Opinions on LTC

[ReiseReise]

Everyone seems to be talking about LTC, i am just wondering what people think of it, and more specifically, what the actual gameplay changes are. Don't give me a link, i want to know OPINIONS. I know i should just try it and see for myself, but this is 'the way I are' - overly cautious and afraid of change, as I have been told by several women in my life

[Galain_Ironhide]

IMO it has definatley more going for it than against it. Once you get used to the unit rebalancing (to the way it should be) you'll be wondering why you didnt download it sooner.

The battle AI seems a lot smarter, I lost to the mongols in my Turkish campaign probably 3 times in decisive battles, that I know I would have won in vanilla 1.2 (allbeit with lower grade troops at the time).

The diplomacy works better too.

If you don't have Kingdoms (like me), version 3.1 is all you need. Plus it is a very simple download which creates its own icons on your desktop,so is very easy to operate. Also the other plus that I have noticed is that on my system, the mod has never crashed, unlike what I have heard happens on many other mods.

I'm much like you Reise, I don't like change at all, but I bit the bullet and went for it and havent looked back.

Best of luck which ever way you choose!

[Lusted]

and more specifically, what the actual gameplay changes are.

I've tried to keep as much of the vanilla gameplay as possible. The unit balancing is the same as that used in the Kingdoms Crusades campaign, effect of religious unrest has been increased slightly. Diplomacy and campaign AI have been improved, battle AI has been tweaked to make it flank more etc. Some tweaks to city/castle system(unit recruitment buildings cheaper in castles, made more expensive in cities, castles make less money, cities more etc., but overall just small tweaks). Recruitment is more logical and so most recruitment moved from walls to barracks, stables and ranges. AI builds more balanced armies. And some new campaign maps thrown in(Hundred Years War, Italian City States and Reconquista in 3.1, those and Grand Campaign replaced with Early, High and Late era campaigns in Gold).

[ReiseReise]

Thanks guys, I was really wondering if Lusted was going to chime in on this one, but here you are!!! I will check it out.

[Monsieur Alphonse]

Is the speed at which soldiers walk during battles increased since 3.1 (or earlier versions)? I played one battle where I assaulted a city. I ordered my soldiers to storm the castle and they walked very slowly to the open gate. It was like a funeral march. I immediately quited battle and uninstalled the mod. I liked the rest of it but the very slow walking soldiers was simply not my idea of a realistic battle.

[Lusted]

The walking speed is the same as in Kingdoms.

[Monsieur Alphonse]

Great! Maybe I'll give it a try. Thanks for the quick response Lusted.

[Ethelred Unread]

Is the speed at which soldiers walk during battles increased since 3.1 (or earlier versions)? I played one battle where I assaulted a city. I ordered my soldiers to storm the castle and they walked very slowly to the open gate. It was like a funeral march. I immediately quited battle and uninstalled the mod. I liked the rest of it but the very slow walking soldiers was simply not my idea of a realistic battle.

You knew that soldiers can run with ladders right?

[Daveybaby]

Only got around to installing it a week ago, but i'm finding it to be really good. Having a really tricky early game with russia at the moment (VH/VH), cash is really tight, and it's nice to see the AI factions actually expanding aggressively for once.

I'm kicking myself for not installing it sooner.

Nice work Lusted.

[Monsieur Alphonse]

You knew that soldiers can run with ladders right?

And they walked very slowely to the open gate

In one of his first versions of LTC Lusted had all the units marching and running at a very slow pace to make the battles last longer. If you read my post carefully you wouldn't have missed the vital clue that my men were marching to the open gate. I don't know how you attack open gates but I don't attack open gates using ladders. Of course I am always wiling to change my mind an learn a new tactic.

[Ethelred Unread]

Sorry - damn my scan-reading eyes!

[ColIndyJackson]

Gents:

Happy 2008 from Canada!!! I hope this finds you and yours well. As for me, I could complain...yadda, yadda, yadda.

Ethelred, you can expect nothing but great stuff from our man, Lusted. I can't wait to see what he does for Empires!!!!

By the by, Lusted, I've just downloaded your "Gold" mod. I can't wait to see what you've done this time!!!!!

By the by, what plans, if any, do you have for Empires? Just put this down to Canuck curiosity!!!!

Live long and prosper, take care and thank you kindly!!!

Sincerely yours always,

Indy.

[Evil_Maniac From Mars]

Does LTC 3.1 make the units slower?

[Xehh II]

I don't have kingdoms so I'm stuck with 3.1 and it's fine, I don't think the units are slower but I miss these kinds of things so they might be slower.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

IMO it has definatley more going for it than against it. Once you get used to the unit rebalancing (to the way it should be) you'll be wondering why you didnt download it sooner.

The battle AI seems a lot smarter, I lost to the mongols in my Turkish campaign probably 3 times in decisive battles, that I know I would have won in vanilla 1.2 (allbeit with lower grade troops at the time).

The diplomacy works better too.

If you don't have Kingdoms (like me), version 3.1 is all you need. Plus it is a very simple download which creates its own icons on your desktop,so is very easy to operate. Also the other plus that I have noticed is that on my system, the mod has never crashed, unlike what I have heard happens on many other mods.

I'm much like you Reise, I don't like change at all, but I bit the bullet and went for it and havent looked back.

Best of luck which ever way you choose!

Agreed. Vanilla tastes too bland now, by comparison.

I haven't played Vanilla since. What's the point?

Thats like going back to preschool. It's not even nostalgia.

[Evil_Maniac From Mars]

I installed 3.1, and I think it's brilliant. Simple answer.

[Joh]

Since you guys seem to have spent a few hours in front of your computers, could you give me your opinions on the best mod between (I have Kingdoms btw)?

• Lands to conquer, LTC
• The Long Road, TLR
• Stainless Steel

I am aware there are many others, but these ones seem to be the most interesting. Other suggestions are welcome, but my playing time is unfortunately very limited

[Vladimir]

Since you guys seem to have spent a few hours in front of your computers, could you give me your opinions on the best mod between (I have Kingdoms btw)?

• Lands to conquer, LTC
• The Long Road, TLR
• Stainless Steel

I am aware there are many others, but these ones seem to be the most interesting. Other suggestions are welcome, but my playing time is unfortunately very limited

LTC: French Vanilla (very good!). How can you not try it given all of his hard work?

The Long Road: Very good with its own unique characteristics, a great feel, but finished.

Stainless Steel: The best, period. LTC is the most "finished" mod I've tried but the latest SS is just more; it's well beyond the diminishing return curve but could use a little polish. SS 6.0 is in the works too! In naval terms: LTC: English navy, SS: USA Navy.

[ColIndyJackson]

Gents:

Good morning from Canada!! I hope this finds you and yours well. As for me, I could complain...yadda, yadda, yadda.

Vladimir, I strongly recommend you download this MAGNIFICENT MOD immediately, if not sooner!!! Lusted has simply done his homework, and the results of said homework is LTC!!! I salute his creativeness!!!

With his mod, I feel as though I've got the ENTIRE Medieval 2 package--all the campaigns in Kingdoms plus his mod= HEAVEN IN THE MIDDLE AGES!!!! It can only get better with Empires!!!!!

Live long and prosper, take care and thank you kindly!!!

Sincerely yours always,

Indy.

P.S. The two mods that were mentioned, Stainless Steel and The Long Road, intrigue me. Does anyone know where to find them and how to download them? Thanks in advance.

[Daveybaby]

Does anyone know where to find them and how to download them?

Want mods? Get twcenter.net.

[Joh]

Hi gents,

Doubting which mod to install, I ended up installing both Lands to Conquer (LTC) and Stainless Steel (SS). I gave up on The Long Road (TLR) since development has stopped even though the mod is not fully finished. But mainly because, being a complete illiterate on these matters, I did not know whether they had their own subfolder so a single M2TW+Kingdoms would suffice, or I had to copy M2TW a couple of times. Actually, I ended up doing so, and now my SEGA folder is something like 35G.

Anyway, my impressions:

• LTC is a nicely finished mod, very similar to vanilla but with a very nice MTW look, with the Early, High and Late campaigns, plus the addition of some "minor" campaigns. The best thing about it is that there is a lot of material on units and technology trees. I had read a bit about some complains of underpowered cavalry, no problems there even though I am used to M2TW vanilla. I did notice some slowness in it though, like slow motion animations (maybe due to some climate conditions as battle was fought in winter???), and foot unit will easily catch up initially when pulling your cavalry away (bodyguards in this case, scouts did not have so much of a problem). I am afraid missile units are highly overpowered, as both my units of Scottish highland archers killed over 200 each on three siege battles (rebels where sallying). 6 highland archers = 1200 kills (VH/VH). You seem to be more tight money wise than vanilla, which to me is a good thing. Have had no problems with unrest expanding into rebel lands, but otherwise I usually play a very chivalric type of game, so I have not rushed other factions (even though York, which is English here, is a great temptation). About stability, I have to admit that I got my first crash playing M2TW ever on my second battle, hopefully a one time thing.
• SS, I have not played much, but it has the most awesome loading screens ever. Plenty of factions to check (but expect a CTD while doing so), new factions, new units, new building trees ... I think almost as much as you would expect for the 1.25Gb download. And that could be my problem, a lot of new things to master. I only tried one new faction, whose name I do not remember now, but are a crusade type faction with one settlement in the Holly Lands surrounded by rebels. The initial moves are rather though as you have no army, a shitty castle and get little income, whereas the rebels seem quite powerful. It actually looked very interesting, but I am afraid it is too much for a beginner with no idea of the mechanics of the game. Does anybody know whether there is a printable guide for the mod btw?

All an all, it will come down to preferences. If you like continuity but would like a little more challenge, go for LTC. If you want a completely new feeling, definitely go for SS. Both of them are superb in their own way.

[crpcarrot]

Since you guys seem to have spent a few hours in front of your computers, could you give me your opinions on the best mod between (I have Kingdoms btw)?

• Lands to conquer, LTC
• The Long Road, TLR
• Stainless Steel

I am aware there are many others, but these ones seem to be the most interesting. Other suggestions are welcome, but my playing time is unfortunately very limited

ive only played LTC 3.1 and SS so i dont offer any opinion on TLR.

my personal preference is LTC over SS due to the simple fact that the mods tries to change the game as little as possible while making it more in line with the Original MTW while fixing a lot of bugs. but the game broadly still sticks to how the developers meant it to be.

although SS as a mod is impressive due to the amount of changes new provices, units traits etc the battles just didnt seem right to me. the chnages to cavalry and weppons however realistic they may be really didnt seem conducive to interesting gameplay. the strategy map is really very good though.

[RoadKill]

I could share some light on these three mods, since I play all three of them.

First of all my very first mod was LTC and 've been faithfully worshipping it for a long time now. It really is a fabulous mod, Lusted fixed all the problems, and made it so that MTW 2 should have been like in the first place. He also made the AI a little bit more challenging, so it's not like fighting a 2 year old anymore. Diplomatic realtionships have also been improved so the AI is really much smarter.

After getting tired of LTC I decided to try SS. And woah, it was like an expansion pack. Although the newest SS which is the best one requires kingdoms. Seriously its great. Adds many more territories so the map is more realistic. It pretty much has what LTC perfected, although I think LTC did a better job of the AI, not sure. SS added a lot of new factions, and they are extremly fun to play with. He also added something called An Late Era campaign. Basically its just like the normal campaign but there are no Rebel settlements. It starts off in the 1200's and all the factions have historically accurate land basically, if you wish to expand you'll have to attack another faction. Also the cities and castle are already advanced for you. So you don't have to build roads and those simple stuff. You also have proffesional armies already suited for you. Its really great, you can get straight to the action

The Long Road. It is like SS, more settlements have been added everywhere, new factions, but the AI is not as good as LTC's or SS. But if you are a hardcore gamer this is the way to go. IT IS THE HARDEST CAMPAIGN I HAVE EVER PLAYED. ITS IMPOSSIBLE. Tried 4 campaigns couldn't win any of them. Basically TLR made it so that rebel settlements have professional armies and each rebel settlement also has a general there. The general could be an extremly powerful one or a lousy one depending on the settlement. Basically TLR made the game so it is exactly like real life. The price for things are really accurate. And it makes you really try hard to mantain your empire.

Overall I would recommend those fanatic Vanilla players to try TLR you'll have the best and most challenging time to play ever.

If you are someone that really wants to enjoy and just have fun and feel a new experience go for SS

If you want the original MTW, but with balances, and have all the problems solved, with a tweaked game. Go for LTC

[Daveybaby]

It pretty much has what LTC perfected, although I think LTC did a better job of the AI, not sure.

SS uses Lusted's AI, so any differences are probably down to how the AI handles the differences in the campaign map and rules.

SS looks great but i've only just installed LTC so at the moment i'm enjoying that too much to try any other mods. Also i'm waiting for SS v6, hopefully that will be out by the time i'm ready to try SS.

[knoddy]

where can i download the LTC version compatible with vanilla 1.2? i followed the link someone else provided to TWC forums but couldnt find it in the hosted mods, or here in the hosted mods section. i also dont know which version i need to run with 1.2

also to lusted or anyone else who has played it, does it extend the camp map time frame either by increasing the time ratio or just making the game end later?

Cheers Knoddy

[Galain_Ironhide]

Here is the link for version 3.1 (to suit M2TW 1.2) http://files.filefront.com/Lands+To+.../fileinfo.html

Instead of every turn being 2years duration, Lusted has changed it to every 1.5years. (givews you 300 turns to complete your task instead of 200.) Start year and end date are still the same.

[Joh]

@RoadKill

The Long Road [...] if you are a hardcore gamer this is the way to go. IT IS THE HARDEST CAMPAIGN I HAVE EVER PLAYED. ITS IMPOSSIBLE. Tried 4 campaigns couldn't win any of them

Your post encouraged me to try it out. It is REALLY HARD.

Started a campaign as the single settlement Scots (ok, with a different name but same faction) in vh/vh. I have to say, I play using a chivalric style, taking out rebels before moving on to other factions ... and only after they attack (and I do not sit a one depleted unit stack on their lands) or they are excommunicated. Also focusing on economic development.

Well, campaign is around turn 100 (1/9 of the campaign). I have taken modern day Scotland (4/5? settlements), modern day Ireland (4 settlements), York and Essex (?) (which I suppose are English) and one continental settlement (Antwerp?). My two largest cities (Edinburgh and York) have just reached 4000. Mid cities are around 1500, but most of them are under 1000. I have played ALL turns with LOW taxes and maximising CHIVALRIC governors. I have ALL CITIES but a SINGLE CASTLE (by the way, it takes now 4000 florins to convert from the simplest castle to the crappiest town). It takes forever to grow a 250 inhabitants settlement. Two merchants have supported my expenses trading textile in continental Europe, but have just been adquired, since they generated as much cash as my kingdom's tax system. I have just recently managed to build DIRT ROADS for my settlements, PORTS (which bring an average profit of 40 florins) and trading facilities in the most productive settlements. My income is PATHETIC.

When it comes to my military, it is DOUBLE PATHETIC. I have the same peasant archers, spear militia and highlanders I started with. Taking any settlement is a extremely painful experience. My troops are largely outclassed and usually outnumbered. Only my family members (of which I have a few) are a real fighting force to match the crossbows, armoured sergeants, huscarls and other heavy infantry units whose name I don't even remember the rebels throw at you. And on top of that, high command mail knights CHARACTERS for generals. How come a crappy 250 population settlement can afford an almost half stack high quality troops?. Anyway, do you love the now I siege, now they sally, now I slaughter them nicely before they get out of the gate trick? Well, now you don't. Before your first unit makes contact at the gate, all these killing machines are out in the field happily smacking the heck out of your troops. Only the mobility and high charge of your family member can save the day.

I just requested a Crusade for Constantinople (which was recently conquered by infidels through a Jihad where at least 5 muslin factions took part), planning to join the two half stacks that I have painfully managed to retrain. Unfortunately, a glorious rebel army just appeared in the core of my nation, so one of the stacks was immediately sent to face the danger (heroic victory). However, my economic, despite all my upgrades, was not able to support these troops, so the second half stack has been sent away to be (most probably) miserably wiped out either on its way or at Constantinople's gates. Do you like a heavy crusade mercenary army for Crusades? Well, now you don't as cheapest crusade unit is about 2500 florins ... which you don't have.

During this campaign I have even allowed myself to bend (euphemism for break) my own home rules. After allying with Spain, Denmark and Poland, I have sold alliance to Hungary and Venice for approx. 10000 florins. I have also allowed myself to retrain battered units before merging so I maintain troop experience. I still refuse to ally with the Pope though, that is just too cheese.

The diplomatic situation is great. Two major European alliances. (Scotland, Spain, Denmark and Hungary) versus (England, France, HRE), and a side group with Milan, Portugal and the Papacy versus Sicily. Western Europe run out of rebel provinces, so things will start heating up now. Byzantium are fighting almost everybody. Russia and other eastern factions, I do not care that much about but seem to be also at it between themselves.

So, my settlements are completely unprotected even though I can almost the hear war cries that are spreading like wild fire in Europe these days. There is no cash to retrain my battered home army ... not to mention maintaining it at full strength. My main (what the heck, my ONLY) attacking army is going to be massacred in a few turns, or even worse, conquer Constantinople. Remember I am a Chivalric type of player. No massacre, no destroying buildings an leaving, but defending the settlement against the infidels for the glory of God. I refuse to break that home rule. It is a matter of principles.

What more can I say,

I AM JUST LOVING IT!

PS: sorry for the length, I just got carried away.

[Xehh II]

Nothing to do with gameplay but I found a spelling mistake in 3.something, in the Italian City States campaign, it says, when you click on the HRE that "they control msot of northern italy." Doesn't affect gameplay as I said, just funny.