Why cant i get Marian armies?

**vtbrandon** · 03-01-2008, 05:59

I searched through the forums and found an old post saying all you need is one imperial palace on mainland italy in order for the Marian reforms to take place.

I have 4; Capua, Lilybauem, Syracuse, and Messana...all fully upgraded with every building imaginable...im really really in desperate need of Marian armies because Egpyt controls all of asia minor and all of north africa up to Lepicus Magna (sp?)...

problem is i control all of africa from the tip of spain to Thapsus and in a very bloody war with egypt...and as you all can imagine, pre-marian armies are SLAUGHTERED by egyptian armies, there is literally no way i can win these battles...i go in with 10 units of fully armored, 3-chevroned (from pantheons to vulcan) triarii, 3-4 generals and their bodyguards and 6-7 units of equites...they just cant stand up to chariots, pharohs bowmen and pharohs pikemen..even on the pre-battle screen itll say i am favored 3:1 but when i fight it i usually loose 75-90% of my army and kill about 20% of thiers...even when i auto-calc (figure 3:1 maybe the PC can do a better job) i loose even worse..one battle i took 726 troops in and came out with 82 and killed just over 100 egyptians

the ONLY thing keeping me alive right now is that im out-producing egypt so i have 4 or 5 armies when they send 1

WHERE ARE MY MARIAN REFORMS!?!?! thanks for any replies

**Ibn-Khaldun** · 03-01-2008, 10:08

You need ! imperial palace in Italy and one in somewhere else ..
Those 4 have all hidden resource italy so I think they are all counted as italian towns ..
The best city to upgrade to huge city status outside Italy is Carthage .. it's population increases very fast so you shouldn't have any problem ..

You are playng Scipii .. right??

**Quirinus** · 03-01-2008, 11:27

I think there is also a minumum date specified, if I remember correctly. 220 B.C. or something like that.

But yes, I hate fighting Egypt. What difficulty are you playing on?

**Horseman** · 03-01-2008, 12:50

Originally Posted by Ibn-Khaldun

You need ! imperial palace in Italy and one in somewhere else ..
Those 4 have all hidden resource italy so I think they are all counted as italian towns ..
The best city to upgrade to huge city status outside Italy is Carthage .. it's population increases very fast so you shouldn't have any problem ..

You are playng Scipii .. right??

Ive never heard of needing an imperial palace away from Italy as well as on it. Indeed in every Roman campiagn I have played once I get an Imperial Palace in Italy the reforms kick in and in a recent test I ran I certainly did not have an Imperial palace outside of Italy and still got the reforms.

Im patched to 1.5, which AFAIK does not have a minimum date (in my test I used the add population cheat and had Lilybaeum grow to 24,000 very quickly so it was only about 15 years into a campaign when i got the reforms)

vtbrandon - are you running any mods at all?

**Omanes Alexandrapolites** · 03-01-2008, 15:17

Horseman is correct - it's only one Imperial Palace on the Itallian Peninsular (Scilly and the Northern Itallian Gallic provinces included) that is not in Rome. This Palace can belong to any Roman faction. Research into the subject also shows no limit into the number of turns the player has to wait for them to be triggered in 1.5 - anytime will do, although in earlier patches some did think that a date restriction did exist.

I do recall a problem like this occuring before, although my searches aren't yeilding anything useful. I think the only solution was to try and find an old save game before an Imperial Palace was built in the triggering regions. Hopefully the reforms would be triggered second time round.

Good luck

**Horseman** · 03-01-2008, 16:21

The other option would be to open up export_descr_units and swap all the Roman units around. So that Hastati and like requires the reforms and legions and like dont. this will simulate the reforms for this campaign (if you dont fancy going back to the save game before you built your 1st imperial palace)

The only thing you will probably be missing is Armoured generals for all factions

**Quirinus** · 03-01-2008, 19:21

I see. I think date restrictions are in place for v1.3-- I distinctly remember playing with the Julii and conquering Rome on pre-Marian troops, quite a while back.

**Horseman** · 03-01-2008, 20:11

There were date restictions in 1.1. IIRC in 1.0 the reforms were triggered as soon as an Imperial palace was built anywhere. In 1.1 it also required a certain date and then in 1.5 (or maybe 1.3) They took away the date criteria and changed it so that you needed an Imperial palace built in a region with the hidden resourse italy.

**vtbrandon** · 03-01-2008, 23:14

yes im playing medium/very hard difficulty as scipii..when i posted this originally it was 176 BC but my current year now in the campaign is 153 BC and still no reforms

not running any mods just my specialized version of RTW where every building is 1 turn build time (i loose interest when it takes so long to build stuff)..kinda fun actually because its unbelieveable how challenging that makes the game, because everything is built so fast your constantly running out of money until you get a few cities with dockyards and curias, and the british and egyptians end up controlling the majority of the map which is good because i got tired of the julii and brutii being too powerful

anyway ive never had this problem before, Thapsus is fully upgraded now too so that should count as my non-italian city

problem im having now is i cant get anymore cities to gain population, carthange is at 19800 ppl and 0% growth rate; all my major cities are at -0.5

the smaller cities like caralis and nepte are 2% so their doing ok but im afraid the same thing will happen to them that happened to the other cities theyll get to 18 or 19000 and decrease or level off in population...i can try and taking a massive city like alexandria and enslaving the populace but that would prolly require 10 or 12 armies lol arghhhhh

**Horseman** · 03-01-2008, 23:55

Hmmm something definately odd going on in your campaign, In any version the reforms should have kicked in by now.

And carthage should hit 24k pop quite easily as it has the grain resource!!!!!

Only suggestion for getting the reform units in the campaign is what I posted. Goto export_descr_units and swap all the Rome units around so you can build post Marius

**Ibn-Khaldun** · 03-02-2008, 08:20

Shouldn't the file he should looking for be a export_descr_buildings.txt ??
There you should just delete the lines after legionary units that says "and marian_reforms" or something like that ...

And about requiring a city outside the italy for reforms ... I remembered this from another thread a long time ago .. because I haven't played roman faction for a long time (EB is to blame

) so I'm not sure ...
alltough .. this might be wrong cause when the reforms happened I was doing a lot of fighting at the time and never noticed what could of triggered these reforms ..

Anyway .. hope you get them

**Horseman** · 03-02-2008, 11:39

Oops yes its export_descr_building he wants, sorry my bad it was late when I posted!

Definately don't need a 2nd imperial palace outside of Italy in 1.5 and i'm 99% certain that you never have had to in any earlier versions