Conseil du Royaume

[TinCow]

No need to worry, de Montpierre, I assure you I have no interest in your womenfolk.

[GeneralHankerchief]

Raynaud de Xaintrailles:

*The noble, unseen by most present until now, stands up and strides to the center of the room. People are muttering to each other about whether this man actually belongs or not. After all, nobody seems to remember him from the Tournament and almost everybody of note was there. Nevertheless, they begin to sit back and listen.*

Good day gentlemen, and I hope you all are well. I hereby once again swear fealty to my King Philippe as well as my Prince and Duc, Louis, and wish long days and pleasant nights upon them.

Now, some of you may not have seen me before. This is perfectly acceptable, as I was… unable… to attend the Tournament. The reason for this is unimportant compared to the matter I will address with you now.

Fellow nobles, I come from Toulouse, which is as you know, a very pleasant area in the South of France. Toulouse and its surrounding areas contain good folk, honest, hearty, God-fearing people. But recently, we have had more to fear than just the Lord. To our west, the English pose a minor threat by occupying the lands of Bordeaux. However, to the south lies a far more dangerous foe. Down on the Iberian Peninsula, the vile and heathen Moors occupy the southern half and threaten to pour through and hit the rest of Europe, just as they did centuries though.

Now, we could wait. Concern ourselves with other matters and hope the Moors go against their very savage nature and stop their conquest and killing, or that the various Christian factions on the Peninsula finally get their act together and hold them off or drive them back. Or, should that fail, we could always repeat the heroics of our ancestor, Charles the Hammer Martel, and turn the tide ourselves at Tours. But I ask you all: Do we really want to risk it getting that close?

No, my fellow children of God, we cannot. We as a people have accomplished too much since the last invasion to risk it all falling apart. We in the South of France have accomplished too much to risk it all being destroyed in the name of some heretical offering to a nonexistent deity. We owe it all, gentlemen, to the people that we watch over, not to let them fall to the threat of eternal damnation!

What the people of the lower Peninsula deserve is a chance at eternal paradise. What our own people deserve is the same, and this will never be allowed to happen with the wicked Mohammedans so nearby. Therefore, it is my intention to take the initiative to drive them back from the Strait of Gibraltar for all time.

Edict 1.5: The Seneschal is instructed to begin assembling generals and men necessary for a Crusade with a target of Cordoba (This is a declaration of war against the Moors). By the end of his term, the Crusade is to have officially set out for its target. The Seneschal is to work toward granting the Pope’s approval for this Holy mission, but the Crusade will begin with or without his blessing. The King is to endeavor to evenly distribute captured Moorish settlements among the Houses.

I hope you will all see the merit in what I am saying. We will all be rewarded in the afterlife should we take up this measure now.

I also second Edicts 1.1, 1.2, and heartily second 1.3.

[Ibn-Khaldun]

A boy, hidden from everyone, sits in the corner and thinks.

"Gah! And I thought that Germans were power hungry and land grabbing egomaniacs! I hope that things will change when I become of age!"

[ULC]

Gaetan raises an eyebrow at Raynaud's proposal.

"Although I would agree that House Aquitaine must drive south into the Kingdom's of Aragon and Navarre, I think you underestimate the prowess of the Portuguese and Spanish, whom you have forgotten my fellow, and whom have beaten back the Almoravids. Are you suggesting that in the entirety of Spain, that not one Spaniard is blessed by God enough that, if his will sees fit, the Muslims will be beaten back across the Gibraltar?"

"I also find it odd that your request would essentially strip bare the of any real armies and generals, when half of the Royaume is occupied by the English. Holy though your quest may be, and gladly would I join in it, but I would never do so to the utter determent of my fellow men."

"I ask that you please reconsider, and simply retake the Spanish March, while Lorraine secures the North. Once this is done, we can be free to remove the English, and then drive south into Islamic lands if god has not blessed the Spanish or Portuguese to do so."

[Vladimir]

*Gontran bolts up, indignant*

Gaeten you fool! How can you advocate we let God's favor fall to the Iberians? What has beautiful France done to you so that you would deny it God's favor?!

*A few deep breaths and the rouge fades from Gontran's face*

The crude Castilians and fish mongers can hardly stay away from each others throats for long enough to realize that the Moors are breathing down their necks. We should undertake this Crusade for the glory of God, the glory of France, and the favor of the Holy See.

While on Crusade our coffers will swell. If the Bastard and his minions do attack when we undertake this Most Holy Cause, where do you think God's favor will lay? The gold saved and experience gained can only aid our long-term goal of reuniting the petals of the flower of France.

I ask you to reconsider your objection and your forgiveness for my initial outburst.

[ULC]

Gaetan shakes his head. "I do not feel the least bit offended at your outburst, you were merely stating your belief. However, I do object with the very idea the Iberians are nothing more then fishmongers and heretics, or the idea that France somehow does not have Gods favor."

"Both we and the Iberians pray to God, and as such God would favor us both if we are true to him - God has infinite love, and infinite patience, and as such, he would look to all his children, and bless them, and not falter as a human would and give attention to only some of them."

"And do not think I am only specifically speaking of just the English praying upon the Royaume - the Germans would be quick to reclaim Charlemanges Empire, the Danes are always willing to plunder, and the very same Iberians we would ignore may prey upon us too. We must focus at home, bring our people back under one banner! Or would you deny an honest Frank his right to join in such a Holy Crusade because his lord does not answer to the King?"

[Ramses II CP]

The Prince rises and speaks once again,

I second Edict 1.5.

Dark days have settled over many formerly Christian regions in Iberia, and though I do honor the valor of the natives who have struggled there it cannot be more clear that they have failed. Not only have they failed to reclaim their lands in the south, they have let increasing numbers of them in their north fall into the very brigandry which troubles our southern border. If the kingdoms there were strong we would not have to aid them in enforcing order, as we so clearly must.

That being said, this call to crusade has not been made in haste! Note that it provide ample time and leeway to the Seneschal to develop a plan for the crusade patiently, over the length of his reign, by saying only that the crusade should set out by the end of the first term. I don't want to lawyer the words of my pious vassal, but fifteen years from now one man riding out from Paris under the banner of the cross might fulfill the letter of the edict without trouble. I rather think we can manage that, no matter who is elected.

More so let me ask you to feel the matter with your heart! Does it not cry out for the blood of infidels? Does it not beg you to take up the banner of Christ and march under the auspices of God? We who speak of chivalry, and I have taken the oath along with many here, do we not also feel a duty to do good works before God, spreading his faith and making an end of his enemies?

I wish France to be whole again as much as any man in this chamber, but that time is not yet. Perhaps in a crusade we can forge such an army, can take such a territory, can win from God such greater favor that when those hardy men return the Bastard will lay aside his claim in peace and return to that bloody island to rot!

I do strongly wish my support not to be seen as merely an issue of regionality as well, so I will go a step further than the encouragement in the edict that the territories been evenly distributed between houses; I will ask indeed that the House of Aquitaine be last to get a Moorish province. Let the more northerly Houses who give more to God's cause be the first to benefit!

On another topic, I will have it known that I frown on edicts such as the one numbered 1.4. In matters of recruitment it is unfitting to force the Seneschal's hand. Bear in mind that the man operates according to the King's will, and it is poor form to attempt to force the King's hand to one's own benefit. I ask that Edict 1.4 be withdrawn immediately, as even it's beneficiary has declined to support it.

The Prince returns to his seat with an expectant look in the direction of Bertin.

[Ignoramus]

Gaspard de Neufville, highly embarrassed, rises to address the conseil.

"Mon highest apologies for mon mistake. I must have missed the section about the requirement of land for office. Forgive me, bons messieurs - I will withdraw my illegal nomination at once."

After hesitating for a moment, Gaspard continues.

"I would however, wish to present an edict which I believe is of the utmost importance.

The Duchie de Bourgogne, of which I am a part, is currently hemmed in by the Duchie de Lorraine to the north, the Duchie de Aquitaine to the south, and the Holy Roman Empire to our west. With the full understanding that the Duc de Lorraine wishes to retake his ducal demesne, there lies very little prospect of Bourgogne being able to expand her domain.

Therefore, I propose the following edict, which attempts to address this.

Edict 1.6: "Should an army be sent to bring the Comte de Flandres back into the Regnum Francorum, it must be lead by a Burgundian."

Gaspard de Neufville resumes his seat.

[woad&fangs]

Prince Louis, I wll not withdraw my proposed edict. The Germans are ready to pounce on Metz and Bruges at any moment. Only Lorraine is in a position to get there before the Germans. We can not wait for reinforcements from Burgundy or Paris. We must attack now and we must have enough soldiers to secure victory.

[ULC]

Gaetan nods at the Princes words.

"I hold no issue with sending a crusade, but with the blessings of both this council and the Pope behind it, however, I must advocate caution upon sinking so much investment into something that may be doomed to only relocate the throne of the Royaume to Iberia. And in such matters, Lorraine I believe holds little interest - it is to far away to reinforce and will be for sometime a money pit, and my Duchy is significantly more interested in keeping the Germans and English away from Paris."

Gaetan's eyes swivel towards Gaspard.

"Which brings me to why the Duchy of Bourgogne is so interested in securing Bruges. I understand that you are hemmed in, but would it be not natural to send your men south? Let us Lorrainians shed our blood taking Bruges, when we have much more at stake then you do - sending yourself Gaspard to Bruges will shed needless blood on your part. Bertin and I, along with Riems garrison, can take Bruges."

"Better to take the Prince up on his offer, and in the spirit of the idea, I ask if it would be acceptable, if this Crusade passes, that the first reconquered city, or castle, be transferred to the Duchy of Bourgogne."

[Ramses II CP]

Prince Louis looks intently at Bertin without a trace of anger in his gaze, but nothing of warmth either.

You are aware that the man most likely to make the attack has disparaged your Edict? That your Prince has asked you to withdraw it? That it impinges on the authority of the King and Seneschal? Needlessly so, even, in the opinion of the men who will fight?

...and still you will not withdraw it?

[Ramses II CP]

Nodding to Gaeten de Rethel the Prince continues,

I am content with that assignment of Crusade territory, though it is not my edict nor my decision in the end. Perhaps the King could speak to the fairness of the matter?

[OverKnight]

A current list of proposed Legislation (go to the bottom of the page).

[woad&fangs]

Bertin nods at the Prince.

Indeed, I will not withdraw it. If it fails to receive the needed seconds or votes, then I accept its failure. However, I have voiced my concerns and I will not be bullied into rescinding them.

[Ignoramus]

Turning to Gaetan, Gaspard begins to respond.

"If we did as you suggested, and sent our men south, we would cause immediate war with the Holy Roman Empire, something which we are not ready not equipped to face. I am sure you would see reason in maintaining friendly relations with our brothers to the east.

I have no qualms about Lorraine being restored to your Duc, but may I ask why are you so eager to claim Flandres as well? Such a result would could the Duchie de Bourgogne to become a mere backwater, unless war were to break out with our neighbours to the east. Something which I consider most unlikely to occur for a long time.

Gaspard resumes his seat.

[ULC]

Gatean shrugs.

"I suggested you send them south, but necessarily to Provence itself. As to Flanders, again, you would gain nothing from sending yourself there, to a holding a province you could not easily reinforce, and in the process, limit the Duchy or Lorraine in the process unless we instigated war. It would not solve any issues, and yet make more."

[GeneralHankerchief]

Raynaud de Xaintrailles:

The Castillians are incompetent and flawed. It is evident, judging by the continued Mohammedan existence on the Iberian peninsula that the Castillians have not been fit for the Lord's favor for quite some time. Indeed, it is only through His mercy and utter disgust for the other residents of the Peninsula that they continue to exist at all, even in the weakened and pathetic state they are in.

No, it will be for the good of everybody involved (save for the Moors, but they are not worth discussing unless it is in the manner of the most efficient way of sending them straight to Hell) if a truly blessed and just nation purges the menace from Iberia.

[OverKnight]

Hugues sighs.

Well before we get to caught up in who gets what, and who should march on what and what not, it is the sole right of the King to decide which, if any, Duchy a newly conquered territory goes to.

As for the Duc de Bretagne and his candidacy for Seneschal, I wish him well. I'd rather be beaten in a melee again than push all that paper.

[AussieGiant]

Frowning to himself and then nodding in agreement at de Champagne's last words Alain stands.

"Yes, well ze expected land grabbing discussions 'ave materialise, I am also guilty of such obvious ploys and apologies to ze King."

He bows towards Philippe and then nods towards Louis.

"While we certainly need to have plans in place, the strength of our foes is such that consolidation and patience is required. Given this would be my approach if I was to be elected Seneschal, I would caution my fellow nobles here on wording edicts that restrict this strategy."

Turning to Raynaud with a far more entertaining look.

"de Xaintrailles, I am a religious man, but calling for a Crusade at zis time is like trying to rodger one to many girl in ze brothel. While it might be enjoyable it is not resources well spent.

To do it wizout ze Pope's blessing would seem even less enjoyable."

[Andres]

Funny to see how the chivalrous ones don't wish to go on a noble crusade and the others do. Maybe the concept chivalrous should be reviewed or there's some hypocrisy going on.

Allthough I couldn't care less about Muslim heathens, it seems to me that our resources are a bit limited at the moment.

On the other hand, before we can rebuild the heathen settlements into decent Catholic ones and start converting the infidel scum, we have to destroy everything that even smells heathen.

If there would come an addition to the Edict about the Crusade on Cordoba dictating that all muslim settlements on the way to Cordoba have to be captured during the Crusade, are to be sacked and all buildings have to be destroyed, then I'd say the Crusade will pay itself. Under such conditions, I could agree with a frivolous adventure in the South.

I'd even like to take part in the fun, if my Duke and the English dogs in Caen and Bordeaux would allow me.

[GeneralHankerchief]

Raynaud de Xaintrailles:

Indeed, that was my intention. There is no purpose of a purge if it is not thoroughly executed. If you like, I will modify my edict to make this clear.

[Ignoramus]

Gaspard de Neufville rises to give his opinion on the Crusades.

I would only support a Crusade against the Moors if the conquered lands were placed under the rule of Leon. Any other action would be opportunistic, rather than motivated by sincere and pious motives.

A Crusade to the Holy Land, however, would need to be governed by the nobles who won the land, for there are no other Christian states to govern them.

[Andres]

Raynaud de Xaintrailles:

Indeed, that was my intention. There is no purpose of a purge if it is not thoroughly executed. If you like, I will modify my edict to make this clear.

Maybe you should, because if it passes as it is now, we risk some "chivalrous" types leading a crusading army and ruining our economy. And getting themselves killed by the "honorably" released captives.

I'd add that all captured prisoners need to be hanged.

They're heathens anyway, so who cares?

[GeneralHankerchief]

Raynaud de Xaintrailles:

Very well, if I hear one more voice in support of this change, I will modify the edict. In the meantime, I will let others decide whether they wish to legislate about the treatment of prisoners.

[econ21]

"Duc Alain de Rohan, you honour us by declaring yourself ready to lead. What, pray, is your manifesto? And is there any legislation that you will require to fulfill it?

We have heard that Duc Hugues de Champagne will not run. What of Prince Louis and Duc Raymond de Provence? A contest is healthy for the Kingdom, particularly if it focuses minds on her future direction. But the sand glass is running and any debate between contestants must begin soon if the voting is to be informed."

[_Tristan_]

The King stands and all murmurs stops.

Mes seigneurs, you all know me to be a staunch defender de notre Mere l'Eglise. I have not forgotten that were it not for the bravery of Charles Martel at Poitiers notre Royaume would have fallen to the Muslim hordes.

Nevertheless, while I can understand the fear and loathing that knowing the Moors have set foot and now have a hold on European soil can create, we must not give way to the fanaticism of a Crusade yet. Les Espagnols et Portuguais are not defeated yet and have managed to create a standstill. Now how would they like to see bands of religious fanatics scour their land for that is how Crusades are led, like swarms of crickets, devastating the countryside which they cross ?

Moreover, I do not wish to see France expand beyond its natural borders while there still remains home territories to regain, and as you well know, this is not for tomorrow.

Even if such a Crusade was granted by the Pope, I agree with the proposal that was made before that all lands reconquered by our amrs by returned to its rightful owner le Roi de Castille et Leon. This would create a strong bond between our two kingdoms, leaving us free to deal with the English and the Germans in their own time, even calling upon our allies to help us.

Once my daughter is in Rome, if this assembly wishes to pursue this course, I will ask her to plead our cause before le Saint Père, but not before.

One other matter requires my attention, I think... I do not like some of the debate going in these halls. Particularly, I do not like the bickering and ambition that worms itself into your words, mes Seigneurs.

While I agree that France must be returned to her former glory de l'Empire de Charlemagne, France will have only one ruler and I will deal with our conquests as I see fit. Should I decide to give Angers to Bourgogne rather than Bretagne, that is my will and I will not have it contradicted. So do not presume to know what course I will hold.

Lastly, I do not like the proposition of binding the Seneschal hands by forcing him to recruit men to give a Seigneur rather than another.

However, if he's willing, I will look favorably to recruiting myself those mercenaries as needed, with the Seneschal necessary allotment of funds and provide them to the general that will seem the most capable of successfully leading the agrred uopn conquests.

Speaking of which, I am saddened and a bit worried for the fate of France when I see so few among its leaders wishing to step up and run for the position of Seneschal.

Turning to his son.

Louis, I would have thought that you would have relished the prospect of taking part of the power of the King before your time ?

Then, scanning the ranks of the dukes.

What of you Provence ? Champagne ? What better way to vie for my favour than to prove yourself worthy by leading the realm on the path of grandeur ?

That said, I will leave you to debate the matters at hand.

[Ramses II CP]

Prince Louis draws his gaze away from Bertin to address his father's concern,

Mon Pere I know more of your heart than you may suspect, and it is not my desire to create dissent by rising above my already lofty place. The day may come when I believe our Kingdom is best served by my taking on the role of Seneschal, but that day is not yet.

On the matter of the Crusade, the edict is most carefully worded to allow ample time for the development of forces towards this noble end. If you wish it I am certain it can be altered to include a provision for temporary ownership of the provinces preperatory to returning them to their prior Christian owners.

I will once more point out, on my own, that the royal prerogative should not be presumed upon. Bertin withdraw your edict. It has felt the disfavor of your King, your Prince, and your own allies within your House. To be true to your intent is noble to a point, and foolishly stubborn beyond that point.

[Marcus Agrippa]

Alexandre rises to speak

My King, Dukes and brother knights.

I Have listened and see much division in our collective thoughts.
With my Ducs permission I shall soon join the company of the Fleur De Lyes and run for it's captain.
I am a Chivilrous man and that means I do what is right.

I believe bringing the near east Metz under our protection would serve our imediate interests.
If the order pursues this and is supported by the King and the Duke of Lorraine then we stand to be united and serving our King and country, our royal highnest shall do with the provence as he sees fit.
While this would be done bringing our focus to restoring France without a war we can't fight, we could pursue alliances to secure our borders.

In this the order will not be at odds with any Duchy.
The order fights for the good of France and the King.

[Andres]

Thierry is in deep thought and looks up. He takes a sip of his goblet of water and stands up to address the Counseil.

Messieurs, it seems like we are not going to war with the English soon and I understand the wisdom behind that.

I also understand that we are going to build infrastructure in our Royaume, which is also a wise course of action.

But, we also have the English present in our very own lands. Yes, we are not powerful enough yet to take the initiative and start war, but we shouldn't be naive by assuming they won't attack us first in the near future. Once the treacherous English make their first moves, we'll need to mass recruit troops.

Some of you speak of conquering rebelious settlements, but we'll need troops for that. I understand that mercenaries will be recruited for that purpose.

Infrastructure is expensive, mercenaries are expensive, recruiting troops to defend ourselves against an attack of the English, is expensive.

We need money.

My esteemed colleague, Raynaud de Xaintrailles, talks about a "Holy Crusade". I prefer to call a spade a spade: we need money, the Moors have rich cities, let's take their money to finance our expensive projects. It will also give an opportunity to the more restless among us to prove themselves on the battlefield. It might be a good lesson for those "chivalrous and honorable" types among us, so that they learn that a silly tournament and a real war are not the same.

It is with this in mind, that I second Edict 1.5. But I'd like to repeat my query to Raynaud and insist that he rephrases it so that all settlements be sacked and all buildings destroyed. Since making money is the purpose, I'd also suggest that we try to ransom the prisoners we take. Of course, if no money is paid, the lifes of our captives are worthless and they should be hanged.

Thierry sits down again.

[AussieGiant]

The duke waits until the King, Prince and other nobles have made their statement.

He then moves onto the chamber floor. His voice is strong and firm and a contrast to his slight but fluid build. He is more boy than man in many respects. He gazes initially at Hermant before then addressing the benches in general.

“My strategy is simple and effective.

Bretagne is cut off from ze rest of ze kingdom. Due to ze Kings wish to refrain from warring wiz ze English, my options as a Duchy are effectively zero.

To zat effect, I can place a ‘and on my ‘eart and swear zat I will do what is best for ze realm as a whole and my objectivity at zis critical moment of our Empires development is assured.

Provinces of opportunity will be taken as efficiently as possible given our limited forces. Metz is certainly one of zem, others will be considered as an when ze time presents itself.

I am an ‘onourable man and zerefore I will conduct ze business of France in a like minded fashion. Our enemies and allies will know where we stand and why.

Given our current underdeveloped facilities, crowns will be given to all Dukes for ze development of our roads, churches and economy. It goes with out saying zat Paris will also benefit from zis expenditure.

Likewise we will open a dialogue with ze Pope in Rome. What they will bring is anyone’s guess but I will endeavour to raise our standing wiz him.

Please be aware, I am not a supporter of mercenaries and zey will be recruited only when absolutely necessary. I do not believe in ‘anding valuable experience in battle to men who can from one moment to ze next be fighting for someone else.

As for edicts, Bretagne ‘as none at zis time. If I am to be considered I would prefer flexibility zan a set of edicts that limit me at zis time.

At this moment the young Duke, stops pacing as he has done since he began to speak.

“On a final note, I know some ‘ere believe I am too young to lead zis Kingdom, I can appreciate zat position, I may ‘ave inherited Bretagne before my time and my fazer certainly went to an early grave. But since ze age of twelve I have been tutored and educated to do just zis task.

I ask you to give me zis shance.”