Is that true that the EB team dislike Romans ?

[Conradus]

Well, in the case of the Romans you could argue that they DID do something to you (well, your ancestors) if your Jewish, German, English, Greek (and the list goes on.)

If that would be a reason to be mad, we should be mad at: Romans, Franks, Vikings, French, Germans, Spanish, Dutch, French, Austrians, French and Dutch. Can you guess the country?
Really, how could anyone be mad at something that happened to your ancestors 2000 odd years ago?

[Tellos Athenaios]

Belgian, I take it?

[Pharnakes]

Even the people we today see as the most 'civilized' of the time, the Romans, and to a lesser extent the Greeks, were all barbarians and murderers whose leaders were also barbarians and murderers.

Gosh, how little the world changes in 2,000 years...

[dezzerx]

Belgian, I take it?

Meh, if he is Belgian (Flemish) than he can scratch the Dutch of his invader list because in my opinion the Flemish and the Dutch are the same one. Except we have the cooler accents ofcourse! And better food.

[Conradus]

Belgian, I take it?

Of course, have a beer

[Conradus]

Meh, if he is Belgian (Flemish) than he can scratch the Dutch of his invader list because in my opinion the Flemish and the Dutch are the same one. Except we have the cooler accents ofcourse! And better food.

We are everything but the same, but when they appeared the first time on my list, I was referring to their becoming independent and letting us stay under Spanish rule, and then taking all our scientists, artists,... draining us completely for 150 years or so.
And the second time, from 1815 till 1830 they were our occupiers :)

[dezzerx]

We are everything but the same, but when they appeared the first time on my list, I was referring to their becoming independent and letting us stay under Spanish rule, and then taking all our scientists, artists,... draining us completely for 150 years or so.
And the second time, from 1815 till 1830 they were our occupiers :)

In that case I vote we go and take our scientists and artists back and get some Spaniards to rule them!

OT: I have been playing a Romani campaign lately, and I love it. I think it is very unfair to say the EB team hates the Romans. Especially if you see the amount of work they have put in to the faction.

[Starforge]

If that would be a reason to be mad, we should be mad at: Romans, Franks, Vikings, French, Germans, Spanish, Dutch, French, Austrians, French and Dutch. Can you guess the country?
Really, how could anyone be mad at something that happened to your ancestors 2000 odd years ago?

Your point is spot on but completely beside the point since we're talking about personal feelings tied to one's own ancestry. In an abstract and maybe evolutionary way it's like harming ones family (regardless that it was in the distant past.) Rationalizing feelings gets pretty murky .

Belgian.....should have known (hands the beer back and grabs a Guinness - unless they have Becks dark on tap)

[C.LVCIANVS]

The question is: Is it true that Romans dislike the EB Team?
The answer is : Who cares? Everybody hates me!!!!

[Krusader]

Hannibal was a great commander, but as was said on him, " He knew how to win a battle, but not how to win a war". To finish off the romans he needed to besiege and capture Rome, and that would have been a long struggle, knowing that the romans had a policy of no peace terms without total victory. Even if the Poeni would have send more aid to Hannibal, Rome's former allies would still not trust him and maybe with time would ally with Rome again, to kick the foreign invader out of Italia. Rome was choosen by the almighty God to earn its place in history, and history is written by the victor, hate him or love him.

Roma Victoria.
Long live the Emperor

Cheers.

You haven't heard of Hasdrubal & his defeat at Metaurus?

[TWFanatic]

Why hate? They didn't do anything to you.

Well, they actually did...modern society in most parts of the world would be far, far different had the Romans not conquered to the extent they did. Arguably for the worse. I think many people here are "joking" when they say they hate the Romans, simply because they wish other factions were more popular (and other reasons I don't understand).

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

I've heard some people saying that is that right uh ?

No.

Hannibal was a great commander, but as was said on him, " He knew how to win a battle, but not how to win a war". To finish off the romans he needed to besiege and capture Rome, and that would have been a long struggle, knowing that the romans had a policy of no peace terms without total victory. Even if the Poeni would have send more aid to Hannibal, Rome's former allies would still not trust him and maybe with time would ally with Rome again, to kick the foreign invader out of Italia. Rome was choosen by the almighty God to earn its place in history, and history is written by the victor, hate him or love him.

Roma Victoria.
Long live the Emperor

Cheers.

DO NOT post crap like that outside the backroom. You may find you offend people.

[Tiberius Nero]

Well, they actually did...modern society in most parts of the world would be far, far different had the Romans not conquered to the extent they did. Arguably for the worse.

How do you define "for the worse" when there is no possible way of thinking the alternatives or indeed of defining "good" in history?

[Starforge]

How do you define "for the worse" when there is no possible way of thinking the alternatives or indeed of defining "good" in history?

Don't mind him - he's probably Italian

[Maeran]

How do you define "for the worse" when there is no possible way of thinking the alternatives or indeed of defining "good" in history?

For the worse, as far as I can tell means "less like my own society."

[CaesarAugustus]

There's no real way of telling if a different society would be "worse", but I must agree that I definently love this Roman Western society we live in today... I cannot imagine how different a Carthaginian, (un-Romanized) Hellenistic, or *shudder* Celtic-dominated world would evolve into a modern society.

[Tellos Athenaios]

Meh, if he is Belgian (Flemish) than he can scratch the Dutch of his invader list because in my opinion the Flemish and the Dutch are the same one. Except we have the cooler accents ofcourse! And better food.

Not entirely right. The difference between the Dutch and the Flemish is that well... talk to Dutch girls.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

The Flemish are just cute, and will never get past the "boy" stage. Their accent and the fact that the Flemish tend to be somewhat smaller than the Dutch contribute to this...

[blitzkrieg80]

We are all Romans because we throw away culture and heritage for the sake of mass production, convenience and efficiency. That is truly Rome. Thus why most of Western Europe and America of non-Italic descent considers itself inheritors of Rome... I went to Japan and they have become Roman. Almost everyone you see or interact with in Japan is using a cell-phone, dressed in a Western European-style suit (they have weddings in such clothes more often than not these days), and they hardly ever are polite (as modern people in any big city) or bow to each other as you might think they would IN JAPAN what happened to the world?! oh yeah, Rome... and why "Rome"? Because they were the first to show the world that there was more to be gained from "do as the Romans" than the ultra-conservatism of other cultures. Although technically Alexanders' influence during the Hellenistic Age was a key building-block.

[Tiberius Nero]

There's no real way of telling if a different society would be "worse", but I must agree that I definently love this Roman Western society we live in today... I cannot imagine how different a Carthaginian, (un-Romanized) Hellenistic, or *shudder* Celtic-dominated world would evolve into a modern society.

What do you mean by "a modern society" and why could this not have been achieved otherwise than through Roman domination?

[Intranetusa]

We are all Romans because we throw away culture and heritage for the sake of mass production, convenience and efficiency. That is truly Rome. Thus why most of Western Europe and America of non-Italic descent considers itself inheritors of Rome... I went to Japan and they have become Roman. Almost everyone you see or interact with in Japan is using a cell-phone, dressed in a Western European-style suit (they have weddings in such clothes more often than not these days), and they hardly ever are polite (as modern people in any big city) or bow to each other as you might think they would IN JAPAN what happened to the world?! oh yeah, Rome... and why "Rome"? Because they were the first to show the world that there was more to be gained from "do as the Romans" than the ultra-conservatism of other cultures. Although technically Alexanders' influence during the Hellenistic Age was a key building-block.

Mass production, convenience, and efficiency aren't necessarily Roman traits, or even western. We all use soap, and modern soap was invented by the Arabs. We use numbers created by the Hindus. We use paper created by Chinese. etc

People today don't belong to any single cultural heritage. No society is pure due to exchange of trade, ideas, and technology via globalization. Thus Egypt & Near Eastern civilizations is often lumped in as ancient western civilization. XD

[blitzkrieg80]

I guess you missed my point entirely, probably because I failed to explain myself properly or articulately. The Romans were not even Romans, but they wanted to call themselves so. It is a fact that the USA does not teach that Western European culture is most firmly rooted in Egypt or the Near East, but that does not diminish what they accomplished and it does show a bias in thought. It is a fact that universities in the USA teach Graeco-Roman / Judeo-Christian culture as the foundation of Western Civilization. My point was that the only reason those cultures are attributed for so much is the amount of amalgamation and cultural diffusion which took place in Graeco-Roman culture, this practice indeed became part of their identity, with them eventually forsaking old tradition (often not by choice) for the sake of fusion and stability, yet great steps toward modernity. This is unique because humans are inherently conservative- "if it ain't broke, don't fix it." The Renaissance looked back to those times for the same reasons which make them stand out, using the plethora of culture available, including Arab, Persian, ect.

I personally feel that the vast Eurasian steppe has more influence on history and culture than many of the great civilizations of Asia and the Near East, nonetheless Europe... Pastoralism, chariots, heavy cavalry, horse-archers, compound bow, saddle, stirrup, Persians, Scythians, Parthians, Huns, Magyars, Turks, Mongols (and many more), oh my! The study of epidemiology in the context of history is very important as well as innovation in warfare, because one cannot underestimate the impact of disease spread through the movements of peoples and exposure of populations without immunities to those of other lifeways.

[Intranetusa]

I guess you missed my point entirely. The Romans were not even Romans, but they wanted to call themselves so.

I can no longer distinguish between deadpan humor, irony, or sarcasm after the Daily Show & Colbert Report went off air due to the Writer's Guild Strike... :(

[NeoSpartan]

Gertrude... S.T.F.U

this and ur other post of Epiros is Freaking STUPID!

[keravnos]

I've heard some people saying that is that right uh ?

Nope. What we dislike is the fact that so many things we supposedly know about all other people in history is relevant to their relationship to the Romani.

I do believe that the Romani depiction as is found in EB is one of the greatest around. They weren't supermen, still they won it all, by having and fielding the best troops and commanders. My own theory is that the centurions are the reason why they conquered the world, but that 's another story.

It was difficult at first for the Romani, then it became easier, then by the time of the Imperial refomrs, it was a walk in the park. That's exactly how EB views them.

Now, if you want Romani with machineguns and kevlar, you can always mod them in, or play other mods who do consider them supermen. Their magnificence wasn't that they were the absolute best. Their magnificence was that from a mere city they basically conquered the world. Think about that for a moment. Hasn't been done since, and probably wont ever again.

[Thaatu]

I can no longer distinguish between deadpan humor, irony, or sarcasm after the Daily Show & Colbert Report went off air due to the Writer's Guild Strike... :(

I no longer know what humour, irony and sarcasm are after Stewart and Colbert went off the air... But don't think we've lost everything. At least we have the suffering.

[Fionnlagh]

Well its just my opinion but none the less. I think the world would be more interesting if the Celts had just killed off all of the Romans in 390 B.C. Christianity probably would of never taken off as it did. That alone would change quite a lot of history right there; Crusades being the most obvious one. A lot of us would probably be sporting long hair and a mustache, also if I remember right, a belt tax would still be around:P
Probably still be in Tribal and Clan family structures. War seasons would still be in fashion:P I don't know about you guys but the concept of cattle raiding to gain riches would certainly make for a interesting and fast paced life lol.

[Pharnakes]

I don't know about you guys but the concept of cattle raiding to gain riches would certainly make for a interesting and fast paced life lol.

Well, where I come from that died out about 150 years ago. In some cases it still hasn't...

[blitzkrieg80]

I no longer know what humour, irony and sarcasm are after Stewart and Colbert went off the air... But don't think we've lost everything. At least we have the suffering.

Don't forget our state of FEAR

[Thaatu]

Don't forget our state of FEAR

Hey, I'm a million miles away. The only thing I'm afraid of is whether I'll ever see Daily Show again.

[blank]

A lot of us would probably be sporting long hair and a mustache

Like in the 70s?

also if I remember right, a belt tax would still be around:P
Probably still be in Tribal and Clan family structures.

In that case all countries should be monarchies now, like Rome was in it's glory days
Slaves, too.
In other words, no - Celtic heritage would not disallow evolution

War seasons would still be in fashion

Well now we have war years, i'm not entirely sure which is better