Nusantara Total War : Portugese Invasion

[Cute Wolf]

Hello, this is Pazu the Kitsune from the twcenter, organizer of the 'Siam: Total War' mod (our thread is here: http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=331660)

Our mod spans from 1530-1700, and includes these regions :)
I think that cooperation between our mods would be rly cool. You clearly seem to know more about this area than i do, but if you ever decide to include Ayutthaya Siam as a faction then wed certainly be willing to help out :)
Right now we still need researchers, so if you have an account at the twcenter then feel free to post some info in our thread and i can make you official researchers for the mod.
Best of luck with this,
Pazu
:D

I think I should wait for Sonic's response first then... he's the historical head men of this mod, as well as the co-leader...
he just said on the phone that our plan was BI mod, and your was M2TW, and the focus of the conflicts was very2 different...

EDIT:
And I may try to include Greater South East Asia next time, but we want to focus in the most important conflicts first (the Western Indonesian and Malaysian are the stepstone and place of fate deciding battles of every empire, as well as most European Colony grows at South East Asia)

Good Luck with you too...

NB: I Put some advice to differentiate our mod then, since you actually not yet made any in game progress... maybe you should focus on indochina area... :wink:

[Cute Wolf]

well, what about pajajaran / malaka unit descriptions then...? Sonic, your turns...

[Rahwana]

Hello, this is Pazu the Kitsune from the twcenter, organizer of the 'Siam: Total War' mod (our thread is here: http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=331660)

Our mod spans from 1530-1700, and includes these regions :)
I think that cooperation between our mods would be rly cool. You clearly seem to know more about this area than i do, but if you ever decide to include Ayutthaya Siam as a faction then wed certainly be willing to help out :)
Right now we still need researchers, so if you have an account at the twcenter then feel free to post some info in our thread and i can make you official researchers for the mod.
Best of luck with this,
Pazu
:D

Sorry to refuse your offer, apparently, I'm busy now for the research, and our mod focus in entirely different sets of conflicts.

Maybe CW can help you a bit in giving some advices if he willing to, but as far as I can tell, your mod is still lack several things, as well as progress... maybe we'll ask you instead to join us when we plan to relase the version with larger map, so I can made you official researcher on Indochina factions.

[Mee4703]

Sorry to refuse your offer, apparently, I'm busy now for the research, and our mod focus in entirely different sets of conflicts.

Maybe CW can help you a bit in giving some advices if he willing to, but as far as I can tell, your mod is still lack several things, as well as progress... maybe we'll ask you instead to join us when we plan to relase the version with larger map, so I can made you official researcher on Indochina factions.

Sure thing :yes:

[G. Septimus]

uhh, yeah
You'll be an Indochina Faction Researcher,
I'll plan the French Landing according to the book I bought

[plutoboyz]

What about some textured symbols, like this one:
https://img217.imageshack.us/img217/8036/acehf.png

hey skull, can you made it like EB Nomad style? I think it would be awesome. if needed I can send you the unedited file.

[plutoboyz]

here, short description for Pajajaran:

Javanese-Sundanese Peasants (sickles) = Tani
Villager force, have no formal training in battle, but their sickles is heavy enough to puncture most armor rather easily, and pissed off peasant mob could be more far more dangerous than real fighting force, depends in the right circumstance or leadership!

Sundanese Watchmen (golok) = Wado
Originally Wado/Wadwa, are soldier who act as watchmen. they are numerous. using Golok as primary weapon, Wado are swift, light, cheap infantry.

Java-Sunda Feudal Spearmen (javelin-overhead tombak) = Prajurit Tumbak
These men are flexible line infantry, common rank and file warriors of both Javanese and Sundanese army. They are capable to fight with their tombak spears, and their javelins are handy to soften enemy ranks before the clash.

Java-Sunda Feudal Archers (archer-golok) = Prajurit Panah
Equipped with good quality helmets, quilted leather armor, and trained in archery. These soldiers are best used as archers, but could fight in melee if necessary, thanks to their heavy equipments.

Sundanese Feudal Swordsmen (parang) = Pamarang
Behold! this is Pamarang, Using a curved sword that can be used as a superb slashing weapon and also can disarm enemy weapon with it. this is a fine soldier, trained well, fierce in battlefield.

Sundanese Jawara (double golok) = Jawara
Jawara are champion. they are best of the best in their region. they fight as mercenary. they trained with martial art. they also have knowledge of Kanuragan. literally; inner power.

Sundanese Elite Watchmen (javelin-tombak) = Bayangkara
Bayangkara, unlike Majapahit's Bhayangkara. Bayangkara are weaker. they act as law enforcer and regional guard as well. they use Tumbak, a spear that can be thrown when necessary.

Sundanese Royal Spearmen (tombakkujang) = Balamati
Balamati. Royal army of Pajajaran. Balamati is backbone of Pajajaran infantry. They are Maharaja favorite army. they fight only for Pajajaran and will die for it. Balamati are fine soldier, with extreme quality of morale. Balamati never fled, they fight to death.

Sundanese Royal Bladesmen (javelin-kujang) = Balamati Kujang
Balamati are threat to enemy, this Balamati are nightmare. unlike traditional Balamati, this Balamati wield a special sacred weapon named Kujang Jago. its a small curved blade, but it could kill you with a small scratch.

Sundanese Warrior-Priest Swordsmen (parang) = Kasatrya Pamarang Purgabaya
Puragabaya, as a true elite of Pajajaran. Puragabaya is not only great warrior, but also a wise priest. trained in religion as well as military knowledge. this Puragabaya wield a sword. it can be used as a superb slashing weapon and also can disarm enemy weapon with it

Sundanese Warrior-Priest Bladesmen (javelin-kujang) = Kasatrya Kujang Purgabaya
This Puragabaya are special. they go to battle field with their Kujang. Kujang is a small curved blade, but it could kill you with a small scratch. this is most deadly close combat weapon in Pajajaran.

Sundanese Elite Warrior-Priest (2handed tombakkujang) = Kasatrya Purgabaya
Puragabaya, as a true elite of Pajajaran. Puragabaya is not only great warrior, but also a wise priest. trained in religion as well as military knowledge. this Puragabaya armed with Kujang Pangarak, a Kujang used as pole arm weapon. it has better reach than standard kujang.

factional cavalry:
Sundanese Light Cavalry (cavjav-lancers) = Prajurit Tumpak Kuda
This Lancer are swift cavalry using Tumbak to harass enemy before charge enemy. they are light armored cavalry that best used in Hit and Run tactic.

Sundanese Royal Horsemen (cavparang) = Balamati Tumpak Kuda
besides as heavy infantry, they also trained in horsemanship as well. although Sunda not focused on cavalry combat, this cavalry still good. they are fine close combat cavalry, because they not using spear, but Sunda Sword.

Sundanese Warrior-Priest Cav (cavjav-kujanglancers) = Kasatrya Kuda Purgabaya
Puragabaya Cavalry are the best horseman in Sunda. they can harass enemy with their javelin, they also have furious charge, and great close combat skill. they use Kujang Pangarak as their weapon of choice. it could kill you even with a small scratch.

Sundanese Chariot (chariot-archers) = Kereta Kuda
Kareta Kuda, are a chariot archer. but what makes them different is they have a spearman for close combat. a good mobile archer and fine close combat cavalry.

Native Forest Worker Elephants (elephant-javelin) = Prajurit Gajah
Abundance of elephants that was used in daily economic activities, means that they could be drafted into military usage too. These men and beasts are actually not a real soldiers, as the elephants are more comfortable to pulling logs and tear down woods, rather than trampling humans and ramming gates.

Sundanese War Elephants (elephant-javelin) = Pasukan Gajah Siliwangi
Our great Sri Baduga Maharaja Siliwangi have reformed our kingdom. he create an elephant corps. used mainly for break enemy formation. its Javelin are fine armor piercing weapon. its protect the beast from light infantry.

[jirisys]

No longer busy... able to help

~Jirisys (200&:daisy: post:clown:)

[Nyz]

Kulaan niring napa takuhiring!!!

Portuguese Military Academy:

Well, 1st Portuguese Military Academy was established in 1641; anyway here the historical name of the academy:

a) Aula de Artilharia e Esquadria (1641) : [lecture of artillery and miter]
b) Aula de Fortificação e Arquitectura Militar (1647) : [Class of Fortification and Military Architecture]
c) Academia Militar da Corte (1700) : [The Royal Military Academy]
d) Academia Real de Fortificação, Artilharia e Desenho (1790) : [Royal Academy of Fortification, Artillery and Design]
e) Escola do Exército (1837) : [Army School]
f) Escola de Guerra (1911-1919) : [War College]
g) Escola Militar (1919-1938) : {Military school]
h) Academia Militar (1959) : [Military Academy]


Proceed to translate civilian building, 1 st start with market:

a) Gerai (trader/stall)
b) Pesara (street of the merchant)
c) Pasar (Market)
d) Gedung dan gudang (Supermarket and warehouse)
e) Kampung Saudagar (merchant quarter)

[Cute Wolf]

I've made the lastest updates of unit lists, as well as "Inlander" native levies for europeans... this was not too neat, but you can take a look... (dang, the ORG attachment have some problem uploading, so I'll use this)

http://www.twcenter.net/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=89858&d=1274075768

[Nyz]

Inlander = Orang Hulu / orang darat (as opposite of orang laut)
If they are native people (aborigines) , we can called them Orang Asli.

Inlander Archers (archer-golok) = Pemanah Hulu / Pemanah Orang Hulu
Inlander Horsemen = Penunggang Kuda Orang Hulu

Melayu Regular Gunners (gun-golok) = Pegawai Istinggar
Melayu Turkish Gunners (gun-scimitars) = Laskar Ispinggar (not istinggar)
Melayu Sultan's Royal Gunners (gun-scimitars) = Awinan Astenggar

Melayu-Sriwj Recr Cav Bodyguards (lancers-cavmaces) = Ceteria

[Cute Wolf]

no, "Inlander" meant as "native" people as a whole... (that's the nickname Portuguese and Dutch gives to Indonesians in colonial time)... not "inland people".. and they are recruitable anywhere for the Europeans

[Nyz]

Oh I see. So inlander mean Orang Tempatan / Peribumi (or bumiputera what we called in Malaysia)

[Cute Wolf]

that's why I put "serdadu" in their names, because they are supposed to be "european only" units...

but their models will share with native units of similar equipments... and what did you think about Sonic's balance system? it was loosely based on EB balance system, albeit with some modification.

[Nyz]

hmm, the Dutch called native archer as Pemanah Lokal? not Serdadu Pemanah? and which one balancing system that made by Sonic? the recent one (that one you post today) or the previous one?

Inlander Horsemen = Serdadu berkuda (OK or not?)

[Cute Wolf]

the recent one of course...

[plutoboyz]

I've made the lastest updates of unit lists, as well as "Inlander" native levies for europeans... this was not too neat, but you can take a look... (dang, the ORG attachment have some problem uploading, so I'll use this)

http://www.twcenter.net/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=89858&d=1274075768

umm.. wolf, Jawara should be weaker than Balamati

[Cute Wolf]

it was "relatively weak" indeed, if you look at the stats, and test it in playtest via custom battle (with 2 comp by LAN - I'm doing this in my laboratory for killing time, and using vanilla models as basis - Jawara was tested by Arcanii model on LOTR 2 handed swords animation), you can imagine that Jawara stats are optimized for frontal assault combat, while Balamati was better in formation, and thus "defensively"

--------------

BTW, many thanks for Jolt, now we have proper Portuguese name for the units:


No problem. Here's the translation:

Inf:

Port Colonial Pikemen / horde (Piqueiros Portugueses)
Port Colonial Crossbow / horde (Besteiros Portugueses)
Port Colonial Swords / horde (Escudados Portugueses)
Portuguese Swordsmen Militia (Peões Portugueses)
Portuguese Pikemen (Terços Portugueses)
Portuguese Crossbowmen (Caçadores Portugueses)
Portuguese Musketters (Musqueteiros Portugueses)
Portuguese Halberdiers (Alabardeiros Portugueses)
Portuguese Noble Pikemen (Suiços Portugueses) - This literally means "Portuguese Swissmen"; Although they aren't Swiss in any shape or form, I decided to put the name as that was what D. Afonso de Albuquerque called them in his congratulatory letter to D. Manuel I when the king adopted a military formation consisting of Pikemen which had many similarities with the Swiss formation and was having great success, thus prompting D. Afonso de Albuquerque nicknaming them so.
Portuguese Elite Swordsmen (Escudeiros-Fidalgos Portugueses)

Cav:

Portuguese Jinetes (Dragões Portugueses)
Portuguese Heavy Cavalry (Cavalareiros-Vilãos Portugueses)
Portuguese Cuirassiers (Couraceiros Portugueses)
Portuguese Heavy Lancers (Lanceiros Portugueses)

Bodyguards:

Portuguese Knights (Cavaleiros-Fidalgos Portugueses)


There you go. I had to make up some names to avoid repeating the same thing over and over again and to set them apart but the end result is pretty good. :)

[Cute Wolf]

so far, the European unit lists and naming... I'll ask Skull to patch the "leaked" units

Bodyguards:
Dutch Knight Bodyguards (lancers-cavlswords) = Lijfwatchen
Portugese Knight Bodyguards (lancers-cavlswords) = Cavaleiros-Fidalgos Portugueses

Infantry:
Port Colonial Pikemen / horde (pike-shortswords) = Piqueiros Portugueses
Port Colonial Crossbow / horde (crossbow-shortswords) = Besteiros Portugueses
Port Colonial Swords / horde (longswords) = Escudados Portugueses
Portuguese Swordsmen Militia (longswords) = Peoes Portugueses
Portuguese Pikemen (pike-shortswords) = Tercos Portugueses
Portuguese Crossbowmen (crossbow-shortswords) = Cacadores Portugueses
Portuguese Arquebusiers (gun-longwords) = Arcabuziros Portugueses
Portuguese Musketters (gun-longswords) = Musqueteiros Portugueses
Portuguese Halberdiers (2handed spear-axes) = Alabardeiros Portugueses
Portuguese Noble Pikemen (pike-shortswords) = Suicos Portugueses
Portuguese Elite Swordsmen (longswords) = Escudeiros-Fidalgos Portugueses
Dutch Colonial Pikemen / horde (pike-shortswords) = Koloniale Piekeniers
Dutch Colonial Crsbow / horde (crossbow-shortswords) = Koloniale Kruisboogschutters
Dutch Colonial Swords / horde (longsords) = Koloniale Zwaardvechters
Dutch Swordsmen Militia (longswords) = Voetvolk
Dutch Pikemen (pike-shortswords) = Piekeniers
Dutch Crossbowmen (crossbow-shortswords) = Kruisboogschutters
Dutch Arquebusiers (gun-longswords) dutch hat! = Arkebussiers
Dutch Indo Heavy Infantry (2handed spears) = Inlandse Speerdragers
Dutch Musketters (gun-longswords) dutch hat! = Musketiers
Dutch Halberdiers (2handed spear-axes) = Hellebaardiers
Dutch Elite Swordsmen (longswords) = Zwaardvechters

Cavalry:
Portuguese Jinetes (cavjav-cavlswords) = Dragoes Portugueses
Portuguese Heavy Cavalry (lancers-cavlswords) = Cavaleiros-Vilaos Portugueses
Portuguese Cuirassiers (cavlswords) = Couraceiros Portugueses
Portuguese Heavy Lancers (lancers-cavlswords) = Lanceiros Portugueses
Dutch Light Cavalry (cavlswords) dutch hat! / Comb Morion Hat??? = Ghemeyn Ruytren
Dutch Heavy Cavalry (lancers-cavlswords) = Lanciers
Dutch Cuirassiers (cavlswords) = Kurassiers
Dutch Heavy Lancers (lancers-cavlswords) = Lansiers

[Skullheadhq]

This is what Heavy European Cav from this timefram should look like
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/39/Retrato_ecuestre_del_conde-duque_de_Olivares%2C_by_Diego_Vel%C3%A1zquez.jpg

Dutch Light Cavalry (cavlswords) dutch hat! (should be that funny spanish conquistadorhelmet -skull) = Ghemeyn Ruytren (Karabiniers)
Dutch Heavy Cavalry (lancers-cavlswords) = Lanciers
Dutch Indo Heavy Infantry (2handed spears) = Inlandse Speerdragers

First two are in 16th century spelling.

Dutch Colonial Swords / horde (longsords) should be Koloniale Zwaardvechters
Dutch Arquebusiers (gun-longswords) dutch hat! = Arkebussiers

All dutch cavalry should only have a handgun, except for the lanciers. We just didn't use swords on our horses, why use swords when you have guns?

[Cute Wolf]

All dutch cavalry should only have a handgun, except for the lanciers. We just didn't use swords on our horses, why use swords when you have guns?

simple things, there is no such gun cavalry animations for RTW... so I must use the swords.

and as far as Javanese literatures are consulted, there was no such things as gun armed cavalry operating in significant numbers in Indonesia that period (two evidence of Dutch gun armed cavalry are depictions of VOC officers), although crossbow armed cavalry are mentioned.

ADD: and there was museum diorama depicting early VOC forces fought mounted with minor armour, with swords, and wearing cowboy like hats...

[Rahwana]

simple things, there is no such gun cavalry animations for RTW... so I must use the swords.

and as far as Javanese literatures are consulted, there was no such things as gun armed cavalry operating in significant numbers in Indonesia that period (two evidence of Dutch gun armed cavalry are depictions of VOC officers), although crossbow armed cavalry are mentioned.

ADD: and there was museum diorama depicting early VOC forces fought mounted with minor armour, with swords, and wearing cowboy like hats...

Stupid! that phrase of Penunggang kuda membawa bedil, was referred to common units, not an officer! anyone can point out to a direction and shout "THE ENEMY WAS HERE!" not just the officer!

[Cute Wolf]

Stupid! that phrase of Penunggang kuda membawa bedil, was referred to common units, not an officer! anyone can point out to a direction and shout "THE ENEMY WAS HERE!" not just the officer!

Ouch... my bad... so we must made the mounted gunners animation then? (I exclude mounted gunner units for that reasons :wall:)

[Jolt]

so far, the European unit lists and naming... I'll ask Skull to patch the "leaked" units

Bodyguards:
Dutch Knight Bodyguards (lancers-cavlswords) = Lijfwatchen
Portugese Knight Bodyguards (lancers-cavlswords) = Cavaleiros-Fidalgos Portugueses

Infantry:
Port Colonial Pikemen / horde (pike-shortswords) = Piqueiros Portugueses
Port Colonial Crossbow / horde (crossbow-shortswords) = Besteiros Portugueses
Port Colonial Swords / horde (longswords) = Escudados Portugueses
Portuguese Swordsmen Militia (longswords) = Peoes Portugueses
Portuguese Pikemen (pike-shortswords) = Tercos Portugueses
Portuguese Crossbowmen (crossbow-shortswords) = Cacadores Portugueses
Portuguese Arquebusiers (gun-longwords) = Arcabuziros Portugueses
Portuguese Musketters (gun-longswords) = Muskueteiros Portugueses
Portuguese Halberdiers (2handed spear-axes) = Alabardeiros Portugueses
Portuguese Noble Pikemen (pike-shortswords) = Suicos Portugueses
Portuguese Elite Swordsmen (longswords) = Escudeiros-Fidalgos Portugueses
Dutch Colonial Pikemen / horde (pike-shortswords) = Koloniale Piekeniers
Dutch Colonial Crsbow / horde (crossbow-shortswords) = Koloniale Kruisboogschutters
Dutch Colonial Swords / horde (longsords) = Koloniale Voetvolk
Dutch Swordsmen Militia (longswords) = Voetvolk
Dutch Pikemen (pike-shortswords) = Piekeniers
Dutch Crossbowmen (crossbow-shortswords) = Kruisboogschutters
Dutch Arquebusiers (gun-longswords) dutch hat! = Haakboogschutters
Dutch Indo Heavy Infantry (2handed spears) = ???
Dutch Musketters (gun-longswords) dutch hat! = Musketiers
Dutch Halberdiers (2handed spear-axes) = Hellebaardiers
Dutch Elite Swordsmen (longswords) = Zwaardvechters

Cavalry:
Portuguese Jinetes (cavjav-cavlswords) = Dragoes Portugueses
Portuguese Heavy Cavalry (lancers-cavlswords) = Cavalareiros-Vilaos Portugueses
Portuguese Cuirassiers (cavlswords) = Couraceiros Portugueses
Portuguese Heavy Lancers (lancers-cavlswords) = Lanceiros Portugueses
Dutch Light Cavalry (cavlswords) dutch hat! = ???
Dutch Heavy Cavalry (lancers-cavlswords) = ???
Dutch Cuirassiers (cavlswords) = Kurassiers
Dutch Heavy Lancers (lancers-cavlswords) = Lansiers

You're welcome. I've noticed that Skullheadhq didn't put "Neerlander", you can also eliminate the "Portugueses", which stands for Portuguese.

The Portuguese Heavy-Cavalry is "Cavaleiros", not "Cavalareiros".
EDIT: Also Musketeers is "Musqueteiros", not "Muskueteiros" (The "k" letter never existed in Portuguese)

[plutoboyz]

how about artillery? will we include them?

[Cute Wolf]

how about artillery? will we include them?

of course yes :grin:.... I still looking for some artillery pieces from certain mods and waiting for permissions... after got that, we'll move on and got some balancing jobs...

@ Jolt : thx... fixed...

[Cute Wolf]

thx to Jirisys too, he helps in translating some Spanish Mercenaries (who are highly sought in South East Asia that time)

Spanish Jinetes Merc (cavjav-cavlswords) = Jinetes Mercenarios Espanoles
Spanish Merce Arquebusiers (gun-longswords) = Arcabuzeros Mercenarios Espanoles
Spanish Merc Musketters (gun-longswords) = Mosqueteros Mercenarios Espanoles
Spanish Merc Pikemen (pike-shortswords) = Piqueros mercenarios Espanoles
Spanish Merc S&B (longswords) = Espadachines Mercenarios Espanoles Con Buclero

[Jolt]

thx to Jirisys too, he helps in translating some Spanish Mercenaries (who are highly sought in South East Asia that time)

Spanish Jinetes Merc (cavjav-cavlswords) = Jinetes Mercenarios Espanoles
Spanish Merce Arquebusiers (gun-longswords) = Arcabuzeros Mercenarios Espanoles
Spanish Merc Musketters (gun-longswords) = Mosqueteros Mercenarios Espanoles
Spanish Merc Pikemen (pike-shortswords) = Piqueros mercenarios Espanoles
Spanish Merc S&B (longswords) = Espadachines Mercenarios Espanoles Con Buclero

Spanish mercenaries? In South-East Asia? Are you sure? That seems completely wrong. The costs of Spanish people going to South-East Asia (I'm not even talking about the opportunity to do so) are so extraordinarily high that seeing Spanish mercenaries (Except when employed to be a part of the Portuguese expeditions in a part of the world where their State had no interests beyond the Philippines (And therefore little opportunity to be inserted within that part of the world) is very small, and I'm extremely surprised that you say that they were highly sought after.

[Hroth]

I am an experienced skinner and would like to provide aid in the development of this modification. I am very busy so this offer (forgive if I may offend some) is only going to be extended once. I am extremely illustrious in other projects, some that I am even paid full time to work for, so I would like to immediatley begin work as soon as possible to save time. Please hit me back with a response.

-Hroth

[Rahwana]

Spanish mercenaries? In South-East Asia? Are you sure? That seems completely wrong. The costs of Spanish people going to South-East Asia (I'm not even talking about the opportunity to do so) are so extraordinarily high that seeing Spanish mercenaries (Except when employed to be a part of the Portuguese expeditions in a part of the world where their State had no interests beyond the Philippines (And therefore little opportunity to be inserted within that part of the world) is very small, and I'm extremely surprised that you say that they were highly sought after.

Actually, Spanish did maintain significant presence in Eastern mollucas and Philliphines, they are bitter rival to that of portuguese in 16th Century, even bringing sultanate of Ternate and Tidore under their "Protectorates". As such relationships was developed (even after the Iberian Union), in the western part of the Islands, they often side with the Native kingdoms against Portuguese and later the Dutch. Their skill in wars was highly prized, and they often form a mercenary core in the Battle.

here's an English source you can understand, and don't forget that moluccas is just mere eastern side of the Indonesia.
http://www.colonialvoyage.com/spainmoluccas.html

--- if you want more refrences, we'll quote the Indonesian sources and try to translate them...

[Nyz]

In Sejarah Melayu there are stated that King of Maluku requested aid from Sultan Alauddin Riayat Syah of Melaka after his kingdom defeated by force from Kastilan...well, that Castile Kingdom of Spain...

[Jolt]

In Sejarah Melayu there are stated that King of Maluku requested aid from Sultan Alauddin Riayat Syah of Melaka after his kingdom defeated by force from Kastilan...well, that Castile Kingdom of Spain...

One thing is an official Spanish force. Another altogether is mercenaries. Mercenaries do not belong to official armies and my main doubt is that spanish individuals would come to offer their services on the other side of the world when they could very easily do it so in Europe.

Also my thanks to Sonic for the link. I was aware of the increased Spanish activity in the Eastern Indies after the Portuguese-Spanish personal union, but I had never heard that the Spanish had sent expeditions to try and wrest control of the Mollucas away from the Portuguese. As usual, they failed. ^_^

[plutoboyz]

Modeler, please take a look of this (http://nu3tara.forumotion.net/the-development-section-f9/unit-pictorial-reference-t23.htm#98). updated unit concept.

[Skullheadhq]

I believe there is a Napoleonic mod out there, maybe you could ask them for the animations.

[Cute Wolf]

One thing is an official Spanish force. Another altogether is mercenaries. Mercenaries do not belong to official armies and my main doubt is that spanish individuals would come to offer their services on the other side of the world when they could very easily do it so in Europe.

of course they go to our islands with their official armies... but a huge ammount of gold offered by local natives and possible riches (spices being more prized than gold, remember?)... as well as some offer of exotic girls (right, they also paid with slave-girls ^^).... Could easily sway their loyalty and they turn themself into mercenary services... :clown:

[G. Septimus]

I believe there is a Napoleonic mod out there, maybe you could ask them for the animations.
yeah, but they hold the musket like holding a bow
http://www.totalwar.org/cutenews/data/upimages/mms_battle-1.jpg SHITLESS!
but it's cool.... awesome unit models


of course they go to our islands with their official armies... but a huge ammount of gold offered by local natives and possible riches (spices being more prized than gold, remember?)... as well as some offer of exotic girls (right, they also paid with slave-girls ^^).... Could easily sway their loyalty and they turn themself into mercenary services... :clown:
uhh, That happens because Indonesians aren't Primitive like the Aztecs!
but, most of them created their new colonies, and that's why the Gov. created an alliance (VoC, EIC)
but, no Mercenaries. They were not Mercenaries. they're free Colonists, or traders
perhaps



Spanish mercenaries? In South-East Asia? Are you sure? That seems completely wrong. The costs of Spanish people going to South-East Asia (I'm not even talking about the opportunity to do so) are so extraordinarily high that seeing Spanish mercenaries (Except when employed to be a part of the Portuguese expeditions in a part of the world where their State had no interests beyond the Philippines (And therefore little opportunity to be inserted within that part of the world) is very small, and I'm extremely surprised that you say that they were highly sought after.

Agreed. who in the World wants to go to the other side of the world only for one's sake?
No One! (except Grand Marshalls, now that, is something diffrent)

[Cute Wolf]

not mercenaries, but colonists and traders...? (oh wait... you are the European researcher)
...

but perhaps, they are did involved in mercenary activity, and then could be called mercenaries for that reason (because local kings sometimes giving them luxurious gifts and golds and slave girls to made the spaniards with them)

--------------- take this as example (soory Jirisys :clown:)

Imagine Jirisys (as a Spanish colonists), sent from his poor family in Spain because they can't keep in feeding him, he was young and not yet married, and he didn't have any real job in Spain, so he apply for become lowly ship crews and try his luck on Spanish armada's trip to far eastern spice islands, later known as Indonesia. For a year, he endure harsh working conditions, low quality foods, and rough sea. After land in the Spanish colony in Moluccas, his supervisor gave him helmet, armour, longsword, and a buckler, and forced him to fight because the local was hostile at Spanish forces (the Spanish did trade armour and weapons for spices, but when they had problems, they did mentioned to arm even their lowest ship-crews to fight because they carry many spare armours and weaponaries - so Jirisys was basically Spanish horde swordsmen). After that, he was braced his very first battle, he stand in the front ranks, just at the side of the Pike formations, defending himself in formations of swordsmen, repelling wave after wave of native levies... and he coming out alive in winning Spanish army because he worn armour, and his enemies are mostly unarmoured, unwilling, and unskilled peasants armed with mere bamboo spears... common to be found in eastern islands (western indonesian army depicted in the Portuguese invasion mod was much better trained, willing, and equipped than eastern Indonesian army! don't even compare moluccas peasant units with Javanese-Sundanese peasants, the Javanese and Sundanese had some martial tradition living even in the peasant society, while the moluccas was completely bland peasants).

Ok, with that experience of battle, and some other battle against some peasant human waves again... Jirisys become battle harded veterans, because he could simply pwn bamboo spear equipped peasants with his swords easily, and he allready kill some. He was promoted to regular soldiery in Spanish army, and tasked to guard a missionary expedition to Java. As you can expect, guarding missionaries and priests, he was forced to live in strict rules, discipline, and most importantly, the boring religious sermons and ceremonies (for him). For some time, he must endure all of it, and one day, the missionaries and priests said the Soldiers could go back to Moluccas because they want to settle down in the village, and convert the locals to Christianity... Jirisys and his friend in that band of soldiers, actually was expected to simply go back and resume their activity in the Army. But a Blambangan (majapahit) noble comes, and ask them to help them in fight against Demak army. At first, they may refuse, but after that, the Blambangan nobles start to open the chest he carries, and show them a big sum of gold coins. He then lead them to his camps, give them tuak (sugarcane-wine), silk clothes, and most importantly, slave girls for each to bang. Of course, befitted of the name of hedonistic pleasures, Jirisys choose to stay in the camp (to drunk and bang the slave girls). A week later, a messager comes and told them to prepare for a coming battle. Jirisys worn his armour (that was cleaned and polished by his slaves), and found himself placed in the central front ranks of battleline. His captain (in his band) order them to charge right into the Demak line, and found themself able to outmatch the Prajurit Pamedhang of Javanese army, because they had better armour. He won and got more gold coins, as well as more slave girls to statisfy his needs... After all of that...

Could you told that wasn't a mercenary activity? :clown: (note : this story of Jiri is fictional, but I done this based on historical texts, how the Spanish army works for Indonesian nobles was treated)

[plutoboyz]

...
uhh, That happens because Indonesians aren't Primitive like the Aztecs!....
hold on... Aztec aren't primitive. They are advanced enough compared Old World. their achievement are by themself. unlike ancient greeks who became advanced because of Egypt and India.

[Rahwana]

hey, you also forgot to mention that Jirisys will also got his share of spices, and when Jirisys want to coming to his parent's home in Spain, he will most likely secure some personal relations with the spice traders here, and got secure money for the rest of his lifetime... but if he survives the battles and wars he involved with...

[G. Septimus]

not mercenaries, but colonists and traders...? (oh wait... you are the European researcher)
...

but perhaps, they are did involved in mercenary activity, and then could be called mercenaries for that reason (because local kings sometimes giving them luxurious gifts and golds and slave girls to made the spaniards with them)

--------------- take this as example (soory Jirisys :clown:)

Imagine Jirisys (as a Spanish colonists), sent from his poor family in Spain because they can't keep in feeding him, he was young and not yet married, and he didn't have any real job in Spain, so he apply for become lowly ship crews and try his luck on Spanish armada's trip to far eastern spice islands, later known as Indonesia. For a year, he endure harsh working conditions, low quality foods, and rough sea. After land in the Spanish colony in Moluccas, his supervisor gave him helmet, armour, longsword, and a buckler, and forced him to fight because the local was hostile at Spanish forces (the Spanish did trade armour and weapons for spices, but when they had problems, they did mentioned to arm even their lowest ship-crews to fight because they carry many spare armours and weaponaries - so Jirisys was basically Spanish horde swordsmen). After that, he was braced his very first battle, he stand in the front ranks, just at the side of the Pike formations, defending himself in formations of swordsmen, repelling wave after wave of native levies... and he coming out alive in winning Spanish army because he worn armour, and his enemies are mostly unarmoured, unwilling, and unskilled peasants armed with mere bamboo spears... common to be found in eastern islands (western indonesian army depicted in the Portuguese invasion mod was much better trained, willing, and equipped than eastern Indonesian army! don't even compare moluccas peasant units with Javanese-Sundanese peasants, the Javanese and Sundanese had some martial tradition living even in the peasant society, while the moluccas was completely bland peasants).

Ok, with that experience of battle, and some other battle against some peasant human waves again... Jirisys become battle harded veterans, because he could simply pwn bamboo spear equipped peasants with his swords easily, and he allready kill some. He was promoted to regular soldiery in Spanish army, and tasked to guard a missionary expedition to Java. As you can expect, guarding missionaries and priests, he was forced to live in strict rules, discipline, and most importantly, the boring religious sermons and ceremonies (for him). For some time, he must endure all of it, and one day, the missionaries and priests said the Soldiers could go back to Moluccas because they want to settle down in the village, and convert the locals to Christianity... Jirisys and his friend in that band of soldiers, actually was expected to simply go back and resume their activity in the Army. But a Blambangan (majapahit) noble comes, and ask them to help them in fight against Demak army. At first, they may refuse, but after that, the Blambangan nobles start to open the chest he carries, and show them a big sum of gold coins. He then lead them to his camps, give them tuak (sugarcane-wine), silk clothes, and most importantly, slave girls for each to bang. Of course, befitted of the name of hedonistic pleasures, Jirisys choose to stay in the camp (to drunk and bang the slave girls). A week later, a messager comes and told them to prepare for a coming battle. Jirisys worn his armour (that was cleaned and polished by his slaves), and found himself placed in the central front ranks of battleline. His captain (in his band) order them to charge right into the Demak line, and found themself able to outmatch the Prajurit Pamedhang of Javanese army, because they had better armour. He won and got more gold coins, as well as more slave girls to statisfy his needs... After all of that...

Could you told that wasn't a mercenary activity? :clown: (note : this story of Jiri is fictional, but I done this based on historical texts, how the Spanish army works for Indonesian nobles was treated)
okay, if it's like this, let's make an AAR!! (Pre-release)

[G. Septimus]

hold on... Aztec aren't primitive. They are advanced enough compared Old World. their achievement are by themself. unlike ancient greeks who became advanced because of Egypt and India.
They don't use clothes and use earrings on their noses!\Indonesians (Even before Religion-spreading) don't do that. we already had clothes from the pre-Budha/Hindu times. you have a point though. they created the Calendar (2012)- but that is the Mayans. the Aztecs were just Conquerors who were conquered by The Spanish

Source: The English in Indonesia, 500 years span from Gramedia
~Sev (I used to do this on posts)

[Cute Wolf]

wait for the shared Portuguese/Dutch/Spanish militia/elite swordsmen to be completed first (the difference is just colours and armour, elite wear much heavier armour)

[G. Septimus]

wait for the shared Portuguese/Dutch/Spanish militia/elite swordsmen to be completed first (the difference is just colours and armour, elite wear much heavier armour)
like this?:
http://www.spvocation.org/site/external/fckeditor/data/Image/FOTM/conquistadors.jpg

[Cute Wolf]

yoi, that was for the Portuguese/Dutch militia swordsmen, but they will have shoulder protector and foot protector as well in Elite Swrodsmen's case.

*. but I don't think that I've ever seen that kind of shield... could you give the details of your picture? it was interesting, maybe they fought against some kind of Elite unarmoured swordsmen... (that will be represented with 2 or even 3 HP in our mod terms)

[G. Septimus]

yoi, that was for the Portuguese/Dutch militia swordsmen, but they will have shoulder protector and foot protector as well in Elite Swrodsmen's case.

*. but I don't think that I've ever seen that kind of shield... could you give the details of your picture? it was interesting, maybe they fought against some kind of Elite unarmoured swordsmen... (that will be represented with 2 or even 3 HP in our mod terms)
I don't have any source about that, maybe I'll read my Book :book:
I'll continue making the Euro Faction Members. we can use M2TW Avatars
I'll right it down
ADD:
the Settlements under Dutch control, will easily rebel. since Indonesians don't like Dutch due to their cruelty.
instead of Rebels Rebelling, it'll be British/ Previous Owner Faction.

[G. Septimus]

okay,
new idea:
Faction Hero/ Badass-Master chief guy
they must be shown with badass pics

[Cute Wolf]

okay,
new idea:
Faction Hero/ Badass-Master chief guy
they must be shown with badass pics

just no, one man army like in Aristeia is simply... err..... ahistorical...
plus leaders and "heroes" at this time mostly got some kind of command position.

and even when I like the idea of one man mow down an army, it was ahistorical... the one man show was mostly single man to man duel occured in general vs general battle...

[Skullheadhq]

VoC:
Check This (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Governor-General_of_the_Dutch_East_Indies) out
achh, needa check out on the "Real Apperance" and the "In-Game" one

The governor-generals never lived in Indonesia, but stayed in the Netherlands.

[Cute Wolf]

The governor-generals never lived in Indonesia, but stayed in the Netherlands.

but some certainly did... and who did actually lived in Indonesia, always got his personal hands on military campaign.
and JP Coen for example, are written as brave (and cruel) generals, fought dismounted in the front ranks, led the men to charge enemy line...

*. so he will be spawned with infantry bodyguards... maybe version of elite swordsmen or some kind.

[jirisys]

of course they go to our islands with their official armies... but a huge ammount of gold offered by local natives and possible riches (spices being more prized than gold, remember?)... as well as some offer of exotic girls (right, they also paid with slave-girls ^^).... Could easily sway their loyalty and they turn themself into mercenary services... :clown:

I'd do it

~Jirisys (Yeah baby!)

[Ibn-Khaldun]

I saw you got your own forum. Congratulations!

[Cute Wolf]

many thanks.... *but still wonder, what should I do because I can't separate each discussions in this thread to more specific threads at the new forum, because it was not yet moved *

[Nyz]

hehehe... just language jokes. Haji mean King

example: Haji Pakuan = King of Pakuan


yeah, but it was the language of later times, right :beam:


Well, Srivijaya's inscription of Telaga Batu also stated Haji as king...


king of Islam domonated areas, to be precise

Telaga Batu inscription date back to 686 AD, are there influenced Islam area around Sumatera at that time?

[plutoboyz]

Telaga Batu inscription date back to 686 AD, are there influenced Islam area around Sumatera at that time?

well, Muslim are in sumatra since the third caliph Uthman. but word Haji older than muslim history. besides, its has different meaning. the word Hajj mean traveling, while the word Haji mean King. later replaced by Prabu, Paduka etc...

[Nyz]

So, the word "Haji (=king)" is irrelevant with Islam influence?

[plutoboyz]

So, the word "Haji (=king)" is irrelevant with Islam influence?

me think so. it just spelling similarity. not much Arabs in Nusantara before Islam, IIRC, Haji (Usually "Ratu Haji")date back to Tarumanagara.

and I never heard muslim ruler called "Haji" (except maybe for those who have done pilgrimage to Makka). more commonly, Sultan, Shah, Padishah, Bey, Malik, etc.

[Nyz]

To all visitors, check out our new group's forum at:

https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/forumdisplay.php?310-Nusantara-Total-War

[sinchan_70]

To all visitors, check out our new group's forum at:

https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/forumdisplay.php?310-Nusantara-Total-War

AFAIK, The Portuguese in Indonesia between 1512–1850, CMIIW

[Cute Wolf]

AFAIK, The Portuguese in Indonesia between 1512–1850, CMIIW

not only Indonesia :grin: melaka invaded in 1511... that's true they start to land in "Indonesia" in 1512, but our mod area is South East Asia

[sinchan_70]

not only Indonesia :grin: melaka invaded in 1511... that's true they start to land in "Indonesia" in 1512, but our mod area is South East Asia

owwww, sorry about that, i think it will be start when they land in Indonesia

[Rahwana]

owwww, sorry about that, i think it will be start when they land in Indonesia

yeah, Nusantara encompass much larger areas than just Indonesia

[Reza]

When the 1.0 released?
i want to play it

[plutoboyz]

When the 1.0 released?
i want to play it

you can download and play 0.5 version. For eternity I'm afraid.

[Cute Wolf]

not eternity, I'll said June :wink:

now let me finish another mod that I'm involved first

[Skullheadhq]

June huh? Promise? If you break the promise, you should sent me a mail order bride for free :clown:

[Cute Wolf]

I'll sent my country's entire export of Locusts and Earthworms if I don't start re-making NUSANTARA on JUNE!!! :clown:

[plutoboyz]

June? Really? Alone? meh, I doubt it. lets see what happen next month.

[Reza]

bisa pake cheat kan mod ini,tinggal download 3ds max dari idws setelah itu ane join ke team NusTW

[Reza]

Released in june,really!!!!!!!!!!
btw the gameplay are very good.but the unit detail graphic are pitiful
did you set your graphic to low?