Romani military era change

[Respenus]

First of all, I must say what great work the EB team has done and I'm sure will do in the future.

So, here's my question.

I've been playing the Romani campaign and I've changed (came, what's the right expression) to the Polybian. Now I've noticed this, before the game gave me the "Times has changed" message.

I've already ordered to build new roman barracks before this message. Now I would like to know, if I'll have to rebuild my highest level Rome barracks for the Marian reforms, or will the units recruited by the barracks change themselves?

One more thing. Seeing how I can no longer train Polibian eras units, and I con't retrain them into Polybian, is my only option to kill them, or use them as garrison duty. I find it strange (although I'm not a historian), that it would be so hard, so just give the old units new weapons and be done with it. I wouldn't like to lose all those highly experienced units.

I thank you all in advance.

[Respenus]

Sorry guys, after going through the FAQ a bit thoroughly, I've found my answers.

I'd ask a mod/admin to delete this topic. No need to clog up space.

THX and sorry.

[Kurulham]

I banged my head into this problem for a while; unfortunately, I don't believe the RTW code has any provision for changing a unit's type while keeping its other salient features (experience, numbers, etc.), though I'd love to be wrong on that score.

If your old units are that important to you, you can refrain from upgrading some of your MICs to the new reform; this will give you facilities for retraining your obsolete units, and even training new ones of that type.

[MarcusAureliusAntoninus]

The message that comes up is not for the Polybian, Marian, or Augustan reforms. That message is the the vanilla Marian Reforms that are being used for other things, such as a few new boats for the Romans. The Polybian Reforms will not give you a message, but will cause a new building to be placed in all of your settlements that says "Polybian Era" (it will not replace the "Camilian Era" building).

If you are upgrading a Camilian MIC when the reform hits, once completed that MIC will still make Camilian units. Either cancel and start building the Polybian MIC of the same level or upgrade again once that Camilian MIC is complete.

The game engine restrictions prevent us from making units from one era upgradable to the next era. We would do it if we could, but simply cannot. It would be best to just disband those units once you have trained their Polybian replacements.

[Respenus]

The message that comes up is not for the Polybian, Marian, or Augustan reforms. That message is the the vanilla Marian Reforms that are being used for other things, such as a few new boats for the Romans. The Polybian Reforms will not give you a message, but will cause a new building to be placed in all of your settlements that says "Polybian Era" (it will not replace the "Camilian Era" building).

If you are upgrading a Camilian MIC when the reform hits, once completed that MIC will still make Camilian units. Either cancel and start building the Polybian MIC of the same level or upgrade again once that Camilian MIC is complete.

The game engine restrictions prevent us from making units from one era upgradable to the next era. We would do it if we could, but simply cannot. It would be best to just disband those units once you have trained their Polybian replacements.

Thanks. The thing is I was so smart, I've already upgraded all my MICs to the Polybian era. Well, cannon fodder, here you come

I'm already training new units. I've already used some and I must say, they fight better then my uber experienced Camilian units.

But this still means it's rebuilding Rome's MIC when new reforms strike (still have a bit over 100 years until it happens).

[MarcusAureliusAntoninus]

Well, the good news is that the script gives you free MICs at the Marian Reform and you won't have to upgrade them then.

[Respenus]

Well, the good news is that the script gives you free MICs at the Marian Reform and you won't have to upgrade them then.

Great! But what if they're already upgraded to the max?

[Ludens]

Great! But what if they're already upgraded to the max?

The Marian MICs won't replace the Polybian ones, in the same way the Polybian Era marker won't replace Camillian Era one. You simply get a new MIC, for free and instantly built, while the Polybian one is damaged to 99%. It's up to you to tear it down (which you should since it doesn't do anything useful). The engine, unfortunatly, does not allow for destruction of buildings unles the player does it himself.

[Respenus]

Thank you!

[I of the Storm]

Since it has been mentioned, I might as well ask in here:

When the vanilla marian reforms trigger, there are new boats for Rome. But what I never really found out is: what changes for other factions? New boats as well? Upgraded bodyguards? New units?

[Tellos Athenaios]

Factions with early & late bodyguards switch to Late. Kataphraktoi become available to the Seleukides. Hysteroi Pezhetairoi become available to the Makedones. IIRC the Saka reform depends on this as well; hence the Indo-Hellenic troops become availble to the Saka also.

[Respenus]

One more question.

What's with the change to Imperial? Why would someone wish to change to Imperial. Are the units more suited for the time or is there something else hidden in there?

[Geoffrey S]

I'm somewhat biased on the matter, but this topic may be of use.

[MarcusAureliusAntoninus]

The Augustan Reforms give you slightly better legionaries, a new regional Roman cavarly, preatorians, auxilia spearmen, and archers auxilia. It's also fun to role-play the Imperial takeover.

[Respenus]

The Augustan Reforms give you slightly better legionaries, a new regional Roman cavarly, preatorians, auxilia spearmen, and archers auxilia. It's also fun to role-play the Imperial takeover.

If you say so, O Great Emperor!

[NeoSpartan]

The Augustan Reforms give you slightly better legionaries, a new regional Roman cavarly, preatorians, auxilia spearmen, and archers auxilia. It's also fun to role-play the Imperial takeover.

Yep, thereby effectively making the Legionary the best Infantry sword unit of the game. Large numbers, really good stats, and good morale, AND LOW COST. Hell its the cheapest elite unit I've seen, and u can recruit them just about anywhere. Compared to other elites that are limited to a few provinces, cost a fortune, and (most) have fewer numbers.

[MarcusAureliusAntoninus]

Yep, thereby effectively making the Legionary the best Infantry sword unit of the game. Large numbers, really good stats, and good morale, AND LOW COST. Hell its the cheapest elite unit I've seen, and u can recruit them just about anywhere. Compared to other elites that are limited to a few provinces, cost a fortune, and (most) have fewer numbers.

Well, they aren't officially elites. They are just well equipped average soldiers.

[Zaknafien]

Roman soldiers are definately not elite.

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

Hmmm, maybe we should keep the Augustans, tie their sandle thongs together.

[gran_guitarra]

Well it seems to me that it is better to keep at the Marian Period, because its better overall.
Imperial Legionnaiers only have +2 defense over Marian ones. Marian reforms allow you to use Vigiles as a decent garrison.
By the time you hit the Marian Reforms you should have a whole bunch of Auxiliary Archers who are cheaper and just as easy to get.
Cohors Evocata are just as good, if not better, than Praetorians, and can be recruited in ALL of Italia, instead of just Rome.
Antesignani make a decent elite, and can be recruited in all type 2 settlements.
Overall they just seem to be better, only losing out to the Imperial Reforms in the standard trooper.
And Cohors Imperiala qualify as elite, just as Thorakitai, Taxeis Triballoi, Galatikon Kluddikon, and all those others who have inferior stats and elites tatus.

[Respenus]

Well it seems to me that it is better to keep at the Marian Period, because its better overall.
Imperial Legionnaiers only have +2 defense over Marian ones. Marian reforms allow you to use Vigiles as a decent garrison.
By the time you hit the Marian Reforms you should have a whole bunch of Auxiliary Archers who are cheaper and just as easy to get.
Cohors Evocata are just as good, if not better, than Praetorians, and can be recruited in ALL of Italia, instead of just Rome.
Antesignani make a decent elite, and can be recruited in all type 2 settlements.
Overall they just seem to be better, only losing out to the Imperial Reforms in the standard trooper.
And Cohors Imperiala qualify as elite, just as Thorakitai, Taxeis Triballoi, Galatikon Kluddikon, and all those others who have inferior stats and elites tatus.

Don't take this wrong, but IIRC Vigiles come with the Imperial reforms

One thing that's good about Imperial is that you can train legionaries anywhere. Praetorians. Why use them? I'm not there, but I imagine only using them for the defense of Rome or my Faction Leader.

I'll go with Imperial when time comes (I'm still around 150 years away from marian so...).

[Bootsiuv]

Factions with early & late bodyguards switch to Late. Kataphraktoi become available to the Seleukides. Hysteroi Pezhetairoi become available to the Makedones. IIRC the Saka reform depends on this as well; hence the Indo-Hellenic troops become availble to the Saka also.

Saka doesn't work IIRC, which is a shame, as those indo-hellenic units look pretty sweet. I think it's a fairly easy fix which will be fixed in the next version.

I've also heard that most reforms will have dynamic triggers in the next release, so vanilla marian won't be used for things like Seleukids.

I just hope they change the Saka's trigger to fighting the Baktrians, like the Seleukids will be for fighting the parthians.

Of course, this is only what I've heard around the forums, so I could be wrong.

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

The big advantage with the Imperial reforms is the standardisation of the auxillary forces.

[Foot]

I've also heard that most reforms will have dynamic triggers in the next release, so vanilla marian won't be used for things like Seleukids.

The vanilla marian will still be used for units that we just want to hold back for a few years, and so for seleucid troops that currently use they still will. Apart from the Hellenikoi Kataphractoi, which will finally get its reform based on the seleukids fighting large numbers of parthian heavy cavalry.

Foot