Fanatic’s First Cohort/Phalanx/Elephant/Chariot minimod

[Mr Durian]

I know nothing about BI, I don't even own it.

Could this be the reason why the mod wont install, because I have BI installed?

[Charge]

You need to extract 'Chocolate' archive, and copy 'EB' folder from it to your RTW main folder (with exe).

[TWFanatic]

Charge has sent me Imperial First Cohort unit cards (thank you!). If you downloaded this mod prior to 00:30 GMT November second, you did not get it. You can download it in the title post as a seperate download (so it's quick).

Ok, thanks a lot. Fixed the problem :)

Great!

[icydawgfish]

Is this compatable w/the city mod? I assume it would be, but I'm just double checking.

[TWFanatic]

Is this compatable w/the city mod? I assume it would be, but I'm just double checking.

No, because both have different EDB files. I suppose it would be simple enough to edit that file then upload it though...
Atm, the city mod's download link is broken. When it's fixed, I'll download it, edit it, then upload a second EDB file for people who want to use both the city mod and this mod.

As for the "naming legions" ability, I'll try to make that work as soon as I get my home computer (which has all my gaming stuff on it) back from the shop.

[Intranetusa]

Great!

Crap, I was looking at a sarrissa phalanx and not the classical phalanx...I still have that problem with hoplites even with defend turned off...>.<

[TWFanatic]

I'm very sorry, but there's nothing I can do. This mod is working for me and everyone else, so I can only assume that you made some mistake during the installation. I hope you can fix it, but if not, perhaps you could just uninstall. Good luck!

[Charge]

@Intranetusa
Check EDU entry for that unit and ensure it have
stat_pri_attr ........... light_spear, short_pike
attribute. If not -> files not overwriten..

camillan triarii

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

type roman infantry triarii early
dictionary roman_infantry_triarii_early ; Triarii
category infantry
class spearmen
voice_type General_1
soldier roman_infantry_triariiearly, 40, 0, 1.22
officer ebofficer_roman_early_centurion
officer ebofficer_roman_early_standard
mount_effect elephant -1
attributes sea_faring, hide_forest, can_sap
formation 0.9, 1.1, 2, 2.4, 4, square
stat_health 1, 0
stat_pri 13, 10, no, 0, 0, melee, simple, piercing, spear, 0 ,0.13
stat_pri_attr light_spear, short_pike
stat_sec 0, 0, no, 0, 0, no, no, no, none, 0 ,0.1
stat_sec_attr no
stat_pri_armour 11, 9, 7, metal
stat_sec_armour 0, 0, flesh
stat_heat 4
stat_ground 0, 0, -3, -2
stat_mental 13, disciplined, highly_trained
stat_charge_dist 30
stat_fire_delay 0
stat_food 60, 300
stat_cost 1, 2268, 567, 50, 697, 2268
ownership seleucid, slave

before:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

type roman infantry triarii early
dictionary roman_infantry_triarii_early ; Triarii
category infantry
class spearmen
voice_type General_1
soldier roman_infantry_triariiearly, 40, 0, 1.22
officer ebofficer_roman_early_centurion
officer ebofficer_roman_early_standard
mount_effect elephant -1
attributes sea_faring, hide_forest, can_sap
formation 0.9, 1.1, 2, 2.4, 4, square
stat_health 1, 0
stat_pri 15, 8, no, 0, 0, melee, simple, piercing, spear, 0 ,0.13
stat_pri_attr light_spear
stat_sec 0, 0, no, 0, 0, no, no, no, none, 0 ,0.1
stat_sec_attr no
stat_pri_armour 12, 9, 4, metal
stat_sec_armour 0, 0, flesh
stat_heat 4
stat_ground 0, 0, -3, -2
stat_mental 13, disciplined, highly_trained
stat_charge_dist 30
stat_fire_delay 0
stat_food 60, 300
stat_cost 1, 2268, 567, 50, 697, 2268
ownership seleucid

[Intranetusa]

@Intranetusa
Check EDU entry for that unit and ensure it have
stat_pri_attr ........... light_spear, short_pike
attribute. If not -> files not overwriten..

camillan triarii

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

type roman infantry triarii early
dictionary roman_infantry_triarii_early ; Triarii
category infantry
class spearmen
voice_type General_1
soldier roman_infantry_triariiearly, 40, 0, 1.22
officer ebofficer_roman_early_centurion
officer ebofficer_roman_early_standard
mount_effect elephant -1
attributes sea_faring, hide_forest, can_sap
formation 0.9, 1.1, 2, 2.4, 4, square
stat_health 1, 0
stat_pri 13, 10, no, 0, 0, melee, simple, piercing, spear, 0 ,0.13
stat_pri_attr light_spear, short_pike
stat_sec 0, 0, no, 0, 0, no, no, no, none, 0 ,0.1
stat_sec_attr no
stat_pri_armour 11, 9, 7, metal
stat_sec_armour 0, 0, flesh
stat_heat 4
stat_ground 0, 0, -3, -2
stat_mental 13, disciplined, highly_trained
stat_charge_dist 30
stat_fire_delay 0
stat_food 60, 300
stat_cost 1, 2268, 567, 50, 697, 2268
ownership seleucid, slave

before:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

type roman infantry triarii early
dictionary roman_infantry_triarii_early ; Triarii
category infantry
class spearmen
voice_type General_1
soldier roman_infantry_triariiearly, 40, 0, 1.22
officer ebofficer_roman_early_centurion
officer ebofficer_roman_early_standard
mount_effect elephant -1
attributes sea_faring, hide_forest, can_sap
formation 0.9, 1.1, 2, 2.4, 4, square
stat_health 1, 0
stat_pri 15, 8, no, 0, 0, melee, simple, piercing, spear, 0 ,0.13
stat_pri_attr light_spear
stat_sec 0, 0, no, 0, 0, no, no, no, none, 0 ,0.1
stat_sec_attr no
stat_pri_armour 12, 9, 4, metal
stat_sec_armour 0, 0, flesh
stat_heat 4
stat_ground 0, 0, -3, -2
stat_mental 13, disciplined, highly_trained
stat_charge_dist 30
stat_fire_delay 0
stat_food 60, 300
stat_cost 1, 2268, 567, 50, 697, 2268
ownership seleucid

Yeh, that's exactly what I have...weird. Maybe I need to start a new game :/


No problem TWfanatic, I'll work it out somehow.

[A Terribly Harmful Name]

Thank you, TWFanatic. One of the biggest troubles with hoplites before was their lack of tactical organization, especially out of guard mode.

[svramj]

This further improves EBs balance thanks TWfanatic

[Midnj]

1. Is there any way to make it so the rear rank hoplites turn their spears horizontal (as opposed to pointing upwards @ 45 degrees) when they thrust? It looks kind of weird to have them kill someone by poking the air above the man's head.

2. Is there any way to make the short_pike hoplites charge properly? Eg. if you do a custom battle with one of the short_pike hoplites vs anything else and just click on them to attack, they will approach, sort of charge, then stop right in front of the enemy thus negating any charge bonus.

I really like the concept of the changes to the hoplites but these are somewhat problematic. I've been experimenting trying to fix it but haven't had any luck so far.

3. Is the short_pike and spear bonus cumulative for +16 vs cavalry? Or does the short_pike override the spear bonus? In other words, if I were to remove just the short_pike part of the mod and keep the rest, would that negatively impact the unit balance?

Thanks!

[Lgk]

Short_pike goes to hell, i'd say. Everything it brings into gameplay is another assortment of bugs.

[konny]

2. Is there any way to make the short_pike hoplites charge properly? Eg. if you do a custom battle with one of the short_pike hoplites vs anything else and just click on them to attack, they will approach, sort of charge, then stop right in front of the enemy thus negating any charge bonus.

The charge bonus for infantry is so low that it won't do anything. At least I haven't seen anyone dying from an infantry charge. Even cavalry needs a 25+ bonus to do any notable damage with the charge.

[TWFanatic]

1. Is there any way to make it so the rear rank hoplites turn their spears horizontal (as opposed to pointing upwards @ 45 degrees) when they thrust? It looks kind of weird to have them kill someone by poking the air above the man's head.

2. Is there any way to make the short_pike hoplites charge properly? Eg. if you do a custom battle with one of the short_pike hoplites vs anything else and just click on them to attack, they will approach, sort of charge, then stop right in front of the enemy thus negating any charge bonus.

I really like the concept of the changes to the hoplites but these are somewhat problematic. I've been experimenting trying to fix it but haven't had any luck so far.

3. Is the short_pike and spear bonus cumulative for +16 vs cavalry? Or does the short_pike override the spear bonus? In other words, if I were to remove just the short_pike part of the mod and keep the rest, would that negatively impact the unit balance?

Thanks!

1. No. Short_pike has ups and downs, this is one of the downs. However, all things considered, the ups far outweigh the downs in many people's opinions. Don't be afraid to test this mod to see which you prefer--uninstallation is easy with the backup file.

2. All Infantry charge like that. I have increased the charge of all hoplite units, not that it even means anything though, for as Konny said infantry charges are worthless in RTW (meaning there's nothing EB can do about it).

3. The effects are not cumulative AFAIK. Btw, all spear-armed units in EB use short_spear. I changed this with hoplites to just spear (in addition to short_pike). Spear greatly increases a unit's pushing power.

[Midnj]

1. No. Short_pike has ups and downs, this is one of the downs. However, all things considered, the ups far outweigh the downs in many people's opinions. Don't be afraid to test this mod to see which you prefer--uninstallation is easy with the backup file.

2. All Infantry charge like that. I have increased the charge of all hoplite units, not that it even means anything though, for as Konny said infantry charges are worthless in RTW (meaning there's nothing EB can do about it).

3. The effects are not cumulative AFAIK. Btw, all spear-armed units in EB use short_spear. I changed this with hoplites to just spear (in addition to short_pike). Spear greatly increases a unit's pushing power.

Great, thanks!

Don't get me wrong I really like the fact that the hoplites stay together and can _actually_ break a line via pushing without either killing the entire unit in front of it or forcing them to rout. It adds a new tactical dimension to battles. In fact I probably won't take out the short_pike when I play a faction that relies on hoplites.

Did not know all infantry charge was screwed up and I guess it hindsight it really doesn't matter too much..

Thanks for the great mod!

[Titus Flaminius]

cool looking units

[Demivrgvs]

I quite like what you did and I've some questions and nitpicking if you don't mind.

Phalangites:
- you said that shield bonuses are doubled when in phalanx formation, does this stacks with shield bonuses being doubled against missiles? Maybe I've misunderstood and it's the same thing all units share and not something related to phalanx. If the shield bonus is doubled by the very phalanx formation then I think having those relatively small shields with 5 is too high when most larger shields only have 4. I would make them 3 as if it correctly becomes 6 when in formation it would still be the most powerful shield protection in the game

Hoplites
- I would at least reduce your shield bonuses by 1, 5 seems alread enough. If you want them to better perform on the front and still be vulnerable to rear attacks incresing defence skill may be better imo

[blado]

Just in case I decide I don't like this mod. I should backup the export_descr_unit.txt in C:\Rome - Total War\Data right? Or is there something else I should backup too.

[TWFanatic]

No. You should backup Rome: Total War/EB/mp game edu backup and sp game edu backup.

[Intranetusa]

I wonder if the First cohort mod can work in conjunction with the 'phalanx mod' ?


Actually, I don't even remember what the phalanx mod does. I downloaded it with other mods such as the First Cohort mod and the AI battle formations mod - I have no idea what the phalanx mod does...?

Can anyone help?

[TWFanatic]

See the first post for info/downloads. I have updated this mod for 1.1--it is now just a "phalanx/aquilifer" mod as the EB team have fixed the other areas with the 1.1 Patch.

[Prussian to the Iron]

i tried this, and i cannot get my hoplites to actually move in a phalanx formation. they stand still with long spears, but when ready, they hold them backwards and above them, and if ordered to charge or move, switch to the old, short spears

[desert]

Hey, TWFanatic; a moment of your time, if you will:

In your description of the mod, you mention that without it hoplites "break formation and charge like unorganized rabble", and with it "they stay in a tight, orderly formation and slam into the enemy as one..."

So, apparently, it is almost impossible for a phalanx to maintain cohesion during a charge, and they didn't organize back into a line until the back rows had caught up with the front. That means that the old style of charge was actually correct.

And, to be clear, I'm talking about regular hoplites, not phalangites.

[Phalanx300]

TWFanatic, I've noticed that in this version you don't have this "ultra push". Or am I the only one not having it? I actually prefer this version rather then the radius change if the ultra push is gone.

[desert]

Ultra push?

What's that?

And I think he might not be around anymore.

[Iskander 3.1]

So do I just extract the export_descr_unit contained in the "sp game edu backup" folder into the RTW\data folder?

[Cyrus]

Hello
i downloaded your mod once and it worked perfectly,(i'm using BI.exe) then i had to uninstall the game and redownload your mod. however this time it doesn't work.... i've even tried extracting it to the eb and BI folder, but still nothing changes, please i really liked this mod!

[Iskander 3.1]

Hmmm, anyone?