About the numbers

**Anakuj** · 12-16-2007, 12:39

Dear EB team!

I just would like to get some information about the real (approximate) number of the east hellenes, because I would like to know that, for example the Arche Seleukeia or the Ptolemaioi how many hellene soldiers could raise - far from Hellas. I have read that in Battle of Magnesia there were 10.000 Argyraspidai phalangites and 16.000 other phalangites (Pezhetairoi or Kleruchoi I dont know), 6000 Kataphraktes and about 2-3.000 Hetairio or other medium cavalry. So if we count the Argyraspidai + other phalangits and ~ 4.000 cavalry as hellene (30.000 total), is it - approximately - correct? So what is the theoretical greek (and galatian, judean) soldier capacity of the eastern hellene states?

I would like to know the ~ real numbers too, because I would like to build my army similar to the real one in my new EB campaigns.

Thank you!

**Ludens** · 12-16-2007, 16:40

That's probably correct. I know that the standard Roman consular army of the day was approx. 20.000 men large. However, in EB, as in vanilla R:TW, unit and population numbers should be taken as an abstraction: 20.000 men would be around 8 stacks of units in-game, so it's impossible to properly conduct a battle with them.

**marodeur** · 12-17-2007, 12:24

Originally Posted by Ludens

That's probably correct. I know that the standard Roman consular army of the day was approx. 20.000 men large. However, in EB, as in vanilla R:TW, unit and population numbers should be taken as an abstraction: 20.000 men would be around 8 stacks of units in-game, so it's impossible to properly conduct a battle with them.

I personally use factor 10, playing with large units, to have an approximation (?) of the number of soldiers involved. So, a full stack normally has about 2.500-3.500 soldiers, depending on unit type. That would be approximately 25.000 to 35.000 men - historically often the size of an army involved in a decisive battle. Take two or three stacks at once and you will get a Cannae-feeling ...

**Anakuj** · 12-17-2007, 15:29

Thank You mates! But I henceforward would like to know the real numbers about the theoretical greek (and galatian, judean, thracian) soldier capacity of the eastern hellene states. So experts of EB unite! Please.

**marodeur** · 12-17-2007, 15:46

Originally Posted by Anakuj

Thank You mates! But I henceforward would like to know the real numbers about the theoretical greek (and galatian, judean, thracian) soldier capacity of the eastern hellene states. So experts of EB unite! Please.

As far as I know, the initial galatians were mercenaries hired by the bithynians against the seleukids. I have found the number of about 20.000 warriors of them coming to asia minor in the first wave. I would guess that there were more of them when they founded their own kingdom, following later on as mercenaries or on their own accord. Even though the gallic language prevailed quite long in the area up to the year 400), I guess that they merged quite quickly with the local population (I don't guess they were accompanied by many women, they most likely were unmarried, young warriors leaving home because as younger kids they would not inherit their own piece of land). So, this initial number can only give you a very first idea of how many galatians probably arrived initially, but not of how many people lived in the area and were after all galatians to outsiders because of customs and language.