Results 1 to 30 of 63

Thread: Socialism: the problem and prescription's of Marx

Hybrid View

Previous Post Previous Post   Next Post Next Post
  1. #1
    Mr Self Important Senior Member Beskar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Albion
    Posts
    15,930
    Blog Entries
    1

    Default Re: Socialism: the problem and prescription's of Marx

    Quote Originally Posted by Rhyfelwyr View Post
    Socialism means the state owns the means of production.
    Actually, you are misrepresenting it a little there. Ideally, it is 'Social Ownership', such as working collectives, common-ownership, cooperatives and it can include state ownership. Typically, state ownership by a democratic government.

    There is also a difference in terminology when applied in the real world too. Socialism is seen as providing minimum wage, higher taxes for higher earners. All in all, trying to rein in the excess of making sure the poor are not completely left out to rot and the rich doesn't simply squander all the money.

    So it does come down to what Lemur says. What do you mean by "Socialism" ? Could also even argue with "What do you mean by Capitalism?" I guess the best one-line definitions would be as follows:

    Capitalism - Private Ownership of the Means of Production with the goal of producing as much profit as possible.
    Socialism - Social Ownership of the Means of Production with the goal of satisfying economic demands and human needs.
    Days since the Apocalypse began
    "We are living in space-age times but there's too many of us thinking with stone-age minds" | How to spot a Humanist
    "Men of Quality do not fear Equality." | "Belief doesn't change facts. Facts, if you are reasonable, should change your beliefs."

  2. #2
    Senior Member Senior Member Brenus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Wokingham
    Posts
    3,523

    Default Re: Socialism: the problem and prescription's of Marx

    You basically right.

    Capitalism believe in inequality as you do not born equal by nature as some are small, some are fat, some are and you can details all our differences. Capitalism believes that human have different values (in tem of money), and the “elite” (self-definition) should earn more because they got there first, and they got the ideas etc… The idea is that the Riches create jobs in allowing workers to have a salary. Capitalism believes that if the poor are poor it is their fault (or destiny).
    Capitalism doesn’t like taxes as them deprive the Riches from what they earn by the work or ideas. Capitalism believes in Charity.

    Socialism (in a very flexible definition) believes in equality and that all men born equal by law. Socialism thinks an enterprise as a community where ah of the individual work and have a decent living for it. Socialism believe that the Riches are rich because the labour of the workers producing the goods. Socialism believes that there are poor because there are Riches, and extreme poverty exist only because extreme greed.
    Socialism aims to rebalance the natural inequality in redistributing the wealth.
    Socialism believes in Justice

    Marx forgot the very "small" detail that humans don´t really want to be equal.”
    Can’t remember this detail. In fact, I don’t remember where Marx did write about humans in such terms. I give you I didn’t read all Marx. Marx analysed a system and describe how it works. Equality is a political value.
    Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. Voltaire.

    "I've been in few famous last stands, lad, and they're butcher shops. That's what Blouse's leading you into, mark my words. What'll you lot do then? We've had a few scuffles, but that's not war. Think you'll be man enough to stand, when the metal meets the meat?"
    "You did, sarge", said Polly." You said you were in few last stands."
    "Yeah, lad. But I was holding the metal"
    Sergeant Major Jackrum 10th Light Foot Infantery Regiment "Inns-and-Out"

  3. #3
    Nobody expects the Senior Member Lemur's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Wisconsin Death Trip
    Posts
    15,754

    Default Re: Socialism: the problem and prescription's of Marx

    Since historical economic theory has never been my thing, I haven't read Marx. However, I do recall a historian saying that his analysis of capitalism was pretty good, and that very little of his writing had to do with communism. But like I said, I ain't read it myself.

    Wealth of Nations, on the other hand, is surprisingly readable, and isn't nearly as radical or one-note monomaniacal as Adam Smith's latter-day idolatrists would have you believe.

    Member thankful for this post:



  4. #4
    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    The EUSSR
    Posts
    30,680

    Default Re: Socialism: the problem and prescription's of Marx

    Quote Originally Posted by Lemur View Post
    Since historical economic theory has never been my thing, I haven't read Marx. However, I do recall a historian saying that his analysis of capitalism was pretty good, and that very little of his writing had to do with communism. But like I said, I ain't read it myself.

    Wealth of Nations, on the other hand, is surprisingly readable, and isn't nearly as radical or one-note monomaniacal as Adam Smith's latter-day idolatrists would have you believe.
    For historical theory it doesn't have to do with communism, a marxist theory assumes a logical sequence of developments

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO