Results 1 to 23 of 23

Thread: Anyone a fan of Woodsmen?

Hybrid View

Previous Post Previous Post   Next Post Next Post
  1. #1

    Post Anyone a fan of Woodsmen?

    My apologies if this topic has been discussed to death in the past, but I'm a recent newcomer to Medieval: Total War & the Viking Invasion expansion. I'll give you a brief history of my TW experiences (in chronological order):

    Rome: Total War
    Barbarian Invasion
    Shogun Total War: Warlords Edition
    Battle Collection - Medieval: Total War & Viking Invasion

    As you can see, its a bit unorthodox, but at last I've found my way into MTW.

    Back on topic, is anyone a fan of Woodsmen? I'm currently into my first MTW campaign, playing Poland on Expert difficulty (fancied a challenge ). The main thing that struck me about this unit is its low recruitment cost (150 florins), low upkeep cost (about 30 florins per turn?), its combat bonus vs armoured units, the unit itself is lightly armoured (?), cheap to retrain.

    The description for these units is accurate though - these unit types are still peasantry (and therefore run like peasantry), but are instead armed with hefty axes. However, for their cost-effective recruitment & upkeep costs alone, I find these units more preferrably than an alternate unit, say Urban Militia for example. Urban Militia cost more to recruit & upkeep than Woodsmen, so this is my main reason for recruiting plenty of Woodsmen units in the provinces where they are available (dense woodland).

    On the battlefield, Woodsmen seem able to inflict casualties easily enough on rival units such as Spearmen, Urban Militia, Peasants and so on. Their only real drawbacks are that they usually take heavy casualties, especially versus archers and cavalry, and they can also waver quite frequently when fighting isolated battles.

    What's the opinion on Woodsmen to their equivalents?


    Currently developing Rome: Total Gameplay (RTG), an unofficial mod for vanilla Rome: Total War v1.5

    Features: improved battles, new units to recruit, more buildings to construct, a modified campaign map, and much more!
    RTG Main Topic
    , Click here to download RTG v1.0

  2. #2

    Default Re: Anyone a fan of Woodsmen?

    Woodsmen are better as flankers while UM can melee a bit better. Militia Sergeants outclass woodsmen in everything except charge, this probably still makes them a better flanking unit than Militia Sergeants.
    “The majestic equality of the laws prohibits the rich and the poor alike from sleeping under bridges, begging in the streets and stealing bread.” - Anatole France

    "The law is like a spider’s web. The small are caught, and the great tear it up.” - Anacharsis

  3. #3
    Boondock Saint Senior Member The Blind King of Bohemia's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    England
    Posts
    4,294

    Default Re: Anyone a fan of Woodsmen?

    Woodsmen are one of those units that when they are in the hands of a tricky rebel army they can be devastating if used properly. A real handful of a unit. I think the Northumbrians had them as an exclusive unit in the Viking campaign and they were very handy indeed in the melee

  4. #4

    Default Re: Anyone a fan of Woodsmen?

    I played Poland first too, and loved the guys. Had plenty in each army and they were pretty effective.

  5. #5
    Vermonter and Seperatist Member Uesugi Kenshin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    The Mountains.
    Posts
    3,868

    Default Re: Anyone a fan of Woodsmen?

    I love woodsmen, but I have never really had an opportunity to use them in the campaign that much. I love setting up ambushes with them in trees/on slopes against heavier infantry in custom battles though.
    "A man's dying is more his survivor's affair than his own."
    C.S. Lewis

    "So many people tiptoe through life, so carefully, to arrive, safely, at death."
    Jermaine Evans

  6. #6
    Senior Member Senior Member naut's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Posts
    9,103

    Default Re: Anyone a fan of Woodsmen?

    Yes woodsmen are useful, especially for a faction like the Polish. But once you can get Men-at-arms, they become useless except as garrison troops.
    #Hillary4prism

    BD:TW

    Some piously affirm: "The truth is such and such. I know! I see!"
    And hold that everything depends upon having the “right” religion.
    But when one really knows, one has no need of religion. - Mahavyuha Sutra

    Freedom necessarily involves risk. - Alan Watts

  7. #7
    Arrogant Ashigaru Moderator Ludens's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Posts
    9,063
    Blog Entries
    1

    Lightbulb Re: Anyone a fan of Woodsmen?

    Neither Urban Militia nor Militia Sergeants get a bonus against cavalry. They care poleaxes, as opposed to polearms, and only the latter give an anti-cavalry bonus (oddly, the unit description of Chivalric Footknights also mentions poleaxes, but they do get an anti-cav bonus).

    Woodsmen: ...... Charge 8 Attack 1 Defence -1 Armour 2 Speed 6, 10, 11 Morale –2 Cost 75 Support cost 22
    Urban Militia: ..... Charge 4 Attack 2 Defence -1 Armour 1 Speed 6, 10, 11 Morale 0 Cost 100 Support cost 30
    Militia Sergeants: Charge 4 Attack 2 Defence 3 Armour 3 Speed 6, 10, 11 Morale 0 Cost 150 Support cost 30
    (From frogbeastegg's unit guide)

    Urban militia have a higher attack and morale, but Woodsmen have better charge and suprisingly also better armour. They don't match up against MS however. In my experience, Woodsmen make decent flankers against armoured troops, and at a bargain price. Especially against the Vikings (playing as the Northumbrians) they can create a carnage, provided you build them in the province that gives them +1 valour. But watch their morale, and don't let them get caught by archers or on multiple flanks! Use carefully, and in moderation.
    Looking for a good read? Visit the Library!

  8. #8
    Villiage Idiot Member antisocialmunky's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    ゞ( ゚Д゚)ゞ
    Posts
    5,974

    Default Re: Anyone a fan of Woodsmen?

    While we're on the subject of that area, there's always competition from the slav warriors. Those guys are pretty good and have some morale which is a godsend in early.
    Fighting isn't about winning, it's about depriving your enemy of all options except to lose.



    "Hi, Billy Mays Here!" 1958-2009

  9. #9
    Tired Old Geek Member mfberg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    NC, USA
    Posts
    757

    Default Re: Anyone a fan of Woodsmen?

    Charging woodsmen into the flank of engaged Royal Cav is a great way to kill off enemy Kings and Princes. I set mine in ambush in the woods on the Polish hillsides and put a unit of Slav warriors slightly separated from the rest of my army as bait. Let the cav hit the slav warriors, and then charge the woodsmen in and you have the peasants chasing the Knights in a rout.

    mfberg
    It is not complete until the overwieght female vocalizes.

    Pinky : Gee Brain, what do you want to do tonight?
    Brain : The same thing we do every night Pinky. Try to take over the world!

  10. #10
    Filthy Rich Member Odin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Just West of Boston
    Posts
    1,973

    Default Re: Anyone a fan of Woodsmen?

    Yes I am a fan of woodsmen, however I use them as set up troops. The setup is I take a few of them into battles and either hide them on ambush or charge them into a high value unit and then use archers to hit that high target as unit.

    In short they are expendable troops in my MTW tactics, thats not to say that they arent more valuable then the use I have for them. In the XL mod, (maybe in vanilla) woodsmen trained in Lithuania get a valor bouns, add to that the morale they get, they are probably the better of the low end units (peasants, UM, Slav warriors and the like).
    There are few things more annoying than some idiot who has never done anything trying to say definitively how something should be done.

    Sua Sponte

  11. #11
    Senior Member Senior Member naut's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Posts
    9,103

    Default Re: Anyone a fan of Woodsmen?

    I stand corrected, maybe I should play as the polish more often
    #Hillary4prism

    BD:TW

    Some piously affirm: "The truth is such and such. I know! I see!"
    And hold that everything depends upon having the “right” religion.
    But when one really knows, one has no need of religion. - Mahavyuha Sutra

    Freedom necessarily involves risk. - Alan Watts

  12. #12

    Default Re: Anyone a fan of Woodsmen?

    I love woodsmen. I use them for my scottish expeditions (I use Super mod) into eastern Europe and and the Norse countries to fill in the ranks of my lost highland clansmen. They do a pretty decent job using moral boosting buildings and stuff to help them out. They are easily replaced and only require a forester to build in BKB's Super mod. So they do their job and they do it well only I wish they were recruitable in western europe as well (westen europe had some dense forests in france I am sure of).


  13. #13
    The Black Senior Member Papewaio's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Location
    Sydney, Australia
    Posts
    15,677

    Default Re: Anyone a fan of Woodsmen?

    Love them, they are like mini-me Vikings.

    They are cheap so they are good to fill out an army on Expert. They have low morale... simple solution build morale upgrades and have a leader the increase morale. They then will fight longer.

    Have a line of Spearmen and use the Woodsmen as counter-assualt and flanking units. Makes for a cheap anti-cav force.

    On a per man basis the Cav will win, on a per florin basis you will be up by about 10:1.
    Our genes maybe in the basement but it does not stop us chosing our point of view from the top.
    Quote Originally Posted by Louis VI the Fat
    Pape for global overlord!!
    Quote Originally Posted by English assassin
    Squid sources report that scientists taste "sort of like chicken"
    Quote Originally Posted by frogbeastegg View Post
    The rest is either as average as advertised or, in the case of the missionary, disappointing.

  14. #14
    Senior Member Senior Member naut's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Posts
    9,103

    Default Re: Anyone a fan of Woodsmen?

    The Black Forest of Germany (Shwarz Wald) is extremely dense, so maybe places like Bavaria should get Woodsmen.
    #Hillary4prism

    BD:TW

    Some piously affirm: "The truth is such and such. I know! I see!"
    And hold that everything depends upon having the “right” religion.
    But when one really knows, one has no need of religion. - Mahavyuha Sutra

    Freedom necessarily involves risk. - Alan Watts

  15. #15
    Host Member Maeda Path Champion, Arkanoid Champion, 3D SuperBall Champion, Simon Champion, Disc Dash Champion, Breakout Champion Zain's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Freedonia
    Posts
    2,515

    Default Re: Anyone a fan of Woodsmen?

    I perfer Vikings over Woodsmen.

  16. #16

    Default Re: Anyone a fan of Woodsmen?

    SA,

    I'm playing Polish Early Hard Vanilla VI and yes i love woodsmen. Recruiting them from Lithuania for the +1 Valour is especially good. They are cheap, can fight and are great to just keep churning out.

    I tend to use them in actual battles, to hide in woods flanking my defensive position ready to charge the enemys flanks, again in woods to attack cavalry (the GH usually) and when on the offensive as troops to lure off horse archers and to flush out enemy troops in forests.

    Coupled with a decent general they are extraordinary value for money.
    The world is full of kings and queens
    Who blind your eyes and steal your dreams
    Its Heaven and Hell

    I need 2 more recruits, please click my link below, you don't even have to play. Thanks

    Kendraam, Guild Founder of The Lords of Chaos

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO