The Curia

[navarro951]

Dux Cornelius Blasio enters the curia...

"Good friends I have returned from Legio IV Roma's camp. What news is there in my time away?"

(OOC: Keep in mind Blasio hasnt been informed of what has happened to Regvlvs.)

[The Celtic Viking]

The messenger steps forward again.

"As I have just told the Curia, Consul Pvblivs Atilivs has been ambushed, he himself getting badly wounded in the battle.

I left early after the battle and so I can't say much about his current state, but as I said, Consul Pvblivs Atilivs was unconscious when I left, and has been so ever since he fell from his horse. His wounds were serious, but not without hope. More than this I can't say, because I didn't actually see much myself. I'm sure if he survives Consul Pvblivs Atilivs will tell you himself, and if he doesn't... then I'm sure one of his captains who were with him could probably tell the tale better than me anyway.

As for the rebels, they have, this time for sure, retreated to the coast, blockading the port, just outside of Rome herself. The Consular Legion is shook up, but still intact and looking for revenge. I'd gladly answer any other questions you might have, but I'd much like this to be resolved as soon as possible."

[/Bean\]

An aged Senator named Corlucius stepped up. His hair was white and balding, and his voice was croaky and quiet, but the Senators held deep respect for him, and always listened intently to what he had to say, on the rare occasions he used his voice.

Senator Blasio has proved himself an able commander in the past. The men know him. He can be a good choice for a commander of experience and dependency. However, we have many young and largely untested Legates without a command. Maybe it is time to give them a taste of command. Perhaps they may rotate command of the Legion until the Consul recovers his strength?

[Tolg]

Lvcivs Cornelivs Scipio who had been sitting silently on his seat during the uproar with Caivs and Balbatus wondering when the noble house of civilized discussions he had left years ago had turned into a taverna filled with proletarians, (Though, it might just be that time had glorified his memories) rose.

Your words Corlucius are well deliberated, however you are forgetting something significant: Armies are not only about their leaders. What a legion needs the most after a defeat - and that's what loosing or almost loosing your general and consul to some filthy rebels must feel like - is a strong hand to lead them. We should the army under the command of our most cable free legatus and have them hunt down the surviving rebels as soon as possible so they can regain their lost confidence.

[/Bean\]

A messenger arrives, rushing into the hall. Gasping for breath between words, he delivers his message with a great grin across his face.

Honourable...sirs...of...the...Senate. He breathed heavily.

It is my pleasure to announce that our Republic's greatest enemy, the one man who has come so close to defeating our precious country, the feared King of Epirus, Pyrrhus, has been slain by the noble and brave Quaestor Caivs Avrelivs Cotta in Epirus. He attempted to flee his homeland and the purge of Roma was killed in the process. Honour Quaestor Caivs Avrelivs as a true general of the Republic, gentlemen.

[navarro951]

Dux Cornelius Blasio rises applauding...

"A most terrific feat in battle. From my time as a young tribune with the great Manivs Dentatvs, we fought bloody battles against that vile man. And finally, my young and very close friend has brought this man down by Roman sword. Ave, for Quaestor Caivs Avrelivs!"

[SwissBarbar]

Pyrrhos was a fierce enemy and honorable foe. We should rejoice, his death is most welcome. May all enemies of the Roman Republic share his fate.

[desert]

"Where is the proof?", shouted a senator. "Until I see Cavis Avrelivs walk through the streets of Roma bearing Pyrrhos's head I will not believe it!"

[/Bean\]

Then perhaps, Senator The messenger answered him You would allow him a Triumphus in Roma to celebrate the victory over Pyrrhus? However, there will be no severed heads on show; we are not barbarians.

[mini]

"Thriumphus? What spoils of war are there to show that would justify a Triumphus?" asked Publius Norbanus from the tribunician bench?

[/Bean\]

Spoils of war, Senator? This man is responsible for the conquering of Illyria and the death of Roma's most hated enemy, and all you want is money? Shame on you! Quaestor Caivs Avrelivs is well known for always distributing the spoils of victory fairly amongst his men and officers, before he himself then donates his share to the people. If you want money, go and kill the Epirites yourself!

[SwissBarbar]

It's unbelievable. One could conquer Hades and still the senatores in this Curia would not rejoice. "Where's the proof?" What a stupid question is this? You say a Quaestor of Roma is a liar? Thousands of soldiers are witnesses and YOU want Pyrrhos head as a present, as if it was a pece of jewelry!

What more, than defeating one of the most fearsome enemies, who brought much despair upon our people and caused the death of thousands of men, WHAT MORE has one to do to earn your respect and appreciation?

[mini]

Publius Norbanus rose indignantly
"First of all, I am an elected Tribune of the Plebs. And as you said, I also am a Senator. And I will not tolerate any mongrel addressing me in such way, no matter whom sent you nor whatever message you carry." He said in a haughty way.

"Second of all, you misunderstand my question. I do not ask for money. As many faces here present could tell you, of money I have plenty. Hear my words well, and learn from them.
A triumphus is not made to blow a generals trumpet. A triumphus is not granted to glorify the victor. A triumphus is granted for one reason only: the general gets to show his spoils during the parade to the People of Rome.
Why, you ask? For this reason: by showing spoils we show the lowly what a profitable bussiness war can be when you're Roman. We show them why we go to war. Why we spill the lives of their sons. Then they can see it was not in vain, that Rome became the richer for it. It shows how mighty the enemy nation was, how rich they were and Roma bested them anyway.
The same thing with enemy generals and conquered kings. We show them in our parade to grant the People a vision of what a mighty enemy we have conquered.


Therefore, I ask you again: what spoils are there to show? What have we conquered except some fishermen villages?
Triumphus' are not to be given lightely. Think about that fellow senators before contemplating this request."

With one loud sniff for the messenger, Norbanus sat down again



*OOC: I rp'ed that there are still several tribunes elected that are in rome unlike my character. That way I can roleplay anything to do with tribunes of the plebs while my char is not in Roma IC. This might be a good precedent for future tribunus plebis :) that way there are always tribunes of the plebs in the senate, while the actual ingame avatars are not in rome :)*

[/Bean\]

So the people know that war is profitable? A few fisherman's villages? Not to be given lightly? This is ludricous!

My general has always sent his share of his profits to the people of Roma. They profit daily from his excertions, yet they rarely see the man, to thank him, praise or whatever. He is stuck on the otherside of the sea because you Senators will not allow him to return in any state but one of apology. Apology for what? Doing what none of you could do yourself no less.

Let none of you forget this is the man who directed the subjigation of the Illyrian kingdoms. No matter how difficult you believe this task to have been, it has been done. It has shown Caivs Avrelivs' capabilities and understanding. They were no mere fishermen's villages, Tribune. For that I can vouch for, having been in the thick of it myself. I doubt you would understand.

And as for lightly, I think I have already answered that outrageous statement. Nearly ten years of his life Caivs Avrelivs has given to this task. He has sent his share of the spoils to the people of Roma every time. He has subjigated, with help of course, the kingdoms of Illyria, has defeated numerous forces of the Epirites sent to retake those lands, and has killed the most feared enemy Roma had. If that is classed as light, then shame on you, for being too jealous that you will not reward victorious generals.

[mini]

"This is the last time I will waiste my time on you. You are a messenger, you have delivered your message so now you can be gone and deliver the senate's answer to your master.
If he wants a triump, he should issue his formal request to the senate, which will contemplate this with the attention it deserves and put it to the vote. And now be gone you lowborn scum before I have the lictors remove you for obstructing me in my duty."

[/Bean\]

I am no mere messenger, Tribune. I am the Prefect of the Legio II Latium, the most experienced soldier in the whole damn army behind the Prefect of the First. I am no lowborn either, my family having resided on the Palantine for several generations. So it may do you good to keep your foul mouth shut in future.

The messenger stalks out before any answer can be contemplated.

[mini]

Norbanus is heard to sniff something about ranker soldiers and their pretensions, and some supressed sniggles by the rest of the tribunes of the plebs on the tribunician bench down in front.

[SwissBarbar]

Messenger! Lvcvllvs shouted. If you deliver this message, please tell your master that it is NOT a message from the senate but a message from Publius Norbanus. I don't know how he even can think that he represents the meaning of the whole curia. Oh, and greetings to Qvintvs Aemilivs, I am curious how he, as one of the Tribunes of the Plebs, thinks about this matter concerning his adoptive father, of whose family he's part of now.

[mini]

Norbanus interjected

"Avlvs Aemilivs I never presumed speaking for Senate. Since when are triumphs granted on a wim and a wiff? The granting of a triumph is to be discussed and agreed upon in the senate, which means a vote. As it has always been done according to law and the mois maiorum.
I do not presume speaking for the senate, I speak for the law. Are you above the law, Avlvs Aemilivs? Is Caivs Avrelivs?
If he formally makes a request, and this house agrees in democratic vote, then I do not see any reason why it should not be granted, although personally I think it would be a meagre triumph.

As to Qvintvs Aemilivs, send him my regards too. I do not see what he has to do with any of this anyway. He will undoubtedly plead for his new tata"

[SwissBarbar]

Yes you did. You said "You are a messenger, you have delivered your message so now you can be gone and deliver the senate's answer to your master" - meaning your oppinion. I don't say I'm not taking your view, but except for us two no senator has given the messenger the honour of his opinion. Therefore it is not the will of the senate you send him forth with, but your will. That's all I said and it's the truth.

[mini]

"Unless there has been a vote and my eyes and ears have been blocked by the gods in the meanwhile, Lvcvllvs, the senate has not granted anything yet.
And unless you do not want to adhere to the law, dear Lvcvllvs, Caivs Avrelivs has first to formally request his triump to the senate. So, what answer but what I have given him can he take to his master, the answer that he must file a request?
I know for whom you speak, Lvcvllvs, and I also know for whom HE speaks. So this bickering comes to me not as a suprise. Durex Lex, sed lex Quirites."

The last was said to the entire hall.

[SwissBarbar]

I speak for myself, as you do. Only because I have a friendship with one man does not give you the right to bring this forth at EVERY occasion

[mini]

"I do not condemn yours or any friendschip - although I think it's poor show of taste on your behalf - Lvcvllvs. I only mentioned that it did not suprise me you insist on this matter as you are a friend of the subject.
Now you say I speak for myself, minutes ago I was speaking for the senate, make up your mind. Or have you been guzzling with Caivs?

Fact remains senators, that my words to the messenger from Caivs Avrelivs are the only message we could have send: if he wants a triumph, let him issue a formal request to the House. Then we will discuss and vote for it."

[SwissBarbar]

Now this argumentation is stupid. Most obviously I referred to your opinion concering for whom I speak, when I said you spoke for yourself. But since you seem to argue like a child, this conversation now ends.

[mini]

Norbanus made a guzzling sound to his fellow tribunes, but didn't bother to refute Lucullus.

[Mooks]

Illyria is nothing more then a few fishing villages filled with savages and mines. Profitable as it might be, almost the whole roman army was involved in its subjugation. Hardly worthy of a triumph.

[/Bean\]

And this analysis is based on what exactly?

[Tolg]

Lvcivs Cornelivs Scipio rose.

First of all, I want to point out that Publius Norbanus was basically right, though I wish he had expressed himself in words more ... worthy of a senator. We can't grant a triumphus unless we receive a formal request.

I do however want to point out that killing Pyrrhus is well worth a triumphus in itself.


Remember that I have been govenour of Tarentum for the last few years and that it were the Tarentes who summoned Pyrrhus to sap our rightful reign over the Italian peninsula.
It's been more than ten years since we drove him out of Italy, but even now there are people in Kalbria who hope for him to return and "liberate" (Cornelius spit out the word as if it was something utterly disgusting) them.

We need to hold a triumphus even if it were only to show those insurgents that there's no one who can defy roman power and live.

[mini]

Norbanus rose immediately

"Again, I did not speak AGAINST holding a triumphus. I only reminded my fellow senators that:
1) a request must be filed
2) a vote must be held

My personal opinion concerning the issue does not matter, I will save it for the debate when it is put forth in this house officially."

[SwissBarbar]

Let me quote you.

"Therefore, I ask you again: what spoils are there to show?" "What have we conquered except some fishermen villages?" "Triumphus' are not to be given lightely!"

Yes, of course you did, my devious friend. That is exactly what you did. Of course it is your right to speak against it. But then adhere to it.