Conseil du Royaume

[Ramses II CP]

I apologize for my silence Mon Roi, I have been indisposed.

Louis looks like he's been drunk for... weeks perhaps. He continues in a strong voice,

All the same it is my duty to point out that I am not alone in violating the terms of this Edict. My King you have also ransomed Englishmen, and had ransom refused, resulting in those men's execution. The fact that I enacted a particularly unpleasant revenge on those English pigs who slew Wood makes them no more or less dead than the men William would not pay you for after your battles.

I ask that you reconsider your words on this matter. I am not a butcher, but I am not the master of my passions as you are Father. When I lose men, when I lose anything, my blood boils and my heart pounds until I pour that fury out on my enemies. I am still your son, still your servant, and I have done the best that I am able to follow your example. Cooler heads have prevailed among my vassals, and for this I credit them, but such is not my lot.

To you, Gaetan de Rethel, I say simply that I accuse you of no complicity in Yvon Lacaze's death except incaution and inexperience. Pamplona was taken, and as I said, I salute your victory, but I also ask that you take some time in that place to think on the consequences of your victory.

Louis appears to want to say more, but he also appears to be about to vomit, so he collapses into a chair and wrestles with his stomach for awhile.

[KnightnDay]

A messenger arrives from the east with word from Thomas.

The enemy has been engaged and defeated before Magdeburg. Their troops, having been ransomed for over 1800 florins have fled into the city.

I wish it could be said that my own losses were minimal, but the truth is that they were not. Further, I had intended after the battle to send a spear company from my position to the honorable Prince Henri, but my forces are quite unable to move

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

(OOC, they can't move).

This was a miscalculation quite unintended. The garrison of Frankfurt consisting of a spear and archer company are some miles west from my position and I am sending word to the prince that both companies are at his disposal if he wishes. My own reduced army has besieged Magdeburg so that no additional troops can be raised against us from this castle. We shall maintain our grip on this place for as long as God allows.

Thomas

[Cecil XIX]

It is most regretable that Aquitaine and Bretagne have each lost a fine noblemen. Bourgogne offers her condolences.

Duc Raymond bows his head.

[Braden]

Thomas,

I only require spears to assault the walls of Hamburg Castle my lord. You have need of archers, take them, I will be here besieging the castle for a good two seasons still unless the German cowards decide to try and take the battle to me outside!

Send me what you can spare, I do not believe it will take much to tip the balance in my favour enough to allow an assault.

[_Tristan_]

A herald steps in front of the King's dais. He raises a parchment at the level of his head and slowly unrolls it. Waiting until the Conseil room is ushed, he then speaks in clear and loud voice.

"By the will of Philippe, King of the Franks,

En reconnaissance of his vassals' efforts in bringing down the enemies of France, His Majesty King Philippe hereby endows :

To the House of Bretagne, the castle of Angers, a poor compensation for the loss of Robert Bouchart;

To the House of Aquitaine, the castle of Bordeaux, again a poor compensation for the loss of a valiant vassal;

To the House of Bourgogne, the castle of Bern, for the support of the House in the wars;

To the House of Lorraine, the castle of Staufen, as reward to Senechal Hugues de Champagne, for the tremendous work done during his term;

After consultation with the Royal lawyers, His Majesty announces that the castles of Pamplona and Valencia and the city of London do not meet the legal requirements to be considered ratified and will need to be in the coming Session of the Conseil.

His Majesty further announces that the castle of Nottingham and the cities of York and Nuremburg are to remain in the King's Demesne. His Majesty wishes to thank the Senechal for his efforts in taking the latter but feels it may be essential in negotiating a truce with our Imperial neighbours.

L'an de Grâce 1110,

Sealed with the King's Seal

Par la Grâce de Dieu,

Philippe
Roi des Francs

[Ramses II CP]

I thank you Mon Roi for granting Bordeaux to my House. We will have the vineyards in shape again in no time.

In my state I somehow overlooked the loss of Sir Robert Bouchart. I grieve at his death, and will drink to his memory after I pray for his speedy passage into heaven. Good men are few and far between these days it would seem, and we have lost more than one of late.

I have spent many hours in thought of late, and I have some proposals for our next session that I believe may bridge gaps within the Frankish people and perhaps even find peace for us, peace I think our weary nation must need. I have also, unfortunately, been hearing hideous rumors spread about my own good person through the city streets. I ask that they be disregarded, such are not a fit topic of discussion for this Council.

Our nation is whole! Our bitter foes are driven back, our oldest grudge repaid, and our noble goal in God's name accomplished. Much has been done, but heavy has become the price of it.

Eat, drink, and be merry men, for soon we council.

[Braden]

*Henri returns from the siege of Hamburg, he is clean and calm in demeanour*

My lords,

I ask the Seneschal clarify some aspects of his latest report. Firstly my assumption is that we have been rejected again by both the English and the Germans. Whilst the Germans are certainly still a very great threat the English have been dealt with..completely.

Whilst I applaud the Seneschal’s efforts to attain a formal peace..can we not just abandon Albion to its native peoples? Let us keep the channel as our buffer and allow time and space become our peace…I believe that we should now walk out of York, Nottingham and London and recall our men of arms completely (OOC: empty the settlements, up the tax and let them go “rebel”). Leave the English and their new King to stabilise his kingdom as he see’s fit.

As to the Germans…again, I applaud the Seneschal’s efforts towards peace but I baulk at the sums being offered here! We complain we lack coin and yet 8,000 florins are offered? I ask that the Seneschal await further consolidation of our position in the East and we may yet be able to offer a better deal in land than being offered now.

Again though, should the Germans wish to remain formally at war then why do we have to remain so? If we offer multiple lands to them…and coin..and trade rights and other incentives and they are still rejected again I say we build our borders, patrol them often and build peace though passive action.

The Germans do not have the stomach to fight me at Hamburg even though they outnumber me still 2:1…I do not believe they will have the will to continue the fight when it becomes clear we have no more aggressive intent.

[deguerra]

I find myself in complete agreement with everything young Prince Henri has said. Well spoken.

[TheFlax]

(By order of Zim)

"The 3rd Conseil du Royaume is now open. It shall close for voting on the 20th of October at 00:00 EST, so make your edicts, amendments, and announce Seneschal candidacies while you can."

[Braden]

Henri stands, nodding in appreciation to Raoul de Châtillon before starting

My Lords,

I will put forth my Edict for the session, seems I am the first thus far.

Edict 3.1: All French forces are to extricate themselves from Albion by the quickest and safest means. Any provinces in Albion currently held by French forces must be evacuated and, where possible, taxes increased to the maximum level.

We are to give Albion back to its inhabitants now that our intentions are non-aggressive towards the English. I feel this shows we are benevolent and true Christians

We have united France and brought the English crown back to the fold of the Papacy, let us bask in our accomplishments and look towards our next challenge…a Crusade against the heathens! We did NOT get the PROMISED crusade in England, now there is no England to crusade against! I ask formally that someone ensure my Edict from the last session stands and is upheld. The Moors have shown themselves to be worthy foes with the ability to sneak an entire ARMY into our heartlands without detection, for Christendom they must be brought to heel and Iberia freed.

Tis a pity I can propose but one Edict in truth so I have chosen the one I feel most important for us to accomplish as soon as possible.

Henri sits again

[Ituralde]

I second Edict 3.1.

[TinCow]

The young Prince speaks wisely. What do we care for holding in England? That poor and cold island is a drain on our resources. Charles the Great never cared for those lands, and who are we to question his judgment?

I second Edict 3.1.

[_Tristan_]

Philippe stands to speak.

Though I can understand the reasoning behind my son Henri proposed Edict, I feel he hasn't fully given this text its full scope. For why should we limit ourselves to give back the territories we conquered in Albion and apply a different standard to those we conquered from the Reich or those that belonged to Castille ? Are those people more French than those of Albion ? I think not... Though if I were to believe the rumours about my son Louis' behaviour in Iberia, I fear we may have more pretendants to the French Crown than I'd care to count...

Henri, would you be willing to give the Reich Hamburg back or let it rebel to show them how non-aggressive and how benevolent we are ? Would you ask Duc Hugues to give back Staufen or Duc Raymond to return Bern to the Reich ?

As such, I will stand against such an Edict. I will not let it be said the the French Crown promotes the rise of robber barons, for that is what your Edict will create Henri... Men that will ransack the countryside and will prey upon their fellow countrymen... Under whose rule do you think the English people will prefer living ? Under our own, knowing they will be treated no different from our own countrymen, under the fearsome yoke of some deranged overlord ?

Or better yet, under the rule of their own King, wherever he's now entrenched... For should we not try and negociate a ceasefire with England, rather than let this state of war simmer, and suddenly find one day an English army disembarking upon our shores, to wreak their vengeance upon our unsuspecting people...

Either that or we keep a stranglehold on England, using its riches to fuel our campaigns, denying it any possibility to raise an army against... Even make them our vassal if our military success allows...

We've driven the English back from our lands but only to find ourselves in the position they were in before the war. Had Guillaume, at that point, accepted to give back to us our settlements of Caen, Angers and Bordeaux, I'm not sure we'd have waged the war we have and that Guillaume would still be among us rather than burning in the fires of Hell, his damnation eternal. So let's not make the same mistake Guillaume made...

I say we must try to negotiate the return of these provinces to its rightful owner but at no other cost... The English King will either have them returned at no cost or he won't have them... And should he not wish to negotiate, then I'll say we'll keep them and we'll meet him on any battlefield, should he wish to take them by force.

(OOC: Just seen TC's post.)

And how are our newly-acquired English territories a drain on our treasury, Sieur de Perronne ? I would have thought they were quite the contrary. London has a port which could generate a sound trade and Nottingham and York, while they're not the cash cows some of our mainland territories are, still do not need heavy garrisoning, nor a lot of building. neither has England needed a lot of recruitment. All conquests have been accomplished by my own army with the Order knights. And a single Mailed Knight company has only just bbegin training this last season. So wher do you see a drain on our resources ?

[Braden]

*Henri stands in response*

My lords,

Firstly I thank you for supporting my Edict as it stands. Next, Father, I have to advise you that I have not put the wording of my Edict to paper lightly.

Indeed, in previous drafts I included both English and Castillian holdings.

*Henri shows a hand to stay any negative comments from members of the House of Aquitaine*

Should I have been permitted by law to present further Edicts, rest assured the questions you raise would have been addressed. I would have the provinces previously held by Castille handed back to Spain BUT…*again a pause*... Aquitaine has shed much blood to obtain them, would you not have them compensated for the deaths suffered…Noble deaths at that?

Nay I say, I would have them only relinquish such provinces if it was agreed they would have provinces we take from the Heathen Moors in our Crusade. A Crusade I called for during the last session and agreed upon.

I cannot propose such Edicts however, such is the law of our lands so they remain…ideas.

*Henri turns as if to sit but turns back towards the King swiftly*

No, Father, I do not either forget Hamburg…where your army still sits in siege..or Magdeburg or Nuremburg. I would be willing to give Hamburg should it fall to YOUR hands. Hamburg is NOT mine to withhold my King, should it fall it is YOURS to use as you feel fit!

In truth, and in front of these Lords, I say…yes, I would wish Hamburg as my own Barony but that is not so yet and I cannot predict the future. However, I ask you and the other lords here that with Bern, Staufen and Hamburg we ensure the continued safety of Frankfurt. Without them, Frankfurt is isolated and nearly surrounded by Imperial lands.

A defensible border is, my lords, the Channel, the narrows of Iberia and a clearly defined border with the Germans.

So, I ask you Father, you point to Guilliaums behaviour as an example but remember he was excommunicated…we are good CATHOLICS we do not…NOT…lead by using the examples set by those who were shown to be evil. Again, I say, we leave Albion to the English, the Channel our border. The English are sore, shamed and beaten…but perhaps their pride does not permit them to accept it so? Is this why there is no peace with them..or indeed the Germans?

Do we fall to such a sin as Pride my Lords? I say, nay, we do not! We rise above those around us who would use pride as an excuse to continue war when it is lost and bring needless suffering to their peoples.

I fear, My King, you underestimate me no?

*Henri smiles and sits again*

((OOC: Lots depends on how you see “rebels”, I take them as the game see’s them, “Independent Nations”, rather than the Rebel forces that randomly spawn on the map…example, Hamburg was actually an Independent City State – Hamburg-Bremen in its HRE time))

[_Tristan_]

Philippe looks sternly at his son Henri.

And pray tell me Henri, why should we even keep Frankfurt ? Why don't we apply the measure of your Edict and give back to the Reich this conquered city as well ? If you wish to make a clearly defined border with the Reich, surrender Frankfurt and you'll have the Rhine as a natural border with Metz our Easternmsot holding ? Or does keeping Frankfurt justify the need to keep Hamburg ?

And when I point to Guillaume's behaviour, it is not in his wrongdoings against the Scots that led to his excommunication, but rather to his refusal to see the benefits of handing back to us what rightly beonged to us from his own free will, forcing us to take it by force. Now, we're in the same position... Only I fear the new English King will be too vengeful or prideful to ask us to return his cities and castles to him.

So as good Christians, it is our duty to make the offer on the only condition that peace exists once again between our Royaumes. But if the English King cannot see reason, I will not stoop to make his people suffer under the rule of robber barons for his short-sightedness. So I say we either offer those provinces in good will against a peace or we keep them as a bulwark against any English invasion. You yourself called the English people "sore, shamed and beaten", there is no worse state in which to leave a nation... If we simply abandon their provinces and take away their gold, we'll be pouring oil on ambers... Sparking a fire that only our own extinctin will extinguish... I will not take responsibility for that... Will you ?

And you spoke of House Aquitaine and the blood spilt in the conquest of our Iberian holdings... I know full well the cost in lives of these conquests...

But what of the blood spilt in our fights in England ? What of the lives lost under my command ? What of your own Brother knight Bouchart, struck down by the English Prince ?
Don't you think these men deserve more than seeing the lands they've fought to conquer, handed down to lowly nobles squabbling among themselves, with no guarantee that their fights and their deaths have granted their Royaume any degree of safety ?

If only for these reasons, I'll stand against you on these matters... Your proposal is not judicious.

As to underestimate you, I don't know why you would think that.

[_Tristan_]

A herald walks forward, unrolls a parchment and begins reading.

"By the will of his Majesty, King Philippe,

The following Edict is presented to your vote.

Edict 3.2 : The city of London and the castles of Valencia and Pamplona are to be ratified.

Submission of requests of ownership are to be presented in this Conseil or to the King's Secretary.

L'an de Grâce 1110,

Sealed with the King's Seal

Par la Grâce de Dieu,

Philippe
Roi des Francs

[TinCow]

My King,

It appears that you agree that we would be hypocrites if we held the English lands after the excommunication has been lifted and our own provinces regained. Your difficulty lies in subjecting those people to the rule of local 'robber barons' in the event that the English are too thick-headed to accept peace in return for their lands.

I do believe this is another option which might satisfy this situation. Let us instead give those English lands to the Scots. They are our friends and the King of Scotland would surely rule those peoples fairly. I am certain we all desire an amicable relationship with those who live on that blasted island. If the English will not see reason, why not aid the Scots and establish their dynasty on the throne of England?

[_Tristan_]

Philippe nods to De Perronne.

I would be amenable to that, with the provision once again that an alliance be the counterpart in said deal. The Scots have demonstrated in the past how obdurate they could be... They have now been repaid by the attacks of the English on their Capital, perhaps it has put some sense in their thick skulls... I hope so, for otherwise we would be trading one evil for another...

And I care little to meet men dressed in skirts on the battlefield...

[Vladimir]

An excellent idea I'm ashamed I didn't think of myself. Let us give the English what they deserve, what will sustain our allies, and our brave men a good drink of wine. It is time to divest ourselves of this English venture. Trust our allies to the north. I just hope Edict 1.8 is in effect and our diplomat is within one season's ride of their capitol.

[Ibn-Khaldun]

Charles enters..

Father and Nobles of the France,

I am Prince Charles. Some might know me alread but those who don't .. it's a great honor being here!

He nods and takes his seat..

[Ituralde]

I strongly support getting rid of the positions in England. Robert Bouchart followed me as Captain of the Order of the Fleur de Lys because he believed in the righteousness of bringing King William to justice in a Holy Crusade! He never wanted conquest or glory, just the satisfaction of having served his Lord in the greatest capacity possible under the guidelines of Edict E1.3. I will not see Robert Boucharts death used to justify a land grab in England!

[_Tristan_]

Hearing Montpierre's words, Philippe's anger rises.

Nor would I see him dead for nothing... Did Bouchart die so that some English noble with a stronger voice or more bravery than his neighbour claims the title of Nottingham or York or London ? Would we not have have replaced then an evil by another ? What does that stand in the eyes of God, whom you're so fond of calling upon ?

I'm always reminded by you and others that the Crusade on England was not called. Need I remind you that such a venture, though it had my favour at the time, did not have the full support of this body and was voted only by the slightest margin.

Need I also remind you that as we delayed until you Order knights prepared yourself and marched across half of Europe to join in the preparations. And that this delay diverted us from our course as the Moors entered our lands, with hardly a peaceful intent. How many here asked that a Crusade be called on the Moors instead ?

I would make a poor ruler were I to completely ignore the will of almost half my Royaume.

I will not let you insult the memory of Robert Bouchart by calling what he helped us accomplish a "land-grab".

Our duty is God's eyes is to provide to those that deserve and punish those who do not. We've accomplished the latter and we would fail in the first, were we to follow the course of action you propose to us.

At least, de Perrone's proposal has the merit of enabling us to gain something from our campaign, when I'm sorry to say that Bouchart's blood, your own brother knight, would have been shed for nothing if Edict 3.1 were meant to pass.

My purpose is not to keep to ourselves those English provinces. They would have their uses but as de Perrone reminded us, they might come at a cost. But I will not see them given away freely to men unfit to rule them, men that could themselves become threat to our Royaume in years to come.

[Ramses II CP]

First I wish to announce my candidacy for the position of Seneschal. I have observed my predecessors most carefully, and so my platform will be one open to input from all houses. Do not be shy in your suggestions.

With that in mind, I have several matters of importance to put forth. If I am elected Seneschal it will not be necessary to make these matters into edicts, I will enact them by virtue of my position.

1. The hiring of new mercenaries shall be capped at two companies per House for the duration of the term; requests to be submitted in writing and in public to the Seneschal in the Council chamber. The King is exempt from the cap, of course.

2. Peace will be accomplished with the English and the Germans. Agents shall be recruited to monitor the remaining English and German territories for warning signs of their intent to return to war. Economic development of the core of France will be the priority of my term following the declaration of peace, to that end I will ask that Barons owning cities request structures with that goal in mind.

3. A crusade against the Moors will be declared on terms similar to those proposed for the English crusade, but only after peace has been assured on at least one other front. Distribution of lands taken in the crusade will be done in a fair manner within the purview of the King's desires, of course.

4. A pair of diplomats shall be assigned solely to the task of maintaining France's good reputation with the Papacy.

Are there any other subjects on which the Council would like to hear my thoughts?

I will second edict 3.2.

[TinCow]

As it appears my suggestion has some support, I will propose it as law in the form I believe best.

Edict 3.3: All settlements in the British Isles will be given to Scotland. The Seneschal must attempt to obtain an alliance with Scotland in return for these settlements. However, if the Seneshal determines that the Scots will not agree to an alliance, no matter how favorable the deal, the Seneshal shall give the provinces to Scotland for whatever deal benefits France the most.

[AussieGiant]

I second Edict 3.3.

[Ituralde]

I second Edict 3.3. I'm done with the Isles, one way or another.

[Vladimir]

As it appears my suggestion has some support, I will propose it as law in the form I believe best.

Edict 3.3: All settlements in the British Isles will be given to Scotland. The Seneschal must attempt to obtain an alliance with Scotland in return for these settlements. However, if the Seneshal determines that the Scots will not agree to an alliance, no matter how favorable the deal, the Seneshal shall give the provinces to Scotland for whatever deal benefits France the most.

Perhaps we should reword the edict as such:

All settlements in the British Isles currently controlled by France will be given to Scotland. The Seneschal must attempt to obtain an alliance with Scotland in return for these settlements. However, if the Seneshal determines that the Scots will not agree to an alliance, no matter how favorable the deal, the Seneshal shall give the provinces to Scotland for whatever deal benefits France the most.

Were the original wording to stand, we would need to conquer all English settlements and destroy the faction entirely. Then we would turn all of these settlements over to someone who may not even wish to ally with us.

I agree, in spirit, of course, and will contribute whatever influence I can muster toward its end.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

A lawyer? C'mon man.

[deguerra]

I am happy with either solution. Scots, England or otherwise. What I wish to avoid is permanent French holdings in Britain. Let us not meet the injustice of Guillaume with an injustice of our own.

[econ21]

My Lords, I thank the Duke of Lorraine for his service to the nation as Seneschal. And I wonder, do we have any among us who would stand for Seneschal? If so, I urge them to declare themselves and their manifestoes, so that they may be open to questions, debate with their rivals and set the agenda for this Conseil.

[KnightnDay]

Despite the obvious toll the Seneschal's position has taken on my good Duke of Lorraine, I shall offer to take up the mantle. Hence I declare my candidacy for the office.

If our good Prince Louis will allow, I shall state my platform based on the three positions he has taken.

First, I shall do more than limit the hiring of mercenaries, I will do what is in my power to eliminate them from the ranks so that we may depend on the good deeds of our own brave men. We have now several fine castles and I have no doubt that what men can be raised from them will make for adequate replacements for these expensive soldiers of dubious loyalties.

Second, I shall be aggressive in the pursuit of peace, but will be equally prepared to prosecute these wars to the fullest if our enemies refuse to see reason. Like all of you, I too mourn the loss of two noble men of the conseil. But my own recent victory near Magdeburg was won at a cost of men nearly a hundred-fold. Who grieves for them? You may not know their names as you do Lacaze and Bouchart, but their families do. Their friends do. Will you have me tell them their sons died to extract peace at any cost? I should hope not, and I would in turn not ask that of any man here.
And so, I say again, I shall offer to promote peace, but an honorable peace. A peace we will have if our foes will bargain in good faith.

Finally on the subject of a crusade against the Moors, if it is the will of the conseil this be done, then I shall furnish an army with the means to liberate the Iberian peninsula. But, any conquered lands of Iberia I shall urge be turned over to our Spanish allies. Since our honorable prince took his bride, we have forged a relationship by blood. We have the opportunity to do more and to demonstrate our good intentions through charity and demonstrate our bond with our Christian neighbor to the west.

With that, I stand ready to answer any questions that should be asked of me.