserve or what ever is handy kills them. If they were smart and kep some reserve, you might still be screwed.

[Tiberius Nero]

*groans*

"General of the Greeks" would be "strategos Hellenon", not "Hellenikon"; "hellenikos" is "Greek" as in "Greek city", "Greek vase" not "a Greek". If you study Russian this should remind you of something similar there.

[PershsNhpios]

Tibbles Nero, do try not to throw your weight around and indirectly attempt to boast of your absolutely astounding knowledge of foreign grammar.
We can start a new thread where you can choose from secondary names to criticise if you wish.

[Tiberius Nero]

Sorry, this has been OT almost from the start, so I thought I was on topic actually. Just rechecked the first post and you are probably right.

Wasn't boasting by the way, just trying to help someone who seems interested in Greek.

[PershsNhpios]

It is no large matter, I renounce any seemingly hostilities!

Although I'm not particularly interested, I shall put some verbal strength into pulling this carcass back to it's former state.

The Koinon Hellenon (Ha ha, I kept thinking "Hellen Keller" for a start, however I have no idea who that is), are a very powerful faction, and capable not in line-holding but in brief and blitzing flank manoeuvers where the quick and crushing force of the traditional hoplite cripples the sides of an enemy formation.
Any straight-forward attack with other hellenic factions will result in the loss of your companies.

Just ask Madmatg, he taught me all about the use of the allied greek states, until I cornered him in a Babylonian street with some very determined Ptolemaic phalanxes.

[Bootsiuv]

It is no large matter, I renounce any seemingly hostilities!

Although I'm not particularly interested, I shall put some verbal strength into pulling this carcass back to it's former state.

The Koinon Hellenon (Ha ha, I kept thinking "Hellen Keller" for a start, however I have no idea who that is), are a very powerful faction, and capable not in line-holding but in brief and blitzing flank manoeuvers where the quick and crushing force of the traditional hoplite cripples the sides of an enemy formation.
Any straight-forward attack with other hellenic factions will result in the loss of your companies.

Just ask Madmatg, he taught me all about the use of the allied greek states, until I cornered him in a Babylonian street with some very determined Ptolemaic phalanxes.

I'm sorry, but I have to disagree with you here. After playing KH quite extensively, I can only say that the Koinon Hellenon IS indeed a faction quite capable of "line-holding". Traditional Hoplites (fantastic line-holders BTW) are fairly slow for flanking, although they can be used to do so, light hoplites are far better for that job, and are quite capable of holding the lines themselves. Iphakratic (sp?) Hoplites DEFINITELY can go toe-to-toe with pikemen, albeit not the elites.

The KH really has to be a "line-holding" faction in the beginning, due to the relative lack of flexibility of hoplite warfare (when compared with Rome or Qarthadastims forces, for example) and extremely poor quality of Southern Greek Cavalry.

[Spoofa]

the chainmail armored hoplitai can definately punch a huge hole through makedonian Phalanx, It has always, ALWAYS happened to me when i seige Thermon as Makedonia and their generals are those guys, they always go straight through my phalanx (16 rank deep) and theres just a huge area where they've been that is filled with bodies, i usually have to send my Peltastai into them from behind my phalanx to keep them from breaking and give them some more manpower and also send another unit to flank them in order to kill them.

The good thing though, is that they always die to the man in a fight to the death so I dont have to worry about them after I've crushed the Koinon Hellenon rebellion.

[Anastasios Helios]

"General of the Greeks" would be "strategos Hellenon", not "Hellenikon"; "hellenikos" is "Greek" as in "Greek city", "Greek vase" not "a Greek". If you study Russian this should remind you of something similar there.

That is the result of my Neo-Byzantine mind. Aware of the military themes due to the reforms of Herakleios? He created the Armeniakon and a few others in Anatolia. "Hellenikon" is my own imaginary little military theme.

....blah

Anyways, thanks for this info...it is my goal to defeat a Romanophile friend of mine

[Thaatu]

"KΑΛΛΙΠΥΓΟΣ ΓΥΝΑΙΚΑ"=woman with a nice "rear end" (in modern greek)
- [ka-li-pi-yos (y as in "yes") yi-ne-ka]

Thanks keravnos! I'll be sure to try it the next time I visit Greece. Results may vary.