Vigiles (Roman Marian unit)

**Lucasiewicz** · 11-06-2007, 22:20

I would like to know why this unit is only available partially troughout my empire (excluding Aegyptus, Asia Minor, Syria, etc.). Where did it historically reside? I've also noted that it disappears again with the imperial reforms. Why is that, did it historically disappear at that time?

In other words, anyone who can give me some info on this unit in particular or some general info on Roman garrisons, is very welcome!

**Sakkura** · 11-06-2007, 22:28

The answer I got was that they represent various garrison troop types. The real-world vigiles were a paramilitary firefighting/police force inaugurated by Augustus, so EB isn't 100% historical on this point.

**Lucasiewicz** · 11-06-2007, 22:37

Originally Posted by Sakkura

The real-world vigiles were a paramilitary firefighting/police force inaugurated by Augustus

But now they disappear with the imperial reforms?

**Sakkura** · 11-07-2007, 00:26

Originally Posted by Lucasiewicz

But now they disappear with the imperial reforms?

Like I said, it doesn't appear to be the most historical side of EB. But it was impossible to include say 10 different garrison units for the Romans, and I guess they decided to call it vigiles since it sounds very... Roman. Plus people know more or less what they were. Then for some reason the real vigiles weren't deemed worthy of inclusion in the game; perhaps they were not military enough compared to the garrison forces of the Marian era? Or perhaps they were too small?

**MarcusAureliusAntoninus** · 11-07-2007, 01:25

Vigiles are latin garrison troops. They are only available in the west, since in the east simple garrison troops were all Hellenistic. They shouldn't disappear with the Augustan Reform.

**Sakkura** · 11-07-2007, 01:31

Originally Posted by MarcusAureliusAntoninus

They shouldn't disappear with the Augustan Reform.

Oh, cool. What do I know, I've never reached that reform

And the unit cards say only Marian for the vigiles, I'll try and find a place to post to let Arka know. His computer can't stay blown up forever, hopefully

**Lucasiewicz** · 11-07-2007, 16:29

If I want the Vigiles to remain troughout the imperial reforms, would I just have to update the export_descr_buildings file? If so, could someone point me the way to the tool needed to do this. Because I don't feel like editing it by hand, it's gotten a little bit to big...

PS: I haven't reached the imperial reforms either, but my statement is based on arka's unit card and the recruitment viewer, which both denote it as a Marian-only unit.

**Admetos** · 11-07-2007, 17:25

Originally Posted by Lucasiewicz
If I want the Vigiles to remain troughout the imperial reforms, would I just have to update the export_descr_buildings file? If so, could someone point me the way to the tool needed to do this. Because I don't feel like editing it by hand, it's gotten a little bit to big...

PS: I haven't reached the imperial reforms either, but my statement is based on arka's unit card and the recruitment viewer, which both denote it as a Marian-only unit.

Originally Posted by MarcusAureliusAntoninus
They shouldn't disappear with the Augustan Reform.

**Lucasiewicz** · 11-07-2007, 18:10

They shouldn't disappear with the Augustan Reform.

okay, if someone states that they won't disappear, out of personal proof or an empirical study, I'm inclined to believe that. As for now, I believe Arka's unit card and the recruitment viewer. :)

**Respenus** · 11-07-2007, 18:13

Someone once told me, that to keep the number of units "low", both Marian and Augustus levy garrison units are vigiles, although not historically 100% true.

**runes** · 11-07-2007, 18:59

i use these guys alot. very useful.

**Megas Methuselah** · 11-07-2007, 19:26

To put out fires?

**overweightninja** · 11-07-2007, 19:37

Originally Posted by Lucasiewicz

okay, if someone states that they won't disappear, out of personal proof or an empirical study, I'm inclined to believe that. As for now, I believe Arka's unit card and the recruitment viewer. :)

They won't disappear, I'm currently playing a blitz roman campaign, I got the Marians in something silly like 220bc, then I accidentally (well it wasn't an accident, I offered the Karthies a cease fire if they gave me all of Africa, and the tards went for it. As my modified script goes purely on number of settlements this tipped me into the Imperial reforms).
Anyway, waffle aside, no I have the imperial reforms and I can still get vigiles. Arkas cards and the viewer (surprisingly enough, I thought it just went off the game code) must have misinformed you.

Cheers

**Sakkura** · 11-07-2007, 19:40

Originally Posted by Methuselah

To put out fires?

They even got a nickname sort of like "bucketeers".

**runes** · 11-07-2007, 20:33

whoops, was thinking of rorarii, heh.

**MarcusAureliusAntoninus** · 11-07-2007, 21:56

Originally Posted by Lucasiewicz

okay, if someone states that they won't disappear, out of personal proof or an empirical study, I'm inclined to believe that. As for now, I believe Arka's unit card and the recruitment viewer. :)

I am 99.9% sure they are in the Augustan Era. Their name is something like "roman_infantry_imperial_vigiles" for one thing. They were in the Imperial Era in 08x and should still be in the Imperial Era. The only reason they won't be would be some sort of recruitment error, which I doubt.

And it seems "overweightninja" has gotten them in 1.0.

**Lucasiewicz** · 11-08-2007, 18:56

well, thanks for the replies all. But I'm still wondering if someone could give some more detailed info on how the Romans historically manned their garrisons in their Eastern Holdings. I simply can't imagine right now that such a bureaucrastic state as the Roman empire would garrison everything with local Hellenic troops.

**Philippus Flavius Homovallumus** · 11-08-2007, 23:16

Well most of Greece was "Free" so, yes that's what they did in this era. Later it was all about the auxillaries.

**Watchman** · 11-08-2007, 23:43

There's also the fact that early on the Roman troops were militia reservists; keeping them mobilized abroad meant they weren't home taking care of their fields and businesses. The later standing legions conversely were bloody expensive to maintain, due to the assorted running costs of full-time soldiers (eg. wages and replacement gear), and duly tended to form a sort of linchpin of the forces stationed in a region with most of the actual day-to-day patrolling being carried out by the Auxilia and various local troops.