One of our repected forum members just picked up a new sneak peak video, not the best quality but sure it shows some more insight.
http://forum.thelordz.co.uk/viewtopi...5861&highlight=
Cheers,
LZoF
One of our repected forum members just picked up a new sneak peak video, not the best quality but sure it shows some more insight.
http://forum.thelordz.co.uk/viewtopi...5861&highlight=
Cheers,
LZoF
Nice, I had not seen this one before.
Sir Robin the Not-quite-so-brave-as-Sir-Lancelot,
who had nearly fought the Dragon of Agnor,
who had nearly stood up to the vicious Chicken of Bristol,
and who had personally wet himself at the Battle of Badon Hill.
Ah, my apologies dear man.
Obsolete post than.
LZoF
No need to apologize, I am pretty sure I have not seen that musket one anywhere before.
He has a nice one there with the muskets and we see the knights charge along their line.
I do hope that is not a battle against the AI though because there is no actual battle line at all.
Sir Robin the Not-quite-so-brave-as-Sir-Lancelot,
who had nearly fought the Dragon of Agnor,
who had nearly stood up to the vicious Chicken of Bristol,
and who had personally wet himself at the Battle of Badon Hill.
the beauty of those graphics makes me cry, and the rediculous running speeds that's gonna waste it all make me cry ever harder. couldn't resist making jetfighter sounds every time those knights warped around the screen
Member of The Lordz Games Studio:
A new game development studio focusing on historical RTS games of the sword & musket era
http://www.thelordzgamesstudio.com
Member of The Lordz Modding Collective:
Creators of Napoleonic Total War I & II
http://www.thelordz.co.uk
When I saw it I was continuously getting the feeling that it was a RTS with those units running all the time. It is too fast. It is like those movies directed by music video directors. Shiny, fast and beautifully framed, but no depth.
Nice, but did you notice how the musketeers (if that's what they were) didn't turn to look at the horsemen attacking them?Originally Posted by Sir Robin
That looked kind of weird...![]()
Yeah its pretty scarry how the AI reacted, or in better words, did not react to the attack. Hopefully this was just a "doesn't this look cool?" battle and the AI was crippled.
Sir Robin the Not-quite-so-brave-as-Sir-Lancelot,
who had nearly fought the Dragon of Agnor,
who had nearly stood up to the vicious Chicken of Bristol,
and who had personally wet himself at the Battle of Badon Hill.
Yeah, it was weird, they all just seemed to stand there like dummies while they got mown down.
I sure hope they don't behave like that in the game!
I did like to see the knights engulf the flintlock-shooter. Take that, early gunpowder units!
"Half of your brain is that of a ten year old and the other half is that of a ten year old that chainsmokes and drinks his liver dead!" --Hagop Beegan
Some comments (may have been mentioned before) about the video in which you see the muskets fire.
-The giant canon: so 1 shot of a canon (or mortar or whatever) can destroy a whole unit of knights with just one shot? And the accuracy of the shot, smack in the middle of the group (in one shot).
-the routing sprinters: a Turkish unit routs and clears a distance of several yards in record breaking time with all of their equipment.
-the ghost knights: When the cavalry hit an infantry unit head on (on several occasions) they just went straight through it, like slicing through butter. It made me think of the ghost army in LOTR, they didn't even lose speed. One moment you could see the infantries backs, the next nanosecond this view was obscured by all the horses.
-dry rain: It was clearly raining in the video, but it had no effect on the battle itself. Archers could use fire arrows (why would one even want to do that when it's raining) and musketeers could fire without any problems. It was really pouring but making fire was apparently no problem.
Hopefully this was just a promotion video and not the real game. I believe it is as there are a lot of 'movie' shots in it (like the shots of the big canon when it was still inactive). But still it doesn't look good for M2TW and just lets hope that our great modding community can fix enough for the game to be somewhat realistic.
Originally Posted by Drone
Originally Posted by TinCow
I really doubt the speed is that high. I think the guy pushed fast forward or something. I refuse to believe it's that high(the unit speed).
Anyhow, I still love MTW2 and I will surely buy it.![]()
Ja mata, TosaInu. You will forever be remembered.
Proud![]()
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Been to:![]()
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Swords Made of Letters - 1938. The war is looming in France - and Alexandre Reythier does not have much time left to protect his country. A novel set before the war.
A Painted Shield of Honour - 1313. Templar Knights in France are in grave danger. Can they be saved?
Well I thougt of that too but we wont know for sure untill the demo comes out.Originally Posted by edyzmedieval
Originally Posted by Drone
Originally Posted by TinCow
oh yeah I forgot to complain about that tactical nuke, it must've shocked me so much that it was automatically erased from my mind to avoid a trauma.The giant canon: so 1 shot of a canon (or mortar or whatever) can destroy a whole unit of knights with just one shot? And the accuracy of the shot, smack in the middle of the group (in one shot).
Member of The Lordz Games Studio:
A new game development studio focusing on historical RTS games of the sword & musket era
http://www.thelordzgamesstudio.com
Member of The Lordz Modding Collective:
Creators of Napoleonic Total War I & II
http://www.thelordz.co.uk
Yea, the video looks cool but it must be a case of overpromoting the action in the game. With that unit speed and nuke stuff the game would stop beeing in the total war genre. But if this is the real deal then i´m afraid ca will loose a lot of the current fans.
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The renaissance total war, colonial total war, imperial total war - That´s what we need![]()
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There was similar stuff with the trailers for RTW - IIRC, elephants and flaming onagers appeared extremely lethal, overpowering even. It looks dramatic, even if it offends the "historical realism" school (of which I am a member). In the actual game, elephants and onagers are still nasty but don't unbalance it terribly - in part because they are so rare. I rather like fighting elephants in RTW - they are one of the few real AI threats. AI onagers, I never seem to encounter unless attacking the Senate. I don't bring them myself as I want the strategic mobility (and they are largely unhistorical in field battles). So I predict very powerful cannons will exist in M2TW but they will probably appear rather late in the game when most players have given up and restarted another campaign.
I'm part of the Historical Realism school, but it doesn't change much if a big bunch of forumers want historical realism.![]()
CA decides what they include in the game, not us.![]()
Ja mata, TosaInu. You will forever be remembered.
Proud![]()
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Been to:![]()
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Swords Made of Letters - 1938. The war is looming in France - and Alexandre Reythier does not have much time left to protect his country. A novel set before the war.
A Painted Shield of Honour - 1313. Templar Knights in France are in grave danger. Can they be saved?
It's true that the onagers and elephants were rather overdone in the trailers, but this doesn't appear to be a trailer to me. Although personally I'm not too worried because I expect it should be easy enough to mod out the nuclear artillery shells. I just hope it doesn't represent the developers' attitude to the game overall. If I want some enjoyably ludicrous gameplay I'll stick on GTA: SA.
Last edited by Furious Mental; 06-06-2006 at 04:45.
cannons, elephant cannone, whatever...its the unit SPEED that is the worst...if it ships in any kind of state we have seen in all the trailers it stops being TW and becomes a aoe, ron imitation
i dont mind taking liberty with history regarding units....its a game, the modders will make it accurate....but the gameplay is taking a bad turn
as someone who has played since STW i looked forward to rtw more than i do mtw2, who knows maybe they will suprise me and honor the original concept of this series.
pretty sure its mostly new devs working on this![]()
And when the brazen cry of achilles
Was heard among the trojans, all their hearts
Were troubled, and the full-maned horses whirled
The chariots backward, knowing griefs at hand...
Am quite tired of this discussion, "RTW is a clickfest game", "It isn't RTW, it is AoE..", "RTW is a RTS..".. And I've gone through it many times. Stop liking RTW to AoE, in AoE their is no shield wall/flanking that matters/charge/hold/wedge/morale/general.. You're simply bashing RTW, at least IMO; liking RTW to a game with no strategies/tactics is simply like liking a modern US tank to a late 60's Iraqi one..
I haven't seen the video, but as long as the speeds are like RTW's, am fine with it..
"Cry, the beloved country, for the unborn child that is the inheritor of our fear. Let him not love the earth too deeply. Let him not laugh too gladly when the water runs through his fingers, nor stand too silent when the setting sun makes red the veld with fire. Let him not be moved when the birds of his land are singing, nor give too much of his heart to a mountain or a valley. For fear will rob him of all if he gives too much."
Cry, the Beloved Country by Alan Paton.
RTW doesnt have a combat penalty for disorganised formationsStop liking RTW to AoE, in AoE their is no shield wall/flanking that matters/charge/hold/wedge/morale/general
RTW doesnt have a combat penalty for placing units on top of eachother
RTW doesnt have a combat penalty for units that are flanked or surrounded
RTW doesnt have a combat penalty for loose formation
RTW doesnt have a combat bonus for wedge formation
what was that you were saying ?
Member of The Lordz Games Studio:
A new game development studio focusing on historical RTS games of the sword & musket era
http://www.thelordzgamesstudio.com
Member of The Lordz Modding Collective:
Creators of Napoleonic Total War I & II
http://www.thelordz.co.uk
When the units engage each other,. Its crazy, there guys jumping and all sorts of crazy graphic movements.
I hope the unit speed is easy to mod slower! Because those knights break the sound barrier.
EDIT: I think we should ensure peoples opinions are respected.
Last edited by naut; 06-06-2006 at 11:24.
#Hillary4prism
BD:TW
Some piously affirm: "The truth is such and such. I know! I see!"
And hold that everything depends upon having the “right” religion.
But when one really knows, one has no need of religion. - Mahavyuha Sutra
Freedom necessarily involves risk. - Alan Watts
The elephants and onagers were overpowered like hell in the RTW gameplay movies too. This was as some people have pointed out a scripted battle.Originally Posted by Furious Mental
The badboy cannon was suppose to wipe the knights out to give them a "glorious" end. While I don't doubt this cannon will be powerful in the final game, it will most likely be very inaccurate.
Yes there was.RTW doesnt have a combat penalty for units that are flanked or surrounded
The morale dropped if the soldiers were surrounded and even more when they were flanked.
What RTW are you talking about? Have you ever played RTW?Originally Posted by [cF]Adherbal
Says who? It doesn't have to have a 'stats' penalty to have a penalty, it surely does have a gameplay one. (You get hit by more arrows, you are easier to flank, you are easier to surround (Morale Penalty))RTW doesnt have a combat penalty for placing units on top of eachother
Combat Penalty? No, other ones? Hell yes.. At least, why should their be a combat penalty? Isn't the 'not-calculated Shield + Defence Skill' through attacks from the back enough? Not considering the big 'morale' penalty..RTW doesnt have a combat penalty for units that are flanked or surrounded
Who told you so? I remember even the guide in the game says it has..RTW doesnt have a combat penalty for loose formation
No it doesn't, but it doesn't need to to make Wedge any useful, I'm sorry if you want an ability to just click and go.. Wedge in RTW has a sense, and is used to break formations, rather than "Wow, it gives + 5 attack.."RTW doesnt have a combat bonus for wedge formation
The bottom line, sure some things aren't like M: TW; with the simple +4/-2 stats effects, it is quite deeper than that, and if you tend to not see or go through the game so deep, am sorry, but you then aren't qualified to judge it. Penalties/bonuses doesn't need to be +5/-2.. The wedge formation for example: You can use a Wedged Clib to go through a Chosen Axemen unit with least casualties messing the Chosen Axemen units, making it vulnerable to a charge from another Cav unit to put an end to it's misery.
"Cry, the beloved country, for the unborn child that is the inheritor of our fear. Let him not love the earth too deeply. Let him not laugh too gladly when the water runs through his fingers, nor stand too silent when the setting sun makes red the veld with fire. Let him not be moved when the birds of his land are singing, nor give too much of his heart to a mountain or a valley. For fear will rob him of all if he gives too much."
Cry, the Beloved Country by Alan Paton.
AFAIK, we did lose [2] moving from MTW to RTW but I think you are being a little misleading on the other points.Originally Posted by [cF]Adherbal
Re [1] There is no "disorganised" state per se in TW. But
(a) a strung out formation - eg one pursuing a routing enemy - will tend to do worse than an ordered one, because its men will get into combat piecemeal with a more concentrated opponent
(b) a stationary braced formation can cope with a cavalry charge better than a "disorganised" one.
(3) disorganisation severely hampers phalanxes
(4) the "hold formation" button captures some aspects of being in proper formation - your defence is higher, but your attack is reduced
Re [3] This is wrong because:
(a) the morale penalties to being flanked etc are very severe
(b) individual soldiers have facing and cutting at one's flank or back does increase kill chances (and stops your target striking back until they turn about)
Re [4] Does there need to be a "penalty"? In loose formation, you will get fewer men into contact with an enemy and hence kill less (be killed more) in melee.
Re [5] Are you sure of this? In STW and MTW, wedge raised attack and lowered defence. I would assume it's the same in RTW.
Which Adherbal are you talking about?What RTW are you talking about?Adherbal not having played RTW, that is a good one.
Last edited by Duke John; 06-06-2006 at 12:44.
Ogh, I forgot to reply to his first note, but anyway, you seem to have covered it.Originally Posted by econ21
Also:
First, you will lose control of your units, try this:RTW doesnt have a combat penalty for disorganised formations
Go ERE and your friend ERE rebels, you get 10 plumbs and he gets 5 clibs. Now you turn fire at will off, and let his clibs walk through your infantry, look how missed will your infantry be, try to organise them then..
Second, you will be to easy to crush. After doing what I said above, let your friend charge your army with 5 Equite CATAS after it has been dis-organised. All he needs to do is retreat and charge again, till you're done.
"Cry, the beloved country, for the unborn child that is the inheritor of our fear. Let him not love the earth too deeply. Let him not laugh too gladly when the water runs through his fingers, nor stand too silent when the setting sun makes red the veld with fire. Let him not be moved when the birds of his land are singing, nor give too much of his heart to a mountain or a valley. For fear will rob him of all if he gives too much."
Cry, the Beloved Country by Alan Paton.
At least in alot of screenshots the armies seem to be in formation. I am aware, though, that screenshots can be and often are staged.
Though all of those 5 points ARE actually covered in the game RTW, it doesn't really matter because of the low overall morale: Units will soon start routing regardless, and fighting will not last long enough for simple +3 or -4 or whatever to influence anything.
The longest fighting i have seen is between 2 units of spartan hoplites, and even that was over way too soon to my taste. So what should I do now? Increase the hitpoints of all units? Increase the morale? That means a penalty for all the units that had high morale/hitpoints to begin with...
I don't even mind the marching/charging speeds, it's a game after all. you can define speeds to be what they are, and these are motion captured animations. Make the battlemap larger and you will be glad to cross it faster. It would be nice to have a little more time to maneuver though, so use Pause...
From the looks of it the knights in MTW2 are even faster than the cavalry was in RTW...
in montem soli non loquitur
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(x.X)(_)(_) who want to achieve world domination!
becoming is for people who do not will to be
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