PDA

View Full Version : Interficio quod Scrupulosa [Concluded]



Pages : [1] 2

Sir Moody
12-13-2006, 14:54
The Year is 145BC and Rome is temporarily at peace. The third Punic War has ended and Carthage has been utterly destroyed leaving Rome as a Superpower unmatched by any. But all is not well, the senators spurred by their victories and rise to power are plotting behind each others back aiming to grab more power to themselves and even, possible, seize control Rome itself. The newly elected consul’s are struggling to maintain control of the veteran armies, many of whom owe allegiance to others on the senate. Civil war is on the horizon.

This night finds Motuus Scipio, consul of Rome, spending far too much time in his cups trying to forget the affairs of state he deals with daily. In his drunken stupor he fails to notice a black shadow slowly creeping over him. His body was found the next day by his slaves, a gladius stuck through his back.

In a hastily arranged meeting the Remaining consul addresses the senate. “Friends, Romans, Countrymen this day we have lost one of our greatest, a true hero of Rome and her People. We have lost a Consul. We have lost a friend. But while we mourn his passing a new consul must be elected to fill Mortuus’s seat BUT we have a problem. Shortly after the news reached me of my friends death I found this letter pinned to my door. In this letter is a warning from an anonymous source, friends we cannot hold elections for a new consul just yet as… his killer is one of us. The letter warns that a rebel faction within the senate are seeking to seize power by killing us all a few at a time, we cannot let this happen. In the great democratic traditions of our great nation I herby raise the motion that we find the guilty party by meeting each day and voting on who we believe the foul murderers are. It is our duty to Rome to see the rebels do not escape our justice. And so friends until the next murders, this session is Closed.”

Interficio quod Scrupulosa is an ancient Rome variant of the “mafia” forum game and will contain many of the same roles as previous games simply renamed to fit the period.

First the basic Rules:

The game takes place in ancient Rome; the players are members of the senate. The game is split into 2 phases, Night and Day. During the Night phase anyone with a special role can PM me with a target, what this does depends on the role but at the end of the night the Rebels (“mafia”) will kill several members. During the day phase all members with voting roles (the consul cannot Vote but more on that in the next section) vote on who they believe the rebels are – once a consensus is reached that person is executed. To win the Senators must kill all rebels before the end of the game.

Available Roles:

The Rebels: The rebels represent a splinter faction within the Senate that are actively killing off their rivals. Each night the Rebels will kill 2 members of the senate no matter how many of them remain. During the Night phase the Rebels must send me a PM containing their target name and the kill write up. This need not be detailed and can be as brief as you like but all methods of killing must be Appropriate to the time period (so no guns). I will edit most kills to either increase their length or remove inappropriate methods. The Rebels will win if at the end of the game at least one of them remains.

The Praetor’s: The Praetor’s are military men who in peace time often find themselves handling Roman law and as such are very good at finding the Truth of a person’s guilt. The Praetor is the “detective” and during each night phase will attempt to find the Rebels by sending me a PM with the name of a senator they wish to investigate. I will send them the result of the Investigation at the same time as I post the kills unless the Praetor himself is killed. Praetors can reveal to everyone at any point and are free to use quotes of my PM’s too them but screenshots of any type are strictly forbidden. Praetors cannot reveal to individuals, they must always reveal to everyone, and cannot reveal if dead.

The Legatus: The Legatus is a high ranking Roman General – a Veteran of the Recent Punic War. He commands a vast number of veteran soldiers all of whom would follow him to the gates of hell and beyond. He can use this loyalty to provide bodyguards to himself or his friends, protecting them from harm. The Legatus is the “Doctor”, each night he can protect one person from harm that night. They do this by sending me a PM with the name of the person they want to protect (it can be themselves!) and this person will survive the night even if targeted by the mafia (unless the Legatus is killed as well).

The Consul: The Consul is the “head” of the senate and cannot take part in the voting of his peers but it is his job to open new motions and has a certain amount of leeway in how the selected senator will be executed. The Consul is the “Town mayor” and each night will PM me with a method of execution. He cannot vote and cannot be killed – he is the only villager who will always be innocent and is free to join in during the voting phase by posting his suspicions.

The number of these roles is influx depending on how many people sign up:

0 – 24 means 2 Rebels 1 Praetor 1 consul
25 – 29 means 2 Rebels 1 Praetor 1 Legatus 1 Consul
30+ means 3 rebels 1 Praetors 2 Legatus 1 Consul

Roles will be randomised with no one person having 2 roles.

Signs up are now open and suggestions on further roles and/or current roles will be taken up until the game starts at which point I will concrete how many of each role are active

Current Sign Ups


Sasaki Kojiro
Don Corleone
Kagemusha
Kommodus
Ituralde
Destroyer of Hope
Caius Flaminius
Csar
GeneralHankerchief
Crazed Rabbit
doc_bean
Craterus
Masy
Reenk Roink
Xiahou
Peasant Phill
AggonyDuck
Proletariat
Dutch_guy
JimBob

Sasaki Kojiro
12-13-2006, 15:01
first!

Don Corleone
12-13-2006, 15:03
Second!

Kagemusha
12-13-2006, 15:08
Third!Btw Sasaki that avatar looks very mean.:hide:

Kommodus
12-13-2006, 15:28
Count me in! :2thumbsup:

I'd like to suggest a slight change in how you've structured the roles, though:



0 – 24 means 2 Rebels 1 Praetor 1 consul


This is fine.



25 – 29 means 2 Rebels 1 Praetor 1 Legatus 1 Consul


This seems perhaps a bit odd. In this second tier, the rebels have both more people to kill and the Legatus to deal with, making it rather more difficult for them than tier 1. However, the balance is still pretty good, as the Legatus is not really very powerful. I guess have no changes to recommend.



30+ means 3 rebels 2 Praetors 1 Legatus 1 Consul


Two Praetors will make an extremely powerful force, especially if they are working in conjunction. If they are working independently, they are still going to be quite strong. This lesson was learned in Cosa Nuova.

As the mafia already have a hard enough time winning, I recommend changing this to 3 rebels, 1 Praetor, and 2 Legatus. It's a small change on the surface but will actually have significant effects on how the game is balanced.

Ituralde
12-13-2006, 15:36
I'll give it a try.

Sasaki Kojiro
12-13-2006, 15:58
Yes there may be some balance issues. 2 mafia weren't able to take out the town in Mafia V even though the detective was offed round 2. 3 mafia lost in TGF2 even though none of them were caught by the detective. TGF2 was very close however. I'd suggest having 3 rebels in all of your setups, and decreasing the number of pro-town roles as the size of the town increases, since large towns make it more difficult for mafia.

Great write up to start the game with btw.

Sir Moody
12-13-2006, 16:35
Agreed i hadnt considered that i was trying to balance the roles - ill edit the brief in a sec

Lord Winter
12-13-2006, 16:39
I'm in

Caius
12-13-2006, 18:14
Im in.

Csargo
12-13-2006, 21:13
I'll join

GeneralHankerchief
12-13-2006, 21:13
Oh yeah, I'm in this one.

Crazed Rabbit
12-13-2006, 21:17
I'll join!

CR

doc_bean
12-13-2006, 21:17
sign me up !

Craterus
12-13-2006, 21:30
Argh! Why not?

Masy
12-13-2006, 21:44
Myself also if you would. I will endevour to get as involved as possible in this one. BTW Sir Moody this is a great take on the bog standard mafia, I look forward to it.

Reenk Roink
12-14-2006, 03:16
This sounds too interesting to pass up! :2thumbsup:

Still, I'm going to be busy in the upcoming weeks, so I might not have too much time to participate.

Though it seems at least for the next several games, my name will be so tarnished that I'll be lynched very quickly... :laugh4:

Xiahou
12-14-2006, 04:18
Sounds like a fun twist.... Sign me up.

Peasant Phill
12-14-2006, 09:47
sign me up scotty

Sir Moody
12-14-2006, 10:21
im going to start this Saturday noonish so signups will close tommorow night - keep on coming guys the more we get the more roles there will be :2thumbsup:

AggonyDuck
12-14-2006, 11:45
Sign me up

Proletariat
12-14-2006, 19:35
Innnnnnnnnnx0r

Dutch_guy
12-14-2006, 21:02
I'm in ~:)

:balloon2:

JimBob
12-15-2006, 00:45
It was fun last time around, in

Sigurd
12-15-2006, 10:12
I will not be able to participate this close to the holydays... if anyone was wondering why I haven't signed up.

Sir Moody
12-15-2006, 14:00
Sign ups end at midnight gmt so anyone who is interested you have 11 hours to go

Sir Moody
12-16-2006, 02:30
ok signups are now closed roles will be distributed and the first night phase will begin tommorow at noon

since w egot 20 people there are 2 Rebels 1 Praetor 1 consul

if you dont recieve a PM you are a "regular" senator

Sir Moody
12-16-2006, 02:50
Roles have been assigned the first night phase will begin at noon tomorrow and each phase will last 24 hours

Good luck to the respective sides - may the best Senator win

(oh and can a mod change the thread to read closed - thanks)

Sir Moody
12-16-2006, 13:16
Consul Csar Steped down and watched the Senators, the news that one of their own was not only were plotting their downfal but was activly reducing their numbers had been met with mixed reactions. Several were rightfully scared and were huddling in groups speaking quietly, or were they feigning this fear and were plotting their next attacks? Others were angry and were loudly shouting at people they suspected, or were they trying trying to set up scape goats? and finally there were those who just didnt care and were openly laughing and joking - convinced that their own power was enough to save them maybe, or maybe they knew better? it was going to be a long night...


Day 1 Night is open PM's please

and guys i know theres nothing to discuss but someone say something :inquisitive:

Kommodus
12-16-2006, 17:22
Alright then, let's make this interesting.

In a trend begun with the conclusion of Mafia II, I've frequently found myself on the receiving end of mafia assassination plots early in the game. In the last two games that I played, this happened in such quick succession that I, cheesed off, decided to hunt down the mafia (in one of the games at least) with ruthless efficiency.

Therefore I am throwing down the gauntlet to the mafia/rebels. I appreciate the fact that I've earned your respect as a townsperson, but I'm also just a bit sick of being slaughtered early in every game because of it. So here's the deal:

Don't kill me off early in the game.

If you do, you can be sure that my full powers of deduction will be leveled against you. I'll take out all the stops, and you will certainly not escape. If, on the other hand, you allow me to live for a reasonable amount of time (say, four or five rounds), I may have mercy on you.

Now, I know how this post will be interpreted by my fellow townspeople/regular senators. "Oh," you'll think, "he's just trying to provide himself a good cover/alibi. He knows we'll suspect him when he stays alive for an unusually long period of time."

I'd understand you thinking that, but you'd be wrong. I'm not a rebel, or the Praetor - I'm just a regular senator. If I was a rebel, I would not be calling attention to myself like this. Granted, it might be some sort of clever/risky ploy - but it isn't. I wouldn't play that sort of game. It's exactly what it looks like - an attempt to stay alive for more than the usual first couple of rounds.

So to the rest of you non-rebels I say this:

Don't lynch me early in the game.

If you do, you'll get no help from me. None. I'll figure out who the rebels are anyway, but I won't say a word, except to laugh at your bumbling attempts when you lynch innocent people. I'll understand if you find me suspicious later in the game and choose to lynch me (after say, four or five rounds). But show a little respect for my intelligence and don't off me with your usual knee-jerk reaction to everyone that tries to be helpful.

There. Let's see how that flies. :book:

Kagemusha
12-16-2006, 17:29
You know Kommodus,if i were a mafioso in this game.I would let you live after your speech.I hope that in this game the experienced players wont be butchered right from the start. :bow:

Don Corleone
12-16-2006, 18:13
No offense, but as somebody who's not an 'experienced player' I kinda resent the idea that we should be lined up as ritual sacrafices first for assasinations/lynchings. Is that our new rule? Lynch all the newbies first, cause if it is, I suspect we're going to have a hard time getting new people to start playing.

What's more, does Kommodus start every game with threats, that if he gets assasinated or lynched, he's going to pull out all the stops? It almost sounds like he's suggesting that he'll bend the rules.

How about if we wait for some kills and descriptions before we start making any declarations on who should get lined up for lynching?

Kommodus
12-16-2006, 18:24
No offense, but as somebody who's not an 'experienced player' I kinda resent the idea that we should be lined up as ritual sacrafices first for assasinations/lynchings. Is that our new rule? Lynch all the newbies first, cause if it is, I suspect we're going to have a hard time getting new people to start playing.

DC... I'm not trying to establish a new "principle" concerning who lives and who dies. It's just that, sheesh, I've made an early exit to every game for like, three games in a row. Two early assassinations, one early lynching. Can you blame me for not wanting it to happen again?


What's more, does Kommodus start every game with threats, that if he gets assasinated or lynched, he's going to pull out all the stops? It almost sounds like he's suggesting that he'll bend the rules.

No, I don't start games this way. This is the only time I've done it. I wouldn't have done it had I not established a clear pattern of pinpointing the mafia with my analytical methods - that's what enables me to make the claim.

And how exactly would I "bend the rules?" I'm not the game moderator, and I can't hack into the .org, so don't have access to any information that the rest of you lack. "Pulling out all the stops" refers to the energy and creativity with which I'll go after the mafia.

Don Corleone
12-16-2006, 18:30
Alright, alright. I see your point. You have been a high profile target for both sides in every game I've been in (that'd be back to GF2). It wasn't just your post. Kagemusha's follow-on (and he has been staying late into games) seemed to indicate that newbies should all get killed early and older players should be left alive for a while. I'm just saying that if we want to expand the normal circle of mafia to new players, that's not a good policy to employ.

Xiahou
12-16-2006, 22:41
Were I a rebel, I'd be tempted to kill you anyhow- just to show we're not afraid of your threats. :yes:

OTOH, since you've drawn such attention to yourself, letting you live might keep the senate guessing- they may even lynch you themselves.

Then there's yet another possibility- that you yourself are a rebel and this is just some elaborate ruse. If you were a rebel and the town lynches you, you've already got yourself an excuse for not helping the senate find your partner. And if you're not murdered, it's because of your threat- not because you are in fact a rebel. :shrug:

Curious statement indeed...

Kommodus
12-16-2006, 23:23
Were I a rebel, I'd be tempted to kill you anyhow- just to show we're not afraid of your threats. :yes:

OTOH, since you've drawn such attention to yourself, letting you live might keep the senate guessing- they may even lynch you themselves.

Then there's yet another possibility- that you yourself are a rebel and this is just some elaborate ruse. If you were a rebel and the town lynches you, you've already got yourself an excuse for not helping the senate find your partner. And if you're not murdered, it's because of your threat- not because you are in fact a rebel. :shrug:

Curious statement indeed...

~:rolleyes:

GeneralHankerchief
12-16-2006, 23:28
Actually, in Godfather 2 our original plan was to execute the veteran players early on (pretty successful, as we nailed Kommodus and Sasaki in successive rounds :evil:), leaving only the newbies alive.

Seriously, the strategies, especially the mafia strategies, evolve so much that I wouldn't worry about it. If it was considered cutting-edge three games ago, it's probably outdated by now.

Sasaki Kojiro
12-16-2006, 23:49
Then there's yet another possibility- that you yourself are a rebel and this is just some elaborate ruse. If you were a rebel and the town lynches you, you've already got yourself an excuse for not helping the senate find your partner. And if you're not murdered, it's because of your threat- not because you are in fact a rebel. :shrug:

Curious statement indeed...

This is what I was thinking. I bet Kommodus's own system would point at him given his behavior so far.

Reenk Roink
12-17-2006, 00:40
Hmm... you "senators" (why such a fine label be given to you women is beyond my intellect) are too timid in your speeches... :rolleyes:

I, Reenkaficsio, issue an ultimatum! :stupido:

To address the Rebel slaves:

Know that if Kommodus possesses his life past this coming night then you have given the senate a couple of insights, both being beneficial to us, and detrimental to you:

1) Kommodus is indeed in league with you slaves, and you will have given his identity away to us. We shall then indeed inflict on him such torture the likes of which no Carthaginian hath faced!

2) You are indeed a most effete group, and by being intimidated in such a fashion, we shall have no great task in rooting you out and crucifying you, leaving your carcasses on display along the country roads, with feces tiaras.

And now to address my fellow senators:

If Kommodus is indeed left alive, we must execute him ourselves. He has easily become a most worthy bride for my sword.

And now to address Kommodus:

If you indeed are innocent, we will use augurs to interpret your information in our search. Do not be lax!

Remember: Reenkaficsio for emperor! :rtwyes:

Kagemusha
12-17-2006, 05:50
Reenks what the hell are you talking about?:sweatdrop:

Kagemusha
12-17-2006, 06:43
Alright, alright. I see your point. You have been a high profile target for both sides in every game I've been in (that'd be back to GF2). It wasn't just your post. Kagemusha's follow-on (and he has been staying late into games) seemed to indicate that newbies should all get killed early and older players should be left alive for a while. I'm just saying that if we want to expand the normal circle of mafia to new players, that's not a good policy to employ.

Don my friend.I only expressed my individual opinion there. All players only have their opinions.What did i do wrong when i encouraged that the experienced players shouldnt be butchered in the first rounds? In two of the latest mafia games that happened and how those games played out? Two loss for the mafia.Becouse by killing of the many experienced players the mafia also made sure that those persons were innocent.Look,im not advocating the lynching and killing of the newbies here. But that its not viable mafia tactics to solemly target the experienced players.I know that some reason you think that im a dangerous player.But im just as dangerous of any other player in this game:bow: .

Ituralde
12-17-2006, 09:03
I don't think I fully understood the conswquences Kommodus has stated in his post. There are, I think three scenarios:

1) The Rebels kill you early on and now you will hunt them down ruthlessly.

2) The Senators (or maybe even the Rebels in their role als Senator) lynch you in the first few round and you turn your back on this game an won't help the Senate.

3) You survive the first few rounds and are now bound by your promise to give the Rebels some leeway, meaning that you will not help the Senate with full force.

So the only way to get you to investigate the Rebels the way you've done it in previous games would be if the Rebels killed you. Otherwise we Senators could not benefit from your deductions, because you stated to not give them to us.
I find this rather strange... :inquisitive:


Just remember Kommodus that, as a Senator, the goal of the game is not to live but to uncover the Rebels. The only case, where surviving would be beneficial is when you are a Rebel, although it is not strictly necessary.

doc_bean
12-17-2006, 11:03
I'd probably kill Kommodus if I was a rebel, just because he issued a challenge and what kind of Senator would turn his back to that ? I think probably half the players feel the same, not the best move you could have made if you wanted to live Komm.
Then again, the mafia might decide to not kill you and see if you get lynched, or simply wait three or four rounds, just to spread confusion. This might be to their benefit too. I see this as a lose-lose situation for the loyal senators, very suspicous. Of course, the tone of your post makes it sounds like you're not willing to give tracking down the rebels a lot of effort anyway, why are you playing then ?

Very strange...

Also: Reenk, wtf is your post about ? Either Kommodus should get killed or we should execute him ? What's your reasoning ? It's not like he said he was the detective and posted a PM or anything like that. He has a higher chance of getting killed than usual, I agree, but no where near 100%, so i don't see how we would always benefit from lynching him early.

See, the confusion has already begun, this is going to keep us busy for a few nights and hinder our efforts of fining the real (or other) rebels.

Sir Moody
12-17-2006, 13:07
Consul Csar slept well that night and awoke to no new murders, surely this was a good sign and that the letter was a poor joke. It was not to be so...

Senator Fatum Rodent, known affectionatly by his friends as "the Crazed Rabbit" was taking an early morning bath, he only loved 2 things in life and intrigue was one of them. While he considered the events of the day before, analysing which senators would be most likely to be Rebels his second love walked in, a beautiful slave girl. So distracted by the Slave as she walked through depositing towels he didnt notice the shadow creeping over him or the leather strap wrap around his neck. His last thought was he would never know the slave girls name...

Hearing the news Csar called an emergency sitting of the senate and rushed to meet them. While the Senators were gathering Venenum Masy was having to endure the usual greetings. As a powerful and very rich senator he was well used to the hand shakes and back slaps before a senate meeting and frankly found it dull. When csar arrived the Senators filed in and took their seats. As Csar began his opening speech Venenum realised the senate was awfully cold today and began to shiver, the shiver became shakes and the shakes became an uncontrollable fit. Csar ran to the dieing senator but could find no vitiable injury's except a small needle prick at the back of his neck...

"Friends the rebels have stuck and 2 of our great senators are dead it is our duty to find their killers and execute them - the senate floor is now open and one of us shall be executed before tonight - may the gods let us chose correctly!"

Alive
Sasaki Kojiro
Don Corleone
Kagemusha
Kommodus
Ituralde
Destroyer of Hope
Caius Flaminius
Csar
GeneralHankerchief
doc_bean
Craterus
Reenk Roink
Xiahou
Peasant Phill
AggonyDuck
Proletariat
Dutch_guy
JimBob

Dead
Crazed Rabbit
Masy

Executed



Voting is open and will close at noon tommorow

Sasaki Kojiro
12-17-2006, 14:52
[I]Consul Csar slept well that night and awoke to no new murders, surely this was a good sign and that the letter was a poor joke. It was not to be so...

Senator Fatum Rodent, known effectionatly by his friends as "the Crazed Rabbit" was taking an early morning bath, he only loved 2 things in life and intregue was one of them. While he considered the events of the day before, anaylsing which senators would be most likely to be Rebels his second love walked in, a beutiful slave girl. So distracted by the Slave as she walked through depositing towels he didnt notice the shadow creeping over him or the leather strap wrap around his neck. His last thought was he would never know the slave girls name...

Hearing the news Csar called an emergancy sitting of the senate and rushed to meet them. While the Senators were gathering Venenum Masy was having to endure the usual greetings. As a powerful and very rich senator he was well used to the hand shakes and back slaps before a senate meeting and frankly found it dull. When csar arrived the Senators filed in and took their seats. As Csar began his opening speach Venenum relised the senate was awfully cold today and began to shiver, the shiver became shakes and the shakes became an uncontrolable fit. Csar ran to the dieing senator but could find no visiable injury's except a small needle prick at the back of his neck...



The mafia are OBVIOUSLY terrible spellers. ~:rolleyes:

n.b. it can't be sir moody because the first post has immaculate spelling.

Dutch_guy
12-17-2006, 14:56
The mafia are OBVIOUSLY terrible spellers. ~:rolleyes:

n.b. it can't be sir moody because the first post has immaculate spelling.

Or someone who doesn't quite understand how to use Spell check.

:balloon2:

Sasaki Kojiro
12-17-2006, 15:16
Or someone who doesn't quite understand how to use Spell check.

:balloon2:

No. If you search the gameroom for these misspelled words they only place they show up is in this thread. The mafioso's in question would have had to never spelled them incorrectly in all of the previous games. Also, writing style doesn't match the poor spelling. Hence the roll eyes smiley.

Craterus
12-17-2006, 15:50
Whoever is the detective should definitely have investigated Kommodus.

Sir Moody
12-17-2006, 15:56
i didnt spell check it ok :help:

Sasaki Kojiro
12-17-2006, 16:18
i didnt spell check it ok :help:

haha ok. So the kills were written by you then?

Don Corleone
12-17-2006, 17:26
Is "Strike For The South" a mystery player in this game?

Don Corleone
12-17-2006, 18:16
Sorry Strike, if you're peeking in here. Just a little humor. :beam:

Anyway, I'm not certain what to make of Kommodu's threat. Apparently the mafia took it seriously, assuming that it's not just part of a cover for Kommodus. I'm surprised, I really expected the mafia to actually kill him BECAUSE of it.

Him or Reenk. Reenk was practically insulting them. And he bascially said that if the mafia didn't kill Kommodus, then we'd know he was working with them. I don't buy that, and I find his ultimatum odd. He knew Kommodus wouldn't be killed, so he knew he already had a lynching victim lined up. How could he know that?

If I misread your post, Reenk, please, correct me. Otherwise...

Vote: Reenk

Sir Moody
12-17-2006, 18:23
yes and no sas the mafia wrote the base kill line and I edited it - its going to be a long game if you pick out all my spelling mistakes...

Xiahou
12-17-2006, 21:34
Hmmm, my guess would be someone who hasn't posted yet- not that it narrows it down by that much. Your typical rebel would be leery of drawing unwanted attention to themselves and would likely not participate in the discussion that took place before the first kills were even logged.

Of course, a more daring rebel might have waded into the discussion from the beginning- but I still feel confident that at least one rebel would be lurking thus far. Besides, lurkers give us nothing to go on- at least active posters give us a track record to look back on in later rounds.

Ituralde
12-17-2006, 22:00
I'm still not fully convinced by Kommodus maneuver and there seems to be no penalty for lynching him. His post was also suspicious as only a veteran player would attempt a stunt like that and hope to get away with it.

Fellow Senators,
It has come to my attention that Senator Kommodus has openly declared that he will collaborate with the Rebels, if they would spare his life. Such an act of cowardice is not worthy of a true Roman! The friend of my enemy is my enemy.
Unless he refutes his connections to the Rebels and gives us full support in the search for those miscreants amongst us, he leaves me no choice, but to cast my vote for him. I'm reluctant to lynch an experienced Senator like him, as he has proven a worthy aid in the past. However open collaboration with the enemy can not be tolerated. If the fear for his life was so dear and his findings so important to our cause, why not ask for protection from our Legate?
As a sign of my disapproval for Senator Kommodus behaviour, I cast my vote as follows:

Vote: Kommodus


As stated above, this vote is not set, but I would like to hear a little more about Kommodus motives and assurance that he will help the Senators in exchange for not lynching him.

GeneralHankerchief
12-17-2006, 22:22
Okay, let me first say that my attention will not be fully focused on this game for around a week. Dutch_guy can attest to this (I'm fighting a massive battle in Will of the Senate, you see). However, I will do the best that I can to watch the thread and give my input when I feel it is necessary.

First of all, I suggest that our Praetor investigate Csar. The sooner we know his identity, the better. He could be the town's (Senate's) key to winning the whole thing.

Finally, as before, I believe that Kommodus is innocent. These kills apparently only being a base confirms it, as I don't believe K can resist writing a good story.

Vote: Abstain

Sir Moody
12-17-2006, 22:58
Csar is the Consul - as stated in the rules in the first post he is always innocent and cannot vote

AggonyDuck
12-18-2006, 00:33
I don't think we should lynch Kommodus. I don't think a mafioso would dare to warrant such attention to himself at the start. Unless of course Kommodus possesses considerable testicular fortitude. So I'd suggest we keep him alive for now, but we should remain suspicious of him as we should remain of pretty much anyone.

I do not think that it is in our advantage to abstain now. Thus I will cast my vote on someone and I've decided to cast my vote on Craterus. He has an uncanny ability to survive far in to the game, without really much posting anything and remaining as a great unknown throughout the whole game.

Vote: Craterus

Kommodus
12-18-2006, 00:50
I knew my speech would cause my detractors to come out of the woodwork! There are many ways for a man to discern who his enemies are. :stare:

Apparently Reenk Roink has an interest in my demise. First he urges the rebels to kill me... then urges the senators to lynch me if they don't. Now how do you think the rebels would respond to this?

The rebels know that if I am killed, my vengeful spirit will dog their steps until the end of their short lives. This is the worst-case outcome for them; obviously they won't do it if they don't have to. It makes some sense for Reenk to challenge them to kill me, then, as that's the outcome the senate might hope for.

However, Reenk doesn't stop there. He then urges the senate to lynch me if the rebels let me live. That's precisely what the rebels are hoping for, as they know that my death at the hands of the mob rids them - permanently - of one of their most dangerous rivals. So it's hardly a surprise that I have lived through the night.

Reenk, please explain yourself, for I find your words unwelcome and suspicious. :inquisitive:

Then we have newcomer Ituralde. Can his unenlightened accusation be attributed to ignorance? Let's see.



It has come to my attention that Senator Kommodus has openly declared that he will collaborate with the Rebels, if they would spare his life.

It would appear that he misuses the word "collaborate." The word collaborate implies cooperation, aid, assistance. I promised no such thing.

You see, even when not using my full analytical abilities, I remain one of the most dangerous foes of the rebels. I have many weapons at my disposal. I have only promised to withhold the use of my most dangerous weapons, which are formidable indeed, should the rebels spare my life.

And yet Ituralde has the nerve to accuse me of conspiracy with the rebels! My fellow senator, if true senator you be, I would have your head at this moment were it not for the respect I have for the democratic process!

With two strong suspects to choose from, I choose for now to vote: Ituralde. His mistaken move will only have the effect of serious harm to the senate. Let him explain himself! :rtwno:

Kommodus
12-18-2006, 01:14
Rereading the thread a bit more closely, I see my ultimatum has drawn criticism. Let me try to clear up a few points of misunderstanding.

1. It has been suggested that I promised to "not help" the senators if the rebels let me live. That was not what I promised - I will still use my analytical abilities. However, I have new, more deadly tools in development, which will not be used immediately as long as I live.

2. doc_bean has suggested that my words will serve only to confuse and draw attention away from the real guilty parties. I have a solution for this. Don't dwell on it. There is no hidden meaning in anything I've said - it's all the plain truth. Unless you feel you have reason to think otherwise, let it go at that and pursue other leads for now.

3. doc_bean further suggests that my ultimatum sets up a lose-lose situation for the senators. Properly understood, this is not the case. If the rebels kill me, the senate wins - every weapon in my arsenal is leveled at them. If the rebels and the senate let me live, the senate wins - I still expend considerable effort in my search for the guilty; just not quite what I would have otherwise. If the senate kills me, the senate loses, for they prove themselves unworthy and ungrateful for my help.

As I said before, don't waste too much effort thinking about me, for if you do I've failed in my intended purpose, which is to help the senate and to exceed my usual life expectancy. There are other, more worthy leads to follow up. For example, it's also important that we get the lurkers to post, lest they be allowed to fly under the radar.

Caius
12-18-2006, 02:24
Senators:
I, Caius Flaminius, think someone here is causing a diseaster.We must be joined in this diseaster, 2 of us have been killed and we must be strong of this situation.

So, my vote is for Reenk.
His "ultimatum" is not the solution to kill the responsibles. Neither is acussating a senator without a good reason.

JimBob
12-18-2006, 02:29
The unofficial vote count
Reenk-2(Don C. and Caius)
Kommodus-1(Ituralde)
Craterus-1(Aggony)
Ituralde-1(Kommodus)

In the interest of creating a tie and extending the round until those who haven't posted do so...
Vote: Ituralde

Reenk Roink
12-18-2006, 02:58
Senators:

Needless to say, I am disappointed so far at the speeches given. I will simplify my elocution for the plebeians among us and then set out to refute the slander against me shortly, however, I must attend to some matters presently...

Sasaki Kojiro
12-18-2006, 05:04
Oh https://img128.imageshack.us/img128/6800/emotwtcae8.gif

I was going to wait and see who went after Kommodus, reasoning that they would jump at a chance to eliminate him. But he is acting so suspicious that I can't blame anyone for voting him, in fact

Vote:Kommodus

You are acting different and that's the biggest mafia tell we're likely to get day one. Your method takes a few rounds to get data. If you are townie it wouldn't matter whether you were dead or not. In the past you've only showed minor annoyance at getting killed or lynched. Your concern with getting lynched this game means you have a role.

Reenk was just messin around getting into the spirit of things. Ituralde had good reason for his vote. An innocent Kommodus wouldn't go after them for this, he told me in TGF2 that he'd given up on psychoanalysis.

Ituralde
12-18-2006, 08:45
It would appear that he misuses the word "collaborate." The word collaborate implies cooperation, aid, assistance. I promised no such thing.

You withhold information from the Senate that could lead to the detection of the Rebels, why else would you do such a thing that ultimately hightens the chances of a Rebel win, if not to help them?

Furthermore doc_bean and I have brought forth similar arguments yet you choose to lynch me out of a grudge. You also haven't addressed the question of the Legate protection and why your life is so important to you in this game.
A dead Senator can still win the game.

I had followed a similar strategy to Sasaki waiting to see who else votes for you Kommodus. I have no intention of killing you yet. Killing Kommodus now would be indicative of helping the Mafia.

RL doesn't permit me to keep up this ruse any longer as I won't get to post before the end of election so I have to change my vote this early without getting more results.

Unvote: Kommodus
Vote: Abstain

doc_bean
12-18-2006, 09:06
3. doc_bean further suggests that my ultimatum sets up a lose-lose situation for the senators. Properly understood, this is not the case. If the rebels kill me, the senate wins - every weapon in my arsenal is leveled at them. If the rebels and the senate let me live, the senate wins - I still expend considerable effort in my search for the guilty; just not quite what I would have otherwise. If the senate kills me, the senate loses, for they prove themselves unworthy and ungrateful for my help.

Now now Kommodus, now it seems like you are almost issueing a challenge for us to lynch you and see how far we'll get. I agree with Sasaki that your behaviour is pretty suspicious, however I'm not convinced you're mafia yet, and you ARE indeed a valuable player, so keeping you alive might be in our best interest, for now.

Reenk has been acting very out of character this game, then again, I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt, since he got so much critisism lately for acting 'in character'. Still, massive turn around, could be suspicious.

Ituralde went straight for Kommodus, but then claims it was only a ruse, could eb true, could not be,

I'll have to think a little longer about who should die. for now I vote:abstain, but hope to change that beofre the end of the day.

Lord Winter
12-18-2006, 09:24
I'm not sure what to believe with Kommodus but I can understand where he's coming from. No one wants to be killed early in the game three games in the row. Until I get more evidence.

Vote:abstain

Peasant Phill
12-18-2006, 09:53
vote abstain

For the moment one can only guess. Kommodus did something nobody here did before and automaticly and logically drew attention to himself. This in itself is a great way (as a pro town role) to survive the first kills of the mafia. Added to this is the threat of the full use of his secret arsenal of mafia detection tools.
He, however, made himself very suspicous by using an unnessecary threat towards the town. I can't blame certain people to be very wary about such behavior. So I would suggest the preator to investigate Kommodus if he isn't lynched this round.

Sir Moody
12-18-2006, 13:22
Voting Closed

Reenk Roink
12-18-2006, 16:36
Voting Closed

Oh man. That's unfair, I was busy last night and had prepared a really good post. :disappointed:

Sir Moody
12-18-2006, 16:39
Csar Stood and cleared his throat, "It appears we have reached an end for this vote and 2 Senators have come out equal - both Senator Magnus Caput capitis, known to most as Reenk Roink and Senator Ituralde have 2 votes. To rectify this I once again open the floor, you may only vote for Reenk Roink or Ituralde,as always abstaining is an option - cast your votes well my friends"

Votes
Reenk Roink = 2 (Don Corleone, Caius Flaminius)
Ituralde = 2 (Kommodus, Jimbob)
Kommodus = 1 (Sasaki Kojiro)
Craterus = 1 (Aggony Duck)
abstain = 5 (GeneralHankerchief, Ituralde, Doc_bean, DestroyerofHope, Peasant Phill)

Vote are open until tomorrow at noon

Sir Moody
12-18-2006, 16:40
sorry Reenk i was actually 30 minutes past the deadline so was closed late...

Kommodus
12-18-2006, 16:46
Um... gah? I don't think the person being lynched this time has more than two votes.

Why are so few people voting?! :help:

It looks like I'll sqeak by this round, with only one vote against me (thank you very much Sasaki), but I'm not exactly what you'd call satisfied with that. Sasaki's right - participation = townspeople victory, while lack of participation = mafia victory.

I guess it's the holiday season; I'm sure my participation level will drop a bit in the coming weeks too. Still, there aren't many valid excuses for not even showing up. This game has fewer people than usual; that means the town has fewer chances. The mafia only need to survive six rounds at most - and that's assuming no mod-kills.

That's all I have to say about that...

As for Sasaki's accusation - yes, my behavior's changed for this game. Blatantly. And yes, I know that the goal here is not to survive, but to win; and further, I'm well aware that I can help the town even when dead. Heck, I'm one of the first ones here to say those very things - way back in Mafia II.

I play these games for the intellectual challenge. I've proven I have the ability to identify mafia - multiple times. However, survival has been a bit more elusive. I've been killed quickly in three straight games, and out of seven games I've survived only one - Mafia IV in which my tool nailed the mafia too quickly for them to kill me.

So this time I decided to try an experiment. I'm trying something that has never been tried before, just to see how well it will work. If no one ever tries new experiments, nothing new is ever learned. If I die because of it, so be it.

But remember, my promise still stands. You lynch me, I'm out - you'll have wasted a lynch thrown away one of your most helpful players. The mafia will probably win if you do this.

EDIT: Oops, I started typing this before Sir Moody's announcement of the tie. Hm...

Kommodus
12-18-2006, 17:03
Ituralde withdrew his vote for me, sparing me the unpleasantness of being part of a three-way tie. He's probably innocent.

In all honesty, Reenk is probably innocent too, but he seems (to me) to be the better bet. Besides, he has yet to die early in any game AFAIK. We may as well get this first round over with. Sasaki's right - my methods all need data in order to work.

Vote: Reenk Roink

Reenk Roink
12-18-2006, 17:14
The post that won't matter:


Addressed to the plebeians who cannot understand secondary school rhetoric:

My original post was an evaluation of the situation as Kommodus’ post was suspicious or at least odd, no?

Please reread these statements, or ask your mommy to read it to you:

“If you do (kill me), you can be sure that my full powers of deduction will be leveled against you. I'll take out all the stops, and you will certainly not escape. If, on the other hand, you allow me to live for a reasonable amount of time (say, four or five rounds), I may have mercy on you.”

“If you do (lynch me), you'll get no help from me. None. I'll figure out who the rebels are anyway, but I won't say a word, except to laugh at your bumbling attempts when you lynch innocent people. I'll understand if you find me suspicious later in the game and choose to lynch me (after say, four or five rounds). But show a little respect for my intelligence and don't off me with your usual knee-jerk reaction to everyone that tries to be helpful.”

Now, essentially, if Kommodus is a senator (that is in doubt), then doesn’t he seem like a very selfish person? After all, his help is conditional on how others treat him. I say good riddance to that.

Now, Kommodus was not killed last round. This can either mean:

1) Kommodus is a rebel, and cannot be killed by rebels.
2) Kommodus is a senator and intimidated the rebels into leaving him alive.
3) Kommodus is a senator and the rebels just didn’t care enough/at all about his post.

Now, if it is either 2 or 3, and Kommodus remains alive for several rounds (he’s already passed his biggest hurdle in round one), then he will be no help to us anyway, as stated by himself personally. He may even be grateful to the rebels and mislead us.

All of this is also discounting the fact that Kommodus may very well be a rebel, and certainly is one of the top suspects if not the main one.

Reenkaficsio doesn’t play this ****.

Now, back to present matters…

Addressed to the people who slandered me (Don Corleone and Caius Flaminius):

So you think me more worthy of a vote than Kommodus. This belief in itself is self refuting. Kommodus is clearly more suspicious than my flamboyant and eccentric self. I will indulge with you no longer because I have lost all hope for your reformation of character. I hope Thracian slaves eat your children! :stare:

Addressed to the Rebels:

Rebel slaves, your actions herald great news for us senators. You are either:

1) Timid as hell and thus easy to suppress. Your flimsy limbs may cause problems in your crucifixions however…
2) In league with Kommodus, in which you have drawn attention to him from now on. Do not expect Kommodus to be alive by the end, whether it be a triumph for the senate or the rebel slaves.
3) Aloof from it all. (least likely)

1 and 2 are clearly more plausible than 3, so I am unconcerned by you. As far as I can see, you are as much a threat as a one armed Samnite warrior with crappy triple disc armor.

Addressed to the rest:

My fellow senators, we must eliminate Kommodus this round. He stands above and beyond any other as a most plausible rebel. Now, I see that not many of you are taking a stand to defend me, Reenkaficsio. Some even think me suspicious and two slander me. Why? Because I am outspoken? Because I act instead of remaining passive like a woman or Persian? I ask you to recall, senators, that it was because of people like me that the menace of Carthage was finally snuffed out. If others had carried the day in the assembly, Rome would be a Punic colony thanks to a revitalized Carthaginian empire. It runs in my blood, the ability to act decisively. It was my father at Pydna, who rallied the troops that ran from the Macedonian onslaught and crushed them when they advanced on the broken and hilly terrain in pursuit. It was my grandfather at Cynoscephalae who broke through the left wing of the enemy and then attacked the right wing from the rear, sealing victory. So if you really want to kill Reenkaficsio, so be it. For my part, I want to kill the rebels, and there is no one who is more likely to be a rebel than Kommodus!

Vote: Kommodus

Edit: Hmm, it seems I won't be lynched (just yet). Ok, well I won't vote for Ituralde just yet, because I think it's Kommodus...

Interesting to see how Kommodus votes for me before I voted for him... :wink:

By the way Kommodus, I have died early in two of the three games before Mafia V.

doc_bean
12-18-2006, 17:19
Hmm, damn, I was a little preoccupied and forgot to actually vote for someone. Partly because I have no idea who to vote for this early, of course.

I don't know much about Ituralde, is this his first game or have we just been playing in different games ? His attack on Kommodus makes him somewhat suspicious, but then it could have been well intentioned.

Reenk really seems to make an effort this time, and that's not like him (sorry Reenk I know i've been one of the people most vocal against you abstain policy, and now I'm the one who has abstained :shame:).

Please people, post your thoughts, I need more to go on in order to chose, they both seem somewhat suspicious to me, so we might have a chance of hanging a mafiosi today.

Caius
12-18-2006, 17:36
Can someone abstain in this votation or i have to select only one?

Kommodus
12-18-2006, 17:50
Can someone abstain in this votation or i have to select only one?

You're allowed to abstain AFAIK.


By the way Kommodus, I have died early in two of the three games before Mafia V.

Ah, my mistake then. Refresh my memory - which games were those? I seem to remember you lasting quite a while in games like Mafia III and Cosa Nuova. You also survived Mafia IV; I don't remember how you fared in the Godfather series.

Ituralde
12-18-2006, 18:09
Seeing as I got into this situation by voting for Kommodus and then pulling back and having JimBob vote for me to create a tie, I really have little to say in my defense.

Anyone who has followed the thread should know that I targeted Kommodus because he acted suspicious/different. I withdrew my vote because I see no gain from lynching Kommdous.

Since someone has to die in the first round to get the game going and the chances for getting a Mafia first try are pretty low, I don't see much harm in lynching an innocent like me. It happens in most games anyway.

Reenk Roinks statements don't sound too suspicious too me either. Really sad that the two people standing on trial are the ones that have participated a bit more and stated their oppinions. No wonder so many didn't dare post or draw attention the last round.


My Dear friends! Fellow Senators!

With much grieve do I note that my open speculation about one of our own has put me in this dire situation with my comrade Reenk Roink. As one of us has to perish at the end of this day, self-preservation is the only option available to a true Roman. So I will have to cast my vote on Reenk Roink, though I beleive him innocent and would much rather have one of my apparently deaf and mute colleagues standing there, who were probably to engrossed in plotting their next kills to participate in our noble discussions.
If I die this day, know that my death will not be the end and my guidance shall still come to you.


Vote: Reenk Roink

Don Corleone
12-18-2006, 18:16
Reenk, I don't know if you're engaged in a failed attempt at humorous role-playing, but insulting me and calling me names, let alone misrepresenting my argument, is NOT going to get me to change my vote. As you're normally a pretty rational fellow, all it's doing to to is cement your guilt in my mind.

1) I BEGAN my post talking about how suspicious Kommodus was. I also concluded, for you to see (talk about needing reading lessons) that he was being too obvious.

2) You on the other hand insult the mafia and basically dare them to kill Kommodus. You stated that if the mafia didn't rise to your challenge and kill Kommodus, then Kommodus must be one of the mafia. How could you possibly have known ahead of time that Kommodus wasn't going to get assasinated? It looked (and even more so now) to me as though YOU knew he wasn't going to get assasinated, and YOU were trying to find a patsy to lynch in round one.

3) In every game up until the New Mafia and Mafia V, you've been big on abstaining, only answering challenges when somebody pointed a finger at you. In the last 2 games, you started acting very pro-actively. Surprise, surprise, you were mafia in both games. Now here you are doing it again.... what am I supposed to think?

4) I told you my mind was not hard and fast. I told you if I my thinking was flawed, explain to me where I went wrong. Instead, you decide to insult me and belittle me, saying that I don't even have a secondary school education. Kiss my ___, buddy. You're now #1 on my list from here on out.

Vote: Reenk

Dutch_guy
12-18-2006, 18:24
My fellow senators, we must eliminate Kommodus this round. He stands above and beyond any other as a most plausible rebel.

Uhm, statistically we all have the same chance of being selected as a rebel. A statement can't change that. it can only change the way how you feel towards a person's posts.

:balloon2:

Don Corleone
12-18-2006, 18:33
Wait a minute... I think I'm being played. Why would Reenk act like this, unless he WANTS me to vote for him.... giving him what he wants just plays into his hands.

I don't know what kind of game you're playing Reenk, but until I figure it out...

Unvote: Reenk
Vote: Abstain

GeneralHankerchief
12-18-2006, 18:33
:wall:

We're lynching two innocents here...

Vote: Reenk

No offense my dear Wanax, but I would like it if we got some later-game help from Kommodus. Sorry my good Senator. :no:

Reenk Roink
12-18-2006, 18:49
Errm this is getting out of hand...

Don (and potentially any others) I wasn't insulting you. I was kidding and going along with the game (just like your STFS thing). I really like the Roman themed thing, and just though I would have some fun by acting like a pompous senator. However, I'm terribly close to getting executed now, I guess my fun has ended. :shrug: :sad: Do host another one soon Sir Moody, I'd like to play this type of game again.

To address a few other things:

1) I never said that Kommodus was a rebel because the rebels didn't kill him. I'm never that absolute in these games. I put it forward as a possibility. I still think Kommodus is the best one to lynch (no offense Kommodus, but my reasons are in the spoilered post).

2) I don't know why people make such a big deal about me changing character. I do it so frequently in these games that it should be surprising when I do not change character, Early on, I started as a bad villager, adding people to the List. Then I had a change of heart and made a Fan Club. Then I started just lurking for a bit, and then abstaining, courteously when hosts got mad at lurkers. Then I stopped abstaining cause people got mad at me for abstaining and just voted for people, giving my reasons and explaining a lot, becoming incredibly more active than in any other game. Now I'm becoming a prick again like I started, but I'm trying to save the senate with my attitude. You track the personality changes; they happen when I'm Mafia and when I'm not.

3) Purely statistically, everyone has an even chance of being a rebel at all times. When Kommodus pointed me out in Mafia V, I still was (statistically) equally likely as all of you to be Mafia. Other things play a huge role in these games. Relying on stats alone is fallacy.

4) You can just not vote or abstain like me if you think I'm innocent by the way. I didn't vote for Ituralde because of that reason. Maybe we can get by without a lynch this round. (This means you Kommodus, Ituralde, and GeneralHankerchief).

5) Do read my spoilered post again. I think it contains valuable information on how to proceed. If you want, ignore the fun character and just read the info.

6) Before Mafia V, Sasaki's Black Hand games both ended quickly for me. In the first one, the whole town got destroyed, and in the second one, I was lynched early for abstaining, courteously. In Mafia IV, the game ended very early again. In The Godfather I, I was killed by Mafia in the 3rd round. Only in Mafia III, Sasaki's first Mafia game, and Cosa Nuevo did I survive long as a townie (in the first because I was a newbie and ignored (until my List), and in the second and thrid because I posted little and didn't vote much).

I'll be going now; sad that I can't continue in this game...

By the way:

Vote: Abstain, courteously :bow: and in spirit Vote: Kommodus!

Craterus
12-18-2006, 19:09
I do not think that it is in our advantage to abstain now. Thus I will cast my vote on someone and I've decided to cast my vote on Craterus. He has an uncanny ability to survive far in to the game, without really much posting anything and remaining as a great unknown throughout the whole game.

Vote: Craterus

Do you have something against me? A kill request in Black Hand 2 and now a "random" vote on me. So, maybe you could PM me about your grudge, cos I think I'm onto something here.

Vote: abstain
They're clearly both innocent and, in my eyes, Kommodus should be getting the lynch at this stage. Getting all self-important and childish... tssss. :zzz:

~;)

AggonyDuck
12-18-2006, 19:36
Sadly the game at this phase is very much like a lottery. You choose someone at random and hope that they are rebels. One thing though; the voting based on suspicious behaviour might not be the best option. I believe it is far more common for the rebels to continue acting as they have done previously, than to drastically change their behaviour.

Craterus, I don't have anything against you except the fact that you have a tendency to stay under the radar and survive to the endgame. I've already played a couple of games where you have been a "unknown" at the end game and I'd rather not have such a situation again.

EDIT: Forgot my vote. My vote goes for Reenk Roink. Of the two he is the one being a bit more suspicious, although what value that has remains to be seen.

Vote: Reenk Roink

Crazed Rabbit
12-18-2006, 19:45
So, before I had the chance to make two posts in this thread, I am slain by the despicable rebels.

Not only does go against the long standing tradition of killing me off at the very end of the game, it does my constitution no good.

In vengence, then, I shall work from the dead to hunt down these rebels and give them a rebel's death. I shall not rest until they are undone, slain, their estates razed and their lineage destroyed.

I retire momentarily, to analyse the transpirings. But I shall make them deeply regret their slaughter of mine person.

CR
PS

Vote: Abstain, courteously
What in hell goes on in New York?!:laugh4:

Caius
12-18-2006, 20:01
Senators:
I cant tolate this!.First, an opinion who says "Lets kill Kommodus, because I want" and second a quote:

I hope Thracian slaves eat your children!
Is this a threat?The Senators doesnt make threats.
You are making a big mistake, and the worse thing is you are making twice.My vote(again!):

Vote:Reenk
He hasnt demostrated Kommodus is a rebel.Why he is saying that?
I want an Explication

Caius Flaminius

Sasaki Kojiro
12-18-2006, 20:50
wth they're both innocent. It's quite likely that Kommodus is guilty so I'll

Vote:Ituralde

because Reenk seems likely to vote for Kommodus.

Xiahou
12-18-2006, 21:17
Vote:Ituralde

His vote and quick retraction struck me as more suspicious than Reenk's roleplaying. Sadly, I dithered too long to get in on the initial round of voting... :shame:

Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.

Reenk Roink
12-18-2006, 21:28
For Jupiter's sake I've explained this too many times! :wall:


My original post was an evaluation of the situation as Kommodus’ post was suspicious or at least odd, no?

“If you do (kill me), you can be sure that my full powers of deduction will be leveled against you. I'll take out all the stops, and you will certainly not escape. If, on the other hand, you allow me to live for a reasonable amount of time (say, four or five rounds), I may have mercy on you.”

“If you do (lynch me), you'll get no help from me. None. I'll figure out who the rebels are anyway, but I won't say a word, except to laugh at your bumbling attempts when you lynch innocent people. I'll understand if you find me suspicious later in the game and choose to lynch me (after say, four or five rounds). But show a little respect for my intelligence and don't off me with your usual knee-jerk reaction to everyone that tries to be helpful.”

Let's also look at the possibilities:


Now, Kommodus was not killed last round. This can either mean:

1) Kommodus is a rebel, and cannot be killed by rebels.
2) Kommodus is a senator and intimidated the rebels into leaving him alive.
3) Kommodus is a senator and the rebels just didn’t care enough/at all about his post.

Now, if it is either 2 or 3, and Kommodus remains alive for several rounds (he’s already passed his biggest hurdle in round one), then he will be no help to us anyway, as stated by himself personally. He may even be grateful to the rebels and mislead us.

All of this is also discounting the fact that Kommodus may very well be a rebel, and certainly is one of the top suspects if not the main one.

It is clear that Kommodus is our best lynch!

And another thing, why hasn't anyone responded to this post? (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1355137&postcount=84)

I mean venusdammit! I've addressed all the charges against me, clarified my posts, and called out people who vote for me for not good reason.

Sir Moody, please tell me when voting ends. I'll die if I must, but seriously, I would have been much rather lynched when I deserved it then now! :stare:

Caius
12-18-2006, 21:57
Hm...i am thinking in making a good mistake, but

Unvote:Reenk
Vote:Abstain

Don Corleone
12-18-2006, 22:09
It is clear that Kommodus is our best lynch!
He's not an option right now.


And another thing, why hasn't anyone responded to this post? (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1355137&postcount=84) I changed my vote back to abstain before you made it.



I mean venusdammit! I've addressed all the charges against me, clarified my posts, and called out people who vote for me for not good reason. See, there's a world of difference between saying I'm not certain and saying there's no good reason. And if you were looking at this objectively, you would see that. Maybe 'lynch Kommodus or else he's a rebel' wasn't the hard and fast rule of your posts, but it is certainly a reasonable take. Again, you're acting out of character. Surely you know you look suspicious. Rather than addressing it (which you did), and leaving it be (which you're not), you're continuing to be provocative and suggesting that anybody that doesn't agree with you 100% isn't employing sound reason. You're making me want to change my vote back. But one thing I've learned in these games is that I've got to learn to quit anger-voting and try to remain as logical as possible. So for now, unless you start acting even more bizarre, I'm leaving the status quo.

I know one thing. Half the Senate not even bothering to abstain doesn't make me like our odds right now... :no:

Xiahou
12-18-2006, 22:18
I know one thing. Half the Senate not even bothering to abstain doesn't make me like our odds right now... :no:What's the WoG rule for this game? I suspect we'll see the grim reaper doing the rebel's work for them before long. :no:

Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.

Caius
12-18-2006, 22:20
What's the WoG rule for this game? I suspect we'll see the grim reaper doing the rebel's work for them before long. :no:

Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.
WoG rule?

Don Corleone
12-18-2006, 22:47
WoG rule?

WoG = Wrath of God. Bascially, participate or perish. If people don't contribute to the discussion and/or the voting, at a certain point Sir Moody will kill them off automatically, for not participating.

Xiahou
12-18-2006, 22:47
WoG rule?
Wrath of God- mod elimination of inactive participants.

Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.

Caius
12-18-2006, 22:55
I think if it is activated, many members will lose

Csargo
12-18-2006, 23:05
I cannot die for I AM INVINCIBLE!!!!!!

Kommodus
12-18-2006, 23:07
Reenk... I can't help but think that this whole thing could've been avoided if it hadn't been for a tragic misunderstanding.



1) Kommodus is a rebel, and cannot be killed by rebels.
2) Kommodus is a senator and intimidated the rebels into leaving him alive.
3) Kommodus is a senator and the rebels just didn’t care enough/at all about his post.

Now, if it is either 2 or 3, and Kommodus remains alive for several rounds (he’s already passed his biggest hurdle in round one), then he will be no help to us anyway, as stated by himself personally. He may even be grateful to the rebels and mislead us.

Now I'm certain it is either 2 or 3 (and very possibly 3 as there is no real reason to think that the rebels were affected by my post). They very well may not have planned to kill me anyway.

However, your implication that I will be no help to the senate is false, for a number of reasons. I wonder if you misunderstood what I said.

I never said I wouldn't help. Originally I simply said "I may have mercy on you (if you don't kill me)." Later I clarified this to mean I would withhold the use of some of my newest and most dangerous tools - but only for a time. Again and again I've explained this; but I wonder if you read my posts?

My originally speech was, as I've said before, an experiment. I thought there were several possible good results that could come of it.

1. The rebels might have been goaded into killing me, proving my innocence.

2. I might've drawn some rebels out into the open, as they would surely be very pleased to see me lynched and withdraw from the game.

3. I might actually survive late into the game, giving myself a chance to cast an accurate vote against the rebels.

An unwanted side effect that did occur, however, was that now everyone's focused on the question of my guilt or innocence, rather than pursuing other avenues. I guess I should've predicted that. If the trend continues, it will do more harm than good to the senate.

Reenk (and Sasaki), I knew that everything I was saying was very suspicious. Do either of you really think I'm that dumb? Regardless, I apologize for the trouble and misunderstandings. Not every experiment is a success...

Meh. At least I gave us all something to talk about during round one. Hopefully some clues have emerged that will be useful later on.

Csargo
12-18-2006, 23:12
Vote: Sasaki Kojiro NOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:guitarist:

Sir Moody
12-18-2006, 23:17
Reenk the voting will close at some point after 12 gmt - it depends on when my Lunch break is at work... busy day tomorrow we have a Manager coming down to inspect the monkeys doing the programming (that would be me) so could be anytime between 12pm and 3pm GMT

Sasaki Kojiro
12-18-2006, 23:26
Reenk (and Sasaki), I knew that everything I was saying was very suspicious. Do either of you really think I'm that dumb?[quote]

It's entirely possible.

[quote] Regardless, I apologize for the trouble and misunderstandings. Not every experiment is a success...

Meh. At least I gave us all something to talk about during round one. Hopefully some clues have emerged that will be useful later on.

The fact that what was presented as a serious statement is now merely an "experiment" suggests that you didn't realize people would think it was suspicious. You're sound surprised, therefore this reaction was not expected so it wouldn't have been "dumb" as mafia.

You sound guilty.

Reenk Roink
12-18-2006, 23:27
See, there's a world of difference between saying I'm not certain and saying there's no good reason. And if you were looking at this objectively, you would see that. Maybe 'lynch Kommodus or else he's a rebel' wasn't the hard and fast rule of your posts, but it is certainly a reasonable take. Again, you're acting out of character. Surely you know you look suspicious. Rather than addressing it (which you did), and leaving it be (which you're not), you're continuing to be provocative and suggesting that anybody that doesn't agree with you 100% isn't employing sound reason. You're making me want to change my vote back. But one thing I've learned in these games is that I've got to learn to quit anger-voting and try to remain as logical as possible. So for now, unless you start acting even more bizarre, I'm leaving the status quo.

I know one thing. Half the Senate not even bothering to abstain doesn't make me like our odds right now... :no:

Don! I am just speechless now! :wall:

I don't know how you could have misinterpreted all my posts like that. You are jumping to very wrong conclusions, and I feel obliged as well as frustrated to respond like this:

On my reasons for lynching Kommodus: :stupido:

I based my position on two things:

1) Kommodus’ odd post.
2) His helpfulness to us.

1 is self explanatory isn’t it? Everyone raised an eyebrow at the post.

2 is based on theoretical outcomes.

There are 4 possibilities with regard to Kommodus’ life:

1) Senators try to kill him and the Rebels leave him.
2) Rebels kill him and the Senators leave him.
3) Senators try to kill him and the Rebels kill him.
4) Senators leave him and the Rebels leave him.

For 1, he definitely will not help us.
For 2 he may help us.
For 3, it will depend on who pisses him off more.
For 4 he will "show mercy" to the rebels (thus not helping us).

Note that Kommodus has survived one round.

My pushing for Kommodus’ execution is a plausible case. I freely admit it can be wrong, but based on what Kommodus said, he was the best lynch for us.

Never did I say that Kommodus was guilty or speak in any absolutes. You are reading this into my posts for whatever reason.

On my insults: :stupido:

For God’s sake Don, I don’t know how you took my posts to be anything but me playing in character and joking around. I clearly am acting like a pompous Roman senator, putting quite a bit of contextual clues in my post.

Your Strike For The South comment was much less obvious of a joke than mine and yet everyone thought it was a joke.

On my acting out of character: :stupido:

First, I think that I have made it clear that I changed character many times. Here is my earlier response to that:


I don't know why people make such a big deal about me changing character. I do it so frequently in these games that it should be surprising when I do not change character, Early on, I started as a bad villager, adding people to the List. Then I had a change of heart and made a Fan Club. Then I started just lurking for a bit, and then abstaining, courteously when hosts got mad at lurkers. Then I stopped abstaining cause people got mad at me for abstaining and just voted for people, giving my reasons and explaining a lot, becoming incredibly more active than in any other game. Now I'm becoming a prick again like I started, but I'm trying to save the senate with my attitude. You track the personality changes; they happen when I'm Mafia and when I'm not.

You say: “In the last 2 games, you started acting very pro-actively. Surprise, surprise, you were mafia in both games. Now here you are doing it again.... what am I supposed to think?”

I reply: Don, in the last two games, I have started off not trying to draw any attention to myself, and being the opposite of what you claim. In Mafia V I was upset that so much attention was drawn to me so early on, and I disappeared for the next three rounds. In Rise of the Mob I stayed quiet until Sigurd Fafnesbane called me out. You are mistaken.

And finally, this:


...you're continuing to be provocative and suggesting that anybody that doesn't agree with you 100% isn't employing sound reason...

First, I don’t know why you take my acting like a Roman senator as provocative. Sure, Reenkaficsio is a outspoken blowhard, but I’m just playing along with the theme. The content of my post is the important part, and the content is what has been ignored. Seriously people, look at my arguments, that I have stripped of the Roman theme.

Second, I’m not suggesting anything of the sort.

Reenk Roink
12-18-2006, 23:33
@ Sir Moody: :bow:

@ Kommodus: All right, thanks for the clarification Kommodus. My case was essentially based on the fact that you sounded very callous and selfish in your post. I saw no reason to let you live as a townie if you would not help us. Now that that part of my case is gone, it rests on your odd posts, which while relevant and suspicious, still cause me to rescind my ultimatum.

GeneralHankerchief
12-18-2006, 23:40
Gah... everyone change their vote to No Lynch.

If we can't do that, then just abstain.

Unvote: Reenkius
Vote: No Lynch/Abstain

Csargo
12-18-2006, 23:44
Gah... everyone change their vote to No Lynch.

If we can't do that, then just abstain.

Unvote: Reenkius
Vote: No Lynch/Abstain

Then I won't get to execute anyone. :no:

Proletariat
12-18-2006, 23:48
Been busy, catching up.

Vote: No Lynch

Caius
12-18-2006, 23:52
Count of Votes please?

Sasaki Kojiro
12-18-2006, 23:54
Are we allowed to vote no lynch?

Caius
12-18-2006, 23:58
Then I won't get to execute anyone

Still 1 vote for Reenk.And 2 for Ituralde.

JimBob
12-19-2006, 00:33
3 votes for Reenk (Kommodus, Ituralde, and Aggony) 2 for Ituralde (Sasaki and Xiahou)
Same game plan on my part sorry Ituralde...
Vote: Ituralde

We haven't heard at all from Destroyer of Hope, Masy, Peasant Phil, and Dutch_guy. I'm for gridlock until they show their faces. We have not heard much from Kage, Craterus, and Prole. Still the first round technically so not horrible. My 2 cents

Don Corleone
12-19-2006, 00:52
Okay, Reenk. My apologies for taking offense where none was intended. I actually didn't get that you were role-playing, as you had a similar rant about how intellectually challenged your detractors were at the end of New Mafia, but you do have a point. I am convinced and will henceforth set about trying to role-play a little myself (I'm sure we could use a wine-addled old veteran that's better equipped to the saddle than the senate floor).

Seriously, I'm actually not really all that suspicious of anybody who's been posting so far anymore. What we've lacked in quantity of contributors we've made up for in quality of contributors. We've had some pretty decent discussions for the first round, when, let's face it, we're all standing around shrugging saying "I dunno, did YOU do it?" :shrug:

Reenk Roink
12-19-2006, 02:32
...as you had a similar rant about how intellectually challenged your detractors were at the end of New Mafia...

Just a little more clarification, that "partial intelligence" comment meant that Sigurd only had part of the story of my statement of Csar, nothing insulting his intelligence either.

Anyway, I guess I could break the tie but I would rather every just abstain and not lynch anyone this round. :wink:

Lord Winter
12-19-2006, 04:50
As I stated in my last post, I don't think we should penalize Reenk for trying to play in character. If he was mafia wouldn't it make more seance to keep to the background and not draw any suspicions? Ituralde's accusing Kommodous doesnt seem a very good reason either. The rebels know the risk and wouldn't be likely to except the bait. Beside his strategy, which kind of reminds me of Saskii's, has worked well for the town in the past. In conclusion I agree with General H. and Vote: No Lynch

Also @ JimBob why are you always voting for a tie? It would be much better for the town to get two more kills and thus more evidence to find the mafia?

JimBob
12-19-2006, 05:16
Also @ JimBob why are you always voting for a tie? It would be much better for the town to get two more kills and thus more evidence to find the mafia?
Its an idea I had based on something someone said in New Mafia. Basically the first round is a crap shoot, so I say extend it and suck three rounds out of it. Someone might slip, you get more people talking and more ideas floated, more bad ideas shot down before the mafia gets to use them to confuse the town. More information equals more chance of a town win. And the mafia doesn't off someone. That and I wanted to stretch it out and bring some of the lurkers in, I don't like people who don't post(see New Mafia for my main reason). My idea has had some good and bad, we'll have to wait and see.

doc_bean
12-19-2006, 09:22
Hmm, so we have a tie now ? I'm still unsure what to make of Reenks behaviour, and Iturlade is a big unknown.

Tough choices, tough choices...

Sir Moody
12-19-2006, 10:18
sorry all No-lynch is not an option - ill allow it in normal votes but in this tie you must vote or abstain - im not sure what i will do in another draw i mite just lynch both so we can keep going - keep that in mind

doc_bean
12-19-2006, 10:21
:sigh:

It pains me, but I just can't keep abstaining, it's against my principles.

Vote:Reenk

Sorry man, if you are just role playing then I'll feel pretty bad about this, but you are the more suspicious of the two :shame:

Peasant Phill
12-19-2006, 10:38
My fellow senators,

The rebels in our midst have won their first battle. They have manipulated us to kill somebody most of us are reluctant to do. Both Ituralde as Reenk Roink are more the victim of their own voting than of evidence provided against them.
Alas, we still have to chose. As we can't let ourselves be lead by suspicions we have to let ourselves be lead by another criterium. Let usefulness be that criterium in order to minimize the loss we have already led.

vote: Ituralde

Ituralde
12-19-2006, 11:23
Once again it's a tie which doesn't surprise me considering who is standing on trial. Reading through Reenk Roinks lenghty posts defending his decisions they are the same as my initial reason. It looked like Kommodus was creating a situation where the town would never benefit from his survival. Although he has cleared some of that up, I still remain suspicious of him. Having him lynched this early only helps the Rebels, so my intention was never to place the final vote on him, because that would have just been stupid.
However he's not off my radar and I intend to pick up his case in the later rounds if I survive this round.
So Sasaki Kojiro, if you want the person to live that will help you kick off Kommodus later you're definitely lynching the wrong guy, because Reenk Roink has said that he understands Kommodus reasons and is not as suspicious of him anymore.

I have said before that the first round will have the highest chance of lynching an innocent, but it is something that has to happen. This is particulary depressing as JimBob has voted the second time against me just to create a tie. To think that we'll get by without a lynch is an illusion. It's how the game works: The Mafia kills, the Town lynches.

It's sad to see that Peasant Phill votes for me because he doesn't think I'm helpful for the Senate. Well this is my first game of this kind and I'm trying my best. Just rest assured that dead or alive I'll try to hunt down the Rebels amongst us.

If push comes to shove and there's still a tie at noon I will redirect my vote. Sir Moody has said that he would probably kill us both if the tie is extended. Now lynching one innocent is to be suspected, but loosing two innocents is cleary a loss for the Senate and thus a gain for the Rebels.

Wait and see...

Ituralde
12-19-2006, 12:14
Looks like my appeal came a bit too late. So before Sir Moody kills two innocents I have to intervene:

Unvote: Reenk Roink
Vote: Abstain

Peasant Phill
12-19-2006, 12:51
It's sad to see that Peasant Phill votes for me because he doesn't think I'm helpful for the Senate. Well this is my first game of this kind and I'm trying my best. Just rest assured that dead or alive I'll try to hunt down the Rebels amongst us.

Drama, drama.
I didn't say you wouldn't be helpful, I said that I thought Reenk Roink would be more helpful. You're a great unknown as somebody here already said.

Sir Moody
12-19-2006, 13:04
Voting Closed - results will be up shortly

Sir Moody
12-19-2006, 13:25
The floor grows quiet and csar stands. "Well it appears you dithering old fools have finally come to a consensus - and only then by Noble Ituralde sacrificing himself, I hope you are all ashamed that such a noble man would throw himself on his own sword in the name of justice! I herby announce that the method of 'punishment' will be noble Suicide so that Ituralde can die with honour." A guard hands Csar a Gladius which he promptly accepts and hands too Ituralde. "Any last words my friend?”. Ituralde pauses as though thinking and then nods "To Justice!" and plunges the sword into his stomach and collapses dead. Csar wipes a tear from his eye and proclaims "In Honour of our fallen comrade I declare this meeting adjourned until tomorrow let us hope we have caught a Rebel although I very much doubt it!"

Votes
Ituralde = 4 (Sasaki Kojiro, Xiahou, Jimbob, Peasant Phill)
Reenk Roink = 3 (Kommodus, Aggony Duck, Doc_bean)
Adstain = 7 (Reenk Roink, Craterus, Caius Flaminius, General hankerchief, Proletariant, Ituralde, Don C)

Alive
Sasaki Kojiro
Don Corleone
Kagemusha
Kommodus
Destroyer of Hope
Caius Flaminius
Csar
GeneralHankerchief
doc_bean
Craterus
Reenk Roink
Xiahou
Peasant Phill
AggonyDuck
Proletariat
Dutch_guy
JimBob

Dead
Crazed Rabbit
Masy

Executed
Ituralde

Night phase begins PM's Please - Next day will begin at around noon Tommorow

EDIT
sorry all i missed Don C's Abstain no change on the lynch tho but added for future reference to who voted

Kommodus
12-19-2006, 15:18
Ituralde, nooooooo... ~:mecry:

I was convinced of your innocence, and I wanted you to live to play more. It's rough to be the first to get lynched when it's your first game. It's happened before, unfortunately. Don't let it get you down. I'll be starting a game of my own sometime in January and would love for you to be a part of it.

I personally apologize for being one of the two who cast a vote to get you into the tie-breaker. It was a mistake. :shame:

You will be avenged, if I have any say in the matter.

Sasaki Kojiro
12-19-2006, 15:37
Kommodus is acting differently. He admits this. This gives us two possibilities:

A) He is mafia
B) He is town acting weird

Now, say we leave him alive. In the case of B, he helps us find mafia. In the case of A, WE LOSE. It's not advantageous to leave him alive, we can't trust him at all unless he's been killed by the mafia anyway. He must by lynched.


And sorry about that Ituralde, I'd have changed if I'd come back in time.

Reenk Roink
12-19-2006, 15:39
Addressed to the Senators: :stupido:

Look at how strife laden this very first night has been. I mocked the rebel slaves for their impotence and effete cowardice, but the senate itself is clearly paranoid because of them and filled with treachery! :stare:

You forced the issue between two good Romans, or perhaps, even both of them! :stare:

Now, one is dead, and you have no one but yourselves to blame. The pansy rebel slaves are not responsible for this recent madness! :stare:

Rome needs Reenkaficsio as emperor! :yes:

As desiring I am and deserving you are of my continued beration, I must turn the floor to more pressing issues:

We must act quickly to crush these rebel slaves.

Praetor, please investigate Kommodus if you have not done so. Although his clarification removes the "best to lynch" clause of my argument, he still remains the most suspicious member of the Senate. If you find compelling evidence tying him with the rebel slaves, bring it to the senate floor immediately!

We should give the Praetor up to third night to come with news. If he does not, then we can plausibly assume that he has gotten a chance to investigate Kommodus and he is innocent. Again, this is not certain, as Praetor's in the past have been less than reliable and prone to corruption, but then again, nothing is absolutely certain.

Kommodus is an enigma to us. We must make sure that he does not harm us, and we should try to have him maximize utility for us as well!

Reenkaficsio moves to personally oversee the planning of the execution should it happen.

He already has a great idea :idea::

We put a oil soaked Kommodus up on a crucifix in the middle of an arena. The 13 lions circling around him will then devour his children in front of his eyes to increase their bloodlust for him. After that deed is done, the lions will be released to attack Kommodus while at the same time, he is ignited, as we do not want those expensive imported lions to suffer food poisoning eating uncooked Kommodus.

Addressed to the noble Senator Ituralde: :stupido:

My good man, you are a true blooded Roman. You acted decisively, as I did in the beginning to push the case against Kommodus.

I don not know why you abstained afterward, but I understand that the pressure was on you, and you had to think for your family. It is fitting that a Roman respect familial bonds.

Your vote for me is pardoned completely, I again understand that family is first.

Still, your noble act of sacrifice shall not be forgotten. I shall make sure to take care of your estate and family, and have you immortalized with statues and games! My third son will be named after you. :bow: I am proud to say I never was unjust to this great man and to myself by voting for him.

I cannot help but wonder if you had just kept your vote for Kommodus in the first place, this would have never happened.

But then again, I am to blame as well...

If only I had left my concubine's side to cast my vote before closing in the first place... :shame:

Sasaki Kojiro
12-19-2006, 15:42
I disagree, we should just lynch Kommodus and leave the Praetor to find the 2nd mafioso.

AggonyDuck
12-19-2006, 16:10
I'm not so convinced over Kommodus guilt. I believe if he was a rebel then he would propably not have posted it. It pretty much effectively dooms him in the end, because it will bring upon him suspicion and unless a Praetor cleans his name he ends up being a big suspect until the end. Also, correct me if I'm wrong, but usually the last thing a rebel/mafioso wants is attention in the first rounds, especially attention like this that really doesn't serve to further his cause.

But on the other hand if Kommodus was the Praetor things would suddenly make sense. He would be afraid of being targeted by the mafia early on and thus to buy time make himself a highly suspicious post asking the rebels not to kill him. It would make sense to a degree.

Anyway currently the game seems like a lottery as does the start of every mafia game. We'll just have to proceed on and eventually we should start to get a proper feel of the game and the different senators.

Kommodus
12-19-2006, 16:49
Oh Sasaki, once again you are so tragically, tragically wrong about me. It's Ok though, I still love you anyway. ~:grouphug:




Reenk (and Sasaki), I knew that everything I was saying was very suspicious. Do either of you really think I'm that dumb?

It's entirely possible.

Um, no.


The fact that what was presented as a serious statement is now merely an "experiment" suggests that you didn't realize people would think it was suspicious. You're sound surprised, therefore this reaction was not expected so it wouldn't have been "dumb" as mafia.

It was both a serious statement and an experiment. The promises I made, both to the rebels and to the senators, remain true.


I disagree, we should just lynch Kommodus and leave the Praetor to find the 2nd mafioso.

~:rolleyes:

Do it if you want to, I guess. It's been a while since the mafia have pulled off a win.

Sasaki Kojiro
12-19-2006, 17:59
I'm not so convinced over Kommodus guilt. I believe if he was a rebel then he would propably not have posted it. It pretty much effectively dooms him in the end, because it will bring upon him suspicion and unless a Praetor cleans his name he ends up being a big suspect until the end. Also, correct me if I'm wrong, but usually the last thing a rebel/mafioso wants is attention in the first rounds, especially attention like this that really doesn't serve to further his cause.

But on the other hand if Kommodus was the Praetor things would suddenly make sense. He would be afraid of being targeted by the mafia early on and thus to buy time make himself a highly suspicious post asking the rebels not to kill him. It would make sense to a degree.

Anyway currently the game seems like a lottery as does the start of every mafia game. We'll just have to proceed on and eventually we should start to get a proper feel of the game and the different senators.

It's not a good idea to draw attention to yourself if you are the praetor either. But what makes you think he knew that post would draw attention? He seems surprised, therefore he didn't know it would draw attention. It's more likely he intended that post to be a "this is why I'm still alive" thing.


And Kommodus, I didn't think you were mafia in TGF2. I just said you were a good lynch.

Masy
12-19-2006, 18:40
Jeez, thats twice now I have been killed in the first round. Pick on someone else next time please? I have just recovered from a bad spate of flu, and was hoping to cheer myself up with a bit of light hearted mind gaming...

Say, Sir Moody, are we allowed to participate once dead in this one (what with it being a historical version and all)? Cos these slaves have really upset me. :thumbsdown:

Sir Moody
12-19-2006, 18:53
yes you can speak from the grave - the romans had many priests who "claimed" they could speak for the dead so no reason why you cant its up to you

Kommodus
12-19-2006, 19:50
But what makes you think he knew that post would draw attention? He seems surprised, therefore he didn't know it would draw attention. It's more likely he intended that post to be a "this is why I'm still alive" thing.

Er... that's a joke, right? :inquisitive:

Maybe I should quote myself here (this is from my original speech):


Now, I know how this post will be interpreted by my fellow townspeople/regular senators. "Oh," you'll think, "he's just trying to provide himself a good cover/alibi. He knows we'll suspect him when he stays alive for an unusually long period of time."

Yeah, Sasaki, your keen "insight" really caught me off guard there. I thought no one would notice I'd even said anything. How on earth did you figure me out? :dizzy2:

The only thing I found mildly surprising was that everyone became totally fixated on it, at the expense of talking about anything else. That's not what I had in mind originally, since it doesn't help the senate.

Thus you have two choices:


1. Lynch me. You waste a lynch on an innocent person and lose any help I might've given you, but hey, at least you get rid of someone Sasaki can't trust.

2. Let me live and pursue other leads. The rebels will eventually kill me, but my methods will almost certainly identify them and we'll win.

Time to choose.

Ituralde
12-19-2006, 20:11
Sure did good to hear your condolence about my death, but there really are no hard feelings. An innocent gets lynched in most Mafia games after the first day and it might as well be me. We had a lot of discussion because of it and that's always good for the game.


Drama, drama.
I didn't say you wouldn't be helpful, I said that I thought Reenk Roink would be more helpful. You're a great unknown as somebody here already said.

Couldn't resist to get a little bit cheesy there. :beam:



Instead of focusing on Kommodus again next round I would have cast my vote to one of the people that haven't contributed much in the past to get a statement out of them. Maybe Sigurd, although his chances for getting WoGed are pretty high.

While Kommodus remains susect there really is no good reason for lynching him yet. Why get him on the bad side of the Senate if you don't have to. Just let him surviev one or two more rounds and then finish him. I totally agree that he's too suspicious to be left alive in the end game, but that's probably true for most of you. :yes:


That's all I've got to say from the grave before the next killing. Thanks to Csar for letting me die honourably, I'm sure Senator Ituralde would not have wanted to go any other way. :2thumbsup:

Caius
12-19-2006, 20:24
Addressed to the Senators: :stupido:
...
Rome needs Reenkaficsio as emperor! :yes:
...
He already has a great idea :idea::

We put a oil soaked Kommodus up on a crucifix in the middle of an arena. The 13 lions circling around him will then devour his children in front of his eyes to increase their bloodlust for him. After that deed is done, the lions will be released to attack Kommodus while at the same time, he is ignited, as we do not want those expensive imported lions to suffer food poisoning eating uncooked Kommodus.


Is this a joke?:inquisitive:

Crazed Rabbit
12-19-2006, 21:19
A cold wind blows through the temple, and a voice is heard...

"Curse the underworld, which is woefully short of fresh carrots! Also, were I Praetor, I would investigate Sasaki and Kommodus...

Then the voice is gone, and a half eaten carrot remains on the floor.

AggonyDuck
12-19-2006, 22:09
It's not a good idea to draw attention to yourself if you are the praetor either. But what makes you think he knew that post would draw attention? He seems surprised, therefore he didn't know it would draw attention. It's more likely he intended that post to be a "this is why I'm still alive" thing.

You might be correct. I've never had a gift for logical reasoning really, atleast in mafia games. Somehow this is a game where logic sometimes misleads you, while a gut feeling might be correct again.

Kommodus
12-19-2006, 23:21
You might be correct. I've never had a gift for logical reasoning really, atleast in mafia games. Somehow this is a game where logic sometimes misleads you, while a gut feeling might be correct again.

So, what does your Mighty Gut (tm) tell you about me?

AggonyDuck
12-19-2006, 23:33
It's a bit early to make any decisions based on gut yet. I first need to develop a feel for the game and everyone's behaviour. My logic is saying no about you being mafia, but my gut is yet undecided. Might need atleast three or four rounds to get a proper feel.

EDIT: Even then I don't think my gut is as reliable as I sometimes tend to believe that it is.

Sasaki Kojiro
12-19-2006, 23:57
Er... that's a joke, right? :inquisitive:

Maybe I should quote myself here (this is from my original speech):



Yeah, Sasaki, your keen "insight" really caught me off guard there. I thought no one would notice I'd even said anything. How on earth did you figure me out? :dizzy2:

The only thing I found mildly surprising was that everyone became totally fixated on it, at the expense of talking about anything else. That's not what I had in mind originally, since it doesn't help the senate.



Dude, you said that because you were trying to give an alibi. Just because you realized your post might be viewed that way doesn't mean it wasn't intended that way. In fact providing excuses before the fact is a common mafia tell.


BUT we can't ignore the rest of the town in this debate. Surely you see you're no help to the town now unless you are killed though.

Don Corleone
12-20-2006, 00:33
Are we voting again? I thought there was another round of kills first....

If Kommodus had made his big pronouncement, then disappeared, I'd be tempted to think of him as guilty. But he's actually been pretty active, and he's explained himself pretty well. After he did that, his original post doesn't come off as all that extreme. And like he said, the game becomes an elaborte tic-tac-toe if you don't mix it up periodically.

I'm actually way more interested in what's going on in the Hall of Silence. We had a pretty dramatic first vote, and a bunch of folks couldn't be bothered to say boo. Any chance we could nudge a few folks into actually saying something?

Csargo
12-20-2006, 00:52
Umm since I'm innocent can the Praetor PM me who he's investigating.

Caius
12-20-2006, 00:53
Are we voting again?
I am asking the same question.
Some senators arent active.Do I a list of these people such as slaves?Maybe they will respond if they are acussated.

and one more thing.I think the 3 senators, Masy, "the Crazed Rabbit" and Ituralde,wll, they are dead, but what about asking they what they think about this enigma?

Csargo
12-20-2006, 01:00
Dutch_guy 3
Crazed Rabbit 3 :thumbsdown:
Destroyer of Hope 3
Proletariat 2
Masy 2 :thumbsdown:
Sigurd Fafnesbane 1

Caius
12-20-2006, 01:02
Dutch_guy 3
Crazed Rabbit 3 :thumbsdown:
Destroyer of Hope 3
Proletariat 2
Masy 2 :thumbsdown:
Sigurd Fafnesbane 1
What are this numbers?

Sir Moody
12-20-2006, 01:10
number of posts - and no csar the praetor shouldnt pm you he/she is only allowed to reveal to all at once - even you

Reenk Roink
12-20-2006, 01:34
So, what does your Mighty Gut (tm) tell you about me?

My gut tells me that your a big, guilty poop who is a pain to expel... :laugh4:

Just kidding of course, though you do need to be investigated. :bow:

Csargo
12-20-2006, 04:15
What are this numbers?

Lurkers my friend, Lurkers

Csargo
12-20-2006, 06:56
Lynch'em both. Sasaki and Kommodus. Let God sort 'em out.

Sasaki is a bit too eager to lynch Kommodus if you ask me.

Kommodus is just acting strange. Different from other games. If you look at RR in the two other games he stopped abstaining after he became mafia. For one simple reason it brought unwanted attention to him.

Using his mathematical method to catch the mafia as leverage was pretty smart move. This would disuade the townspeople from lynching him for fear of him withholding information that would most likely lead to the lynching of the mafia members. Doing that would atleast buy him 4 or 5 rounds if the people believe him.

I say lynch him we've won Mafia games before without the help of his method and we can do it again.

Sir Moody
12-20-2006, 14:21
Senator Proletariat was enjoying the chariot races - despite the plebs all talking about the murders. The only flaw was someone continually bumping into him. Finally enough was enough and he turned round ready to beat whomever he found. To his shock it was Senator Flavius Pacuvius (known as Dutch_Guy) convulsing uncontrollable. He was so shocked he took a step back and fell over the railing onto the race track colliding, fatally, with a Chariot.
When Flavius's body was found the only mark on him was a small needle incision on his shoulder...

Senator Compleo Vir, known to his friends as Kagemusha was visiting the Senate latrines, it had been an awfully long session after all. Upon arriving he noted that there was already a senator inside. Taking no note Compleo moved to an empty stall and began to relieve himself when a thought hit him - "I came straight here so how did the other senator beat me?" - he never got an answer as just as he began to turn to ask he felt a sharp pain in his throat and everything went black. When his body was discovered, his throat cut, the words 'Vir prudens non contra ventum mingit' were written in his blood on the walls...

Csar called another meeting, "Fellow Senators the Rebels are still abroad we must find them or all is lost!! The Senate floor is open may the gods bless your Votes"


Alive
Sasaki Kojiro
Don Corleone
Kommodus
Destroyer of Hope
Caius Flaminius
Csar
GeneralHankerchief
doc_bean
Craterus
Reenk Roink
Xiahou
Peasant Phill
AggonyDuck
JimBob

Dead
Crazed Rabbit
Masy
Kagemusha
Dutch_guy

Executed
Ituralde

Suicide
Proletariat

Caius
12-20-2006, 14:41
Many senators are calling to the silence.We need to know why they are away.
Black list of Senators:
Empty for now.

Now, lets hear some new voices in this Senate.If they dont talk, they are giving me a reason for calling they rebels.
In other news, 2 more senators are with Jupiter.We have an ultimatum, not the Reenk proposal, so we need act very faster and lets kill that annoying rebels.
So lets hear new voices here!

Sasaki Kojiro
12-20-2006, 14:44
Vote:Kommodus

Don Corleone
12-20-2006, 15:13
WOW! 2nd round and Prole got WoG'd?!?! :skull: What was that about? And why does Sigurd keep showing up as a suspect. He's not playing, is he?

My vote is for Destroyer of Hope. One thing is for certain, we need more discussion, and with only 2 posts to his credit, of the remaining senators, he's contributed the least.

DoH, nothing personal. But in the absence of any hard and fast evidence, I'm going for getting more discussion and theories out there...

Vote: Destroyer of Hope

Sir Moody
12-20-2006, 15:29
Prole asked to commit suicide so no WoM yet (Wrath of Moody) i will probably active that after the 3rd execution

Kommodus
12-20-2006, 15:30
WOW! 2nd round and Prole got WoG'd?!?!

It was a suicide, not a WoG. Prole probably asked to be removed from the game; chances are she's going to be otherwise occupied during the holidays.

Grr. This bodes ill for the senate. Prole's probably not going to be the only one. In fact, after tomorrow I'm going away on vacation for more than a week, and won't be able to participate as much. I have a feeling the rebels will walk away with this one. What ill timing. :no:

EDIT: Sir Moody beat me to it.

Caius
12-20-2006, 15:47
Vote:Xiahou
Sorry, but this seems to be the only way to make you talk

Kagemusha
12-20-2006, 16:31
Ahh.This one was fast for me. I wont be much online during holidays either,but then im dead.So from the dead i curse the killer,attacking Senator Kage in the latrine while im releaving my self is bad behaviour for even rebel scum.I hope the Lictors will meet this renegade soon enough and release his shoulders of the burden of his head.:whip:

GeneralHankerchief
12-20-2006, 18:26
With all this talk about guts, my own is telling me something:

Vote: AggonyDuck

I will be the first to admit that this is not based on any evidence whatsoever, but I just have a funny feeling. I do believe that K is innocent, but I also think that Sasaki is barking up the wrong tree, as he did with Banquo's Ghost in Mafia V. So until Ducky defends himself, my vote stands.

Sasaki Kojiro
12-20-2006, 18:45
Grr. This bodes ill for the senate. Prole's probably not going to be the only one. In fact, after tomorrow I'm going away on vacation for more than a week, and won't be able to participate as much. I have a feeling the rebels will walk away with this one. What ill timing. :no:


If you knew you were going to miss most of the game then what was the point of the whole "don't lynch me/kill me" thing? Or is this just a pretend vacation?

Don Corleone
12-20-2006, 18:54
Bah, never mind. I can't begin to think why Kommodus would make himself unavailable after demanding to be left untouched for the whole game, but this is too crazy for even my conspiracy theories.

Kommodus
12-20-2006, 19:04
If you knew you were going to miss most of the game then what was the point of the whole "don't lynch me/kill me" thing? Or is this just a pretend vacation?



Oh Sasaki, ya got me again! Can't pull a fast one over on you, can I? The whole "vacation" thing is just a game of make-believe.

First I'll imagine the long drive home to the imaginary little town where my parents live; then I'll pretend to greet my friends and family members and dream about their potential responses. (I hope no one sees me doing this, or they'll think I'm crazy.) After a self-induced mirage of a candlelight service at the little local church (also a mirage), I'll spend a quiet evening gazing at an empty space in the living room where a Christmas tree might have been - but isn't. The next morning I'll remove nonexistant wrapping paper from gifts which are, of course, a figment of my imagination. Later on, my fabricated brothers and I will head outside for a snowball fight (the snow, of course, doesn't really exist). :dizzy2:



In all seriousness, I never said I would totally disappear. I only said my participation level would decrease. It takes a word-twister like you to turn that into "missing most of the game."

Don Corleone
12-20-2006, 19:08
I find it odd that not one but two senators have votes against them, for no other reason that they've been unusually quiet and neither of them have had boo to say. DoH, Xiahou... you guys awake out there....??? :help:

Sasaki Kojiro
12-20-2006, 19:12
Oh Sasaki, ya got me again! Can't pull a fast one over on you, can I? The whole "vacation" thing is just a game of make-believe.



So you admit it?

Kommodus
12-20-2006, 19:35
So you admit it?

~:rolleyes:

*edits earlier post to make things a little clearer*

Dutch_guy
12-20-2006, 19:42
lol, killed in character.

How fitting.

:balloon2:

Sasaki Kojiro
12-20-2006, 19:43
unvote,Vote:GeneralHankerchief

for lurking

Kommodus
12-20-2006, 19:55
lol, killed in character.

How fitting.

Er, did I miss something? What do you mean by this?

Dutch_guy
12-20-2006, 20:04
Er, did I miss something? What do you mean by this?

Well, note how the name Flavius Pacuvius comes up in the kill, which is the character I'm currently controlling in the WotS PBM (check my user title).


Finally enough was enough and he turned round ready to beat whomever he found. To his shock it was Senator Flavius Pacuvius (known as Dutch_Guy) convulsing uncontrollable. He was so shocked he took a step back and fell over the railing onto the race track colliding, fatally, with a Chariot.
When Flavius's body was found the only mark on him was a small needle incision on his shoulder...

That help ?

:balloon2:

Csargo
12-20-2006, 20:14
:eyebrows: Vote Sasaki. This is not a joke. I repeat this is not a joke.

Don Corleone
12-20-2006, 20:30
:eyebrows: Vote Sasaki. This is not a joke. I repeat this is not a joke.

Erh, uhm, WHY? :shrug:

Kommodus
12-20-2006, 20:39
That help ?

Yeah, thanks. I missed that.


Erh, uhm, WHY? :shrug:

Indeed, why Csar? I'd like a bit more information, if you please.

Have you concocted some amazing new numerical method or something? :book:

Csargo
12-20-2006, 21:03
Yeah, thanks. I missed that.



Indeed, why Csar? I'd like a bit more information, if you please.

Have you concocted some amazing new numerical method or something? :book:

Yeah.

AggonyDuck
12-20-2006, 21:04
With all this talk about guts, my own is telling me something:

Vote: AggonyDuck

I will be the first to admit that this is not based on any evidence whatsoever, but I just have a funny feeling. I do believe that K is innocent, but I also think that Sasaki is barking up the wrong tree, as he did with Banquo's Ghost in Mafia V. So until Ducky defends himself, my vote stands.

Well I believe it would be kinda hard to defend myself against such an argument. I don't know if anything I can actually say will change the mind of your gut and frankly I do not see a point in doing so either. At the moment this game resembles a lottery at best and well to be blunt, it really comes down to luck at the moment to lynch the rebels, so I suppose I am as good as any other suspect.

GeneralHankerchief
12-20-2006, 21:54
unvote,Vote:GeneralHankerchief

for lurking

Right, just like I did in the two Godfather games when I was mafioso.

Look, in order to make this completely clear, Mafia will *not* be my #1 Org priority for a while. Probably not until after New Years'. I'll contribute when I can, but for the most part I *will* just lurk.

Edit: That answer satisfies me for now (to AggonyDuck).

Unvote: AggonyDuck
Vote: Sasaki

That's two experienced players he's attempted to lynch now.

Caius
12-20-2006, 22:45
:eyebrows: Vote Sasaki. This is not a joke. I repeat this is not a joke.
Why?

I am still surprised why i am not dead.

Csargo
12-20-2006, 23:09
Why?

I am still surprised why i am not dead.

He's just a good choice as any.:smash:

Caius
12-20-2006, 23:17
Unvote:Xiahou
Vote:Sasaki

GeneralHankerchief
12-20-2006, 23:26
Unvote: Sasaki
Vote: Caius Flaminius

For trying too hard to appear innocent


I am still surprised why i am not dead.

and bandwagoning.

Caius
12-20-2006, 23:32
:inquisitive:
I started to laugh a bit.i am innocent.

I am new on this type of games.Thats why i said that.I thoughout i was killed in the first round.Thats all.

This is really absurd.

Sasaki Kojiro
12-20-2006, 23:32
Unvote: Sasaki
Vote: Caius Flaminius

For trying too hard to appear innocent



and bandwagoning.

See GH, ridiculous votes can lead to good things.

unvote

tempted to vote Caius but he's new so I'm not sure.

Caius
12-20-2006, 23:40
Unvote:Sasaki
Vote:Xiahou.
Talk, Xiahou.

Sasaki Kojiro
12-21-2006, 01:00
watcha doin caius?

Sasaki Kojiro
12-21-2006, 01:04
Senators:
I cant tolate this!.First, an opinion who says "Lets kill Kommodus, because I want" and second a quote:

Is this a threat?The Senators doesnt make threats.
You are making a big mistake, and the worse thing is you are making twice.My vote(again!):

Vote:Reenk
He hasnt demostrated Kommodus is a rebel.Why he is saying that?
I want an Explication

Caius Flaminius

Vote:Caius Flaminius

The spellings of the kills match his posts.

JimBob
12-21-2006, 01:07
Caius is not acting like a townie, accuse me of band wagoning but
Vote: Caius
Don't vote for lurking, WoM will handle that. Don't waste votes

Caius
12-21-2006, 01:11
The spellings of the kills match his posts.
Man, i have serious grammar horrors.
Remember, English is not my first languaje.

Caius
12-21-2006, 01:18
Unvote:Xiahou
Vote:Caius

Sasaki Kojiro
12-21-2006, 01:28
Hmm this is tricky.

1) Moody could have forgotten to spell check Caius's kill
2) Bad spelling could be mafia plant
3) Bad spelling could be Moody's own

The 2nd kill has improved spelling, but:

1) Caius's fellow mafia could have taken over writing
2) Sir moody could have spell checked
3) Mafia could have given up on ploy

I wonder which it is. I'm not sure why one person would be writing both the kills.

Also, in the 2nd kills, Prole is referred to as "he". Mistake or deliberate change up? Sigurd deliberately changed it in tbh2.

Caius
12-21-2006, 01:35
1)You dont believe me, right?
How I said, i have serious errors in grammar.
2)I dont know, I am not a slave.I am Caius Flaminius, Senator, not slave
3)It could be posible
4)I repeat.Im not a slave
5)Humans doesnt make the same error twice
6)?

Don Corleone
12-21-2006, 01:59
Hmm this is tricky.

1) Moody could have forgotten to spell check Caius's kill
2) Bad spelling could be mafia plant
3) Bad spelling could be Moody's own

The 2nd kill has improved spelling, but:

1) Caius's fellow mafia could have taken over writing
2) Sir moody could have spell checked
3) Mafia could have given up on ploy

I wonder which it is. I'm not sure why one person would be writing both the kills.

Also, in the 2nd kills, Prole is referred to as "he". Mistake or deliberate change up? Sigurd deliberately changed it in tbh2.

Sir Moody was pretty clear that the spelling mistakes were his own. Caius might have had a 'slight' bandwagoning, but frankly, this early in the game, what else is there to do? Accuse somebody and make up a reason why or agree with the reason somebody else came up with. I think you're all barking up the wrong tree.

Still no word from DoH or Xiahou. I'm not changing my vote until there is.

Reenk Roink
12-21-2006, 02:01
I'm going to hold off writing a Reenkaficsio post to avoid wrath from people. It's Christmas time and I want to be happy and merry.

Anyhoo...

I really got no one at this point.

I want to wait on Kommodus, as he is definitely still suspect number one, but lynching him can have bad consequences given his revision to his stance.

Also, Sasaki Kojiro and Sigurd must die by Round 5. That's just real. Sasaki is always suspicious alive (and sometimes dead), and Sigurd has always been mafia when he's lived that long.

As for now:

Vote: Reenk Roink (courteously)

:shrug:

Xiahou
12-21-2006, 02:08
Vote: Reenk Roink (courteously)

:shrug:Oh just abstain you pansy. :laugh4:

When does the voting close? My main choices right now are between Sasaki and Caius... Then there's Kommodus, but with the shocking arrogance he's been displaying Im almost starting to believe his innocence. I'll vote shortly.


Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.

Caius
12-21-2006, 02:30
1) Moody could have forgotten to spell check Caius's kill

Any contact with Sir. Moody.No Pm.No msn.No email.No nothing.

Xiahou
12-21-2006, 03:41
Vote: Caius

Maybe you're new, maybe you're mafia... either way, you're acting suspiciously. :shrug:


Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.

Caius
12-21-2006, 03:53
Senators:

If you want to kill me, kill me.
But I assure all, Im not a slave.How many times i have to explain you?
Tomorrow, think it.You are killing an Senator, not a slave.
Well, "Crazed Rabbit", Masy, Flavius, Prole and Ituralde, I will join they.Not dying for natural causes,i'm dying for a bunch of Senators and 2 slaves, who are here in this Senate.
I will not shut up.i will speak from the underworld.I keep all the names who voted for my injust execution.Remember me, in a couple of days there will be 2 more kills, and you wasted time in killing an one of you.
Bye, nasty world.

Csargo
12-21-2006, 06:36
Hmm this is tricky.

1) Moody could have forgotten to spell check Caius's kill
2) Bad spelling could be mafia plant
3) Bad spelling could be Moody's own

The 2nd kill has improved spelling, but:

1) Caius's fellow mafia could have taken over writing
2) Sir moody could have spell checked
3) Mafia could have given up on ploy

I wonder which it is. I'm not sure why one person would be writing both the kills.

Also, in the 2nd kills, Prole is referred to as "he". Mistake or deliberate change up? Sigurd deliberately changed it in tbh2.


Prole was suicide. I'm pretty sure about that.

Sigurd is not in this game RR.



Senators:

If you want to kill me, kill me.
But I assure all, Im not a slave.How many times i have to explain you?
Tomorrow, think it.You are killing an Senator, not a slave.
Well, "Crazed Rabbit", Masy, Flavius, Prole and Ituralde, I will join they.Not dying for natural causes,i'm dying for a bunch of Senators and 2 slaves, who are here in this Senate.
I will not shut up.i will speak from the underworld.I keep all the names who voted for my injust execution.Remember me, in a couple of days there will be 2 more kills, and you wasted time in killing an one of you.
Bye, nasty world.

I have a hard time believing you. Weird but I've noticed that you've made a lot of mentionings of slave. Sometimes especially with newer players that seem to mention the role they have not on purpose of course..........................................

doc_bean
12-21-2006, 09:40
Err..not much interesting going on here.

vote: Caius

When I doubt, bandwagon ! :embarassed:

Sir Moody
12-21-2006, 10:09
Prole was a suicide and so i wrote her into the Rebels kill - and i refered to her as a he because roman senators were men (no offence lady prole)

edit
oh and voting will close at around 12 noon gmt like always

Peasant Phill
12-21-2006, 11:14
Fellow Senator Xianhou,

From lurker to avid poster is always suspicious, certainly when some senators were letting there votes depend on the activity of fellow senators. Sure, you can say that you were merely trying to avoid being lynched but when just a explanation would suffice you suddenly and extremely changed your posting habit.


Vote: Caius

Maybe you're new, maybe you're mafia... either way, you're acting suspiciously. :shrug:


Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.



Senator Compleo Vir, known to his friends as Kagemusha was visiting the Senate latrines, it had been an awfully long session after all. Upon arriving he noted that there was already a senator inside. Taking no note Compleo moved to an empty stall and began to relieve himself when a thought hit him - "I came straight here so how did the other senator beat me?" - he never got an answer as just as he began to turn to ask he felt a sharp pain in his throat and everything went black. When his body was discovered, his throat cut, the words 'Vir prudens non contra ventum mingit' were written in his blood on the walls...

Why did you suddenly start using a latin quotation? Is this a hint, something to laugh about when we don't catch you? You only started to use it after you saw the writings in the latrine.

Vote Xianhou

AggonyDuck
12-21-2006, 11:49
Kinda busy at the moment and I don't feel like joining the Caius bandwagon, so:

Vote: Abstain

Sir Moody
12-21-2006, 13:11
Voting Closed

Sir Moody
12-21-2006, 13:36
"well my friends we have made up our minds Senator Caius Flaminus is hereby accused of murder and treason. Let us hope we have chosen correctly as the poor man is clearly half insane having thrown many accusations around and - in the end - voting for HIMSELF! because of this i have decided to show mercy, as Punishment Caius Flaminus will be striped of all lands, wealth and slaves, his hands and tongue will be cut off and he will be cast out onto the streets - if the plebs take pity on this poor fool then he will surivive as a pauper if not? well we will not think on that. Sleep well my Friends - Session adjourned."

Votes
Caius Flaminus = 6 (General Hankerchief, Sasaki Kojiro, Jimbob, Caius Flaminus, Xiahou, docbean)
DestoryerofHope = 1 (Don Corleone)
Xiahou= 1 (Peasant Phil)
Reenk Rionk = 1 (Reenk Rionk :juggle2:)
Abstain = 1 (AggonyDuck)


Alive
Sasaki Kojiro
Don Corleone
Kommodus
Destroyer of Hope
Csar
GeneralHankerchief
doc_bean
Craterus
Reenk Roink
Xiahou
Peasant Phill
AggonyDuck
JimBob

Dead
Crazed Rabbit
Masy
Kagemusha
Dutch_guy

Executed
Ituralde
Caius Flaminius

Suicide
Proletariat

Night Phase Begins - PM's Please

Kommodus
12-21-2006, 14:56
Aw crap, I missed the vote... I was trying to figure out who to vote for 'cause I thought Caius was innocent. Oh well. :embarassed:

Sir Moody
12-21-2006, 15:08
as a little pre warning anyone who hasnt taken part at the end of the next voting session will be wrathed - you have been wanred

Caius
12-21-2006, 23:04
Seems all want to be WoM.

A paper fly in the air. That paper has written a phrase.
Senators, you had selected the wrong person.

Sasaki Kojiro
12-22-2006, 08:03
Why did we lynch caius instead of kommodus

Csargo
12-22-2006, 08:06
Why did we lynch caius instead of kommodus

Yeah you voted for Caius.

Oh and I'm pretty sure you started that wagon ;)

doc_bean
12-22-2006, 10:21
vote: Kommodus

I say we've waited long enough.

Sir Moody
12-22-2006, 11:13
(the kills are early today as everyone has sent them in and its the office party so forgive me but i wont be in any state to write kill around noon :inquisitive:)

Senator Paganus, often called Peasant Phill mockingly, was visiting the local brothel. He was a regular and was sent straight to his room to await his favorite slave girl. He lay on his stomach and waited. After a few minutes he became a little impatient and stood up and went into the adjoining room to ask what was taking so long - as he stepped through the door a leather cord was sliped around his neck and pulled taught. The last thing he saw was the words ' No inquira de iste neci' written on the walls in the slave girls blood...

As the Senators filed in for the days vote Senator Imperator Tela, known to his enemies as GeneralHankerchief, was feeling the weight of Rome on his shoulders. So far they had killed 2 of their own and the murders were still happening and the senate would soon be too small to fight back. He was so engrossed in his thoughts he didnt notice the needle fixed onto his chair. He sat down and quickly stood up in pain. Realising he was doomed he tried to accuse those he was sure were his killers but only froth came out of his mouth. he collapsed to the floor in a fit...

Csar Turned to the senators "two more of our friends are dead, this must end soon may you vote well and true"


Alive
Sasaki Kojiro
Don Corleone
Kommodus
Destroyer of Hope
Csar
doc_bean
Craterus
Reenk Roink
Xiahou
AggonyDuck
JimBob

Dead
Crazed Rabbit
Masy
Kagemusha
Dutch_guy
Peasant Phill
GeneralHankerchief

Executed
Ituralde
Caius Flaminius

Suicide
Proletariat

doc_bean
12-22-2006, 11:44
wow, was a bit too early there.

Still vote: Kommodus !

Craterus
12-22-2006, 13:42
Yeah, why not? His post at the start was the most suspicious thing so far.

Vote: Kommodus

Caius
12-22-2006, 13:47
Oh and I'm pretty sure you started that wagon ;)
GH do it.Now he is dead.

Peasant Phill
12-22-2006, 14:07
Damn the worst death yet (even worse than to die in a surreal popcorn explosion). I shall call this the blue balled strangulation case.

P.S. can somebody translate 'No inquira de iste neci'. I think that our killer is leaving clues, or at least some quotations about the deaths.

Kommodus
12-22-2006, 15:18
Why did we lynch caius instead of kommodus

Er... you voted for Caius, buddy. :inquisitive:


I say we've waited long enough.

No, you haven't.

I still have some tinkering to do before I cast my vote, but hey, you want me dead, go ahead then. I'm more than happy to sit back and watch the mafia take this one. As for my defense, well... I've already explained it several times - no need to add anything.

Reenk Roink
12-22-2006, 16:44
I know it's getting late and we need to make good lynches (Kommodus still being our biggest lead), but I also think it plausible that our Praetor has investigated him by now. I don't know what to do. :huh:

Praetor, if you even have a collection of 4-5 innocents (by next round), come out and reveal. Give your PM's (as quotes) so we can compare them with Csar's.

Sasaki Kojiro
12-22-2006, 17:56
Vote:Kommodus

Ituralde
12-22-2006, 18:10
Well, strange things are happening. Maybe it really is a little bit too early to lynch Kommodus. Either way the next lynching should be Sasaki Kojiro, preferably today, but there's already many 'supporters' for Kommodus.

Why Sasaki?
Well his posting style has really differed from previous games. He hardly discusses the scarce evidence we have, but instead throws himself on different people. His pledge for Kommodus has been strong since the beginning but why his sudden change of vote to Caius? He switched votes several times during that turn.
Maybe he's just acting differently because he wants to try out a new strategy, but his constant attacks on Kommodus nag at me, mabye he fears that Kommodus' methods may point to him.
All in all he's acting highly suspicious and a dead Sasaki should not hurt the town too much, while removing one of the major suspects.

If I were alive I would vote Sasaki.

JimBob
12-22-2006, 18:18
Yeah, why not? His post at the start was the most suspicious thing so far.

Vote: Kommodus

Can we spell bandwagon?

Vote: Craterus

GeneralHankerchief
12-22-2006, 18:37
Wow, I died because I sat on a needle. :no:

I would like to think that... eh, nevermind.

Oh, and don't vote for Kommodus.

Sasaki Kojiro
12-22-2006, 19:29
Well, strange things are happening. Maybe it really is a little bit too early to lynch Kommodus. Either way the next lynching should be Sasaki Kojiro, preferably today, but there's already many 'supporters' for Kommodus.

Why Sasaki?
Well his posting style has really differed from previous games. He hardly discusses the scarce evidence we have, but instead throws himself on different people. His pledge for Kommodus has been strong since the beginning but why his sudden change of vote to Caius? He switched votes several times during that turn.
Maybe he's just acting differently because he wants to try out a new strategy, but his constant attacks on Kommodus nag at me, mabye he fears that Kommodus' methods may point to him.
All in all he's acting highly suspicious and a dead Sasaki should not hurt the town too much, while removing one of the major suspects.

If I were alive I would vote Sasaki.

1) If you want to compare, look at Csar's game not Mafia V.
2) I changed to Caius because no one was going for Kommodus and because I thought the kills might have been written by him. I still think we should have lynched Kommodus last round.

With 11 alive we have 3 lynches left. Mafia have a good chance at pulling it off due to inactivity. If there are 3 WoG's we will only have 2 lynches.

Kommodus only felt confident enough in his system to post an accusation after 560 posts and 5 lynches in Mafia V. We've had 220 posts and 2 lynches. Furthermore, he has admitted that his system has trouble differentiating between mafia and detectives/doctors, and there is an equal chance of his system picking one of them. In spite of this he insists that he is vital to our towns chance of success and must not be lynched (because he'll refuse to help out if he is). This is suspicious.

I also found his "Ituralde I thought you were innocent :sadface:" "caius I thought you were innocent :sadface" comments suspicious, it's like he knew they were innocent is trying to gain favor with them.

Xiahou
12-22-2006, 19:42
With 11 alive we have 3 lynches left. Mafia have a good chance at pulling it off due to inactivity. If there are 3 WoG's we will only have 2 lynches.Wow, that seemed fast. If we still have a Praetor, it might be time for him to speak up if he can clear some of the living as innocent and narrow our slate of suspects.

As to Kommodus, I agree that we've had that albatross hanging around our necks for too long, he may well be mafia- regardless, it's making it difficult to look at other suspects with all the attention he's drawn to himself. Personally, I was hoping the mafia would kill and thereby exonerate him- but not such luck.

Vote Kommodus; I have some other suspects in mind too, but I'll withhold my suspicions until the next vote so as not to aid the mafia.

Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.

doc_bean
12-22-2006, 20:50
No, you haven't.

I still have some tinkering to do before I cast my vote, but hey, you want me dead, go ahead then. I'm more than happy to sit back and watch the mafia take this one. As for my defense, well... I've already explained it several times - no need to add anything.

BS Komm, we have 9 dead people already, I understand not wanting to get killed the first few rounds, but we're entering mid game now, I say everything goes, If you want to help the Senate then I applaud you, but if you're going to be upset over getting lynched halfway through the game you're just being whiney.

On an unrelated note: can wa have a break on Xmass (24-26 december) ? I have a lot of family to visit and probably won't be able to participate, I recon a lot of people will have similar problems.

Xiahou
12-22-2006, 21:04
BS Komm, we have 9 dead people already, I understand not wanting to get killed the first few rounds, but we're entering mid game now, I say everything goes, If you want to help the Senate then I applaud you, but if you're going to be upset over getting lynched halfway through the game you're just being whiney.Or just being mafia. :inquisitive:


On an unrelated note: can wa have a break on Xmass (24-26 december) ? I have a lot of family to visit and probably won't be able to participate, I recon a lot of people will have similar problems.
Good point, I'll be completely unavailable all day tomorrow with limited availability on Sun,Mon,Tues- although I should be able to get on long enough to read up/log a vote on those days.

Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.

Don Corleone
12-22-2006, 22:22
Damn the worst death yet (even worse than to die in a surreal popcorn explosion). I shall call this the blue balled strangulation case.

P.S. can somebody translate 'No inquira de iste neci'. I think that our killer is leaving clues, or at least some quotations about the deaths.

Hey guys, Peasant Phil has a good point here. Last round, he asked about the Latin and he wound up dead, with another Latin phrase next to him. Does anybody speak Latin? I don't. But I'd really like to know 3 things:

1) What do these phrases mean?

2) What does the phrase in Xiahou's signature mean?

3) Is he being bold, or is he being framed? I think it's the former. I think he saw Kommodus's crazy statement at the beginning and viola, he figured be too obvious, and we'll never look at him. I don't think Kommodus is his partner. I think his partner is already dead.

I'm not saying whom and I'm not saying why, but I 'think' we've got one of the mafia already. I'm testing a theory and when I'm proven right or wrong, I'll let you guys know. But I think if we lynch Xiahou this round, we win. If we don't lynch Xiahou this round, don't be surprised to see me showing up dead with a Latin phrase next to my corpse next round.

Edit to add: Not to mention, Xiahou didn't say hardly anything the first 2 rounds. Now he's wading in, going for lynches without a lot of evidence.

Vote: Xiahou

Csargo
12-22-2006, 23:46
Hey guys, Peasant Phil has a good point here. Last round, he asked about the Latin and he wound up dead, with another Latin phrase next to him. Does anybody speak Latin? I don't. But I'd really like to know 3 things:

1) What do these phrases mean?

2) What does the phrase in Xiahou's signature mean?

3) Is he being bold, or is he being framed? I think it's the former. I think he saw Kommodus's crazy statement at the beginning and viola, he figured be too obvious, and we'll never look at him. I don't think Kommodus is his partner. I think his partner is already dead.

I'm not saying whom and I'm not saying why, but I 'think' we've got one of the mafia already. I'm testing a theory and when I'm proven right or wrong, I'll let you guys know. But I think if we lynch Xiahou this round, we win. If we don't lynch Xiahou this round, don't be surprised to see me showing up dead with a Latin phrase next to my corpse next round.

Edit to add: Not to mention, Xiahou didn't say hardly anything the first 2 rounds. Now he's wading in, going for lynches without a lot of evidence.

Vote: Xiahou

Can anyone say wild goose chase? :yes:

There about like the bible quotes from Mafia V.

Don Corleone
12-23-2006, 00:44
Can anyone say wild goose chase? :yes:

There about like the bible quotes from Mafia V.

Funny that you say that. Somebody pointed the finger at Seamus, because of the bible quotes. As it turns out, he WAS one of the killers. And rather than blowing it off, why don't you explain all the Latin quotes. For all we know, Xiahou's signature means "You can't catch me, you fools".

Caius
12-23-2006, 00:50
Negative.

"And therefore I believe that Carthage must be destroyed".Translation of "Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam".

Sasaki Kojiro
12-23-2006, 00:50
^^^ https://img178.imageshack.us/img178/1058/emotarghbr6.gif


Funny that you say that. Somebody pointed the finger at Seamus, because of the bible quotes. As it turns out, he WAS one of the killers. And rather than blowing it off, why don't you explain all the Latin quotes. For all we know, Xiahou's signature means "You can't catch me, you fools".

"For the rest, I am of the opinion that Carthage is to be destroyed."

Csargo
12-23-2006, 00:52
Funny that you say that. Somebody pointed the finger at Seamus, because of the bible quotes. As it turns out, he WAS one of the killers. And rather than blowing it off, why don't you explain all the Latin quotes. For all we know, Xiahou's signature means "You can't catch me, you fools".

Otherwise argue In Carthage to be delendam-From his post

To swim to ask about that neci' -From the last kill

Don Corleone
12-23-2006, 01:04
Damn. Okay, that doesn't sound all that helpful. Do you guys really think Kommodus would be that obvious to call that much attention to himself at the beginning of the game like that? It just seems way, way too obvious. I don't know what to think... :dizzy2: I'm seriously asking. I just can't sell myself on him being that dumb. Then again, crazy like a fox, right?

Unvote: Xiahou (sorry about that)

Vote: Abstain

Reenk Roink
12-23-2006, 04:00
Ok, I've been doing some thinking, and while it is plausible to take the Praetor's silence as a sign that he investigated an innocent Kommodus, it is equally plausible that he is dead.

Vote: Kommodus

Also, Sasaki must die next round. I'm surprised he's lived this long.

Kommodus
12-23-2006, 04:43
Looks like it's the end for me. So sad; I had almost finished the updates I had planned to my latest tool. Oh well, I'll try 'em out some other time.

FYI, you are wasting a lynch here. I'm not the one you want. But I understand your suspicion - so just like in GF2, no hard feelings. Doc_bean: I don't actually care much about being lynched. It only seemed that way; I just wanted to try a new strategy to see if it would keep me alive any longer than in recent history.

Anyway, good luck to the town - you'll need it... :skull:

GeneralHankerchief
12-23-2006, 05:35
Ugh, we're making a huge mistake here guys... :wall:

Yeah, there's an experienced mafioso here. But it's not Kommodus. It's Sasaki.

He's been dogging Kommodus since Round 1, using pretty much the same accusation each time. Compare this to previous Mafia games where he has consistently piled on the evidence, suffocating the poor person buried underneath. Here it's just "that first post was weird, lynch him."

Secondly...


"For the rest, I am of the opinion that Carthage is to be destroyed."

This is the first time in a while he's referenced a red herring, as if he was trying to detract attention from himself. I tried it in GF2. IIRC, he didn't even mention the Bible passages in Mafia V. Heck, he even went after Banquo's Ghost because he tried to explain the Wanax reference! Is this characteristic of an innocent Sasaki? No.

Third, he's been going after experienced players all game. Kommodus is obviously his number one target, but went after me (and I don't buy that it was bait) to sort of test the waters. When I defend myself and spin the blame towards Caius he quickly feigns indecisiveness, and then later bandwagons. This is the exact strategy I used to get him lynched in Godfather 2.

Vote Sasaki, people.

Csargo
12-23-2006, 05:40
GH is right everyone. Though I already told you that. Lynch Sasaki.

Sasaki Kojiro
12-23-2006, 06:16
Ugh, we're making a huge mistake here guys... :wall:

Yeah, there's an experienced mafioso here. But it's not Kommodus. It's Sasaki.

He's been dogging Kommodus since Round 1, using pretty much the same accusation each time. Compare this to previous Mafia games where he has consistently piled on the evidence, suffocating the poor person buried underneath. Here it's just "that first post was weird, lynch him."

Yeah, pretty much exactly like Csar's game which was also low activity.


Secondly...



This is the first time in a while he's referenced a red herring, as if he was trying to detract attention from himself. I tried it in GF2. IIRC, he didn't even mention the Bible passages in Mafia V. Heck, he even went after Banquo's Ghost because he tried to explain the Wanax reference! Is this characteristic of an innocent Sasaki? No.

I translated the quote that Xiahou's been posting to show Don that it wasn't "haha I did it". I haven't translated any of the kills quotes.


Third, he's been going after experienced players all game. Kommodus is obviously his number one target, but went after me (and I don't buy that it was bait) to sort of test the waters. When I defend myself and spin the blame towards Caius he quickly feigns indecisiveness, and then later bandwagons. This is the exact strategy I used to get him lynched in Godfather 2.

Vote Sasaki, people.

Kommodus is acting suspicious. If you want to claim that I'm going after him to lynch an experienced player, go ahead. But you have to then show that my accusations are contrived. You haven't done that, all you've said is "he's guilty". I have posted several arguments against Kommodus that you could have addressed specifically.

Csargo
12-23-2006, 06:35
I can't let you live. ;)

Sasaki Kojiro
12-23-2006, 06:54
I can't let you live. ;)

You must be guilty :sweatdrop:

Csargo
12-23-2006, 06:57
You must be guilty :sweatdrop:

Oh kill him please. Vote: Sasaki he's so obviously guilty. Him and Kommodus.

Peasant Phill
12-23-2006, 10:54
I wouldn't just discard Xiahou just yet.

- The quotation has a second meaning, namely that important things should be constantly repeated. What are you hinting at?

- Xiahou only started to use this quotation right after the rebels started to use quotations. Again why?

- Most of us respond the first chance we get when we're being accused. You however ignored my questions and accusations twice. For the third time why? Are you trying to let your little hint slip by unnoticed?

AggonyDuck
12-23-2006, 11:07
I'm going to vote for Sasaki. His posts are very suspicious. He has been going after Kommodus for the whole game now, but with a sudden vote changing last round from Kommodus to GH and from GH to Caius. There's something fishy in his posting/voting methods this game.

Vote: Sasaki

Btw Peasant Phill, Xiahou started using that quote before the kills and it's likely that the latin quotes are a red herring. Its a rather historical quote.

Sir Moody
12-23-2006, 13:18
Voting Closed

Sir Moody
12-23-2006, 13:43
"Friends, Romans, Countrymen we have chosen today to kill one of our oldest and most revered members, Senator Indubitanter Peto known as Kommodus. As a punishment to such a veteran the senate we hereby decree he should be crucified at the steps of the senate as a reminder to the plebs that justice will be done. Retire now my friends and let us watch the punishment - justice has been done."
As they filed out there was a rumble and the floor began to shake. A rift suddenly appeared in the floor swallowing up Senator desidiosus known as the Destroyer of Hope. The rumbling ceased and the rift resealed itself. A voice boomed out "Foolish Mortals do not tempt the gods through inaction we will smite those who do not contribute!"

Votes
Kommodus = 5 (doc_bean, Craterus ,Sasaki Kojiro, Xiahou, Reenk Rionk)
Craterus = 1 (Jimbob)
Sasaki Kojiro = 1 (AggonyDuck)
abstain = 1 (Don Corleone)

Alive
Sasaki Kojiro
Don Corleone
Csar
doc_bean
Craterus
Reenk Roink
Xiahou
AggonyDuck
JimBob

Dead
Crazed Rabbit
Masy
Kagemusha
Dutch_guy
Peasant Phill
GeneralHankerchief

Executed
Ituralde
Caius Flaminius
Kommodus

Suicide
Proletariat

Wrath of God
Destroyer of Hope

I have decided the next night phase will be extra long - this night phase will end Noon GMT on Wednesday - everyone enjoy your holidays and hopefully we can come back and finish this game afterwards

Sasaki Kojiro
12-23-2006, 17:07
Interesting. 9 left. Since csar can't vote and can't be killed, if there is one more wrath of god then we only have one lynch left. But I think everyone from the list has been active enough. Praetor should definitely claim next round though.

Sasaki Kojiro
12-23-2006, 17:29
Ok Kommodus. Did you come up with any results at all from your system? I'm curious.

Reenk Roink
12-23-2006, 21:36
Ugh, we're making a huge mistake here guys... :wall:

Yeah, there's an experienced mafioso here. But it's not Kommodus. It's Sasaki.

He's been dogging Kommodus since Round 1, using pretty much the same accusation each time. Compare this to previous Mafia games where he has consistently piled on the evidence, suffocating the poor person buried underneath. Here it's just "that first post was weird, lynch him."

Secondly...



This is the first time in a while he's referenced a red herring, as if he was trying to detract attention from himself. I tried it in GF2. IIRC, he didn't even mention the Bible passages in Mafia V. Heck, he even went after Banquo's Ghost because he tried to explain the Wanax reference! Is this characteristic of an innocent Sasaki? No.

Third, he's been going after experienced players all game. Kommodus is obviously his number one target, but went after me (and I don't buy that it was bait) to sort of test the waters. When I defend myself and spin the blame towards Caius he quickly feigns indecisiveness, and then later bandwagons. This is the exact strategy I used to get him lynched in Godfather 2.

Vote Sasaki, people.

Oh don't worry, Sasaki has been on my target list since round 3. He'll die by our lynching next round. I've made it clear that Sasaki must die.

I'm finishing up my speech against him, it'll come after Christmas. :yes:

doc_bean
12-24-2006, 12:54
I never notice JimBob around, does he always post this little ?

I'm all for voting for Sasaki next round, he's been acting 'funny', or 'funnier' than usual anyway :inquisitive:

Sasaki Kojiro
12-24-2006, 16:26
I never notice JimBob around, does he always post this little ?

I'm all for voting for Sasaki next round, he's been acting 'funny', or 'funnier' than usual anyway :inquisitive:

You think I've been acting funny and yet you voted for caius and kommodus without giving a reason?

JimBob
12-24-2006, 19:05
I never notice JimBob around, does he always post this little ?

Its a little less than in Csar's game. In my own defense I'm still getting my feet wet in mafia. And this is the third day of winter break for me. I have not really spent much time at home or lucid. Come the next round I'll be getting back up to speed.

Kommodus
12-24-2006, 21:41
Ok Kommodus. Did you come up with any results at all from your system? I'm curious.

:laugh4:

EDIT: Merry Christmas everyone!