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Thread: Some joyous tidings from Israel

  1. #661
    Ming the Merciless is my idol Senior Member Watchman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Some joyous tidings from Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by hooahguy View Post
    this sums it up pretty well:


    "...but first we'll drop a million tonne high explosives on them from outer space and that'll show those cowards."
    - random Marine at Fallujah, according to a snarky Swedish cartoon

    Your oh-so-clever cartoon forgot the attack helos, tanks, artillery and fighter jets from the picture, methinks.
    Or the little detail that the IDF doesn't particularly care if there's a baby in cart in the way. Never did to begin with.
    "Let us remember that there are multiple theories of Intelligent Design. I and many others around the world are of the strong belief that the universe was created by a Flying Spaghetti Monster. --- Proof of the existence of the FSM, if needed, can be found in the recent uptick of global warming, earthquakes, hurricanes, and other natural disasters. Apparently His Pastaness is to be worshipped in full pirate regalia. The decline in worldwide pirate population over the past 200 years directly corresponds with the increase in global temperature. Here is a graph to illustrate the point."

    -Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster

  2. #662
    This comment is witty! Senior Member LittleGrizzly's Avatar
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    Default Re: Some joyous tidings from Israel

    I would also like to laugh at the absurdity of Hamas gathering away from populated areas, firstly the place is fairly packed, secondly are hamas supposed to pick some field and all gather up and wait for israel to bomb them ? They haven't got a jungle like vietnam to fight a guerilla war in, and would be massacared trying to aviod civilian casualtys, so if they believe in thier cause, and im sure the ones who put thier life on the line do, its incorrect to describe it as cowardice more fighting by any means possible ?

    They should stay away from kids more though!
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  3. #663
    Chieftain of the Pudding Race Member Evil_Maniac From Mars's Avatar
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    Default Re: Some joyous tidings from Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by Bopa the Magyar View Post
    Anyone who knows something about Hamas knows that they reviewed that little gem a while back.
    Google doesn't appear to know anything about Hamas.

    It does know that Hamas wants the withdrawl of Israel to at least the 1949 lines and the withdrawl from all Palestinian territory before it will negotiate a long-term truce, in the worlds of Khaled Mashal.

  4. #664

    Default Re: Some joyous tidings from Israel

    Fine, have the Hamas Covenant itself:
    Yes lets have a look at that badly written piece of crap...oh sorry you didn't did you , you have a brief from the Israeli government instead .

    this sums it up pretty well:
    Wow unbelievable , that Israeli soldier in the cartoon is actually following the order that came about after a big struggle in the Israeli courts that he shouldn't hide behind human shields .
    Now if only every soldier in the "most moral army" would follow those orders eh .

  5. #665
    Bopa Member Incongruous's Avatar
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    Default Re: Some joyous tidings from Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by Evil_Maniac From Mars View Post
    It does know that Hamas wants the withdrawl of Israel to at least the 1949 lines and the withdrawl from all Palestinian territory before it will negotiate a long-term truce, in the worlds of Khaled Mashal.
    Ummm, so what?

    In my view Israel is completley illegal and a colonial construct unworthy of existence, if the Jews had wanted safety in Palestine they should have organised something with the Arabs, not stolen their land.

    As for the supposed extremism of wanting to claim back what is rightfully yours while allowing others to keep some of it, I laugh very loudly.
    the only acceptable borders are those of 1949, all others are a continued act of agression worthy of millitary defiance on the part of the natives of Palestine.

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  6. #666
    Praefectus Fabrum Senior Member Anime BlackJack Champion, Flash Poker Champion, Word Up Champion, Shape Game Champion, Snake Shooter Champion, Fishwater Challenge Champion, Rocket Racer MX Champion, Jukebox Hero Champion, My House Is Bigger Than Your House Champion, Funky Pong Champion, Cutie Quake Champion, Fling The Cow Champion, Tiger Punch Champion, Virus Champion, Solitaire Champion, Worm Race Champion, Rope Walker Champion, Penguin Pass Champion, Skate Park Champion, Watch Out Champion, Lawn Pac Champion, Weapons Of Mass Destruction Champion, Skate Boarder Champion, Lane Bowling Champion, Bugz Champion, Makai Grand Prix 2 Champion, White Van Man Champion, Parachute Panic Champion, BlackJack Champion, Stans Ski Jumping Champion, Smaugs Treasure Champion, Sofa Longjump Champion Seamus Fermanagh's Avatar
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    Default Re: Some joyous tidings from Israel

    Wasn't it British territory at the time?

    Or, effectively, UN territory administered for the UN by the British?

    According to international law, the UN could dispose of this territory more or less as it saw fit. That suggests that the original 1947 UN mandate for Israel was not "stolen" -- though one could argue that the UN didn't emphasize/appreciate the desires of the locals and nearby neighbors.

    I acknowledge that anything aside from the 1947 boundaries (including Gaza) would be a separate issue. Those territories were acquired by Israel by various means, but were never sanctioned by the UN as part of returning the mandate territories to local control.
    "The only way that has ever been discovered to have a lot of people cooperate together voluntarily is through the free market. And that's why it's so essential to preserving individual freedom.” -- Milton Friedman

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  7. #667
    Ming the Merciless is my idol Senior Member Watchman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Some joyous tidings from Israel

    The last I checked the Arabs kind of lived on it at the time. That's usually regarded as counting for something...
    "Let us remember that there are multiple theories of Intelligent Design. I and many others around the world are of the strong belief that the universe was created by a Flying Spaghetti Monster. --- Proof of the existence of the FSM, if needed, can be found in the recent uptick of global warming, earthquakes, hurricanes, and other natural disasters. Apparently His Pastaness is to be worshipped in full pirate regalia. The decline in worldwide pirate population over the past 200 years directly corresponds with the increase in global temperature. Here is a graph to illustrate the point."

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  8. #668
    Chieftain of the Pudding Race Member Evil_Maniac From Mars's Avatar
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    Default Re: Some joyous tidings from Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by Watchman View Post
    The last I checked the Arabs kind of lived on it at the time. That's usually regarded as counting for something...
    Great! When do we get Prussia back?

  9. #669
    Ming the Merciless is my idol Senior Member Watchman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Some joyous tidings from Israel

    Dunno, but remind me again, what were you basing your claim on it on again?
    Last edited by Watchman; 01-09-2009 at 04:34.
    "Let us remember that there are multiple theories of Intelligent Design. I and many others around the world are of the strong belief that the universe was created by a Flying Spaghetti Monster. --- Proof of the existence of the FSM, if needed, can be found in the recent uptick of global warming, earthquakes, hurricanes, and other natural disasters. Apparently His Pastaness is to be worshipped in full pirate regalia. The decline in worldwide pirate population over the past 200 years directly corresponds with the increase in global temperature. Here is a graph to illustrate the point."

    -Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster

  10. #670
    Chieftain of the Pudding Race Member Evil_Maniac From Mars's Avatar
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    Default Re: Some joyous tidings from Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by Watchman View Post
    Dunno, but remind me again, what were you basing your claim on it on again?
    The same thing you're basing yours on. We possessed it once, so we naturally deserve it back.

  11. #671
    Ming the Merciless is my idol Senior Member Watchman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Some joyous tidings from Israel

    Who's "we" ?
    "Let us remember that there are multiple theories of Intelligent Design. I and many others around the world are of the strong belief that the universe was created by a Flying Spaghetti Monster. --- Proof of the existence of the FSM, if needed, can be found in the recent uptick of global warming, earthquakes, hurricanes, and other natural disasters. Apparently His Pastaness is to be worshipped in full pirate regalia. The decline in worldwide pirate population over the past 200 years directly corresponds with the increase in global temperature. Here is a graph to illustrate the point."

    -Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster

  12. #672
    Bopa Member Incongruous's Avatar
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    Default Re: Some joyous tidings from Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by Evil_Maniac From Mars View Post
    Great! When do we get Prussia back?
    Note that the Palestinians did not lose a war after trying to dominate and conquer their neighbours, they lost a war trying to defend their land.

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  13. #673
    Chieftain of the Pudding Race Member Evil_Maniac From Mars's Avatar
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    Default Re: Some joyous tidings from Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by Bopa the Magyar View Post
    Note that the Palestinians did not lose a war after trying to dominate and conquer their neighbours, they lost a war trying to defend their land.
    Right. What about the land we lost after the First World War then? Surely we deserve that back?


  14. #674
    Ming the Merciless is my idol Senior Member Watchman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Some joyous tidings from Israel

    I seem to recall you were being fairly, uh, offensive that time around as well.
    "Let us remember that there are multiple theories of Intelligent Design. I and many others around the world are of the strong belief that the universe was created by a Flying Spaghetti Monster. --- Proof of the existence of the FSM, if needed, can be found in the recent uptick of global warming, earthquakes, hurricanes, and other natural disasters. Apparently His Pastaness is to be worshipped in full pirate regalia. The decline in worldwide pirate population over the past 200 years directly corresponds with the increase in global temperature. Here is a graph to illustrate the point."

    -Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster

  15. #675
    Chieftain of the Pudding Race Member Evil_Maniac From Mars's Avatar
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    Default Re: Some joyous tidings from Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by Watchman View Post
    I seem to recall you were being fairly, uh, offensive that time around as well.
    Not the first time I've heard that Germany started the First World War. Not the first time it's been inaccurate either.

  16. #676
    Ming the Merciless is my idol Senior Member Watchman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Some joyous tidings from Israel

    You're going to have a very hard time arguing that the various ambitions of Imperial Germany weren't a pretty darn major factor in the process that led to it, though.
    "Let us remember that there are multiple theories of Intelligent Design. I and many others around the world are of the strong belief that the universe was created by a Flying Spaghetti Monster. --- Proof of the existence of the FSM, if needed, can be found in the recent uptick of global warming, earthquakes, hurricanes, and other natural disasters. Apparently His Pastaness is to be worshipped in full pirate regalia. The decline in worldwide pirate population over the past 200 years directly corresponds with the increase in global temperature. Here is a graph to illustrate the point."

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  17. #677
    Chieftain of the Pudding Race Member Evil_Maniac From Mars's Avatar
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    Default Re: Some joyous tidings from Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by Watchman View Post
    You're going to have a very hard time arguing that the various ambitions of Imperial Germany weren't a pretty darn major factor in the process that led to it, though.
    Sure. But I'm hoping you understand my point. Does France deserve Quebec back? What about Poland, does it deserve the territories toward the east? I've come to terms with the fact that some of the lands of my origin will probably never be under the governance of my people again. Perhaps Hamas should do the same, and come to terms with the current political situation.
    Last edited by Evil_Maniac From Mars; 01-09-2009 at 04:53.

  18. #678
    Ming the Merciless is my idol Senior Member Watchman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Some joyous tidings from Israel

    Erm, the last I heard the Quebecans were still there... not sure about the Poles, I'd have to read up on it.

    On a more practical note though, you seem to be forgetting that the Palestinians are rather lacking anywhere to go and live in - which isn't quite the case with the examples you've thrown around. And it's reduced them to a sufficient misery they're willing to go to fairly extreme lenghts to try to rectify the situation.

    So, your comparisions held water where again...?
    Last edited by Watchman; 01-09-2009 at 04:56.
    "Let us remember that there are multiple theories of Intelligent Design. I and many others around the world are of the strong belief that the universe was created by a Flying Spaghetti Monster. --- Proof of the existence of the FSM, if needed, can be found in the recent uptick of global warming, earthquakes, hurricanes, and other natural disasters. Apparently His Pastaness is to be worshipped in full pirate regalia. The decline in worldwide pirate population over the past 200 years directly corresponds with the increase in global temperature. Here is a graph to illustrate the point."

    -Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster

  19. #679
    Chieftain of the Pudding Race Member Evil_Maniac From Mars's Avatar
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    Default Re: Some joyous tidings from Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by Watchman View Post
    Erm, the last I heard the Quebecans were still there... not sure about the Poles, I'd have to read up on it.
    Are there no Palestinians in Israel? None? Is there a single Palestinian in Israel leading a relatively normal life?

    On a more practical note though, you seem to be forgetting that the Palestinians are rather lacking anywhere to go and live in - which isn't quite the case with the examples you've thrown around. And it's reduced them to a sufficient misery they're willing to go to fairly extreme lenghts to try to rectify the situation.
    Yawn. You're missing the point.

    Anyway, Israel can afford to continue retaliating. Palestinians cannot. So once Palestinians realize this and decide to stop firing the rockets, perhaps a solution can be reached.

    By the way, I added on to my post. Here:

    I've come to terms with the fact that some of the lands of my origin will probably never be under the governance of my people again. Perhaps Hamas should do the same, and come to terms with the current political situation.
    That is the point.
    Last edited by Evil_Maniac From Mars; 01-09-2009 at 04:59.

  20. #680
    Bopa Member Incongruous's Avatar
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    Default Re: Some joyous tidings from Israel



    Awsome, you realise that you are talking tosh and so you descend into creating absurd diversions, now why don't we get back to the part where you said Hamas wanted to destroy Israel, shall we?

    So, Hamas does not wish to destroy Israel and would very likely lay down its home made weapons if Israel returned to the '67 borders. However, even this I warrant will in the long term not be enough to stop the Palestinians from seeking further justice, that is, the full Israeli withdrawal to its UN suggested borders and apology for being such an awful neighbour. Seems just and right to me. In any case, as soon as the US loses Hegemonic status, Israel will be in trouble. I suggest they and their supporters start changing things for the better now.

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    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
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    Default Re: Some joyous tidings from Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by Guildenstern View Post
    I think Israeli Rules of Engagement seem to be very simple. They are to execute any human that is not an Israeli.
    That's what a friend of mine thinks as well, but he reads quality newspapers and watches the news, he can't help it.

  22. #682
    Iron Fist Senior Member Husar's Avatar
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    Default Re: Some joyous tidings from Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by Fragony View Post
    How does that logic work? All I am saying, is give war a chance. With Fatah in charge the situation will improve.
    It's very simple, if you expect me to embrace you and call your enemy scumbags then maybe you should not behave like a scumbag yourself. Giving war a chance, very nice, maybe you would like to repeat that in the face of someone who lost his whole family in that war you so readily approve of?
    Would you feel the same way if I embraced the bombing of Rotterdam in 1940 or whenever that was? Yeah, don't know when it was but at least we showed those dutch beards who has the power. *

    the point isn't that Hamas are actually nice guys, the point is that when you throw 500pound bombs into civilian areas, your usual excuse of "surgical strikes" stops working and your "collateral damage" are whole families who may have nothing to do with Hamas. If I lost my family that way I might just join Hamas myself or just form my own terrorist group because you know, that would really piss me off.

    *That's just hypothetical my dutch brother


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  23. #683
    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
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    Default Re: Some joyous tidings from Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by Husar View Post
    It's very simple, if you expect me to embrace you and call your enemy scumbags then maybe you should not behave like a scumbag yourself. Giving war a chance, very nice, maybe you would like to repeat that in the face of someone who lost his whole family in that war you so readily approve of?
    Sure no problem.

    the point isn't that Hamas are actually nice guys, the point is that when you throw 500pound bombs into civilian areas, your usual excuse of "surgical strikes" stops working and your "collateral damage" are whole families who may have nothing to do with Hamas


    How many percent of the Gaza population are children? 60 or so? Even more? And how many percent of these casualties are children? Does that sound like just throwing daisy-cutters on civilian area's to you? Yes surgical strikes.

  24. #684
    BrownWings: AirViceMarshall Senior Member Furunculus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Some joyous tidings from Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by LittleGrizzly View Post
    I would also like to laugh at the absurdity of Hamas gathering away from populated areas, firstly the place is fairly packed, secondly are hamas supposed to pick some field and all gather up and wait for israel to bomb them ? They haven't got a jungle like vietnam to fight a guerilla war in, and would be massacared trying to aviod civilian casualtys, so if they believe in thier cause, and im sure the ones who put thier life on the line do, its incorrect to describe it as cowardice more fighting by any means possible ?

    They should stay away from kids more though!
    that the palestinian people are represented politically by a group that:
    a) has the stated aim of destroying its neighbourhood superpower
    b) launching attacks at said superpower from the hospitals and schools of its populace

    tells me that:
    1) the palestinians in gaza are deeply stupid, and will sadly pay a high price for that stupidity
    2) Hamas moral legitimacy to act as a valid political representative of their nation, to other nations, is nil.

    if the palestinian people are willing to pay that price:
    i) more power to them i say, if they succeed in creating a palestinian state out of the ashes of israel then they deserve to reap the rewards
    ii) that doesn't mean that I will treat their politcal representatives as anything other than what they are, a bunch of terrorists
    Last edited by Furunculus; 01-09-2009 at 10:44.
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    BrownWings: AirViceMarshall Senior Member Furunculus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Some joyous tidings from Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by Tribesman View Post
    Wow unbelievable , that Israeli soldier in the cartoon is actually following the order that came about after a big struggle in the Israeli courts that he shouldn't hide behind human shields .
    Now if only every soldier in the "most moral army" would follow those orders eh .
    wow, no pleasing you. you are actually complaining about a political system that acts responsibly and a military that obeys those responsible political directives. tough crowd.
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    BrownWings: AirViceMarshall Senior Member Furunculus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Some joyous tidings from Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by Bopa the Magyar View Post

    In my view Israel is completley illegal and a colonial construct unworthy of existence, if the Jews had wanted safety in Palestine they should have organised something with the Arabs, not stolen their land.

    As for the supposed extremism of wanting to claim back what is rightfully yours while allowing others to keep some of it, I laugh very loudly.
    the only acceptable borders are those of 1949, all others are a continued act of agression worthy of millitary defiance on the part of the natives of Palestine.
    sadly for your sense of injustice, that has no bearing on legal reality, and israel is indeed about as valid a nation state as exists anywhere.

    the matter of the occupied territories is another matter, but that does negate israels right to exist.
    Last edited by Furunculus; 01-09-2009 at 10:51.
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    BrownWings: AirViceMarshall Senior Member Furunculus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Some joyous tidings from Israel

    Quote Originally Posted by Strike For The South View Post

    Bopa you always overestimate how much I give a damn when it comes to this subject. Frankly we should give the most money to the side that says the will ethnically cleanse in the shortest amount of time. That way my news will go back to covering to more important things like American Idol and two headed farm animals.
    tend to agree with this sentiment.
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  28. #688
    This comment is witty! Senior Member LittleGrizzly's Avatar
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    Default Re: Some joyous tidings from Israel

    So let me get this right, if britian manages to invade a country and take it over successfully today, then tommorrow the residents have no more valid claims on the lands because you now we'd have to go through 1000's of years of history giving everyone thier land back.... Great!

    this sums it up pretty well:

    Really ? to me the solidiers seem to be eqaully well equiped, your missing some tanks and some f-15's there....

    Maybe a more accurate picture would be a bunch of rag tag gunmen hiding among some houses with aircraft wizzing over head and bombs exploding everywhere...

    so hamas can go and massacre hundreds of citizens if it wants to because they didnt sign?

    It is a bit difficult to hold people to treaty's they didn't sign, it doesn't mean im happy for them to commit war crimes but they didn't sign up saying they wouldn't. Im pretty sure they could be brought up for war crimes though, bring the palestinian and israeli leadership in and punish them both for thier crimes... imo.

    Keep dreaming

    It is really of no use having this discussion if it's has to be held witheen these limits, it's the leftist dogma about causes of terrorism, that cartoon I posted earlier nails it.

    Yes logic can be a bit annoying, hmm out of interest then Fragony why the hell does Hamas exsist if not because of the grievances of the palestinian people ?!

    Did palestinians wake up one day and decide it would be fun to start killing israelis ?

    You can argue that palestinians or hamas response to thier grievances that they have is too much or unfair or bad, but too deny that hamas exsists because of palestinians grievances just completely flies in the face of logic... your reasoning is quite simply absurd on this frag

    a few questions if you'll humor me frag,

    1) Why does Hamas exsist if not because of the grievances of the palestinian people ?

    2) If the palesinians do have grievances and israel saw to these complaints, do you think the palestinians would still engage in terrorism ? and why ?

    3) If the palestinian grievances are seen to and they no longer support terrorism as a result, do you think hamas would still be able to operate without local support ? and if so... how ?!

    However, what the poster really meant -- which you are aware -- is that the IRA had no designs (offically at least) on Scottish or English territory. Hamas (or at least notable elements thereof) really would prefer for ALL of Israel to cease to exist.

    I don't think it downplays the issue that it was northern ireland they had designs on, northern ireland is part of britian as much as london or glasgow is. Well this isn't completely the same point as hamas wanting israel off the map, it does make a very good point (which is maybe the point tribes was trying to make) and that is when you deal with peoples legitimate grievances the terrorists will (whether they want to or not) withdraw thier extreme claims and become more moderate as grievances are settled.

    The whole place is alot more radicalised and worse off than the ireland england situation but hearts and minds can work all the same...
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  29. #689
    master of the pwniverse Member Fragony's Avatar
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    Default Re: Some joyous tidings from Israel

    It's quite simple why Hamas exists LittleGrizly, this isn't about Palestina it's about Israel, Palestina is just the frontline of the propaganda-war between the west and the east. And if you wonder why Palestines support them, go to youtube and do a search for "Palestinians killing Palestinians", make sure you are 18+, and don't go if you have a general dislike for walls with holes in it.

  30. #690
    This comment is witty! Senior Member LittleGrizzly's Avatar
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    Default Re: Some joyous tidings from Israel

    that the palestinian people are represented politically by a group that:
    a) has the stated aim of destroying its neighbourhood superpower
    b) launching attacks at said superpower from the hospitals and schools of its populace

    tells me that:
    1) the palestinians in gaza are deeply stupid, and will sadly pay a high price for that stupidity
    2) Hamas moral legitimacy to act as a valid political representative of their nation, to other nations, is nil.

    if the palestinian people are willing to pay that price:
    i) more power to them i say, if they succeed in creating a palestinian state out of the ashes of israel then they deserve to reap the rewards
    ii) that doesn't mean that I will treat their politcal representatives as anything other than what they are, a bunch of terrorists


    Well i agree with what your saying to a certian point, but israel has pushed the palestinians to more and more extremity and now use that extremity as an excuse for thier actions, alot of the fault for palestinian terrorism lies with israel causing it...

    I heard the vatican the other day (peace and justice spokesman) said the place is starting to resemble a concentration camp more and more every day, he has a point i think the wording its just likely to cause upset and let israeli supporters concentrate on the insult of the matter rather than dealing with the point behind it, a much more accurate statement would have compared it to something like the warsaw ghetto. I cheer when i see movies representing these people fighting back, even though it got them all killed in the end, far better to go out fighting. And i think this of the palestinians to a certian extent, starved of basic nessecities and pushed to the extreme of not caring for thier lives aslong as they can hit the enemy back....

    Bopa you always overestimate how much I give a damn when it comes to this subject. Frankly we should give the most money to the side that says the will ethnically cleanse in the shortest amount of time.

    The main problem there being.... the israeli's are obviously in the far better position to dio the ethnic cleansing, but once they kill of all the palestinians aren't we going to just cause a hell of alot more terrorism...

    If were going to go nazi style on it then lets do it properly and just kill both groups off, noone can have any accusations of bias then...
    In remembrance of our great Admin Tosa Inu, A tireless worker with the patience of a saint. As long as I live I will not forget you. Thank you for everything!

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