View Full Version : Name the faction
Ok, we're not doing any more previews before the beta is out, but we thought we would have a little fun in the meantime.
Here we have a new unit that has not been previewed. Try to guess what its ethnicity is. Do you think it is a regional unit or on a faction's unit list? If on a faction list, which faction do you think it belongs to? If it is a regional unit, what factions do you think will have access to it?
As a bit of background, our unit recruitment is based on many factors, but one of them is that we generally divide units into two categories: Faction units and regional units. Faction units are generally tied to specific factions (though can be shared) and will have recruitment areas that vary based on the government type, faction, and other things. Regional units generally aren't tied to specific factions, they're located in a specific area, show up as rebels, and the area in which they can be recruited never changes based on who is doing the recruiting or what government type they have. They're basically ethnic groups that aren't under the control of specific factions. Mini-factions, if you want to think of them that way.
So here is the new unit - who do you think it belongs to?
https://img411.imageshack.us/img411/5575/unit18ct.th.jpg (https://img411.imageshack.us/my.php?image=unit18ct.jpg)
Duncan_Hardy
10-10-2005, 17:40
Hmm, it looks ethnically "barbarian" (Celtic, Germanic, whatever) with the light skin and red/brown moustache... It's also well-armoured, and I don't think tribal cultures had access to such advanced weaponry (forgive me if I'm stereotyping), so, in a wild stab in the dark, I'm going to say it's a Gallic/Iberian mercenary supplied with Carthaganian weapons. (So it would be on Carthage's faction unit list, or available for recruitment in Iberia/Southern Gaul).
Ianofsmeg16
10-10-2005, 17:48
I'm gonna say a Germanic regional unit from the southern ares towards rome, maybe even a helvetii tribesman?
i'm just saying it looks very german am i right?
A celtic (shape of the shield and helmet, motif of the trousers) "noble" (because of the heavy equipment) unit.
Maybe galatian (the "mediteranean" countryside made me say that).
tehy're Galatians if i'm not mistaking...
Ypoknons
10-10-2005, 18:00
Definately a Gallic unit. Their shields are round. Galatians?
They use the Soldurii model with the helmet alpha-ed out, I believe. Just your fun fact of the day.
Big_John
10-10-2005, 18:39
as everyone else has said.. they definitely look celtic to me: celtic sword and the torc. heavy armor makes me think 'nobles', but not necessarily.. could just be a very heavy infantry i guess. since everyone else took galatians, i'm going to say they are arverni nobles. :book:
edit: oh and per khelvan's questions: i think it's a regional unit that romans, carthies, and aedui have access to. maybe sweboz to..
Spendios
10-10-2005, 18:41
They look celtic with the helmet, the oval shields. The fact that they are wearing a coat of mail means that they are a sort of "elite" unit.I guess they belong to a gallic tribe or maybe they are galatians.
so khevlvan...what is it?
I'm going with a Celtic noble unit of some kind.. The helmets, oval shields, swords and torques gave them away. I'm guessing a main list unit for the celts, some form of heavy infantry, and elite noble unit..
Steppe Merc
10-10-2005, 19:08
Hmm, it looks ethnically "barbarian" (Celtic, Germanic, whatever) with the light skin and red/brown moustache... It's also well-armoured, and I don't think tribal cultures had access to such advanced weaponry (forgive me if I'm stereotyping), so, in a wild stab in the dark, I'm going to say it's a Gallic/Iberian mercenary supplied with Carthaganian weapons. (So it would be on Carthage's faction unit list, or available for recruitment in Iberia/Southern Gaul).
Barbarian isn't an ethnicity. ~;)
In addition, Gauls weren't really tribal at this point. And non Greek and Latin peoples made some of the best weapons and armor, which was often copied by their neighbours. Celts had great armor and weapons, many of which was copied by Rome. Celts invented chain mail, and many other typical types of armor we think of as Roman. Steppe peoples had some pretty ornate stuff as well, as did other less "civilized" peoples.
I'm going with a Celtic noble unit of some kind.. The helmets, oval shields, swords and torques gave them away. I'm guessing a main list unit for the celts, some form of heavy infantry, and elite noble unit..
no doubt these guys pack a punch...if it's a homeland-gallic unit it's definatly elite.
if it's galatian it doesn't need to be noble, since Iron is less "epxpensive" there.
Aymar de Bois Mauri
10-10-2005, 20:01
It's also well-armoured, and I don't think tribal cultures had access to such advanced weaponry (forgive me if I'm stereotyping), so, in a wild stab in the dark, I'm going to say it's a Gallic/Iberian mercenary supplied with Carthaganian weapons. (So it would be on Carthage's faction unit list, or available for recruitment in Iberia/Southern Gaul).You are stereotyping and that's actually funny since Celts invented mail armour...
Ypoknons
10-10-2005, 20:17
Galatians, iirc, were heavily recruited by the sucessors and Pontus.
Galatians is a good guess. I'm going to say that they're a Galatian regional unit.
AggonyDuck
10-10-2005, 20:45
Guessing on the Galatians too...~:)
so nwo for Khelvan to show us the answer, a name and a description....i hope...
and then the next guessing game: wich faction am i previeuwing?
or even more popular: is this file the EB open beta version 0.4 or 0.5?
well were alread on 0.6.x...
RTR is at 6.1...
yes but were one 0.6
yes but were one 0.6
~D this could mean two things
either EB is slow
or RTR didn't even try on the first 5 goes...
~D this could mean two things
either EB is slow
or RTR didn't even try on the first 5 goes...
It's probably RTR~;)
Steppe Merc
10-10-2005, 21:13
As someone who has had more experience, I can safely say that we are slow. ~;)
As someone who has had more experience, I can safely say that we are slow. ~;)
EB slow? how ridiculous! ~D
EB is slow, yes, but our version numbers don't correspond. RTR made public what EB would only release internally.
Birka Viking
10-10-2005, 21:19
I think its a celtic noble unit..~:cheers: ~:cheers: ~:cheers:
Alot of people are close but not close enough....
One thing for sure this unit belongs to a "barbarian" faction...~;)
These games are much funnier when you aren't an EB member tough.
It's not fun if you can't guess.
are they soldurii elite's?
helvetti?
Belgae?
are they soldurii elite's?
helvetti?
Belgae?
no soldurii
no helveti
and no Belgae, sorry.
They are Galatian Ninja Elite units.
They aren't Galatian, but we will have a Galatian unit based on the same model.
SpawnOfEbil
10-10-2005, 22:09
They are obviously Bartixian!
KingOfTheIsles
10-10-2005, 22:09
Are they Celtic mercenaries?
Seleukus I Nicator
10-10-2005, 23:17
They are celtic for Sure!
Are they Germanic?
saulot333
10-10-2005, 23:45
A celtiberian unit for the Iberian faction. Am I right or what? ;)
alman7272
10-10-2005, 23:50
I'd say they're Caledonian. :book:~:confused:
I'd say they're Caledonian. :book:~:confused:
Then you'd be wrong. ~;p
If they're not Galatian, they're Gauls of some kind..
Like many of the others have said, definitely Celtic elite/noble unit with more of a continental feel, I think. I would hope that they would be part of the Aedui faction, (personal favorite), but, since the Celts were well known as mercenaries, I could see these guys hiring themselves out to the highest bidder.
All that aside, my gut feeling after seeing the unit was that it is an elite unit of the Nervii, but Gertgregoor said no Belgae...
So, just a guess... elite infantry of the Aquitani?
PSYCHO V
10-11-2005, 00:53
lol ~;)
Brennus' Celts that traveled to Thrace and Greece, the Galatians diverged from them.
This is definitely a Gallic unit. There is a sreenshot with the exact same (or at least it looks exactly the same) unit fighting Romans in the Gallic wars action shots in the Roman preview. I have looked at the screenshots so many times that I recognized it instantly. I can't post any attachments for what every reason but here is a link to the preview.
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=53849
We have a winner!
:balloon2: :balloon2: :balloon2: :balloon2: :balloon2: :balloon2: :balloon2:
Divinus Arma
10-11-2005, 04:21
deleted
the_handsome_viking
10-11-2005, 06:41
they are gauls because they can also be seen in the gaul vs romans gallic wars picture set at the end of the roman preview.
they are a very nice looking unit.
Aedui, right?Zero1 wins!
It is Gallic, an Aedui unit on their faction list; the Neitos, to be exact.
No fair looking at our action shots ;)
I'll point out at this point, it's not an elite unit. It's just a very late game Gallic unit, when mail was more heavily proliferated amongst the Gauls. It'll still be expensive compared to unarmoured Gallic swordsman, but won't be much better in combat, with the exception of their superior armour. However, bare in mind, the late Gallic armies were mainly spent fighting other Gauls, and such soldiers would either be engaged by Gauls, or allies of the Romans, also fighting Gauls. That sounds unnecessarily confusing, but I can't find a way to better word it.
Zero1 wins!
It is Gallic, an Aedui unit on their faction list; the Neitos, to be exact.
No fair looking at our action shots ;)
Galatians next time? ~D
I recognized the Gallic mow/mustache thingy and immediately thought Aedui ~:cool:
I'll point out at this point, it's not an elite unit. It's just a very late game Gallic unit, when mail was more heavily proliferated amongst the Gauls. It'll still be expensive compared to unarmoured Gallic swordsman, but won't be much better in combat, with the exception of their superior armour. However, bare in mind, the late Gallic armies were mainly spent fighting other Gauls, and such soldiers would either be engaged by Gauls, or allies of the Romans, also fighting Gauls. That sounds unnecessarily confusing, but I can't find a way to better word it.
So, basically what you mean is these particular soldiers where around during the civil war time in Gaul and spent more time fighting eachother then anyone else, right? :duel:
The answer was just Aedui? I was thinking were looking for a tribal specific answer... darn.
Ranika: If this unit is not much better at combat than a bare chested swordsman, is it possible that this unit will only be available after some type of reform? Say around 100 BC or sometime after that?
PSYCHO V
10-11-2005, 12:20
So, basically what you mean is these particular soldiers where around during the civil war time in Gaul and spent more time fighting eachother then anyone else, right? :duel:
~:) Well, the civil war / wars ebbed and wained for almost the entire period, but if you mean the last major one (1st C BC) then yes.
These guys (Neitos) started turning up very late in the period. Historically, the rivals states were too exhausted to field too many of these units but we've included them to add some versatility to the end game...kinda EB's what-if Gallic unit. So if the human / AI player happens to do better than what the Gauls did historically, they'll no doubt have some of these units included in their forces.
my2bob
The answer was just Aedui? I was thinking were looking for a tribal specific answer... darn.In some cases, this would be true, but this one happens to be an Aedui faction unit, rather than a non-affiliated tribe.
RandyKapp
10-11-2005, 15:32
Next one?
Ok, here is an easy one, so you're going to have to get specific.
https://img377.imageshack.us/img377/5457/unit22dn.th.jpg (https://img377.imageshack.us/my.php?image=unit22dn.jpg)
Ianofsmeg16
10-11-2005, 16:08
Some sort of Italian Swordsman? maybe a mercenary?
Reenk Roink
10-11-2005, 16:15
Oscan Swordsmen
(very nicely done too, with the shield design and triple disc armor)
Samnites, right? They are sweeeeet~D
Conqueror
10-11-2005, 17:17
The armor looks similar as a samnite in a certain Osprey plate. But what about those swords, they look like Iberian falcatas. Did the Samnites use falcatas? Could these be units that Karthadast can recruit in Italy?
May I just say that there were similar weapons in the mediterranean basin that may or may not have been developed in paralell. They were used as widely as the Iberian Peninsula, all the way into the Far East, brought by greek colonists, and as a curiosity, led to the appearence of these kinds of weapons in India and Nepal which we consider typical of them.
A Machaira
http://www.hollywoodcostumesandparty.com/trojans/500730.jpg
A Kopis
http://www.fabriziocaldarelli.net/kopis.jpg
The Iberian Falcata
http://www.historialago.com/leg_iberos_i_falcata_01.jpg
Ethruscans also used such a blade...
that must be samnites, made by Prometheus ~:)
Spendios
10-11-2005, 18:44
They seem to be some kind of italian infantry. I would say Bruttian maybe...
There's an armour greave on the left leg, so, logically, they're a phalanx unit of some kind. Samnite seems a good guess, though; I'll go with that.
Ethruscans also used such a blade...
Etruscans were based in Italy, that's still part of the Mediterranean Basin, maybe they're on to something...~;)
Edit: NeonGod... the romans also wore only one greave on the leading leg, and they were not, for the most part, a phalanx-type army by this point.
Big_John
10-11-2005, 18:50
damn! why am i always johnny-come-lately? well, since everyone already took the good and correct answers.. i'll say it's campanian heavy infantry, a regional unit in campania, available to rome, carthage and the hellenic factions.
Edit: NeonGod... the romans also wore only one greave on the leading leg, and they were not, for the most part, a phalanx-type army by this point.
But why? They didn't march the same way a phalanx would. Covering up one leg just makes it more obvious that you need to strike the other.
-Abbey.keeper-
10-11-2005, 19:53
Iberian Caetratii? by the red border design on their tunic
Spendios
10-11-2005, 20:08
Iberian Caetratii? by the red border design on their tunic
Remember that it is a non-previewed unit~;)
Steppe Merc
10-11-2005, 20:11
But why? They didn't march the same way a phalanx would. Covering up one leg just makes it more obvious that you need to strike the other.
Fashion? ~:confused:
~;)
Birka Viking
10-11-2005, 20:18
I think it's samnites~:cheers: ~:cheers: ~:cheers:
-Abbey.keeper-
10-11-2005, 20:21
Remember that it is a non-previewed unit~;)
lol i tried to nail the design on their shield but a search on google from "3 winged" to "tripennis" yield nothing except for imperial shuttles and the scientific name of some obscure creature ~;)
not exactly caetratii, but some unit of khadrastrim(sp?) or phoenician(sp?) origin would be my guess.
man this is fun~:)
Ypoknons
10-11-2005, 21:55
There's an armour greave on the left leg, so, logically, they're a phalanx unit of some kind. Samnite seems a good guess, though; I'll go with that.
Sammnites wouldn't use argive shields though. Etruscans swordmen is my guess, although it's probably a bit off. I believe the Romans had their version called the CLIPEUS too.
But why? They didn't march the same way a phalanx would. Covering up one leg just makes it more obvious that you need to strike the other.
When you use such a large shield, it becomes almost unnecessary to have bodyarmour, as the only part of you that's exposed is your head (covered by a helmet) and your leading leg (the one you use to establish your position firmly, for balance, and that was covered by the greave).
I must say that I'm not sure that's an argive shield. It is too much of a liability when fighting in a sword fight, especially when your opponent has a scutum or thureos which have a horizontal grip. The argive shield sacrifices personal combat ability, for added protection in a formation of similarly armed soldiers.
My first guess was Samnite, but since no one has confirmed that yet I will guess that it might be Umbrian. My only basis for calling it Umbrian is that in DBA Samnites and Umbrians get the same army.
Reverend Joe
10-12-2005, 02:51
Heavy Iberian infantry. I am guessing that those are falcatas, even though they could easily be from the Italian peninsula. Also, their armor and shields are modelled after Greek and Carthaginian armies. However, the design on their shields doesn't look to me like any kind of Italian infantry. Because they are quite possibly modelled after Carthaginian infantry, I am guessing heavy infantry from the Southern Iberian peninsula, near the area of Carthaginian influence.
However, I am farily baked at the moment, and so I would take my observations with a few grains of salt.
Edit: Also, the first soldiers looked like late Roman infantry, especially comnistantes... is there a connection there?
Another edit: that helmet proves me wrong. It is definitely Samnite, or some other southern Italian group. They are heavy auxiliary infantry, used to guard the flanks of advancing phalanxes, and to hit the flanks of enemy forces after the Phalanx has the enemy pinned.
Seleukus I Nicator
10-12-2005, 03:05
Looks like Samnites.
Their Breast Armor is making me think their samnites. Still that Falcata makes me wonder
https://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a393/MagnosAchos/Samnites.jpg
(NOTE THE GREEN SWASTIKA)
https://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a393/MagnosAchos/samnites2.jpg
These units look like Macedonian. and the cavalry seems like a Xystophoroi or the Sophos... whatever.
DarkLordHistoricus
10-12-2005, 03:42
How bout Sicel Mercenaries? That design on the shield looks somewhat similar to the three part symbol of sicily, also the mix of Italian, Greek and Carthaginian elements makes sense. After all draw a line from the centers of italy, greece, and carthage and you will pretty much get sicily culutrally
Ypoknons
10-12-2005, 04:15
Lucanians. Lucanian swordsman. If that pic that Seleukus posted are anything to go by, anyways.
Callum Murray
10-12-2005, 04:16
Even more late than Big John, I agree with his conclusions.
Campanian heavy infantry, I think I recognise the armour from an Osprey book, the two disks and a woman's horned head?
A Regional unit available to Romans, Carthage, and Hellenic factions?
Omegamann
10-12-2005, 08:30
Definatly a Samnite or Campanian warrior. My guess would be they are a faction unit of the Carthagian faction, representing the central italian allys during the punic wars.
Like I said, this unit was rather easy. It is our Samnite heavy infantry mercenary unit; right now we have no plans for them to be recruitable by any faction, though of course hireable by all as mercenaries, and they'll probably show up in some rebel armies.
So, a new unit. This one might be a bit easy as well:
https://img446.imageshack.us/img446/5787/19hm0dk.th.jpg (https://img446.imageshack.us/my.php?image=19hm0dk.jpg)
https://img446.imageshack.us/img446/7994/29ei7eb.th.jpg (https://img446.imageshack.us/my.php?image=29ei7eb.jpg)
Birka Viking
10-12-2005, 14:39
It must be some indian unit...
Omegamann
10-12-2005, 15:06
Mauryan Nobels?
Regulars would fight without armor I guess.
Nice bamboo bow by the way.
Artabrii
10-12-2005, 15:10
I think this unit is a indian warrior:cool:
Reverend Joe
10-12-2005, 15:14
That's Mr. T in a turban.
"I pity the foo who thinks he can unite a panhellenic empire that will stand the test of time! Drink your milk!"
Byzantine Mercenary
10-12-2005, 15:26
could it be a local militia unit for some of the regions near india?
Conqueror
10-12-2005, 16:17
Well, it looks to be an Indian archer unit. But is it available to any faction? I think it'll be in the local rebel armies, maybe recruitable by Baktria.
...Or is there a secret Mauryan faction that we haven't been told about? ~D
antiochus epiphanes
10-12-2005, 16:43
a maruyan mercinary
Taliferno
10-12-2005, 17:12
Indian/Mauryan Longbowmen or Patiyodha if you prefer.
Probably rebels and a unit available to factions that manage to take control of the indian provinces, and choses the right government.
Spendios
10-12-2005, 18:51
Very nice unit I especially like the bamboo longbow. I guess the unit must be a kind of Mauryan rebel unit maybe available to Bactria.
Big_John
10-12-2005, 20:03
sigh.. late again. anyway, i'll swim with the tide this time..
mauryan patiyodha, regional unit and found along the indus. recruitable by baktria and seleukia if they conquer those regions and choose the right government.
"I pity the foo who thinks he can unite a panhellenic empire that will stand the test of time! Drink your milk!"
Hahaha! Yes!
Seleukus I Nicator
10-12-2005, 22:29
Mauryan Infantry and Mauryan archers.
I know I was there ~D
BTW why does the guy have to swords in the top pic? (look carefully)
Either we can show the sword in the scabbard, or we can have the scabbard be empty. We cannot have it filled and empty based on what weapon he uses. So we chose in the scabbard.
Seleukus I Nicator
10-13-2005, 02:23
Alrit Kool!
Cant wait to see next unit! ~:eek:
nikolai1962
10-13-2005, 04:46
Your previews and mini-previews are a truly refined form of sadism imo :)
Mauryan Infantry and Mauryan archers.
I know I was there ~D
BTW why does the guy have to swords in the top pic? (look carefully)
It's the same unit. Notice both pictures feature a hip-quiver and a scabbard. Unfortunately, like Khelvan said, it is not possible to alter the unit skin depending on which weapon it is carrying. So either it always has a sword in the scabbard or it never has.
The last unit is beautifull, BTW.
Byzantine Mercenary
10-13-2005, 14:44
Its way better than the new models for BI with their weird blue bowmen
moddles for BI
You call that models??You must be joking...
Yes, these were Indian longbowmen, defending our easternmost provinces and available to at least Baktria in the Indian provinces should they take them.
Now, this one is a little bit more difficult:
https://img117.imageshack.us/img117/5647/cavalry0ea9do.th.jpg (https://img117.imageshack.us/my.php?image=cavalry0ea9do.jpg)
Reenk Roink
10-13-2005, 19:44
I'm thinking Thessilian Cavalry but that has been previewed so I don't know ~:confused: .
Reverend Joe
10-13-2005, 19:54
Successor state medium cavalry... I don't know which, because I have little experience with the successor states. However, that is definitely Greek-style armor, with a xyston spear.
Edit: which faction uses the feather and wings on the helmet? That should pin it down.
Birka Viking
10-13-2005, 20:00
hm this one was hard.....I also think it's some medium Greek cavalry.
the_handsome_viking
10-13-2005, 20:33
man look at the quality of these units and them compare them to the units in barbarian invasion...
Seleukus I Nicator
10-13-2005, 20:56
I have to say its Thracian Cavalry
Thracian Cavalry
https://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a393/MagnosAchos/ThracianCavalry.jpg
RandyKapp
10-13-2005, 21:04
Thracian companions!
(ya never know =P)
Well, its definately Greek or succesor state calvalry of some kind, the armor, xyston and falcata inspired sword are a dead give away...
I'm going to take a wild guess aand say Macedonian medium calvalry of some kind.
Mouzafphaerre
10-13-2005, 22:27
.
This one is definitely a cavalry unit! :yes:
.
Idomeneas
10-13-2005, 23:28
Italian cavalery of some sort? I think so cause of the tunic decorations.
The equipment looks heavily on the Greek side to me, but it could be Italian...where they using Xystons and the like in this period?
Big_John
10-14-2005, 00:15
i'm going to go off the deep end and say it's a roman cavalry unit, thracian auxilia. on the faction list for rome, recruitable in thrace if the romans conquer it. i should read a book or something.. :freak:
I'm with Mouzaphaerre on this one.
EDIT: And what a stupid way to make your 800th post.
Spendios
10-14-2005, 12:16
Like everybody I would say that it is a thracian cavalry but it could be an italian cavalry like campanian or lucanian
the_handsome_viking
10-14-2005, 13:02
macedonian heavy cavalry?
Byzantine Mercenary
10-14-2005, 14:12
i think that macedaon would be too obvius, what about one of the less known greek regions, Syricuse or south italy.
Yes, these were Indian longbowmen, defending our easternmost provinces and available to at least Baktria in the Indian provinces should they take them.
Uhm, ¿will be an indian faction? ~:cool:
The_Mark
10-14-2005, 16:59
:grin:
He's just playing with your mind :smile:
:tiny:
By the way, has no one noticed the saddle for this latest unit?
Big_John
10-14-2005, 19:29
hmm, i noticed the saddle, but i'm not knowledgable enough to understand the significance of it. :undecided:
i googled for winged helmets and found these:
http://www.legionsix.org/wingedffront.jpg
http://www.legionsix.org/wingedleft.jpg
http://www.legionsix.org/wingedright.jpg
http://www.legionsix.org/wingedback.jpg
they are phrygian helmets. phrygia was in the western part of modern-day turkey, right? so maybe they are a seleucid unit or something? i'm sure other people had winged helmets though...
:help:
edit: someone at twc beat me to the phrygian idea. by like a day. :cry:
Conqueror
10-14-2005, 20:12
Hmm now that Khelvan mentioned the saddle, I re-checked the picture and noticed that the saddle has those "horns" protruding from the sides. There's an Osprey plate showing a Roman Equites riding on a similar looking saddle. So this would be a Roman cavalry unit? Or did other Italian people use this kind of saddles?
eastern men often rode saddles
i'm going for pontic-medium cav...
Birka Viking
10-14-2005, 22:22
Lol... Saw that to..so i must agree..It could be some Roman unit~:cheers: ~:cheers: ~:cheers:
Steppe Merc
10-14-2005, 22:58
Celts and Iranians used the four pronged saddles first, I believe. Other nations copied them later.
Hrrrmn, Bactrian companions maybe?
Titus Pullo
10-15-2005, 04:21
Could it be some sort of Italian cavalry that the Romans hired as mercs or allies. I think the term would be Eqvites Extraordinarii? This is a total guess...
I am going to guess Pontus. Compare the helmet to that of this unit in the Pontus preview.
https://img197.imageshack.us/my.php?image=chalkaspidai9dt.jpg
I am going to guess Pontus. Compare the helmet to that of this unit in the Pontus preview.
https://img197.imageshack.us/my.php?image=chalkaspidai9dt.jpg
Except it's also the same helmet as in the Thessalian cavalry and I believe some Ptolemaic cav also.
Yeah, your right, it is the same helmet. The Thessalian cavaly was in the Makedonia preview, though. Perhaps it is som sort of Thessalian mercenary cavalry, or Thessalians available to Koinon Hellonon or another Hellenic faction.
Steppe Merc
10-16-2005, 15:04
Phyrgian caps were a common helm type. It is based off the cap that the Scythians wore, I believe. Then other people added first scale to it, then made it into a solid helm.
Ok, so those were the Equites Extraordinarii. They are a Roman unit, representing the best of the pre-Marian allied cavalry. They are recruitable by no one else, though the model is shared so some elements will be familiar to you.
This one should give you less trouble in general, though picking the ethnicity may give you fits:
https://img289.imageshack.us/img289/3030/19lt.jpg
Kurdish horsemen perhaps? They defiantely look Armenian, or Near Eastern-ish.
Steppe Merc
10-16-2005, 18:22
Hah, this should be good! ~D
RandyKapp
10-16-2005, 18:30
Jews?
Birka Viking
10-16-2005, 18:36
Hmm...Pahlavian horse archers???~:cheers: ~:cheers: ~:cheers:
Spendios
10-16-2005, 18:58
Near-estern horse archers for sure but what nationality ? To be original I will say Arachosian cavalry available for Bactria...
Artabrii
10-16-2005, 19:22
Sarmatian cavalry?~:confused:
Dux Corvanus
10-16-2005, 19:37
Based on my knowledge, now I'm sure this is DEFINITIVELY NOT American native unit. :wacko:
The guy with the twisted stick looks like Saladdin, but has not a sword like his in "Kingdom of Heaven" :uneasy:
Besides, I must say, they're rather big-sized guys, not so small as gnomes, which is great, because it shows there were human beings outside Europe. Unless the horses are also small, or are foxes instead of horses, but no, the tails are not fox tails. But they may be gnome-size after all, because they wear bullets as helmets. But no, because gnomes were extinct yet in that frame time, at least in Europe. But outside Europe? :inquisitive:
Well, at least it is clear that they are not American native gnomes. I'm going to see in Google when the gnomes got extinct. You know, after the meteorite that destroyed Babylon. Ah no, it was a comet, sorry. :inquisitive:
Ok, let me guess...
Sioux? :idea2:
Eastern horse archers, but no clue other than that.
Seleukus I Nicator
10-16-2005, 22:39
Horse Archers!
Pathians I would guess
Titus Pullo
10-17-2005, 01:21
I'm going to guess and say some sort of horse archer (obviously) from a Sarmatian subgroup.
Hrrrmn, the hair looks to dark to be Indo Iranian, so I'm going to rule out Parthian, Sarmatian and Skythian...
Ummm, some sort of Turkic horse archer recruitable at the farest eastern edge of the steppes?
Some kind of Sarmatian, or less likely, Scythian, horse archer (based on the saddle cloth).
Reverend Joe
10-17-2005, 16:19
Based on my knowledge, now I'm sure this is DEFINITIVELY NOT American native unit. :wacko:
The guy with the twisted stick looks like Saladdin, but has not a sword like his in "Kingdom of Heaven" :uneasy:
Besides, I must say, they're rather big-sized guys, not so small as gnomes, which is great, because it shows there were human beings outside Europe. Unless the horses are also small, or are foxes instead of horses, but no, the tails are not fox tails. But they may be gnome-size after all, because they wear bullets as helmets. But no, because gnomes were extinct yet in that frame time, at least in Europe. But outside Europe? :inquisitive:
Well, at least it is clear that they are not American native gnomes. I'm going to see in Google when the gnomes got extinct. You know, after the meteorite that destroyed Babylon. Ah no, it was a comet, sorry. :inquisitive:
Ok, let me guess...
Sioux? :idea2:
You idiot! How could you possibly come up with something that stupid?! I mean just look at them! They're so obviously Iroquois!
:jester:
I'm gonna go with Pahlava. They just look like those heavy horse archers that the Pahlava are supposed to have.
Dux Corvanus
10-17-2005, 19:57
You idiot! How could you possibly come up with something that stupid?! I mean just look at them! They're so obviously Iroquois!
Oh yes? And where is the typical-Iroquois bunch of bananas, mmmm? Have you seen Iroquois coinage? Iroquois always carried a bunch of bananas in our time frame. ~:rolleyes:
Ignorants... ~;p
Mr Jones
10-18-2005, 07:29
i think it MIGHT be a horse archer of some nationality. but then, i am an idiot.
The last image was of the rebel Yancai Nobles, defending their steppe lands and available to the Sarmatians should they be conquered.
I hope you are enjoying this little game.
Shall I continue? Here we are then, another easy one:
https://img281.imageshack.us/img281/161/cav9n9fb.th.jpg (https://img281.imageshack.us/my.php?image=cav9n9fb.jpg)
Ianofsmeg16
10-18-2005, 16:49
Greek (maybe Corinthian) cavalry
EDIT: For the Greeks.......actually looking at the colour, is it rebels?
Birka Viking
10-18-2005, 16:57
It´s some greek cavalry..
A comment or two on the Yancai Nobles:
Sauromatian was probably the closest to the ethnicity anyone got. Not really that bad, as the Yancai are often considered the ancestors of the Alans, who are regarded as being a Sarmatian group or closely related to them.
What no one seems to have suggested is that this was a "noble" unit, though someone spoke about "heavy" horse archers. If you look closely you see they are better protected (jacket studded with metal, metal helmet...) than your average horse archer.
Conqueror
10-18-2005, 18:14
Greeks with nifty hats ~:) Could be a mercenary unit. But what is that armor they're wearing?
Spendios
10-18-2005, 18:49
An Hellenic light cavalry maybe Thracian ?
They seem like Greek light cavalry, but the relief on the shield makes me curious, since I don't recognize it. I wonder if it's pertinent.
Mouzafphaerre
10-18-2005, 20:08
.
It's horse riding cavalry. ~:)
.
Steppe Merc
10-18-2005, 20:12
Hrrrmn, the hair looks to dark to be Indo Iranian, so I'm going to rule out Parthian, Sarmatian and Skythian...
Ummm, some sort of Turkic horse archer recruitable at the farest eastern edge of the steppes?
Well, some Iranians were pretty dark, there was a large range. Persians had dark hair, as did some Scythians and Sarmatians. Its really a mix of dark and light (sometimes really light) complexions.
RandyKapp
10-18-2005, 20:45
I guess some kind of Thrace/Dacian light cav.
Greek_fire19
10-18-2005, 20:59
Hmmmm, well they're definately greek cavalry. I guess it's possible that they're ptolemaic or from Pergamum, but my personal hunch is they're 'proper' greeks.
They're too light and amateurish-looking to be macedonian/thessalonican, so I'd say southern greek.
How about greek militia hippies recruitable in attica and the pelopponese
Ummm, some sort of Greek light calvalry would be my best guess
Then again!, I just noticed they're wearing that kind of scaled cuirass worn by Iberians, and if you look closely you can see that kind of broad bladed dagger the Iberians would use, and well...Iberians were influenced by Greeks...
Could if be Iberian?
Reverend Joe
10-18-2005, 23:54
You are thinking too hard. It is supposed to be easy: Greek light screening cavalry.
I say that it is Thracian, not the Gatae type Thracian but the more Greek-like Thracian. If it isn't Thracian than I guess that it is just plain old greek.
Julian the Apostrophe
10-19-2005, 02:44
Tarantine cavalry, perhaps? They were supposed to have made up a specialized part of Alexander's cavalry, and were presumably mercenaries from the Greek city of Tarantum in southern "Italy," though they may have just as easily been a style of cavalry associated with, but not orginating from, Tarantum. I have absolutely no idea if they were active in the relevant time period though.
Just for the sake of curiousity, does anyone onsite know more about Tarantine cavalry?
Lvcivs Asiarvm
10-19-2005, 03:12
I say it's some kind of Sythian ethicity horse archer based on both the terrain and the skin including the saddle
Seleukus I Nicator
10-19-2005, 03:31
ITs Greek Ippiko.
antiochus epiphanes
10-19-2005, 05:59
well i regonize the mount as a seleucid mount so..........
its thier compainions!?!?
Divinus Arma
10-19-2005, 06:09
I am surprised this one was shown so quickly. A great unit produced by a coalition of our finest. Nice armor.~:)
Teutobod II
10-19-2005, 12:19
Greeks with nifty hats ~:) Could be a mercenary unit. But what is that armor they're wearing?
in RTW cretan archers had those tropical hats
Ahhh cretan light rebel cavalry, ha ha
I am surprised this one was shown so quickly. A great unit produced by a coalition of our finest. Nice armor.~:)
pretty factory based..to quick for me to keep up..
design-make-show in 3 days or so~;)
Rodion Romanovich
10-19-2005, 12:37
Finally a unit that I came in time to guess before the answer was given!
I'd say a they're greek javelin cavalry.
Conqueror
10-19-2005, 13:40
I'd say a they're greek javelin cavalry.
I don't think it's javelin cavalry. They don't seem to carry any javelins on their shield hands, and carrying only 1 javelin would be silly. It's probably just normal spears they're holding in the screenshot.
Then again!, I just noticed they're wearing that kind of scaled cuirass worn by Iberians, and if you look closely you can see that kind of broad bladed dagger the Iberians would use, and well...Iberians were influenced by Greeks...
Could if be Iberian?
Or perhaps hellenic cavalry from the greek colonies by the eastern coast of Iberia, such as Saguntum.
Steppe Merc
10-19-2005, 19:28
I say it's some kind of Sythian ethicity horse archer based on both the terrain and the skin including the saddle
Any unit that has a bow holds it while idle...
Rodion Romanovich
10-19-2005, 20:08
@Conqueror: Oops, silly me, it's an overhand spear... Very short spear, so it's probably some lighter and not very professional cavalry as professionals probably would go into battle with something longer, but that might just be my prejudice...
Crownsteler
10-19-2005, 22:44
Well, this is what an idle overhand spear animation looks like:
https://img334.imageshack.us/my.php?image=overhand17jt.jpg
Notice any differences in pose (and lenght of spear?) I doubt such a short spear could be really usefull for anything else but trowing with them anyway.
Little Legioner
10-20-2005, 09:34
Prodromoi cavalry of Greeks...:charge:
Prodromoi are lightly armored lancers, not javelin cav. Try to guess the greek name for this unit and I'll reward you with another unit pic!
Prodromoi are lightly armored lancers, not javelin cav. Try to guess the greek name for this unit and I'll reward you with another unit pic!:whip:
Seleukus I Nicator
10-20-2005, 21:47
I should repeat its Ippiko.
Im confident but i might be wrong, nice graphics though
Prodromoi are lightly armored lancers, not javelin cav. Try to guess the greek name for this unit and I'll reward you with another unit pic!
that's mean! they'll never guess it..me thinks...
a small hint: what a skirmisher called in greek?
and what's a horse called in greek?
to all mods: if i'm spoiling it..delete it..
"Ippos" is horse, and I think that there are a few words for skirmisher.
I thought "ekvos" was horse.
You might be right, I'm not entirely sure.
No, hippos is horse. A horse javelineer is a hippakontistes, though the plural would be hippakontistai. Someone already put this up at twc.
I was close, I just missed the "H".
Well, actually, you were quite right. The "H" is just the breathing.
that's mean! they'll never guess it..me thinks...
a small hint: what a skirmisher called in greek?
and what's a horse called in greek?
to all mods: if i'm spoiling it..delete it..No hints!
:whip:
scipio_aemilianus
10-21-2005, 08:30
Actually prodromoi means scouts if I'm not wrong.
ScionTheWorm
10-21-2005, 09:56
Prodromoi Hippos? :grin3:
Edit:
I have to guess twice...
Thureporoi Hippos?
No hints!
:whip:
sorry..but at least now they're guessing names. instead of "it might be a skirmishing cavalry.." or "I think it's greek"
i'll keep my mouth shut next time...
QwertyMIDX
10-21-2005, 13:24
The accent should be acute not grave, there's no word following it to make the accent shift to a grave. ~;) (A little knowledge is a dangerous thing...yay Intro Greek!)
Spendios
10-21-2005, 17:07
Hippo-psiloi ???
I'm not sure where 'Ippiko' came from. To me, that barely seems like Greek. Where did you get that from? Is the end an omega with an iota subscript, in which case it is dative?
The term would be Hippeis Akontistes, compounded into one word: Hippakontistai.
Since one of you got it: Who are these guys. ~;)
https://img62.imageshack.us/img62/4184/equitesromanilate7xj.jpg
The accent should be acute not grave, there's no word following it to make the accent shift to a grave. ~;) (A little knowledge is a dangerous thing...yay Intro Greek!)
Furthermore, though the -es ending is correct when it is not a compound word, it morphs into a proper first declension feminine plural nominative -ai.
wow, thats one sweet cavalry unit..I haven't even seen it...
Roman auxillary calvalry?
wow, thats one sweet cavalry unit..I haven't even seen it...
you should check out the old screenshot thread then...
Birka Viking
10-21-2005, 20:34
It must be Roman auxillary calvalry~:cheers: ~:cheers: ~:cheers:
Spendios
10-21-2005, 21:12
I woulh have said they are equites but they don't look like the previewed equites. They must be some kink of roman auxiliary cavalry.
Conqueror
10-21-2005, 22:24
If those Hippakontistai are javelin cavalry, why do they carry only one javelin? That's odd, it's not like they couldn't bear the weight of a few extra ones on the shield hand. And their armor also seems rather good for a skirmishing cavalry to be wearing (scales of some metal?) Care to tell us more about this unit?
Seleukus I Nicator
10-21-2005, 23:15
This new screenshot is interesting. I would say Roman cavalry but their helmet is just doesnt seem Roman. I cant say what kind of cavalry it is.
I remember seeing that duck-helmet on a Bactrian unit once, could it be some sort of Bactrian calvalry if it isnt Roman?
Aymar de Bois Mauri
10-22-2005, 00:09
If those Hippakontistai are javelin cavalry, why do they carry only one javelin? That's odd, it's not like they couldn't bear the weight of a few extra ones on the shield hand. And their armor also seems rather good for a skirmishing cavalry to be wearing (scales of some metal?) Care to tell us more about this unit?1-When a skirmisher cav has spent all javelins and starts figthing in melee should they have javelins still on their shield? No...
2-The armour is not scale. And it does not look like scale. It's quilted leather armour.
This new screenshot is interesting. I would say Roman cavalry but their helmet is just doesnt seem Roman. I cant say what kind of cavalry it is.
That is a boeotian helmet. It was probably the most popular cavalry helmet in the Greek and the Roman world.
Steppe Merc
10-22-2005, 00:48
You can tell scale by the fact that it is almost always metal, save for a few ones that are of horn. Thus, they are shiny, as well as being sewn onto a leather backing.
Titus Pullo
10-22-2005, 00:54
I doubt it is this obvious, but could these guys just be regular ol' Roman Equites?
Reverend Joe
10-22-2005, 00:57
Thracian medium cavalry. I don't know any names, but they would be used for catching skirmishers/lighter cavalry, or as shock cavalry in a pinch. Something just tells me that's what it is.
I doubt it is this obvious, but could these guys just be regular ol' Roman Equites?
I don't think so. Equites were shown in the Roman preview a few weeks ago. Besides, that would be too easy.
Aymar de Bois Mauri
10-22-2005, 02:02
I don't think so. Equites were shown in the Roman preview a few weeks ago. Besides, that would be too easy.Equites Consulares and Equites Singulares are just the Pre-Marian and Post-Marian general's bodyguard units and I shall say no more...
ScionTheWorm
10-22-2005, 03:13
I'd say roman dogs of war
the_handsome_viking
10-22-2005, 04:53
it appears that they are resting their spear on their shoulder, which i remember was a resting animation for cavelry in one preview thread.
either that or they are overhead spear fighters, like some of the germanic tribes cavalry men were.
they look roman based on the chainmail.
Conqueror
10-22-2005, 09:47
1-When a skirmisher cav has spent all javelins and starts figthing in melee should they have javelins still on their shield? No...
2-The armour is not scale. And it does not look like scale. It's quilted leather armour.
GAH! It never occurred to me that they might have been fighting before the screenshot was taken. And I'm just crap at telling leather from metal I guess :surrender:
As for the latest unit picture: I remember an Osprey plate illustrating an equites wearing a helmet like that. That plus the maille armor has me thinking that this unit is Roman Equites.
The choices are:
Always have javelins carried behind the shield.
Never have javelins carried behind the shield.
We, at no time, can have javelins disappear when they are thrown.
I think the unit is pre-Marian Roman equites (not the General's bodyguards Aymar mentioned). Whether early or late, I don't know - I'd say early.
Idomeneas
10-22-2005, 10:38
Furthermore, though the -es ending is correct when it is not a compound word, it morphs into a proper first declension feminine plural nominative -ai.
Not that many will care but actually Ippikon is the way Hippikon is actually pronounced. The ''h'' is a muted letter wich later became a spirit used from hellenistic era until 1982 when it was eradicated with all spirits except one from our grammar due to ''enlighted'' reformations by a minister back then. We stopped using it but it remained in all foreigh transcriptions. Take for example Hellas. Its actually Ellas the ''h'' is not pronounced. Just like ''hotel'' in french~:)
Ippos means horse. Ippikon means cavalry. Ippeas is the rider, Ippeis the riders. Take for example the name Philip wich is actually the mutilated version of ΦΙΛΙΠΠΟΣ ΦΙΛΟΣ= friend ΙΠΠΟΣ= horse so its ''friend of horse''~:)
Spendios
10-22-2005, 11:27
Equites Consulares and Equites Singulares are just the Pre-Marian and Post-Marian general's bodyguard units and I shall say no more...
So they must be just "regular" equites.
Not that many will care but actually Ippikon is the way Hippikon is actually pronounced. The ''h'' is a muted letter wich later became a spirit used from hellenistic era until 1982 when it was eradicated with all spirits except one from our grammar due to ''enlighted'' reformations by a minister back then. We stopped using it but it remained in all foreigh transcriptions. Take for example Hellas. Its actually Ellas the ''h'' is not pronounced. Just like ''hotel'' in french~:)
Ippos means horse. Ippikon means cavalry. Ippeas is the rider, Ippeis the riders. Take for example the name Philip wich is actually the mutilated version of ΦΙΛΙΠΠΟΣ ΦΙΛΟΣ= friend ΙΠΠΟΣ= horse so its ''friend of horse''~:)
The H is a rough breathing, and it was pronounced, according to Liddel-Scott and most of the ancient Greek experts.
GiantMonkeyMan
10-23-2005, 15:38
i think they are roman generals bodyguards...
Idomeneas
10-23-2005, 16:13
The H is a rough breathing, and it was pronounced, according to Liddel-Scott and most of the ancient Greek experts.
i disagree but dont have the time to elaborate. So the word ΕΛΛΑΣ (ellas) was ΗΕΛΛΑΣ(iellas) ?
L'Impresario
10-23-2005, 17:32
Well he means that the spirit was carrying that sound, not exactly like modern greek "χ" but close to it, maybe more like a soft 'ha "ح" in arabic. So it was still "Ελλάς" with a daseia, but ofcourse that's during and after the Hellenistic period. Initially that sound was represented by using the "H" -ήττα, the phoenician "het"-, which became the basis of the two spirits that were later invented by the "wisemen of Alexandria"(try splitting "H" in two parts). Ofcourse, initially "H" didn't actually have the "e" sound that it acquired through time.
BTW in ancient greek it was "ιππεύς", with "ιππικόν" being the nominalised adjective in neuter that still is used to describe a collective of units with similar attributes esp. in military terms, in this case namely a unit of "ιππείς".
Teleklos Archelaou
10-23-2005, 23:03
i disagree but dont have the time to elaborate. So the word ΕΛΛΑΣ (ellas) was ΗΕΛΛΑΣ(iellas) ?
Yeah. Just as OROΣ (boundary stone) was actually written HOROΣ. For an easy to read example (from an Athenian public inscription from about 500/480 BC), check here:
http://icon.stoa.org/albums/hauck/horos.sized.jpg
It dropped out of written use around 400 BC, but a half H symbol continued to be used by western Greeks and Alexandrian grammarians adapted it into the "rough breathing" or "aspirate" symbol above vowels. It is even occasionally found in Attic inscriptions from the 1 c. AD and later. But greek words borrowed into Latin continually reproduced the H sound as another indication of its use (e.g., historia), and "forms in other languages point to its retention up to at least the beginning of the Christian era, e.g. in Coptic and Syriac and in astronomical terms such as hora in Sanskrit." The presence of initial aspiration (even without the letter H) as a continuing practice is also evident in the substitution of the aspirated phi, theta, and chi for unaspirated pi, tau, and kappa, before words beginning with the aspirate.
In any case, the aspirate is totally gone in Greek by the 4th century AD though, in all examples.
You guys are making me nervous. ~:eek:
THE GREEK LANGUAGE WAR IS ON AGAIN!:duel: :duel: :duel: :duel: :duel:
*takes cover*
Titus Pullo
10-24-2005, 04:16
I agree. So anyways, what unit is this last one?
Equites Consulares and Equites Singulares are just the Pre-Marian and Post-Marian general's bodyguard units and I shall say no more...
My new guess is Equites, but I really don't know.
QwertyMIDX
10-24-2005, 04:59
Yeah. Just as OROΣ (boundary stone) was actually written HOROΣ. For an easy to read example (from an Athenian public inscription from about 500/480 BC), check here:
http://icon.stoa.org/albums/hauck/horos.sized.jpg
Wow, that's really cool Dave, I will post it for ancient greek class to look it.
Mr Jones
10-24-2005, 08:49
they are the nabataean heavy archers.
they are the nabataean heavy archers.
They don't look Nabataean. They don't look like archers either.
Well if they arent Romans, are they some sort of Roman Itallian allies cavalry auxillary?, Like Umbrians or Etruscans or something of that nature?
saulot333
10-24-2005, 23:52
They DO look heavy, though. Heavy Casse Infantry, I'd say.
Steppe Merc
10-25-2005, 01:25
Infantry?
Yeah, is everyone looking at the right pic? ~:confused:
Kralizec
10-25-2005, 01:36
They appear, at least, to be cavalry that uses the overhand spear stab. Using an underhand long lance like the kontos or the sarrissa is preferable for cav, so I'd say they're of a faction not reknown for their cavalry. (did that make any sense?)
Also, they use chainmail, and I think that the plumes on the helmuts are Roman. I'd say it's either a Greek cavalry type belonging to Koinon Hellenon or regular (not generals) Roman equites, and I'm leaning towards the latter.
Reenk Roink
10-25-2005, 04:33
Without a doubt these are Kalaharian Janissaries.
Carthaginians? *I noticed the white tunics*
Mr Jones
10-25-2005, 08:14
They don't look Nabataean. They don't look like archers either.
sorry i was looking at a different picture. i meant sabaean nobles on arabian lion mounts. it looks like they are armed with the spear of achilles from spartan: total warrior as well.
Ok, my last unit was the Hippakontistai, Hellenistic javelin cavalry. What Matt posted was the late pre-Marian Roman Equites, horse notwithstanding. I assumed he would post the answer since he posted the unit. :bow:
This next one is brand new, so I hope you enjoy them as much as we are. Good luck with guessing who they are and who can recruit them, though:
https://img461.imageshack.us/img461/9436/14ni.jpg
Well, they wear the same style helmet as my avatar, which I thought was a fantasy design simply because it looked too hilarious to be true. As such, I have no idea what this unit is.
Conqueror
10-25-2005, 09:27
Brown-haired horse archers wearing Phrygian helmets and maille... hmm. They're some Iranian people, could be regional or a normal faction unit. I'd guess that this is a medium/heavy unit for the Sauromatae, capable to both horse archery and melee.
EDIT: I just noticed something in the picture. In the right lower corner you can see part of a rider who is cleary not equipped like these others. That is either a different unit standing next to this one, or it's some kind of officer. I'm thinking that it's a different unit though, I don't see why EB would use limited model slots for officers other than the generals.
EDIT2: Of corse, there's the chance that it's a captain. In which case it might give some hint to what factions this unit might be available to.
Birka Viking
10-25-2005, 11:16
I think it's Pahlavian heavy horse archers...*Very nice skins*~:cheers: ~:cheers: ~:cheers:
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