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Looks like even Texas is figuring this out:
Raise your hand if you're surprised.
More government money has been spent on the cause of sexual abstinence in Texas than any other state, but it still has the third-highest teen birth rate in the country and the highest percentage of teen mothers giving birth more than once.
The rate of student pregnancies in Austin high schools has increased 57 percent since the 2005-06 school year, and rates of sexually transmitted diseases are rising among Travis County teens. [...]
The abstinence-only approach to sex education, which has cost U.S. taxpayers at least $1.3 billion since 1996, has fallen out of favor in many parts of the country. Half the states had withdrawn from Title V by the time it ended in June. In other recent developments:
The American Medical Association adopted a report that found that sex education programs based on promoting abstinence produced "no delay of initiating sexual activity, no reduction in the number of sexual partners and no increase in abstinence." The AMA recommended schools use comprehensive sex education instead.
A study released by Columbia University found that earlier progress in increasing contraceptive use among teens has stalled. Another troubling trend: The CDC reported that birth rates among adolescents ages 15-19 are continuing to increase after years of decline; so are rates of gonorrhea and syphilis infection.
The rate of student pregnancies in Austin high schools has increased 57 percent since the 2005-06 school year, and rates of sexually transmitted diseases are rising among Travis County teens. [...]
The abstinence-only approach to sex education, which has cost U.S. taxpayers at least $1.3 billion since 1996, has fallen out of favor in many parts of the country. Half the states had withdrawn from Title V by the time it ended in June. In other recent developments:
The American Medical Association adopted a report that found that sex education programs based on promoting abstinence produced "no delay of initiating sexual activity, no reduction in the number of sexual partners and no increase in abstinence." The AMA recommended schools use comprehensive sex education instead.
A study released by Columbia University found that earlier progress in increasing contraceptive use among teens has stalled. Another troubling trend: The CDC reported that birth rates among adolescents ages 15-19 are continuing to increase after years of decline; so are rates of gonorrhea and syphilis infection.
Raise your hand if you're surprised.
I am not...
Abstinence is farce. How many teen males wish to be celibate??
Abstinence is farce. How many teen males wish to be celibate??
Never mess with the way of things.
More wonderful throwbacks to the Puritan fools that settled on these shores centuries ago.
I will say this much though. Two major fears kept me from doing the deed until early in college; pregnancy and disease. Pregnancy carries the obvious problems with it, like cutting your life short so you have to go to work to support the child. There were more than a few teen pregnancies in my high school, quite a few of which were due to broken prophylactics too. Disease is a lot more insidious, there was also a lot of it going around my high school. Some of that crap is just nasty, and can stay with you for life. No thanks.
I will say this much though. Two major fears kept me from doing the deed until early in college; pregnancy and disease. Pregnancy carries the obvious problems with it, like cutting your life short so you have to go to work to support the child. There were more than a few teen pregnancies in my high school, quite a few of which were due to broken prophylactics too. Disease is a lot more insidious, there was also a lot of it going around my high school. Some of that crap is just nasty, and can stay with you for life. No thanks.
Originally Posted by Whacker:
I will say this much though. Two major fears kept me from doing the deed until early in college; pregnancy and disease. Pregnancy carries the obvious problems with it, like cutting your life short so you have to go to work to support the child. There were more than a few teen pregnancies in my high school, quite a few of which were due to broken prophylactics too. Disease is a lot more insidious, there was also a lot of it going around my high school. Some of that crap is just nasty, and can stay with you for life. No thanks.
Yeah, same here. If I was actually attracted to women that is.I will say this much though. Two major fears kept me from doing the deed until early in college; pregnancy and disease. Pregnancy carries the obvious problems with it, like cutting your life short so you have to go to work to support the child. There were more than a few teen pregnancies in my high school, quite a few of which were due to broken prophylactics too. Disease is a lot more insidious, there was also a lot of it going around my high school. Some of that crap is just nasty, and can stay with you for life. No thanks.
Those religious fundamentalists should instead cite the exorbitant contraception failure rates as well as the horrors of STIs. That is the only effective advertising IMHO.
Contraceptives can work quite well as long as you dont use them like "HURRDURR s4f3s3ckz".
maybe if the kids were taught to put on the condoms right instead of abstinence there would be fewer cases?
also, in sweden girls start using pills when they are around 15, so teenage pregnancy is rare there.
abstinence never worked, never will (never should).
also, in sweden girls start using pills when they are around 15, so teenage pregnancy is rare there.
abstinence never worked, never will (never should).
I think our first sex ed class was when I was about 10, can't remember what was discussed but I remember a lot of giggling and there were 2 kids who sat in the hall because their parents didn't want them hearing about it. Then we had a few more in depth classes when I was about 14 that went more into contraception and safe sex, and they showed us the disgusting STD pictures. Despite the fact that there were a lot of kids trying sex, I never heard about any girls getting pregnant in my school, so they must have done something right.
From memory there has been plenty of evidence for this for years, but certain groups of people don't like pesky thing like evidence and facts, so the failure continues.....
Originally Posted by aimlesswanderer:
From memory there has been plenty of evidence for this for years, but certain groups of people don't like pesky thing like evidence and facts, so the failure continues.....
Aww, c'mon - everyone hates facts when they do not go their way. Do not blame the Republicans. I am no Republican, but still, there is no need to slander them - they have already screwed up enough without this additional allegation.From memory there has been plenty of evidence for this for years, but certain groups of people don't like pesky thing like evidence and facts, so the failure continues.....
But yes, the facts were always there. In that respect, you are correct.
It's quite crazy that some US states prefer to teach abstinence rather than how to use a condom and have sex safely. Once again, I'm speechless.
Originally Posted by Meneldil:
It's quite crazy that some US states prefer to teach abstinence rather than how to use a condom and have sex safely. Once again, I'm speechless.
Then you must be mute It's quite crazy that some US states prefer to teach abstinence rather than how to use a condom and have sex safely. Once again, I'm speechless.
, as this is but one of the minor illogical transgressions the human governments decree... Even now, in developed nations such as US.Originally Posted by :
Raise your hand if you're surprised.
I'm shocked - shocked, I say. We tell teens the bad things that can happen, and they do it anyway?Raise your hand if you're surprised.
Next you'll tell me the earth is round.
Originally Posted by aimlesswanderer:
From memory there has been plenty of evidence for this for years, but certain groups of people don't like pesky thing like evidence and facts, so the failure continues.....
I agree with AP, look at the post above you where miotas concludes that sex ed "must have" worked because he never heard about any girls getting pregnant at his school.From memory there has been plenty of evidence for this for years, but certain groups of people don't like pesky thing like evidence and facts, so the failure continues.....
I should hope Abstinence-Only Education will become a thing of the past. This child abuse ought to stop.
I'm fine with adults eschewing whatever essence of life they want. For whatever reason. But it is plain child abuse to scare young adolescents into doing too.
Tell adults not to have sex if you must. But don't take your sexual frustrations out on children.
I'm fine with adults eschewing whatever essence of life they want. For whatever reason. But it is plain child abuse to scare young adolescents into doing too.
Tell adults not to have sex if you must. But don't take your sexual frustrations out on children.
Originally Posted by Louis VI the Fat:
I should hope Abstinence-Only Education will become a thing of the past. This child abuse ought to stop.
I'm fine with adults eschewing whatever essence of life they want. For whatever reason. But it is plain child abuse to scare young adolescents into doing too.
Tell adults not to have sex if you must. But don't take your sexual frustrations out on children.
And while we're at it, drop the age of majority to 13, eliminate child-labor laws and mandatory education beyond age 12. Free the children.I should hope Abstinence-Only Education will become a thing of the past. This child abuse ought to stop.
I'm fine with adults eschewing whatever essence of life they want. For whatever reason. But it is plain child abuse to scare young adolescents into doing too.
Tell adults not to have sex if you must. But don't take your sexual frustrations out on children.
Originally Posted by KukriKhan:
And while we're at it, drop the age of majority to 13, eliminate child-labor laws and mandatory education beyond age 12. Free the children.
I'd say the more proper analogy would be to scare adolescents into thinking learning and personal development are bad and filthy. That adolescents must abstain from experimenting with education until 18.And while we're at it, drop the age of majority to 13, eliminate child-labor laws and mandatory education beyond age 12. Free the children.
Originally Posted by Louis VI the Fat:
I'd say the more proper analogy would be to scare adolescents into thinking learning and personal development are bad and filthy. That adolescents must abstain from experimenting with education until 18.
Brilliant!I'd say the more proper analogy would be to scare adolescents into thinking learning and personal development are bad and filthy. That adolescents must abstain from experimenting with education until 18.
If there was actually any success at any time of our history in restraining our youth... I would like to hear about it. Contrary to popular opinion, the Mediaeval Ages were in many ways, even more promiscuous than our times. The difference is, they were in denial about it, or more accurately, they accepted it, but kept an official silence about it.
I say, advocate abstinence and frighten the kids with tales of pregnancies and STIs. But at the same time teach safe-sex methods. Call it a contradiction, a hypocrisy, but if a child has to choose between having sex or not, I doubt he/she will consider his/her sex education as a factor. The child will not be influenced by his/her sex ed., as such things do not get into the way of sex.
When have you heard or read about a teenager who was about to have sex and then thought "Oh, I have not received sex education - I am not having sex because of this!" Never, that is the answer. Sex education will not make the teens any more licentious or confident in their despite to engage in coitus. There is pornography for that.
Now I am interested to hear a rebuttal. Forget statistics for now, as they are overtly contradictory in this case, although the latest and most accurate ones do generally show the lack of effectiveness of abstinence-only education. Let us simply use logic and models of common behaviour here.
I say, advocate abstinence and frighten the kids with tales of pregnancies and STIs. But at the same time teach safe-sex methods. Call it a contradiction, a hypocrisy, but if a child has to choose between having sex or not, I doubt he/she will consider his/her sex education as a factor. The child will not be influenced by his/her sex ed., as such things do not get into the way of sex.
When have you heard or read about a teenager who was about to have sex and then thought "Oh, I have not received sex education - I am not having sex because of this!" Never, that is the answer. Sex education will not make the teens any more licentious or confident in their despite to engage in coitus. There is pornography for that.
Now I am interested to hear a rebuttal. Forget statistics for now, as they are overtly contradictory in this case, although the latest and most accurate ones do generally show the lack of effectiveness of abstinence-only education. Let us simply use logic and models of common behaviour here.
Originally Posted by Aemilius Paulus:
I say, advocate abstinence and frighten the kids with tales of pregnancies and STIs. But at the same time teach safe-sex methods.
I say, advocate abstinence and frighten the kids with tales of pregnancies and STIs. But at the same time teach safe-sex methods.
Those sex ed classes put the fear in all the blokes I knew, they wouldn't even consider for a second the possibility of sex without a few frangers in their wallet.Originally Posted by Aemilius Paulus:
Do not blame the Republicans.
Nobody but you has even mentioned them in this thread. Texas, for example, trends Republican, but the Austin are is solidly Dem. Abstinence-only edumucation is a sufficient exercise in stupidity without dragging any political parties into it.Do not blame the Republicans.
And for my next thread, I'll talk about global warming and how "certain groups of people hate evidence and facts", without bringing the republicans into it at all.
Ah, I see what you mean. Fair enough. And I guess it's patently obvious that abstinence-only education was championed by certain elements of the GOP.
I wuz wrong.
I wuz wrong.
Abstinence-only isn't a very bright educational model. 
It is valid to teach abstinence as the only method approved by most Christian denominations (actually most of the religions hew to this if I recall correctly) and as a method which virtually guarantees you cannot become pregnant, impregnate someone, or contract a STD.
However, denying other information is simply poor education.
I loathe Marxism and believe it to be moribund intellectually, but wouldn't advocate removing it from the curriculum.
Kadagar:
Your tone with issues in this vein always makes me think that your version of Sex Education would involve instruction and demonstration in proper foreplay techniques etc.
I'm probably reading too much into this.
It is valid to teach abstinence as the only method approved by most Christian denominations (actually most of the religions hew to this if I recall correctly) and as a method which virtually guarantees you cannot become pregnant, impregnate someone, or contract a STD.
However, denying other information is simply poor education.
I loathe Marxism and believe it to be moribund intellectually, but wouldn't advocate removing it from the curriculum.
Kadagar:
Your tone with issues in this vein always makes me think that your version of Sex Education would involve instruction and demonstration in proper foreplay techniques etc.
I'm probably reading too much into this.
The US has a really messed up view of s3x. The biggest producer and consumer of pr0n in the world and yet you tell your children that s3x is bad and dangerous and dirty.
I don't think s3x is bad and dangerous and dirty, so why on earth would I tell my children that?
I don't think s3x is bad and dangerous and dirty, so why on earth would I tell my children that?
Originally Posted by Seamus Fermanagh:
Kadagar:
Your tone with issues in this vein always makes me think that your version of Sex Education would involve instruction and demonstration in proper foreplay techniques etc.
I'm probably reading too much into this.
Why not? For the right age group, in the right setting. Why not?Kadagar:
Your tone with issues in this vein always makes me think that your version of Sex Education would involve instruction and demonstration in proper foreplay techniques etc.
I'm probably reading too much into this.
Originally Posted by KukriKhan:
And while we're at it, drop the age of majority to 13, eliminate child-labor laws and mandatory education beyond age 12. Free the children.
I'd be OK with the last 2 of those. And while we're at it, drop the age of majority to 13, eliminate child-labor laws and mandatory education beyond age 12. Free the children.
Certainly in the UK education isn't valued. If a 8 hour shift was the alternative, chances are the students would apply themselves more to it.
Originally Posted by Idaho:
The US has a really messed up view of s3x. The biggest producer and consumer of pr0n in the world and yet you tell your children that s3x is bad and dangerous and dirty.
I don't think s3x is bad and dangerous and dirty, so why on earth would I tell my children that?
Anything associated with disease is historically considered dirty, we evolved an innate psychological mechanism for such purpose. Soil, feces, urine, spit, vomit. Teaching kids about std's feeds into that. The US has a really messed up view of s3x. The biggest producer and consumer of pr0n in the world and yet you tell your children that s3x is bad and dangerous and dirty.
I don't think s3x is bad and dangerous and dirty, so why on earth would I tell my children that?
I'm sure in England there is nothing taboo about it. You all probably chit chat about the details with your grandmother, hmm?
Can't think of a single taboo here. My grandmother admitted to me that she sometimes watches soft-porn on tv with her new boyfriend by the way. And no she's everything you would expect from a granny a real granny granny.
Well it's not like the alternative works either, look no further than the UK and it's hordes of chavs for proof.
Maybe education can't really make much of a difference when it comes to this.
Maybe education can't really make much of a difference when it comes to this.
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