Central Mediterranean: Can't Sail?

[ArtistofWarfare]

Quick question guys:

At 1106 in my Italian campaign, beginning to just dominate the eastern and central med , working on the western with a shipwright/dockyard going in Genoa now...

One issue: I have ships in every marine tile (water tile) in these waters except for the Central Mediterranean, because I can't seem to find a way to get a ship in there. No matter what tile I have my ship(s) positioned on during the prior turn, it still lets me go anywhere around it but not onto/in it.

Does it have to be approached from the bottom near east africa/middle east? That's the only approach I haven't tried yet, due to the fact that my ships are strung toward all of the ports which are to the north of where I'm talking about there.

I'm going to catch some sleep, will be back around tomorrow afternoon/evening so no extreme rush on the answer tonight...but any help would be appreciated.

Thanks

[caravel]

Central Mediterranean is a deep sea zone so your ships will never be able to enter there, as the Italians, Sicllians and Byzantines ("Galley" factions) don't have any deep sea vessels.

[macsen rufus]

Any sea regions without a land neighbour will classify as deep sea, so you will also be unable to access the Atlantic Ocean region and ... oh, dear, what's it called - the one just east of Sicily, anyway. You're a coast-hugger as an Italian, as caravel says

[ArtistofWarfare]

Any sea regions without a land neighbour will classify as deep sea, so you will also be unable to access the Atlantic Ocean region and ... oh, dear, what's it called - the one just east of Sicily, anyway. You're a coast-hugger as an Italian, as caravel says

Interesting...I never knew this before...

Or did and forgot...

Well, I'm assuming that this really doesn't effect things too drastically as I can still access most of the tiles I need to...

Still, this begs the question: Who has ships that can go anywhere?

Italian Galleys get a +1 morale...but they can't go into deep waters? That just seems off to me...

edit: Nevermind- I looked up at Yas' Tools regarding the ships...

This is the ONE thing I overlooked when picking the Italians...

Although I don't think it would have changed much, I still love their infantry, and their location to begin with still allows a Naval/Mercantile empire to be built rather quickly.

Thanks for the answer though guys...saved me some time today ...I see why the give and take exists now. Nations most set to control the seas are given slightly less capable ships than nations that would have to do some significant conquering before they'd have access to the regions that would give them maritime control. It's not bad...

[Musket]

Ships as small as galleys would not go into deep waters, due to the risk of being sunk or foundered by a storm. A one-sail Galley could take weeks just to cross the Aegean Sea from Greece to Turkey in real life. The chances of a fleet of ships going from Italy to say, north Africa was unlikely, unless they were deep-sea vessels such as ..... Cogs I believe?

[caravel]

Well, I'm assuming that this really doesn't effect things too drastically as I can still access most of the tiles I need to...

Still, this begs the question: Who has ships that can go anywhere?

It's not much of a handicap, you do still have have the fastest ships on the map and two types of light vessel available to you. You also get some fairly potent ships later on. All of the other factions (excluding Byzantine, Sicilians and Italians) have ships that can travel into deep sea zones.

Italian Galleys get a +1 morale...but they can't go into deep waters? That just seems off to me...

Ships don't have a morale stat so I'm assuming you mean "command"? Galleys get a command bonus in Venice.

[Mouzafphaerre]

.
My incomplete/unreleased Modlet

internally consists of phases. Phase 001 (coming after Phase 000) deals with ship availability. IIRC, Phase 000 (Basic Modifications) includes minor unit stat tweaks suggested by frogbeastegg in her guide and the removal of land bridges. Again IIRC, the phases are cumulative; that is if you get Phase 001, you get Phase 000 too.

So, if it's good enough for you, here is the CRUSADERS_UNIT_PROD11.TXT, which is internal Modlet Phase 001. Extract the archive to your MTW root directory after making a backup copy of the original.

Rationale:

Historically, naval technology has been related more to a region than its rulers. People often adopted it when they controlled a region, or failed. In MTW time frame adoption was more common practice than failure. On this basis, I've reorganised ship recruitment regionally. Roughly, Mediterranean/Black Sea sector gets Galleys+, North Africa Dhows+, Atlantic Barque+ and the Baltic Longboat+; yet there are finer points.

.

[ArtistofWarfare]

It's not much of a handicap, you do still have have the fastest ships on the map and two types of light vessel available to you. You also get some fairly potent ships later on. All of the other factions (excluding Byzantine, Sicilians and Italians) have ships that can travel into deep sea zones.


Ships don't have a morale stat so I'm assuming you mean "command"? Galleys get a command bonus in Venice.

1) Indeed, regarding it not being much of a handicap. I spent some time researching/reviewing ship capabilities and I'm finding the Galleys to be perfectly suited to my mercantile approach.

2) Sorry, indeed again- I mean unit command for the ships, not morale. And yes, that's specifically what I was thinking of- the +1 command Galleys trained in Venice receive.

Thanks again...this thread has been very helpful to me...