Representative Democracy [Concluded]

[Askthepizzaguy]

Of course, don't fail to mention Pizza's neato writeups and how much flesh they built around the persona of Supreme Chancellor Cass.

I loved the idea of drafting an unwilling person into a position of power, and Cass's own unique personality fit the mold of a mortified innocent bystander.

But of course that innocence wouldn't be reasonable if it were to go on for years, so eventually even she gets corrupted by power, and (as anyone would) used the moon for target practice. I'm pretty sure we all saw that coming, and I apologize for being so predictable.

[Askthepizzaguy]

why is it not being revealed?
and do we get the mafia qt?

There was some unpleasantness in the game and I'm asking the players not to reveal those quicktopics just to keep the peace.

Otherwise it is the usual custom.

[Askthepizzaguy]

it was no problem tho FTR if you EVER tell me its gonna be a low volume game again im gonna laff in your face. :D

This was a huge problem.

If you look at the post counts of other games here it should have been manageable, but folks like Renata, Zack, Visor, Monty, and then a deluge of new players who weren't reluctant to press the "post reply" button, made for an outcome I couldn't have predicted.

It usually is not this talkative around here, by a longshot.

I enjoyed it, but many people couldn't keep up at all, including poor Csargo.

[Choxorn]

The voting thing wound up being rather pro-town, I think? Though it might not always be. But like only three people had signed on to choxorn needing to die on day one (me, atheotes, Dp), one of those grudgingly (and Visor did also like the idea but voted for someone else), and he still died. I don't know if I could have gotten him lynched in the normal way. It's not something I'm particularly good at. Again, the good day one and the clear townies resulting from that played a big role in the whole representative thing not turning into a massive distrustful mess.

Yeah, and only two actually voted for me. I was definitely annoyed about that, especially because it felt like I was getting lynched for silly day 1 reasons.

I honestly had totally forgotten the game started! The post only seemed so disjointed because I wrote the first part of it as soon as I opened the thread again, then wrote the second part of it after I'd read through the thread, and that took me about two hours. Town chox would have done more or less the same thing!

That being said, bleh, me disappearing and forgetting for most of day 1 is some pretty shit d1 play, and that's even by my standards of always sucking at day 1, so I don't really have much of an excuse for playing so badly.

Pizza mentioned somewhere else a few weeks ago that spreading votes on day 1 is an effective way of catching the mafia, and I think this game showed that he was right- the votes were all over the place, and more importantly, only 3 of them actually counted, and on day 1 in particular it wasn't easy to see which 3 were going to count. Things could swing around pretty rapidly with just a few people changing their minds, and that meant we were always under pressure. Barto and I didn't react to always being under pressure as well.

A suggestion if someone wants to host a game like this in the future? Start out with 7 districts of 3 people instead of 3 districts of 7 people. The vote's a bit less swingy that way, and it would greatly increase the chance that one of the scums would manage to get voted a district rep if they only have to win over one townie's vote instead of two or three. Sure, there was always the chance of us getting voted a district rep in this game, but it never happened, and having no voting power hurt us- if the town's best weapon is the vote, the mafia's best defense against that weapon is screwing with it as much as they can. Our votes not counting for anything made it a lot harder to defend ourselves.

I think we should try the all jesters game

that was like the third game I hosted

I'm reminded of that game civplayah hosted a long time ago where everyone was a lone wolf without a kill and the point was to see how long it would take for people to figure that out.

Quote Originally Posted by choxorn
"Foolish townies. You think there was some meaning or spews behind my posts, when in reality I was totally winging it and had no idea what I was doing."

It's funny because it's true. My vote for Al was just "Shit, haven't voted yet, it's 5 minutes until EOD and I have no time to think or say anything about the votes on me... let's see if I can find something kinda scummy on the last few pages and vote someone for it!" And then I saw Al's post, thought it was kinda scummy, and voted him for it.

Quote Originally Posted by choxorn
"Just roleclaim a 400-foot-tall purple platypus bear with pink horns and silver wings, see how they react to that.

Or maybe Melon Lord. Or Wang Fire."

My references are the best references.

Mafia is an unsymmetrical game, where if town guesses correctly, there's nothing the mafia can do to stop the win.

It's like the mafia are in a mate-in-three situation or fewer at all times from the game start. it's up to town to see the mate, if they can't, they will eventually lose the game.

Mafia should never feel bad about a loss to town. It literally is the town's game to win. You play the role of the villains, you steal victory from the town's grasp only.

True, but it's a mate-in-three situation where black's pieces are pretending to be white's pieces. Or white's pieces are pretending to be black's pieces, I'm not sure which side is town and which side is mafia. Also all the pieces are disguised as pawns, and some of them can move like a combination of a queen and a knight and... I think my metaphor got lost here.

[Choxorn]

Needed more VCs by the mod. That is something that frustrates me in general. I want vcs from the mod for 2 reasons 1 so I know where things stand (especially when I wake up to 20 pages more) and 2 so I KNOW its correct. its awesome that players are willing to make the effort but I want the mods cause as part of their job they will make SURE theres no mistakes AND you cant mistake it when someone is actually doing VC analysis not giving a current vc.

Dicetosser, there's only so much the game host can do, they're not online all the time, they have to sleep and go to work or school too, they also sometimes wake up and find 20 new pages in the thread. We don't have the tools here we have at a site like MU to make tally keeping easy.

I recognize it can be frustrating going a long time without an official vote count, but believe me, the game hosts are usually doing all they can.

This was a huge problem.

If you look at the post counts of other games here it should have been manageable, but folks like Renata, Zack, Visor, Monty, and then a deluge of new players who weren't reluctant to press the "post reply" button, made for an outcome I couldn't have predicted.

It usually is not this talkative around here, by a longshot.

I enjoyed it, but many people couldn't keep up at all, including poor Csargo.

It seems like you're incapable of hosting a game that doesn't have insane activity. Is it that your games are so interesting, or that you just keep bringing in lots of new players from across the internet that like to post more than we do here at the .org?

[Askthepizzaguy]

True, but it's a mate-in-three situation where black's pieces are pretending to be white's pieces. Or white's pieces are pretending to be black's pieces, I'm not sure which side is town and which side is mafia. Also all the pieces are disguised as pawns, and some of them can move like a combination of a queen and a knight and... I think my metaphor got lost here.

Just put a blindfold on white and remove the chess board entirely and instead make the pieces a bunch of mafia players.

The analogy is perfect. Anyone who says otherwise will bear the full brunt of my daisy.

[Askthepizzaguy]

It seems like you're incapable of hosting a game that doesn't have insane activity. Is it that your games are so interesting, or that you just keep bringing in lots of new players from across the internet that like to post more than we do here at the .org?

I put drugs in my role PMs. You've all been high this entire time.

[Montmorency]

True, but it's a mate-in-three situation where black's pieces are pretending to be white's pieces. Or white's pieces are pretending to be black's pieces, I'm not sure which side is town and which side is mafia. Also all the pieces are disguised as pawns, and some of them can move like a combination of a queen and a knight and... I think my metaphor got lost here.

Important rule: never claim to be the king - especially if you are the king.

Just put a blindfold on white and remove the chess board entirely and instead make the pieces a bunch of mafia players.

The analogy is perfect. Anyone who says otherwise will bear the full brunt of my daisy.

So who is blindfolded white? The game host?


One thing about this game, it was so huge that I actually started to take notes from the end of D1, and got into the habit of using the forum's reply-quote function rather than simple copy-paste. Otherwise it would have been impossible to keep track.

But my notes weren't more than crude extracts and milestones. For posterity:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

By late D1:

Others: Cuth on Schema; GH townread dicetosser;
Town: DP101, Cass, Renata, Jabbz (defended)
Lean Town: atheotes, Zack, Monstrbro,
Null: Cuth, Dice, Winston, El Barto, Sooh, GH, Choxorn (defended)
Lean Scum: Schema
Scum: Visor
Others: Zack and Renata against Jabbz, Choxorn; Cass against me; Visor against me and Cuth; Sooh

against atheotes; Cass on Atheotes-Jaabz if Renata is town; dicetosser against me;
Special: Csargo (lolscum)
Little: BSmith, riedquat, Csargo, Al Sipsclar,
Lynched: Choxorn (SCUM)




Start D2:

Others: Renata says Jabbz townier for being lectured by Chox; Visor says Winston likely town; Renata

likes Winston; Schema says Al Sips spewed town by late Chox vote; Monstr calls me always villa;

Monstr says Visor/Winston never w/w; Monstr kinda think El Barto villager; Monstr likes dicetosser;

DP likes dicetosser; Monstr leans Barto; Winston likes Monstr; Renata likes Dicetosser; Winston

likes Dicetosser; Dice leans Monstr; winston agrees case against Cuth is good; Al Sip likes

dicetosser;
Town: DP101, Cass, Renata
Lean Town: Jabbz, atheotes, Monstrbro
Null: Dice, Winston, El Barto, Sooh, Csargo
Lean Scum: Schema, GH, Cuth,
Scum: Visor
Others: Visor says Schema/Cuth/GH looks bad; Renata shade Monstr for Chox slight town; Renata down on

Zack; Jabbz distrustful Visor; Monstr kinda suspect Cuth; Monstr suspects Winston; Monstr thinks

there is low-posting deepwolf; Monstr leans on GH; DP leans on Zack; dice suspects me; Al Sips leans

GH;
Little: BSmith, riedquat, Csargo, Al Sipsclar,
Killed: Sooh (TOWN WATCHER)




Early D2:

Others: Al Sipsclar says Schema looks okay on re-read; Cuth likes Monstr, Schema, Dice, Winston, and

me; Visor says Cuth wolf should clear Schema; Monstr leans Al Sips; Cuth leans Al Sips; Visor yolo

that Chox spewed Al Sips clear; Visor same for Chox on Jabbz; DP likes Jabbz and Winston; Visor likes

Winston, Monstr, Zack; Monstr kind think Cuth town; Cass leans Schema and Cuth;
Town: DP101, Cass, Renata, atheotes
Lean Town: Jabbz, Monstrbro, Zack
Null: Dice, Winston, El Barto, Csargo, Visor
Lean Scum: Schema, GH, Cuth
Scum: if Visor scum, one of Jabbz/Al Sips likely partner (see Visor's dual spew assessment);
Others: Visor says Schema looks bad; Cuth doesn't like Zack, GH, and bart; Visor leans GH; Visor

simple solution - GH/Cuth/Bart/Inactive; Monstr down on Zack; Zack doesn't like BSmith for liking my

case(s); Visor accuses Cass, not sure if srs; Visor says Bart and GH kinda wolfy; Visor suspects

BSmith; Renata thinks Cuth on Sooh atrocious; GH on Cuth/Schema opposite, doesn't like Jabbz and

Riedquat; Cuth thinks best to look in low-post ranks; Cuth says GH progression allows GH-Jabbz; Cass

leans Zack and Winston; Visor (p57) said Cuth and two of Bart/GH/BSmith
Little: BSmith, riedquat, Csargo, Al Sipsclar,






Late D2:

Others: If Cuth is wolf it clears Bart (who?? - Monstr said Cass always village if Visor & Bart v/v; also Monstr said scum-town for Cuth-Bart, or vice versa); Visor thinks Cuth scum makes Zack likely town; Winston uptrend El Barto; Winston uptrend Monstr; DP locks Winston town forever; Riedquat likes Zack;

Cuth likes Zack; Cass sees no m/m between Monty-GH or Monty-Renata; Winston maybe Schema-Cuth

unlikely; Winston thinks Schema looks townie; something about Cass and Winston seeing Riedquat as

more genuine than BSmith; Monstr leans Riedquat; Schema likes dice, monstr, probably zack, lean

Winston; Monstr thinks Cuth village, has good vibe on Zack; Zack meh on GH; Monstr ok with Al Sips,

Riedquat (Zack agrees); Visor likes Zack; DP says Jabbz town; Zack leanspost says Monstr, Visor,

Winston, dice, Al Sips, & Schema (in order) above the midline; Cass finds Visor village as hell; Jabbz

likes Zack better; Schema not quick to lynch Zack; GH says Zack most likely town;
Town: DP101, Cass, Renata, atheotes
Lean Town: =Monstrbro, Riedquat
Null: Dice, Winston (downtrend), El Barto, Visor, Zack, Jabbz
Lean Scum: Schema, GH, Cuth (maybe Winston)
Scum: Winston-dice-Jabbz possible?
Others: Visor says Schema looks bad; Winston suspects Zack; DP suspects Zack; Zack thinks Cuth scum;

Visor suggests GH-Cuth-Schema, GH-Bart-Schema, Cuth/BSmith or inactive/GH; Cass still doesn't like

Barto; Zack teams Cuth, Bart, and Jabbz, plus Bsmith to lesser extent; Monstr would lynch inactives

over many current wagons (e.g. Gh, Cuth), with Zack agreeing; Monstr would look at Jabbz; Monstr

doesn't like Bsmith (Zack agrees; Zack says Csargo before Reidquat and Al Sips (Schema agrees);

atheotes potential teams El Barto, GH, Cuth, maybe Csargo, Monty; Visor finds Schema's defence of

Zack sketchy, vague, generic; Renata like to see any of GH, Cuth and one of inactives up for lynch
Little: BSmith, Csargo, Al Sipsclar,
Lynch: GH TOWN; People OK with Barto lynch: Cass, Zack, GH, Visor, Schema, Monstr atheotes






Start D3:

Others: Schema lean Zack; Monstr maintains town core public and personal; Fenn likes Zack & Renata; Jabbz put Zack town for Dp101 NK WIFOM; Schema has Cuth looking less bad, but still shouldn't be rep; Cuth thinks Monstr is town; doesn't have >thin reads on Atheotes, BSmith, Dice

Town: DP101, Cass, Renata, atheotes
Lean Town: Monstrbro, Riedquat
Null: Dice, Winston, El Barto, Visor, Zack, Jabbz, BSmith, Al Sipsclar,
Lean Scum: Schema, (maybe Winston)
Scum: Cuth

Others: Zack suspect Cass-Chox-Cuth-Bart conspiracy; Fenn says Cuthillius seems more scummy than El

Barto; Fenn found GH null, Cuth scummier than Bart and worth a lynch; Cass says Schema and Cuth go

down from last reads list;

Special: Fenn/Csargo lolscum
Little: BSmith, Al Sipsclar
Night Kill: Dp101 TOWN






Early D3:

Others: Jabbz finds Zack townie, unsure about Winston; Fenn likes Schema for explaining D1 reads; Riedquat likes Zack and Bart; Fenn ok with Riedquat for Rep; Renata sees Riedquat as like previous townquat; Cuth mild townread on Bsmith; Cuth on Fenn says his towniest moment is finding Ried's post towny; Cuth gives dicetosser town lean; Cuth says Bart is slightly towny; cuth has (dead) GH as top scum (Visor wanted him to expand before I pointed out problem and ruined the opportunity); Cuth townread atheotes on tone with slight reservations; Cuth has Schema mild towny for D1, though later Schema hedged a lot; Cuth has Winston sure-town, despite his pushing Zack a bit too much; Cuth puts Cass town in one sentence/post, then same for Renata; Cuth has Monstr towniest, pure town; Cuth fairly confident Visor town, bit less so for Zack; Monstr now townreads Winston; Fenn has Renata, Cass, atheotes as def town, lean town on Monstr, Visor, Zack; Monstr has Visor as town for D1, and can't be m/m with me; Monstr says Zack almost as town as Visor. never scum with Cuth or Jabbz; Zack has me tiny town lean; Dice now leans Cuth town because of his unapologetic post with reads; Cuth actually had me as town;

Town: Cass, Renata, atheotes
Lean Town: Monstr, Riedquat
Null: Zack, Barto, Visor, Jabbz, BSmith, Al Sipsclar,
Lean Scum: dice, Schema, (maybe Winston)
Next Tier: schema winston fenn bart
Next Tier: bsmith zack dice jabbz
Scum: Cuth (full reads post 2479; read Jabbz last, null on him)

Others: Cass shades Schema; dice still doesn't like me; Renata wants Cuth lynched, then Bart, suspicious of Zack; Renata bothered by Schema's SoD statement on districts; Visor sus Schema for ignoring mid-day and little substance; Fenn wants Cuth, then Bart, lynched; Ried wants Cuth lynched, then BSmith; atheotes can't look past Cuth and Barto; Cuth scumread Fenn on not caring about reasoning for primary lynch target, and not trying to find town; Cuth tiny scum lean on Al Sips; Cuth small scum lean on Riedquat, esp. for post on GH; Cuth has me top scum; Monstr now (almost?) wants to lynch Bart (pp. 83-4); Monstr has Jabbz and Zack never m/m, but one might be scum; Monstr still think Cuth town; Monstr says Bart-Winston unlikely scum team for antipathy; Fenn has Bart, dicetosser, and Cuth as scum (though Cuth's lean posts were towny); Monstr says Fenn/barto/monty/Schema Yolo (Least confident in schema); Zack has Barto scum; dicetosser wants Barto lynch;

Special: Fenn/Csargo lolscum
BARTO ISO: On D1, leaned Monstr as scum, same for Early D2 (and vote);






Late D3:


Others: Winston has Renata pure town; Bart has Cass, Monstr, Renata, Al Sipsclar as town; dice has town Cass, Monstr, Renata, & probably Cuth; Al Sipsclar has town Renata, Cass, atheotes, Winston, Visor; Visor suspects dice; Cass puts dice as unlikely scum with Cuth; atheotes has Al Sipsclar trend up a little; Zack and Renata null on Al Sips; Jabbz has Al Sips best among low-posters; Fenn still think Schema towny; Jabbz puts Cuth probably town, even tho he townreads Schema; Jabbz has town Cass, Renata, atheotes, Cuth, Zack;

Town: Renata, Cass, atheotes.
Lean Town: Monstr, Riedquat
Null: Zack, Barto, Visor, Jabbz, BSmith, Al Sipsclar, dice
Lean Scum: (Bart-Monstr coming in), Winston, Fenn, Schema (but less if Cuth town I said)
Scum: Cuth

Others: Winston has Visor worse (for neatness since D1), me scummier; Bart has me, Ried, and Fenn as scum, maybe Visor (though not with me); dice leans monty, barto, & visor (for dropoff); Al Sips has scum Bart, Mont, Zack, BSmith, Cuth; Cass tinfoil Visor, will downtrend if Cuth and Zack are town; Atheotes has me and Fenn on POE; Renata moves Jabbz down a little for early D3 views on DP NK wrt Zack and mislynch; Winston still has Zack top scum read; Al Sips moved Schema down (according to Cass); Renata could see scum Zack, but not right now; Zack says Al Sips moved him to scum from town and Monstr from town to "no idea"; Jabbz has Schema more scummy than not, and Fenn for seeming to suppprt Schema and try to suggest D1 would-have-done wrt Sooh; Jabbz has Bart and Schema as scum, maybe Bsmith & Fenn;

Lynch: BARTO SCUM GOON






Start D4:


Others: Winston points out Jaabz clear for reads and vote on Barto at EOD; Fenn says events clear/look good for atheotes, Monstr, dice; Visor still says Winston probs town because of tone and process; Winston says Visor been townie enough, but could fake it; Zack says dice, atheotes, and Jabbz voted scum when it counted, BSmith & Cass are mechanically clear, and Monstr (though earlier was nervous or ambivalent - but Cuth defense!) & Visor are tonally clear (the rest are uncategorized or null); Winston has Jabbz even townier than Zack leans;

Town: Monstr, Atheotes, Cass
Lean Town: Jabbz, Riedquat, dice
Null: Zack (note that EOD2 he said meh on GH, should be better lynch), Visor, Al Sipsclar, BSmith,
Lean Scum: Schema, Fenn, Winston, (Visor?)
Scum:

Others: Winston still has Zack scum, but less so with Barto flip; Winston says my pushes don't ring true, seem counter-town; Winston says Fenn now stands out as scum based on D3 tone and positioning; WInston found Schema good on tone, but falling to scum on situational stuff; Zack sees Monty as maybe lolclear, or at least barely outside of POE for now; Monstr responding to Zack reads says VIsor and Monstr shouldn't be in same category because Monstr scum seems much more difficult than VIsor scum; Dice wants to lynch Zack, and if he is scum lynch Cass;

Special: BSMITH CLAIM VIG
Night Kill: RENATA & CUTH TOWN






Early D4: Cass has Zack ok today but disagrees that Barto flip makes Zack townier; Cass says Winston good tone though mechanically suspect for staying on Cuth and moving off Barto; Cass has EoD3 efforts of Jabbz and Atheotes looking good; Cass doesn't see scumdice despite dogmatic paranoia on bussing and clearing, finds Visor's responses opportunistic, but doubts m/m; Cass has Monstr town but still holds out for secret DeepWolf, will look later; Monstr has tentative trust for Monty, Visor, & Winston, believes likely all 3 townies; Riedquat has town Monty (pretty/almost sure), Monstr, Cass, zack, dice (mostly), Bsmith (w/ reservations wrt claim), atheotes, dicetosser (mostly), schema (same as dice), fenn (more townie than scummy),

Others:

Town: Monstr, Atheotes, Cass
Lean Town: Jabbz, Riedquat, dice
Null: Zack (uptrend?), Visor, Al Sipsclar, BSmith,
Lean Scum: Schema, Fenn, Winston, (Visor?)
Scum:


Others: Cass says Monty can't be lolcleared, feels puppet strings around weird comments especially EoD3, more commentating/canvassing/mechanics than commitments; Cass wants to hear more from low-posters; Cass feels Schema has slipped away following an opinionated start; Cass feels Riedquat isn't offering enough if town; Winston wants Monty and Zack dead, they are interference-running, POE-extending, agenda-setting scum; Visor leans Schema; Visor suggests Al SIpsclar/Riedquat and maybe dice after lynch Schema; Riedquat has no scum reads besides himself/Riedquat, but no clue on Jabbz and Al Sipsclar, feels weird and unsure/less sure on Winston, weirder on Visor;






Late D4:

Others: Al Sips leans dice & Jabbz, won't lynch Cass, atheotes, Monstrbro, Winston, & Bsmith; Al Sips surprised that Fenn likes his tone and reasons, but calls him null for now; Monstr thinks Fenn town, 80-85%; Schema has had Monstr as town most of game; Cass townread Monstr, BSmith, Atheotes(with reservations), dice, Jabbz; Cass YOLO town Riedquat & Al Sips; Monstr likes Schema; Schema felt that everyone who has given her townreads so far has been town, will trust Fenn for now on that;

Town: Monstr, Atheotes, Cass, BSmith
Lean Town: Jabbz, Riedquat, dice
Null: Zack (uptrend?),
Lean Scum: Schema, Al Sipsclar
Scum: Winston, Fenn, Visor

Others: Al Sips downgrades Visor; Al Sips has Zack and Monty scum, former a bit more; Riedquat has Schema scummier than Fenn; Cass says Monty more likely scum if Atheotes town; Cass downtrend atheotes; Cass feels VIsor on Dice is opportunistic/not right (see also Post 3262); Schema only "eh" about Visor right now (of Winston-Visor-Fenn), but wanted to lynch Monty earlier on; Cass doesn't feel good about Zack and his approach; Fenn doesn't like Schema's return, but feels wolves are on the sudden wagon on her; Cass bottom tier Schema/Fenn (more bothered by Fenn), then Visor/Monty/Zack/Winston; Schema says Fenn feels forced but too low-impact for lynch today; Schema bugged about Visor for being alive, reaction to Cuth flip, and insistence on quality of own reads; Schema's unhappy place is Cass's Winston/Visor/Monty trio; Monstr has Fenn fine to die; Monstr says one of Fenn/al sips/schema must be scum; Zack says Fenn over Visor, Schema over Al SIps; Schema says Visor over Fenn probably, but trusts Cass if Fenn;

Lynch: AL SIPSCLAR TOWN






Start D5:

Others: Schema townreads Fenn & Monstr; Schema claims she had everyone at EOD for lynch (i.e. Al Sips & Fenn) as town; dicetosser has Schema gtown; Schema seems to like me (suspicious acceptance of atheotes?);

Town: Monstr, Atheotes,
Lean Town: Riedquat, dice
Null: Zack
Lean Scum: Schema (but not with atheotes)
Scum: Winston, Fenn, Visor

Others: Monstr claim peek Zack scum; Schema not impressed with Atheotes, believes Monstr claim against Zack; Zack shades Schema as Fenn's partner; dice WTL Visor, Monty, Zack; Visor said nothing about Al Sips was towny;

Night Kill: BSMITH TOWN 3DAY VIG; JABBZ TOWN;






Early D5:

Others: Monstr doesn't think Zack is bussing Schema out of Fenn & Schema;

Town:
Lean Town:
Null:
Lean Scum:
Scum:

Others: Monstr says Riedquat or dice, or Fenn, or Visor, maybe even Monty, could be Zack's partners;

Special: Monstr scan claim:
N1 atheotes v
N2 Barto w
N3 cuth
N4 Zack w

[Askthepizzaguy]

Dicetosser, there's only so much the game host can do, they're not online all the time, they have to sleep and go to work or school too, they also sometimes wake up and find 20 new pages in the thread. We don't have the tools here we have at a site like MU to make tally keeping easy.

I recognize it can be frustrating going a long time without an official vote count, but believe me, the game hosts are usually doing all they can.

I'm a lazy gobshite, I've been pampered by automatic vote counters on other websites for too long, then I decided to host a game where it's got three things to count with different colors so it would break the vote counter programs, because if there's one thing I have, it's FORESIGHT.

[Askthepizzaguy]

So who is blindfolded white? The game host?

In the game of chess, you can never let your adversary see your pieces.

[GeneralHankerchief]

Oh, one last bit of moderator greentext (inb4 powertripping fascist):

I'm never going to officially, as moderator, ask people to cut down on their level of posting (unofficially though, as player, all bets are off). That said, especially in these high-volume games, I *am* going to ask that all posts remain on topic. We already had one drop-out happen due to people being unable to keep up, if a page or so is taken up by two or three people talking about the weather or fan theories or something completely unrelated to mafia, it doesn't help out anyone.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Can I spam a lot of posts about politics? Especially insulting ones about all the people who-

Pizza didn't even finish this post before GH nuked it.

[El Barto]

Pizza mentioned somewhere else a few weeks ago that spreading votes on day 1 is an effective way of catching the mafia, and I think this game showed that he was right- the votes were all over the place, and more importantly, only 3 of them actually counted, and on day 1 in particular it wasn't easy to see which 3 were going to count. Things could swing around pretty rapidly with just a few people changing their minds, and that meant we were always under pressure. Barto and I didn't react to always being under pressure as well.

I simply wasn't around to react. In the last 18 hours of any game I was off doing other stuff and in the few hours at night that I had for the first week I was still GMing elsewhere.

[Choxorn]

For all the troubles this game had, I had fun playing with all of you, at least for the brief period I was actually playing, and I hope next time I last a little longer.

[Jabbz]

One thing though, why did you kill Jabbz N4 rather than Monstr or atheotes? I think I even had that big analysis post for potential killers that ruled you out because you wouldn't do it just out of spite!

This. Inquiring minds are dying (or already died, semantics) to know.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Pizza mentioned somewhere else a few weeks ago that spreading votes on day 1 is an effective way of catching the mafia, and I think this game showed that he was right- the votes were all over the place, and more importantly, only 3 of them actually counted, and on day 1 in particular it wasn't easy to see which 3 were going to count. Things could swing around pretty rapidly with just a few people changing their minds, and that meant we were always under pressure. Barto and I didn't react to always being under pressure as well.

Big bandwagons means less tension. The tension even disappears when the vote is on a scum.

Tension is a big concept in chess but also in mafia. Keeping tension in the game can cause problems for your opponent, both in terms of giving them more to have to calculate every move, but also, giving them more things to stress out about.

If the tally is low, every "piece" is in danger. And you can get scumbags in check with maybe one vote switch, giving each villager the power to be heroic.

[Askthepizzaguy]

One thing that can be under-appreciated is not just the tension from mafia being in danger, but the tension from the mafia being in not insurmountable danger, where they have the dangling carrot of lynching a townie as the prize that round. If the tally allows a townie to be lynched with a single vote change, but a scum is still in danger, that presents a decision to the mafia that they must make or they must ignore, and that makes them stress a bit.

Contrariwise, put them up by five votes, and they begin to accept their fate a bit more, and go into anti-spew. And their teammates know there's little they can do to save their ailing teammate, so they don't feel the stress of trying to.

This game's tally mechanics were a bit different, but the chancellorship, persuading others who to lynch, and the representative seats were all worthy things to try for.

[Renata]

I loved the idea of drafting an unwilling person into a position of power, and Cass's own unique personality fit the mold of a mortified innocent bystander.

But of course that innocence wouldn't be reasonable if it were to go on for years, so eventually even she gets corrupted by power, and (as anyone would) used the moon for target practice. I'm pretty sure we all saw that coming, and I apologize for being so predictable.

I was in the car with my husband and son when I read the first writeup, and I was smirking and giggling so much I wound up having to describe the whole game to the both of them by way of explanation.

[Visor]

Wpwp zack

Gg all

Surprised at only 3 scum, though given the vote.mechanics it makes sense iguess maybe. Could have used one more perhaps (or two)

Setup is far more interesting as a mountainous though I'm not sure I want to play something like.it again
The exclusion of people from having an impact on the game and the feeling like your vote doesn't matter is kinda meh.

[Visor]

530am deadlines zzzzzzzzz

Can't do it

edit: thanks for hosting pizza

[atheotes]

I came in here thinking i was going to be Chancellor soon!

Very surprised to see only 3 mafia. My guess was atleast 4 and quite possibly 5
it was a fun game. Thanks for hosting Pizza. The writing was top notch as always.

[atheotes]

Well played Zack. you were always in my POE though. Always will be.

Town played a pretty good game. But to be honest we got lucky with the Choxorn lynch.
if Choxorn was not lynched D1, the game would have been a lot more chaotic as intended by Pizza.

[atheotes]

I have nothing but respect for the game host himself, I should have made that clearer but it was funnier how I posted it.

I remember one time on the discord we were talking about hosting a mafia game with all of the elements in it that had made us angry over the years, and that particular setup had at least four or five of the things you should never have in a game setup in it.

You learn that from experience. Sometimes it's a painful one.

I think we should try the all jesters game where the jesters are the town and the mafia will be able to resurrect townies. It will be a blast.

And the mafia will be recruitable but they won't win with the cult even after having been cult and helped cult win.

That latter one might have been a real game I'm still angry at like 7 years later. Replace might with is, and you've got it perfectly.

I think i remember this game and may have been part of the cult. not sure. But i remember it as being very unfair on you.

[atheotes]

...

The only paltry personal successes for my scumdar, at least, were identifying town meta from atheotes and Riedquat - but the former showed it to the town at large fairly soon after and the latter...

....

What town meta?

[Montmorency]

What town meta?

The way you misunderstood my mechanics talk early on. I argued that a certain arrangement wouldn't work out even if the town had so much knowledge as to start with the identity of the Mafia - in other words, defeat the purpose of the whole game - and you bizarrely thought this amounted to a role claim or role knowledge, and stuck with it for a while. It's a very town-atheotes kind of push.

I already mentioned "District 3 towny, District 1 powerful". As for individuals, I don't like Visor and I like Cass and DP.

As far as new information goes, well you're acting typical for town Atheotes, even if that's not really "new" from a manner of speaking.

[Cuthillius]

@imdone

good game, seriously
@Visor

:)
@Cass_

:D i forgot about that otter
@Askthepizzaguy

yup

although my play was not, uh, the best (sorry @Sooh)

i always have trouble caring more than other players in the game

if the game is inactive and most people aren't invested it makes it hard for me to do so

which is always tricky with these org games

also i try to hold back on posting which definitely always totally works out great

decreases both the quality of my posts and my wim

but meh idk

you hosted well though, thanks

[Schema]

I daresay this was my worst game ever as far as reads and thread presence goes. Apologies to everyone for that one.

Thanks for the game. Might come back for a smaller one later on? We'll see.

[Monstrdude]

@Cuthillius

I enjoyed playing with you and was really glad I cleared you successfully

You were a fairly obvious villager to me

[Sooh]

Should host a new game with different lynch mechanics. To vote to lynch someone, you have to use " Kiss: " instead of "Vote:" in bold pink.

I just want it to be known that I was the first one to Kiss: Zack this game. Mostly in jest of course, but it could have been amazing ;)

Thanks for the game everyone!

I actually think it was great for me to die early this game, because I needed the break :)

Cuth, you are forgiven. I just need to beat you up first.

[Visor]

I daresay this was my worst game ever as far as reads and thread presence goes. Apologies to everyone for that one.

Thanks for the game. Might come back for a smaller one later on? We'll see.

you better.