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  1. #1
    Grand Patron's Banner Bearer Senior Member Peasant Phill's Avatar
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    Default Some tactical notes

    Quote Originally Posted by Glenn
    Corleone, I had not used any Men-At-Arms, for I found them to be very weak in a previous campaign as the Castilian faction - however I feel this is because I probably asked to much of them, and expected them to be the spearman and the swordsman.
    I will try them in the way you have mentioned.
    Wait, you found MAA to weak and you used UM instead? Um's are of the lowest quality not in the last place because they are peasants (low morale). MAA will be your best offensive unit until high.

    Quote Originally Posted by Glenn
    As for archers, I had lost faith in them because they did not seem to be effective in mounting casualties, ...
    However, as you have seen, this is because of the ranks in which I deployed them...
    I did perch my men atop a hill - admittedly it was the smallest hill, however it was also the steepest hill, and the closest to the enemy, meaning I was immediately able to loose arrows amongst them, and pressure the Muslims into attacking immediately up a steep advance.
    You use your RTW experience for MTW battles which will get you routed more than you like. Like someone else said, you have to unlearn first. Missile units aren’t the killers in MTW, they are used to cause disruption. They cause premature attacks, halted advances and most importantly they cause a morale drop. This is also where your number of rows come in. The moral won’t drop unless at least 1 soldier dies in a unit. The loss of moral is only temporarily so you have to keep killing with arrows until they rout. The difference between 2 rows and 3 rows is the amount of arrows in 1 volley and the amount of volleys it can fire in 1 minute. 3 rows will fire more volleys of less arrows each. Normal bows reload fast enough that they can keep the moral down deployed in 2 rows. Xbows and firearms can’t always manage that so they may benefit from 3 row deployment.

    Another tip, make the enemy fatigue itself. If the Almohads had to walk half the map, they would be less fit to fight and would rout sooner. Besides a bigger hill = bigger range for your archers = more depletion of enemy units and a less eager attacking force.

    Quote Originally Posted by Glenn

    I had my sergeants formed in a Roman Manipular position, as I intended to charge the enemy when they were climbing the sharpest ascent of my hill.
    Why would you want to charge with your spears when your enemy comes to you? Formation is everything for spear units. Without a close formation they loose a lot of their fighting skill and charging is one of the biggest disrupters of a close formation. Only charge your spears if the enemy doesn’t come to them.

    Quote Originally Posted by Glenn
    This allowed two gaps on either side, on the right I placed the King and two units of spearmen to flank and drive away cavalry.
    The other side housed my archers perfectly, but ineffectively because they were ranked in 4 lines each.
    Good placement of your knights as they are immediately able to flank. You might consider moving your general more to the center if you are afraid it has low moral (locale moral boost).
    But don’t use spearmen as flankers, flankers are fast and have decent melee stats. Spearmen are to cumbersome if you run them round the flanks as they need to reform before engaging and they just don’t kill fast enough. They only serve to lower moral of the flanked unit. Like it has been said, you should’ve used your horses and your UM’s for that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Glenn
    halfway down the eminence, at the place where the ascent is steepest and most difficult, at the point where I intended my infantry to hit the enemy - I placed in hiding two units of Royal Knights - to deliver a heavy charge and then retreat, and three units of Urban Militia to cut apart the back of the enemy.
    This failed because the flanking units were outnumbered by the amount of enemy companies still attempting to catch up to the front line which was fighting the Sergeants.
    It was a excellent plan, using appropriate units to ambush and flank but the execution may have been less than excellent.
    Firstly your UM’s and RK’s should hide somewhere to the side of the path the enemy will most likely take. Otherwise the enemy will stumble on your hidden troops and you will have successfully handed over an isolated part of your fighting force.
    Secondly don’t spring the trap to soon. When you charge out before the enemy is engaged they’ll simply turn and meet you head on. You’ll soon be overwhelmed if this happens. You could charge out sooner if an isolated part of his army is within reach and you’re confidend that you can disengage or destroy that part before help arrives.


    Quote Originally Posted by Glenn
    I found that the Scottish armies are far more suited to my fighting style.
    Clansmen seem to be your cup of tea but don’t forget gallowglasses (AP) and viking units as other similar units. AND don’t forget to build spear units. Clansmen just die to fast if they can’t attack.
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  2. #2

    Default Re: Some tactical notes

    Quote Originally Posted by Peasant Phill
    Why would you want to charge with your spears when your enemy comes to you? Formation is everything for spear units. Without a close formation they loose a lot of their fighting skill and charging is one of the biggest disrupters of a close formation. Only charge your spears if the enemy doesn’t come to them.
    This is a point I can't emphasise enough. Spears are defensive units. They can hold their own in melee against poor quality infantry but against anything else they're not going to get a lot of kills. It's in defence against cavalry units that spears excel. The trick with spear units is not to attack but to use drag positioning and place them in the best position to either hamper your enemies movements, protect your vulberable units tie up/delay specific enemy units while other units are brought in. They are also ideal for hammer and anvil type tactics where the enemy units are held by the spears, and hit from the rear or flank(s) by a good flanking unit.

    On the subject of flankers, good flanking units are those with reasonably good attack, a decent speed, a very strong charge and preferably an armour piercing ability. This can be either cavalry or infantry. Some good flankers are units such as Ghazi Infantry, Gallowglasses, Mamluk Cavalry, Woodsmen, Clansemen and others. Polearm units make the best flankers when dealing with cavalry due to their anti cavalry bonus, especially medium to heavy cavalry that your weaker infantry may not be able to handle. Polearms units include Billmen, Janissary Heavy Infantry, Halberdiers, Swiss Halberdiers and Chivalric Foot Knights (dismount unit).
    Last edited by caravel; 12-13-2007 at 15:20.
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  3. #3

    Default Re: Oh, Portucale!

    I just twigged that the "Spanish" game was in fact Portugal with the XL Mod - so no Jinetes for them, I guess.

    @ Glenn I'm glad you found something suitable to play style. It's fun watching you learn the MTW pieces - and we're all so eager to share when you ask us! (Perhaps you noticed).

    I wonder, though, if Scotland can ever have peace with England in this game ... I am sure your paranoia was justified at seeing an English build up in Northumbria. Where else could those armies go but Scotland?

    It seems you have shown the English the error of their ways. I'll admit that I don't raze provinces - I view them as my property on loan to another faction. I find it a bore to build up from scratch, but hadn't considered ignoring another faction's lands completely.

    With the Scottish clansmen, just be aware that as time passes the other factions will start to armour up and get better units. By 1150 or so they'll be a lot less vulnerable to being swamped by those speedy fanatics. Heavy cavalry charges will do damage to your clansmen, and if you run into a lot of FMAA you will have trouble once the shock of the clansmen's charge is over.

    That said, when playing England I'll always have a unit or two of clansmen around my armies (errr ... of course I take Scotland when I'm playing England).

    Just a minor point - you can identify who has which province if you click and hold a strategic agent over the map - hover it, don't drop it. You'll get the owner of the province in the tooltip. If you want the agent to go back where it came from and have forgotten the drop the agent over the sea - it will return to its start point.

    Let us know how you progress ....

    (I do take the point generally about spears - using them defensively, and so on. Sometimes though you might be stuck needing to use them offensively ... and there are specialty spears like the Muwahids who beg for the chance to charge. The important thing, I think, is to let them form up facing the opposition, if possible. The damage comes when you suddenly ask them to attack someone on their flank, or half way through a manoeuvre.)

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