Unit Balancing

[Bwian]

I am building up a rough conversion spreadsheet, trying to work in some of hte factors. I need to come up with a rough cost/attack.defence kind of sum that will give a balanced overall number. This will give me my base line to work from. It will throw up some daft values, but these can be manually changed. Cannon fodder units with a quarter of the power of say, a Bone Giant would not be a quarter of the cost. There will be a need to build higher buildings and special structures to make such things, and these costs are also a factor. These sorts of things will be manually adjusted.

So... we need to work out a rough approach to convert WH armour and attack values to something that will work in TW land, and also factor in the creation and upkeep costs. There will be some 'juggling' to get some of the less usual units done ... since I think things like Zombies and undead units would not necessarily be expensive to buy, but might require a lot more upkeep ( Necromancers don't work cheap! ) to keep them in the field. Likewise, the build times might be another factor to juggle. VC's could raise a swarm of undead from the graveyards in no time at all, and have them in combat.... but might have to pay a lot of gold to have the spells cast!

So..ladies and gentlemen, we need to come up with some ideas and calculations, plus think about a base 'unit' to work our values from... and come up with a starting point for some playtesting.

[A Norseman]

I have said it before... Use whatever modificaton King Kong uses in his Stainless Steal mod for a basic adjustment of the stats. And vary the diffrent units after this basic.

For example:

type Armored Sergeants
dictionary Armored_Sergeants ; Armoured Sergeants
category infantry
class spearmen
voice_type Heavy
banner faction main_spear
banner holy crusade
soldier Armored_Sergeants, 60, 0, 1
attributes sea_faring, hide_forest, can_withdraw, free_upkeep_unit
formation 1.0, 0, 2.0, 2.0, 4, square, schiltrom
stat_health 1, 0
stat_pri 5, 3, no, 0, 0, melee, melee_blade, piercing, spear, 25, 1
stat_pri_attr spear, spear_bonus_4
stat_sec 0, 0, no, 0, 0, no, melee_simple, blunt, none, 0, 1
stat_sec_attr no
stat_pri_armour 5, 2, 6, metal
stat_sec_armour 0, 0, flesh
stat_heat 4
stat_ground 1, -2, 3, 2
stat_mental 7, normal, trained
stat_charge_dist 5
stat_fire_delay 0
stat_food 60, 300
stat_cost 1, 340, 150, 85, 65, 340, 4, 130
armour_ug_levels 2, 3
armour_ug_models Armored_Sergeants, Armored_Sergeants_ug1

Here is a unit stat over armored sergants. A medicore spearmen unit.
Here is his stats:


-----------------
Atack: 5
Charge: 3
-----------------
Armor: 5
Defence: 2
Shield: 6
-----------------
Moral: 7.
Cost: 340
upkeep: 150.

From this basic, you can adjust after the skill of the spearmen in the warhammer world.

The skeleton Spearmen is a weak spearmen unit.
Here i use a little lower than the Sergants


frighten_foot
Frighten_horse
---------------
Attack: 3
Charge: 2
--------------
Armor: 0
Defence: 2
Shield: 6
--------------
Moral: ??
Cost: 100
Upkeep: 75

Imperial Spearmen is a medicore spearmen unit
Here i use about the same as the Sergants.

-----------------
Attack: 4
Charge: 3
-----------------
Armor: 6
Defence: 2
Shield: 5
-----------------
Moral: 6.
Cost: 250
upkeep: 150.

High Elf Spearmen is a Elite spearmen unit.
Here i use higher stats than the Sergant.

-----------------
Attack: 6
Charge: 2
-----------------
Armor: 6
Defence: 5
Shield: 6
-----------------
Moral: 9.
Cost: 400
upkeep: 200.

This is a sugestion to how you may do it. I hope you find the best solution.

[uanime5]

Point Blank also made a mod for M2TW (Real Combat) that gave the units are more realisitic attack and defence. If you download his mod (http://www.twcenter.net/forums/downl...o=file&id=1520) it comes with a rft file that explains how he's calculating upkeep.

[Phats]

Just thought I would post up a link to the Statistical Conversion Thread as a refresher on the topic.

[Bwian]

Gentlemen...please be assured, I know the basic mechanics ofthe stats and how all that works...and I know how to get a balance for units... what I need to sort out is a conversion from Warhammer values to M2TW stats, so the units have the correct relative values and a cost that represents the number of army points one unit would take up

we would need:

1) An army point - Unit cost conversion factor.

2) A base set of stats the reflect a units attack or defence value in Warhammer

3) A rough guide to how special attributes that cannot be shown in TW land would affect unit stats to beef up a unit that would not come out as relatively strong as it should ..and so on.

I can just go ahead and do it... but I want to involve the community so we can get a wider spread of suggestions and ideas.

I had planned to use the Empire as a baseline, since they are 'human normal' and probably the closest to an existing M2TW faction in terms of weapons and armour. Seems the easiest faction to start with!

[lanky316]

I'd suggest the basis is to work out, what is a standard human value and work from there deciding the rest. It's not going to be definate but if I'm going at it we'll say take movement and inititive add those together for movement speed (with standard human I believe it's 4+3 so 7) and adding 1 to each point of either. I haven't really thought about this in depth so give me a couple of days with an old army book and I'll see if I can find some more ideas and expand on it. Just to find you've already got a better system :P