Spartan Shoes/Boots?

[Phalanx300]

Spartans had apparantly a special type of shoe and seeing how conservative it was it most likely used it at EBs time frame as well.

Though it would definately be a special sight to see crimson red shoes. :dizzy2:


http://www.romanarmytalk.com/rat/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=26877

[paramedicguyer]

heads up, another on the forum have made a similar comment about spartan shoes?lack of shoes. Find sources. title or ISBN would be great for the book by sekunda mentioned in the url. Am I to assume it is an osprey publishinng

[Megas Methuselah]

Spartans had apparantly a special type of shoe and seeing how conservative it was it most likely used it at EBs time frame as well.

Lol. Assuming the Spartans used outdated equipment solely because they were "conservative" is somewhat ridiculous:

Hey, guess what?! I think the Spartans used stone-tipped spears and wooden armour during EB's timeframe, seeing how conservative they were and all!

[paramedicguyer]

Lol. Assuming the Spartans used outdated equipment solely because they were "conservative" is somewhat ridiculous:

Hey, guess what?! I think the Spartans used stone-tipped spears and wooden armour during EB's timeframe, seeing how conservative they were and all!



Dude, I'm sure you've read the new thread from krusader...so why be lke that?

[MeinPanzer]

Lol. Assuming the Spartans used outdated equipment solely because they were "conservative" is somewhat ridiculous:

Hey, guess what?! I think the Spartans used stone-tipped spears and wooden armour during EB's timeframe, seeing how conservative they were and all!

We have a statue from the 2nd c. AD showing these boots in use from Sparta.

[Megas Methuselah]

Dude, I'm sure you've read the new thread from krusader...so why be lke that?

It was an honest reply. Being "conservative" isn't enough of a reason to conclude Spartans used outdated equipment. Unfortunately for me...


We have a statue from the 2nd c. AD showing these boots in use from Sparta.

... the professor appeared and brought proper evidence. *exasperated sigh*


EDIT: Wait, is this statue entirely conclusive? For all we know, judging by the fact that this statue was dated to the 2nd century AD, these boots could merely have been a revived fashion in Sparta, a fashion which was non-existent during EB's timeframe. I'm not saying that this was the case, but we'd need more solid evidence to deduce that these particular boots were widely used amongst the Spartans during EB's timeframe.

[Aemilius Paulus]

Dude, I'm sure you've read the new thread from krusader...so why be lke that?
Meth was not spamming, it was a jest in the topic of the thread and completely legitimate IMHO. And he had a point too. Nor did he disrupt the thread by prompting more spam, other than my Apology.

[Phalanx300]

Lol. Assuming the Spartans used outdated equipment solely because they were "conservative" is somewhat ridiculous:

Hey, guess what?! I think the Spartans used stone-tipped spears and wooden armour during EB's timeframe, seeing how conservative they were and all!


OMGWTF... They use Pilos helmet which was around way back and bronze muscled cuirasses as well. They grow bears which was an Archaic practice. :furious3::idea2: Same with their long cloaks. :sweatdrop: And hell they still fight as Hoplites here! :whip:

THEY DO USE OUTDATED EQUIPMENT ALREADY!!

I gues that makes them stone age men? :laugh4:

[Watchman]

Dude. Spears are nevar outdated. Whaddya think the bayonet is ? ~;)

[Phalanx300]

Dude. Spears are nevar outdated. Whaddya think the bayonet is ? ~;)

A knife on a stick? :yes: Well I gues you can call that a spear.

[Azathoth]

They grow bears

Holy ****!

https://i494.photobucket.com/albums/rr309/desertSypglass/1262584641_e1d9e0e063.jpg

Oh, I see - you meant beards :smash:.

[Megas Methuselah]

OMGWTF... They use Pilos helmet which was around way back and bronze muscled cuirasses as well. They grow bears which was an Archaic practice. :furious3::idea2: Same with their long cloaks. :sweatdrop: And hell they still fight as Hoplites here! :whip:

THEY DO USE OUTDATED EQUIPMENT ALREADY!!

I gues that makes them stone age men? :laugh4:

Until someone brings along some hard evidence, I'll give your unreasoned logic the benefit of the doubt.

[Phalanx300]

Until someone brings along some hard evidence, I'll give your unreasoned logic the benefit of the doubt.

Indeed, so unreasoned, Spartan shoes are a thing later adapted like the Pilos, and there has been many mentions of Spartan/Lakonian shoes.

What many are doubting from The Spartan Army book is that he claims Spartan shoes were crimson red, the fact that they existed isn't.

http://books.google.nl/books?q=Spartan+Shoes


Edit: Here is a quote of that book about the shoe:


Even so, we hear of a special type of Lakonian shoe. Literary sources describe it as being single-soled (haplai). Demosthenes (54. 34) referred to 'those who Lakonize with their tribounes and single-soled footwear'. Consenquently, we can identify the open-toed sandal with a tongue at the top, on statues of Greek philosophers, as the Lakonian shoe. Pollux (Onom. 7. 88) informed us the shoe was coloured red (not crimson).

[Megas Methuselah]

Thank you, that is much more suitable than your "Spartanz r conzervatif so dey use old bootz."

[Phalanx300]

Thank you, that is much more suitable than your "Spartanz r conzervatif so dey use old bootz."

Seeing that they still use Archaic things thats actually not that weird. :inquisitive:

[Megas Methuselah]

Seeing that they still use Archaic things thats actually not that weird. :inquisitive:

That may be so, but it still isn't conclusive.

[Phalanx300]

That may be so, but it still isn't conclusive.

Yet it does speak in support of it.:whip:

[antisocialmunky]

I don't think you'll be looking at their shoes when they are man-training their way through a bunch of poor Pantodapoi.

[Megas Methuselah]

I don't think you'll be looking at their shows-

Shoes.

[antisocialmunky]

Shoes.

shoes

... if you really want to be technical.

[Azathoth]

shoes

... if you really want to be technical.

But the first word in a sentence is always capitalized.

[Ludens]

:focus:

[Megas Methuselah]

Yet it does speak in support of it.:whip:

I'm not denying that. But it is still a point that you, in your opening post, had taken too far.

[Phalanx300]

I'm not denying that. But it is still a point that you, in your opening post, had taken too far.

Sparta is all about convervatism, which made them a very stable nation as well. :inquisitive:

[Watchman]

"Stable" would be pretty relative in that context, IIRC some of the TWC discussions on the topic. Helot trouble, anyone ? Or the occasional lolroyaldrama, such as that preceding Leonidas' ascension to kingship ?

[Phalanx300]

"Stable" would be pretty relative in that context, IIRC some of the TWC discussions on the topic. Helot trouble, anyone ? Or the occasional lolroyaldrama, such as that preceding Leonidas' ascension to kingship ?

When compared to other nations it definately was stable and continious.

The Helots, that would only relate to the Messenian Helots as the Lakonian Helots found themselves Lakonians. And the Spartans treated them well like they did the Lakonian Helots before and then they massively rebelled which ment the second Messenian war and after that the Spartans started their brutal oppresion as revenge.

A royal drama? It was hardly a drama which put the entire state in crisis.

[antisocialmunky]

Resistence to change is a two edge sword. It only works as long as conditions don't change and it makes you hopeless when you do try to change.

See Agis IV and Cleomenes III.

[Phalanx300]

Resistence to change is a two edge sword. It only works as long as conditions don't change and it makes you hopeless when you do try to change.

See Agis IV and Cleomenes III.

Well it only makes you hopeless when you face a changed army which structure is superior. When Cleomenes was finally able to make his reforms Sparta quickly became the leading state in the Peloponessos again which eventually led to Makedonia intervering.

In his campaign I like the fact that the Acheans had a 3 times bigger army at one point but thought they would be no match for the Spartans.

When the Spartans adopted the Macedonian Phalanx they excelled at it, seeing they hold their own against Makedonian pikemen who were 32 ranks deep instead of the 16 deep of the Spartans.

And of the 6000 Spartans only 200 survived, really the last true battle of Sparta. Afterwards it just went downwards with Tyrants. :shame:

[antisocialmunky]

And Nabis rofl.

[Phalanx300]

And Nabis rofl.

Yeah, afterwards it lost all what made it Sparta. :whip:

[antisocialmunky]

Well the 400+ years of Eugenics did make a tough people that ended up fleeing into the mountains after the Goths burned Sparta down. They ended up turning into the still exant Tsarkonian people who served the Byzantines as superb cavalry.

[moonburn]

i don´t get why you have to pick on nabis considering that he had very litle to work with and he did made a great attemp (one could argue that had he kept those kretan pirates under control and he could have rebuilded spartan power again with the blessing of rome ) that almost worked :book:

[Phalanx300]

i don´t get why you have to pick on nabis considering that he had very litle to work with and he did made a great attemp (one could argue that had he kept those kretan pirates under control and he could have rebuilded spartan power again with the blessing of rome ) that almost worked :book:

Well Sparta was already dead when he took over.

Cleomenes also rebuilded Spartan power and it almost became dominant force once more. I like his story better and he goes back to the Lycurgan laws! :2thumbsup:




Well the 400+ years of Eugenics did make a tough people that ended up fleeing into the mountains after the Goths burned Sparta down. They ended up turning into the still exant Tsarkonian people who served the Byzantines as superb cavalry.

Actually the Spartans fled to Mori(some already with Roman takeover, though not only Mori I gues), and the people of Mori for the biggest part only marry with other Mori so they are actually a population which hasn't changed much since ancient times and they are the closest descendants of the Spartans. Also they remained unconquered by the Ottomans and were very important in the Greek rebellion. I also read Napoleon comes from a colony created by people from Mori, so yeah Napoleon was a Spartan. :clown:

[antisocialmunky]

Actually the Spartans fled to Mori(some already with Roman takeover, though not only Mori I gues), and the people of Mori for the biggest part only marry with other Mori so they are actually a population which hasn't changed much since ancient times and they are the closest descendants of the Spartans. Also they remained unconquered by the Ottomans and were very important in the Greek rebellion. I also read Napoleon comes from a colony created by people from Mori, so yeah Napoleon was a Spartan. :clown:

THIS IS PARIIIIS!!!

No, not the same effect, sorry.:sweatdrop:

[Megas Methuselah]

THIS IS PARIIIIS!!!

Ajaccio? :clown:


I also read Napoleon comes from a colony created by people from Mori, so yeah Napoleon was a Spartan.

Can you elaborate on this vague statement? Sounds like a story worth sharing, mah man.

[moonburn]

i had always assumed the spartans didn´t created colony´s since all of their true citizens where 2 busy beating the crap out of the helots and naked dancing for the spartan women, instead of worrying about space to live or marchants quests :shame:

[spanakoryzo]

I'll give it a try.Keep in mind though that this naration is modern greek pseudo-history.True Spartans are supposed to have fled to the rugged southern half of Taygetus in order to escape roman and byzantine occupation.From these refugees the population of medieval and modern Mani (Maina) has supposedly evolved.Some real history now.Under ottoman occupation (in the early 17th century) a number of maniot clans fled the Peloponnese and were settled in Corsica.Today there's only one elderly woman with any knowledge of maniot greek living in Corsica - all the rest have been fully assimilated.But in late 18th/early 19th there were still grecophones in substantial nubers around Ajaccio.And now we step into pseudo-history again.Several greek romantics expected to be liberated from the ottoman yoke by the triumphant armies of Napolen - who they believed to be one of these corsican grecophones.See the supposed connection here?You must also bare in mind that this tale is still being credited by ultra-nationalist greeks even today...

[Megas Methuselah]

Nice. A fine story; very similar to the Aeneid. :yes:

[antisocialmunky]

Which you might conclude has some merit with the Etruscan origin theories.(They're cloest related to populations of central Anatolia iirc, correct me if I'm wrong)

[Megas Methuselah]

Which you might conclude has some merit with the Etruscan origin theories.(They're cloest related to populations of central Anatolia iirc, correct me if I'm wrong)

Mhmm. Like the stories in the Bible's Old Testament...

[moonburn]

there where always greeks in the western mediterranean and corsica most certainly had it´s fair amount of colonies

the greeks and the poeni where fighting for the western mediterranean for centuries massalia siracuse emporion are just a few examples or greek strongholds

towards the aproximation date of eb start the poeni where "winning" this war by kicking the greeks out of the baleares islands and having strong footholds in corsica and sardinia and but still fighting this merchants wars over iberia and sicily (carthage was not the capital of the poeni empire but one of the many city states rulled by a senate or council of poeni )

to the best of my knowledge the 1st punic war derived out of the roman fear of the carthaginians control over the western mediterranean by controlling lilibaeum carthage and the massilia straight wich would create a division (sea division) beteween the western greeks and the rest of hellas (hellas as the lands who own hellenic speakers and have a comon culture)

if the carthies controlled the western mediterranean sea rome would eventually become dependent of carthage for their sea suply´s and their merchants would be at a disadvantage when trading while the greek colonies being isolated would eventually be all swollen one by one (since colonies where created where there where metal veins to be traded)

so napoleon could be a greek descendent but to claim him as a spartan descendent seems 2 much of coincidence to be believed

altough it´s a nice story :laugh4: