View Full Version : Large Mafia Game Mafia vs Werewolves [Concluded]
God Emperor
06-29-2012, 07:37
Well.. If we do not see any night kills from now on, my death won't be a problem. I still wouldn't go after kagemusha though.
dcmort93
06-29-2012, 08:12
Well.. If we do not see any night kills from now on, my death won't be a problem. I still wouldn't go after kagemusha though.And why is that?
God Emperor
06-29-2012, 09:58
And why is that?
For the same reason I gave the last time.. Simply too much of a lurker (or more correctly, inactive), to have a good chance of being scum imo. His behavior when he was active (the first phases) was reasonable imo, and I did not suspect him back then.
(I will just add my thoughts on the game here)
To me the most townish person is Edse, and especially yesterday as he kept changing his mind.. It would suggest that he is on a very honest effort to try and catch scum.. There are however two teams, and so he naturally could be a mafia, but his behavior does not give me these vibes.
I imagine BSmith to be the so called 'town leader' (pizzas name) and though I do not know what credentials he has put forward.
yourself (Dcmort) I think appear to a large extent townish, because you seemed to have really been left in the dark earlier on in the game, and you obviously wanted to be active -> you take scum hunting into your own hands. Your behavior seems coherent.
Given these thoughts, I would not lynch Dcmort, Edse(the pretend town leader), and Bsmith. So what we have left is myself, Kagemusha and The king. I know I am a vanilla townie, and so lynching the King (as I would prefer him over Kagemusha), seems to be the most reasonable choice. If he is not the last mafia, then I would be fine with Kagemusha I think.. As long as we do not see night kills, we have plenty of time to remove 'biggest suspects' and I am sympathetic if I myself is included in that list.. It would be counter productive if I were still alive when/if we are only 3 people left, and I am not trusted by that time.
So these are my thoughts on the game.
If the scum is one of the three people I considered least likely to be scum, then the obvious choice at that point would be to put forward all evidence and claims in public etc.
Kagemusha
06-29-2012, 20:11
Im going to vote: The King. I am on my summer vacation, so my participation as many have pointed out has been less then satisfactory.The host has pointed out to me that i will get vogged unless i vote.I know i am innocent and confirmed by some wolfie by attacking me.So there you have it.Let us hope the conclusion is preferable for this round.
2 God Emperor: dcmort93, The King
2 Kagemusha: edse, BSmith
2 The King: God Emperor, Kagemusha
Well, well... interesting.
dcmort93
06-29-2012, 20:20
For the time being I'll let GE and Kage live. Unvote; Vote The King
Im going to vote: The King. I am on my summer vacation, so my participation as many have pointed out has been less then satisfactory.The host has pointed out to me that i will get vogged unless i vote.I know i am innocent and confirmed by some wolfie by attacking me.So there you have it.Let us hope the conclusion is preferable for this round.
I sense much scum in you.
Tally:
The King: God Emperor, Kagemusha, Dcmort
God Emperor: The King
Kagemusha: Edse, BSmith
'All right' said Jarema. 'We have problems with decision once more? Well, lets see... Oh. I see that you, in fact, did decide. The King must die? Let it be so'
The King was a magic accessories merchant/
'I have also another info for you: Memnon was a werewolf! Now, your town is free from this problem'.
Night 11 begins
List of living players:
1.
2.
3.
4. Edse
5.
6. Bsmith
7.
8.
9.
10.
11.
12.
13.
14. dcmort93
15.
16.
17.
18. Kagemusha
19.
20.
21.
22. God Emperor
23.
24.
25.
26.
27.
Dead players:
1. Visorslash, werewolf hunter, lynched day 1. Not a werewolf. Had criminal contacts.
2. Chaotix, grain merchant, killed night 1. Not a werewolf.
3. Xenoneb, toy merchant, lynched day 2. Not a werewolf. No criminal contacts. Mason.
4. Daveshack, mayor, killed night 2. Not a werewolf.
5. DoubleA, jail keeper, killed night 2. Not a werewolf.
6. Ishmael, cloth merchant. lynched day 3. Not a werewolf. No criminal contacts.
7. Montmorency, miner's guild master, killed night 3. Not a werewolf.
8. SalmonSoil, herbalist, killed night 3. Not a werewolf.
9. LazyMcCrow, spice merchant, lynched day 4. Not a werewolf. No criminal contacts.
10. Centurion1, weaver’s guild master, lynched day 5. Not a werewolf. No criminal contacts.
11. Autolycus, herbalist, killed night 5. Not a werewolf.
12. Csargo, fruit merchant, lynched day 6. Werewolf!
13. Robbiecon (replaced Xehh II), night watch captain, killed night 6. Not a werewolf.
14. Wideyedwanderer , priest, killed night 6. Not a werewolf.
15. Atheotes, blacksmith's guild master, lynched day 7. Not a werewolf.
16. Askthepizzaguy, scout's leader, killed night 7. Not a werewolf.
17. Cute wolf, deputy mayor, WoGed day 8. Not a werewolf.
18. Choxorn, healer, lynched day 8. No criminal contacts. Not a werewolf.
19. Arjos, tool merchant, lynched day 9. No criminal contacts. Werewolf!
20. Classical Hero, city watch marshall. killed night 9. Not a werewolf.
21. Memnon, butcher's guild master, lynched day 10.
22. The King, magic accessories merchant, lynched day 11.
Player list:
1. Arjos
Alpha werewolf; cover role: Tool merchant. Lynched day 9
2. Memnon
Subordinate werewolf; cover role: Butcher’s Guild Master. Lynched day 10
3. Csargo
Subordinate werewolf, criminal contacts; cover role: Fruit Merchant , lynched day 6
4. Cute Wolf
Mafia. Deputy mayor. Wogged day 8
5. Askthepizzaguy
Mafia. Scouts leader. Killed day 7
6. The King
Mafia. Spy guild master.
7. Salmonsoil
Mafia. Herbalist. Potions: water, poison, killed night 3
8. Classical Hero
Mafia. City watch marshal. Killed night 9
9. Daveshack
Mayor killed night 2
10. Autolycus
Herbalist. Killed night 5
11. Xenoneb
Toy Merchant (and mason)
12. Kagemusha
Scouts deputy leader (bitten by werewolf night 2)
13. Xehh II/ Robbiecon
Night watch captain, killed night 6
14. wideyedwanderer
Priest, killed night 6
15. Edse
Magistrate clerk
16. Bsmith
Magistrate clerk. wounded
17. Visorslash
Werewolf hunter, criminal contacts
18. Choxorn
Healer lynched day 8
19. dcmort93
Village fool, criminal contacts
20. DoubleA
Jail Keeper, criminal contacts killed night 2
21. Atheotes
Blacksmith’s Guild Master lynched day 7. Will look as if he had criminal contacts
22. Centurion1
Weaver’s Guild Master,
23. Montmorency
Miner’s Guild Master (and mason). Killed night 3
24. Chaotix
Grain Merchant killed night 1
25. LazyMcCrow
Spice Merchant, lynched day 4
26. Ishmael
Cloth Merchant lynched day 3
27. God Emperor
Wine Merchant, criminal contacts
Mafia had some power roles, but no power to actually kill at night (with possible exception of herbalist making poison - but it didnt work),
Werewolves had no power roles besides being werewolves.
Werewolves mechanics:
At waning and waxing moon one of them (alpha) attack with full strength, and two of them (‘subordinates’) attack and only wound their victim. At full moon, all three players attack. Attacks are compulsory. At new moon werewolves cannot attack. Additionally, during full moon alpha werewolf can decide to only wound their target. This target would be from now on carrier of lycanthropy (he would not know that). During next full moon, he would transform into a beast and attack someone chosen at random. Still, he would be town (or mafia) aligned player, and he would not know what happened to him. Lycanthropy can be cured from him, but only at new moon (or if werewolves are eliminated). After alpha werewolf dies, during next full moon one of subordinates would become new alpha. One of subordinates would have criminal contacts. Werewolves heal their wounds automatically at full moon. They are also more powerful and perceptive then (during full moon werewolf automatically attacks person tracking or watching him).
Kagemusha was biten at night 2. He murdered wideyedwanderer at night 6. he could be healed from lycanthropy only at new moon (or with death of other lycanthropes)
werewolves qt: http://www.quicktopic.com/47/H/nzixLT2Qkjj4
mafia qt: http://www.quicktopic.com/47/H/dkKTpYnW5n4qr
dead qt (rather boring): http://www.quicktopic.com/47/H/drtuksa2iMnm
Roles descriptions:
Mafia. They call themselves ‘Violet Order’. 5 mafia players. They cannot attack at night. Roles:
1. Deputy mayor.
Twice per game, you can make killed player appear as if he was mafia for any investigators. You cannot use this power at two consecutive nights
2. Herbalist.
During full moon you can make some potions, and then use it at further nights. There can be potions that do nothing, that poison others, that heal, that offer protection against werewolves for one night, and even one that gives double-vote ability for one day. You will get random three of them each time you brew them. You start without any potions
3. Spy guild master (cover identity: magic accessories merchant).
You have a lot of contacts – it means that you are tie-breaker, and that you cannot be lynched by ‘normal’ number of players as long as at least two other mafia members are alive. To lynch you, an absolute majority of votes must be reached as long as at least two other mafia members are alive
4. Scouts Leader.
You can spy someone at night and see whom he visits. Be warned that during full moon werewolves may become aware that you are tracking them, and attack you. At new moon on the other hand it is too dark to track effectively
5. City watch marshal.
Role blocker. Be warned that during full moon werewolves may become aware that you are blocking them, and attack you.
Town:
1. Mayor.
Once per game, as a night action, you can block all actions of mafia players (but not werewolves).
2. Herbalist.
During full moon you can make some potions, and then use it at further nights. There can be potions that do nothing, that poison others, that heal, that offer protection against werewolves for one night, and even one that gives double-vote ability for one day. You will get random three of them each time you brew them. You start without any potions
3. Scouts Deputy Leader.
You can spy someone at night and see whom he visits. Be warned that during full moon werewolves may become aware that you are tracking them, and attack you. At new moon on the other hand it is too dark to track effectively
4. Night watch captain.
You can observe someone’s house at night. You will know if that person leaved house or not, and if someone visited that person (but not who). Be warned that during full moon werewolves may become aware that you are observing them, and attack you. At new moon on the other hand it is too dark to watch effectively
5. Priest.
You know your community quite well. As a night action, you can determine if someone has a power role. All mafia have power roles. Some townies have power roles and some don’t. Werewolves do not have power roles.
6. Magistrate clerk (two of them).
You can examine living place and documents of deceased person, and determine if he/she had criminal contacts or not. All mafia members have criminal contacts, but also some townies have them. You can decide to ‘publish’ results of your investigations if you want (I will put them in a game thread). You cannot use this ability on consecutive nights.
7. Werewolf hunter.
You have some silver bullets… You can attack other person at night (and, if successful, kill him/her). You will learn if that person was werewolf or not. If not, you commit suicide immediately. Alternatively, you can use your weapon in other way: every night you can decide that you will shoot to any person visiting you (and kill first person who does so). You will learn if that person was werewolf or not. If not, you commit suicide immediately.
8. Healer.
You can heal someone’s wounds as a night action. You can also examine someone’s health.
9. Village fool.
You can target one player at night. I will sent him info that you contacted him. You will be confirmed innocent for him, but you will not know if he is townie or not.
10. Jail keeper.
You can target one player. You will block and protect him at the same time. You can use this ability only once per player and you cannot use it on yourself.
The rest of players are different merchants guild masters. Two of them are additionally masons.
Game log:
day 1
Visorslash (werewolf hunter, who was here to give town limited ability to kill at night) lynched
Night 1
[/Bsmith investigates body of Visor. Publish the info – he had criminal contacts!
Edse investigates body of Visor. Publish the info – he had criminal contacts! Roleblocked
ATPG spies Ishmael
Classical Hero blocks Edse
Kagemusha tracks Chaotix
Dcmort93 contacts ATPG and informs him that he is vanilla townie- that one is interesting
Double A jails ATPG
Wideyedwanderer investigates Xenoneb and learns that he has no power role
Arjos attacks Chaotix (and kills him)
Memnon attacks Montmorency (and wounds him)
Csargo attacks Classical Hero (and wounds him)
Day 2
Xenoneb (mason) lynched
Night 2
Salmonsoil brews potions of: water (target is informed that you gave him water), poison, healing. Potion of poison poisons character – he gets wounded, and if he would not be healed he will die later.
Autolycus brews potions of: anti-werewolf protection, double-vote (usable at night; person on whom you use it, gets double-vote ability for one day), healing
DoubleA jails Montmorency
DcMort reveals to Montmorency
ATPG tracks wideyedwanderer (and learns he visited him)
Wideyedwandered scans ATPG and learns he has a power role
Choxorn examines Memnon and learns he is healthy
Arjos inflicts lycanthropy on Kagemusha
Csargo attacks Daveshack (mayor) and kills him
Memnon attacks DoubleA (jail keeper) and kills him
I will write more later, now I have to go to sleep
Day 3
Ishmael (vanilla) lynched
Night 3
Memnon attacks Montmorency
Csargo attacks Montmorency
Arjos attacks SalmonSoil. First mafia death. He was the only mafia chance to kill someone at night (herbalist)
Edse examines Xenoneb. Results should be published. He had no criminal contacts. There were signs, that he was in contact with some kind of benign group.
BSmith examines Ishmael. Results should be published. He had no criminal contacts.
Wideyed scans Atheotes and learns that he has no power role
DCmort reveals to Kagemusha
SalmonSoil heals Classical Hero
Day 4
Centurion vs LazyMccrow tie; resolved due to The King tie-breaking ability. Lazy was vanilla
Night 4
Wideyedwanderer examines Centurion. Roleblocked!
Classical roleblocks wideyed
Autolycus uses potion of double-vote on Kagemusha
It was new moon, so no attakcs
Day 5
Centurion (vanilla) lynched
Night 5
Arjos attacks and kills Autolycus (town-aligned herbalist)
Memnon attacks and wounds Classical
Csargo attacks and wounds BSmith
Autolycus heals Kagemusha
BSmith examines body of Centurion. Publish results. (no criminal contacts)
Edse examines body of LazyMcCrow. Publish results (no criminal contacts)
Choxorn examines wideyedwanderer and learns that he is healthy
ATPG tracks Csargo (he attacked BSmith)
Wideyed scans BSmith and learns that he has a power role
DcMort reveals to Memnon
Day 6
Csargo lynched - first death among wolves
Night 6
Arjos attacks Robbiecon
Memnon attacks The King
Kagemusha attacks random person (wideyed)
3 kills despite lynch of one wolf
ATPG gives anti-wolf potion to The King
Robbiecon watches wideyedwanderer
Dcmort reveals to Edse
Choxorn heals classical and scans dcmort
Day 7
Atheotes (vanilla) lynched
Night 7
Arjos attacks ATPG (killed) - another mafia going down
Memnon attacks Classical Hero (wounded) - Classical bears many wounds :)
Classical Hero roleblocks God Emperor
ATPG tracks Arjos
Choxorn checks if Edse is injured, and heals Kagemusha (partially, because it is not new moon).
Day 8
Choxorn (healer) lynched due to false testimony
Night 8
nothing happens
Day 9
tie between Arjos and The King; of course Arjos is lynched. Alpha werewolf killed!
Night 9
Memnon attacks Classical Hero and kills him (wounds, but he was wounded already)
Day 10
Memnon lynched. Bye, bye, werewolves
Night 10
Edse investigated Arjos.
Kagemusha tracks BSmith
Day 11
The King lynched. town victory!
Montmorency
06-29-2012, 21:15
:laugh4:
Beautiful
dcmort93
06-29-2012, 21:17
Well played by everyone. Pizza I must thank you for working so extensively with me even though it wouldn't have taken much to totally screw me over. Other mafiosos well played by you as well. Wolves, well done but in the end we got ya.
dcmort93
06-29-2012, 21:18
Oh and for the record I was the one commonly referred to as 'trusted townie leader' due to my ability to be Host proven Innocent.
I must admit that mafia was hitted hard by WoG-ing one of them.
Fun game to host, a lot of interesting things happened (I will include more info in earlier posts)
And, Dcmort, after you revealed to ATPG night one, I had wonderful times :)
And after you revealed to wolves, I was sure you are going to die soon...
I must admit that mafia was hitted hard by WoG-ing one of them.
Fun game to host, a lot of interesting things happened (I will include more info in earlier posts)
And, Dcmort, after you revealed to ATPG night one, I had wonderful times :)
And after you revealed to wolves, I was sure you are going to die soon...
I think I brought it up once in the qt, but we had a few crises immediately after I was revealed to. What with Csargo being lynched, and the attempt at a cover-up. Why did I have to choose Choxorn as the visitor to ATPG? It would've been much easier to choose a lurker like CuteWolf. Eh, it was fun.
dcmort93
06-29-2012, 21:52
Oh ya that's right I did reveal to Memnon. I'm pretty sure that was Pizza's idea but it worked out never the less
God Emperor
06-29-2012, 22:23
Thanks for the game. :)
Askthepizzaguy
06-29-2012, 22:37
Yeah, if the wolves had ever killed dcmort, or if we scumbags could have killed anyone, we would have ruled all.
It was completely hilarious for a while there, considering how completely over the barrel we had the town, how much information I had, and how we abused the town's own abilities to our advantage.
But, without being able to personally attack the wolf suspects, we had to rely on town to lynch them. And it took too long, and the wolves kept hitting us instead of fearless townie leaders we could never, ever get lynched.
Hey, dcmort, why don't you reveal the message I sent you about Paulie....
Askthepizzaguy
06-29-2012, 22:40
Once the wolves had all but killed us off, I played to ensure they wouldn't win either. We deserved a win I feel, and since they kept picking us off, I wanted to make sure they all died. So, town wins. But at least we outlived them. :evil:
So yeah I think I helped make sure you guys got your correct lynches. :snobby:
dcmort93
06-29-2012, 23:39
Hey, dcmort, why don't you reveal the message I sent you about Paulie....
As you wish. It gave me quite a laugh.
~:pimp:
Greetings and salutations, townie dcmort.
~:pimp:
This is a friendly reveal and helpful bit of information from your very nice friends in the err... um... local legitimate association of honest businessmen. We think of ourselves as the Family.
~:pimp:
Business hasn't been going too well, upstanding and honest civilian citizen townie dcmort. You see, there's these wolves... and they're... trying to kill us all. And they're succeeding.
~:pimp:
This, as you might imagine, very bad for business. So bad in fact, that I'd be willing to go straight. As a matter of fact, were you aware that since this, shall we say, crisis began, the local association of legitimate and honest and very friendly businessmen has been working full-time to take care of this... shall we say... infestation of parasitic and murderous werecreatures.
~:pimp:
It would seem we are well-suited to this task. For we had, at one time, the ability to block, and track, and even capture these wolves. We could even outvote them with special powers. Unfortunately, try as we might, the local businessmen's association of honesty and community service and happy fun sprinkles on your ice cream cone has been running into... shall we say... staffing issues.
~:pimp:
By the way, would you like to share a slice of Pizza?
~:pimp:
Allow me to tell you that, in another time, and in another place, it would have been my very great pleasure to see you and all your little straight laced goody-goodies dead... your families dead... your houses burnt to the ground... and so on. But these are trying times. And you know what?
You're not such bad folks.
~:pimp:
You've even been willing to reach out to your friendly neighborhood organized crime family for assistance in matters which have proven to benefit us both. And I like that in a townie.
~:pimp:
That's why I am willing to help you achieve what you have always dreamed was possible, townie and beloved patriotic citizen dcmort, who smells like strawberries... and purity. Do you have a passing interest in science, Dcmort?
Have you ever heard of the "Paulie exclusion principle?"
The Paulie exclusion principle is the mafia mechanical principle that no two rival scum teams (Anti-town with play-for-keeps as a victory condition) may occupy the same town simultaneously.
It's named after my good friend and trusted business associate, Paulie.
~:pimp: <------SAY HELLO TO MY FRIEND PAULIE.
You see, when somebody messes with my friend Paulie, they tends to wind up... dead. In terms of remaining among the living, they... don't. They cease to exist. It can lead to a feeling of being... you know... excluded.
So, once upon a times, there was this team of wolves. And they messed with the wrong Pizzaguy. And so this Pizzaguy, he's kind of a prickly pear. He gets all worked up when he sees his friends made into stiffs by a bunch of low-down, dirty, disgusting, frickin' werewolves. So he calls up his good friend and loyal upstanding citizen who is also quite handsome, dcmort.
And he says to him, hey, let's kill all the :daisy: werewolves in this godforsaken town.
And then he says, hey, I know who all of you townie bums are. I could always just be a jerkass and reveal you all to the wolves. But that's not what I'm after. Even though I could ruin you all, that's not what I'm all about. You see, we've come to develop a preference, over these many moons, and that preference is for siding with our fellow human beings. Even if they are goody-goody townies.The truth of the matter is, me and Paulie, well, we can't do this without you law-abiding, taxpaying clockpunchers.
~:pimp:
Hey, I'd never want to work for some guy that I wasn't allowed to shoot. That's just who I ams. But hey, if you don't mind, it's no skin off my ball bag. To each, his own. As a matter of fact, I admire your restraint. God knows I don't have any. That's why when I see my friends being reduced to a pile of former business associates, I likes to take matters into my own hands.
~:pimp:
But there's this horrible new commandment from on high, probably from the Almighty Game Lord, which states quite profusely that we legitimate businessmen are not allowed to kill anyone. And this is very true. As such, as much as I would like to just walk over and shoot those bastard sons of ******s for killing my very close associates, I can't. It's just not in my nature anymore.
That's where you good townie bums come in.
~:pimp:
You see, I'm very much willing to sit in some jail cell for the crimes I've thought about doing, but under penalty of WOG I can't. I'm not allowed to do even though I'm a fricking Made Man. It's a crime against nature, it is.
~:pimp:
But I've been doing some digging, and some thinking, and some cooperating with.... ugh... law enforcement. Ugh! That kind of thing can get a wiseguy killed in most parts. So don't think I haven't risked my left testicle for this town. I've paid my dues.
~:pimp:
And I've come to the conclusion that I know where the bags of dirt are hiding.
~:pimp:
So, although I am not allowed to use my friend Tommy, I propose that you and I continue our pleasant business arrangement and, I'll take a shovel, and you'll take a shovel, and we go fill up some bags with some bodies, and maybe make sure they're never found ever again.
~:pimp:
I'll make sure Paulie watches out for us while we do this. He's good at making sure certain things don't bother anybody anymore. He's quite good at that. He is willing to watch over us under the following conditions.
~:pimp:
Condition number one: You never heard of me. I'm just some guy. My revealing my connections to the Family never happened. You don't tell nobody, especially the authorities, i.e. fellow townies.
Condition number two:Don't ask me questions about who my associates are. You got me for free. That's good enough.
Condition number three: You're going to win this game. Don't get all paranoid. Let me help you. Agree to these conditions and I'll point you right at those sons of werebitches, to a degree of extraordinary accuracy.
Condition number four: If you get smart and try to muscle me, I'll get very uncooperative. You see, the wolves are going to kill me. So threatening me with death or outing me to the group, is not a wise idea, even for a wiseguy like you. I do have sensitive informations as to your identity, your friends' identity, where you live, what kind of car you drive, which windows you leave unlocked at night, and how much you smell like a delicious roast beef sandwich, under the correct moonlight. Let's not get all crazy here, because I'm a crazy SOB and I've played this game before. I wouldn't reveal to you unless I had in my possession the correct leverage to make killing me for being nice a bad idea. Especially since you're going to win the game anyway and I'm just in this to frag some stinking wolves.
~:pimp:
But, I am asking that you trust me, and assist me in some Revengening. Because some of these wolf things, they've upset and disrespected my good friend and business associate, Paulie. And I just can't stand to see Paulie upset.
~:pimp:
You, sir, are my number one guy. You're my principal associate now, so to speak. And therefore, I would like you, my principal associate, and my good friend Paulie, to assist me in "excluding" some wolves.
~:pimp:
It's the Paulie exclusion principle.
~:pimp:
Capice?I couldn't get the colors and the bolding but it works never the less
Askthepizzaguy
06-30-2012, 00:52
As per usual, I did not reveal the entire truth.
When I sent that message, the mafia team still had four people alive, and it gave Dcmort the impression we were almost defeated and therefore no threat, which encouraged him to focus on the wolves and take my advice as to who to suspect. Which meant that over the course of the game, the mafia remained pretty much unlynched.
IMO that was worth the gamble. I was offering my head freely in exchange for some useful pointing and a mistruth or two. Which worked to the Mafia's advantage. The town benefitted as well, and since the town was missing us by a mile, the wolves were always the main threat.
That was enough for a win, except there were three wolves and we lost enough folks, and then dcmort and other townies that were part of the network never got killed, which meant that my remaining associates never really stood a chance. But, we did well enough to eliminate a murderous team of three before we got wiped out, got access to all town information for the most part, I even got the protective item and spared The King from death once, and healed Classical_hero. Basically the best you can do without winning. A second place finish well earned.
BTW the "spoiler" info I got was in the dead thread, I became aware that the wolves didn't have special roles. Nothing else. That was enough to compromise me, so I couldn't really play further. But, since it was involuntary spoiling, I used in-thread data to make my points.
As it happens, such a spoiler would have led me to suspect folks like God Emperor even more than I had, and that would have been wrong. So it wasn't exactly game-breaking. Just disappointing.
I think I brought it up once in the qt, but we had a few crises immediately after I was revealed to. What with Csargo being lynched, and the attempt at a cover-up. Why did I have to choose Choxorn as the visitor to ATPG? It would've been much easier to choose a lurker like CuteWolf. Eh, it was fun.
Interestingly, had you actually chosen CuteWolf, ATPG would have immediately known you were lying, as his mafia partner obviously wouldn't kill him.
Interestingly, had you actually chosen CuteWolf, ATPG would have immediately known you were lying, as his mafia partner obviously wouldn't kill him.
The funy thing is, that with lycanthropy mechanic, it was possible to happen :D
t never did, because Kagemusha was the one bited, but it could
Askthepizzaguy
06-30-2012, 06:57
Interestingly, had you actually chosen CuteWolf, ATPG would have immediately known you were lying, as his mafia partner obviously wouldn't kill him.
A word of advice to all mafia/wolves in the future games-
There are certain claims which are worse than claiming vanilla, and here are the reasons.
If you claim you can scan for guilty/innocent results:
The hypothetical mafia or actual rival mafia in the game should be making you one of their highest priority murder targets. If you don't get murdered by rival mafia (and why would you want to encourage that?) then people will eventually start to question why you're still alive. This isn't The Prometheus anymore (my first game as mafia) if you claim detective, you will generally have to accept that you will be lynched if you're not murdered almost immediately. The workaround is when there's a doctor in the game, then you could always claim to be protected by the doctor, but you also need to murder the doctor, and if there's a doctor, there's also usually a real detective who can bust you.
Your results have to be 100% accurate or else you will be lynched.
If you "scan" people as innocent you can't argue for their lynch anymore, and you'll eventually end up arguing for your own partner's lynch when you run out of people to accuse.
If you "scan" people as guilty they will know you're lying, or they are your mafia partner. And if they flip innocent, you're dead.
People will accept your claim as plausible, at first, but then since you're outed, you must claim to have results and those results will box you in and eventually defeat you. Claiming detective is only good for short-term gains, and sometimes it doesn't even work.
Half of all detective claims come from scumbags, remember that. You claim detective, you're admitting that you're likely mafia. How many mafia/scum in this game alone claimed to be able to scan? You know some of them are liars. It's generally going to be a fact at this point.
If you claim to be able to scan for other kinds of results:
Such as, was that person active or not, or if they wear shoes, or what gender they are, etc. These types of scan are not particularly essential to solving the game, and thus, offer less protection from being lynched under suspicion.
Claiming to be able to scan for non-guilty results is also a common host-provided cover role, or common claim as scum. Claiming it means you are going to be assumed to be a suspect, and that your claim is about 50% likely to be bogus.
If you claim to be able to do that scan, then you have to be a good guesser or actually have that power. If your "scan" results don't match reality, you'll get called on it immediately.
Why are you still alive at the endgame? This question will be asked. Especially if you're not under suspicion for a while. Real mafia don't like leaving people alive who are never going to be lynched. Maybe it's a WIFOM game, but it's still a legit question. Why are you a scanner nobody wants dead and yet the mafia haven't murdered you yet?
If you claim to be a roleblocker:
You absolutely have to have that power. If you are told to block someone, you'd better be able to do it. Otherwise you're the next lynch. Townies who can do ANY action can disprove your power, so they'll likely come forward and say "Oh yeah? Block me."
I've checked. In games where the mafia are on large teams and have multiple powers, some of them killing, some of them other kinds of powers, almost 100% of the time, one of the powers they have is being a roleblocker. If you claim roleblocker, you are likely mafia, point blank. Especially if you don't die. Claiming roleblocker is usually a death sentence. If you're told to block your own mafia partner, and someone tracks you somewhere else, or watches your partner and doesn't see you, or scans you or your partner, and you don't block your partner, then you and your partner are both dead. You can ruin your own team by claiming blocker. Especially if it is just you and him in the endgame. Roleblocker is one of the WORST claims a mafia can make. It can save you from a lynch, maybe. But it's very, very temporary. I highly advise you do not claim blocker.
There are rarely duplicate townie roleblockers. If another roleblocker exists and you claim, you're either a blocked townie roleblocker and therefore useless, or an outed scumbag. Bad move.
If you claim to be a doctor:
Might be even worse than claiming roleblocker. Doctor is even higher on the murder list than detectives are, because to kill the detective, the doctor has to be dead. If you claim doctor, and don't die, you're lynched. End of story. If you claim doctor, claim to protect someone, and they die, you're lynched. End of story. Claiming doctor should only be done to save your neck that one day. After that, you're dead. Might as well accept it.
Townies, recognize the boxes these claims put scumbags into. Use them.
I claimed a tracker role, my partner classical hero was a roleblocker. Memnon claimed Watcher. These are scum powers, and scum covers, half the time.
classical_hero
06-30-2012, 11:51
How many times did the wolves attack me? Four time? That was one reason why I was concerned about the lynch of choxorn, but even ATPG got done by Memnon's claim
Askthepizzaguy
06-30-2012, 12:52
How many times did the wolves attack me? Four time? That was one reason why I was concerned about the lynch of choxorn, but even ATPG got done by Memnon's claim
This is partly true.
Part of the game was to seek out wolves as our priority, however, my first goal was to ensure that fellow mobsters did not get lynched, so that the town would be in the minority by endgame and the wolves would be reduced. Either lynch was good, both lynches were superior.
THERE WAS NO OTHER WAY OF GETTING CHOXORN LYNCHED. Memnon's claim allowed me to argue for Choxorn's death. Then, Memnon's death. That's two phases of no mafia deaths and at least 1 wolf dead.
I wish I could have argued it the other way around, but there wasn't any way I could plausibly do that. Once Memnon flips wolf, Choxorn is a no-lynch and there's no way of murdering him.
Like I mentioned regarding the atheotes lynch and any other supposed miscues, I was entirely satisfied with every single one of the moves I made in this game, including the mislynches. The goal is to force as many of them as possible. If we got all the wolves gone, but there was still a large enough bloc of presumed townies in the network, there would be no way of lynching the core of the town. As it stands, when the wolves did kill, they removed some folks I needed dead and could only get dead that way.
I simply couldn't command the wolves to kill only non-mafia. I had to hope they hit the town core more often, and they didn't. This was a situation where you could make all the logically correct moves, but still get picked off regardless.
classical_hero
06-30-2012, 18:15
Yeah I see the plan now. The town only lynched one of us, which means we did rather well to stop them from getting to us, but the wolves targetted us far too often, which they had to do. It was a shame that Salmonsoil was killed first and not Cute Wolf, since he wasz by far our least useful member of the team and Salmon could actually allow us to get some kills.
@ATPG: Well, several of you claimed abilities you actually had, which isn't a bad strategy, but you need a way to explain why you're not dead, which is why claiming those abilities will only work in a very small number of situations. Even if you're a townie, you probably shouldn't claim them unless you're about to be lynched, as you're just going to go straight to the top of the mafia's kill list, which is generally something like Doctors -> Roleblockers -> Scanners -> Other People they have some reason to kill.
Interestingly, had you actually chosen CuteWolf, ATPG would have immediately known you were lying, as his mafia partner obviously wouldn't kill him.
Well I would've said kage, if we didn't have such a stake in him. Also there were almost zero vanilla roles, if not none, in this game, so I had to claim something. The watcher role was the one that I figured I could cause most harm to the town with. If I had not tried to attack the king, and instead went after dcmort that last full moon, things might have gone differently. Just a lot of glitches in memory... Oh well.
By the by, I'm curious, what could the werewolf hunter have done if he wasn't lynched the first day? What was his action?
7. Werewolf hunter. You have some silver bullets… You can attack other person at night (and, if successful, kill him/her). You will learn if that person was werewolf or not. If not, you commit suicide immediately. Alternatively, you can use your weapon in other way: every night you can decide that you will shoot to any person visiting you (and kill first person who does so). You will learn if that person was werewolf or not. If not, you commit suicide immediately.
Maybe someone would like to try my new small game?
I expect it to be pure madness, and either a bad game that wil be quickly forgotten, or really interesting one that will be quickly repeated
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?141847-Small-mafia-game-Guess-what-your-role-is-%28aka-role-insanity-%29
wideyedwanderer
07-01-2012, 08:37
That was a fun game. Thanks, Jarema. Hooray for townie victory!
That was a fun game. Thanks, Jarema. Hooray for townie victory!
And you were unlucky (you died as a randomly picked target of Kagemusha's night attack)
LazyMcCrow
07-02-2012, 10:36
thanks for the game jarema :2thumbsup:
Thank you all for signing for this!
And especially active people who made this game so funny
And special thanks for Edse and others who helped me with tallies. It made my life easier.
Kagemusha
07-02-2012, 18:50
Thanks for the game Jarema and guys! I guess it figures that i am late even saying thanks! :)
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