Onin no Jidai

[L'Impresario]

Sounds interesting but...

Too much money and the game becomes too attritional. Without guns any incentive to buy missiles is significantly reduced; after all, instead of paying 400 koku for a SA you can pay a bit more and get a ND. Of course if it comes down to dislodging an army from a hill, archers will have a role to play, although in a 4v4 the most effective strategy in such a setting would most likely involve no missiles.

[Tomisama]

Sounds interesting but...

Too much money and the game becomes too attritional. Without guns any incentive to buy missiles is significantly reduced; after all, instead of paying 400 koku for a SA you can pay a bit more and get a ND. Of course if it comes down to dislodging an army from a hill, archers will have a role to play, although in a 4v4 the most effective strategy in such a setting would most likely involve no missiles.

Hi Alex

Good fighting with you last week

My first inclination was to go to 5 to 7k with this, thinking that in the early days that armies would be smaller. Then I read numbers like 80 and 85 thousand troops, and figured that our little 960 men armies would be fine historically .

Now I am looking at less money again, but now with larger units. Imagine 5k and 120 man units (host selects huge). Beyond being a gorgeous spectacle, this transforms the game. You get only half as many units, but they are twice the size.

More thoughts?

[TosaInu]

Hello Tomisama,

Using yari on horseback was a reaction to facing more opponents and especially the need for samurai to fence of packs of ashigaru. The Onin war and some other conflicts before that, changed the battlefield already, but mounted archery should be more important here than we saw up till now.

[Tomisama]

Hello Tomisama,

Using yari on horseback was a reaction to facing more opponents and especially the need for samurai to fence of packs of ashigaru. The Onin war and some other conflicts before that, changed the battlefield already, but mounted archery should be more important here than we saw up till now.

Hiya Tosa

It is my current understanding that the fighting peasants organized into military “ashigaru” units did not happen until 1485, when the ji-samurai formed the ikki army.
If it is as you say, that the mounted yari were a reaction to the quills (stekelvarken ) of the ashigaru, then should the yari cavalry be included in an Onin War conflict, which ended in 1477?

And indeed, I am thinking that without the gun wall, that the cavalry archer will emerge to fill a more important role in samurai wars also


Anyone have a reaction to 120 man units, pro or con?

[ELITEofWARMANGINGERYBREADMEN88]

Hiya Tosa

It is my current understanding that the fighting peasants organized into military “ashigaru” units did not happen until 1485, when the ji-samurai formed the ikki army.
If it is as you say, that the mounted yari were a reaction to the quills (stekelvarken ) of the ashigaru, then should the yari cavalry be included in an Onin War conflict, which ended in 1477?

And indeed, I am thinking that without the gun wall, that the cavalry archer will emerge to fill a more important role in samurai wars also


Anyone have a reaction to 120 man units, pro or con?

Pro. But just my opinion.

[TosaInu]

Hiya Tosa

It is my current understanding that the fighting peasants organized into military “ashigaru” units did not happen until 1485, when the ji-samurai formed the ikki army.
If it is as you say, that the mounted yari were a reaction to the quills (stekelvarken ) of the ashigaru, then should the yari cavalry be included in an Onin War conflict, which ended in 1477?

And indeed, I am thinking that without the gun wall, that the cavalry archer will emerge to fill a more important role in samurai wars also


Anyone have a reaction to 120 man units, pro or con?

Hello Tomisama,

There have always been non samurai in the armies. Ashigaru became more an organised and professional unit during sengoku jidai and samurai became more a free duck.

I'm not sure about (authentically) excluding units, except for teppo. I'm sure that samurai would use whatever is available, but mounted archery is more important. But for a game, anything is fine with me.

[Tomisama]

Hello Tomisama,

There have always been non samurai in the armies. Ashigaru became more an organised and professional unit during sengoku jidai and samurai became more a free duck.

I'm not sure about (authentically) excluding units, except for teppo. I'm sure that samurai would use whatever is available, but mounted archery is more important. But for a game, anything is fine with me.

Well, since simple is always best, lets make Onin Rules just no guns.

Have a game or two and see what develops



I really would like to play with big armies again some time though

[ELITEofWARMANGINGERYBREADMEN88]

I hear you guys did a no gun game yesterday. I see if I can come back this Sunday if School Permits. What type of money you guys used? normal 9k for the No Gun or no?