The Obssession with Homosexuality

[rasoforos]

A very wise greek proverb roughly translates:

'A cucumber that doesn't grow up your bum you shouldn't care how it grows'

It means that if something does not really affect you then you should not try to stop it

Perhaps, just perhaps, some 'straight' people are so 'interested' in homosexuality because they try to hide their own homosexual feelings (and there is a plethora of anti-gay enthusiasts caught taking it up the bum to prove it)

[Askthepizzaguy]

DUDE! I'm eating cucumbers right now wtf have some respect for people who want to eat cukes!










obviously.

[rasoforos]

DUDE! I'm eating cucumbers right now wtf have some respect for people who want to eat cukes!










obviously.

You don't really want to know the other greek proverb involving cucumbers then...

[Vuk]

A very wise greek proverb roughly translates:

'A cucumber that doesn't grow up your bum you shouldn't care how it grows'

It means that if something does not really affect you then you should not try to stop it

Perhaps, just perhaps, some 'straight' people are so 'interested' in homosexuality because they try to hide their own homosexual feelings (and there is a plethora of anti-gay enthusiasts caught taking it up the bum to prove it)

Sorry Ras, but that does not make much sense to me. The thing is that they think it IS affecting them, even though they are not the ones with the cucumber up their butts. :P
Also, the argument that people who oppose the spread of homosexuality are secretly gay is as ridiculous as saying that people who oppose the spread of murder are secret murderers. Don't get me wrong, I am not equating the two, but a lot of people think they are both a sin, and so oppose the spread of homosexuality. (if there was not so much of it and if it were not being flaunted so, there would not be so much contraversy over it)

[Askthepizzaguy]

Also, the argument that people who oppose the spread of homosexuality are secretly gay is as ridiculous as saying that people who oppose the spread of murder are secret murderers. Don't get me wrong, I am not equating the two, but a lot of people think they are both a sin, and so oppose the spread of homosexuality. (if there was not so much of it and if it were not being flaunted so, there would not be so much contraversy over it)

There are a number of people who think Jews are evil. By your logic, if there were just fewer people practicing Judaism and it wasn't done so publicly, there would not be so much controversy over it. If you have a problem with homosexuality that's fine, but it's never been demonstrated how it harms people, especially straight people.

[Vuk]

There are a number of people who think Jews are evil. By your logic, if there were just fewer people practicing Judaism and it wasn't done so publicly, there would not be so much controversy over it. If you have a problem with homosexuality that's fine, but it's never been demonstrated how it harms people, especially straight people.

You missed my point entirely ATPG. Jews do not flaunt their Judaism like gays flaunt their gayness. My point isn't whether it is right or wrong, but simply that people who think it is evil make a big deal about it because gay make such a big deal about themselves. I was not arguing for or against liking or disliking gays, simply saying that everyong who opposes them being secretly gay is hardly a satisfactory argument. I think the way gays flaunt themselves is a much more likely reason for there being so much anti-gay ferver.

[Askthepizzaguy]

You missed my point entirely ATPG. Jews do not flaunt their Judaism like gays flaunt their gayness. My point isn't whether it is right or wrong, but simply that people who think it is evil make a big deal about it because gay make such a big deal about themselves. I was not arguing for or against liking or disliking gays, simply saying that everyong who opposes them being secretly gay is hardly a satisfactory argument. I think the way gays flaunt themselves is a much more likely reason for there being so much anti-gay ferver.

I believe some Jews do flaunt their judaism, by wearing the skull caps and going to temple and wearing their hair a certain way and speaking the Yiddish and saying things like Mozel Tov. Some of them even wave the flag of Israel in their signature lines, or in support of Israel in front of their place of business. And by the way, most gays do not flaunt their gayness, because certain people AHEM make them feel unwelcome.

You know, those darn black people also make such a big deal about the equal rights, tolerance and acceptance of blacks, that if they would all just shut up and go away the world would be a better place, now wouldn't it?

So the reason you don't think gays deserve equal protections is because they insist on living their lives in an openly gay manner?

None of that, act normal, don't impose, tada. But that seems to be rather hard for attention-whores and provocation-junkies. Tearing eachother apart in broad daylight where everybody can (must?) see it, that doesn't help at all. I am not going to respect someone who doesn't respect me. Ask me to respect them as a person, fine. Demanding respect for their sexual preference, get lost.

Straight people flaunt their sexuality much more than gay people do, because there is no majority of people who disapprove of it and condemn them for being Godless straights. The respect argument here is ludicrous, when you have rappers making music (?) videos involving barely clothed women, with drug-related, gang-related, money-obsessed, violent, sexist content, that is much more offensive to me than a man who speaks with a lisp and wears a pink shirt that says "We're here and we're queer." Straight people, historically, have zero respect for gays. So now, you're arguing since they don't automatically respect your wishes and just hide in the closet all the time, it is their own fault that the world hates them? Pardon but they've been in the closet for untold generations. They just want equal rights.

You can hate them and disrespect them all you want, so be it. It's a free country and if you want to judge them as being inferior or unworthy of your respect, feel free to do so, and I can do the same for you, and have a lot more reason to do so. But if you advocate against their equal rights, and you don't have an argument as to why, then why are you having the discussion? If the bottom line is that queers make you uncomfortable, (or if blacks make you uncomfortable, or if Jews make you uncomfortable, or if Democrats or Republicans make you uncomfortable, or if Midgets make you uncomfortable...) you know, suck it up or move to a homogenous and intolerant culture like, say, North Korea. You'll fit right in.

[Fragony]

They just want equal rights.

They got equal rights.

You can hate them and disrespect them all you want, so be it. It's a free country and if you want to judge them as being inferior or unworthy of your respect, feel free to do so, and I can do the same for you, and have a lot more reason to do so.

The ATPG monologues.

I respect them as a person, not as a homosexual, why should I? It ain't an achievement or anything all it takes is bending over. I don't respect people because they are christians, I don't respect people because they are muslims, and I don't respect people because the are gay.

But if you advocate against their equal rights

It's all in your head

If the bottom line is that queers make you uncomfortable

If you think I am harsh you should talk to a gay, yes, friend of mine who hates girlyfag's guts with a passion. Normal guy, has a relation, nobody thinks about it they just are. By the way, I slept with him. No not like that but in the same bed, that is how uncomfortable I am.

[Vuk]

I believe some Jews do flaunt their judaism, by wearing the skull caps and going to temple and wearing their hair a certain way and speaking the Yiddish and saying things like Mozel Tov. Some of them even wave the flag of Israel in their signature lines, or in support of Israel in front of their place of business. And by the way, most gays do not flaunt their gayness, because certain people AHEM make them feel unwelcome.

You know, those darn black people also make such a big deal about the equal rights, tolerance and acceptance of blacks, that if they would all just shut up and go away the world would be a better place, now wouldn't it?

So the reason you don't think gays deserve equal protections is because they insist on living their lives in an openly gay manner?

Ok, who said I thought that they did not deserve equal protections? Boy ATPG, talk about putting words in peoples' mouths.
Your entire argument is bunk! Jews do not wear 'skull caps' (so tempted...), wear their hair a certain way, and speak Yiddish to draw attention to themselves. They do it because it is a religious calling. You know I am talking about the gays who relish in the attention they get for being gay. People who go to gay parades dressed as God knows what, people who screw each other in the street at said parades, people who everywhere they go (not for a religious convinction, but just to draw attention to themselves for being gay) wear rainbow T-shirts and eat the face off their boyfriend in Hardeez (talk about a way to ruin my darned male. I am sinking my teeth into a thick burger and all of a sudden two homos in rainbow shirts in front of my start eyeing me and then eating each other's faces off - disgusting). And yeah, I have seen all to many gays like that. (never seen anyone screaming for attention for being straight, you'll have to point the next one out to me) My argument was that that was why a lot of people were focusing on them, because they are demanding people's attention. Sure, there are straigh attention-, but they are not looking for attention for being straight. When repubs (gay or straight) hold parades and wear t-shirts and demand attention for being repubs, people pay attention to them for being repubs, 'cause that is what they are flaunting. When women (gay or straight) flaunt their sexuality, you hear people focusing on how imoral people are, because that is what was being flaunted. Likewise, when you have a lot of people flaunting their gayness, it is going to rally people who believe being gay is wrong. If gays would stop making a big deal about them being gay, then it wouldn't be a big deal that they were gay.
I personally think homosexuality is wrong (and I am not gonna get into an argument as to why), but I got gay friends. It is their choice and I am not gonna judge them on it (heaven knows I make plenty of mistakes myself. I know most of them think me being a conservative is wrong :P). I really do not care at all that they are gay. When I see a bunch of sparkling guys dressed as peacocks in parade with their hanging out, I find THAT offensive. You know what though? If people started having straight parades and flaunting being straight, and dressing like asses, and having sex in the streets, I would be disgusted by that too. If you do not want attention, DON'T DEMAND IT!


EDIT: and so you do not have another ATPG flight of fantasy, let me stress that I am not talking about people looking for attention, I am talking about people demanding attention for being gay. I am not saying that gays cannot kiss in public. I am talking about doing things just to show people that they are not gay. "I am gay" t-shirst for instance. WTF? Who cares? When you wear that t-shirt, you want people to care. I don't go wearing "I am straight" t-shirts, because it really shouldn't matter to anyone (but my gf ). The only reason I would wear such a t-shirt is to make people focus on me being gay. Before you use you Judiasm argument, that is not the same, because they do not wear their cloths to flaunt themselves off as Jews. They do it out of religious conviction. I WANT people to know that I am a nice person. I WANT people to know that I am an honest person. I WANT people to be fooled into thinking that I am an intelligent person. I don't want people focusing on my sexual preferences though, because that is not what defines me. You can handsome and ugly people gay and straight. Smart and dumb. Nasty and nice, etc. Do you really want people to think of you as a sexual preference (ie a 'gay man') and not a person? Gay activist claim to want the very opposite, yet they define themselves as being gay and always call attention to it. If they want it to be no more important than 'do you like sugar with your coffee?', then why don't they act like it? If it is that important to them, then it will be that important to others.

[Tribesman]

Saw this gem on another forum

1. Homosexuality is not natural, much like eyeglasses, polyester, and birth control are not natural.

2. Heterosexual marriages are valid because they produce children. Infertile couples and old people cannot get legally married because the world needs more children.

3. Obviously gay parents will raise gay children because straight parents only raise straight children.

4. Straight marriage will be less meaningful, since Britney Spears's 55-hour just-for-fun marriage was meaningful.

5. Heterosexual marriage has been around for a long time, and it hasn't changed at all: women are property, Blacks can't marry Whites, and divorce is illegal.

6. Gay marriage should be decided by the people, not the courts, because the majority-elected legislatures, not courts, have historically protected the rights of minorities.

7. Gay marriage is not supported by religion. In a theocracy like ours, the values of one religion are always imposed on the entire country. That's why we only have one religion in America.

8. Gay marriage will encourage people to be gay, in the same way that hanging around tall people makes you tall.

9. Legalizing gay marriage will open the door to all kinds of crazy behavior. People may even wish to marry their pets because a dog has legal standing and can sign a marriage license.

10. Children can never succeed without both male and female role models at home. That's why single parents are forbidden to raise children.

11. Gay marriage will change the foundation of society. Heterosexual marriage has been around for a long time, and we could never adapt to new social norms because we haven't adapted to cars or longer lifespans.

12. Civil unions, providing most of the same benefits as marriage with a different name are better, because a "separate but equal" institution is always constitutional. Separate schools for African-Americans worked just as well as separate marriages will for gays & lesbians.

[Askthepizzaguy]

If gays would stop making a big deal about them being gay, then it wouldn't be a big deal that they were gay.

Ya know, I bet if we just made sure they had civil rights, you'd see them acting out a lot less. Pass gay marriage and you'll get a lot less marching in the streets.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

I personally think homosexuality is wrong (and I am not gonna get into an argument as to why), but I got gay friends. It is their choice and I am not gonna judge them on it (heaven knows I make plenty of mistakes myself. I know most of them think me being a conservative is wrong :P). I really do not care at all that they are gay. When I see a bunch of sparkling guys dressed as peacocks in parade with their hanging out, I find THAT offensive. You know what though? If people started having straight parades and flaunting being straight, and dressing like asses, and having sex in the streets, I would be disgusted by that too. If you do not want attention, DON'T DEMAND IT!

Political change often requires that you demand people's attention.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

EDIT: and so you do not have another ATPG flight of fantasy, let me stress that I am not talking about people looking for attention, I am talking about people demanding attention for being gay. I am not saying that gays cannot kiss in public. I am talking about doing things just to show people that they are not gay. "I am gay" t-shirst for instance. WTF? Who cares? When you wear that t-shirt, you want people to care. I don't go wearing "I am straight" t-shirts, because it really shouldn't matter to anyone (but my gf ). The only reason I would wear such a t-shirt is to make people focus on me being gay. Before you use you Judiasm argument, that is not the same, because they do not wear their cloths to flaunt themselves off as Jews. They do it out of religious conviction. I WANT people to know that I am a nice person. I WANT people to know that I am an honest person. I WANT people to be fooled into thinking that I am an intelligent person. I don't want people focusing on my sexual preferences though, because that is not what defines me. You can handsome and ugly people gay and straight. Smart and dumb. Nasty and nice, etc. Do you really want people to think of you as a sexual preference (ie a 'gay man') and not a person? Gay activist claim to want the very opposite, yet they define themselves as being gay and always call attention to it. If they want it to be no more important than 'do you like sugar with your coffee?', then why don't they act like it? If it is that important to them, then it will be that important to others.

They have a right to express themselves. Any nudity or lewd conduct in public is against the law and should be prosecuted. Other than that, tough it out.

[Fragony]

Perhaps, just perhaps, some 'straight' people are so 'interested' in homosexuality because they try to hide their own homosexual feelings (and there is a plethora of anti-gay enthusiasts caught taking it up the bum to prove it)

yaya.

It are actually the gays themselves who are obsessed with their sexual preference. I wouldn't care if they didn't care so much but too much is too much. Example, we have the gay parade here, boats full of gays in Amsterdam. They wanted a boat for homosexual people with down syndrome, they wanted a boat for homosexual 11 year olds (wtf?). Just act normal.

[Vuk]

yaya.

It are actually the gays themselves who are obsessed with their sexual preference. I wouldn't care if they didn't care so much but too much is too much. Example, we have the gay parade here, boats full of gays in Amsterdam. They wanted a boat for homosexual people with down syndrome, they wanted a boat for homosexual 11 year olds (wtf?). Just act normal.

Exactly, just get on with it. I recently just found out that a friend of mine here in Hungary was gay. I had no idea until it came up in conversation. I don't care, it is his choice. It affected me about as much as if he told me that he was straight. Anyone, gay or straight who goes around like an obnoxious twit, flaunting their sexual preference I find disgusting though. I have never seen a straight person do it, but infortunately, I have seen gays do it all too often. I think that is why most people make a big deal about them, because they make a big deal about themselves. It is asking why everyone in the room is fixated with the stripper; because the stripper wants attention and is demanding it, so of course she he (it fits better with the mood :P) is going to get it.

[Tribesman]

they wanted a boat for homosexual 11 year olds (wtf?). Just act normal.

Same old crap again Frag , can you force yourself to write what the real story was instead of once again repeating your oft debunked fabrication ?

[Fragony]

Same old crap again Frag , can you force yourself to write what the real story was instead of once again repeating your oft debunked fabrication ?

[insert debunk here]

[aimlesswanderer]

I find hilarious when loud anti gay crusaders are eventually caught doing what they constantly denounced, hypocrisy FTW! Hello Ted Haggard http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ted_Haggard. Hello former senator Larry Craig http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Larry_Craig

[rory_20_uk]

I think it's a continuing reaction against homophobia. When they realise in most places they're demonstrating a non existent majority they'll calm down.

Although expecting them to loose interest in parades with fabulous dresses and make up is probably asking too much...

[Vuk]

I think it's a continuing reaction against homophobia. When they realise in most places they're demonstrating a non existent majority they'll calm down.

Although expecting them to loose interest in parades with fabulous dresses and make up is probably asking too much...

Well they are being just as bad as homophobes. Sure, they have their right to sexual preferences, but what about the rights of the people who do not want sexual parades going by their houses? They cannot intrude on other people's rights so that they can flaunt their own. It is not just them though, I remember when I was in Chicago there was some kind of up fetish parade going right by where I slept. I was absolutely , because I saw and heard a lot of things I could have gone my entire life without seeing and hearing, could not go outside, and was kept up all night. Crap like that that infringes on other people's rights should be illegal. Man, I forgot how much I hate Chicago. :P That darned city is the armpit of the States. :P I have lived in big cities I have liked, so they cannot blame it on being a big city. It ain't the people either, because there are plenty of other cities with a lot of Poles, blacks, Serbs, Germans, etc. It is just the politics and way of life in Chicago. (and no, I had this opinion loooong before I heard of Obama :P) No offense to Chicagoians, but I have never had worse experiences than I did in Chicago, and have never been in a city I found more offensive. :P (even London is a nicer place )

EDIT: Maybe if I moved to Amsterdam

[Evil_Maniac From Mars]

Perhaps, just perhaps, some 'straight' people are so 'interested' in homosexuality because they try to hide their own homosexual feelings (and there is a plethora of anti-gay enthusiasts caught taking it up the bum to prove it)

Some, maybe. On the other hand, I think KarlXII said it perfectly with:

All Republicans that oppose Obama are, in fact, insecure Democrats.

Saying that everyone who opposes gay marriage is a closet homosexual is a rather amusing troll.

[Kadagar_AV]

I have yet to see a valid argument as to why homosexuality would be "wrong".

[Evil_Maniac From Mars]

I have yet to see a valid argument as to why homosexuality would be "wrong".

I've already said that I don't care much either way. However, it really depends what you see as valid.

[Kadagar_AV]

I've already said that I don't care much either way. However, it really depends what you see as valid.

Valid - an argument that has any sort of sence behind it...

[Evil_Maniac From Mars]

Valid - an argument that has any sort of sence behind it...

Which is, of course, purely subjective.

[Askthepizzaguy]

If one argues that it is against God's will;
One can counter that they are the way God made them. If God wanted them some other way, he would have made them that way. Any argument regarding God's will is pure speculation anyway, because no one knows the mind of God. Any who claim to are fools.

If one argues that it is against nature;
There have been countless species who have demonstrated homosexual desire and coupling. Some species even change gender spontaneously in a same-sex environment, to keep the species alive. There is nothing particularly unique about human behavior, it is once again, perfectly natural, as we are part of nature, not separate from it.

If one argues that it is uncivilized;
It is a consenting activity between two adults, which is far less uncivilized than most other human behaviors such as hatred, loathing, greed, sloth, gluttony, selfishness, apathy, and so forth which are destructive things, none of them illegal. So if we are to legislate morality, why not touch on the things which clearly are tearing society apart, such as organized hatred? If you won't make hate illegal, why must you make love that you don't understand illegal? If Nazis can march freely in our streets, so can the gays. And duh, I'd prefer gays marching than Nazis.

If one argues that it is perverse;
Then you must make illegal all forms of sodomy including relations which involve parts of the body above the neck, because many people argue those activities are equally perverse, even among heterosexuals. You must also ban adult videos and literature, as well as adult oriented playthings. And you must also ban articles of clothing, public and private, which tittilate the senses and encourage lust which is not for the defined purpose of procreation. Once you outlaw what things people deem perverse, you must outlaw all forms of sex for pleasure, as that is not what God/nature/religious people intended it to be for.

If one argues it will lead to polygamy;
I have news for you. Polygamy already exists and it is indeed a separate issue. If you're this concerned about marriage, why not confront Islamic fundies who allow girls as young as 8 to be married to 50-year olds and be given no legal rights or protections. There are far worse things in the world than two consenting adults getting married, which involve much greater "distortions" of what we call marriage.

If one argues that it is immoral;
It is immoral to persecute a people who have done you no wrong. It is immoral to fire people from a job because of which consenting adult they choose to share a bed with. It is immoral to focus so much on preventing gay people from obtaining equality under the law. It is immoral to prevent people of the same gender to obtain the right to visit their loved ones in a hospital, or to adopt children. Gay and bisexual people often end up having children, and as such they are allowed (as if they needed our approval?) to raise their own children as fit, loving parents. A person's same-sex preference should not exclude them from acting as a normal member of society.

If one argues that it teaches children that it is ok, and that is contradictory to your religious teachings;
Other forms of behavior banned by your religious teachings, such as gambling or prostitution or divorce, happen all the time, and yet somehow you manage to live. Wars and slavery and human destruction of themselves and their environments happen all the time, and frankly the religious sector of our population tends to support or ignore those policies more than the secularists do. You can, as you are legally allowed to do, spread teachings of fear and hatred against gay people to your children. You can teach that they are rotten to the core and will burn in hell. And someday, your child may see your false piety and your casting off of other human beings as garbage, and they may elect to do the same towards you; especially considering that the chance that your child may be gay is greater than you might imagine. You must also realize that they can choose to believe in whatever faith they like in this country, or none at all, and increasingly that's what they will do. Yet somehow, ever since marriage between gays became legal in several states, God did not smote us, and nothing out of the ordinary happened. Oh, except for some very extraordinary things... such as a people once persecuted are now being treated like equal human beings, and it didn't affect your life in a negative way at all. For some people you've already judged as being fodder for Satan, they are enjoying their lives as free people. And if there is a God and he does judge them, let Him judge them for doing something they were free to engage in, not bullied into hiding from by religious zealots, forced to live an uncomfortable lie which often leads to depression and suicide.

Finally:
Love thy neighbor, and don't judge him or her, because you're hardly a saint, and their sexuality is none of your business. Because this will affect our laws and therefore our courts, you have a right to have an opinion on the matter, but once the votes have been counted and the laws upheld by a court, let it go. Find another scapegoat for blaming the world's troubles on.