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  1. #1
    EB Nitpicker Member oudysseos's Avatar
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    Default The Europa Barbarorum Quotes Project



    Greetings Europa Barbarorum fans.




    Here are the files for adding the new quotes to EB1.2

    Download and extract the .zip-archive from here



    Download and extract the .zip-archive.

    Quotes goes in your EB/data/text folder.
    Descr_quotes_lookup and descr_transition_screen go in your EB/data folder.

    Say "yes" if asked to overwrite old files. It is always a good idea to backup your old files first, just in case. I will not of course take any responsibility if it all goes wrong somehow, although I might feel bad about it.

    That's it. I have playtested these files on my own version of EB1 and have encountered no problems. If anyone does, PM me or post on this thread and I will do what I can to help.

    The new quotes file contains ca. 240 quotes, at least half of which are new (you will have seen some of them on the quotes project thread). Almost all of the remaining old quotes have been redone to include correct citations and often the original language. A few old quotes do remain to be redone in this way.



    I would like to invite you all to participate in an ongoing project to codify, correctly reference, and add variety to the loading screen quotes for Europa Barbarorum II. This is a chance for anyone and everyone to have something that they did included in the mod.

    There are two parts to this task. The first is to go over the quotes that we have been using in EB1 and to better identify their sources. In many cases this would mean book, chapter and line numbers. This would be desirable even when the authenticity of the quote is not in question, as it would be an aid to anyone wishing to read further in the context of the original source, or if anyone wished to offer an improved translation.

    For example, "Alea iacta est", "Let the dice fly high!" or "The die is cast." is I'm sure known by everyone in the RTW community as what Gaius Julius Caesar said when he crossed the Rubicon. However, even this simple and well-know quote would benefit from better citation.

    And so, when he was come to the river Rubicon, which was the boundary of the province allotted to him, he stood in silence and delayed to cross, reasoning with himself, of course, upon the magnitude of his adventure. Then, like one who casts himself from a precipice into a yawning abyss, he closed the eyes of reason and put a veil between them and his peril,

    Ἑλληνιστὶ πρὸς τοὺς παρόντας ἐκβοήσας, "Ἀνερρίφθω κύβος," διεβίβαζε τὸν στρατόν.

    He [Caesar] declared in Greek with loud voice to those who were present 'Let the die be cast' and led the army across.
    Plutarch, 'Life of Pompey, 60.2.9'
    Caesar was in fact borrowing a phrase from Menander, a Greek writer of comedy, and some sardonic humour or irony may have been intended, and not the usual modern sense of 'things have gone past the point of no return'. According to Lewis and Short, the phrase used was a future active imperative, Iacta alea esto, "Let the die be cast!", or "Let the game be ventured!" This is the meaning of Plutarch's third-person imperative ἀνεῤῥίφθω κύβος.

    Another version of the incident is

    Cunctanti ostentum tale factum est. quidam eximia magnitudine et forma in proximo sedens repente apparuit harundine canens; ad quem audiendum cum praeter pastores plurimi etiam ex stationibus milites concurrissent interque eos et aeneatores, rapta ab uno tuba prosiliuit ad flumen et ingenti spiritu classicum exorsus pertendit ad alteram ripam. tunc Caesar: 'eatur,' inquit, 'quo deorum ostenta et inimicorum iniquitas uocat. iacta alea est,' inquit.

    While he was thus hesitating, the following incident occurred. A person remarkable for his noble mien and graceful aspect, appeared close at hand, sitting and playing upon a pipe. When, not only the shepherds, but a number of soldiers also flocked from their posts to listen to him, and some trumpeters among them, he snatched a trumpet from one of them, ran to the river with it, and sounding the advance with a piercing blast, crossed to the other side. Upon this, Caesar exclaimed, " Let us go where the omens of the Gods and the iniquity of our enemies call us. The die is now cast."

    Suetonius, Divus Iulius, paragraph 32/3
    So just by correctly citing Plutarch and Suetonius, we open up a whole new world of possible meanings. Did Caesar speak in Greek or Latin? Was he being fatalistic, or was he trying to boost morale by being pithy and witty? There is not enough room on the loading screen for all of this, but a few line numbers make it possible for anyone to dig as deeply into it as they wish.

    The second and probably more popular part of this project is to propose new quotes for inclusion into EB II. There are already many Greek and Latin authors, so it would be preferable to broaden our scope as much as possible. However, really good and interesting quotes from Latin or Greek are still worthwhile proposing.

    What we're looking for are quotes contemporary to the 3rd century BCE and up to the 1st or 2nd century CE. Do not feel restricted to the 'Factions': quotes from or about any people on the map will be welcomed, from Lusitania to the Punjab and everywhere in between.

    Sources from much later than our time period will probably not be considered. Beowulf, the Tain, the Hildebrandslied; these won't do. But it's better to try and find something good than not, so if in doubt post it.

    Texts are the obvious place to look, but numismatic (coins) and epigraphic (inscriptions on stone) sources are also good. Someone could look into the Edicts of Ashoka, for example, or the Res Gestae.

    The Perseus Project is a good place to start for texts, and my own Periplus thread has a lot of good links and some primary texts. There's lots out there, people. Go get 'em.





    The Rules

    1. No Spam will be tolerated. Spurious, "funny", or obscene posts will be deleted and the poster reported to global moderators if necessary. If the Team's time is wasted on policing juvenile spam, the project will be abandoned and the thread locked and/or deleted.

    2. Read the Quotes already in EB or already proposed. Posting something that is already there just wastes everyone's time. A search of the thread will help determine if your author has already been posted.

    3. Follow the Format, please.

    Desired Format

    Quote in original if possible
    Quote translated
    Author, Work, Chapter or Line if possible, other reference if not

    4. The Team will decide which quotes will be included. There may be an upper limit to how many quotes are possible, and overall balance will also be a consideration. Ultimately, we'll decide which quotes go in the release, although anyone can modify their own version if they wish.







    These Quotes Still Need Proper Citation (Updated June 12- I might have missed one or two)

    Code:
    {Author_102}	Aeschylus
    {Quote_102}	In war, truth is the first casualty
    
    {Author_114}	Dionysius of Halicarnassus
    {Quote_114}	Only the brave enjoy noble and glorious deaths.
    
    {Author_121}	Euripides
    {Quote_121}	Danger gleams like sunshine to a brave man's eyes.
    
    {Author_132}	Thucydides
    {Quote_132}	Self-control is the chief element in self-respect, and self-respect is the chief element in courage.
    
    {Author_138}	Hannibal, asked by Antiochus if his richly ornamented army was enough to defeat the Romans at Magnesia, ca. 189BC
    {Quote_138}	Indeed they will be more than enough, even though the Romans are the greediest nation on earth!
    
    {Author_141}	Athenogoras of Syracuse
    {Quote_141}	If a man does not strike first, he will be the first struck.
    
    {Author_144}	Polybius, The Histories, On the Mercenaries War
    {Quote_144}	This war had lasted for three years and four months, and it far excelled all wars we know of in cruelty and defiance of principle.
    
    {Author_28}	Thucydides
    {Quote_28}	A collision at sea can ruin your entire day.
    
    {Author_45}	Lucius Annaeus Seneca
    {Quote_45}	In war there is no prize for runner-up.
    
    {Author_51}	Hieronymus of Cardia
    {Quote_51}	The Celts rushed on their enemy with the fury of a wild beast. Hacked with swords and axes, and pierced with missles, their rage died only with life itself. Some even plucked out the weapons that struck them and hurled them back at the Greeks.
    
    {Author_57}	Polybius
    {Quote_57}	A good general not only sees the way to victory, he also knows when victory is impossible.
    
    {Author_58}	Polybius
    {Quote_58}	In war we must always leave room for strokes of fortune, and accidents that cannot be foreseen.
    
    {Author_62}	Lucius Annaeus Seneca
    {Quote_62}	Quemadmoeum gladis nemeinum occidit, occidentis telum est                                                   A sword is never a killer, it's a tool in the killer's hands.
    
    {Author_67}	Socrates
    {Quote_67}	A disorderly mob is no more an army than a heap of building materials is a house.
    
    {Author_68}	Sophacles
    {Quote_68}	Quick decisions are unsafe decisions.
    
    {Author_75}	Thucydides
    {Quote_75}	War is not so much a matter of weapons as of money.
    
    {Author_77}	Hannibal Barca, addressing Phormio's lecture on leadership
    {Quote_77}	I have seen during my life many an old fool; but this one beats them all.
    
    {Author_82}	Xenophon
    {Quote_82}	When one side goes against the enemy with the gods' gift of stronger morale, then their adversaries, as a rule, cannot withstand them.
    
    {Author_87}	Aeschylus
    {Quote_87}	...now in place of the young men urns and ashes are carried home to houses of the fighters.
    
    {Author_88}	Demosthenes
    {Quote_88}	Beware lest in your anxiety to avoid war you obtain a master.
    
    {Author_97}	Euripides
    {Quote_97}	Courage may be taught as a child is taught to speak.

    Last edited by XSamatan; 08-27-2011 at 10:59.
    οἵη περ φύλλων γενεὴ τοίη δὲ καὶ ἀνδρῶν.
    Even as are the generations of leaves, such are the lives of men.
    Glaucus, son of Hippolochus, Illiad, 6.146



  2. #2
    EB Nitpicker Member oudysseos's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Europa Barbarorum Quotes Project

    Don't everyone talk at once...


    Here's an example or two;

    Negat ullius consilium imperatoris in speciem audacius, re ipsa tutius fuisse quam suum: ad certam eos se uictoriam ducere
    No commander has ever adopted a plan apparently more reckless, but actually more sure of success, than this of mine. I am leading you to certain victory.
    Claudius Nero, marching to reinforce Livius at the Metaurus (Livy 27.45)

    Basileos Basileon Arsakou Euergetou Dikaiou Epiphanous Philillenos
    Of the King of Kings, Arsaces, Beneficent, Just, Outstanding, Friend to Greeks.
    Legend on a Parthian Coin

    Many of the societies from which we would like to have quotes were non-literate, or like the Gauls wrote mostly inscriptions using Greek letters. That's o.k., we could use some of that if someone can find something good.
    The other way to get in quotes from non-literate peoples (or from peoples whose literature has not survived) is to look at Greek and Roman authors who wrote about them: Herodotus wrote about Scythians, Persians, Egyptians and everyone else. Tactitus and Arrian, though from a later time, wrote extensively about Germans, British, Indians and so on. Strabo and the other geographers might also have some quotable passages about almost anywhere on our map. So that's o.k. too.

    And be creative: the Milinda Pañha or Questions of Milinda is a Buddhist text which dates from approximately 100 BCE, and it purports to record a dialogue in which the Indo-Greek king Menander I (Milinda in Pali) of Bactria, who reigned in the second century BCE, poses questions on Buddhism to the sage Nāgasena. So maybe there are some good Baktrian quotes there: or as I mentioned one could look in the Edicts of Ashoka:

    Amtiyoko nama Yona-raja param ca tena Atiyokena cature 4 rajani Turamaye nama Amtikini nama Maka nama Alikasudaro nama
    Now it is conquest by Dhamma that Beloved-of-the-Gods considers to be the best conquest. And it (conquest by Dhamma) has been won here, on the borders, even six hundred yojanas away, where the Greek king Antiochos rules, beyond there where the four kings named Ptolemy, Antigonos, Magas and Alexander rule, likewise in the south among the Cholas, the Pandyas, and as far as Tamraparni.
    Rock Edict Nb13 (S. Dhammika)

    No, this doesn't mean there's going to be a Mauryan faction in EB2: but an Indian quote that references Greeks is definitely worthy of consideration.
    οἵη περ φύλλων γενεὴ τοίη δὲ καὶ ἀνδρῶν.
    Even as are the generations of leaves, such are the lives of men.
    Glaucus, son of Hippolochus, Illiad, 6.146



  3. #3
    amrtaka Member machinor's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Europa Barbarorum Quotes Project

    Two quotes from Aristotle's politics regarding kingship and tyranny:

    hapantes gar euergetêsantes ê dunamenoi tas poleis ê ta ethnê euergetein etunchanon tês timês tautês, hoi men kata polemon kôlusantes douleuein, hôsper Kodros, hoi d' eleutherôsantes, hôsper Kuros, ê ktisantes ê ktêsamenoi chôran, hôsper hoi Lakedaimoniôn basileis kai Makedonôn kai Molottôn.
    For in every instance this honor fell to men after they had conferred benefit or because they had the ability to confer benefit on their cities or their nations, some having prevented their enslavement in war, for instance Codrus, others having set them free, for instance Cyrus, or having settled or acquired territory, for instance the kings of Sparta and Macedon and the Molossians.
    Aristotle, Politics, Book V, 1310b

    dio kai tôn pleonektêmatôn ta men chrêmata turannika, ta d' eis timên basilika mallon: kai phulakê basilikê men politikê, turannikê de dia xenôn.
    Hence even in their requisitions money is the aim of tyrants but rather marks of honor that of kings; and a king's body-guard consists of citizens, a tyrant's of foreign mercenaries.
    Aristotle, Politics, Book V, 1311a


    The first quote is a bit long... but interesting nontheless since it references the origin of Spartan, Makedonian and Molossan kingship (it does however NOT refer to the Hellenistic kings of each of the states) as being basically spear-conquered states.

    I will post some more quotes if I stumble across any.



    EDIT:
    The detailed reference for the Aristophanes quote:

    ANGELOS

    ienai s' ekeleuon hoi stratêgoi têmeron
    tacheôs labonta tous lochous kai tous lophous:
    kapeita têrein neiphomenon tas esbolas.
    hupo tous Choas gar kai Chutrous autoisi tis
    êngeile lêistas embalein Boiôtious.

    LAMACHOS

    iô stratêgoi pleiones ê beltiones.
    ou deina mê 'xeinai me mêd' heortasai;


    HERALD

    The Generals order you forthwith to take your battalions and your plumes, and, despite the snow, to go and guard our borders. They have learnt that a band of Boeotians intend taking advantage of the Feast of Cups to invade our country.

    LAMACHUS

    Ah! the Generals! they are numerous, but not good for much! It's cruel, not to be able to enjoy the feast!

    Aristophanes, "Acharians", episode 4, lines 1073-9 [The "Ah! The Generals..." line is line 1078]
    Last edited by machinor; 03-06-2009 at 21:02.
    Quote Originally Posted by NickTheGreek View Post
    "Dahae always ride single file to hid their numbers, these tracks are side by side. And these arrow wounds, too accurate for Dahae, only Pahlavi Zradha Shivatir are so precise..."
    <-- My "From Basileion to Arche - A Makedonian AAR" Memorial Balloon.

  4. #4
    master of the wierd people Member Ibrahim's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Europa Barbarorum Quotes Project

    لَقيناهم بأَسيافٍ حِدادٍ *وأسدٍ لا تفر منَ المنيهْ/ وكان زعيمُهُمْ إذْ ذاكَ لَيثاً * هزبراً لا يبالي بالرزيهْ/ فخَلَّفناهُ وسْطَ القاع مُلْقى* وها أنا طالب قتل البقيهْ

    “we met them with iron swords*and a lion that does not flee from the dying/and their leader was then a lion*, a lion who cares not for disaster/so we left him in the middle of the plain dumped*, and here I demand the slaying of the rest.”

    -Antarah ibn shadad of Abas, about a victory against the hanthal tribe, c.600AD

    EDIT: more:

    أيا ابنة عبد الله، وابنة مالكٍ،* وبا ابنة َ ذي البُرْدينِ والفرَسِ الوردِ/ إذا ما صنعت الزاد، فالتمسي لهُ * أكيلاً، فإني لست آكلهُ وحدي / أخا طارقاً، أو جار بيتٍ، فإنني* أخافُ مَذَمّاتِ الأحاديثِ من بعدي / وإنّي لعَبْدُ الضّيفِ، ما دام ثاوياً* وما فيّ، إلاّ تلكَ،من شيمة ِ العَبدِ/

    “Oh daughter of abd ullah and daughter of malik * and daughter(or abnah, another person) with the two cloaks and the rose horse /If I made provisions, then beseech for it* an eater, for I am not eating it alone;/ brother tariq, or neighbor of a house, for I * fear the blames of the sayings from after me/ and I am a servant of the guest, so long as he stays * and except for that, there is no trait of a servant within me.”

    hatim at-taa'i, on generosity, and his motivation behind it. its like that king In EB who said no one should beat him in generosity.


    I'll try to find more. and no, the translation is not perfect-Arabic is a pain to translate; I fear some of the origional intent was lost.

    @moderators: someone should deal with the post above mine.
    Last edited by Ibrahim; 03-07-2009 at 21:59.
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  5. #5
    amrtaka Member machinor's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Europa Barbarorum Quotes Project

    Seriously Skullheadhq, is it so damn hard, do follow the rules of this thread?
    Last edited by machinor; 03-07-2009 at 18:38.
    Quote Originally Posted by NickTheGreek View Post
    "Dahae always ride single file to hid their numbers, these tracks are side by side. And these arrow wounds, too accurate for Dahae, only Pahlavi Zradha Shivatir are so precise..."
    <-- My "From Basileion to Arche - A Makedonian AAR" Memorial Balloon.

  6. #6

    Default Re: The Europa Barbarorum Quotes Project

    machinor would it be easy to post in the original greek with τόνοι, δασείες, περισπωμένες, etc?

    The goal for EBII would be to use the original greek, wherever possible.


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    Legatvs Member SwissBarbar's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Europa Barbarorum Quotes Project

    As far as I see it here, one of the most famous quotes of Caesar is not included:

    Veni, vidi, vici

    Gaius Iulius Caesar, describing his victory in the Battle of Zela over Pharnaces II of Pontus in his letter to Amintius 47 BC


    "Pontico triumpho inter pompae fercula trium uerborum praetulit titulum veni vidi vici non acta belli significantem sicut ceteris, sed celeriter confecti notam"

    During the pontic triumphal procession he (Caesar), among all the other stuff, let carry along an inscription consisting of 3 words: I came, I saw, I prevailed; unlike anything else it should not refer to what happened in the war, but how fast the enemy was defeated. (this is my own humble translation, surely you are better in it)

    Caius Suetonius Tranquillus, De Vita Caesarum, VITA DIVI IVLI, 37

    Also Plutarch is quoting this veni vidi vici somewhere...
    Last edited by SwissBarbar; 03-08-2009 at 13:35.
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  8. #8
    amrtaka Member machinor's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Europa Barbarorum Quotes Project

    Quote Originally Posted by keravnos View Post
    machinor would it be easy to post in the original greek with τόνοι, δασείες, περισπωμένες, etc?

    The goal for EBII would be to use the original greek, wherever possible.
    Didn't think of that. I'll see what I can find. Unfortunatly the Perseus Project only features transliterated Greek texts and none written in Greek.
    Quote Originally Posted by NickTheGreek View Post
    "Dahae always ride single file to hid their numbers, these tracks are side by side. And these arrow wounds, too accurate for Dahae, only Pahlavi Zradha Shivatir are so precise..."
    <-- My "From Basileion to Arche - A Makedonian AAR" Memorial Balloon.

  9. #9
    Member Member NIKOMAHOS's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Europa Barbarorum Quotes Project

    Glory lies not in never failing but in standing up each time you fall.

    Maybe in the future i will loose a battle but never a minute. Napoleon.

    Foolish claims that they learn with their experience. I'd rather advantage from others experience. Bismark.

    Strategy: the practice orientation of all means available to a general in success of a specific target. Moltke.

    Leadership is the art of putting someone you want to be done because he want's to do it. Dwight D. Eisenhower.

    Love the responsibility. Say: Me, me on my own I have the duty to save Earth. In case she is not safe I will be responsible. Nikos Kazantzakis-Salvatores Dei.

  10. #10
    EB Nitpicker Member oudysseos's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Europa Barbarorum Quotes Project

    Um, Niko, we're really looking for material germane to the Hellenistic Era, not any quote from any general at any time. But thanks for having a go, maybe you could look through Herodotus or something?
    οἵη περ φύλλων γενεὴ τοίη δὲ καὶ ἀνδρῶν.
    Even as are the generations of leaves, such are the lives of men.
    Glaucus, son of Hippolochus, Illiad, 6.146



  11. #11
    Member Member penguinking's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Europa Barbarorum Quotes Project

    "Depositis autem operibus et machinamentis, quorum expleta iam pridem inventione nullam video ultra artium materiam."

    A very rough translation: "Abandoning all considerations of works and engines of war, the invention of which has long since reached its limit, and the improvement of which I can see no further hope in the art."

    -Frontinus, Strategemata, Book III, AD 90.
    Last edited by penguinking; 03-14-2009 at 05:32. Reason: Added better citation
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  12. #12
    EB Nitpicker Member oudysseos's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Europa Barbarorum Quotes Project

    Penguinking, I like that one a lot: do you have a more complete citation?

    Ibrahim, I'm eager to have some non-Graeco-Roman sources, but the quotes still have to fit into the general framework, i.e. relating to the period and people. If we take in quotes from a later time, they're still going to have to relate to the game somehow. Do you know of any early Arabic histories of the EB period? That kind of thing would be worth considering, or something like;

    And surely I recollected you, even when the lances were drinking my blood,
    and bright swords of Indian make were dripping with my blood.
    The Poem of Antar
    Otherwise we have to look in Herodotus and Strabo for possible quotes, i.e.;
    Mariaba, the capital of the Sabaeans, is situated upon a mountain, well wooded. A king resides there, who determines absolutely all disputes and other matters; but he is forbidden to leave his palace, or if he does so, the rabble immediately assail him with stones, according to the direction of an oracle.
    Strabo, Geography,XVI.iv.19
    Augustus Caesar's...intention [was] either to conciliate or subdue the Arabians...He hoped to acquire either opulent friends, or to overcome opulent enemies.
    Strabo, Geography, XVI.iv.22
    The Nabataeans are prudent, and fond of accumulating property.
    Strabo, Geography, XVI.iv.26

    I'm surprised that no-one has put up Xenophon's most famous quote: I copied the whole passage as it's well worth reading (the quote will be shorter)

    καὶ ἀφικνοῦνται ἐπὶ τὸ ὄρος τῇ πέμπτῃ ἡμέρᾳ: ὄνομα δὲ τῷ ὄρει ἦν Θήχης. ἐπεὶ δὲ οἱ πρῶτοι ἐγένοντο ἐπὶ τοῦ ὄρους καὶ κατεῖδον τὴν θάλατταν, κραυγὴ πολλὴ ἐγένετο. [22] ἀκούσας δὲ ὁ Ξενοφῶν καὶ οἱ ὀπισθοφύλακες ᾠήθησαν ἔμπροσθεν ἄλλους ἐπιτίθεσθαι πολεμίους: εἵποντο γὰρ ὄπισθεν ἐκ τῆς καιομένης χώρας, καὶ αὐτῶν οἱ ὀπισθοφύλακες ἀπέκτεινάν τέ τινας καὶ ἐζώγρησαν ἐνέδραν ποιησάμενοι, καὶ γέρρα ἔλαβον δασειῶν βοῶν ὠμοβόεια ἀμφὶ τὰ εἴκοσιν. [23] ἐπειδὴ δὲ βοὴ πλείων τε ἐγίγνετο καὶ ἐγγύτερον καὶ οἱ ἀεὶ ἐπιόντες ἔθεον δρόμῳ ἐπὶ τοὺς ἀεὶ βοῶντας καὶ πολλῷ μείζων ἐγίγνετο ἡ βοὴ ὅσῳ δὴ πλείους ἐγίγνοντο+, [24] ἐδόκει δὴ μεῖζόν τι εἶναι τῷ Ξενοφῶντι, καὶ ἀναβὰς ἐφ' ἵππον καὶ Λύκιον καὶ τοὺς ἱππέας ἀναλαβὼν παρεβοήθει: καὶ τάχα δὴ ἀκούουσι βοώντων τῶν στρατιωτῶν θάλαττα θάλαττα καὶ παρεγγυώντων. ἔνθα δὴ ἔθεον πάντες καὶ οἱ ὀπισθοφύλακες, καὶ τὰ ὑποζύγια ἠλαύνετο καὶ οἱ ἵπποι. [25] ἐπεὶ δὲ ἀφίκοντο πάντες ἐπὶ τὸ ἄκρον, ἐνταῦθα δὴ περιέβαλλον ἀλλήλους καὶ στρατηγοὺς καὶ λοχαγοὺς δακρύοντες. καὶ ἐξαπίνης ὅτου δὴ παρεγγυήσαντος οἱ στρατιῶται φέρουσι λίθους καὶ ποιοῦσι κολωνὸν μέγαν.

    kai aphiknountai epi to oros têi pemptêi hêmerai: onoma de tôi orei ên Thêchês. epei de hoi prôtoi egenonto epi tou orous kai kateidon tên thalattan, kraugê pollê egeneto. [22] akousas de ho Xenophôn kai hoi opisthophulakes ôiêthêsan emprosthen allous epitithesthai polemious: heiponto gar opisthen ek tês kaiomenês chôras, kai autôn hoi opisthophulakes apekteinan te tinas kai ezôgrêsan enedran poiêsamenoi, kai gerra elabon daseiôn boôn ômoboeia amphi ta eikosin. [23] epeidê de boê pleiôn te egigneto kai enguteron kai hoi aei epiontes etheon dromôi epi tous aei boôntas kai pollôi meizôn egigneto hê boê hosôi dê pleious egignonto+, [24] edokei dê meizon ti einai tôi Xenophônti, kai anabas eph' hippon kai Lukion kai tous hippeas analabôn pareboêthei: kai tacha dê akouousi boôntôn tôn stratiôtôn thalatta thalatta kai parenguôntôn. entha dê etheon pantes kai hoi opisthophulakes, kai ta hupozugia êlauneto kai hoi hippoi. [25] epei de aphikonto pantes epi to akron, entautha dê perieballon allêlous kai stratêgous kai lochagous dakruontes. kai exapinês hotou dê parenguêsantos hoi stratiôtai pherousi lithous kai poiousi kolônon megan.

    On the fifth day they did in fact reach the mountain; its name was Theches. Now as soon as the vanguard got to the top of the mountain, a great shout went up. [22] And when Xenophon and the rearguard heard it, they imagined that other enemies were attacking in front; for enemies were following behind them from the district that was in flames, and the rearguard had killed some of them and captured others by setting an ambush, and had also taken about twenty wicker shields covered with raw, shaggy ox-hides. [23] But as the shout kept getting louder and nearer, as the successive ranks that came up all began to run at full speed toward the ranks ahead that were one after another joining in the shout, and as the shout kept growing far louder as the number of men grew steadily greater, it became quite clear to Xenophon that here was something of unusual importance; [24] so he mounted a horse, took with him Lycius and the cavalry, and pushed ahead to lend aid; and in a moment they heard the soldiers shouting, “The Sea! The Sea!” and passing the word along. Then all the troops of the rearguard likewise broke into a run, and the pack animals began racing ahead and the horses. [25] And when all had reached the summit, then indeed they fell to embracing one another, and generals and captains as well, with tears in their eyes. And on a sudden, at the bidding of some one or other, the soldiers began to bring stones and to build a great cairn.

    ...They heard the soldiers shouting, "The Sea! The Sea!"...and when all had reached the summit, then indeed they fell to embracing one another, and generals and captains as well, with tears in their eyes.
    Xenophon, Anabasis, 4.7.21-25
    ταῦτα ἔδοξε, καὶ ἐποίουν ὀρθίους τοὺς λόχους. Ξενοφῶν δὲ ἀπιὼν ἐπὶ τὸ εὐώνυμον ἀπὸ τοῦ δεξιοῦ ἔλεγε τοῖς στρατιώταις: ἄνδρες, οὗτοί εἰσιν οὓς ὁρᾶτε μόνοι ἔτι ἡμῖν ἐμποδὼν τὸ μὴ ἤδη εἶναι ἔνθα πάλαι σπεύδομεν: τούτους, ἤν πως δυνώμεθα, καὶ ὠμοὺς δεῖ καταφαγεῖν.
    tauta edoxe, kai epoioun orthious tous lochous. Xenophôn de apiôn epi to euônumon apo tou dexiou elege tois stratiôtais: andres, houtoi eisin hous horate monoi eti hêmin empodôn to mê êdê einai entha palai speudomen: toutous, ên pôs dunômetha, kai ômous dei kataphagein.
    This plan was decided upon, and they proceeded to form the companies in column. And as Xenophon was going back from the right wing to the left, he said to the troops: “Soldiers, these men yonder whom you see are the only ones who still stand in the way of our being forthwith at the place we have long been striving to reach; if we possibly can, we must simply eat these fellows raw.”
    Xenophon, Anabasis, 4.8.14
    εἴς γε μὴν τὸ εὐπειθεῖς εἶναι τοὺς ἀρχομένους μέγα μὲν τὸ [καὶ] λόγῳ διδάσκειν ὅσα ἀγαθὰ ἔνι ἐν τῷ πειθαρχεῖν, μέγα δὲ καὶ τὸ ἔργῳ [κατὰ τὸν νόμον] πλεονεκτεῖν μὲν ποιεῖν τοὺς εὐτάκτους, μειονεκτεῖν δὲ ἐν πᾶσι τοὺς ἀτακτοῦντας.
    To make the men who are under your command obedient, it is important to impress on them by word of mouth the many advantages of obedience to authority, and no less important to see that good discipline brings gain and insubordination loss in every respect.
    Xenophon, The Cavalry Commander, 1.1.24
    καὶ κατασκόπων δὲ πρὶν πόλεμον εἶναι δεῖ μεμεληκέναι
    You must also have taken steps to enlist the services of spies before the outbreak of war.
    Xenophon, The Cavalry Commander, 4.1.7
    οἵη περ φύλλων γενεὴ τοίη δὲ καὶ ἀνδρῶν.
    Even as are the generations of leaves, such are the lives of men.
    Glaucus, son of Hippolochus, Illiad, 6.146



  13. #13
    urk! Member bobbin's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Europa Barbarorum Quotes Project

    ΔΕΞΑ (Dexa) - "Take that" or "Catch" an inscription found on a 4th century BC sling bullet from Athens in the British Museum, Upper floor, Room 69, Greece and Rome: Daily Life
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

    Think "Take that" is the more accurate translation but "Catch" is more funnier
    Also read as ΔΕΞΑΙ (Dexai) in Foss, Clive. "A Bullet of Tissaphernes." The Journal of Hellenic Studies, 95, 25-30. 1975.


  14. #14
    Member Member penguinking's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Europa Barbarorum Quotes Project

    Quote Originally Posted by oudysseos View Post
    Penguinking, I like that one a lot: do you have a more complete citation?

    It's from book III of the Strategemata.
    Completed campaigns:
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    "I don't intend for this to take on a political tone. I'm just here for the drugs."
    -Nancy Reagan at an anti-drug rally.

  15. #15

    Default Re: The Europa Barbarorum Quotes Project

    "For what profit is it to a man if he gains the whole world, and loses his own soul?"
    - Matthew 16:26

    "The object of war is not to die for your country, but to make the other bastard die for his."
    - George Patton

    Just wondering, how are you going to put in those ridiculously large quotes seen before?

    'Let no man be called happy before his death. Till then, he is not happy, only lucky." -Solon


  16. #16
    Unoffical PBM recruiter person Member /Bean\'s Avatar
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    Default Re: The Europa Barbarorum Quotes Project

    @Alsatia: Nice quotes, but the team is really looking for quotes from the EB timeframe, 272BC-14AD. See if you can find any of these.
    Last edited by /Bean\; 05-07-2009 at 19:58.
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  17. #17

    Default Re: The Europa Barbarorum Quotes Project

    Sorry. I see your point there. How about these, not sure about the first.

    "Let no man be called happy before his death. Till then, he is not happy, only lucky."
    - Solon

    (Latin cannot be found for below)

    "Death is not natural for a state as it is for a human being, for whom death is not only necessary, but frequently even desirable."
    - Marcus Tullius Cicero

    "To have command is to have all the power you will ever need. To have all the power you will ever need, is to have the world in the palm of you hand."
    - Tiberus

    'Let no man be called happy before his death. Till then, he is not happy, only lucky." -Solon


  18. #18
    That other EB guy Member Tanit's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Europa Barbarorum Quotes Project

    "We accept it!"
    Response of the Carthaginian Council to the Roman declaration of war.
    Polybius, Book III, Ch. 33, p. 77



  19. #19

    Default Re: The Europa Barbarorum Quotes Project

    Really? Or was that another quote?

    "Famous men have the whole earth as their memorial."
    - Pericles

    “Ability without honor is useless.”
    - Cicero

    'Let no man be called happy before his death. Till then, he is not happy, only lucky." -Solon


  20. #20
    amrtaka Member machinor's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Europa Barbarorum Quotes Project

    Quote Originally Posted by Tanit View Post
    "We accept it!"
    Response of the Carthaginian Council to the Roman declaration of war.
    Polybius, Book III, Ch. 33, p. 77
    This one is awesome! That's got be in EB(II).
    Quote Originally Posted by NickTheGreek View Post
    "Dahae always ride single file to hid their numbers, these tracks are side by side. And these arrow wounds, too accurate for Dahae, only Pahlavi Zradha Shivatir are so precise..."
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  21. #21

    Default Re: The Europa Barbarorum Quotes Project

    "I consider every good Barbarian to be Greek, and every bad Greek to be Barbarian"
    Attributed to Alexander.
    I may be paraphrasing >.>
    Μηδεν εωρακεναι φoβερωτερον και δεινοτερον φαλλαγγος μακεδονικης

  22. #22

    Default Re: The Europa Barbarorum Quotes Project

    ‘the glory of riches and appearance is fleeting and fragile, but to have prowess is something distinguished and everlasting.’
    Sallust, Bellum Catilinae 1.4

    ‘It is a splendid thing to do well for the advantage of one’s commonwealth’.
    Sallust, Bellum Catilinae 3.1

    ‘For, to kings, the good are more suspect than the wicked, and prowess in another is always a source of fear to them’.
    Sallust, Bellum Catilinae 7.2

    ‘”Is it not better to die with prowess than to lose in disgrace a life which is pitiable and dishonourable, once you have become the plaything of the haughtiness of others?”’
    Speech by Catiline in: Sallust, Bellum Catilinae 20.9

    ‘”Here, stretching before your eyes, lies that freedom which you have often craved, as well as riches, respect and glory!”’
    Speech by Catiline in: Sallust, Bellum Catilinae 20.14

    ‘The community quaked at these measures, and the face of the city was altered.’
    Sallust, Bellum Catilinae 31.1

    ‘”But, as for us, we seek neither command nor riches, which are the cause of all wars and struggles among mortals, but freedom, which no good man loses except along with his life’s breath.”’
    Instructions of C. Manlius to Marcius Rex in: Sallust, Bellum Catilinae 33.4

    ‘”But, as for those who are endowed with some great command and spend their years at the zenith, all mortals know their deeds.”’
    Speech by Caesar in: Sallust, Bellum Catilinae 51.12

    ‘”Do not think that it was by arms that our ancestors made the commonwealth great from being small. If that were so, we would now be seeing it at its finest by far, since we have greater supply of allies and citizens, and of arms and horses besides, than our ancestors did. But it was other things which made them great, and which we no longer have’.
    Speech of Cato the younger in: Sallust, Bellum Catilinae 52.19

    ‘After Catiline saw that he was shut in by the mountains and enemy forces, that affairs in the city were against him, and that there was no hope of either flight or reinforcements, he deemed the best thing to do in the circumstances would be to test the fortunes of war’.
    Sallust, Bellum Catilinae 57.5

    ‘”I advise you to be courageous and prepared in spirit, and, when you enter the battle, to remember that in your hands you carry riches, honour and glory, to say nothing of freedom and the fatherland.”’
    Speech of Catiline in: Sallust, Bellum Catilinae 58.8

    ‘He helped the flagging, summoned the fit to take over from the injured, made every provision, fought hard himself, and often struck the enemy: he performed simultaneously the duties of committed soldier and good commander.’
    Catiline in: Sallust, Bellum Catilinae 60.4

    ‘In fact, from that entire force, no freeborn citizen was captured either in battle or in flight: they had no more spared their own lives than those of the enemy.’
    Sallust, Bellum Catilinae 61.5

    ‘As for the many who had emerged from the camp for the purpose of viewing or plundering and were turning over the enemy corpses, some discovered a friend, others a guest or relative; likewise there were those who recognised their own personal antagonists. Thus, throughout the entire army, delight, sorrow, grief and joy were variously experienced.’
    Sallust, Bellum Catilinae 61.8

    ‘Then, when the ground for their joy was certain, such a storm of applause began and was so often repeated that it was easily apparent that of all blessings none pleases a throng more than freedom’.
    Livy, History of Rome, 33.32.4-10

    ‘[When] wars are announced, wisdom is driven from their midst, matters waged by force; the good speaker is shunned, the rude soldier loved.’
    Aulus Gellius, Attic Nights, 20.10.4

    ‘The Gauls are exceedingly addicted with wine and fill themselves with wine brought by merchants, drinking it unmixed, and since they drink without moderation because of their craving for it, when they are drunken they fall into a stupor or a state of madness.’
    Diodorus of Sicily, Universal History, 5.26.3

    ‘Meanwhile cause the barbarous business of warfare to be lulled to sleep over every land and sea.’
    Lucretius, On the Nature of Things, 1.30

    ‘But never in those times did a single day consign to destruction many thousands of men marching beneath military standards; never did the boisterous billows of the ocean dash ships and sailors upon the rocks.’
    Lucretius, On the Nature of Things, 5.999

    ‘All the sacred shrines of the gods had been filled by death with lifeless bodies, and all the temples of the celestials, which the sacristans had crammed with guests, were continually littered with corpses.’
    Lucretius, On the Nature of Things, 6.1272


    Here are a few quotes, some of which might be worthy of use. Sorry i only have translations. really sorry also if any of these have been mentioned before but i started using the search function to see if each one had been mentioned in turn but realised id be there for a few days to do them all because of the wait between searches. now these are up i can start gathering the rest.
    Compassion and human kindess? Compassion and human kindness are for the weak!!

  23. #23

    Default Re: The Europa Barbarorum Quotes Project

    ‘Shortly thereafter [Mithridates] captured Manius Aquillius, who was the foremost agitator for this embassy and for this war. Mithridates led him around tied to an ass, and proclaimed himself Manius to everyone who saw him. Finally, at Pergamum, Mithridates poured molten gold down his throat as a rebuke against Roman avarice.’
    Appian, Mithridatic Wars, 21

    ‘Don’t you realize that the Romans turned eastward militarily only after the ocean had blocked their westward advance? That since the beginning they have possessed nothing that they have not stolen: home, wives, lands, empire?’
    Sallust, Letter of Mithridates, 17-21

    ‘While he appeared to be ready to answer their requests, he gave an arranged signal for his troops to surround the Jews. The Jews now found themselves in a ring of soldiers, three men deep, and they were dumbstruck at the unexpected sight.’
    Josephus, Jewish war, 2.169-74

    ‘The Jews saw that war was now fast approaching the capital, and they abandoned the feast and ran to arms’.
    Josephus, Jewish war, 2.517-19


    ‘This is because peace is not welcome to these people, and they cannot distinguish themselves more readily among dangers. Besides, a great retinue cannot be maintained except by war and violence.’
    Tacitus, Germania, 14


    ‘The first reports of the Cimbri and Teutones’ numbers and strength were incredible... They most likely were German tribes, whose territory extends to the northern ocean. This idea is supported by their great size, the light blue colour of their eyes, and the fact that the German word for plunderers is ‘Cimbri’.’
    Plutarch, Life of Marius, 11.2-6

    ‘Entrapped by forests, marshes, and ambuscades, the army was annihilated almost to a man by the same enemy whom it had been accustomed to slaughter like cattle...’
    Velleius Paterculus, Roman Histories, 2.119

    ‘From earliest times this country has had an ambiguous national character and geographical situation...’
    Tacitus, Annals, 2.56. on the Armenian plateau.

    ‘At the same time he talked in bold and menacing ways about the old boundaries of the Persian and Macedonian empires, and his intention of taking the territories that Cyrus once held and after him Alexander.’
    King Artabanus of Parthia in: Tacitus, Annals, 6.31

    ‘He looked over the row of prisoners, without any regard to their individual records, and... announced that those ‘between the bald heads’ were to be lead away’.
    Caligula in: Suetonius, Lives of the Caesars, Caligula 27.

    ‘Finally, as if he were to embark upon a war, he drew up his battle lines and set out his catapults and other artillery on the ocean shore. When no one had the least idea what he intended, he suddenly gave the order that they were to gather sea shells, filling their helmets and the folds of their tunics. These were what he termed spoils owed by the Ocean to the Capitol and Palatine.’
    Caligula in: Suetonius, Lives of the Caesars, Caligula 46

    ‘As for his horse Incitatus... it is said, too, that he meant to make him consul’.
    Caligula in: Suetonius, Lives of the Caesars, Caligula 55.

    ‘Nero watched the fire from the tower of Maecenas, delighted with what he termed “the beauty of the flames” and, dressed in his stage attire, he sang of “the Fall of Troy”.’
    Nero in: Suetonius, Lives of the Caesars, Nero 38.

    ‘”I will carry out great vengeance on them and punish them in my wrath. Then they will know that I am the lord, when I take my vengeance upon them”.’
    Ezekiel 25:17

    ‘And no more under slavish yoke to thee will either Greek or Syrian put his neck, barbarian or any nation, thou shalt be plundered and shalt be destroyed for what thou didst, and wailing aloud in fear thou shalt give until thou shalt repay.’
    Sibylline Oracles, 8.121-9

    A few more. again sorry i only have translations.
    Compassion and human kindess? Compassion and human kindness are for the weak!!

  24. #24
    lictor Member Urg's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Europa Barbarorum Quotes Project

    I've started going through the "old" quotes that need more accurate citations (only the latin ones). Here's what I could find for the Seneca quotes.

    {Author_101} Lucius Annaeus Seneca
    {Quote_101} Iniqua nunquam regna perpetuo manent - Stern masters do not reign long.
    The quote comes from: Medea 196


    {Author_120} Lucius Annaeus Seneca
    {Quote_120} Non mortem timemus, sed cogitationem mortis
    We do not fear death, but the thought of death.

    The quote comes from: Epistulae Morales IV, 30:17


    {Author_122} Lucius Annaeus Seneca
    {Quote_122} Constant exposure to dangers will breed contempt for them.
    The latin is: Contemptum periculorum adsiduitas periclitandi dabit

    The quote comes from: De Providentia 4:12


    {Author_45} Lucius Annaeus Seneca
    {Quote_45} In war there is no prize for runner-up.

    {Author_46} Lucius Annaeus Seneca
    {Quote_46} In war, when a commander becomes so bereft of reason and perspective that he fails to understand the dependence of arms on Divine guidance, he no longer deserves victory.
    I looked long and hard but couldn't find these anywhere in Seneca's works.


    {Author_62} Lucius Annaeus Seneca
    {Quote_62} Quemadmoeum gladis nemeinum occidit, occidentis telum est
    A sword is never a killer, it's a tool in the killer's hands. (or something to that effect - I think the text file already has a translation??)

    The latin quote is incorrect. It should be: Sic quemadmodum gladius neminem occidit: occidentis telum est

    The quote comes from: Epistulae Morales XI-XIII, 87:30
    Last edited by Urg; 06-10-2009 at 23:36.

  25. #25
    Vicious Celt Warlord Member Celtic_Punk's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Europa Barbarorum Quotes Project

    A few of my favourite excerpts from St. Crispian's day speech by Henry V written by Shakespeare - for those of you who do not know.

    "That he which hath no stomach to this fight,
    Let him depart; his passport shall be made,
    And crowns for convoy put into his purse;
    We would not die in that man's company
    That fears his fellowship to die with us. "

    "He that shall live this day, and see old age,
    Will yearly on the vigil feast his neighbours,
    And say 'To-morrow is Saint Crispian.'
    Then will he strip his sleeve and show his scars,
    And say 'These wounds I had on Crispian's day.'
    Old men forget; yet all shall be forgot,
    But he'll remember, with advantages,
    What feats he did that day. Then shall our names,
    Familiar in his mouth as household words-
    Harry the King, Bedford and Exeter,
    Warwick and Talbot, Salisbury and Gloucester-
    Be in their flowing cups freshly rememb'red.
    This story shall the good man teach his son;"

    "From this day to the ending of the world,
    But we in it shall be remembered-
    We few, we happy few, we band of brothers;
    For he to-day that sheds his blood with me
    Shall be my brother; be he ne'er so vile,
    This day shall gentle his condition;
    And gentlemen in England now-a-bed
    Shall think themselves accurs'd they were not here,
    And hold their manhoods cheap whiles any speaks
    That fought with us upon Saint Crispin's day."

    Everyman who I know who's seen combat lives by those famous words, "we happy few".


    EDIT: perhaps some of this speech has been suggested but I only did a search for "we would not die in that mans company" so I assumed it would be fine to just throw in my favourite parts aswell as the first verse.


    Oh! and another favourite quote of mine from Platoon ; "Everybody's gotta die sometime, Red!" - SSGT Robert Barnes or "The first casualty of war is innocence." - Oliver Stone

    I think that last quote is much truer than the quote from Aeschylus "Truth is the first casualty of war" because you can still be honourable and truthful to an enemy to an extent. In some cases war TURNS dasterdly rather than begins with lies. You must first lose innocence to kill. Therefore before the first shots are fired, before the first man dies, before the first lie is spewed, The deciders have lost their innocence inorder to declare a state of war and send the young to death. The young will lose their innocence along the way to meet the enemy.
    Last edited by Celtic_Punk; 06-19-2009 at 11:51.
    'Who Dares WINS!' - SAS
    "The republic stands for truth and honour. For all that is noblest in our race. By truth and honour, principle and sacrifice alone will Ireland be free."-Liam Mellows


    Who knows? If it's a enough day we may all end up Generals!"

  26. #26

    Default Re: The Europa Barbarorum Quotes Project

    I thought all the Shakespeare would not be included.

    'Let no man be called happy before his death. Till then, he is not happy, only lucky." -Solon


  27. #27
    Vicious Celt Warlord Member Celtic_Punk's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Europa Barbarorum Quotes Project

    why?
    'Who Dares WINS!' - SAS
    "The republic stands for truth and honour. For all that is noblest in our race. By truth and honour, principle and sacrifice alone will Ireland be free."-Liam Mellows


    Who knows? If it's a enough day we may all end up Generals!"

  28. #28
    EBII Mod Leader Member Foot's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Europa Barbarorum Quotes Project

    Quote Originally Posted by Celtic_Punk View Post
    why?
    What does the writings of shakespeare have to do with hellenistic era of the ancient world? Hence we won't include quotes that are written within an alien context to our own mod's timeframe.

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  29. #29
    Vindicative son of a gun Member Jolt's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Europa Barbarorum Quotes Project

    Quote Originally Posted by Celtic_Punk View Post
    why?
    By then we could add the General Patton's quote I find most memorable, which has a nice ring to it.

    "Fixed fortifications are monuments to the stupidity of man.", which would be cute considering the timeframe the game is on. :D
    BLARGH!

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