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Re: Medieval Total Realism: Age of Ambition
Quote:
Originally Posted by King of Atlantis
Well if there is really a 30 faction limit like they said why not make Coroboda a faction? I just think factions are funnier to fight than rebels and a spain filled with rebels, dispite how strong they may be would be kinda boring.
I meant in terms of factions. Again all rebel. People like factions. Fighting rebels gets dry and boring. Is there no faction that could be around tunisia or something?
Taifa kingdoms will be represented realistic as much as possible (we don’t know limits of m2 tw until game come in market). There were several strong emirates in Al-Andalus after death of Umayyad Caliph al-Muzaffar in 1008. Those emirates were divided between Arabs, Berbers and Slavs. Arabs held the most of Al-Andalus, Berbers were located in the south of Iberia and Slavs held eastern parts. Slavs were the weakest and they survived longest in Baleares (Emirate of Mallorca from 1076) until 1114 when famous Emir Mubākir ibn Suläymān was killed. He made in Baleares a strong pirate base from 1093 to 1114 when united fleets and armies of Pisa, Catalonia, Narbonne and Montpellier led by Count Ramon Berengar III occupied the island and killed him. Mubākir was the last Slavic emir. Next year (1115) Murabitin (Almoravid) fleet took Baleares from Christians.
You may know guess that Baleares will be strong pirate island… http://smiles.zy.cz/481.gif
Conclusion - expect at least strong rebels in Al-Andalus, as we don’t know how much slots will be in the game.
If there will be 30 free slots, then I can bet that Cumans will be faction.http://smiles.zy.cz/174.gif
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Re: Medieval Total Realism: Age of Ambition
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About Dubrovnik - in 1062 town was under Byzantium protection. And I will also look for true.
http://www.hostkingdom.net/westbalk.html#Ragusa
Venice had control of Zadar and Split only on paper, especially Zadar. Reality was different. And that I will check.
Today I consulted three sources, two Byzantine and one Serbia and found the following.
Dubrovnik was indeed under Byzantine protection, but it was a combination of direct and autonmous control without being a protectorate.
Dubrovnik was the seat of a strategos...but not a regular garisson which suggests that local resources were deployed from Dubrovnik and not Constantinople.
Dubrovnik was first included in the theme of Dalmatia by Basil I, level of control was still local but it was part of the Byzantine administrative system since it was part of a theme. The theme of Dalmatia came under Venetian sovereignty when Basil II granted the title Dux Dalmatiae to the Venetians, however, it seems to have effectively covered Zara and Spalato since Dubrovnik was under Byzantine influence and local control until the Normans seized it in 1081, whereby it was seized back by Alexius I Comnenus.
I'd still say Dubrovnik should be under Byzantine control was it was under direct (with strong local autonomous) control under a Byzantine strategos. However, forces guarding the city should unique and not composed of Byzantine soldiers.
Quote:
Taifa kingdoms will be represented realistic as much as possible (we don’t know limits of m2 tw until game come in market). There were several strong emirates in Al-Andalus after death of Umayyad Caliph al-Muzaffar in 1008. Those emirates were divided between Arabs, Berbers and Slavs. Arabs held the most of Al-Andalus, Berbers were located in the south of Iberia and Slavs held eastern parts. Slavs were the weakest and they survived longest in Baleares (Emirate of Mallorca from 1076) until 1114 when famous Emir Mubākir ibn Suläymān was killed. He made in Baleares a strong pirate base from 1093 to 1114 when united fleets and armies of Pisa, Catalonia, Narbonne and Montpellier led by Count Ramon Berengar III occupied the island and killed him. Mubākir was the last Slavic emir. Next year (1115) Murabitin (Almoravid) fleet took Baleares from Christians.
You may know guess that Baleares will be strong pirate island…
Conclusion - expect at least strong rebels in Al-Andalus, as we don’t know how much slots will be in the game.
If there will be 30 free slots, then I can bet that Cumans will be faction
yep agreed, under MTR, rebels will be portrayed more as independent factions with their own unqiue character in the province they are in.
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Re: Medieval Total Realism: Age of Ambition
Quote:
Originally Posted by Woad Warrior
@ Orda Khan, Kataphrakoi, and especially Wraithdt - how on earth do you manage to draw concept art like that? Do you just use a standard pencil, read up on some info and then draw away? I've been trying to draw some concept art, have you got any tips, becuase those drawings are incredible!:2thumbsup:
Just wanted to drop in to say Hi to you guys just so you know I'm not dead. I've busy with work and other stuff lately so I rarely have time to do new sketches. Look out for a new Gothic Foot Knight in glorious colour some time soon.
Woad Warrior: I do lotsa personal research and reading into the subject and then I start conceptualizing. It really helps if you can get visual references; I highly recommend the Osprey military books as they are beautifully illustrated and contain many photos as well. When I draw I sometimes use the good ol pencil but mostly I'm more comfartable with a wacom tablet as it allows me me to draw straight into the computer using photoshop. Its alot more convinient that way.
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Re: Medieval Total Realism: Age of Ambition
Sorry for double posting but I couldn't edit my previous post. No idea why.
Anyway I forgot the say thanks to you guys for the compliments. I appreciate it.
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Re: Medieval Total Realism: Age of Ambition
Quote:
Originally Posted by DukeofSerbia
Taifa kingdoms will be represented realistic as much as possible (we don’t know limits of m2 tw until game come in market). There were several strong emirates in Al-Andalus after death of Umayyad Caliph al-Muzaffar in 1008. Those emirates were divided between Arabs, Berbers and Slavs. Arabs held the most of Al-Andalus, Berbers were located in the south of Iberia and Slavs held eastern parts. Slavs were the weakest and they survived longest in Baleares (Emirate of Mallorca from 1076) until 1114 when famous Emir Mubākir ibn Suläymān was killed. He made in Baleares a strong pirate base from 1093 to 1114 when united fleets and armies of Pisa, Catalonia, Narbonne and Montpellier led by Count Ramon Berengar III occupied the island and killed him. Mubākir was the last Slavic emir. Next year (1115) Murabitin (Almoravid) fleet took Baleares from Christians.
You may know guess that Baleares will be strong pirate island…
http://smiles.zy.cz/481.gif
Conclusion - expect at least strong rebels in Al-Andalus, as we don’t know how much slots will be in the game.
If there will be 30 free slots, then I can bet that Cumans will be faction.
http://smiles.zy.cz/174.gif
SLAVS?! WTF? Since when were there Slavs in Spain?!:inquisitive: EDIT:Okey I checked Wiki seems these "Saqaliba" were mercs in the service of the Umayyads who set up emirates in Spain. Heh, yah learn something new every day!
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Re: Medieval Total Realism: Age of Ambition
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SLAVS?! WTF? Since when were there Slavs in Spain?! EDIT:Okey I checked Wiki seems these "Saqaliba" were mercs in the service of the Umayyads who set up emirates in Spain. Heh, yah learn something new every day!
Yep, we try to uncover all the little things :2thumbsup: The more obscure the better hehe.
You know of any other unique phenomena in the Muslim factions?
There were also Slavs who assimilated in Syria as well.
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Re: Medieval Total Realism: Age of Ambition
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trajen the 1st
SLAVS?! WTF? Since when were there Slavs in Spain?!:inquisitive: EDIT:Okey I checked Wiki seems these "Saqaliba" were mercs in the service of the Umayyads who set up emirates in Spain. Heh, yah learn something new every day!
Wikipedia is not good for searching history as Wiki in not primary source (everybody can write what he want and then interpret that).
Primary sources about Slavs in Iberian pininsula are like Abū l 'Abbās al Maqqarī "Nafh at tīb min ghusn al Andalus" from XI century etc (little secret are others).
Plus, Francis Conte (professeur à l'Université de Paris-Sorbonne) wrote excellent book Les Slaves -Aux origines des civilisations d'Europe centrale et orientale (VI-XIII siècles).
It will be more suprises...:2thumbsup:
P.S.
Slavs weren't only excellent mercenaries, they were also poets, teachers, eunchs, viziers etc in Al-Andalus.
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Re: Medieval Total Realism: Age of Ambition
There were also Slavs in the service of the Fatimids...
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Re: Medieval Total Realism: Age of Ambition
Ive done more research on Zara and Split and it seems that Venice has difficulty in forcing its protectorate over Zara and Split despite being given the Ducate of Dalmatia :laugh4: In 1062, there was resistance to a Venetian fleet in Zara....so we know its a grey era of control/loss/control and even more ambiguity. But this means to me that Venice has no effective control over Zara and it seems Split as well. Venice will have to reinforce its Ducate starting from 1062. No soup for you Venetians :laugh4:
Well, at least, u get to send a fleet and start ur maritime empire eh???
:2thumbsup:
Show no MERCY ME HEARTIES!!
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Re: Medieval Total Realism: Age of Ambition
Ive done more research on Zara and Split and it seems that Venice has difficulty in forcing its protectorate over Zara and Split despite being given the Ducate of Dalmatia :laugh4: In 1062, there was resistance to a Venetian fleet in Zara....so we know its a grey era of control/loss/control and even more ambiguity. But this means to me that Venice has no effective control over Zara and it seems Split as well. Venice will have to reinforce its Ducate starting from 1062. No soup for you Venetians :laugh4:
Well, at least, u get to send a fleet and start ur maritime empire eh???
:2thumbsup:
Show no MERCY ME HEARTIES!!
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Re: Medieval Total Realism: Age of Ambition
What I said about Zara and Spaleto? Zara was sacked by Crusaders in 1202 as town refused to accept Venetian supremacy. Several years before that Zara's fleet destroyed large Venitian fleet in gulf of Tarent or ?
P.S.
Open your e-mail. And you doubled posted.
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Re: Medieval Total Realism: Age of Ambition
I can be Seljuk-Ottoman researcher. I did it before and quite frankly, even the Ottoman flag used in the game is utter rubbish. Turkic faction has all to reasearch for.
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Re: Medieval Total Realism: Age of Ambition
Check revised map in first post :2thumbsup:\
or here!
https://img136.imageshack.us/img136/...isedks2.th.jpg
Ah darn it. Keep forgettin...Dang.
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Re: Medieval Total Realism: Age of Ambition
Just one question. Where did Serbia go? Or is it representated by that litle province encircling Dubrovnik?
And your first link is wrong. Remove the damn .th from it.
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Re: Medieval Total Realism: Age of Ambition
Serbia is represented by the Dioclea (Duklje) region, I'm waiting from DukeofSerbia to confirm if Raska/Rascia and Duklje were under the same ruler or not, Dubrovnik was under a Byzantine Strategos but not quite directly under control of Constantinople, nor independent either.
Hopefully Cebei can tell me what territory the Seljukids controlled in 1062.
Notes on changes:
Added provinces:
Tbilisi
Aragon
Western Sahara
Proposed future changes:
More islands..but not as provinces.
These maps are still in the "process".
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Re: Medieval Total Realism: Age of Ambition
Just a humnle suggestion of mine: If there indeed is going to be possible to have 30 factions I think an interesting faction to add could be the Abbasid Caliphate of Baghdad, yeah I know at the start date they were pawns to the Seljuqs (who nonetheless treated them with respect and gave them an illusion of power), but during the 12th century they were practically independent until they were destroyed by the Mongols in the 13th century that is. Even though they were historically confined to a small territory they have a few interesting sides, the Futtuwa code (which was nearly like the chivalric code in Europe, though with much more emphasis on religious zeal I think) developed there and the Abbasids were also terrorized by the Assasins' sect (who would be very fun to include one way or another)...
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Re: Medieval Total Realism: Age of Ambition
I've read recent reviews and the developers keep talking about 17 playable and 4 unplayable factions, which means 21 factions. Darn it. :embarassed:
But if there is indeed 30 faction slots, we will consider a lot of things. :2thumbsup:
I would like a Hashashin faction too!!
I would have liked more pagan factions actually like the Qipchaks, Patzinaks, etc, etc....
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Re: Medieval Total Realism: Age of Ambition
Well, I remember reading on the .com forums a little while back that they were considering raising the faction limit to 30...
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Re: Medieval Total Realism: Age of Ambition
I believe kataphraktoi is referring to this - rather more recent - developer interview.
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=67314
I don't really think there would be scope for more factions at this point (unless there are going to be empty slots left open for modding).
As it is, 17 playable factions and 4 unplayable (most likely rebels, Papal States and the two Native American factions).
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Re: Medieval Total Realism: Age of Ambition
Research Template (Organising Research Data):
You guys can be as detailed possible, theres no rush! MTW2 isn’t out yet, so you have like 6 months to research it!! Have fun!! And remember, small things matter too!
SYMBOL /FLAG of FACTION:
1) NAME OF RESEARCHER: Eg. Supamurat
2) FACTION: Eg. Danes
3) INTRODUCTION TO FACTION:
Eg. The ferocious northmen have been tamed by Christianity. Now they uphold the name of Christ as a Christian Kingdom…etc,etc. The year is 1062.…etc, etc.
4) PROVINCES:
Check my map to see which ones your faction can claim in the year 1062. I'm still making changes, but the provinces were pretty much as they are now. I will notify of any province border changes, but highly unlikely from this poiint on.
Province Name: Eg. Thrace
Capital of Province: Eg. Adrianople (Edirne) If possible, state alternative name as well
Description of province: Eg. Flat featureless plain, good for farming but exposed to enemy attacks.
Tradeable products from province: Wheat
Raw resources from province: eg. Gold
5) MILITARY UNITS:
Remember the mod goes from 1062 to 1453, so unit list must cover this range!!
Name of military unit (if possible, name of unit in native tongue of faction):
Description of military unit:
Unit Type: Describe as either
- LIGHT INFANTRY
- MEDIUM INFANTRY
- HEAVY INFANTRY
- MISSILE INFANTRY
- MISSILE CAVALRY
- LIGHT CAVALRY
- MEDIUM CAVALRY
- HEAVY CAVALRY
- SUPER HEAVY CAVALRY
- ARTILLERY
- GUNPOWDER
Estimated Combat Characteristics
Melee Attack: Rate out of 10
Defence: Rate out of 10
Charge: Describe as either WEAK/MEDIUM/STRONG/IRRESISTIBLE
Armour:
Melee Weapons:
Missile Weapons:
Defensive Panoply:
Speed:
Morale
Discipline:
Notable abilities:
Example of a military unit:
Name of military unit: Klibanophori; Singular Klibanophoros
Description of military unit: A renaissance of the Late Roman Clibanarii, the Klibanophori was re-introduced by Nikephoros Phokas who..etc,etc
Unit Type: SUPER HEAVY CAVALRY
Estimated Combat Characteristics:
Melee Attack: 8
Defence: 8
Charge: MEDIUM
Armour: Lamellar, Mail, Padded Epilorikon
Weapons: Mace, Lance
Missile Weapons: Javelins
Defensive panoply: Small shield
Speed: Slow
Morale: Very good
Discipline: Excellent Discipline
Notable abilities:
Can form wedge
Can fire javelins before charge
6) CULTURE OF THE FACTION:
I’ll leave it at your discretion as to what you consider culture, but it should at minimum discuss religion…although I’d like someone to mention FOOD!!
7) FAMOUS FIGURES:
Famous people in your faction from 1062 - 1453
Don’t limit yourself to just military figures!
It could be:
- Religious figures
- Statesmen
- Poets
- Artists
8) FAMOUS BUILDINGS:
Very obvious - famous buildings. Eg. Hagia Sophia
9) FAMOUS ACHIEVEMENTS OF THE FACTION:
Eg. Seljukids famous for tile work, etc, etc
10) ADDITIONAL INFORMATION OF INTEREST:
- Famous qoutes
- Poems
- Famous Documents
Here is the skeleton TEMPLATE: :2thumbsup:
SYMBOL /FLAG of FACTION:
1) NAME OF RESEARCHER:
2) FACTION:
3) INTRODUCTION TO FACTION:
4) PROVINCES:
Province Name:
Capital of Province:
Description of province:
Tradeable products from province:
Raw resources from province:
5) MILITARY UNITS:
Name of military unit:
Description of military unit:
Unit Type:
Estimated Combat Characteristics
Melee Attack:
Defence:
Charge:
Armour:
Melee Weapons:
Missile Weapons:
Defensive Panoply:
Speed:
Morale
Discipline:
Notable abilities:
6) CULTURE OF THE FACTION:
7) FAMOUS FIGURES:
8) FAMOUS BUILDINGS:
9) FAMOUS ACHIEVEMENTS OF THE FACTION:
10) ADDITIONAL INFORMATION OF INTEREST:
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Re: Medieval Total Realism: Age of Ambition
There's just something I remembered, something pretty important, and it's an issue in a way (in that it could tough to implement) and it's also pretty interesting and it's about Egypt and it's a about religion, the religion in question being Christianity, Coptic Christianity.
Well to put it simply up until the end of the 12th century Egypt was actually a predominately Christian country (most ordinary people were Coptic Christians), however representing them as Catholics or Orthodox Christians wouldn't be right as their belief differed on a key issue, they believe that Christ had two 'natures', so to speak, a human and a divine and they were united but not mixed together, because of this belief they had previously been persecuted by the Byzantines and were viewed with distrust (and as heretics) by Catholics. Muslims did tolerate them and allow them to practise their religion, provided that they pay the special tax for other 'people of the book', some must think that because of this it could work making them Muslims but I don't think that would quite solve it for all their tolerance the Muslims did persecute the Copts at times as well, a certain Fatimid Caliph (Al-Hakim bi-Amr Allah) was the worst and sped up the process of making the country majorly Muslim. The Crusades also created many prejudices against Christians amongst Muslims, even though many Eastern christians held the Catholics as much in contempt as the Muslims did.
So, even though the game is not yet out, how should we try to solve this one?
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Re: Medieval Total Realism: Age of Ambition
i had a quick little idea. was it possible to script rebellions in rtw? if it was then it will probably be do-able again in m2. if it is, then maybe we could stage rebellions that would recreate feudal fragmentation of certain countries like poland (1138) and the kiev rus (circa 1054).
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Re: Medieval Total Realism: Age of Ambition
Quote:
There's just something I remembered, something pretty important, and it's an issue in a way (in that it could tough to implement) and it's also pretty interesting and it's about Egypt and it's a about religion, the religion in question being Christianity, Coptic Christianity.
Well to put it simply up until the end of the 12th century Egypt was actually a predominately Christian country (most ordinary people were Coptic Christians), however representing them as Catholics or Orthodox Christians wouldn't be right as their belief differed on a key issue, they believe that Christ had two 'natures', so to speak, a human and a divine and they were united but not mixed together, because of this belief they had previously been persecuted by the Byzantines and were viewed with distrust (and as heretics) by Catholics. Muslims did tolerate them and allow them to practise their religion, provided that they pay the special tax for other 'people of the book', some must think that because of this it could work making them Muslims but I don't think that would quite solve it for all their tolerance the Muslims did persecute the Copts at times as well, a certain Fatimid Caliph (Al-Hakim bi-Amr Allah) was the worst and sped up the process of making the country majorly Muslim. The Crusades also created many prejudices against Christians amongst Muslims, even though many Eastern christians held the Catholics as much in contempt as the Muslims did.
So, even though the game is not yet out, how should we try to solve this one?
its all hardcoded. :embarassed: by 1062, the Copts and the Monophysites have little influence since egypt and the middle east is majority musliim by 950s. however, we may be able to script it so that whoever owns Jerusalem also benefits from the revenue gained from pilgrimages to the holy shrines.
We could also script buildings that are purpose built to regulate "minority affair", they have the ability to increase revenue by their responsibility for imposing and collecting jizya. Not too sure though...
Quote:
i had a quick little idea. was it possible to script rebellions in rtw? if it was then it will probably be do-able again in m2. if it is, then maybe we could stage rebellions that would recreate feudal fragmentation of certain countries like poland (1138) and the kiev rus (circa 1054).
exactly what i had in mind.
Guys please note the research template!!
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Re: Medieval Total Realism: Age of Ambition
Here are our factions list, will also be posted in first post:
Scottish
England (Pre-Norman)
Duchy of Normandy
Danes
Duchy of Southern Italy
Papal States
HRE
Poland
Rus
France
Crown of Aragon
Leon-Castile
Moorish Sultanate
Egyptian SultanateTurkish Sultanate
Romaion (Byzantines)
Serbs
Venice
Hungary
Mongols
Georgia-Sakartvelo
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Re: Medieval Total Realism: Age of Ambition
Quote:
by 1062, the Copts and the Monophysites have little influence since egypt and the middle east is majority musliim by 950s.
That may be true for the Middle-East as a whole, but Egypt was majorly Coptic Christian at the mod's starting year...
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Re: Medieval Total Realism: Age of Ambition
Is there any important Coptic activity in the year 1062, or after 1062??
As I said before, its all hardcoded.
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Re: Medieval Total Realism: Age of Ambition
Nah, no really important activities except that they were excempt from military service (because of the special 'peoples of the book'-tax) and that they were persecuted by a Fatimid Caliph by the end of the 11th century...
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Re: Medieval Total Realism: Age of Ambition
Quote:
Originally Posted by kataphraktoi
Notes on changes:
Added provinces:
Tbilisi
Aragon
Western Sahara
Aragon didn't own Catalania (Barcelona) in 1062 as they were separate states: Kingdom of Aragon and County of Barcelona. They merged in 116x. So, Catalonia should start as rebel Christian province.
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Re: Medieval Total Realism: Age of Ambition
Quote:
Originally Posted by Randarkmaan
There's just something I remembered, something pretty important, and it's an issue in a way (in that it could tough to implement) and it's also pretty interesting and it's about Egypt and it's a about religion, the religion in question being Christianity, Coptic Christianity.
Well to put it simply up until the end of the 12th century Egypt was actually a predominately Christian country (most ordinary people were Coptic Christians), however representing them as Catholics or Orthodox Christians wouldn't be right as their belief differed on a key issue, they believe that Christ had two 'natures', so to speak, a human and a divine and they were united but not mixed together, because of this belief they had previously been persecuted by the Byzantines and were viewed with distrust (and as heretics) by Catholics. Muslims did tolerate them and allow them to practise their religion, provided that they pay the special tax for other 'people of the book', some must think that because of this it could work making them Muslims but I don't think that would quite solve it for all their tolerance the Muslims did persecute the Copts at times as well, a certain Fatimid Caliph (Al-Hakim bi-Amr Allah) was the worst and sped up the process of making the country majorly Muslim. The Crusades also created many prejudices against Christians amongst Muslims, even though many Eastern christians held the Catholics as much in contempt as the Muslims did.
So, even though the game is not yet out, how should we try to solve this one?
If religion will be hardcoded, then Coptic Christians should be Orthodox. There is no difference between Oriental and Eastern Orthodoxy in current time. Orthodox Churches accepted Oriental Orthodoxy and in future there will be full community.
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Re: Medieval Total Realism: Age of Ambition
Im taking a break. Updates won;t be as frequent, but there will still be weekly updates. And to all team members doing research don't forget the template!!!!!!!
REMINDER AGAIN: CONSULT THE TEMPLATE!! :2thumbsup: