Stupid behaviour at city gates

[marodeur]

How to stop those madmen?
I have a problem with the AI. If the AI has got a spie inside a city (against which I can't do a lot but trying to kill the guy with an assassin before he reaches the town) with at least a level 3 wall (stone wall) and the gates are open at the beginning of a battle (no matter, wheter I make an atack upon the sieging troops or wheter they attack me), they all ignore their siege equipment (if they have already some) and start like madmen storming one of the open gates. I only have to place two or three good units (princeps, triari, gallic warriors, neitos, even hastati or hoplitae are sufficient) behind the gate and a few archers / slingers on the wall and the whole enemy army will die at this gate (if I'm in a nasty mood, I'll use a cavalry unit which leaves the town at another gate to attack them from behind and defeat them even more soundly). I'm playing on VH/H, so the tactical abilities of the AI should be nearly maxed. The attackers don't even bother to attack another open gate or climb the walls. It's like slaughtering cattle, even if Gasatae are included among the attackers. I can't stop the AI from always sending new full stacks against my towns in this fashion and I don't get rid of the spies. The battles would be much more interesting if there would be a real fight at the walls - and I'm quite sure, I would not win easily, if at all. It's getting a little bit annoying, and my undertakers are threatening me with strike cause of too much work... . This is quite similiar to the behaviour of the AI at river crossings (at least, if there is only one bridge or fort, if there is a second one, I send a second army across it and can get a decent battle this way. Any ideas?

[Pharnakes]

Nope, this is RTW AI for you.

Nothing anyone outside of CA can do, and I think they would aready have done it if they were going to.

BTW. Battle difficulty does not in anyway effect the AI's intelegence, it only gives all AI units plus 3 attack, defence skill and morale. SO the AI will do this no matter what difficulty you play on.

[marodeur]

Nope, this is RTW AI for you.

Nothing anyone outside of CA can do, and I think they would aready have done it if they were going to.

BTW. Battle difficulty does not in anyway effect the AI's intelegence, it only gives all AI units plus 3 attack, defence skill and morale. SO the AI will do this no matter what difficulty you play on.

So it seems I should enslave some town to get some new volunteers for undertaking...

[Hooahguy]

if you want a real fight, let them take the walls (i.e. dont have an of your units defending on the walls) and try to retake the walls, much more fun, IMO.
same thing applies with river crossings. let them all cross, then let battle commence.

[Pharnakes]

Its so hard to resist the temptation, though.

[sanitarium]

Playing as Epeiros, I was able to hold Taras for nearly 50 years because of this. The Romans always seemed to have a spy in there, and they sent stack after stack against the town, which was held by a few of my cheap phalanxes. In total, I'd say about 80,000 Romans died at the gates of Taras.

I noticed they do still use the sap points, but they abandon siege towers and ladders.

[Long lost Caesar]

same thing applies with river crossings. let them all cross, then let battle commence.

thats actually what i suggest doing. Let the enemy poke their head and shoulders out, and once theyre there, surround em. Proper good way to demoralise em!

[Hooahguy]

nah, let them poke their head, shoulders, and torso, and legs out!

[Horst Nordfink]

Stupidity must be punished! If the AI is stupid enough to run at a small gate full of spears then they deserve to die!

[Hooahguy]

does that mean a great majority of the world must run at a small gate full of spears?

[Horst Nordfink]

No, running at a gate full of spears is not the punishment for stupidity. The punishment is death. The act of stupidity is running at the spears!

[Tellos Athenaios]

Since the majority of all the people on the world is going to die anyway -regardless of whether it runs into a spear or not ...

[Horst Nordfink]

The majority?! Surely everyone?

[Tellos Athenaios]

So far at least two have refused to die: Santa & Sinterklaas.

[Pharnakes]

Doesn't that count as one?

[Horst Nordfink]

Are you trying to tell me that if Santa Claus charged at a gate of spears, he would come out the other end unscathed?

[Hooahguy]

nah- he has 12 reindeer, one with a fire-breathing nose, to clear the path in front of him.

[Horst Nordfink]

I forgot about those! The crazy Finnish bastard!!

[Tellos Athenaios]

Are you trying to tell me that if Santa Claus charged at a gate of spears, he would come out the other end unscathed?

You have correct your obvious Norris-error I see. And had you taken the time to read my post a bit more carefully you might've noticed one subtlety: "So far"

[Horst Nordfink]

Indeed, the fascination with Chuck Norris is something that is tiresome to me! I don't know why I wrote it really. I must be tired!

[hoom]

against which I can't do a lot but trying to kill the guy with an assassin before he reaches the town

Your own spies sitting in a town will hunt out & kill the intruder pretty efficiently, often on attempted entry in my experience.
After some time in there they get the Spy Guild Master trait which gives a substantial boost in their skill until they leave the town.

[Thrond]

If you roleplayed it, then the enemy spy opening the gates for them would mean they were launching a surprise attack...

Therefore your men wouldn't be surrounding the gates but perhaps scattered around the city and scrambling to mount an effective defence of the streets.

So if the AI has a spy open the gates, you should allow them to enter and then fight the battle as if they took you entirely by surprise.

[marodeur]

Your own spies sitting in a town will hunt out & kill the intruder pretty efficiently, often on attempted entry in my experience.
After some time in there they get the Spy Guild Master trait which gives a substantial boost in their skill until they leave the town.

So it's spy against spy? good to know. I have always tried to flush them out using assassins siiting in the town, but this didn't work.

[marodeur]

If you roleplayed it, then the enemy spy opening the gates for them would mean they were launching a surprise attack...

Therefore your men wouldn't be surrounding the gates but perhaps scattered around the city and scrambling to mount an effective defence of the streets.

So if the AI has a spy open the gates, you should allow them to enter and then fight the battle as if they took you entirely by surprise.

sounds good to me. I will give it a try. thanks.

[marodeur]

[QUOTE=marodeur]So it's spy against spy? [QUOTE]
Nobody around who still knows mad magazine spy vs. spy? oh my gawd i'm getting old...

[Hooahguy]

ya, i know them... god stuff, but havent read Mad Mag in years- moved on to more mature things, like EB.....

[Zangor]

Playing as Epeiros, I was able to hold Taras for nearly 50 years because of this. The Romans always seemed to have a spy in there, and they sent stack after stack against the town, which was held by a few of my cheap phalanxes. In total, I'd say about 80,000 Romans died at the gates of Taras.

I noticed they do still use the sap points, but they abandon siege towers and ladders.

*pops out of his lurker-hole*

In my current Epeirote campaign, I held Taras for quite some time with one or two Phalangitai Deuteroi (the rest of my units hung back "just in case" the phalingites broke, except for the rare battle in which I had to use them when the Romans actually bothered to build extra rams). Usually, the Romans would just take a single battering Ram, knock down the gate, and send everybody through the one entry. I once had to use my other troops to hold a second breach in the wall. I managed to do so quite handily, because they sent only a few low quality troops through it.

Just when I upgraded to a stone wall, then, those damn Romans bribed my city! The brave defenders, who had killed scores of thousands of Romans, were willing to sell the freedom of the worthy greeks, just four a few ounces of silver!

I sent no less than the young grandson of Pryhrros Aikedes-- who would one day be basielus himself-- straight from Sparta, where he'd finished his Agoge, and his wrath was terrible. I retook Taras and then crushed to Romans, establishing a Samnite Republic in their stead!

*pops back into his lurker-hole before he is spotted*