1.3 useful and useless fractions

[LadyAnn]

Here are some useless frictions:

I , personally dont like the taste of Kingdoms and Retrofit, its like plastic.

I, personally like Vanilla MTW2 and its metall taste.


Conclusion: doubling, tripling and crippling community will kill already weak MP. Cmon, stay together and play. I dont want changes anymore.

But... but... CA wants you to play Kingdoms and the only way to play kingdom is to play retrofit (else you would wait for days in Tetonic Campaign watching others play Crusade Campaign :D).

Wished CA patch up M2:TW (but then why should they?)

Annie

[zaher]

Does Retrofit attempting to make from MTW2 MTW1? It just seems ridiculous, Annie. I mean, CA can make also mumbo-umbo tribe with lots of HA, heavy cav units and polearmers with early infantry weakness.

The problem is that quantity abowe quality direction taken by developers destroying weak castle of MTW2 MP players. All I need is to see how improwing existing MTW2 MP and SP.

[LadyAnn]

Does Retrofit attempting to make from MTW2 MTW1? It just seems ridiculous, Annie.

If you think it is ridiculous, then may be it is. :D

Let me explain it a bit clearer. M2:TW balance (for MP) was broken, resulting to games with numerous rules (max 6 cavalry units and 3 horse archers, etc.) Although M:TW was played with some rules too (for example, no artillery), we could practically chose any type of faction or armies compositions without people start imposing rules (to limit exploits).

This is possible because an army composed of a lot of one kind (such as all cavalry army, or all missiles, or all infantry) is weaker than a composite army which has several types complementing each other. However, it wasn't a lot weaker than the "standard catholic" army, thus it was viable to bring variations to the battle field.

In M2:TW, single type army are either too weak or too strong. Given a game of "no rule" with sufficient florins, one can spam 20 units of heavy cavalry and beat the crap out of any one who didn't bring enough horses. Or you could bring a lot of horse archers to annoy the hell out of people.

So, I should have said "retrofit v1.0 brought M2:TW/K game balance back to the level of M:TW/Vi." Is it ridiculous? You tell me. After 3 years! :D

I do have hope that the modders of Retrofit would bring it to a better level with v2.0 (disclosure: I am not associated with these modders nor participate in their tests). I believe they could. I hope v2.0 will allow imaginative combinations of units that will give character to the factions (or a particular playing style).

M:TW/Vi(1.03) was not balanced either: the catholic army was still most optimum and adopted by many competitive players. That explains the preference for "high" era, because that's the era of pavise xbows, sword wielding heavy infantry, and lancer cavalry. However, as I said above, it was an acceptable "slight advantage" and some players would sacrifice that slight advantage for the fun of playing an unusual army, resulting in the fun of the unexpected.

Annie

[zaher]

There are always two sides for one coin. Who decided that in Chess game King can walk 1 space in turn and Queen can go everywhere ( almost )? Why Medieval or late Kings and Princes didnt decided to mod chess and make King walking everywhere? Who decided that Elephants can go only diagonal and Towers only strait? Why not the opposite? I always use archers in vanilla and mostly win so what? I never rush too and win, so what? I satisfied by Pikes and HA in vanilla, satisfied by xbows and heavy cav too. Try to get more than 10 heavy cav units for 10k florins - you cannot. And if you get 10 heavy cav - you will lose vs my mixed army. So, dunno what you all want from game - may be a norse axemen was your brother or dad? And he told you how it really was? He was payed 700 florins per year or month? How was a food in tavern? There was salt there?


Only the thing i wanted is official price fix for recruiting Danish (norse axemen, obudshaedr), German ( zweihanders, Forlrn hope ) and some other units (longbowmens, sipahi etc.), and properly distributed units for all eras, i mean , i want to see Nubian archers or Dismounted noble knights in game. Or zweihanders. And i want it not as a free present coming with Kingdoms too. I want just normal patch to MTW2 fixing all that. Be ready to buy Empire:Underwater Total War after you buy Empire: TW. You will be able to play Empire normally then, like most civilised people are. And remember to vote for " Underwater:TW" and not for " Moon : TW ". Because we know how to mod Underwater units and know nothing about space.

[Wolf_Kyolic]

I always use archers in vanilla and mostly win so what? I never rush too and win, so what?

Woaw!

[zaher]

Woaw!

Anything else?


P.S. Wolfes never can get easy the fact that somebody win. They still thinking that all victories in the world are and must be their. Scaring newbies with attitude like this.

[KrooK]

retrofit v1.0 brought M2:TW/K game balance back to the level of M:TW/Vi

Not all true - you are going into direction that came CA making mtw 1 but you are doing it worse. I remind that retrofit is not balanced (vide Papal - Turkey example). You made one mistake but it was great mistake.
According to my information you simply copied unit stats from Kingdoms to vanilla. This is your mistake. Stats that are balanced into small kingdoms campaigns will not be balanced into big campaign. Like Mongols or Turks.



Anyway I didn't like situation from mtw 1 at all. Cheap spearmen could stop elite knights. It's was joke :) I must tell that I got used to devastating charges:)

[Wolf_Kyolic]

Scaring newbies with attitude like this.

No don't be scared. We are good guys.