Can't get the idea of this mod off my mind...

[Kaidonni]

Well, here I am again, considering modding MTW. I just *can't* get the idea of my own mod off of my mind. It's that Medieval's Rome: Total War idea, where I try to capture the glory along the lines of RTW, but in MTW, making it even more glorious. But I wouldn't be able to do it on my own...and it'd take a very long time. That said, plenty of conceptual work would be in store before any modding itself was done.

So, should I really make a run at this idea for a mod? Should I assemble a team of some of our finest modders - and other people who can help out in other areas - to help it along?

I think it'd be well worth it to attempt this mod, but it's so complicated with all the issues to consider...

It might be best to start by asking who might be able to help out and how before jumping into any modding venture. And what everyone's ideas might be for a mod like this. I've started threads before, but they've died down and I've gotten lazy about it all. I have no wish to do so this time.

So, personally, I'd like to develop a mod that is along the lines of the original Rome: Total War, but with a bit of a better balance between gameplay and historical accuracy. Not too many factions, but I really like having plenty of players in the world - it makes it more interesting, more varied (as long as they don't keep getting gobbled up within the first few turns), complete with historically accurate names (what they called themselves). New campaign map, along with new campaign map pieces (armies and the castle pieces) and a new province layout altogether. New portraits for all characters. Titles to reflect the era (especially the Roman Senate's heirarchy...from Aedile to Censor to Pontifex Maximus and all that...). Perhaps multiple campaign starts, but that is something to worry about later. A game that spans from 295BC to 117AD or so...

All ideas to throw around. As I said before, it's best to throw ideas around first before anything can get done. My mistakes previous times I attempted this were that I just didn't make the necessary preparations and enlist the necessary help...

A few extra things I forgot from above...instead of religion, there'd be culture (not spread by agents). There'd be 1) Roman, 2) Hellenic, 3) Eastern, 4) Carthaginian, 5) Barbarian and 6) Egyptian (Ptolemaic Empire) as the cultures.

The factions I imagine could be involved (only generic placeholder names at this point...) would be along the lines of:
1) The Republic of Rome
2) Carthage
3) Epirus
4) Illyria
5) Macedonia
6) Greek City States
7) Seleucid Empire
8) Ptolemaic Empire
9) Pontus
10) Armenia
11) Parthia
12) Scythia/Sarmatia
13) Gallic tribes?
14) British tribes?
15) Germanic tribes?
16) Iberian tribes?
17) Numidia?
18) Dacia?
19) Etruria?
20) Picts (separate from British tribes, the guys beyond good ol' Hadrian's wall)?
21) Kingdom of Pergamum?

Now, that's just a potential list, and by no means historically accurate at this point (one reason I tagged the word 'tribes' in there - perhaps one tribe from history chosen to represent each of those peoples?).

So, if I may ask everyone what they think? I mean, another possibility is a shrunken campaign map to cover the earlier Roman times, with the Samnites, Etruscans, Carthaginians, etc etc. All ideas are welcome.

EDIT: Sorry for such a long post.

EDIT 2: Again, wondering about the province limit...107, isn't it? That creates issues, in my opinion, that would constrain my personal ideas about the mod. So I do need input, because I'm probably thinking too big...

[caravel]

Well, here I am again, considering modding MTW. I just *can't* get the idea of my own mod off of my mind. It's that Medieval's Rome: Total War idea, where I try to capture the glory along the lines of RTW, but in MTW, making it even more glorious. But I wouldn't be able to do it on my own...and it'd take a very long time. That said, plenty of conceptual work would be in store before any modding itself was done.

You can do it on your own. Many of the best mods out there for MTW have been mainly one man efforts. If you don't settle to do this mod on your own then it will probably never happen. Relying on other people to chip in to make a team effort will inevitably result in disappointment and failure. Basically it's up to you to do this.

New campaign map

You'd need to modify the existing map to reflect the Roman provinces or you could base it on RTW but the functionality of the map would remain the same. You wouldn't be able to get the map working in any way like RTW, it would still work like an MTW/STW map.

A few extra things I forgot from above...instead of religion, there'd be culture (not spread by agents). There'd be 1) Roman, 2) Hellenic, 3) Eastern, 4) Carthaginian, 5) Barbarian and 6) Egyptian (Ptolemaic Empire) as the cultures.

This could work but not for building types. You would have to use the current religions of Pagan, Orthodox, Catholic and Muslim as your culture types. This would mean that a conquered province would take time to culturally adjust to the conqueror.

Using the existing religions you could do something like the following as your cultures:

1) Roman
2) Hellenic
3) Eastern/Carthaginian/Egyptian
4) Barbarian

I'm not sure how you would represent the senate. You may possibly be able to use the Pope as this and have the Roman factions using the catholic culture and relgion to link them to the SPQR. This would keep them very loosely connected but war would still break out pretty quickly. I doubt you'll be able to replicate the permanent alliance of the roman factions in RTW. Also using the Pope would cause other problems, as he would keep calling for crusades.

You could perhaps use these as "senate missions" but remove actual crusades from the game and do some renaming and rewording. Instead of: "the Pope has called for a crusade against the 'Egyptians' " it could be: "The Senate has decided that the Egyptians are not to be considered the friends of Rome" or whatever. You could then either decide to heed the advice or ignore it. It would be only cosmetic really. If you did keep crusades and rename them as "senate missions" (perhaps with the eagle on top of the crusade marker instead of the cross?) then your "senate mission" could move through the other roman faction's provinces picking up their troops and then head off to the target. Once the target had been captured the Senate would reward you for the mission - in the same way that the Pope would reward you for a successful crusade. Zeal could also be implimented for the (formely catholic) roman culture factions as "senate popularity". You could have an agent (a senator or whatever you want to call it) that raises the senate popularity in a Roman province there by causing more people to join the senate missions when they pass through.

If this gets too complex though you could leave out the Pope, probably wise, and have a single "Roman" faction which would probably work better with the type of map used in MTW anyway.

The titles of office are easy but you'd have to assign them to your general as you do in MTW vanilla. You can have the usual provincial governors and then the titles for certain buildings. So if you wanted Senate titles they would still need to depend on a certain building in your province. Other factions would also be able to have their own duplicates. It wouldn't work as it does in RTW.

I can never remember the exact province limit, but the lukupmap is represented by a 256 colour lbm file (a type of indexed pallette bitmap). Every province uses 2 colours. One for the province area and another for the visible borders you see. Then there are so many colours reserved for sea zones, one or two unsusable ones and the pink dead zone colour (used for sea and land borders and unusable areas (dead) of the map.

I'm not sure if you can, for example, scrap two sea zones that have colours that are adjacent to each other in the pallette and use those two to make one new land province instead. macsen rufus may know more about this.

[macsen rufus]

I'm not sure if you can, for example, scrap two sea zones that have colours that are adjacent to each other in the pallette and use those two to make one new land province instead. macsen rufus may know more about this.

Hmmm, my ears are burning, what?

Alas no, the number of land provinces has a hard limit (107 IIRC). After a certain point in the palette it starts interpreting them as sea regions. However, you can have three more sea regions than are implemented in MTW so far (I put in a "Phoenician Coast" and divided the Black Sea into three sections).

Alas, I must now log off and go home, I'll try to return tmrw

[Kaidonni]

Well, just a couple of questions at the moment...

1) How modifiable are religions? I mean, I'm aware that it is possible to relogo and rename Catholicism, Orthodoxy, Islam and Paganism - but what about Judaism and Heretical Cults? Can they be used at all? I'd assume that this is possible, but any factions that use relogoed and renamed versions of those two religions would have to use building and unit review panel graphics, for example, from the Catholic, Orthodox, Islam and Pagan folders - or something like that?

2) With this mod, I'd like to expand the map southwards (on a possible, not certain yet) and eastwards (to the Caspian Sea) to an extent - what would be the limitations on this?

I'm sure I can think of more questions, but those two are the most important at this point.

[ULC]

We at DATW have a map you may be interested in Kaidonni, as it just happens to extend to the Caspian sea. Just give OmarPacha due credit, he the one who made the wonderful map.

[caravel]

Well, just a couple of questions at the moment...

1) How modifiable are religions? I mean, I'm aware that it is possible to relogo and rename Catholicism, Orthodoxy, Islam and Paganism - but what about Judaism and Heretical Cults? Can they be used at all? I'd assume that this is possible, but any factions that use relogoed and renamed versions of those two religions would have to use building and unit review panel graphics, for example, from the Catholic, Orthodox, Islam and Pagan folders - or something like that?

While Heretic and Judaism exists as relgious type I don't think you can have Heretic or Jewish factions. Agents can be made to propogate heresies. I modded spies to do this as a side effect to their usual loyalty boosting abilities. I also pondered on rebel only jewish rabbis to add flavour but never got around to doing them.

I'm not sure about extending the map. @YLC: Is your map within the scale of the vanilla map or is it actually larger in terms of x and y?

[Kaidonni]

YLC>The map for that mod looks just about right. Very similar area to RTW. Of course, I was hoping myself to extend the map southwards so I could get in Numidia, but since as this is MTW, not RTW, that would be for me a) a waste of provinces and b) create too vulnerable a faction. But then again, it might not do those things, as looking at the map for your mod there is room at the bottom for Numidia, without extra extension southwards.

I was, of course, looking to add the Baelaric Islands into my mod, and make the campaign map a little more colourful. But thanks for telling me about the map, I'll ponder on it.

The number of factions I'd want for my mod are something to consider, especially in light of the 107 province limit. I'd have to locate provinces properly...you don't mind if I save a jpg of the 800x600 map from DATW (from the link in the thread where it shows a zoomed out map), do you? I was thinking of calculating roughly where the provinces could be added, and how it might affect the province limit, in Photoshop.

EDIT: Nevermind...just checked an old thread in the RTW forums here at the .org - vanilla RTW had 101 provinces, and with swapping some provinces around because of room and adding extra ones in, that's more than enough. I'll have to ask the team of RTR if I could take a peek at their map and if I can base part of mine off of it, amalgamating it with the vanilla RTW province layout. Should be fine, though. Of course, still want the Baelaric Islands present, but going southwards...not certain about that. Omitting Numidia might be wise, I dunno.

I also reconsidered culture. Here is my preference as follows if there are only 4 slots:
1) Catholicsm > Roman
2) Orthodoxy > Hellenic
3) Islam > Barbarian
4) Paganism > Middle Eastern (amalgamation of Carthaginian, Egyptian and Eastern)

The reasoning behind the swapping of Islam and Paganism in terms of what culture they'd be renamed and relogoed as is simple - I will include the Papacy as the Roman Senate, and have Crusades as special Senate Missions. This means agents to increase zeal in Roman provinces is to be a feature. AND since as Islam allows Jihads, converting it to represent the Barbarian factions will allow me to use the Jihad function as a sort of 'Horde' or 'United Battlefront' option, where the barbarians all join together to fight a common enemy for a short time, to reconquer annexed lands (a bit like Boudicca (sp?) or Vercingetorix (sp?)).

PS: I hope I didn't offend anyone by stating my intention to relogo and rename the Islam religion as the Barbarian culture set. I only did so because I can now use the Jihad function of the game and rename it to allow the barbarian factions to band together against their enemies. If I did offend anyone...sorry, but tough luck, if I implement the use of this feature, this is the only way it can be done - unless there's a way to allow the converted Paganism religion to use such a feature (in that case, Islam would be converted to the Middle Eastern culture, and Paganism would be used for the Barbarian culture).

[ULC]

You can use Judaism and Heretical Cults for a religion, as I am in DATW (I'm the script writer). The problem is both lack cultures, which can be a problem. You can work around this by setting them up with any other culture, you just have to remember what you assigned them. For example, the Steppe factions in Dark Age are heretics (Steppe Culture Type) with a pagan culture, and they work fine. They properly spread their own religion, through time, agents and buildings, but EVERYONE hates them, thus they at least appear to be on the move. Just a note, Judaism is not as hated.

When using said religions coupled with a different culture, remember how this can effect unit recruitment, and also remember to add the lines "Place Culture Here"_CULTURE after the end of every unit you give them in the Startpos file. It works for me, but ask Macsen, he did with his Israelites in Ancient Total War, which you may be able to get a few ideas from.

[Kaidonni]

Technically, by culture, I was referring to what I'd rename and re-logo the religions as. Sorry if I confused anyone. But thanks for the tips on the other use of culture in MTW. :)

At the moment, I'm still considering whether or not to go ahead with the mod, while working out certain features. It's the investment of time that concerns me, what with trying to get out of laziness and procrastination where my animation is concered. Of course, I could work on the mod at times when I'm not animating...

I've so far formulated the way 'Religion,' converted to 'Culture,' would work:
-There'd be 6 'Cultures' - 1) Roman, 2) Hellenic, 3) Barbarian, 4) Egyptian, 5) Eastern, and 6) Carthaginian;
-Agents and buildings (possibly will allow temples and other special buildings if they can be destroyed whenever a rival Culture takes a province) will not spread Culture - only by owning a province can it be spread;
-The Roman Culture will be converted from Catholicism so I can use the Papacy, renamed, to have some sort of reign over another faction, a playable Roman faction, in the form of Senate Missions, replacing Crusades (but working exactly the same);
-This playable Roman faction will be able to request such Senate Missions on non-Roman territory - so, for example, if you hate those pesky Carthaginians, and want to show them what's what with a nasty army, the Senate might 'endorse' a special mission to invade;
-The Islamic religion will be converted to the Barbarian Culture so the Jihad system can be used in the form of 'Horde' missions in which barbarian peoples join together against a common enemy and try to retake annexed land;
-Zeal is no longer useless under this system, so special agents will be used to increase zeal in provinces.

As for the factions...here is a possible list I've been working on (generic placeholder names only at this point), along with the culture set (R=Roman H=Hellenic B=Barbarian Eg=Egyptian Ea=Eastern C=Carthaginian):
1) Roman Senate (SPQR) R
2) Army of Rome R
3) Epirus H
4) Greek City States H
5) Kingdom of Macedonia H
6) Seleucid Empire H
7) Ptolemaic Empire Eg
8) Pontus Ea
9) Armenia Ea
10) Parthia Ea
11) Illyria B
12) Scythia/Sarmatia B
13) Galatia B
14) Tribe to represent Gaul B
15) Tribe to represent Germania B
16) Tribe to represent Brittania B
17) Tribe to represent Iberia B
18) Picts B
19) Carthage C
20) Numidia C
21) Etruria H (if they were Roman, they'd also be tied to SPQR, which I don't want)
22) Kingdom of Pergamum H
23) Rebels

The above list is along the lines of what I'd prefer...

As for time span, preferred beginning is 280BC, preferred ends would have been either 79AD (when Vesuvius erupted) or 117AD (when the Roman Empire was at it's greatest extent). However, I am considering RTW's 14AD, as I don't like the idea of too many turns. 359 or 397 just seems far too many turns. 294 is a more comfortable number. Oh, and 280AD is a preferred start date because of Pyrrhus of Epirus - gotta have him. 295BC, another preferred start date, deprives me of adding him in just the way I want him - ready to either get a butt whupping off of Rome, or to, well...not make his name in history how he did...

[caravel]

You can use Judaism and Heretical Cults for a religion, as I am in DATW (I'm the script writer). The problem is both lack cultures, which can be a problem. You can work around this by setting them up with any other culture, you just have to remember what you assigned them. For example, the Steppe factions in Dark Age are heretics (Steppe Culture Type) with a pagan culture, and they work fine. They properly spread their own religion, through time, agents and buildings, but EVERYONE hates them, thus they at least appear to be on the move. Just a note, Judaism is not as hated.

When using said religions coupled with a different culture, remember how this can effect unit recruitment, and also remember to add the lines "Place Culture Here"_CULTURE after the end of every unit you give them in the Startpos file. It works for me, but ask Macsen, he did with his Israelites in Ancient Total War, which you may be able to get a few ideas from.

That's good to know. So do your heretic Steppe factions have their heretic piety showing on their generals' info parchments in the correct form?

And this brings me to the next part. If religion were to be used as "culture" then how would piety still be viable? Perhaps piety could be seen as how much of a true Roman your general is as well as loyalty to the people/faction? Currently a pious general is the best choice of governor for a pious province. This could work as for example a "true Greek" being a better governor to "true Greeks" but a poor governor to non Greeks? Yes I think that would work well.

On the subject of jihads it's a doable idea but you might have a problem with them being spammed if they're too easily available. Also they'd be rather ahistorical as they were in MTW anyway. I'd also keep the Muslim relgion and culture as the Cathaginian/Eastern/Egyptian culture and not use it for the barbarians. They would be better as the Pagans. I'm not sure but I think you can probably mod Jihads to be used by other religions anyway, as they're not linked to a papacy like entity in the same way crusades are.

[ULC]

Yes they do. Although they no longer refer to piety but ethnicity (best I can come up with, if anyone else has any Ideas...back on subject!) and I have changed the wording so it makes sense, always thought it was funny to have a pious heretic for some reason, and I have changed the icon as well.

I PM you some links Kaidonni, hope their helpful. I would love to see this mod, I really hope you get it done. If you need anything just ask.

[Kaidonni]

Thanks for the links, YLC.

At the moment, for provinces, I'm considering a balance between vanilla RTW province layout and a little from one of the realism mods (primarily for extra regions here and there).

I really have six provinces spare to use in this mod, but if I use DATW's map, it might be wise to omit one of the Egpytian provinces on the south of the map, Thebais, from RTW. That way, I have seven provinces to play about with - gonna remove Malta and replace it with Baelaric Islands, and one of these seven provinces goes to become Corsica. One for the north of the British Isles. Leaves me with five...perhaps one to Norway/Sweden, leaves me with four... I could then proceed to split two of the provinces in Asia Minor, perhaps one in the Steppes, and add Ancona on to the Italian Peninsula, between Umbria and Apulia.

Now whether or not I can split Sicily into three provinces is something else. If only two, it again gives me another province to play about with and relocate. AHHH! Remembered, I have to decide between Sparta or Corinth as a settlement on the Peloponnesus - so that definitely means I relocate one province in that case (I'd rather have Sparta). Athens definitely remains, and hopefully I can add most of the other Greek provinces from RTW in, with the exception of perhaps the province of Thessalia (might need to relocate it as another province).

All comments on this are welcome.

[caravel]

To split Sicily you'd need to use a magnified sub map, otherwise it'll get too tight and crowded. You need to be able to fit several army stacks, several agents, titles and the fortress into the available space. The Pocket Mod map has a problem with Tripoli being too small. To fix this I would probably have to either increase it's size or use a modified maptex.tga with a sub map - which I'd rather avoid.

[sharpshooter]

Interesting to follow this thread ... thanks for the time on it people. Good luck with the mod Kaidonni - I think you should do it.

@ All

Are Jihads moddable, or strictly attached to the Muslims? I didn't see an answer to that ... and are they attached to the REL_MUSLIM, or MUSLIM_CULTURE ... or even to the FN_ ?

What I'm wondering is - could you, for example, have a faction with one type of religion and but another type of culture to work around this and still get a Barbarian horde, as Kaidonnis wants?

@ Caravel

Currently a pious general is the best choice of governor for a pious province.

Do you mean a province with high Zeal?

@ YLS

always thought it was funny to have a pious heretic for some reason,

Most famous heretics were pious - they weren't atheists. For example, Jan Hus and John Wycliffe came across as much more pious than the cynical church hierarchy whose practices they were opposing.

The word comes from the Greek, meaning "able to choose" - in other words, a free thinker. Heretics mainly rejected church doctrines and chose their own interpretations - as in the case of Hus, who refused to recant, even at the stake when offered freedom for doing so, unless he could be shown to be wrong according to the scriptures.

Just thought that might set your misgivings to rest.

[caravel]

@ Caravel

Currently a pious general is the best choice of governor for a pious province.

Do you mean a province with high Zeal?

A high piety province. A general is a better governor of a province with piety that most closely matches his own. Try placing a high piety muslim general as governor of a province that is over 50% catholic and watch the provincial happiness drop.

[ULC]

Originally posted by Sharpshooter
Most famous heretics were pious - they weren't atheists. For example, Jan Hus and John Wycliffe came across as much more pious than the cynical church hierarchy whose practices they were opposing.

The word comes from the Greek, meaning "able to choose" - in other words, a free thinker. Heretics mainly rejected church doctrines and chose their own interpretations - as in the case of Hus, who refused to recant, even at the stake when offered freedom for doing so, unless he could be shown to be wrong according to the scriptures.

Just thought that might set your misgivings to rest.

Hmm, thanks for the info on the origins of the word heretic. I currently own several books on history (one exciting one which starts around 3200 b.c. and ends with the fall of the Western Empire). I understand that heretics tended to be rather pious, what I was humoured by was the fact that CA used a burning book to represent the heretics, which seems strange. Book-burning Heretics? I thought that was the Catholic churchs' domain ?

.... , back on topic!

[dimitrios the samian]

Hi Kaidonni ,, I would also like to see your Mod come to fruition !! Just wondering if you ever downloaded or played a Mod similiar to what your proposing ,, Im fairly certain it was called "Patrician Rise of Rome" ,, Pm me if you would like a copy as I don't think it is available for download anywhere .. cheers .

[Tony Furze]

http://www.gamespot.com/pc/strategy/...d_6093031.html

For Medieval Total War only, not Viking Invasion

[ULC]

Nonetheless, he could glean something from it. Patrician was well done, especially within the limitations o the vanilla MTW engine.

A suggestion to your roster would be to add more Celtic/Germanic/Iberian factions. These were VERY fractituos people, and can't really be represented by single unified factions. As a suggestion, split the "Gauls" into the Aedui and Averni, split the "Germans" into the sweboz and the Teutons and/or Cimbri. Also, add the Getai for balance in the east. Sorry if it sounds like I'm making your game a EB clone, but I don't want such a good idea to end up like RTW either...

[dimitrios the samian]

Im glad there's a few of us that are interested , Perhaps Kaidonni can download Patrician to inspire him to make a start , Im sure once he gets started and realizes that a lot of the units are already made (( Patrician - Fall of Rome - ATW - Hellenic )) he may surprise us all with some news .

[Kaidonni]

Well, I'll have to be careful about Patrician, because I have MTW: Gold, so since as it's not for VI, my copy might not take too kindly to the mod. I'm still thinking things through, about whether or not to pursue the idea of the mod. I'll get back to everyone shortly.

[dimitrios the samian]

No need to dowload and install ,, just download & check out the units and other extras that went into it .

[Tony Furze]

Here's the ReadMe:

Download Details

Patrician V1.2 The Birth of Rome


Author: King David
Strategic Fiction
Version 1.2
Date: 01/04/03


Installation:

This modification will change many aspects of your Medieval Total War game.
If you play MTW on line or do not want to overwrite your current game
folder,
It is adivisable that you copy your entire MTW Game to a separate location
and install this mod into
The Original Unmoded (Unchanged) Version 1.1 (Patched version) of MTW.

1. Unzip your Patrician V1.2 to Desktop or your favorite spot in your drive.
2. Simply click on the Patrician V1.2 selfinstall to install into the ORIGINAL
V1.1 (Patched) MTW.
3. Run the Game - Select Dificulty (My Fave is Centurion)
4. On Campaign Screen Select Patrician V1.2 to play the Mod.
5. Select your favorite faction. You can scroll down to view all the factions.

Dos and Don'ts
DO NOT Try to play Patrician on your original EARLY HIGH OR LATE campaigns
without first replacing
the modified unitprod11.doc file and the Patrician Campaign files. Your game
will crash do to the fact that most
factions are Pagan.
You can play Patrician with your original EARLY HIGH AND LATE campaings if you
use the original unitprod11.doc
file in your MTW root directory.
Example: Original Unitprod11 file and EARLY HIGH LATE campaigns must match to
play.
Pat Campaign with Pat unitprod11 and MTW campaigns with original unitprod11.doc
file.
If you own Patrician V1.1 I suggest you back it up and store it in a safeplace
just in case you dont like V1.2 or
just feel nastalgic enough to return to it.
If your game crashes, Try replacing the unitprod11.doc file with the original
and play the mod with your original early
campaign to see if it works for about 100 turns. Then contact me at the Total
War.org Forums\Dungeon\patrician available
thread and give me a detailed specific account of what you did and what
happened. Thank you.





Background:

Patrician is a modification of Creative Assemblies Medieval Total War game
set around 390 BC douring the
Early Roman Republican Era when Gaul was recorded to have invaded Rome. Altho
Patrician has many historycal
similarities to that period it will not be entirely accurate but fictional.



Known Issues:
You may get better performance if you crank down the unit size to default in
your performance screen.
SICILIAN MISTRESSES wont show up till about 20 turns into the game and some may
end up in the circus maximus
as Thracian Gladiators even tho the message board says they are available early
in the game.
The game may slow down later in the game (Arround AR190) as your armies grow
larger altho I think I managed to balance that out after
testing it. Usualy this will manifest while the AI opponent goes into thinking
mode sometimes as long as a minute looking
like a game freeze but its not. I think this is attributed to massive faction
armies on the campaign map mode.


Portraits
Patrician V1.2 has some of the most elaborate unit portraits ever created for
MTW. It is sugested that you apply them
as follows after install:
Total War\Medieval-Total War\Campmap\Portraits
Pagan\General\25 to 62 delete them
Catholic\King\ Just keep King01. Delete the rest
Catholic\General\Just Keep General01 to General26. Delete the rest
Catholic\Pope\ Just keep Pope01. Delete the rest
Orthodox\king\ Just keep king01 Alexander the Great
Orthodox\General\General01 and 02 you can keep. Get rid of the rest
You can also copy the princess folder from the catholic folder into the pagan
faction folder.



Patrician CREED

By The Tribunician Powers vested in me, Marcus Davidicus Maximus Creator of
the Patrician order for Medieval Total
War, I delclare you Citizen of Rome. As a citizen of Rome, you are entitled to
conduct civic affairs in the formation of the
Patrician order such as you deem adequate to modify and or change the way MTW
looks and or behaves. You may cast
your oppinions and or suggestions for change along with other Roman Citizens.
On behalf of Consul Marcus II we welcome
you to the Patrician order.

(The whole is courtesy of King David.)

I for one would like to see your mod materialize,Kaidonni. I was really enthusiastic when I got RTW, then disappointed when it didn t run properly. Now it does run and Im doubly disappointed with it as a game.

So I m really with you, cheerleadingwise but unfortunately Im no modder.

[dimitrios the samian]

Im another baking you all the way K ,,, I can also help in a limited way with parchments , review panel images & portraits ,, As you can see most of the peices are ready and waiting to be used .

[Kaidonni]

Okay, been thinking a bit over Christmas about this mod, and have worked a number of extra things out...

How about the implementation, for review panel images, of the building designs from Rome: Total War? It'll save me A LOT of work at the end of the day, and the building info scroll could have the info scroll pics from RTW, too (both a colour and more grey-scale or brown-scale or whatever version, like in MTW for the building info scrolls - the colour one would apply to when the building was completed, the more monochrome one just for the info pic where the writing is overlayed). Same for units (at least for the info pics). Also, what of the character portraits, is it possible to implement them somehow?

I'm going to allow six 'Cultures' (NOT to be confused with the building architecture usage of the same term), basically re-logoed and re-named Religions.

1) Catholicism > Roman
2) Orthodoxy > Hellenistic
3) Islam > Eastern
4) Judaism > Egyptian
5) Paganism > Barbarian
6) Heretical Cults > Carthaginian

Although agents will not spread Culture, they will reinforce Zeal for the Roman and Barbarian Cultures because of renamed Crusades and Jihads. Crusades now become Conquests, which can be called for by the Romans on the enemies of Rome (there are to be two Roman factions - SPQR and another one whose name is somewhat elusive - the Army of Rome or something, I dunno what will be the most appropriate). Hordes are accessible by the Barbarians, allowing them to unite against a common enemy and reclaim lost territory.

The map will be inspired somewhat by Macsen Rufus' map in his Alexander campaign for ATW - in that, instead of the original MTW map (or the DATW map, as kindly offered for lending by the DATW team), I want to opt for an actual map from an atlas, preferably of a similar time period. Or the same time period.

Now, would I be right in assuming I can't somehow attempt to implement the campaign map pieces (settlement pieces, not armies or agents) from RTW? And what about the faction symbols, somehow, from the various modifications (if I can get permission)? Might hopefully be a matter of getting the files from one game to the other and modifying them slightly so that they work in MTW's game engine...

And on the renaming of Piety to Ethnicity, and the re-wording of the descriptions of character stats, such as how 4 Command might be described? Is that possible?

[dimitrios the samian]

Hi K ,, The implementation your referring to is possible ... See my thread importing images ,, So its good news ..
As for those peices of the campaign map from RTW into MTW .. As a newbie i would say that those can also be imported and used ,,
I honestly beleive it can all be done ..
We just need somebody to start on it .
I have no data, script engine skills at all but have messed with tga's , review panels , unit icons etc etc with some archaic success .
Should your mod ever start you can count me in as a helper .

[Kaidonni]

Thanks for the offer. :)

Updated the faction list...however, not sure about going with historical names now, maybe gonna stick with SPQR and Republic of Rome rather than their historic names, also listed.
1) SPQR (Senatus Populusque Romanus) (R)
2) Res publica Romana (Republic of Rome) (R)
3) Kingdom of Epirus (H)
4) Kingdom of Macedon (H)
5) Greek City States (H)
6) Seleucid Empire (H)
7) Ptolemaic Empire (Eg)
8) Galatia (B)
9) Kingdom of Pontus (Ea)
10) Kingdom of Armenia (Ea)
11) Parthian Empire (Ea)
12) Carthaginian Empire (C)
13) Kingdom of Numidia (C)
14) Gallic Tribes (B)
15) Germanic Tribes (B)
16) Britons (B)
17) Celtiberians (B)
18) Kingdom of Dacia (B)
19) Odrysian Kingdom (B) (Thracians, but 'Odrysian Kingdom' sounds cooler )
20) Caledonii/Picts (B)
21) Sarmatia (B)
22) Kingdom of Pergamum (H)
23) Kingdom of Etruria (H)
24) Kingdom of Illyria (B)
25) Syracusans (H)
26) Rebels (-)

As for the map, I must do some intense searching, but online I found a NASA satellite map...http://homepage.mac.com/msb/163x/maps/europe-small.jpg. I could see what I can do with that map for the mod...but I really need to get my hands on a proper atlas of Roman Europe, plus some of the extra areas I want...

[ULC]

Well..I could offer this

Unless your more specific about what you want, I can't help, which I want to by the way .

[macsen rufus]

Hi Kaidonni - have you seen this thread? https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showt...t=26839&page=2 Duke John has posted up a resource pack that includes some very nice unit animations you might be able to use