View Full Version : Cold War Cataclysm. Sign up thread
Greyblades
05-13-2009, 04:17
WARNING THIS IS A 1980 WHAT IF SCENARIO, NONE OF THE VIEWS OR ACTIONS POSTED HERE ARE MENT TO BE TAKEN SERIOUSLY. THIS IS A PURELY SPECULATIVE SCENARIO, IF YOU ARE EASILY OFFENDED BY COLD WAR POLITICS DO NOT CONTINUE AND CLOSE THIS TOPIC.
I intend to start a non mafia game about the cold war within the next 2 months.
This will be a game quite like Noble sons 2 in that you will take a country and lead it to victory or at least survive without getting turned to ash, think of this as the roleplayers dream. The difference is that you will be taking over a real country in the world during 1980.
I could go on but I want this thread up before 5 in the morning so I will just say this:
Look at the map and if you are interested in playing, copy it and use micosoft paint to colour in the five countries you would most want to play. Realy, any country, be it russia or the holy see and you will get one of them, which one you will get will determine on which countries are wanted by multiple players.
https://img218.imageshack.us/img218/9774/templatet.jpg Anyone interested?
Update
Nice to see that people are taking an interest. Allthough in hindsight I should have asked you lot to list them from top to bottom which ones you want the most to make dividing the countries out easier.
The game can have up to about 15-20 players and I might have to recruit a sub host to deal with the writeups. I am fine with just about anyone having the non nuclear nations like Poland, Canada, Switzerland, etc. but I am going to have to put a restraint on who gets the "Nuclear five" and India because there will be nukes in this game and I would rather not have them being fired off at random by a player that is easily rilled (Like in my days of playing superpower 2, when they peeved off the USA it got pretty messy). So USA USSR China UK India and France won be given out lightly but the rest are up for grabs.
As for the Actual game I am not sure whether or not to make unique goals for each player, get through 20 years with the most to show for it or, if it turns out this way, survive till 2000 without getting nuked.
Update 2
The main 4 alliances will be Nato, the countries that have been persuaded not to become communist or being supported by a Nato faction, Warsaw pact and other Russian allies and their supporters.
The main game will be each side trying to convert undecided nations and destroy or cripple any active supporters of the other side while using espionage, sabotage, assassination, coup attempts and generally terror to make the enemy weak enough so that you can win should Defcom 2 ever be declared. But that will be if neither side is willing to go on all out warfare over Europe and Alaska straight away and risk nuclear holocaust.
The factions that aren't taken by a player will be played by me. I.E. will pretty much act historically and otherwise just sit on their arses until a player interferes with them or an alliance member asks for aid from all members of said alliance.
Caius: USA
Death is yonder: USSR
Centurion 1: China
Drizzt: UK.
AVSM: Somolia
Pevergreen : West Germany.
White_eyes:D: Turkey
The Flax: Pakistan.
Beefy: Japan
Blackadder: France
Zim: India
Navarro: Cuba.
Khazaar: East Germany.
Beskar: Iran.
Ichigo: Italy
Khaan: Indonesia.
Jolt: Portugal
Roadkill: Canada
Heres the final game rules and system summary.:
The rules and systems
The main rules
1.When you want your country to do something PM me what you want and as long as it is realistic and you can afford it you should see its effects either in the writeup.
2.Each turn will last 2-3 days 2 days for everyone to have a chance to get in on whatever discussion and to send in orders and one for me to do the calculations and all that and ATPG to do the writeups.
3.Each order can be anything from a single sentance of "attack this with that many soldiers" or it can be paragraphs detailing the tactics to be used in each part of the plan. It might give you a bonus in combat but mostly it'll give atph more to work with,
Millitary system
I will keep this somewhat simple, each country will be given a set number of armies with a 1-10 tech rating. For each millitary action choose how many armies you will take from your reserves to devote to the actions. The more you send the higher the chance that you will succeed, simple?.
The tech levels will keep countries like New zealand or poland, who have small but well equipped armies, from being killed by countries like venezuala who has a similar amount of armies but have troops using a poorer quality of weaponry.
Now most conflicts will be determined by a roll of a dice and the numbers that will have to be rolled to see which side wins will be subjected to modifiers like the tech levels and number of armies involved. Dont be afraid to send in tactics with your orders it will influence the writeup and, if its good enough, affect the chance of success.
One last thing, If your tech level is 5 levels below the country you are fighting you will lose automatically unless you outnumber them three to one. That goes both ways: if your enemy is still using weaponry like lee enfields or thompson machine guns that havent been used in 20+ years and you are using M16's and abrams (ie you are 5 levels above them) you will roll over them easily.
The espionage system
The most versatile method of war, Each turn you can ask for your secret services to concentrate on doing one fact finding mission, be it finding where the enemy is keeping its ICBN's or what cologne their chief of staff is using either way they will attempt to find out. Or you could just tell them to search for enemy spies which will add a bonus on to the spycatch score(I'll tell you later).
Each country will gain 2 ratings: espionage (1 to 5) and counter espionage (1 to 5).
Espionage efficiency is the main reference I will use to determine what dice roll you must get to succeed; If your score is 1 and you are up against someone with a counter score of 1 you will have to get a 6, if your score is five its a 2+, etc.
The counter espionage score is the modifier that tells me how much chance that your law enforcement and citizens will find enemy spies I.E. how many points are taken off of the enemies dice roll. A score of 2+ can be converted to a 5+ by having a counter espionage high enough to give you a score of 5.
Economics
Ok then I'll try to explain this as well as I can but YLC will probably have to correct me.
Each turn you will earn 20 points per trading partner added to the base economy growth. You can spend your collected cultural exchange points on many actions, most of them I probably wont have thought of so if you dont see it on this meager list I'll just come up with a cost when asked:
1.a new army that will cost 10 points for each tech level you have, with a limit of one per day unless specified otherwise,
2.a coup D'etat in a minor country for 30 points.
I'm keeping minor espionage and sabotage free seeing as the price for an agent, a rifle and a pack of tnt is pretty irrelivent to a countries budget but medium actions will cost 10 points, major 20 points and epic actions like blowing up the pentagon or even bigger will cost 50 apeice.
Nuclear developement
I wasn't planning to actrually let anyone develope and build nuclear weapons as I didnt realy think that there would be much point expecting any country other than the superpowers could afford to do it. I dont expect anyone will actually do it but if you can pull it off then heres the way: The process to go nuclear will be difficult and expensive for most countries. To start the process you have to stockpile 1500 cultural exchange points and tell me to start the program. You will then have to spend 3 years, 12 whole turns, without being attacked before you will get the capability to start making nuclear weapons.
The prices for nuclear weapons will be as such:
1.one ICBN for 20 points after completing nuclear developement.
2.one nuclear missle suited for submarines will cost 10 points
3.one nuclear bombing run for 5 points
4.enough nuclear ammunition for an artillery volley for 2 points
The role layout:
I think I should have explained this through before sending them out but I think its too late to be thinking like that. Anyway if there were any part of your role PM's you didnt understand heres a description of each section.:
Name
Government Type -
The government type pretty much decides the B.E.G and having the same government will give you a bonus when dealing with a NPC.
Base Economy Growth (B.E.G) -
This is the amount of economic points you will generate for yourself each turn the 10-50 means hat you the minimum you will get between 10 and 50 points per turn..
Cultural Exchange Points -
This is the starting points you have.
Trade Good -
This is the bonuses that each player country can give to their allies and trading partners. The bonuses affects the host aswell and it should serve as a sort of incentive for the superpowers to actually keep their allies and not try to absorb them as if they get kicked out of the game the effects are removed from the game with them.
National Attributes
This is where I put the situational effects, national bonus's that you get over the other countries and minor abilities. I will keep track of the effects and bonus' for you but you will have to inform me when you want the ability to be used.
Military Tactic
This was origionally supposed to be a seperate thing and I think one or two roles have one of these for everyone else this part was merged with the national attributes seeing as I couldnt think of an unique tactic for more than 2 countries.
Military
Battalions at the ready -
This is the base amount of battallions you support during peace time I'll increase this and the recruitment pool in proportion to the amount of land you take when you are fighting. At the start when you lose forces by not engaging in battle for 4 turns while you are recruiting you can quickly replensh up to this number.
Recruitment Pool -
This is the amount of troops over the base line that you can recruit to your army the average recruitment rate is one battalion/army a turn unless I have stated otherwise.
Offence - 1-10
How good your men are at attacking, this stat will be compared to the enemies defence to help determine whether you will win or lose.
Defence - 1-10
How good your men are at defending a position, this stat will be compared to the enemies offence to determine if you win or lose.
Recon - 1-5
How likely you will notice an attack before its too late to prepare.
Stealth - 1-5
How likley you will take the enemy by surprise.
Morale - 1-10
How long your troops can last while in harsh conditions (like constant hit and run attacks, harassment by snipers, fighting suicidal forces, etc) without becoming innefficient(penalties to offence and defence) or even mutiny(your soldiers could do anything from refusing to act or attack recklessly in a search for revenge)
Tech 1-10
I'll explain this later on but in effect is the difference from the US rangers to zulu spearmen.
Nuclear weapons
Number of nukes: 0
Average yeild 0 KT
ICBN:
SSNB:
Bombers:
Artillery
The main difference between each type of nuke is generally range: bombers are for short ranges like say they can go from the Paris to Moscow but wont be able to go from Calias to China, Artillery are for the next country over like Eastern France to West Germany.
SSNB's, or nuclear subs, are the mobile launchers and can be placed in any sea as long as it isn't land locked like the great lakes etc. The closer you place them to the enemy the more chance you will be able to nuke them before they know what's going on but it also increases the chance of them being detected before hand which by the way is a very good excuse for war.
And ICBN's, the silos, are able to hit anywhere from anywhere. Simple huh?
The main game play element that nukes will play is placement. You can make a country really sweat by putting a nuke in their neighbours garden. Remember you can't actually fire them unless Defcom one is declared this goes for every other officially nuclear country.
Secret service:
Espionage: 1-10
Counter:1-10
Special forces:
This is pretty much where I explain how good your spies and special forces are. Unless your people are especially good, a superpower or in the two alliances it will pretty much look like this:
You have a regular Spec ops/secret service that can do minor and medium sabotage and espionage actions without much problem. Major actions like bombing an airforce base containing nuclear bombers, finding the locations of the enemies armour depots or even sabotaging the Kremlin/pentagon will need allied help if you want to have more than a 1 in 10 chance to succeed.
Special abilites:
I dont think I have to say very much about this part. Its a powerful action or ability that only the recipient can implement.
pevergreen
05-13-2009, 04:38
Cant do what you askd because im at work, but I'd play Australia, Brazil, Egypt, Italy, Sweden.
seireikhaan
05-13-2009, 04:43
Indonesia, Egypt, Somalia, Cuba, Bhutan.
Italy would be my first choice. The rest: UK, Turkey, Yugoslavia, or USSR
A Very Super Market
05-13-2009, 04:58
Micronesia, Easter Island, Vanuatu, Maritius, and the Galapagos.
Japan, Iran, Cuba, Switzerland, United Kingdom.
https://img17.imageshack.us/img17/9774/templatet.jpg
Iskander 3.1
05-13-2009, 05:32
France, Switzerland, UK, USSR, Canada
Beefy187
05-13-2009, 05:38
Besker took my first choice. So...
Korea, North Korea, China, Taiwan
Prepare to die :beam:
Askthepizzaguy
05-13-2009, 06:27
China, Iran, North Korea, USSR, Cuba
In, if I can play one of the badddddd guys.
Cultured Drizzt fan
05-13-2009, 09:55
United Kingdoms, Poland, Chile, Israel, Greece.
https://img4.imageshack.us/img4/9415/coldwarcataclysm.jpg
West Germany, USSR, US, Czechoslovakia, South Africa
Besker took my first choice. So...
Korea, North Korea, China, Taiwan
Prepare to die :beam:
Beefy took ALL my choices :furious3:
Beefy187
05-13-2009, 11:49
Beefy took ALL my choices :furious3:
You still have Hong Kong :laugh4:
Ok in that case
I'll change mine to, Thai, Indonesia, Vietnam, Mongol, India
Greyblades
05-13-2009, 14:46
OP Updated.
Doesn´t Israel and Pakistan have nukes too? Isn´t that one of the major deterrants against its neighbours?
Greyblades
05-13-2009, 15:18
Not before 1980 Apparantly (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_states_with_nuclear_weapons) Sorry wikipedia isnt the best source but its the best I could find. And even if they did they I doubt that they would be willing to use them around by then for fear of the US or russia taking notice.
Actually that could work, I could have emergant nuclear powers coming around mid game to spice things up. And there is the nuclear sharing going on between the Nato countries to be considered so I guess... I'm going to have to think about this.
I guess it doesn´t matter for gamemechanics, they probably have a small stockpile only. I just dug out jarred fragments of information.
I´d pick (in order of preference): East Germany, Japan, Vietnam, North Korea or Denmark
Greyblades
05-13-2009, 16:03
@ Kazaar: Not unless Blackadder has changed his mind recently.
I'm probably going to regret this, but seeing as noone else is taking interest in the USA, YLC will be USA should no-one try to claim it. I did say that the Nuclear countries weren't going out to the first slack-jaw that asked but I do actually need someone to play them
Updating the tally:
Tally of countires:
Khaan: Indonesa, Egypt, Cuba, Bhhutan.
Ichigo: Italy, UK, Turkey, Yugoslavia, USSR.
Iskander: France, Switzerland, UK, USSR, Canada,
Beefy: Japan, Taiwan, S. Korea, Mongolia, Thailand
YLC: W Germany, USSR, US, Czechoslovakia, South Africa. USA
Kazaar: East Germany, Japan, Vietnam, North Korea, Denmark
The Flax: Pakistan, Turkey, Saoudi Arabia, West Germany.
Captain Blackadder: Australia, East Germany, Poland, France
White_eyes:D: Pakistan
ATPG: China
Drizzt: Israel.
AVSM: Somolia
Beskar: Iran.
Pevergreen : Sweden.
Remember just because someone else asked for it doesnt mean its definitate he will get it over you
Tally depicting Uncontested countries per name:
Khaan: Bhhutan. Egypt, Indonesia, Cuba.
Ichigo: Yugoslavia. Italy.
Iskander: Canada. Switzerland.
Beefy: Thailand, Mongolia, Taiwan.
YLC: Czechoslovakia, South africa, US.
Kazaar: Denmark, N. Korea
Blackadder: Australia, Poland.
At this point if you wanted you could ask for one of the ones beside your name and you wouldnt get contested but I would advise trying for the prominent ones anyway.
Contested:
France: Blackadder, Iskander
West Germany: YLC, The Flax.
East Germany: Blackadder, Kazaar.
Cuba: Khaan, ATPG.
UK: Ichigo, Iskander.
USSR: Ichigo, Iskander, YLC.
Japan: Beefy, Khazaar.
Vietnam: Beefy, Khazaar.
Turkey: The Flax, Khaan.
Ive probably missed alot out so if you have issue with the tally just tell me.
Greyblades
05-13-2009, 17:37
I'm going to need at least 4 more people.
Askthepizzaguy
05-13-2009, 18:18
I'll take China now. Now, not later. China still cool. We much more awesome than dumb Americans.
http://acc6.its.brooklyn.cuny.edu/~phalsall/images/c-flag.gif
Oh look what I just built. It thermonuclear missile. Would you like to order the Moo Goo Bye Bye?
I'll try to play it a little more authentic and a little less offensive during the actual game... unless everyone is cool with a "South Park" style impression of awesome Chinese dictatorship.
I think given the sheer number of countries, and also how close China and North Korea are, I should play both.
Perhaps everyone can pick a couple countries?
Greyblades
05-13-2009, 18:24
Good now I can start coming up with a couple of military goals for china.
And I would rather it be one person to one country or there will be one heck of confusion in roleplaying.
Askthepizzaguy
05-13-2009, 18:25
Sign me up for hosting assistant if you need help with the writeups. To be fair, you have to just give me the results, I can't determine them myself.
Greyblades
05-13-2009, 18:28
That was what I was thinking when I asked for sub hosts. Ok then.
I'd like Pakistan, Turkey, Saoudi Arabia, Afghanistan (Is that even possible?), Federal Republic of Germany (Western Germany)
https://img.photobucket.com/albums/v638/The_Flax/templatet.jpg
Cultured Drizzt fan
05-13-2009, 20:14
alright, I will go with Israel, I can live with that. go IDF!!!!
I will go with Iran.
I believe this is the beginning of the Islamic Republic of Iran, and in the time-frame of Iranian-Iraqi war and disagreements with the Afghanistan Taliban. All sorts of various events during this time period.
Unless some one who is Iranian wants to take over, I will allow them priority.
How much are we going to follow history and the alliances in place at that time? I am aware that once the game starts we will be changing the course of history, but will we basing ourselves on all the previous events during the Cold War and the current crisises and wars in 1980?
Having majored in history and minored in international relations, I am very interested in this. :yes:
I'd like Pakistan, Turkey, Saoudi Arabia, Afghanistan (Is that even possible?), Federal Republic of Germany (Western Germany)
https://img.photobucket.com/albums/v638/The_Flax/templatet.jpg
If TF gets west, I demand East Germany then :brood:
If TF gets west, I demand East Germany then :brood:
Its my fifth pick, versus your first pick. I doubt I'll get since I want four others contries before that which nobody wants for now.
If pever really wants Italy he can have it, and I'll take Turkey. If he doesn't then I'll take Italy.
Italy, Turkey, UK Yugoslavia, USSR.
From most wanted to the least.
A Very Super Market
05-13-2009, 23:46
My countries will be the grand headquarters of SMERSH and such! I will create havoc for the government and provide women for James Bond to run off with! Super fun!
Beefy187
05-14-2009, 01:33
In that case,
Japan, Taiwan, Vietnam, Thailand and Mongol from most wanted to the least :bow:
Captain Blackadder
05-14-2009, 08:11
Australia,East Germany,Poland,France,
Greyblades
05-14-2009, 12:04
How much are we going to follow history and the alliances in place at that time? I am aware that once the game starts we will be changing the course of history, but will we basing ourselves on all the previous events during the Cold War and the current crisises and wars in 1980?
Having majored in history and minored in international relations, I am very interested in this. :yes:
The main 4 alliances will be Nato, the countries that have been persuaded not to becomne communist or being supported by a nato faction, Warsaw pact and other russian allies and their supporters.
The main game will be each side trying to convert undecided nations and destroy or cripple any active supporters of the other side while using espionage, sabotage, assassination, coup attempts and generaly terror to make the enemy weak enough so that you can win should Defcom 2 ever be declared. But that will be if neither side is willing to go on allout warfare over europe and alaska staright away and risk nuclear holocaust.
My countries will be the grand headquarters of SMERSH and such! I will create havoc for the government and provide women for James Bond to run off with! Super fun!
I'm giving you somolia and you will like it.
alright, I will go with Israel, I can live with that. go IDF!!!!
You can still try for the other factions if you want.
Japan, Iran, Cuba, Switzerland, United Kingdom.
Give me back my avatar!
This is not your avatar, it is a different face, position and hood colour!
Greyblades
05-14-2009, 12:27
Hmph, my blooming replacement computer has a monitor thats dark enough to make Beevis and the buthead look bright and refined.
Yes, you got green (possibly my favourite colour) while I got grey.
Greyblades
05-15-2009, 19:15
Hmm, well this was pretty odd timing; the day I sent off my computer to have a video card installed and tested (After making a multicore processor into a small drinks mat I leave the installing of new parts to the pro's) the entire forum goes haywire. Just a reminder that I will need about 3 more players and maybe one more guy who is good at writeups.
Greyblades
05-15-2009, 23:01
OP Updated
I would like some ideas on how to make players able to fight it out without them holding back on the premise of "if we start to win too much they will nuke us and its game over".
Askthepizzaguy
05-16-2009, 00:58
The idea could be something along the lines of real life... there were plenty of conflicts where nukes weren't used but certain nations still engaged in warfare. The idea might be to obtain the alliance of one of the nuke-carrying nations so you can battle with approval of one of the nuclear club. The alliance can be made public, so if someone uses nukes on that nation, the allied nation uses their nukes on them.
If 2 nuke nations are at war, it must be assumed that if nukes are launched to obliterate that one nation, an automatic return volley will be sent and that will wipe out the nuking power as well.
Greyblades
05-16-2009, 01:24
Well at the time there was alot of guerilla warfare going on in afew countries between the USA/USSR sponsered states and rebels/freedomfighters. Maybe I could have it so that if the sides dont help their side win the civil wars they could lose main resources with consequences. For example if Venesuala becomes communist, Nato loses an oil supply and take longer to mobilise for war.
I think I will implement one or two mercenary nations like somolia that if supplied and armed by, lets say, Russia, they will raid nato's shipping and make transportation around the indian ocean area allmost imposisible and the only way to stop it is to invade.
A Very Super Market
05-16-2009, 01:27
Huh, so I am Somalia now? Dawh.
Greyblades
05-16-2009, 01:29
Lighten up, you wanted to be a pain in the arse so I gave you the pirate faction.:grin:
White_eyes:D
05-16-2009, 01:33
If I was the U.S.S.R I would launch the nukes.....(I was always the first one to do it in DEFCON:everybody loses....)
I would always win:2thumbsup:......what's left...:sweatdrop:
Greyblades
05-16-2009, 01:36
Hmm, another one off the "likely to be responsible with nukes list". Still, there's about 200 other countries to play if your interested.
White_eyes:D
05-16-2009, 01:43
Hmm, another one off the "likely to be responsible with nukes list".
This made me laugh for about 5 mins....:laugh4: most players online hate me.......I ALWAYs whip out the WMD's on any game.....
Rise of Nations:I nuked many of my allies in diplomacy.....(can't have them turn on me:beam:)
Starcraft: I used nukes many times in diplomacy.....yet again.....:clown:
Star wars: Empire at war: I would the Death Star more then a little more was needed......:evil: nobody wants to play 1v1 in that campaign map anymore:cry2:
pevergreen
05-16-2009, 01:45
I'll go Sweden, so Ichi can have Italy and CB can have Aus.
White_eyes:D
05-16-2009, 01:48
I would like Pakistan......(it has nukes:book:)
First one to get nuked is Somalia:beam:
Iskander 3.1
05-16-2009, 01:49
Not during the cold war, it didn't.
Beefy187
05-16-2009, 01:49
I'll withdraw from Indonesia and Vietnam
Instead I'll claim Taiwan and South Korea.
Who ever is Japan is going to have a nightmare..
White_eyes:D
05-16-2009, 01:50
Not during the cold war, it didn't.
Don't worry.....I well research it.....like I did in Hearts of Iron....:laugh4:
Greyblades
05-16-2009, 01:54
You could yes but I doubt that you would be able to mass produce WMD's without someone catching on. The large test Explosions on remote pacific islands are kinda hard to miss.
White_eyes:D
05-16-2009, 01:57
Don't worry.....I will only nuke the ANNOYING guys....Somalia pirates are on the top of that list...:bow:
Greyblades
05-16-2009, 02:00
I am starting to think I will have to make upholding the geneva convention compulsory for player countries. Or at least the USA and European ones.
White_eyes:D
05-16-2009, 02:02
Well.....nobody really listens to it.......I don't have any idea why it would stop me from nuking someone....:laugh4:
Greyblades
05-16-2009, 02:05
Well if I remember correctly, nuking, or otherwise killing, civillians, is considered unsporting.
Beefy187
05-16-2009, 02:20
Well if I remember correctly, nuking, or otherwise killing, civillians, is considered unsporting.
So as creating a explosive chemicals in a medievil times :clown:
I have a question. Do some countries start as allies? Eg, America and Canada? Or is alliance totally up to the players?
Askthepizzaguy
05-16-2009, 02:28
given those alliances can change on turn one, I dont think it matters.
Greyblades
05-16-2009, 02:33
I have allready said that there will be 2 starting alliances: Nato and Warsaw pact, and though you may leave a your leisure it is encouraged that you all stay in an alliance with a superpower at all times because I can easily see any defectors being pounced on by their enemies. You can do as you wish but remember no one country can beat one of the superpowers without aid.
So as creating a explosive chemicals in a medievil times
There have been explosive chemicals for aeons, its just it was only recently that humans figured out how to synthesise some..
A Very Super Market
05-16-2009, 03:58
SOMALIANS, WHAT IS YOUR PROFESSION?
I will have fun with this. Whee!
So I presume I will get EastGermany...
Greyblades
05-16-2009, 12:21
@ Kazaar: Not unless Blackadder has changed his mind recently.
I'm probably going to regret this, but seeing as noone else is taking interest in the USA, YLC will be USA should no-one try to claim it. I did say that the Nuclear countries weren't going out to the first slack-jaw that asked but I do actually need someone to play them
Updating the tally:
Tally of countires:
Khaan: Indonesa, Egypt, Cuba, Bhhutan.
Ichigo: Italy, UK, Turkey, Yugoslavia, USSR.
Iskander: France, Switzerland, UK, USSR, Canada,
Beefy: Japan, Taiwan, S. Korea, Mongolia, Thailand
YLC: W Germany, USSR, US, Czechoslovakia, South Africa. USA
Kazaar: East Germany, Japan, Vietnam, North Korea, Denmark
The Flax: Pakistan, Turkey, Saoudi Arabia, West Germany.
Captain Blackadder: Australia, East Germany, Poland, France
ATPG: China
Drizzt: Israel.
AVSM: Somolia
Beskar: Iran.
Pevergreen : Sweden.
Remember just because someone else asked for it doesnt mean its definitate he will get it over you
Tally depicting Uncontested countries per name:
Khaan: Bhhutan. Egypt, Indonesia, Cuba.
Ichigo: Yugoslavia. Italy.
Iskander: Canada. Switzerland.
Beefy: Thailand, Mongolia, Taiwan.
YLC: Czechoslovakia, South africa, US.
Kazaar: Denmark, N. Korea
Blackadder: Australia, Poland.
At this point if you wanted you could ask for one of the ones beside your name and you wouldnt get contested but I would advise trying for the prominent ones anyway.
Contested:
France: Blackadder, Iskander
West Germany: YLC, The Flax.
East Germany: Blackadder, Kazaar.
Cuba: Khaan, ATPG.
UK: Ichigo, Iskander.
USSR: Ichigo, Iskander, YLC.
Japan: Beefy, Khazaar.
Vietnam: Beefy, Khazaar.
Turkey: The Flax, Khaan.
Pakistan: The flax, White eyes.
Ive probably missed alot out so if you have issue with the tally just tell me.
I thought this goes in order of posting, so if I posted East Germany first and Blackadder Australia first he´d get Australia and I´d get East Germany... Anyway sratch Denmark from my list, I´d be willing to go USA if you need it. I´m not a crazy player...
Greyblades
05-16-2009, 12:35
If you claim a country and noone else claims it you can get it without any argument but if someone else claims it I flip a coin or go to random org. or whatever and the country gets given out to one of the requesters randomly.
seireikhaan
05-16-2009, 17:57
My preference order: 1) Indonesia, 2) Egypt, 3) Bhutan, 4) Cuba
Greyblades
05-16-2009, 18:03
Well unless someone asks for indonesia in the next day or so its pretty much yours.
navarro951
05-16-2009, 18:58
I would love to play with my people...VIVA CUBA POR VIDA!!
navarro951
05-16-2009, 19:52
Also if this is the Cold War, how can one play as vietnam or germany.
there would be an east and west and a south and north.
Greyblades
05-16-2009, 20:06
West and east germany are their own factions and as far as I am aware vietnam was in one piece by 1980.
About the tally, you seemed to have placed Pakistan as uncontested for White Eyes, yet that was my first pick, so it should be contested. :bow:
Also, you posted earlier that there would be NATO and the Warsaw Pact as the starting alliances, how do you categorize countries outside of that bipolar system? Like China, India, Pakistan, to name just a few important ones.
Greyblades
05-16-2009, 20:18
Nato alliance afilliated countries, Warsaw pact afilliated countries and neutral countries with their own agenda.
The tally was thrown together at the last minute so thanks for pointing that out.
navarro951
05-16-2009, 20:18
West and east germany are their own factions and as far as I am aware vietnam was in one piece by 1980.
O this is just 1980s of the cold war?
Askthepizzaguy
05-16-2009, 20:20
1980 and beyond only.
China wants to announce that it prefers to tend to its own matters of state and does not wish to become a puppet of the Soviet regime or of the American Empire.
Just noticed something else Greyblades, you took out Afghanistan from my list of countries, does that mean it is unplayable?
A Very Super Market
05-16-2009, 20:26
Somalia wants to state that we've got your oil.
Greyblades
05-16-2009, 20:30
^ Huh, I thought they got their oil from the middle east, Texas and Venesuala.
@The flax: No just a typo, I'm going to look up afganistan's status in 1980 before I put it back up there though.
Greyblades
05-16-2009, 20:34
I looked it up, Afghanistan was invaded by Russia in 1979 so I would guess that you cant play Afghanistan unless you want to be an occupied nation with no military until 1989 or at least until you are liberated.
Afghanistan was occupied by the USSR in 1980, but they really didn't control the country at all. Russian troops mainly held the big cities and got bogged down in asymmetric warfare with various guerrilla factions.
In my mind it would be playable, but not as a standard country. Basically a player could control the opposition forces in the country and make appeals to other countries for help. Anyhow, its sort of moot since I'd much rather play Pakistan. :clown:
Greyblades
05-16-2009, 20:50
Technically its not moot seeing as it is a 50/50 chance between you and White eyes... So do you want heads or tails?
Technically its not moot seeing as it is a 50/50 chance between you and White eyes... So do you want heads or tails?
Heads. And if I lose, then we can flip for Turkey. If I lose that, then I might consider Afghanistan. Still moot for me since Saudi Arabia (3rd pick) is uncontested.
Now, you better flip that coin in my favor mister. :smash:
:clown:
Greyblades
05-16-2009, 20:59
Ok then *Flips 20p coin* heads. You get it, White eyes if you would be so kind as to request another country. Theres a couple of countries where the americans and russians have installed missile silos if you want.
Now I have to find a way to see who gets the USSR, somehow I doubt that a coin will cut it..
1980 and beyond only.
China wants to announce that it prefers to tend to its own matters of state and does not wish to become a puppet of the Soviet regime or of the American Empire.
We long ago gave up our Imperialistic notions through conquest, thank you very much. And stop calling the Kettle black - You design to have as much or more influence in the world as either us or the USSR.
White_eyes:D
05-17-2009, 02:08
Fine......I well go with....whatever one that has not been claimed yet......(this is not very balanced, if people are claiming 100 countries and getting them....:inquisitive: I can understand supwerpowers like...USA or USSR...but most of middle east?????!!!)
Greyblades
05-17-2009, 02:13
100 countries? Mate there is only going to be 20 players with one country each. Allthough I guess I should have thought about the method of assigning countries some more.
White_eyes:D
05-17-2009, 02:20
Well....The Flax is getting Pakistan, Turkey and West Germany....WHY in the hell would Pakistan help NATO???? he should choose a nation in middle east again or just rename his country or something....I was thinking of only one country per player....otherwise it is a confusing mess....(unless someone helps host.....I can't...10-20 mins day is not enough time for this kind of thing:sweatdrop:)
Greyblades
05-17-2009, 02:22
Huh? They're the countries that he had a claim to. He's only getting Pakistan.
No I havent updated the tally.
White_eyes:D
05-17-2009, 02:27
The Flax: Pakistan, Turkey, Saoudi Arabia, West Germany.
So what does this mean??:book: Does he get those as well?? or is it meaning he called for those but only gets Pakistan now??? if true...I go for Canada....and it better be a coin toss in my favor:brood:
Greyblades
05-17-2009, 02:37
I knew that there would be a load of people wanting the same thing so I made it so that they would have a fair chance at getting the one they wanted by making each player make a claim for the 5 countries they most wanted. I would then use random.org to chose who gets the ones with multiple claims that's all.
I'm kinda glad I'm not starting off straight away now seeing all the chaos that this system has made I think it will probably take weeks just to get people happy and with a country. :sweatdrop:
Final Word: There will not be any players with multiple countries.
White eyes: You want Turkey but Ichigo also has a claim to it. I will wait until he comes here and says that he wants to uphold his claim and if he will it I will flip for it.
So what does this mean??:book: Does he get those as well?? or is it meaning he called for those but only gets Pakistan now??? if true...I go for Canada....and it better be a coin toss in my favor:brood:
Those where my picks in order of preference, if you take a look at Greyblades' OP you will see that is what he asked of us. Now that I got Pakistan, I don't have a claim on any of the four countries I listed.
Edit: Ya, what Greyblades said.
I wanted Italy and afaik no one else has claims on it.
Greyblades
05-17-2009, 12:52
Ok then, Italy it is.
White eyes gets turkey.
Greyblades
05-17-2009, 14:51
Confirmed:
ATPG: China
Drizzt: UK.
AVSM: Somolia
Beskar: Iran.
Pevergreen : Sweden.
Ichigo: Italy
White_eyes:D: Turkey
The Flax: Pakistan.
Khaan: Indonesia.
Debatable/Taken by default/Given because I need the superpowers to be under a player's control:
YLC: USA (For now, I don't really understand why no-one else wants the tied-most powerful country in the world)
Iskander: USSR
Kazaar: East Germany
Undecided (I'm tempted to make one of them France but its their call):
Beefy.
Blackadder.
Well then, I'm going to have to ask for a few more players to join and take France, India, West Germany and Great Britain, then I can start work on the players goals and find a way to represent the amount of troops each country has.
Cultured Drizzt fan
05-17-2009, 19:52
I would have taken Great Britain, but when I wasn't under the contested areas for it I thought it was off limits.
Greyblades
05-17-2009, 19:53
Well do you want it?
Cultured Drizzt fan
05-17-2009, 19:56
Yeah I will take them, Britain's my favorite country.
Greyblades
05-17-2009, 21:26
I know that there has been a bit of confusion about the alliances in the game so I went and found a map showing the main alleigences of 1980:
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/8/87/New_Cold_War_Map_1980.png
I hope this clears it up.
Askthepizzaguy
05-17-2009, 22:08
NATO or Ally: (at game start)
YLC: USA
Cultured Drizzt fan (CDF): United Kingdom
A Very Super Market: Somalia
Ichigo: Italy
White_eyes:D: Turkey
The Flax: Pakistan.
Shinseikhaan: Indonesia.
Beefy: Taiwan or South Korea?
Captain Blackadder: Australia?
USSR or Ally: (at game start)
Iskander: USSR
Khazaar: East Germany
China: (at game start)
Askthepizzaguy: China
Neutral: (at game start)
Beskar: Iran.
pevergreen : Sweden.
Somehow, I think the non-Nato players are screwed.
Greyblades
05-17-2009, 22:12
Thats is why I want more players...
In the case of NATO allies, the word "ally" should be used lightly.
I am surprised to see no one is playing India in that list.
navarro951
05-17-2009, 22:15
Thats is why I want more players...
Well can i have Cuba? thats all i want is Cuba, no secondary choices.
Greyblades
05-17-2009, 22:19
...Sure, why not? Just dont go american friendly.
Askthepizzaguy
05-17-2009, 22:23
Well I did say "allied at game start"... that doesn't mean that things will stay as they are.
Greyblades
05-17-2009, 22:25
Alas that is also a problem; neither side will disband in fear that the other side will take advantage and pick them off one by one.
Cultured Drizzt fan
05-17-2009, 22:27
So what are we going to do about the British dependent territories? and Beijing?
Askthepizzaguy
05-17-2009, 22:27
Alas that is also a problem; neither side will disband in fear that the other side will take advantage and pick them off one by one.
That's OK. They can count on China. We're totally insane and we are feeling trigger happy today.
navarro951
05-17-2009, 22:37
...Sure, why not? Just dont go american friendly.
O kno ill stay to the historical truth of things. I look forward to when i can finally start my mafia game...The Cuban Revolution hehe.
So what are we going to do about the British dependent territories? and Beijing?
There aren't many of those left in 1980 though. What of Beijing?
Cultured Drizzt fan
05-17-2009, 22:43
ohh, sorry not bejing, I meant to say Hong Kong.....
Askthepizzaguy
05-17-2009, 22:44
HONG KONG IS CHINA! TAIWAN IS CHINA! TIBET IS CHINA!
Nobody touches China land.
Cultured Drizzt fan
05-17-2009, 22:49
In September 1982, the Prime Minister Margaret Thatcher travelled to Beijing to negotiate with the Chinese government on the future of Britain's last major and most populous overseas territory, Hong Kong.[169] Under the terms of the 1842 Treaty of Nanking, Hong Kong Island itself had been ceded to Britain "in perpetuity"
wondering about this.
Askthepizzaguy
05-17-2009, 22:52
Well it not 1982 yet. And we claim Hong Kong. You have problem with that, you take it up with Fat Boy, pet name for nuclear missile. You can also have Little Man, Short Man, Hot Wok, and Peking Duck. Collect all 5 missiles and get 6th one free.
Don't mess with China.
Cultured Drizzt fan
05-17-2009, 22:55
exactly, its not 1982 so Hong kong is now ours.
face it china all your bases are belonging to us! :clown:
Askthepizzaguy
05-17-2009, 22:57
Don't make me point Long Dong Silver at you. It may be small but it pack serious punch.
It named after Dong Zhuo. Look it up.
Well Hong Kong should be in British hands in 1980. As I understand it was leased to them for 99 years, and in 1997 (I think) it returned to Chinese control. Anyways, I don't think it is a major consideration for this game, although it makes a good point of contention for RP.
Askthepizzaguy
05-17-2009, 22:58
Shut up, history boy! Hong Kong belong to China!
Cultured Drizzt fan
05-17-2009, 23:02
I can already tell this is gonna be fun!
you may have nukes, but mess with us and I promise you the UN will be giving you a very STERN talking to!!!!!!
Askthepizzaguy
05-17-2009, 23:04
No it won't. We part of UN. I promise many deadlock. And if you don't like it, just remember, all your nukes are belong to us and all your weapons are made in China!
Cultured Drizzt fan
05-17-2009, 23:09
are we seriously gonna nuke each other into oblivion because of a single city? :laugh4:
and we decided to stop buying our goods from china, everything they make seems to fall apart very easily.
Askthepizzaguy
05-17-2009, 23:11
are we seriously gonna nuke each other into oblivion because of a single city? :laugh4:
and we decided to stop buying our goods from china, everything they make seems to fall apart very easily.
Maybe so, but you can't stop eating Chinese food. If it weren't for China, you would be stuck eating English food. I tasted English food once, and I must say, I would rather eat my meals off of the hind end of a boar that wallows in its own feces.
And yes, China cares very deeply about its own people. It none of your concern. Go away and take your journalist with you. Now, we show image of our Glorious Leader, and you should all line up and kiss his dumplings. It great honor.
https://fhswolvesden.wikispaces.com/file/view/Mao_Zedong.jpg
White_eyes:D
05-18-2009, 00:17
should China really have nukes???:sweatdrop: (Greyblades you should make a DEFCON system....so this way...guys can't start nuking at the start....I would:yes:)
Askthepizzaguy
05-18-2009, 00:27
should China really have nukes???
Turkey does not like China having nukes, eh? We don't need Defcon. We only need the word of our Chairman. He says those who threaten China must die. You have more to be concerned about than China. I am sure that Soviet Union does not like having NATO ally on their doorstep.
China tends to its own business, you tend to yours. I don't know what it is you Turkeys are doing... perhaps being cooked rotisserie style. If it take too long, China offers to heat you up very fast.
Cultured Drizzt fan
05-18-2009, 00:29
baaaahhhh, china can be as huffy and puffy as it wants, it wont change the fact if it tries to nuke someone in NATO then it will be bombed faster than it can say child labor laws
Askthepizzaguy
05-18-2009, 00:42
British Imperialists complaining about Child Labor laws? Very funny. Hahahaha.
Not everyone sit on big pile of money. Some of us have 1 billion people to feed. Before you push your laws on us, you silly English types, why don't you worry about the Irish Republican Army? Once you restore law and order to your own islands, then you can talk down to China as if you know what is best for us. Until then, continue to buy our products and eat our food because you know China is better.
Cultured Drizzt fan
05-18-2009, 00:46
Hey I was just saying not to get to gun ho about your nukes, (Stupid cultural isolationists thinking they are better the everyone else!)
British Imperialists complaining about Child Labor laws? Very funny. Hahahaha.
I actually laughed at this
Beefy187
05-18-2009, 00:50
Confirmed:
ATPG: China
Drizzt: UK.
AVSM: Somolia
Beskar: Iran.
Pevergreen : Sweden.
Ichigo: Italy
White_eyes:D: Turkey
The Flax: Pakistan.
Khaan: Indonesia.
Debatable/Taken by default/Given because I need the superpowers to be under a player's control:
YLC: USA (For now, I don't really understand why no-one else wants the tied-most powerful country in the world)
Iskander: USSR
Kazaar: East Germany
Undecided (I'm tempted to make one of them France but its their call):
Beefy.
Blackadder.
Well then, I'm going to have to ask for a few more players to join and take France, India, West Germany and Great Britain, then I can start work on the players goals and find a way to represent the amount of troops each country has.
If no one is taking it, I would love to have Japan.
If not, Taiwan or Korea is fine :bow:
Askthepizzaguy
05-18-2009, 00:57
Hey I was just saying not to get to gun ho about your nukes,
We get Gungho, and we also get Guangzhou and Qingdao. I make a funny. Now, why should China not be proud of our nukes? Unites States parade around like it is policeman of the world, touting it's nuclear power. Needs to be poured a big glass of mind your own business.
Feast your eyes on true leadership.
http://scrapetv.com/News/News%20Pages/Entertainment/images-2/mao-zedong.jpg
Cultured Drizzt fan
05-18-2009, 01:00
http://scrapetv.com/News/News%20Pages/Entertainment/images-2/mao-zedong.jpg
Excuse me while I go express my joy over in the trash can, preferably one made in china.
Beefy187
05-18-2009, 01:03
We get Gungho, and we also get Guangzhou and Qingdao. I make a funny. Now, why should China not be proud of our nukes? Unites States parade around like it is policeman of the world, touting it's nuclear power. Needs to be poured a big glass of mind your own business.
Feast your eyes on true leadership.
http://scrapetv.com/News/News%20Pages/Entertainment/images-2/mao-zedong.jpg
I don't care what china does, as long as China doesn't go east beyond the Sea of Japan.
Or over the North Korean boarders.
Askthepizzaguy
05-18-2009, 01:20
I understand that China and Japan are due to experience a great new era of trade and cooperation. :bow:
Beefy187
05-18-2009, 01:24
I understand that China and Japan are due to experience a great new era of trade and cooperation. :bow:
As long as you leave Korea, Taiwan and Tibet alone my friend :bow:
If not, Wrath of USA will strike you... Beat you down like a sack of potatoes!!
I'm not sure if I'm even getting Japan :sweatdrop:
China sure talks a lot for an isolationist state. :clown:
Askthepizzaguy
05-18-2009, 01:36
North Korea is our ally. South Korea will see the error of its ways and rejoin the glorious North on it's own. Taiwan is part of China. That's why we represent China, not them, on the security council. Tibet has been part of China for thirty years. Not to worry. We take good care of our people. That's why they have freedom of religion and freedom of the press and they vote in free elections, so long as we approve of their choices.
Captain Blackadder
05-18-2009, 01:36
Allright then I will take France.
We shall not be known as surrender monkeys for much longer.
Cultured Drizzt fan
05-18-2009, 01:40
Obligatory french joke: how many Frenchmen does it take to hold Paris?
we don't know, they never tried!
Captain Blackadder
05-18-2009, 01:48
You foolish English pig dog to try your cooking is to lose all hope in humanity.Go back to your fish n chips whilst I have some lovely Cuisse de cochon de lait rôtie, purée de pommes; jus de cuisson.
Cultured Drizzt fan
05-18-2009, 01:49
at least we can spell our food without consulting a thesaurus.
at least we can spell our food without consulting a thesaurus.
:thumbsdown: Those are not complicated words in french.
Yes, I am a french native speaker. :clown:
Cultured Drizzt fan
05-18-2009, 01:56
ok fine, at least I can read English food without consulting a thesaurus :clown:
I guess I should be nicer to good old france, we are on the same side after all.
Captain Blackadder
05-18-2009, 01:56
:thumbsdown: Those are not complicated words in french.
Yes, I am a french native speaker. :clown:
fantastique, It is a fine dish is it not?
As for you britisher you are inculte
A Very Super Market
05-18-2009, 02:13
Mao is dead, foolish Chinese. Even us Somalians know that! We're going to take your goods now, mmkay?
-:china:
navarro951
05-18-2009, 02:42
HONG KONG IS CHINA! TAIWAN IS CHINA! TIBET IS CHINA!
Nobody touches China land.
Taiwan and Tibet are not China.
Tibet is its own people.
Taiwan is an enemy government of China...while they are Chinese in nationality...just nationalists.
Askthepizzaguy
05-18-2009, 03:04
*Puts finger on the button.*
Tibet and Taiwan are China.
Cultured Drizzt fan
05-18-2009, 03:07
what ever happened to MAD??? good old mad, how I knew ye well...... yet china here doesnt seem to subscribe to the same ideals I guess....
Askthepizzaguy
05-18-2009, 03:09
We are not ruled by Dr. Claw! Inspector Gadget is not our arch-nemesis! We're China, not MAD!
Beefy187
05-18-2009, 03:13
Taiwan and Tibet are not China.
Tibet is its own people.
Taiwan is an enemy government of China...while they are Chinese in nationality...just nationalists.
For the sake of our friendship and continuing our tradition of ambiguity, Japan will not comment on this matter :book:
However if Taiwan and Korea is to be under our control, then I will have to mildly protest...
I fear the Chinese are a bit delusional - America does not strut around, acting as the worlds policeman and cowing others with it's nuclear weapons anymore then the Russians do.
At least we are not so utterly oppressive so as to destroy your cultural heritage and intellectual infrastructure.
Taiwan and Tibet are not China.
Tibet is its own people.
Taiwan is an enemy government of China...while they are Chinese in nationality...just nationalists.
sorry to say, but being a brit born chinese, i have to say that Taiwan is part of china (history is along the lines of civil war caused a bunch of chinese to move to taiwan, and the full chinese name for taiwan consists of the words china.)
Tibet has also been part of china for a looooong time, if i remember correctly, at least from the Song dynasty, maybe even before.
and please don't judge china from american and british television alone - china has done a lot to improve it's status and it just needs time to further improve itself. whilst there are always places that want to hinder china's improvement, just give them time.
Askthepizzaguy
05-18-2009, 04:20
As an aside, my statements are attempts at entertaining representations of my imagination of what a spokesperson of the People's Republic of China would say. They may not be accurate, and I may not agree with them.
navarro951
05-18-2009, 04:53
sorry to say, but being a brit born chinese, i have to say that Taiwan is part of china (history is along the lines of civil war caused a bunch of chinese to move to taiwan, and the full chinese name for taiwan consists of the words china.)
Tibet has also been part of china for a looooong time, if i remember correctly, at least from the Song dynasty, maybe even before.
and please don't judge china from american and british television alone - china has done a lot to improve it's status and it just needs time to further improve itself. whilst there are always places that want to hinder china's improvement, just give them time.
No...NO and NOOO! Tibet is a people who while they have been oppressed by the Chinese are their own people. They have their own country on a map and are their own people. And Taiwan is Taiwan. It has its own political agenda, its own military, and the US backs it. The Nationalists left after the Commies took over and went to Taiwan, again the Tibetians and Taiwanese may be of Chinese decent and nationality, but they are most certainly their own country.
No...NO and NOOO! Tibet is a people who while they have been oppressed by the Chinese are their own people. They have their own country on a map and are their own people. And Taiwan is Taiwan. It has its own political agenda, its own military, and the US backs it. The Nationalists left after the Commies took over and went to Taiwan, again the Tibetians and Taiwanese may be of Chinese decent and nationality, but they are most certainly their own country.
I'm going to preempt here and ask that this subject be dropped. If anyone wants to discuss politics you can always use PMs or the Backroom.
This game will require a lot of self moderation from everyone if its going to work, please avoid debates on political views and racist stereotypes or this thread will simply end in one big argument.
Thank you. :bow:
EDIT: This was not aimed at you in particular navarro, I quoted you because it was relevant to what I was trying to say.
Beefy187
05-18-2009, 05:41
sorry to say, but being a brit born chinese, i have to say that Taiwan is part of china (history is along the lines of civil war caused a bunch of chinese to move to taiwan, and the full chinese name for taiwan consists of the words china.)
Tibet has also been part of china for a looooong time, if i remember correctly, at least from the Song dynasty, maybe even before.
and please don't judge china from american and british television alone - china has done a lot to improve it's status and it just needs time to further improve itself. whilst there are always places that want to hinder china's improvement, just give them time.
Being half Chinese, I love the Chinese people as much as the Japanese.. But.
Taiwan is a country made up from the natives on that island and the National government of China who bailed to Taiwan when the Communist government rose to power.
If Taiwan is part of China, then America is part of Britain and Japan is still part of China.
And yes, we should go to the backroom for more discussions.
I wish I could post in the backroom. :cry:
Iskander 3.1
05-18-2009, 06:37
Sorry I've been gone (and I'm too lazy to read every page of this). Have countries been assigned yet?
Sorry I've been gone (and I'm too lazy to read every page of this). Have countries been assigned yet?
Some of them have been, you can see the list here (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=2238641&postcount=92).
Beefy187
05-18-2009, 07:08
I wish I could post in the backroom. :cry:
Can't you just apply access to the backroom from User CP?
Can't you just apply access to the backroom from User CP?
Oh, I did. Just never got a reply on it.
Greyblades
05-18-2009, 11:35
should China really have nukes???:sweatdrop: (Greyblades you should make a DEFCON system....so this way...guys can't start nuking at the start....I would:yes:)
I was going to start coming up with rules after I had enough players but I can do that.
Well Hong Kong should be in British hands in 1980. As I understand it was leased to them for 99 years, and in 1997 (I think) it returned to Chinese control. Anyways, I don't think it is a major consideration for this game, although it makes a good point of contention for RP.
I'm going to have to look up what else Britain has dominion over but yes Hong Kong is British at the start, no matter how much china may wish otherwise.
If no one is taking it, I would love to have Japan.
If not, Taiwan or Korea is fine :bow:
Japan is yours.
Allright then I will take France.
We shall not be known as surrender monkeys for much longer.
Ok then France it is.
You foolish English pig dog to try your cooking is to lose all hope in humanity.Go back to your fish n chips whilst I have some lovely Cuisse de cochon de lait rôtie, purée de pommes; jus de cuisson.
:sweatdrop: your on the same side you know...
I just need 3 more players to be India, west Germany and Poland.
And before anyone comes up with any ideas about first turn surprise nuking I may not have a defcon system up yet but I know that most countries would shoot national leaders who tries to launch a nuke without provocation.
and the US backs it.
the US backs the splitting of all countries :P
no more from me, back to hosting work
First off I think we need a BIG Disclaimer in the first post of this topic or I presume this will be closed, because we can´t avoid talking politics. We´re playing Countries after all...
WARNING THIS IS A 1980 WHAT IF SCENARIO, NONE OF THE VIEWS OR ACTIONS POSTED HERE ARE MENT TO BE TAKEN SERIOUSLY. THIS IS A PURELY SPECULATIVE SCENARIO, IF YOU ARE EASILY OFFENDED BY COLD WAR POLITICS DO NOT CONTINUE AND CLOSE THIS TOPIC!!!
Another thing, as we play to represent countries there is no room for open insults, be diplomatic and insult the other without him noticing (if you can).
As for gamemechanics, a very simple rating system could be useful to gage the capabilities of your and other contries.
Maybe someting like this:
W. Germany (social Democratic State) (rating from 1-12, one beeing pathetic, twelve beeing superpower)
Military: 5 W. Germany was aware that it was a likely battlefield for the third world war. Aside from Allied troops Germany was one of the leading arms producers and developers. Beeing a democratic country with a faschist past has limited the maximum ammount of military buildup. The U.S.: has nukes stationed in W. Germany.
Economy: 10 W. Germany (like Japan) is one of the worlds biggest exporters and turned into a Financial powerhouse after WW2.
Political: 6, W. Germany is a member of NATO and the UNO.
Security: 5 W. Germany has a well structured Police and Inteligence Agency, democratic ethics and structures hinder it in increasing its security rating.
Stability: 9 W. Germany was very prosperous and its citizens had lots of freedoms. Only the threat of WW3 and subsequent possible nuclear warfare caused concern.
E. Germany (Communist State)
Military: 7 E. Germany has been built up by the U.S.S.R to be the buffer against capitalism. The whole state is set up to defend against it. U.S.S.R. troops (with stationed nukes) are also stationed in E. Germany.
Economy: 4 While beeing the most advanced Warsaw Pact state with good infrastructure and great industry in 1980 serious mismanagement has caused E.Germany to fail economically. The continuous armsbuildup has left the contry bankrupt.
Political: 4 E. Germany has started out as a puppet state of the U.S.S.R. and has never realized a lot of potential. It has a limited influence in Africa and middle East, mainly through Arms Deals and Military training. It is a member of the Warsaw Pact.
Security: 10 E. Germany was a policestate that controlled its people. A major ammount of funding went into security and espionage. Hardly anything happened without the Stateparty knowing about it.
Stability: 8 E. Germany is ridgidly contolled though Party, Police, Agencies and Military. It´s population is contolled but unhappy with the failing system. It´s stability rating would be critically lower without State contol.
These ratings were made as a Sample without too much research. Since we´re(I presume) not really aiming for a classical mafia game I´m not sure how useful the U.N. would be. Most likely the Nations with vetopowers would always block eachother...
Greyblades
05-18-2009, 16:01
These ratings were made as a Sample without too much research. Since we´re(I presume) not really aiming for a classical mafia game I´m not sure how useful the U.N. would be. Most likely the Nations with vetopowers would always block eachother...
This is not realy a mafia game so there wont realy be any special roles as such. Each player will be able to carry out espionage and sabotage each phase as well as attack other countries if so wished.
Heres a list of the only things you will need to realy keep track of.
1. The amount of military you have to swing around.
2. How quickly you can replenish any lost troops.
3. How effective you home guard is. (IE what bonus do you ge from militia when fighting at home)
4. How dependant on oil you are (and how much of a penalty you will recieve if your deprived of it).
5. How effective your secret services are .
An example of this would be that UK has less millitary resources than USSR but have a 25% bonus in espionage and sabotage and suffer less when deprived of oil..
A little bit of historical information on Chinese leaderhsip:
In 1980 Mao was dead. Sorry AtPG. :P Deng Xiaoping is in charge and he loves to privatize everything he has his hands on (Which is practically everything)
A little bit information on China-British relations over Hong Kong:
When India invaded Portuguese India in 1961, SU Chairman, Kruschev declared that Mao should follow Nehru's example and get rid of China's last traces of colonialism (Hong Kong and Macau). Obviously, Mao would have followed Kruschev's advice and overran Macau and Hong Kong, but the British Government was swift in announcing in attempt of invasion of Hong Kong would be followed by a nuclear strike on China (Which since Britain had Nuclear Submarines, wasn't bluff at all). Having lost much of its prestige in the Suez Crisis, Britain wasn't going to lose face again was willing to nuke China to smithereens to protect its interests. Of course, Mao could easily overrun Macau, but then he'd lose face for only taking the territory of those who couldn't protect themselves, without attacking the other British enclave a few miles apart. Furthermore, not only was Portugal a founding member of NATO which could lead to trouble for China, but Portugal was also one of the closest allies of Britain, and British action in an eventual taking of Macau, even if Mao was willing to be known as a bully in the International Scene, was sketchy, and could lead to a British attack anyway.
Besides that, Portugal was the country where Maoism had its biggest influence, (Which was insignificantly small anyway) and attacking Portugal might lead to a disillusionment of many Maoists in Portugal eventually ending a possible spread of the ideology throughout Europe.
So, yeah. China was afraid of Britain in this issue.
If I can take Portugal, I'd be willing! I wouldn't have much of an International weight initially, but hey, at least I could challenge China in Portugal's last colony and with NATO help, defeat China and make China "The jewel of the Republic". Then with Portuguese leadership, China would be ushured into a new era of progress, and all Chinese would see the enlightment of Portugal, and declare themselves convict Portuguesemen, ready to expand the Portuguese empire to the rest of the world. In the end of the game, I shall have unified the world under my leadership.
If I can take Portugal, I'd be willing! I wouldn't have much of an International weight initially, but hey, at least I could challenge China in Portugal's last colony and with NATO help, defeat China and make China "The jewel of the Republic". Then with Portuguese leadership, China would be ushured into a new era of progress, and all Chinese would see the enlightment of Portugal, and declare themselves convict Portuguesemen, ready to expand the Portuguese empire to the rest of the world. In the end of the game, I shall have unified the world under my leadership.
That's the Spirit! Start small and grow big - prove to the world how much the underestimated the Portuguese :beam:
Greyblades
05-18-2009, 18:10
Ok then, seeing as the 5 choices thing went downhill, we're going to first come first serve. Portugal is Jolts country from this point on.
I'd really wish someone would take India, being Pakistan is not as fun if I don't have someone to bicker with constantly. :laugh4:
I'd really wish someone would take India, being Pakistan is not as fun is I don't have someone to bicker with constantly. :laugh4:
Lucky you - EVERYONE hates me :laugh4:
Iskander 3.1
05-18-2009, 18:39
Lucky you - EVERYONE hates me :laugh4:
Everyone? I don't think he signed up for this...
Greyblades
05-18-2009, 18:51
I needed a USA and he was the only one who had any interest in it.
I'd be willing to take India, or Mexico if that would work better.
Greyblades
05-18-2009, 19:18
I would rather have you india at this point than mexico, if you dont mind.
That's fine with me. I had initially been thinking somewhere in Latin America when I first saw the thread, since that's where my specialty at my university was, but looking at the scenario and seeing we have a Pakistan already it occurred to me India might work better for the game.
India did their first nuclear weapon test well before 1980, didn't they? Would that make them a nuclear power in the terms of the game?
Iskander 3.1
05-18-2009, 19:33
India tested a "peaceful nuclear explosive" (for damming, mining, etc.) in 1974 but didn't test any nuclear weapons until 1998.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/India_and_weapons_of_mass_destruction
Can Texas have "nucular" weapons in this game? Please?
(edit: the url was shortened to "ass destruction":)
Greyblades
05-18-2009, 19:34
^Somehow I think peaceful nukes are easy to use as war nukes.
@Zim: Yes, though weak one in terms of the amount of nukes they had in comparison to the other nuclear countries.
Iskander 3.1
05-18-2009, 19:43
Not as easy as you may think. For one, the bomb was made with material designed only for power generation, so the destruction level wasn't that great (estimated to be 12 kt, compared to 15 kt at Hiroshima). Second, India relied on technology and material imported from Canada to make that bomb, and Canada cut off supplies after the bomb was tested.
Wow TF and Zim, will you ever stop picking opposite sides of the fence :clown:
Cultured Drizzt fan
05-18-2009, 20:17
this map pretty accurately shows Britain overseas territories. the major one has to be the Falkland islands. the Falkland war took place in 1982.
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/9d/Location_of_the_BOTs.png
the antarctic territory is really only loosely under British control, because well its Antarctica... plus Hong Kong isn't shown here.
Askthepizzaguy
05-18-2009, 20:22
(edit: the url was shortened to "ass destruction":)
I do believe that if a nuke was dropped in the vicinity, it would most definitely cause its destruction. You can pretty much kiss it goodbye. So it is both accurate and hilarious.
Forewarning to all - I have helped Greyblades with some rules and will help him with keeping track of statistics for this game
Fear me :clown:
Greyblades
05-18-2009, 20:41
Yes, YLC is now the guy helping me with keeping track of the numbers. I'm tempted to have the military force scale to be 1 point per bullet.
Yes, YLC is now the guy helping me with keeping track of the numbers. I'm tempted to have the military force scale to be per bullet.
:sweatdrop:
Greyblades
05-18-2009, 20:48
:evilgrin:
:clown:
Cultured Drizzt fan
05-18-2009, 21:17
so if we want to we could switch alliances, I don't have to stay in NATO if I don't want to? if I was so inclined I could just go Socialist and shack up with the USSR? (Not that I would, just wondering) this should be fun, its time to regain the British Empire!
Greyblades
05-18-2009, 21:20
I doubt that the USSR will give you much help seeing as Britain and Russia have been on and off rivals for about 2 centuries.
Cultured Drizzt fan
05-18-2009, 21:25
I know that, just speaking hypothetically.
Greyblades
05-18-2009, 21:28
You could but it would be pretty suicidal to go against the USA without help and there will allmost definitely be a rebellion against going communist.
Cultured Drizzt fan
05-18-2009, 21:29
ok just wanted to know, I don't plan on doing it. the Brits will never surrender their freedom!!!! just wanted to know If I have to watch my allies closely.
Greyblades
05-18-2009, 21:32
The direct nato and warsaw factions most likely wont switch sides, if they did their old superpower ally would probably kick their head in. But the other nations on the other hand have greater freedom with this.
Cultured Drizzt fan
05-18-2009, 21:36
I should probably just wait for the rules, it will probably answer any questions I have.... :sweatdrop:
Iskander 3.1
05-18-2009, 21:39
I doubt that the USSR will give you much help seeing as Britain and Russia have been on and off rivals for about 2 centuries.
Ah, the Great Game...19th Century Cold War!
Cultured Drizzt fan
05-18-2009, 21:41
how Ironic I end up on the opposite side of a conflict with Iskander! Finally I shall have vengeance!
You could but it would be pretty suicidal to go against the USA without help and there will allmost definitely be a rebellion against going communist.
He'd have Portuguese help! So far as going communist, then we'd just help the USA mop up the British and gain a few islands here and there to restore our national empire.
Cultured Drizzt fan
05-18-2009, 21:45
you would go against one of your oldest and truest allies!! what is this blasphemy! don't worry Portugal, you shall have Britain's full support in most matters (especially concerning China)
Iskander 3.1
05-18-2009, 21:49
so if we want to we could switch alliances, I don't have to stay in NATO if I don't want to? if I was so inclined I could just go Socialist and shack up with the USSR? (Not that I would, just wondering) this should be fun, its time to regain the British Empire!
First it's your wife, and now you want to shack up with me too?
Cultured Drizzt fan
05-18-2009, 21:51
yeah so I can murder you in your sleep obviously. with nukes of course. :clown:
believe me the chances of Britain becoming Socialist is as much as me not finding some way to screw up every plan you make.
Actually, it wasn't impossible in the 1980's. Labour party was still socialist then. Unfortunately, you have Maggie Thatcher destroying the economy.
He'd have Portuguese help! So far as going communist, then we'd just help the USA mop up the British and gain a few islands here and there to restore our national empire.
Glad I can count on the Portuguese :2thumbsup:
Any specific trade deals you wish to work out now, loyal ally?
Cultured Drizzt fan
05-18-2009, 22:06
dang it, that means I am going to fail at messing with Iskanders plan.......
Cultured Drizzt fan
05-18-2009, 22:20
why does everyone take me asking a question as I sign I want to betray everyone..... :sweatdrop: I mean sure there was that one time in WotB but come on!
Britain will stand by the USA and its other allies. end of story.
Iskander 3.1
05-18-2009, 22:28
You don't even know what my plan is! Well ok, it's world domination, but I guess that's obvious.
Cultured Drizzt fan
05-18-2009, 22:38
with the USSR its ALWAYS world domination...... :beam:
My question is twofold.
First, how does the economy work? Money being the sinews of war and all that. And second, YLC mentioned trade, how would that work? In 1980 we have, much like today, a globalized economy and trade of specific things is not handled by the government, but by the market. (Communist countries need not apply :clown:) So apart from military equipment, money and technology, there's isn't much people can trade. Governments can encourage or discourage trade of certain items with tariffs or deny trade with sanctions, but can't do much more.
Sorry for the long winded question. :sweatdrop:
A Very Super Market
05-18-2009, 23:01
Obviously, we print more money, so we get richer. Foolproof!
Greyblades
05-18-2009, 23:02
I'm going to deflect that question to YLC seeing as he's the one who's going to be keeping track of trade.
My question is twofold.
First, how does the economy work? Money being the sinews of war and all that. And second, YLC mentioned trade, how would that work? In 1980 we have, much like today, a globalized economy and trade of specific things is not handled by the government, but by the market. (Communist countries need not apply :clown:) So apart from military equipment, money and technology, there's isn't much people can trade. Governments can encourage or discourage trade of certain items with tariffs or deny trade with sanctions, but can't do much more.
Sorry for the long winded question. :sweatdrop:
I will let Greyblades explain the trade and economy system, although I have some clue as to how it will work - just know that you want trade partners, and a lot of them, to secure your position in the world.
No trade partners means no growth.
Also, just a hint for now - their are multiple ways to win, one is economic, one is military, one is ???
I'll leave you to guess what the last one is, but it has to do with the trade system :evilgrin:
Greyblades
05-18-2009, 23:10
To think that this started out as a simple game of forum chicken...
Ummm..okay, seems I am answering the trade question :sweatdrop:
Trade is handled in the "goods" sense and monetary sense.
When you trade with a country, you have 1 of two options - trade for their "good" or trade for their money/goods.
Trading for the "good" provides a static benefit. For instance, both Germanies have the "good" High Quality*. This means for either Germany, and anyone they see fit to trade their "good" with, any action they take has reduced penalties and their military replenishes and is more efficient - a basic, overall boost to everything they do (were covering military and economy here, so hold yer horses on the "But!").
However, trading for the "good" gives you no economic benefit.
Trading for money/goods nets you a benefit to your country depending on who has a stronger cultural rating and government type - the more capitalistic your nation, the greater your income will be but the more subject it will be to change. More Communist, the less you will receive, but the more stable it will be (this is for gameplay balance, not actually subject to reality :sweatdrop:). The more culturally dominate you are, the more money you gain as well.
However, you do not gain any of the benefits of that trade partners "good".
Culture - that is the final Victory you can have. the following is the basic Culture rules.
You have (10) cultural exchange points. When you trade with someone, you may also automatically trade CE points, any amount you choose - so long as they are your trade partner, they do not get a say in how much. Every turn, it will add up, until it reaches 100 points, at which point it essentially has become an extension of you and a permanent ally, netting you the ability to gain the "good" and economic benefits. Thus, be careful whom you trade with.
At the start of the year, a vague report will be given to each player on their current culture, notifying them if it is being subverted.
CE points are further disseminated through allies. If your allies have further trade partners that you are not already trading with, then they will receive half of the CE points, rounded up.
At anytime, to counter cultural change, you may -
1. Spend CE points to counter it. CE points spent on countering count for triple their value.
2. Conduct a mission by your agencies to stop the flow of CE - this way costs nothing but only works for one turn, limiting your Espionage and Sabotage attempts.
3. Sever trade with the country. This stops the flow of CE, and the CE will go down at 1 point per turn.
In the case of a conflict, the country will fall into civil war - it will be up to the player of the country to decide whether he will play those culturally subverted, or play as the nationalists from then on.
I am still working on solidifying the rules and numbers, so please be patient. I still have military, technology, basic "Home" economy to deal with, and Espionage and Sabotage to try and figure out.
If Greyblades hasn't a system already :sweatdrop:
*subject to interpretation
Cultured Drizzt fan
05-18-2009, 23:26
this sounds awesome........ :2thumbsup:
Glad I can count on the Portuguese :2thumbsup:
Any specific trade deals you wish to work out now, loyal ally?
Of course! I wish to trade your vast amounts of oil, steel, grain, manganese, fats, platinum lastest edge weaponry and machinery, and two dozens of nuclear Inter-Continental Ballistic Misilles along with ballistic and nuclear technology make my country self sufficient in that issue - for my high quality non-metallic minerals such as marble or calcium, prized for your magnanimous statues you intend to build to honor glorious communism, besides highly valuable military-industrial strategic resources being those uranium and phosphate. Sounds fair no? I can forsee great things for us! Portugal takes on the leading role in the world with the USSR as its mighty sidekick. With Portugal leading the world, who is to stop us?
Cultured Drizzt fan
05-18-2009, 23:30
I can trade Tea!!!!! :yes:
nobody want any tea? come on you all like it!
wait a second Portugal is a commie?
A Very Super Market
05-18-2009, 23:34
I will take your goods, then trade them back to you! :D
I can trade Tea!!!!! :yes:
nobody want any tea? come on you all like it!
Tea isn't Britain's "Good" (need a better name:shame:) :laugh4: - that falls under normal economy boosting and cultural subversion.
I will take your goods, then trade them back to you! :D
Wait till you see your trade "good" :laugh4:
Greyblades
05-18-2009, 23:38
If Greyblades hasn't a system already :sweatdrop:
I don't.
I had origionaly planned that this would be a military/political game with each player as war leaders with the economy sorting itself out while the players had fun. Mainly I didn't have it originally because an economy would mean tripling the workload and I would have less less fun doing write ups and comparing tactics to see who wins. :juggle2:I don't know why but making inventive write ups seems more fun to me than actually playing Mafia.
Although seeing as he's put so much thought into it I guess that we can put it in there. But your sorting it out!
Cultured Drizzt fan
05-18-2009, 23:38
but...... Tea is what makes the world go around....... I like tea........ :clown:
I don't.
I had originally planned that this would be a military game with each player as war leaders with the economy sorting itself out while the players had fun. Mainly I didn't have it originally because an economy would mean tripling the workload and I would have less less fun doing write ups and comparing tactics to see who wins. :juggle2:I don't know why but making inventive write ups seems more fun to me than actually playing Mafia.
Although seeing as he's put so much thought into it I guess that we can put it in there. But your sorting it out!
Bah, good practice for my more indepth and longer running game :2thumbsup:
Greyblades, you can handle everything after it goes through my numbers crunching - I am the machine, you are the interpreter.
Of course, you will have to handle the Espionage and Sabotage numbers and orders - being a player means I shouldn't know about what I shouldn't know.
Greyblades
05-18-2009, 23:51
That is a given.
Hmph, seems that my PC is needing yet again a new motherboad because I forgot to vacuume the fans and a piece of metal (dont know what) got in and damaged the innards. Sorry if I cant have the map finalised until next week but I dont want to risk this damn fedora laptop exploding from trying to run photoshop.
Of course Portugal is not communist? How could a country that was always based upon and instigated the high disparity of social and economical differences among its population ever become communist? It is against us! Our poor would never do anything to the rich! It has always been so! How could we change anything?
In any case, I shall trade with the USSR or any other country on those fair trade deals. Vast amount of resources for us for our moral support (Which is the best thing you could ever get in the entire world) and some important resources.
Curiously, not only does Britain produce little to no tea (It consumes it. Doesn't produce it. It'd be the same as saying that the USA could export large amounts of oil, just become they consume large amounts of it), but tea was introduced by who? (English Queen of the Portuguese Royal House - Catarina/Catherine de Bragança) Hehe, it always comes back to us.
Cultured Drizzt fan
05-19-2009, 00:09
I am going to stop talking before I succeed in alienating all of my allies. :shame::sweatdrop:
(I know Britain doesn't produce tea, but I wasn't sure what Britain's good would be soooooo yeah.)
I wasnt sure why you were talking about the USSR as your trading partner when YLC is the USA.
Greyblades
05-19-2009, 00:17
SAS training? Best special forces in the world are trained by them and your allies could get an increase in Covert ops efficiency.
In the end its down to YLC.
Beefy187
05-19-2009, 00:57
Lucky you - EVERYONE hates me :laugh4:
I don't... Hail the president...Cough Hiroshima... and everything sir!! :yes:
Of course Portugal is not communist? How could a country that was always based upon and instigated the high disparity of social and economical differences among its population ever become communist? It is against us! Our poor would never do anything to the rich! It has always been so! How could we change anything?
In any case, I shall trade with the USSR or any other country on those fair trade deals. Vast amount of resources for us for our moral support (Which is the best thing you could ever get in the entire world) and some important resources.
Curiously, not only does Britain produce little to no tea (It consumes it. Doesn't produce it. It'd be the same as saying that the USA could export large amounts of oil, just become they consume large amounts of it), but tea was introduced by who? (English Queen of the Portuguese Royal House - Catarina/Catherine de Bragança) Hehe, it always comes back to us.
The US does export large amounts of oil...and it produces enough to satisfy 2/3rds of the USA's needs. We do in fact, export it, and if I am not mistaken, to countries where they end up getting raided by Somalians...
I can't disclose each persons Trade Good unless they specifically do so themselves, I mean I am not sure if I should - I am still working on one for each country. This is going to sound stupid, but does anyone have a current list of those taken?
Greyblades
05-19-2009, 01:23
Well I think its about time to actually come up with a rule
*Ahem*
The espionage system
The most versatile method of war, Each turn you can ask for your secret services to concentrate on doing one fact finding mission, be it finding where the enemy is keeping its ICBN's or what cologne their chief of staff is using either way they will attempt to find out. Or you could just tell them to search for enemy spies which will add a bonus on to the spycatch score(I'll tell you later).
Each country will gain 2 ratings: espionage efficiency(1 to 5) and loyalty of population(-2 to 3).
Espionage efficiency is the main reference I will use to determine what dice roll you must get to succeed; If your score is 1 you will have to get a 6, if your score is five its a 2+, etc.
The country loyalty score is the modifier that tells me how much chance that your citizens will report enemy spies if they find them I.E. how many points are taken off of the dice roll. A need score of 2+ can be converted to a 5+ by having a population happy enough to give you a score of 3 in the same way that a score of 3+ can be converted to a 2+ by a disgruntled and rebellious population.
I hope this makes sense. If you see a problem with this tell me so it can be corrected before I put it onto the OP.
Can you tell me what will be "the" Trade Good of Lieschtenstein?
Can you tell me what will be "the" Trade Good of Liechtenstein?
Umm...miniaturization? Not sure if anyone is playing Liechtenstein...
Could other powers become nuclear nations if they get the supplies from lets say USSR and USA?
Askthepizzaguy
05-19-2009, 03:25
Or China...
Or China...
...if you like them being made out of cheap plastic, crafted in sweatshops by children, and break at the slightest provocation.
All in good fun my Oriental friend - if you want Quality, you buy American.
:clown:
Beefy187
05-19-2009, 04:33
...if you like them being made out of cheap plastic, crafted in sweatshops by children, and break at the slightest provocation.
All in good fun my Oriental friend - if you want Quality, you buy American.
:clown:
What about made in Japan :sweatdrop:
Askthepizzaguy
05-19-2009, 04:36
Since you get most of your stuff from China and Japan, maybe you don't want to make us angry... :yes:
Since you get most of your stuff from China and Japan, maybe you don't want to make us angry... :yes:
Actually, we get our stuff from Taiwan, Indonesia, and Japan, and some South Korean stuff as well.
From Taiwan, not from China.
Beefy187
05-19-2009, 04:38
Since you get most of your stuff from China and Japan, maybe you don't want to make us angry... :yes:
I'm not sure which side I should go on...
Historical (America), My friends fantasy (East Asia alliance) or..... Complete independence :beam:
I'm not sure which side I should go on...
Historical (America), My friends fantasy (East Asia alliance) or..... Complete independence :beam:
It's up to you my friend - just remember, you won;t have things such as anime, freedom of press, religion, any form of accepted intelligentia, would have to start eating, breathing, and being Chinese - unless you dominate them first.
:yes:
Askthepizzaguy
05-19-2009, 04:44
Oh come on, now, Beefy... we're your closest relatives in China. We care about you more than the United States... they won't even let you have a military.
We forgive you for World War II, that was decades ago. let's be friends.
Oh come on, now, Beefy... we're your closest relatives in China. We care about you more than the United States... they won't even let you have a military.
We forgive you for World War II, that was decades ago. let's be friends.
He's a terrible lair, we have and always will have your best interests at heart. Indeed, your restricted in using your military in an arbitrary and reckless way - this shows intelligence and forsight on your part, but it does not restrict your ability to defend yourselves or use it for good purposes. And we never imposed this upon you, it was you, your own people, who wrote that into law.
The US has always and will continue to think of Japan as one of it's closest friends.
Askthepizzaguy
05-19-2009, 04:57
We never dropped a nuke on you, Japan. Surely you agree that Western Imperialism is not something we need in Asia. We both fought very hard to get these invaders out of our lands.
I see this game turning into something from Code Geass. Though, I think there should make it so the world can take a separate path. For example, African Union (Africa under the control of one, and builds itself up to become a force) same with for example an Asian and Pacific Union (China, Japan, etc), United Arabian States (or similar. Middle East blocking together) and European Union, etc.
I the Islamic Republic of Iran will be announcing planned cooperation with other Middle Eastern nations based on the holy words of Allah himself to keep morality and decency in our society from the Judeo-Christian Empire and that of the God-Forsaken communists. (The game hasn't started yet, still sign up's, isn't it? ^^;)
Askthepizzaguy
05-19-2009, 05:09
If this is just a signup thread, as it should be, we don't need to update the original post. But when the game starts, please post all the rules, updated map, players and their countries and stated alliances in the OP so I don't lose my mind and fire off a nuke just to keep things interesting.
I need to borrow some nukes ATMG. I'll need them for my evil plots against somebody.
Askthepizzaguy
05-19-2009, 05:18
What??? This is incredible. This is unprecedented. This is an outrage. There is absolutely no way the Chinese government will arm you with nukes. Not even if you send us a private message to discuss things using unofficial channels.
The vile Ichigo, the head of the Catholic Abomination declares a Crusade against the Muslim faith. Men, Women, prepare to fight for our Lord against their vicious religious tyranny.
Also, I retract my previous statement, this isn't like Code Geass, this is definitely like Hetalia Axis Powers.For those who don't know what that is, it is basically a bunch of countries anthromorphised in an anime. Lots of stereotypes like Germany is played by a built soldier with blonde hair blue eyes, Italy is a coward. America loves hamburgers. England has all these fairy tale creatures, etc.
Also China, we have associates which can assist in taking care of a certain government in exile for you, if you assist us with supplying arms.
Sadly Beskar, a middle eastern coalition would be like, you and me. :clown: We could maybe get Turkey, but I don't remember any other countries in that area being played by someone. That's too bad, because its a very interesting hot spot.
Yeesh, not a one of you has received your countries PM yet, and your already trying to trade and barter away things you may or may not have :laugh4:
We got lots and lots of Oil. Maybe it might be in America's interest to show diplomatic support for us with investment and other various things. Maybe in the same scole, maybe it would be in the interest of the USSR, in at least to prevent strategical location and resources.
Also, theFlax, I just saw that you are Pakistan. Would you be interested in relations with the Islamic Republic of Iran?
We got lots and lots of Oil. Maybe it might be in America's interest to show diplomatic support for us with investment and other various things. Maybe in the same scole, maybe it would be in the interest of the USSR, in at least to prevent strategical location and resources.
Also, theFlax, I just saw that you are Pakistan. Would you be interested in relations with the Islamic Republic of Iran?
Read above for why the US doesn't need imported Oil. Proper regulation and we'll be okay :mellow:
Iskander 3.1
05-19-2009, 05:58
Don't worry, the USSR is going to sweep in and abolish the masses' opiate.
Actually, do you know why the US sells its oil onto other people while it imports Oil from the middle east?
There are different grades and ultimately, the US has bad quality oil. It is actually far cheaper to ship it from places like Saudia Arabia using their oil opposed to the domestic oil at home.
Iskander, for the record, isn't this the period where USSR tries to invade Afghanistan and gets beaten back by the Taliban? An attack on Iran would get all the other countries such as Syria, Egypt, Lebenon, etc all involved during this time period. Also, it could united Iran's domestic enemies into joining forces against the USSR.
But the US has Canada's oil also. I think Canada has actually more oil than the US, if you count the huge reserves it has that are difficult to extract.
Beskar's point still stands though, the US being self sufficient in oil would not be cost effective, unless the oil was very expensive to the consumers. The cost of extracting and refining oil is not the same anywhere and I feel that such economic factors cannot be properly represented with an abstract model.
Iskander 3.1
05-19-2009, 06:19
Yup, this was back when bin Laden was on the CIA's payroll.
Yup, this was back when bin Laden was on the CIA's payroll.
The good old days. :clown:
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