Understanding Hannibal and Cannae -TV Heads Up!

[ToranagaSama]

Just a headsup for those interested.

Today, tommorrow and in April the Discovery Times Channel is airing an episode entitled "Hannibal".

It gives an EXCELLENT accounting of the events surrounding Hannibal's Spanish and Italian campaigns. What is particularly outstanding is the graphical dipiction of the battle of Cannae. This documentary gives a greater textbook dipiction of the troops and tactics employed at Cannae. It does so in a manner superior to either the British, "Time Commanders" or American, "Decisive Battles" (which I presume to be virtually the same), which focused more on the *dramatic*.

The Discovery Times version VERY accurately displays the *Convex-Straight-Concave" battle manuverings, along with Hannibals decisive use of his cavalry.

If you've ever wanted to know *how* to use your calvalry in any of the Total War games---watch this episode! Equally, the episode provides the best graphical viewing of how to best tactically employ your foot units in the Total War series.

Just as Hannibal succeeded at Cannae, the episode graphically dipicts the tactical theory for defeating a larger (and somewhat superior) force within the Total War Series.

[Just as an aside, I first viewed this episode a few months ago. Upon viewing and comprehending Hannibals tactics at Cannae, I was rather shocked to see that, being ignorant of the Cannae tactics, through too many hours and much trial and error, thru Shogun and the MedMod, that I had developed tactics mirroring Hannibal at Cannae PRECISELY. That is the, Convex-Straight-Concave manuever, as well as *unit* layout.

My argument regarding CA's choice for 1.1's speed and unit settings were in the view that Hannibal's, as well as my own's battle tactics and manueverings were IMPOSSIBLE to effect as the *middle* would not hold long enough to effect the manuevers. Version 1.2 is a good deal better, but still not truly adequate, imuho. MTW/VI and the Medmod were the best version to effect such.]

This post is not intended to rehash ANY old arguments, simply to point to what I believe to be an excellent documentary.

If you're in the NYC area the episode airs today at 1:00 and 4:00 PM. Here's a listing of other dates and times.

Enjoy!

[n00bicus]

There is no option for a tactical retreat in RTW, which Hannibal used in the centre. This means you would be wiser to station extra troops immediately behind the point you expect to be pushed back in.

All in all, you're better deploying like this:


As your cavalry hit the backs of the enemy on your flanks, they push into the centre, where they (and the now freed-up infantry from the flanks) hit the enemies centre in the flank and rear.

[EvilNed]

Of course, in the total war games, rarely does the enemy just "march on" with their entire army, like the romans did. At least in MTW there's always a couple of units trying to sneak past your flanks. These units can be stopped, of course, but might slow down your little maneuver.

Anyways, in MTW, I usually used a tactic just like that (without knowing how Hannibal did at first), but remember, there was so much more to hannibals tactic than just "run around to the rear and attack them with cavalry". He let his center infantry feign retreat, drawing the romans forward, whereas the reserves went up on the sides and the cavalry on the back. Thus: Romans in a box. A box made out of mercenaries, cutting away at anything latin-looking.

Is there anyway to download all these episodes of Time Commanders or even this program legally? Because I don't have Discovery Channel. Actually, i doubt I can even get it here.

[Puzz3D]

It's unlikely Hannibal used tactical retreat at Cannae, and it apparently wasn't even a tactic in ancient times once the lines engaged. He used a weak center which was probably routing when the flanking units closed in. He must have correctly judged how long his center could hold. So, I wouldn't say it should be a tactical opion in RTW, but, since everything is so speeded up in RTW, you can't re-enact such a battle with RTW despite the History Channel's Decisive Battles program giving the impression that you can. I think with the SPQR mod there is a much better chance of re-enacting ancient battles such as Cannae. You'll even get significant pushback by stronger forces on weaker forces since the fighting time is long enough for this to occur.


EvilNed,

Forget about the Discovery Channel programs. They are poorly done, and give a false impression of how RTW actually plays. I've never seen Time Commanders, but my European friends who did see the programs say that RTW doesn't play the way it did in those programs. Something changed before RTW was released or Time Commanders was given a special version of the game which had different gameplay.

[steve]

Sweet! i can make the 4pm airing thanks for the heads up!

[Atreides]

@ Puzz3D

I think you're wrong. Hannibal was brilliant. While outnumber with less quality forces he was able to win over and and over again.

But I think you should see the broadcast like the author (or me). Not say: 'I heard from my friend that, bla bla bal).

[EvilNed]

I actually think Hannibal ordered his iberian mercenaries (who formed up the front), to feign retreat, for one single reason: He didn't want to loose to many of then. Remember, his tactics were not only to kill the romans, but to loose as few of his own men as possible, since he didn't know if he would ever be getting any reinforcements.

[Puzz3D]

@ Puzz3D

I think you're wrong. Hannibal was brilliant. While outnumber with less quality forces he was able to win over and and over again.

But I think you should see the broadcast like the author (or me). Not say: 'I heard from my friend that, bla bla bal).

I didn't say he wasn't brilliant. I said his center was pushed back and probably routing. There is no way you can use this tactic in RTW.

I can't watch the Time Commanders show since it's only shown in Europe. Several of my European friends told me that the gameplay in the original Time Commanders programs was not like the gameplay in the RTW. I did watch several of the History Channel's Decisive Battles programs which used RTW, and they all gave a false impression of what you could do with the game.