Graffiti Mafia [Concluded] [Archive] - Page 3

Kommodus

01-17-2007, 15:45

Ituralde and Sir Boo was attempted murdered the nights JimBob sent those messages.

Sir Boo was protected by the Masons two nights in a row but was killed the night he wasn’t protected. As you all noticed when Don C got killed there was only one kill that night too. I believe that was the night Kommodus should have acted against Sir Boo if he was a mafia.

Wrong, Sigurd. I got my message from "Little Timmy" between the second round's execution (when Reenk was lynched) and the third round of kills (when Warluster and Masy were killed). That's right, there were two kills that night.

That makes this the second time you've lied to try to get me lynched. :inquisitive: Why anyone would trust you at this point is beyond me.

At this point it appears that Sasaki included several non-mason pro-town roles. I think it's safe to assume he would've also included one or more pro-mafia roles as well, to keep things balanced. I'm also pretty sure that one of those roles belonged to Sigurd. Obviously the mafia didn't know about it, since they killed him.

This makes Sir Moody even more likely to be the second mafioso in my view, as if earlier considerations weren't enough. Is he possibly feeling a bit of pressure after receiving two votes last round? His list of suspects appears to highlight some of those I consider most likely to be innocent. :no:

Seamus Fermanagh

01-17-2007, 15:51

This makes Sir Moody even more likely to be the second mafioso in my view, as if earlier considerations weren't enough. Is he possibly feeling a bit of pressure after receiving two votes last round? His list of suspects appears to highlight some of those I consider most likely to be innocent. :no:

Okay, please recount/expand upon your case against Sir Moody and upon the differing evaluations you have of the suspects he names.

A Kommodus who will NOT expand upon his analysis is one I am leery of.

Kommodus

01-17-2007, 16:11

Okay, please recount/expand upon your case against Sir Moody and upon the differing evaluations you have of the suspects he names.

Ah, what the hey. I'm currently writing a document explaining my various methods, which I hope to post soon, so I might as well.

My current method is the same statistical analysis program that I used to nab you and Reenk in Mafia V. The program gathers and calculates various stats to measure people's posting patterns. There are a number of different metrics evaluating factors such as post length, posting frequency, delay between the start of a turn and first post, etc. As the method evolves I add more metrics.

Since the program makes it easy to calculate these stats for just about all the games that have been played on this forum, I can look at essentially the following two things:

How does a player's behavior compare to that of past mafiosi?
How does a player's behavior compare to his/her past behavior?
The evaluation of these questions, of course, is really more art than science. There are certain things to look for - for example, Sir Moody's posting frequency falls within the range mafiosi have usually been found. Also, his posts have been much longer in this game than in the past; this is often indicative of a person taking the game more seriously. Stuff like that tends to indicate a role - not necessarily mafia, but probably something.

When a player raises a red flag mathematically, I then use the program to extract all their posts and evaluate them subjectively, to see if any other red flags are raised. In this case, I noticed the argument between GH and Sir Moody in the first round; I also noticed that Sir Moody retracted his vote for GH rather quickly. It also became apparent that Sir Moody was a bit late on the final GH bandwagon. These considerations raise more red flags for me.

As for those on Sir Moody's list, well... I'm away from my home PC right now and can't look up their stats at the moment. However, IIRC most of them just don't look as suspect. I don't remember all the details right now; I'll have to check again when I get home.

Seamus Fermanagh

01-17-2007, 16:31

Fair enough.

Actually, your methodolgy and mine run fairly parallel -- though I put more of an emphasis on the interplay of previous votes.

The subjective points you spotlight are those all of us evaluate.

Your initial sifting program would appear to be a key difference -- adding a lot of discipline to your intial "read." This is, frankly, better than what I have been doing on that level. Kudos! At least I was thinking of the correct metrics -- just never put in the time you did to systematize.

I look forward to your precis regarding the other suspects.

Dutch_guy

01-17-2007, 16:58

Oh my god, you fools

You were played, all of you. How could I even defend myself - didn't you realise I'd be asleep the entire time?!

So in the end, the attention I deserved was for me to get lyched - without having the chance to defend myself.

You screwed up guys, good job mafia. Good job Seamus.

:balloon2:

Husar

01-17-2007, 17:18

At this point it appears that Sasaki included several non-mason pro-town roles. I think it's safe to assume he would've also included one or more pro-mafia roles as well, to keep things balanced. I'm also pretty sure that one of those roles belonged to Sigurd. Obviously the mafia didn't know about it, since they killed him.
Now you know why I changed my vote to abstain so often.
Sigurd's "proof" seemed somewhat created at times and he liked to mention that he wwas proven innocent(I think I pointed that out before but maybe that was only in the chat, can't find it anymore).
He was also quite sure of what he said all the time, had contact to the masons, a doctor etc and seemed to be pulling strings behind the secene, maybe all this was to help the mafia, I don't know. He also explained as a mafioso he would go after innocents "Sasaki style", going by his really condemning ways and aggressive behaviour, as well as the constant "I'm really sure, I pulled this and that string, here is the 100% proof evidence, now go and lynch!" there is a certain chance he may have a secret mafia support role but I wouldn't be too certain about it, may just be an eager ex-townie who is a bit(or a bit more) wrong at times.~;)
Oh, and I just got reminded that he gives disco a lot more credibility than he should.

Dutch_guy

01-17-2007, 18:43

[QUOTE=Ichigo]I'de rather not see Kommodus die so

Unvote:Prole though your still suspicious
Vote:Dutch_Guy

Well do for obvious reasons. Your not really adding anything to the discussion your about like Sigurd up there lieing about the phone numbers and trying to get Kommodus lynched.

I didn't vote for Kommodus, nor did I ever want him lynched - you're going to have to prove that utterly ridiculous statement. Voting for me is fine, hmmz, but adding such an idiotic reason is just sad :no:

By the way, why don't you want to see Kommodus die ? What has he done so far this game ? He hasn't pointed out someone, with his famed method, nor is a prime mafioso target dead yet. Either by lynch or by mobster death.

Kommodus - how you didnt lynch him is a mystery to me he is the prime choice for a mafia outfit as he never explains any of his "methods" and is generally considered pro-Town. His odd role also has me highly suspicious of him

Ichigo - im not sure here but hes a complete flip flop - one second hes a saint and helping the town the next second hes throwing wild accusations around and the sudden twist onto Dutch_Guy rather than komm has me wondering what is going on

Seamus Fermanagh/jimbob - they both joined Ichigo very quickly and saved komm with no real explanation they just jumped on board

Well, have to agree. Seamus simply hinting at me being bad started the wagon in the first place, not exactly the thought out moves one expects of Seamus - very, very strange. He didn't even state why ? Guys, think for your selves !

"Jumped on board" mine arse. I STARTED the movement for lynching Dutch. I pushed for it for several posts. I did so because he seemed suspicious. Another with his voting record had already been removed, yet he was allowed to continue in play....

He makes a great CHOICE for a mafioso, but that does not mean he must have been chosen. He is not "clear" of suspicion in my eyes, but neither was I willing to run him up a pole based on what I'd read to date. Let's see the case.

Good, suspicious.

Right, why was that again ? Because, as you very well know, people don't get WoG'ed because they don't vote (note how one get's added to the abstainees when one doesn't post a vote, one merely has to contribute) but because people stay out of the game - Completely ! Not quite my behaviour now was it ? (note: you're all perfectly able to answe that yourselves, even without Seamus' guiding hand)

So the only thing I did was lurk, as I do in all games, and that was enough. You're a pretty good choice for a mafioso yourself, you know. So is every member here, we'd all make good ones considering our experience playing the game. Heck, with your well thought out posts (normally) you'd be a grand choice.

Also, I'd rather be run up a pole than simply lynched without being able to defend myself. Not that hard to understand either.

Moreover, despite Sigurd's stridency, I am not yet convinced that Kommo should be our target. I would like to see the evidence against him put into a single post, neatly, so we can evaluate.

Now why would we want that, I mean, you didn't have to convince the town to lynch me - you merely had to ask. Why extend him that courtesy ?

Why don't you do so now. He hasn't been of any help to the town, plus, he as a person is suspicious enough as it is. More so than I am, I bet his voting patterns can affirm that !

Sorry for the last bit Kommodus, but his blatant protecting of your person is quite obvious...

:balloon2:

Sir Moody

01-17-2007, 20:20

I also noticed that Sir Moody retracted his vote for GH rather quickly. It also became apparent that Sir Moody was a bit late on the final GH bandwagon

i retracted my vote when prole went from kill csar mode to kill sir moody mode at the drop of a hat

and since General was one of the players i posted in my list of suspects ealier i dont see how me voting for him during the bandwagon was such a suprise - i work a 9 to 5 job and when i get home i play games for a few hours before i read the forums - that is why i was late to vote you will find i dont often make votes between 5 and 7 normally

Csargo

01-17-2007, 20:55

I didn't vote for Kommodus, nor did I ever want him lynched - you're going to have to prove that utterly ridiculous statement. Voting for me is fine, hmmz, but adding such an idiotic reason is just sad :no:

By the way, why don't you want to see Kommodus die ? What has he done so far this game ? He hasn't pointed out someone, with his famed method, nor is a prime mafioso target dead yet. Either by lynch or by mobster death.

I wasn't talking about you I was saying your not really adding anything to game. The bottom part was about Sigurd not you. I said you were acting like Sigurd not really doing anything. Sigurd is just throwing around lies and accusations while you and just saying random crap up until now.

Atleast Kommodus is doing something other than picking out quotes and saying crap.

Dutch_guy

01-17-2007, 21:26

Well do for obvious reasons. Your not really adding anything to the discussion your about like Sigurd up there lieing about the phone numbers and trying to get Kommodus lynched.

So, that's the bottom part that wasn't about me* ? You see how that can be quite vague, especially as a ground for lynching someone who - as you so eloquently put it - has said nothing but crap this entire game ? I mean, sorry for coming over harsh after just being lynched without a case against me previously, but I hope you understand why I might be confused by your post.

Plus, what has Kommodus been doing this game which is ground for you to not lynch him, but lynch someone who's been ''picking out quotes and saying crap'' - seeing as the town has been dealt a pretty heavy blow, it might be worth mentioning.

Oh well, all in all we've now - again - lost one townie. A lynching which took about an hour (less) to garner it's votes - all three of them...

* I have no idea what other bottom part I'd have to look for, seeing as those three lines were the lowest of that post.

:balloon2:

Csargo

01-17-2007, 21:32

So can you tell me why you haven't voted except for abstaining?

Seamus Fermanagh

01-17-2007, 21:50

Probably can't Ichi. If he was a role player, he can't reveal when dead.

He's right about one thing, however, I will need to hear more from Kommo to feel confident. His post earlier was more along the lines of what we need to hear, but I'd like a bit more.

Siggy's had his inconsistencies pointed out by GH and Kommo, so no need to rehash my disquietude over his role in this.

Dutch_guy

01-17-2007, 21:55

So can you tell me why you haven't voted except for abstaining?

Sure.

I tend to not vote unless I have a pretty clear idea on one's status in the game, I don't like pointing the finger unless I'm sure (or am convinced, as being sure in such a game is a rarity) of one's innocence or guilt. That said, it also helps deter the voting patterns - things that are often a handy tool in framing, lynching someone and almost always comes back to get you. This obviously works both ways, as it is just as suspicious as it is when used with a just cause. Abstaining, for me, at least, is simply the same as not voting (which is it's main purpose, of course). So, when I don't wish to vote, I abstain (obviously). However, I'm not always able to do so, time(zone!), school and the such are the main reason for not being able to always actually reply on time.

That said, one may be hard pressed to actually find me voting - in recent games at least - but then again, I do tend to contribute. Which is the reason I don't get WoG'ed at times where others are WoG'ed. Also, I understand one can get slightly irritated at such behavior, however, it is a style all on it's own you know.

PS: I was typing this when Seamus posted.

:balloon2:

Csargo

01-17-2007, 22:08

I'm thinking Prole is mafia.

Husar

01-17-2007, 23:57

I'm thinking Prole is mafia.
Good for you.

Csargo

01-17-2007, 23:59

Good for you.

I don't need any sass from you missy.:whip:

Kommodus

01-18-2007, 00:47

Ok Seamus, I promised an evaluation of the suspects on Sir Moody's list, so here it is.

1. Ichigo

I'm surprised to see this name so high on the list (or at least I would be if I didn't think Sir Moody was mafia). We all know Ichigo/Csar posts like crazy, but he actually follows a pretty consistent pattern most of the time. The one time he differed significantly from this pattern was in GFII, when he was the Godfather. And how did he differ? His posting frequency went way down. In practical terms, this means he's the kind of player to lay a bit lower when he's guilty. In this game, his posting frequency has usually been much closer to his "innocent" baseline, except for lately when it's actually gone up significantly.

Add to this JimBob's testimony, and it looks like Moody is going after the wrong guy.

2. Seamus Fermanagh/JimBob

Ichigo and I both know that JimBob is telling the truth, since we both got messages indicating what he said. He couldn't possibly have known the contents of our PMs unless he arranged to have them sent. Thus no numerical analysis is necessary. Sir Moody attacks him with a factually incorrect statement, saying that he jumped in to save me with no real explanation. Nothing could be further from the truth.

I have less to say about Seamus Fermanagh. What called my attention to him in Mafia V was a dip in his average post length. This made me consider the possibility that he wasn't working as hard to find the mafia, and made me wonder why. This time he's staying closer to his baseline. He could've simply learned his lesson, but it's hard to say at this point.

3. AggonyDuck

The only game he's differed significantly from his norm was Black Hand 2, when he was guilty and posted a lot more. Therefore Sir Moody's attacks on him for "laying low" ring hollow with me.

4. Proletariat

I can't really evaluate this one effectively with so little data to work with.

5. Husar

Well, he's one of those who tends to hang around in the statistical range in which I usually find mafia, but that by itself doesn't mean much since quite a few people do. As Sir Moody said, the mafia were trying to get us to lynch him earlier, so he's probably innocent.

Anyway, my point was that Sir Moody's list of suspects contained a number of people I consider most likely innocent. As it is, his accusations remind me of Gertgregoor in Mafia III, who started throwing accusations around wildly when he started feeling the pressure.

Sigurd

01-18-2007, 00:56

Siggy's had his inconsistencies pointed out by GH and Kommo, so no need to rehash my disquietude over his role in this.

Actually which inconsistencies are we talking about?
If you are referring to my claim of the numbers naming Kommodus, it has already been explained.

As to the timing of someone attacking Sir Boo I mistakenly interpreted what this player that I mentioned said. The masons claimes to have protected Ituralde. They claimed also to have protected Sir Boo, several times.

We really don’t know the mechanics of this Little Timmy business. He claims that he PM’ed those names in the first round to Ichigo and in the second round to Kommodus.
Now if the mechanics are what Kommodus claims them to be, then he is in the clear. That is: they will not take effect until the round following the note. This is plausible as he didn’t get the note until the intermediate between the lynching in round two and the kills in round three. This is confirmed by Ichigo who got his 3 minutes prior to the kills in round two.
Let’s hear from JimBob… He would know how the mechanics works.

I interpreted them as in force the actual round they were posted
Round 1: Kagemusha and CF.. no one saved -> Csar in the clear
Round 2: only me .. someone saved -> Kommodus not in the clear

if the mechanics is set to next round:
Round 2: only me ... someone saved -> Csar not in the clear
Round 3: Masy and Warluster .. no-one saved -> Kommodus in the clear.

And Little Timmy should have put a few more notes under someone’s door as we are in round 6 (?).

[edit]: out of curiosity Kommodus, how did I fare in your method?

JimBob

01-18-2007, 02:43

And Little Timmy should have put a few more notes under someone’s door as we are in round 6 (?).
I was ambushed by RL. It is why I was away from my computer for a few days.

As to the Little Timmy role. I sent them in after the first set of kills, then after the second set. Effecting rounds two and three respectively. I have sent the ones for this round. I am counting on who ever got them to keep quiet about it. My vote for Dutch came down to trusting the logic put forward by Seamus because I was frankly not caught up all the way. No I think I have a better grip of what is going on and will act accordingly.

Sigurd, you are also a liar. You say both of my innocents were targeted and saved on the nights I sent them. Yet two people died on one of those nights. I smell mafia tool.

Csargo

01-18-2007, 02:48

I think that pretty much damns me then. Since there was only one kill in the second round.

discovery1

01-18-2007, 04:48

So Sasaki, what do you say to posting an hour early?

Sasaki Kojiro

01-18-2007, 05:50

Proletariat, Ultrawar, and Peasant Phill had elected to stay away from the town meetings and wander around the deserted town instead. They came upon an open door and entered, only to be blown away by a blast of fire from a tommy gun wielded by a drunken evil sadist.

Only one of us Remains we cannot protect you for much longer - call these phone numbers to help us before it is too late!

0800 9685962433262766 - 0800 545556666387

Killed (7):

Caius Flaminius
Kagemusha
Sigurd Fafnesbane
Warluster
Masy
Don Corleone
Sir Boo

Lynched(3):
Reenk Roink
GeneralHankerchief
Dutch_guy

WoG(4):
Divine Wind
Proletariat
Ultrawar
Peasant Phill

Alive: (13):

discovery1
Jimbob
Seamus Fermanagh
Xiahou
AggonyDuck
Sir Moody
Ituralde
Husar
doc_bean
Kommodus
Al Khalifah
Ignoramus
Ichigo

Begin Voting

discovery1

01-18-2007, 06:10

Vote: Kommodus

JimBob

01-18-2007, 06:56

I sent discovery1 and Seamus to Aggony Duck.

Sigurd

01-18-2007, 09:29

Vote: Kommodus
I guess your henchmen struck Gold in the last voting.
But then again.. No kills this round?
Are your henchmen getting sloppy, not dedicated enough?
Resting on their laurels are they?
You should tighten their leash Godfather, you can’t win this game with such a sloppy crew.

:laugh4: :laugh4: :laugh4:

Husar

01-18-2007, 09:35

So JimBob was killed?
No kill description?
Were you lazy disco?
Why didn't prole receive the WoG?

Sigurd

01-18-2007, 09:39

So JimBob was killed?

He is not in the killed list

No kill description?
Were you lazy disco?

He showed us the kill description in the chat yesterday.. I guess his victims were protected.

Why didn't prole receive the WoG?
Who knows... Sasaki has WoG'ed before has he not?

Sasaki Kojiro

01-18-2007, 09:48

My bad, I forgot the WoG.

Added.

Husar

01-18-2007, 12:39

He is not in the killed list
Sasaki edited but since it was early in the morning and I was in a hurry, I might have misread Sir Boo as JimBob.

He showed us the kill description in the chat yesterday.. I guess his victims were protected.
He showed us a generic one, despite the fact that we shouldn't believe him anything anyway.
And why do you say "victims", which is plural, since you yourself are so sure that GH was a mafioso?

Who knows... Sasaki has WoG'ed before has he not?
He has and he has now, thanks Sasaki.:2thumbsup:

The new mason message, given that it is from a mason, is also pretty interesting, especially considering the last one before that.

doc_bean

01-18-2007, 12:39

vote: Kommodus !

This game is getting too confusing for me, I'll just keep accusing Kommodus so he defends himself and perhaps can draw some mafiosi out (or is part of the mafia and gets lynched, win-win here !).

Sigurd

01-18-2007, 12:43

And why do you say "victims", which is plural, since you yourself are so sure that GH was a mafioso?

A slip-up... Sorry.

discovery1

01-18-2007, 15:21

Meh, WOG. Might be handing victory to the cultists.....

Kommodus

01-18-2007, 15:23

Oh, for the love. :laugh4:

Disco, I really appreciate all the respect you and your thugs are giving me in this game. :dizzy2:

The coded messages are clear:

9685962433262766 = YOULYNCHEDAMASON
545556666387 = KILLKOMMODUS

But just like Sigurd can't get his stories straight, you can't even get your graffiti to be consistent. I seem to remember a turn ago, a coded message from the masons (?) was:

878163875338 = JUST1OFUSLEFT

Now you tell us that we've just lynched one of you (by this you must mean Dutch_guy), and that there is now, er, one of you left. :inquisitive:

I've studied algebra, geometry, trigonometry, discrete and abstract math, probability, and quite a few levels of calculus, but never come across a mathematical discipline in which 1 - 1 = 1.

Nice try, really, but are you perhaps becoming a bit desperate?

Also, Sigurd, I still don't trust you. More inconsistencies keep creeping into your stories.

Sir Boo was protected by the Masons two nights in a row but was killed the night he wasn’t protected. As you all noticed when Don C got killed there was only one kill that night too. I believe that was the night Kommodus should have acted against Sir Boo if he was a mafia.

I interpreted them as in force the actual round they were posted
Round 1: Kagemusha and CF.. no one saved -> Csar in the clear
Round 2: only me .. someone saved -> Kommodus not in the clear

if the mechanics is set to next round:
Round 2: only me ... someone saved -> Csar not in the clear
Round 3: Masy and Warluster .. no-one saved -> Kommodus in the clear.

Uh... which night did you think I was supposed to have attacked Sir Boo? The night Don C was killed, or the night you were killed? Anyway, it doesn't matter anymore because as JimBob said, your latter scenario is in fact the correct one.

Anyway, hopefully I don't have to recount my reasons to:

Vote: Sir Moody

Sir Moody

01-18-2007, 15:57

you may want to eat humble pie in a few hours Komm - im at work and busy coding right now but im going to make a pretty big announcment at 5ish when i get home

Kommodus

01-18-2007, 16:12

you may want to eat humble pie in a few hours Komm - im at work and busy coding right now but im going to make a pretty big announcment at 5ish when i get home

No problem dude, take your time. It probably takes a while to come up with a convincing mason-assignment PM in Sasaki's style. :laugh4:

Seamus Fermanagh

01-18-2007, 16:32

....Well, if Kommo is fooling me, he's reeling me in nicely. So far his arguments have an elegance that I don't see from the arguments against him.

I will not vote yet -- Moody deserves to speak first.

With the non voters largely gone, things should be fast and furious from here.

Sigurd

01-18-2007, 18:21

Uh... which night did you think I was supposed to have attacked Sir Boo? The night Don C was killed, or the night you were killed? Anyway, it doesn't matter anymore because as JimBob said, your latter scenario is in fact the correct one.

I guess inconsistensies are creeping into your statements as well.
I can’t find where JimBob alledgely said such a thing.

I found however these statements:

Obviously I will need your pm before everyone else's, so I would ask that you send me yours at the beginning of every day just after the kills have been announced. Please respond to this asap.
and

The second two names were Ituralde and Sir Boo. In the first and second rounds respectively. Kommodus received Sir Boo, Csar, Ituralde.

It is obvious from those statements that my initial suggestion is correct and hence you tried to kill Sir Boo the round I died; in round two.

Yes I messed up my first attack on you, but that was rather because I didn’t have the data in front of me and used the memory on top of my head. Obviously that memory was scrambled.
I don’t know why you got those notes late… If we should trust JimBob’s actual statements and not some imaginary ones, the names Csar got was applied to round one where Kage and CF were killed and the names you got applied to the round I was killed… I guess the masons could verify who they protected that night because someone clearly was protected. There should be one or two left in this game.

Kommodus

01-18-2007, 18:33

I guess inconsistensies are creeping into your statements as well.
I can’t find where JimBob alledgely said such a thing.

It is obvious from those statements that my initial suggestion is correct and hence you tried to kill Sir Boo the round I died; in round two.

Well then, either you're not reading the thread carefully or you're deliberately ignoring things in an attempt to obfuscate.

As to the Little Timmy role. I sent them in after the first set of kills, then after the second set. Effecting rounds two and three respectively. I have sent the ones for this round. I am counting on who ever got them to keep quiet about it. My vote for Dutch came down to trusting the logic put forward by Seamus because I was frankly not caught up all the way. No I think I have a better grip of what is going on and will act accordingly.

Sigurd, you are also a liar. You say both of my innocents were targeted and saved on the nights I sent them. Yet two people died on one of those nights. I smell mafia tool.

For the love, Sigurd, pay attention! Mistakes, omissions, and deliberate lies - we've seen 'em all before. Most notably from mafiosi in past games such as GeneralHankerchief in GFII and Reenk Roink in Mafia V. They all claimed to have good reasons for it. The reality: it's just harder to keep everything consistent when you're lying than when you're telling the truth. :no:

Sir Moody

01-18-2007, 19:11

Hello Dutch_guy, Warluster, and Sir Moody,

You are all three Masons. As members of this order it is your duty to protect the town and help eliminate the mafia. You are more powerful than ordinary townies however.

First of all, you are all three doctors. You must each send me each night the name of the person you wish to protect, if anyone tries to kill them the will be saved. You may not protect each other or yourself for obvious game breaking reasons.

Second, the mafia will be painting graffiti messages on the wall of the town court house each night. You may do the same. These messages will be displayed after the kills, in a random order, with no indication of who is sending which message. The mafia will be trying to confuse the town, you can use these to help the town. You don't have any investigative roles, but you could for example pretend you have someone as a confirmed innocent and then protect them that night when the mafia tries to kill them. If the town believes you and the person you select isn't mafia of course...

Good luck

Sasaki

so there it is - I am the last mason. Warluster was killed by the mafia, you lynched dutch last round and that leaves me with little power and with kommodus and his gang after me

i cant comment on my fellow members too much but im sure they will pitch in and help but im going to give you a brief sumery of our actions - i dont have pms for all of them as my pm box is way too small for the amount of discussion myself and Dutch_guy had but i still have enough for kommodus's last few points

The first night we were of course limmited by a complete lack of clues - we basically had to just pick at random who to protect and so we decided we would save those of most use to the town

I protected General Hankerchief (ironic), Dutch_Guy and Warluster protected Kommodus and Seamus - we were close the Mafia targeted Sigurd and a New player

We discussed graffiti heavily but didnt manage to send in anything in time hence no grafiti

We were ready for the next round tho - We used a innocent to bait the Mafia into attacking - Sir Boo, my brother (didnt know that did you komm :beam:). Knowing it was risky we approached him and he agreed to help so we set the plan in motion. Dutch_guy wrote the graffiti using a telephone code he thought would be broken quickly - more fool us i guess.

I took a leap of faith and had a go at following the mafias pattern - Dutch_Guy defended my brother while i defended someone newish(Itrulde) and Warluster protected a veteran(not sure who).

As we now know thanks to timmy this paid off someone tried to kill Itrulde and i blocked it - result only 1 death (kage)

So we came to round 3 - no-one was listening to our graffiti and were proclaiming the peotic trash the mafia were using as the masons - i decided we needed to send a better message and so the graffiti signed by the hammer was my idea (hammer = masons)

For protection Dutch_guy took my brother again I protected someone new - i dont have the pm and i cant remmber who maybe dutch_guy can help here and Warluster protected Ignoramous - we failed and Masy and Warluster went down - we were one man down and no closer to the mafia - 2 kills told us that Reenk wasnt mafia and was innocent but out telephone code was paying off as the first few people started to break it - it was this round that sigurd contacted my brother and told him the code said he was innocent - we brought sigurd into the fold slowly using my brother as a intermidiate to begin with

Kommodus took his first swipe at me and no-one listened to him (thankfully)

once again Dutch_guy protected my brother while i protected ultrawar - one of us must have blocked it as we were down to one kill again, from little timmy i think we can surmise it was my brother who was attacked

Suspicion mounted on GH who was one of the main 3 in my Suspect list so we pulled some strings and helped get him lynched - considering the evidence against him we didnt really have to try

we sent no graffiti because no-one wa slistening to us anyway

we were sure we had a mafia member lynched and didnt think they would target my brother again - we got cocky - and so i protected Itrulde again and Dutch_guy protected Ignoramus

the message was once again Dutch_guys pervue and it wasnt ment to be what he actually wrote ( i have this pm)

My PM to Sasaki

Quote:
I will protect Ignoramus

Moody is protecting Ituralde

On the wall will be painted

''A job well done fellow villagers, but we're not there yet. Keep the discussions going, and feel free to call the following numbers: 0800 - 5878163875338 and 0800 - 46635825''

The numbers state, just one left, and good look.

:balloon2:

well we messed up not only does the message not say what he wanted too but we let my brother die(he wasnt very happy)

i took a break from the game for the next voting phase - i had lots of work and wasnt in the mood to play, well i should have at least looked at the thread as by the next morning(real life morning) the Dutch_guy bandwagon had lifted off and had gathered enough votes - we were now down to one mason and with kommodus and his goons litterally on my heels

With Dutch_guy down i took the graffiti into my own hands

Grafiti = Only one of us Remains we cannot protect you for much longer - call these phone numbers to help us before it is too late!

0800 9685962433262766 - 0800 545556666387

i will protect Jimbob tonight

kommodus has posted there meanings exactly so i wont again - well looks like i got my protection right i figured little timmy would be a good target and now there are no kills so i hit the mark once again

Sigurd has been helping since the 3rd round and we let him in on who we were - while he may be fudging the codes somewhat he is telling the truth and has been helping us

so why am i sure its komm? im not - i dont have a magical mafia detector like him and frankly ive never liked pure math methods as they ignore the human element too much - his behavior this game has been frankly dodgy at best and that has twiged me onto him - i way be wrong but i dont think so

seamus seems to be playing good cop bad cop with Komm and hence has drawn my attention too but sigurd suspects him more than me so ill let him explain why

i expect im going to have komm debunking this as soon as its posted so hopefully dutch_guy, warluster and seamus can lend me their versions and we can see im telling the truth - good luck all as im a dead duck now

edit for my awful spelling

Dutch_guy

01-18-2007, 19:49

Aye, that's how it is people.

Just for reference, two PM's I sent in, this was the round Ituralde was protected.

Datum : 2007-01-08 14:10
Titel : Re: Masons
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
i think we shouldnt protect the Veterans anymore unless we can be sure they are clean - most of them will continue to post if they are killed anyway and theres a good chance at least a few of them are mafia

i will protect Ituralde

as to the graffiti - im not really sure waht we can write that will help the town...

Whom shall we protect now ? Seems to be quite random, as we don't know a whole lot yet...

I'd say we simply pick a couple, less active, players to protect - as the mafia 'll likely kill them first. As active players tend to atract more suspicion to themselves.

I'm going to protect Masy, and you two may decide whom you'd like to save.

Also, there's the matter of the Writings on the wall, let's discuss that ASAP.

:balloon2:

And this one, the PM I sent to Sasaki

Datum : 2007-01-08 22:47
Titel : Re: Mafia, masons
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
[QUOTE=Dutch_guy]This is the message for the townies:

''Townies, fear not for we are doing our best to rid you of this evil ! Feel free to call these numbers, anytime:
0800 2664 6662368 or, if that line is busy 0800 9275 87837. We are here to help, we must work together !''

These are to be protected;

Masy

Ituralde

JimBoB (assuming Warluster hasn't sent in anything, that is*)

These are but two PM's, which I saved on my hard drive, that back up Moody's claim.

That said, let me provide some backing on the encrypted numbers, as I thought that up:

As Masons we were tasked with protecting (not finding !) the mafia. Each night we'd be able to protect one townie, one by each mason.
We also had the power to spray paint graffiti on the wall, and what to write was entirely up to us. And that was harder than it seemed...

One can imagine that giving the town information, which you don't have, is harder than it seems. What can we possibly give the town which they couldn't get for themselves ? We were not able to confirm anyone but ourselves, and the dead, innocent but we could however try luring the mafia out. By giving them names, and protecting them afterwards - thus stalling their progress.

However, then the mafia 'd have to actually be able to break the codes. So it had to be clear enough to seem meaningless, but interesting enough to try and break. Since I assumed everyone 'd be familiar with Text messaging, I thought I'd go for that.

The second round I encrypted Sir Boo is innocent, and warluster. With the specific order to call the numbers. Few, however, caught on. A lot publicly stated they didn't get enough information. Not knowing we couldn't give them anything they'd possibly want to know, other than who we protected. Plus, the chances were high the posted info would fall into the wrong hands. Also, we didn't want to publicly argue about our seemingly useless info, for fear of seeming to protective.

The next round, some people (Sigurd and Seamus in particular) hinted at having broken the code. This was at the time Sigurd contacted Boo. Congrats Sigurd, you were fast. The fastest as a matter of fact. However, that night Warluster was killed. Sad, since he was a mason, but he died giving us the needed information. Namely that the mafioso had also figured out the code, and would pay more attention to it in later rounds. They did, and it didn't work for them at all. As we thwarted them a couple of times, giving the townies more chances to pull this off.

A few rounds past without any particular disturbing events, Moody and I corresponded, and (amongst other things) decided that if one of us would die - he was especially fearful since Kommodus attacked him - he would reveal and state what we knew, for all to hear.

However, then Seamus started the wagon which would eventually kill me. Sad, since the townies apparently wanted me dead ASAP. I was doomed, and unable to defend myself, in less than an hour. Well played, mafia, well played. Sadder it was, however, that I had successfully been able to lay low, and not attract that much attention to myself. A fact which has helped me numerous times, and at the same time tends to be a perfect excuse to kill me.

Finding the mafia was never our meaning, and thus we couldn't be of any extra help to the town in that regard. A shame, but that's the game.
That said, Seamus has been on my list for quite a while now - he just doesn't seem like himself. A thought which I couldn't quite surpres even after my death. The General only acted in a not-so-normal manner when people started to accuse him, he seemed to love his life more than any other villager previously executed. Which isn't that suspicious per sé, but it didn't quite come out the way I expected it too. Sounds weird, yes, but that's how it seemed to me.

Well, I guess that's it for now. Any questions, which don't require a screenie to answer are welcome..

:balloon2:

Kommodus

01-18-2007, 19:53

i expect im going to have komm debunking this as soon as its posted

Your wish is granted! Though I didn't expect you to make it this easy for me... I guess Reenk's advice holds true: have faith in the stupidity of the mafia.

The first night we were of course limmited by a complete lack of clues - we basically had to just pick at random who to protect and so we decided we would save those of most use to the town

I protected General Hankerchief (ironic), Dutch_Guy and Warluster protected Kommodus and Seamus - we were close the Mafia targeted Sigurd and a New player

Mistake #1: Kagemusha and Caius (a somewhat new player) were targeted.

I took a leap of faith and had a go at following the mafias pattern - Dutch_Guy defended my brother while i defended someone newish(Itrulde) and Warluster protected a veteran(not sure who).

Dutch_guy wrote the graffiti using a telephone code he thought would be broken quickly - more fool us i guess.

Mistake #2: So apparently the masons decided to identify one of their own in their first message, using a code they knew would be easily broken? I doubt it. More likely they used the opportunity to identify an innocent player.

As we now know thanks to timmy this paid off someone tried to kill Itrulde and i blocked it - result only 1 death (kage)

Mistake #3: (Related to mistake #1) It was Sigurd who died this round. Story's looking a little worse for wear, I'm afraid.

well we messed up not only does the message not say what he wanted too but we let my brother die(he wasnt very happy)

Mistake #4: Ah yes, the last real masonic message doesn't fit with the rest of your story (as I pointed out), so you try to invalidate it. I have to ask: why would you claim only one left when it was false? Lying is better suited to mafia than masons.

Sigurd has been helping since the 3rd round and we let him in on who we were - while he may be fudging the codes somewhat he is telling the truth and has been helping us

Mistake #5: Enlisting someone who has repeatedly lied and gotten it wrong (deliberately or otherwise) to support your case. Not what I would do if I were mafia, buddy.

hopefully dutch_guy, warluster and seamus can lend me their versions and we can see im telling the truth

Mistake #6: You know as well as the rest of us that it's against the rules for a dead person to reveal their role.

Those are the obvious mistakes. I didn't mention the fact that I consider it a bit unlikely that Sasaki would give all the masons the same role, because that's a subjective judgement.

Anyway, looks to me like a botched reveal. However, if anyone isn't sure, I'm fine with being lynched along with Sir Moody, following the townie-role-for-a-mafia-is-a-good-trade rule. My role isn't worth that much anymore, since the mafia know it's risky to attack me.

Good luck, guys! :2thumbsup:

EDIT: For broken quote tags; also, I was typing this while Dutch_guy was posting. Hm, I'll have to take a look at that...

Sir Moody

01-18-2007, 20:05

Mistake #1: Kagemusha and Caius (a somewhat new player) were targeted.

oh im so sorry komm i swaped two kills around by accident - it doesnt matter much does it? we failed to protect them they died

Mistake #4: Ah yes, the last real masonic message doesn't fit with the rest of your story (as I pointed out), so you try to invalidate it. I have to ask: why would you claim only one left when it was false? Lying is better suited to mafia than masons.

dont ask me i didnt have anything to do with it Dutch_Guys PM's tells me all i knew about it - i gave the pm ask him

Mistake #5: Enlisting someone who has repeatedly lied and gotten it wrong (deliberately or otherwise) to support your case. Not what I would do if I were mafia, buddy.

we enlisted him as you and you buddies killed him thus he was a confirmed innocent - we needed as many people as we could get to convince people - anwser me this why would someone you want to belive i killed help us?

Mistake #6: You know as well as the rest of us that it's against the rules for a dead person to reveal their role.

they havent revealed - i revealed them - im alive they are dead as far as i know i dont have to remove their names and since i have revelaed them this isnt a problem - if sasaki tells me otherwise ill remove the PM's

your basic defence is pretty lame Komm cant you come up withsome mystical maths to help you?

Vote Kommodus

Dutch_guy

01-18-2007, 20:12

I'm merely going to confine myself to some questions, as Moody (I'm sure) knows how to answer those best. However, a couple are just a bit far fetched:

Mistake #4: Ah yes, the last real masonic message doesn't fit with the rest of your story (as I pointed out), so you try to invalidate it. I have to ask: why would you claim only one left when it was false? Lying is better suited to mafia than masons.

Are you referring to the justone(1)ofusleft message ? That was done to confuse the mafia, lulling them into a false sense of security. Hey, we all know how Disco can get. Also, we needless to say didn't expect the town to lynch me. Actually making the statement true.

Mistake #5: Enlisting someone who has repeatedly lied and gotten it wrong (deliberately or otherwise) to support your case. Not what I would do if I were mafia, buddy.

His lies were all ruse. Example, when he attacked you about your suposed name in the numbers, he was faking it. I PM'ed him actually asking him if he understood what he was doing, he was, he said. So, no, it may not be what the mafia would do. But hey, we aren't exactly mafia now are we.

Mistake #6: You know as well as the rest of us that it's against the rules for a dead person to reveal their role.

Those are the obvious mistakes. I didn't mention the fact that I consider it a bit unlikely that Sasaki would give all the masons the same role, because that's a subjective judgement.

I am allowed to reveal, posting PM's is not forbidden. Posting screenies is, a thing which we haven't done - and we won't need. If the town believes me, is another matter entirely. If I'm mistaken, Sasaki, then I'm terribly sorry. And feel free to delete the post. However, such a reveal (especially after being lynched !) doesn't mean a thing if the town doesn't believe me, which is something they have to decide for themselves ! Were I killed, then you might argue it to be illegal - as I'd be a confirmed innocent. A thing which I'm not.

Also, consider it as unlikely as you'd like, Sasaki did as the PM stated.

Anyway, looks to me like a botched reveal. However, if anyone isn't sure, I'm fine with being lynched along with Sir Moody, following the townie-role-for-a-mafia-is-a-good-trade rule. My role isn't worth that much anymore, since the mafia know it's risky to attack me.

Same here, a mafioso for a townie is a good trade off. Didn't expect you to actually admit to be one, though. Oh well, as Reenk said have faith in the stupidity of the mafia.

:balloon2:

Kommodus

01-18-2007, 20:21

oh im so sorry komm i swaped two kills around by accident - it doesnt matter much does it? we failed to protect them they died

Accident? Obviously, but that sort of thing tends to happen when you're making up your story on the fly. That's exactly what happened to GH in GFII. A real mason, keeping track of things that have happened during the game, would be more likely to get it right.

we enlisted him as you and you buddies killed him thus he was a confirmed innocent - we needed as many people as we could get to convince people - anwser me this why would someone you want to belive i killed help us?

Already answered much earlier. He probably had a mafia support role, only you killed him because you didn't know his identity and viewed him as a threat.

they havent revealed - i revealed them - im alive they are dead as far as i know i dont have to remove their names and since i have revelaed them this isnt a problem - if sasaki tells me otherwise ill remove the PM's

Oops again - see above for Dutch_guy's post-mortem claim.

And what's this with Dutch_guy supposedly "breaking" a known rule against post-mortem role-claims? Come to think of it, why wasn't that rule included in the PM you "quoted" from Sasaki?

Could it be because, um, Sasaki didn't write it?

As Seamus and others pointed out, Dutch_guy was a bit suspicious. I personally didn't think he was guilty, but now... is it possible, perhaps, that he had another mafia support role? There are at least a couple of non-mason pro-town roles, leading me to suspect for some time that there were multiple pro-mafia roles as well. That scenario makes more sense to me, since Dutch_guy would only be falsely claiming a role after death.

Kommodus

01-18-2007, 20:34

Are you referring to the justone(1)ofusleft message ? That was done to confuse the mafia, lulling them into a false sense of security. Hey, we all know how Disco can get.

His lies were all ruse. Example, when he attacked you about your suposed name in the numbers, he was faking it. I PM'ed him actually asking him if he understood what he was doing, he was, he said.

Um... just how many of your side's lies are you going to claim as "ruses?" I thought by now we'd established the fact that for the townie side, honesty is the best policy. Those caught lying and later claiming "it was all a ruse!" have nearly always been mafia. Reference, again, GH in GFII and Reenk in Mafia V.

Also, consider it as unlikely as you'd like, Sasaki did as the PM stated.

Hm... an unlikely interpretation, at best, of the following statement:

There will be 3 masons, each with a special power.

Sheesh, guys... it boggles the mind... :dizzy2:

Dutch_guy

01-18-2007, 20:41

Accident? Obviously, but that sort of thing tends to happen when you're making up your story on the fly. That's exactly what happened to GH in GFII. A real mason, keeping track of things that have happened during the game, would be more likely to get it right.

A real mason is but a human being, with school, work, RL, and other such things which tend to sap the already scarce time off your hands have indeed attributed to the lack of a 'log' of some sort. That said, I did save all the PM's sent, and received to my hard drive. Not taking those now in my box into account. I can, of course post some ? Or Moody can, for that matter.

Already answered much earlier. He probably had a mafia support role, only you killed him because you didn't know his identity and viewed him as a threat.

Ah, a mafia support role...

...

Sure, nice theory there Kommodus. So we first killed him, then used Boo as an in between (an innocent, confirmed) to then kill of our own man (Warluster), a thing which isn't possible, to eventually make amends with Sigurd...

Not much of a theory, now is it.

Oops again - see above for Dutch_guy's post-mortem claim.

And what's this with Dutch_guy supposedly "breaking" a known rule against post-mortem role-claims? Come to think of it, why wasn't that rule included in the PM you "quoted" from Sasaki?

I can claim all I like, it is, after all a mere claim nothing conclusive (as you're doing your best to point out). The town have their PM's, and are at the moment deciding whom to lynch, I believe they'll make the correct choice now.

Could it be because, um, Sasaki didn't write it?

As Seamus and others pointed out, Dutch_guy was a bit suspicious. I personally didn't think he was guilty, but now... is it possible, perhaps, that he had another mafia support role? There are at least a couple of non-mason pro-town roles, leading me to suspect for some time that there were multiple pro-mafia roles as well. That scenario makes more sense to me, since Dutch_guy would only be falsely claiming a role after death.

He did write it, it fits his posting style - that much is clear at least.

Well, Seamus is still in the game, an interesting fact on its own. I still fail to see how me acting the same as every other game is suspicious, especially considering my clean record in the past games. You were, as a matter of fact, right. I am not guilty ( as I've proven already), and no, I do not have a mafia supporting role...and I am not falsely claiming.

You do, however, realise that simply guessing at hidden roles doesn't help your case - at all ?

:balloon2:

AggonyDuck

01-18-2007, 20:41

Sorry to say this Kommodus but I know better. Sir Moody's claim is valid. What Moody and Dutch just told pretty much filled the gaps in my knowledge and they fit perfectly in with what I've previously found out. You're undermining your own credibility by trying to dispute the claim. I was going to vote for Seamus this round, but after seeing this there is no doubt in my mind about your guilt.

Vote: Kommodus

Kommodus

01-18-2007, 21:17

Sorry to say this Kommodus but I know better. Sir Moody's claim is valid.

Um, can I ask what makes you so sure of this?

C'mon people, think. In round 3, I got a "Little Timmy" message indicating any night actions could only be performed on Sir Boo or discovery1. There were two deaths, neither of which were Sir Boo.

I'm not mafia.

Csargo

01-18-2007, 21:24

When someone reveals another Kung-Fu/Explosive's expert role I guess we've found our final mafioso.

Vote:Kommodus

Sorry I didn't trust you Dutch_Guy just didn't think. After I voted for you later that night I thought about it and you were acting suspiciously like a Doctor or Detective even if it's your normal posting style still.

JimBob

01-18-2007, 21:30

Sorry to say this Kommodus but I know better.
How?

Sir Moody's claim is valid. What Moody and Dutch just told pretty much filled the gaps in my knowledge and they fit perfectly in with what I've previously found out.
You wish to lay that out for us or are you just bsing us? I'm not going to take your word for it.

was going to vote for Seamus this round
Why? Did your attempted hit on him last night fail? Want to finish your business?

I sent discovery1 and Seamus to Aggony Duck.
Either the mafia targeted Seamus or me apparently. And there is enough inconsistency in Aggony's post. He's also is far too confident.

Vote: Aggony Duck

Masons, contact me. We can work together on this

Xiahou

01-18-2007, 21:33

Interesting developments... Kommodus has been looking suspicious since his apparently phony reveal while Moody's reveal seems too well orchestrated to be fake.

Vote: Kommodus

Sigurd

01-18-2007, 21:33

For the love, Sigurd, pay attention! Mistakes, omissions, and deliberate lies - we've seen 'em all before. Most notably from mafiosi in past games such as GeneralHankerchief in GFII and Reenk Roink in Mafia V. They all claimed to have good reasons for it.
You are of course right... Sorry... I honestly didn't catch that last post by JimBob.

The reality: it's just harder to keep everything consistent when you're lying than when you're telling the truth. :no:

:laugh4: ... It seems for me it is the other way around.
I need to pay more attention to the game whilst being a townie.

Csargo

01-18-2007, 21:34

Um, can I ask what makes you so sure of this?

C'mon people, think. In round 3, I got a "Little Timmy" message indicating any night actions could only be performed on Sir Boo or discovery1. There were two deaths, neither of which were Sir Boo.

I'm not mafia.

It's simple really all of the kills have been sent by Disco or he's just writting them, but who really knows.

Csargo

01-18-2007, 21:37

Interesting developments... Kommodus has been looking suspicious since his apparently phony reveal while Moody's reveal seems too well orchestrated to be fake.

Vote: Kommodus

WTF??????????? I'm pretty sure you voted for me last round.:dizzy2: If I'm not mistaken that was before you voted for me.

Kommodus

01-18-2007, 21:49

It's simple really all of the kills have been sent by Disco or he's just writting them, but who really knows.

No, that's impossible. If discovery1 were performing all the kills himself, what would be the point of having a "Little Timmy" role?

Seamus Fermanagh

01-18-2007, 21:55

This is subject to change.

Vote: Kommodus

Not quantifiable, I'm afraid, but the tone of your deconstruction of Moody's reveal is off from your usual analysis -- reads more like Sasaki or Siggy.

Moody is a bit of a cypher to me, but his being a Mason would explain the discrepancies in style just as well as mafia status -- and his reveal coheres nicely (even accounting for the multi-hour run up).

I'll re-read tonight.

By the way, Moody, if I seem "off" to you, think back to how you were when hosting your shindig in the Gameroom. I'm frittered.

Csargo

01-18-2007, 21:57

No, that's impossible. If discovery1 were performing all the kills himself, what would be the point of having a "Little Timmy" role?

What's the point of a mysterious Kung-Fu role? What the point of a Explosives role? Sasaki might not have put in the PM that Disco couldn't send in the kills and so Disco has been using that to his advantage so he wouldn't have to put his mafioso in danger.

Husar

01-18-2007, 22:12

Now this is really nice, whatever happened, I am inclined to say the masons really messed up here.
I am inclined to believe that masonic reveal for reasons I may(or may not) state later but the thing about "only one alive" is really, really bad.
Then again, they couldn't have killed Warluster if dutch and Sir Moody were mafia. What also speaks for them is that I somehow cannot imagine disco selecting them as mafiosi as they are not really an experienced crew, but maybe that was just what made disco select them, hoping that the experienced players would lynch one another. and Kommodus' defense about warluster maybe having a support role sounds a bit valid, maybe they are also counting on him being away and not posting here anymore?

I'm really confused right now and may go to ask disco what he thinks I should do......

Kommodus

01-18-2007, 22:26

Sure, nice theory there Kommodus. So we first killed him, then used Boo as an in between (an innocent, confirmed) to then kill of our own man (Warluster), a thing which isn't possible, to eventually make amends with Sigurd...

Then again, they couldn't have killed Warluster if dutch and Sir Moody were mafia.

Gah! I never said anything at all about Warluster, and I certainly never said he was mafia, as Dutch_guy implies. Clearly he wasn't, because he was killed. I don't know what role, if any, he had. I also don't really know what role Dutch_guy had - I speculated that he had some kind of mafia support role, since he's shown up here to support Sir Moody by claiming a role post-mortem, a move that is normally illegal. For all I know, he might've actually been mafia.

Warluster, on the other hand, hasn't said anything.

Sigurd

01-18-2007, 22:36

I don't know if this helps in any way...
But I contacted Warluster first and had a pretty good dialogue with him. He was of course very skeptical towards me at first and would not give too much information.

It was to him I showed what Csar had asked me about. He will confirm this.
Hence he, Sir Moody, Sir Boo and Dutch_guy are the real deal.

I then contacted Sir Boo and the rest of the story you already know.

AggonyDuck

01-18-2007, 22:50

How?

Basically I've been discussing with Sigurd in this game. Before Sir Moody's reveal I knew these things. Warluster was a Mason and that Sir Boo was a brother of one of the masons. So when Sir Moody and DG told this and additionally filled in the gaps, I knew that their claim was valid. So when Kommodus went and tried to refute the claim, I knew that he was lying.

You wish to lay that out for us or are you just bsing us? I'm not going to take your word for it.

I'm speaking the truth or atleast what I believe is the truth according to what Sigurd has told me.

Why? Did your attempted hit on him last night fail? Want to finish your business?

Seamus has been on my suspect list from the start with Sir Moody. When it became clear that Moody was a mason, I was going to go for Seamus, but then Kommodus started his attack against the mason reveal. Thus I decided to go for him instead.

Either the mafia targeted Seamus or me apparently. And there is enough inconsistency in Aggony's post. He's also is far too confident.

Vote: Aggony Duck

I believe Sir Moody said that he did protect you last night. As to your vote against me; I can tell you this; I'm not the guy you're looking for. It is just a matter of trusting me. I do not betray the trust of others. (But it is up to you to trust me)

The matter of your note:

Your note was delivered to me at 7:52 am GMT +2, two minutes after the kills. AFAIK they would limit me the next night, not the last one.

Warluster

01-18-2007, 23:41

Husar

01-19-2007, 01:01

Okay, theres a big argument over who is a masons and all, well to back up my fellow (dead) masons I say some stuff.

Yes I was a mason, simple easy done.
Dutch_Guy was a mason. simple,easy done
Sir Moody was a mason. simple,easy done

Over time I watched some people think we were mafia. Some people thought the mason mesage was a mafia one. I can even tell you who I protected over the game.
Finally, after Sigurd destroyed his credibility I was 80% sure he had a mafia supporting role, but that you had one as well sounds a bit far-fetched.

Vote: Kommodus

I don't really need to say why, do I?

Kommodus

01-19-2007, 01:18

Reenk Roink

01-19-2007, 02:53

For the love, Sigurd, pay attention! Mistakes, omissions, and deliberate lies - we've seen 'em all before. Most notably from mafiosi in past games such as GeneralHankerchief in GFII and Reenk Roink in Mafia V. They all claimed to have good reasons for it. The reality: it's just harder to keep everything consistent when you're lying than when you're telling the truth. :no:

Yet you (and most of the town) believed me even though I was basically caught red handed. :laugh4: :grin2: Manipulation...

Anyhoo, I'm fairly confident that Kommo is guilty, not as confident as Gen-Hanky of course, but confident nonetheless.

As Kommodus himself put it (paraphrased), lynching Seamus in Mafia V:

It's not certain (what really is?), but it's our best shot.

Vote: Kommodus

By the way, I've always had a nagging feeling that Sigurd was attempting to play me, but he doesn't know which game I'm playing so... :wink:

Husar

01-19-2007, 03:01

Gah... what the heck... :shrug:

Well, looks like people have chosen to believe private communications they've had with untrustworthy people rather than rational argument. The mafia have done a fine job of building a coalition of trust. I'm not privy to these communications, so I guess I can't argue against them.

I'm a bit disappointed that no one seems to care about the inconsistencies in Sir Moody's problem-ridden reveal. But oh well, I knew I'd get lynched eventually. C'est la vie.

Kudos to Sir Moody, Sigurd Fafnesbane, and gang. You've done a fine job of leading the town around by the nose. I wish the town luck, but at this point I don't fancy its chances. :no:

I don't know what to make of Warluster's comments. There's something going on that I don't understand; I suppose we'll find out at the end of the game, won't we? Still, I don't think a post-mortem role-reveal is an allowable thing, so... ???

Sir Moody, your time will come, you dirty mafioso!

Have fun, guys! :2thumbsup: :skull:
Well, you do sound pretty desperate(especially for someone who relies on rationale and numbers~;) ) so my heart says let him live.
But I don't really see any other option now, there seem to be a lot of people who think that you are guilty and their claims are somewhat consistent.
I'm not going to believe sigurd anything again anytime soon I think but all three supposed masons tell the same story.
Either you are a mafioso or we might really have some cult thing going on here. They all seem to know "more" and I feel a bit excluded as well so I might change my opinion and abstain again or something like that.
All those lies and "ruses" from their side really hurt their cause, whatever that may be, well, why not do it now, this game has been spoiled by so many deceptions, I'm completely torn in all directions, the only one whose role is clear and makes me feel warm and fuzzy is disco, at least I know his agenda......

Let's see who else is there...

Unvote: Kommodus
Vote: doc_bean for staying under the radar(at least under mine)

May turn out to be my first "effective" vote in case anyone needs this for a statistic to get me lynched.:2thumbsup:

discovery1

01-19-2007, 06:18

woah, no lynch.....

Sasaki is slacking.

Sasaki Kojiro

01-19-2007, 06:25

And so Kommodus was lynched.

However, it appears that during the heated discussion prior to the final vote being cast, Sir Moody had revealed to much. His claim to be a mason might have been doubted had it not been for the two deceased masons stepping up and arguing alongside him. This was proof enough for the mafia don and Sir Moody was found face down in the street riddled with bullet holes.

Killed (7):

Caius Flaminius
Kagemusha
Sigurd Fafnesbane
Warluster
Masy
Don Corleone
Sir Boo

Lynched(4):
Reenk Roink
GeneralHankerchief
Dutch_guy
Kommodus

WoG(5):
Divine Wind
Proletariat
Ultrawar
Peasant Phill
Sir Moody

Alive: (11):

discovery1
Jimbob
Seamus Fermanagh
Xiahou
AggonyDuck
Ituralde
Husar
doc_bean
Al Khalifah
Ignoramus
Ichigo

pm's please

Not quite fair I know. The rules mention nothing about role reveal after death. However, it has been a standard in other games, and for a good reason. One of the powers of the masons is the ability to confirm each other innocent, and it's not right that this ability extends past death. I let it go because it was too late and I hadn't mentioned anything in the rules but I feel this makes up for it.

discovery1

01-19-2007, 06:55

Discovery1 blows the smoke off from his tommy gun.

Good riddence. Pitty I couldn't have more fun with you though.

Discovery1 climbs into a car and speeds off.

Sir Moody

01-19-2007, 10:25

Not quite fair I know. The rules mention nothing about role reveal after death. However, it has been a standard in other games, and for a good reason. One of the powers of the masons is the ability to confirm each other innocent, and it's not right that this ability extends past death. I let it go because it was too late and I hadn't mentioned anything in the rules but I feel this makes up for it.

no i got what i deserved (tho i should be under wog not dead sas :help:)

i thought it would be ok as i was revealing them first - i probably should have checked with you first

Ituralde

01-19-2007, 10:38

So Sasaki pretty much confirmed the Mason role, that's good to know.

Seamus Fermanagh

01-19-2007, 15:33

Dutch_guy

01-19-2007, 16:08

While eradicating the last one. Not sure if I'd be talking about "silver linings" yet.

Still, makes me feel better about doing for Kommo. Kommo may simply have been on the wrong track, but his vociferous efforts against Moody still make me suspicious.

Wonder if I'll live to vote again? I will I be gutted by the mafia or even by Little Timmy?:inquisitive:

Well, why would the mafia remove such a valuable player. And further more, I don't think it's possible for mafioso to kill themselves - or colleagues for that matter.

If you're not a mafia, as you state, don't be worried. They'd be tremendously stupid to lynch you - and you know the town knows it, as do the bad guys.

:balloon2:

Csargo

01-19-2007, 21:18

I think doc_bean needs to explain his reason for not posting here.

Seamus Fermanagh

01-19-2007, 22:35

Well, why would the mafia remove such a valuable player. And further more, I don't think it's possible for mafioso to kill themselves - or colleagues for that matter.

If you're not a mafia, as you state, don't be worried. They'd be tremendously stupid to lynch you - and you know the town knows it, as do the bad guys.

:balloon2:

Perhaps so, but I have yet to survive one of these games -- regardless of role.

Kommodus

01-19-2007, 22:52

JimBob

01-19-2007, 23:51

In the event of my death things AggonyDuck says about Csar are true.

Dutch_guy

01-19-2007, 23:58

Wow. :shocked2: ~:eek:

My word did I ever have that wrong. Sir Moody and gang, I obviously owe you an apology. I suppose I deserved that lynch after all. This game threw me pretty badly. :dizzy2: :embarassed:

I was so sure I had it figured out. But jeez, guys, didja really have to include those wierd inconsistencies? What was I supposed to think? :help:

Anyway, bleegggghhhh... sorry. :shame:

We all know how hectic things get in these games, there really is no need to apologize at all. God knows we've all, at least once, accused someone who then turned out to be the village hero. It happens, no problem here. :2thumbsup:

...

Now let's get back to business. :yes: ~D

:balloon2:

Seamus Fermanagh

01-20-2007, 02:12

Apparently my blitz efforts agin you were misplaced. Nothing personal, just business.

Sasaki Kojiro

01-20-2007, 05:39

Jimbob was home, sitting at his desk. He had just finished writing a few notes when he thought he heard movement in the kitchen and got up to investigate.

Just as he rounded the corner, he was surprised by what appeared to be a large clown, holding a small horn in his hand, standing by the refridgerator.
*Honka!*
"Sparky .....is that you?"
*Honka!*Honka!*
An expression of horror spread over JimBob's face as he began to wimper quietly....

The next morning, JimBob's severed head was discovered in the town square, his mouth crammed with blue and red slips of paper, each with the name JimBob scrawled on them in crayon.

***

Killed (8):

Caius Flaminius
Kagemusha
Sigurd Fafnesbane
Warluster
Masy
Don Corleone
Sir Boo
Jimbob

Lynched(4):
Reenk Roink
GeneralHankerchief
Dutch_guy
Kommodus

WoG(5):
Divine Wind
Proletariat
Ultrawar
Peasant Phill
Sir Moody

Alive: (10):

discovery1
Seamus Fermanagh
Xiahou
AggonyDuck
Ituralde
Husar
doc_bean
Al Khalifah
Ignoramus
Ichigo

Let the voting begin!

Warluster

01-20-2007, 07:53

Well my suspicions are aroused.
I think Husar is a mafia.
The poem in the second round about him clearly pointed out it was Husar, making us thinking he was next, and we thought him innocent.

Discovery1 was declaring on the chat names of mafia, some didnt believe him because it was too obvious, so he tricked us.

When Husar was not murdered it was obvious, there fore I come to think it is Husar.

Csargo

01-20-2007, 19:22

Vote:doc_bean

I have yet to hear anything from him in a while. I doubt his innocence at this point.

doc_bean

01-20-2007, 19:28

Csargo

01-20-2007, 19:54

Well, if Kommodus was mafia, which he might well have been, looking at the debate the last few days between him and the masons, I did vote for him rather consistently.

Truth be told I haven't been paying as much attention to this game as I should have. :embarassed:

You voted for him twice. And that was both times you really gave no reasons besides "Hey maybe we can find some mafioso's".

Looking back through your posts your acting exactly like I did in GFII. Voting but only giving one line reasons. I really doubt your innocence now.

Caius

01-20-2007, 21:53

somewhat new player
Dont you remember me?

discovery1

01-20-2007, 22:16

Now Csar, why would I let a mafia do something that would attract attention to themselve, like let them stay quiet?

AggonyDuck

01-20-2007, 22:42

Well essentially we're stuck in a situation we're noone really stands out from the crowd in suspicion. Luckily we have approximately three to four lynches to get this right. But before this the town needs to rally itself to find the last culprit.

I was initially going to vote for Seamus. Something has been off with his behaviour lately, but I believe it could be caused by the mammoth mafia game that he is hosting. Thus I will cast my vote against Xiahou. He has managed to lay low the whole game without really attracting any suspicion what so ever. He seems like a guy that Discovery would recruit.

Vote: Xiahou

doc_bean

01-20-2007, 22:44

random number generator says: vote: Ichigo

He doesn't like me anyway :laugh4:

vote will change if anyone can put forth a good reason to vote for someone else.

Husar

01-20-2007, 23:56

Hmm, random guessing?
Will that get us anywhere?
Well, since doc_bean thinks so...

Vote: doc_bean

It's good that you voted for Kommodus consistently, maybe voting consistently is a good idea.:sweatdrop:

Csargo

01-21-2007, 00:02

Now Csar, why would I let a mafia do something that would attract attention to themselve, like let them stay quiet?

Really can you make someone change how they post Disco? I didn't think so.

doc_bean

01-21-2007, 00:32

Hmm, random guessing?
Will that get us anywhere?

Well, do YOU have any clues ???

Share them, please...

Csargo

01-21-2007, 00:53

The only problem with lurking is it only works til the end when someone notices it.

discovery1

01-21-2007, 01:29

Really can you make someone change how they post Disco? I didn't think so.

I can send PMs telling people they better make more noise, or less, depending on what I think of them.

Xiahou

01-21-2007, 01:45

Vote: Ichigo

I relented for a round after what looked like a sure-thing to lynch Kommodus turned into a lynch on DG. Kommodus was highly suspicious and deserved lynching, so I helped make sure of it.

Now back to Csar/Ichigo, he's been acting suspicious virtually the entire game talking about knowing the "truth" while not having a role. I think he was trying to make us think he was the soothsayer- which he clearly was not.

AggonyDuck

01-21-2007, 03:14

Csargo

01-21-2007, 03:28

After re-reading the thread, I've reached the conclusion that Xiahou is innocent. So I'm switching back to Seamus.

Unvote: Xiahou
Vote: Seamus Fermanagh

About doc_bean, I'd say that he is innocent due to the fact that he did vote for himself earlier in the game. It's a risky assumption, but we have to take risks at the moment, because it is likely that there is still two mafiosi left.

So did Kommodus but we still lynched him. That doesn't confirm you innocent.

Vote: Ichigo

I relented for a round after what looked like a sure-thing to lynch Kommodus turned into a lynch on DG. Kommodus was highly suspicious and deserved lynching, so I helped make sure of it.

Now back to Csar/Ichigo, he's been acting suspicious virtually the entire game talking about knowing the "truth" while not having a role. I think he was trying to make us think he was the soothsayer- which he clearly was not.

I said something about the truth once. I thought I had figured out who the masons were, but I was wrong. You could have interpreted it anyway you want. If you remember I always said I never had a role. :P Not my fault you didn't believe me. I doubt your mafia cause when you were you lurked.

Csargo

01-21-2007, 04:28

Are you kidding me? Where is everyone at? Get out there and vote!

Sasaki Kojiro

01-21-2007, 04:45

Vote count:

Ichigo 2
doc_bean 2
Seamus 1

Csargo

01-21-2007, 04:49

This is the worst round of voting I've seen in a while. Sad really.

discovery1

01-21-2007, 05:14

Vote: Ichigo

I SAW HIM EATING A MEATBALL!!!!

Csargo

01-21-2007, 05:16

Vote: Ichigo

I SAW HIM EATING A MEATBALL!!!!

Figures

Seamus Fermanagh

01-21-2007, 05:23

My head is not as into this game as it should be.

My notes on characters "acting out of character" says:

Ducky is voting more regularly and with more analysis (less gut) than ever before.

Ichigo and Sigurd are teamed in some way -- and Sigurd is more choppy than usual, though only by a bit.

Moody was a Mason, some Kommo was attacking wrong.

Doc is voting more than usual for him and more consistently involved (not just reading). He has voted the entire game for either Ichigo or Kommo to buy it. This continues. This much pitbull is unusual, but not a typical mafia approach. Tenacity draws attention the wrong way.

In this case, I'll follow his lead. I am wary of Sigurd's help and Doc is striking a chord with me.

Vote: Ichigo

That's:

Ichigo = 3 (Seamus, Doc_bean, X-man)
Doc_bean = 2 (Husar, Ichigo)
Seamus = 1 (Ducky)

Sasaki Kojiro

01-21-2007, 06:43

Ichigo has been lynched.

Ichigo = 4 (Seamus, Doc_bean, X-man,discovery1)
Doc_bean = 2 (Husar, Ichigo)
Seamus = 1 (Ducky)

***

Killed (8):

Caius Flaminius
Kagemusha
Sigurd Fafnesbane
Warluster
Masy
Don Corleone
Sir Boo
Jimbob

Lynched(5):
Reenk Roink
GeneralHankerchief
Dutch_guy
Kommodus
Ichigo

WoG(5):
Divine Wind
Proletariat
Ultrawar
Peasant Phill
Sir Moody

Alive: (9):

discovery1
Seamus Fermanagh
Xiahou
AggonyDuck
Ituralde
Husar
doc_bean
Al Khalifah
Ignoramus

pm's please

Csargo

01-21-2007, 08:21

I doubt Seamus's innocence as well as doc's, but I've been lynched so I guess that doesn't matter now. And by some crappy evidence IMO.

Ituralde

01-21-2007, 11:54

Just want to drop in real quick and apologize for my absence yesterday. I was at two different birthdays the whole day yesterday and figured I could get a vote in before I went to bed last night. Well, with my GF around it didn't quite work out the way I planned, that's why I didn't vote.

But since I'm not convinced of anything besides my own innocence, I would have been pretty lost for casting a vote anyways. :thumbsdown:

Sigurd

01-21-2007, 12:33

(on pda)
damn people, isn't it obvious tha Ichigo was innocent?
Disco put one of the two final votes on him. A GF would not want to lose one of his own at this point in the game.
Then Seamus comes out from hiding and put the damning last vote.
Damn suspicious if you ask me.

I don't know if I have a say in this anymore, but Seamus should be lunched. And if the game doesn't end, then lynch Husar. He is giving Mafia support vibes. If the game doesn't end then, then we are damned.

doc_bean

01-21-2007, 17:00

I don't know if I have a say in this anymore, but Seamus should be lunched. And if the game doesn't end, then lynch Husar. He is giving Mafia support vibes. If the game doesn't end then, then we are damned.

I agree Seamus' vote is a bit weird, but I think he's just pre-occupied with his own mafia game.

Husar

01-21-2007, 20:20

I agree Seamus' vote is a bit weird, but I think he's just pre-occupied with his own mafia game.
Then lynch me, going by Sigurd's logic.
But we might want to wait for the next kills, maybe disco has a different end prepared for me.:sweatdrop:

Seamus Fermanagh

01-21-2007, 20:48

[QUOTE=Sigurd FafnesbaneI don't know if I have a say in this anymore, but Seamus should be lunched.[/QUOTE]

Agreed. Someplace with a nicely varied salad bar please.

Csargo

01-21-2007, 21:48

Then lynch me, going by Sigurd's logic.
But we might want to wait for the next kills, maybe disco has a different end prepared for me.:sweatdrop:

Doubtful.

Sasaki Kojiro

01-22-2007, 01:34

pevergreen replaces Al Khalifah
Redleg replaces Ignoramus

Alive: (9):

discovery1
Seamus Fermanagh
Xiahou
AggonyDuck
Ituralde
Husar
doc_bean
Al Khalifah pevergreen
Ignoramus Redleg

Csargo

01-22-2007, 01:37

Weird stuff Sasaki.

Redleg

01-22-2007, 01:41

so to make it clear to me, the game is going into night phase correct?

Sasaki Kojiro

01-22-2007, 01:42

It is currently night. Night should end in 4 hours or so, then voting will begin. Gives you some time to read.

AggonyDuck

01-22-2007, 02:03

What exactly is the purpose of such a switch?

Sasaki Kojiro

01-22-2007, 02:23

What exactly is the purpose of such a switch?

They were inactive. I prefer this to WoG, I've already WoG'd a bunch of players.

pevergreen

01-22-2007, 02:37

Now you will fear me!

MWHAHAA

Sasaki Kojiro

01-22-2007, 05:58

Pevergreen had just finished dinner at the local greasy spoon. A lot had been going on in this town and he had a lot of catching up to do if he was going to catch the mafia.

After paying his bill, he started the walk home. As he rounded a corner, deep in thought he was startled when he stepped on something...
*Honka!*
Looking down pevergreen saw he had stepped what appeared to be a small horn, the type you might find on a bicycle. As he studied the strange object he hear a reply from behind a nearby building.
*Honka!*
Intrigued, pevergreen cautiously peered into the shadows behind the building when suddenly a large clown stepped out from the shadows holding a small horn in one hand and a meat cleaver in the other. He turned to run as the clown stood grinning menacingly at him. But as he began to flee, he slipped on a cream pie that he could've sworn wasn't there a moment ago. pevergreen fell and hit his head hard on the pavement... the last thing he heard was the horn.... *Honka!*

The next morning, pevergreen's body was found in an alleyway, apparently strangled by a balloon animal which was still tied tightly around his neck. :clown:

***

Killed (9):

Caius Flaminius
Kagemusha
Sigurd Fafnesbane
Warluster
Masy
Don Corleone
Sir Boo
Jimbob
pevergreen

Lynched(5):
Reenk Roink
GeneralHankerchief
Dutch_guy
Kommodus
Ichigo

WoG(5):
Divine Wind
Proletariat
Ultrawar
Peasant Phill
Sir Moody

Alive: (8):

discovery1
Seamus Fermanagh
Xiahou
AggonyDuck
Ituralde
Husar
doc_bean
Redleg

New voting rules: 8 alive, so 5 to lynch. This means you will have to reach some sort of semi-consensus. Once the 5th vote has been cast the voting will be over regardless of any unvotes that follow. Don't edit your posts to change votes, make a new post.

AggonyDuck

01-22-2007, 08:42

I believe that either Seamus or Husar is guilty. I will stick to my rather constant suspicions and vote for Seamus.

Vote: Seamus Fermanagh

discovery1

01-22-2007, 09:26

Now you will fear me!

MWHAHAA

Pretty scarry, you being worm feed.

Warluster

01-22-2007, 09:57

Aye, Pevergreen, we can not fear you, as you are dead! HA!

Dutch_guy

01-22-2007, 10:19

Now you will fear me!

MWHAHAA

Pretty scarry, you being worm feed.

You killed him just because he said that, didn't you ?

:balloon2:

Sigurd

01-22-2007, 10:38

Agreed. Someplace with a nicely varied salad bar please.
:laugh4:

I will keep the typos as they were funny...

Ituralde

01-22-2007, 11:01

I can agree with AggonyDucks reasoning. Also I always considered Ichigo innocent, making anyone that has put a vote on him suspicious to me. Since we have to reach some consent here, I'm gonna go with Seamus.

Vote: Seamus Fermanagh

Should give him more time for his game, too! :beam:

pevergreen

01-22-2007, 11:16

I deserved that! :laugh4:

Quite mean though, killing me as soon as i replace someone!

Damn-eth you Sasaki!

Husar

01-22-2007, 14:20

So now that we have a lot of beliefs and two votes on Seamus, does anyone have an idea or something substantial to base a vote on?
I didn't think a lot about this game over the weekend so I don't have much of an idea now, except for a few more beliefs that is.

Sigurd

01-22-2007, 14:34

Ichigo has been lynched.

Ichigo = 3 (Seamus, Doc_bean, X-man)
Doc_bean = 2 (Husar, Ichigo)
Seamus = 1 (Ducky)

I explicitly saw Discovery make a vote for Ichigo…
In your rules it states that the Godfather is allowed to vote but his vote in not counted in the tally.

Is this the case? In the endgame this is important to know since the mafia will then have one more vote to counter the town.

That said…
If there is a pro-mafia role in this game the mafia should have 3 votes to place this round (assuming that GH and Kommoudus were Mafiosi).
The town should have 5 votes against the mafia.
I am assuming this as Sasaki just changed the voting rules. I know I am assuming a great deal here but this could very well be the scenario we are facing.

The town is divided in two camps and this is the camps as I see it:

Mafia/pro-mafia:
Discovery1 : Godfather
GH : Henchman (dead)
Kommodus : Possible Henchman (dead)
Seamus : Possible Henchman
Husar : Possible Pro-Mafia

Town:
AggonyDuck
Xiahou
Doc_bean
Redleg
Ituralde – Soothsayer (All though he could have a dual role Mafioso/soothsayer but currently I don’t feel any vibes from that direction)

My whole basis for this assertion is the fact that Discovery1 have chosen his own henchmen from the players.
All though I would have chosen differently I would ensured that Kommodus was on my team to disable that method he has of finding mafia. The fact that he has not used it in this game (If we disregard that he named a Mason) counts to him being “dirty”. All though he could have misled us greatly with this method but have chosen not to, also counts to his tally of Mafia clues. He is an honorable fellow and will not further discredit his method.
From speaking with GH in the chat I am without doubt concerning his guilt.
Now to Seamus… I get the same vibes from him as I got from Kommodus. It is the perfect cover to be less involved in a game to host one of your own. This has been the case here. Last time Seamus was Mafioso he showed the same traits, not eagerly concerned with his role as townie. That he voted out Ichigo, a bandwagon that even the Godfather joined at this end stage of the game speaks of “dirtyness”.
Husar… Now here is a fellow that either plays along with the mafia to avoid getting killed by them or a fellow with a pro-mafia role.

Another matter is the introduction of two new players at this stage.
That the Mafia killed one of them is a clear statement to us that Al was innocent.
What about Ignoramus... a bold move to choose him as henchman if you ask me all though feasable. I think it not likely. No, Disco had a short time to choose his henchmen and I believe he chose what would in a normal situation be a winning team. That is GH, Kommodus and Seamus. All experienced Mafia, but sadly diluted.
It was too obvious a choice.

Sigurd

doc_bean

01-22-2007, 14:44

Xiahou wouldn't have been a bad choice either. Remember the previous game were in the final round it was between him and (mafiosi) Don C ? He's a surviver that tends to stay under the radar.

I'd give Seamus the benefit of the doubt right now...

vote:Xiahou

Sasaki Kojiro

01-22-2007, 16:09

I explicitly saw Discovery make a vote for Ichigo…
In your rules it states that the Godfather is allowed to vote but his vote in not counted in the tally.

Is this the case? In the endgame this is important to know since the mafia will then have one more vote to counter the town.

Fixed. I was copying Seamus's vote count.

Redleg

01-22-2007, 16:15

From reading the numerous posts of this game.

Vote:Seamus

Seamus Fermanagh

01-22-2007, 16:30

Not Mafia.

Not sure at this point who is.

Followed Doc's lead last time.

I'll select Xiahou this time -- see reasoning a couple of post above. Works for me.

Vote: Xiahou

Xiahou

01-22-2007, 20:52

I agree with Sigurd on this one. Seamus would've been an ideal choice for a mafioso and has done a good job of lying low as compared to his normal style.

Vote: Seamus

I think we can also safely assume Redleg's innocence- I don't know of anyone who would go inactive after receiving a mafia role.

Csargo

01-22-2007, 21:05

Seamus=4
Xiahou=2

Seamus Fermanagh

01-22-2007, 21:07

Well, it looks like I'm for the chop.

I am not mafia, I have no special role, but I am distracted. Perhaps too distracted to be a proper help and thus deserving of an exit.

discovery1 (GF)
Seamus Fermanagh
Xiahou
AggonyDuck
Ituralde
Husar
doc_bean
Redleg

I suspect we have one mafia, possibly two left. If it's two, we're in trouble.

All of these players are involved differently than in preceding mafia outings. Redleg new to the fold but avid, Doc, Ituralde, Ducky, X-man all differing from previous games -- but no clear reason for why. Many explanations would be positive for the town. Husar has already come under fire.

I guess X-man tops my list, but I've got little concrete to go on.

If it's my turn, I say: "Shoot straight you _______, don't make a mess of it!"

AggonyDuck

01-22-2007, 21:22

I'm pretty sure that Xiahou is innocent, mainly due to his role in getting GH lynched, whom seems to be a pretty definitive mafioso. At the moment I have two suspects: Seamus and Husar. I'm almost inclined to believe what Seamus is saying, simply because he appears sincere. That would leave Husar left. Anyway it appears like I still have time to change my vote.

Unvote: Seamus
Vote: Husar

AggonyDuck

01-22-2007, 21:26

All of these players are involved differently than in preceding mafia outings. Redleg new to the fold but avid, Doc, Ituralde, Ducky, X-man all differing from previous games -- but no clear reason for why. Many explanations would be positive for the town. Husar has already come under fire.

Care to elaborate how my behaviour differs from previous games and I might get a chance to explain myself? I'm curious to know how differently I actually am playing.

Seamus Fermanagh

01-22-2007, 21:48

Ducky:

A lot more consistently active -- in previous games you'd be streaky, busy for a couple of rounds then lurking a few more.

Post count has probably increased slightly (check with Kommo) and I know post word length has gone up.

Posts seem a little more strongly analytical, especially in the early part of this game, and less "by the gut."

Now, for the life of me I have no clue whether this means:

a) you're mafia

b) your're a role player and a little more involved this time

c) you're simply getting into these games more and its reflected in a changing post style

Any of these are plausible. I'm too frazzled to clear it up in my own head. I even stopped my vote tallies last round in this one....:dizzy:

Husar

01-22-2007, 21:59

Hmm, I'm torn between AggonyDuck and Xiahou now.

doc_bean has a good point concerning Xiahou but IMO AggonyDuck is also a bit suspicious. He asks how his behaviour is different from previous games, may be a bit overeager to know what could give him away. He was also in the chat lately, while this is appreciated in itself, he may have been chatting with disco there.
I was suspecting Seamus before especially after talking to Sigurd a lot in the beginning of the game but I am not sure about this anymore.

Actually, since he wants to explain himself before he was even accused:

Vote: AggonyDuck

AggonyDuck

01-22-2007, 22:03

Well a plausible explanation for this change in behaviour would be the fact that I discussed with Sigurd in the Chat around round 3 or so. He shared some of his inside information, which fueled my interest for this game. Previously when playing a villager my activity tended to rise as the game entered the final stages, but here it has been more consistent, like you said.

Also what might have affected something was the Interficio-mafia game. Overall it wasn't a nice experience for me being one of the mafia in it. So now that I actually got the chance to play a villager again, I decided to put some more effort into it, although I fear my results are not that good.

AggonyDuck

01-22-2007, 22:27

I explained myself, because Seamus asked me to in a sense.

Many explanations would be positive for the town.

I have nothing to hide in this game, hence I have no problems with explaining myself if it helps the town.

Anyway as to my vote on Husar. I urge you all to re-read the thread if you have the time. I read it all and my current conclusion is that he is guilty. Even if you might not reach the same conclusion as I have, it will still give you a better perspective of the current situation. Please just re-read it.

Csargo

01-22-2007, 22:45

Redleg

01-22-2007, 22:48

unvote: Seamus

Vote: AggonyDuck

Lets just say Seamus provided a convincing arguement in thread to unvote him.

Csargo

01-22-2007, 22:53

unvote: Seamus

Vote: AggonyDuck

Lets just say Seamus provided a convincing arguement in thread to unvote him.

This is all going to crap. Convincing arguements what like I'm not mafia blah blah blah yada yada yada not blah mafia blah. Yep really convincing especially since he's throwing out names. Why are you so afraid to die Seamus?

discovery1

01-22-2007, 23:46

La de la de la.

I'm hungry.

Vote: Me

Csargo

01-22-2007, 23:58

La de la de la.

I'm hungry.

Vote: Me

I'm pretty sure he wants to commit suicide Sasaki.

Seamus Fermanagh

01-23-2007, 00:07

Csargo

01-23-2007, 00:10

Ichigo:

Either you believe from the tone of my posts that I'm not mafia or you don't.

My death will not help the town, but I won't fight it much harder than I am as it would ease my forum monitoring for a while.

You, on the other hand, are quite active here after death despite bowing out early in the other game. Something have your interest in this one more...

Never mind, never mind.....

Like I told you Seamus I do have more interest in this game because it's almost over and I've been active the entire game. I find it suspicious though that you came and put another vote on me after Disco put a deciding one on me....

Sasaki Kojiro

01-23-2007, 00:29

Vote Count:

Seamus 2 (Ituralde,Xiahou)
Xiahou 2 (doc_bean,Seamus)
AggonyDuck 2 (Husar,Redleg)
Husar 1 (AggonyDuck)
discovery1 (la de la de la)

5 to lynch. No deadline currently.

Husar

01-23-2007, 00:46

So any reasoning for your change of behavior in this game Husar?
No.:juggle2:

Csargo

01-23-2007, 00:46

No.:juggle2:

Figures

Husar

01-23-2007, 01:07

Well, we should think about who we lynch now since we don't have that many tries left.
Besides that, Seamus didn't mention any change in my behaviour, I didn't notice any change, if you noticed one you may want to explain it before asking me to give a reason for it(and there may even be none, I play like I want, I don't try to stick to any behaviour).

Duck just keeps saying I was suspicious but I haven't really understood why he thinks that, he also believes Sigurd and his "inside information" it seems, I did so in the early game as well but apparently a lot of it was not really true which makes me reject his newer accusations a bit(of course I am now suspicious on his list, first I mentioned him as possible pro-mafia, now I am possible pro-mafia in his list:inquisitive: ).

Csargo

01-23-2007, 01:09

The fact you've only actually voted maybe two to three times this entire game.

Csargo

01-23-2007, 02:03

GeneralHankerchief

01-23-2007, 02:06

Csargo

01-23-2007, 03:40

Big talk from a lynched person. Being lynched and all, you're in no position to name who is guilty/innocent.

I highly doubt that Disco would put the deciding lynch vote on his own mafioso. It's funny that you show up after all this time to say that I can't claim anything GH. Hiding something?:inquisitive:

Seamus Fermanagh

01-23-2007, 04:28

I highly doubt that Disco would put the deciding lynch vote on his own mafioso. It's funny that you show up after all this time to say that I can't claim anything GH. Hiding something?:inquisitive:

Pardon me. I had thought that Disco's votes were irrelevant. Did I miss a rule change or something?

Husar:

I have slightly less experience with you than with the others, but you do seem closer to your baseline in style and content. Only varied a little when under attack, but I think we all do, so for me your inconclusive at this point.

Guess I'm flailing a bit here.

Sasaki Kojiro

01-23-2007, 04:29

Disco's votes count.

discovery1

01-23-2007, 05:49

Disco's votes count.

WOOOHOOOO!!!!!

On an unrelated note, I could go for some booze right about now....

Csargo

01-23-2007, 06:15

Pardon me. I had thought that Disco's votes were irrelevant. Did I miss a rule change or something?

Husar:

I have slightly less experience with you than with the others, but you do seem closer to your baseline in style and content. Only varied a little when under attack, but I think we all do, so for me your inconclusive at this point.

Guess I'm flailing a bit here.

Well when he puts the deciding vote on someone I doubt it's irrelevant, but hey that's just me.

AggonyDuck

01-23-2007, 08:07

Duck just keeps saying I was suspicious but I haven't really understood why he thinks that, he also believes Sigurd and his "inside information" it seems, I did so in the early game as well but apparently a lot of it was not really true which makes me reject his newer accusations a bit(of course I am now suspicious on his list, first I mentioned him as possible pro-mafia, now I am possible pro-mafia in his list:inquisitive: ).

I'm basing all my decisions and suspicions on the assumption that GH is guilty. Of all the players left, you were one of the few who did not side against him. Overall you've avoided taking sides until a strong support for something has become apparent. Anyway got to go back to class now. :wall:

Husar

01-23-2007, 11:53

Alright I've been thinking about this for a while now and I'm pretty sure the Graffiti messages from the mafia name one of their own Husar. I know this seems a little odd at first, but think about it. It would be ingenious to name one of your mafia members in their Graffiti. Once the townies figured out which one's were mafia and which were Mason's then that would put the town off of Husar and make them think he was innocent. But then why wouldn't the mafia kill him then if they've already pretty much confirmed his innocent? Well he's one of their own of course. Really Disco did you think no one would catch that?
Pffft, I expected to get lynched because of those messages, it's not my fault that almost noone voted for me earlier and it's no wonder that disco didn't have me killed earlier since it was to be expected that someone like you would come up with this again, having a highly suspect townie in the endgame is really good for mafiosi. And while I'm at it, weren't you the first one who jumped on it and wanted me lynched?:inquisitive:

Big talk from a lynched person. Being lynched and all, you're in no position to name who is guilty/innocent.
Isn't it cute how he "defends" me with a seemingly neutral post?
A very clever way to defend his fellow mafioso, or get a townie lynched...

I'm basing all my decisions and suspicions on the assumption that GH is guilty. Of all the players left, you were one of the few who did not side against him. Overall you've avoided taking sides until a strong support for something has become apparent. Anyway got to go back to class now.
Well, the masons and Sigurd lied a lot this game(I'm repeating myself) and that confused me quite a bit(like I said before and with almost every Abstain-vote I made). You might want to say I'm overrating it, but isn't it usually the mafia which puts up a network of lies in this game?
If Sasaki hadn't indirectly said that the masons were masons, I would still find them highly suspicious.
And who tells me that Ichigo and Sigurd were really on the masons side? Who tells me that all the lies have come to light yet?

Now the important question is who to lynch?
So far, as the Duck said, I have been abstaining a lot and effectively voted only once(for doc_bean) but I think it's time to get voting now.
AggonyDuck seems to not try to escape discussion while Xiahou, after receiving two votes, didn't react a bit and thus tried to stay under the radar I believe.
Trying to hide in the endgame is a bit suspicious, thus:

Unvote: AggonyDuck
Vote: Xiahou

Husar

01-23-2007, 18:08

Hey, it's six hours since my last post, I was expecting some responses.:furious3: :whip:

Xiahou

01-23-2007, 19:07

Now the important question is who to lynch?
So far, as the Duck said, I have been abstaining a lot and effectively voted only once(for doc_bean) but I think it's time to get voting now.
AggonyDuck seems to not try to escape discussion while Xiahou, after receiving two votes, didn't react a bit and thus tried to stay under the radar I believe.
Trying to hide in the endgame is a bit suspicious, thus:

Unvote: AggonyDuck
Vote: XiahouI wasn't particularly concerned about 2 votes when we were 1 vote away from a lynch on Seamus. However, now I see that voting is going all over the place now. What's changed?

If someone knows Seamus to be innocent, please share it with us- otherwise, my vote has to stay. IMO, he's giving off an all too similar vibe to that of his last mafia role. I know myself to be innocent and am all but certain of Redleg's innocence... and to a lesser extent, Ituralde. Unfortunately, that leaves far too many suspicious characters around with too few rounds left to get to the bottom of it. I'm still not sure what to make of GH's slightly ham-handed defense of Husar either... misdirection? a misguided attempt to help an ally?

If the rest of the town wants to lynch the only person to have definitively caught a mafioso, that's their business- but I don't know that we have enough time remaining for such nonsense. Personally, I think that Seamus is still our best bet- although Husar's behavior might run him a close second.

Ituralde

01-23-2007, 19:14

Seamus and Husar are also my favourites right now. :beam:

discovery1

01-23-2007, 19:28

DAMN IT!

I work up late so I only could take a shower now. Now I have to go eat and get to my next class...

VOTE: AERO ROCKS!

lalalalala

Husar

01-23-2007, 19:47

Seamus and Husar are also my favourites right now. :beam:
I feel honoured.:bow:
But your return on voting for me may be a bit disappointing except if you're a mafioso.
Now that Xiahou talked a bit, I could switch to Seamus and if that doesn't work out right, you guys can lynch me, if that doesn't work out right, well, then you're screwed.:2thumbsup: (and I know how the second of those lynching will turn out...)

Ok, now that we have a plan:

Unvote: Xiahou
Vote: Seamus Fermanagh

Though that sounds like a very...obvious choice of mafiosi but the town wants to see the usual suspects lynched, this time I shall play along...

AggonyDuck

01-23-2007, 20:10

Okay, I agree. Lets get Seamus and see what happens.

Unvote: Husar
Vote: Seamus

Seamus Fermanagh

01-23-2007, 20:17

Fair enough. Things need to keep moving forward.

Unvote; Vote:Seamus

X-man, you read about the same as always to me these last few posts. If you're scamming me, kudos to you.

Csargo

01-23-2007, 20:56

Pffft, I expected to get lynched because of those messages, it's not my fault that almost noone voted for me earlier and it's no wonder that disco didn't have me killed earlier since it was to be expected that someone like you would come up with this again, having a highly suspect townie in the endgame is really good for mafiosi. And while I'm at it, weren't you the first one who jumped on it and wanted me lynched?:inquisitive:

Isn't it cute how he "defends" me with a seemingly neutral post?
A very clever way to defend his fellow mafioso, or get a townie lynched...

Well, the masons and Sigurd lied a lot this game(I'm repeating myself) and that confused me quite a bit(like I said before and with almost every Abstain-vote I made). You might want to say I'm overrating it, but isn't it usually the mafia which puts up a network of lies in this game?
If Sasaki hadn't indirectly said that the masons were masons, I would still find them highly suspicious.
And who tells me that Ichigo and Sigurd were really on the masons side? Who tells me that all the lies have come to light yet?

Now the important question is who to lynch?
So far, as the Duck said, I have been abstaining a lot and effectively voted only once(for doc_bean) but I think it's time to get voting now.
AggonyDuck seems to not try to escape discussion while Xiahou, after receiving two votes, didn't react a bit and thus tried to stay under the radar I believe.
Trying to hide in the endgame is a bit suspicious, thus:

Unvote: AggonyDuck
Vote: Xiahou

Yeah you also kept saying that you expected to be killed by Disco which has yet to happen which is highly suspicious because if you were really innocent(which I highly doubt) then you would have been dead after the soothsayer asked his question. But if you weren't innocent then that would give you a alibi. I can't be sure about anything in this game until the end, but your looking pretty guilty to me. Especially with your jump voting you've voted for almost everyone that is alive this round! I think you've voted for more people in this round then the entire game.

I doubt Seamus is guilty because of his recent vote on himself and the fact that his posting habits seemed to have changed drastically from Mafia V. That maybe because of his game, but he tried to stay close to his old posting habits in Mafia V when he was mafia.

AggonyDuck

01-23-2007, 21:07

Damn, this is confusing. Now I again feel like changing back to Husar, but Seamus just put the deciding vote on himself, so too late for that. :wall:

discovery1

01-23-2007, 21:14

No one else thinks aero rocks?

:(

Csargo

01-23-2007, 21:27

No one else thinks aero rocks?

:(

No one cares.

discovery1

01-23-2007, 21:44

No one cares.

~:mecry: ~:mecry:

I need to brush my teeth....

Husar

01-23-2007, 22:32

Especially with your jump voting you've voted for almost everyone that is alive this round! I think you've voted for more people in this round then the entire game.
I've said so myself repeatedly, why do I feel like you want me to say it yet again?:dizzy2:

@Disco: What Aero? Aero Glass? Aero Glass is cool. As a nick it's not bad either.

Sasaki Kojiro

01-23-2007, 22:54

Seamus has been lynched.

Seamus 5 (Ituralde,Xiahou,Husar,AggonyDuck,Seamus)
Xiahou 1 (doc_bean)
AggonyDuck 1 (Redleg)

***

Killed (9):

Caius Flaminius
Kagemusha
Sigurd Fafnesbane
Warluster
Masy
Don Corleone
Sir Boo
Jimbob
pevergreen

Lynched(6):
Reenk Roink
GeneralHankerchief
Dutch_guy
Kommodus
Ichigo
Seamus Fermanagh

WoG(5):
Divine Wind
Proletariat
Ultrawar
Peasant Phill
Sir Moody

Alive: (7):

discovery1
Xiahou
AggonyDuck
Ituralde
Husar
doc_bean
Redleg

pm's due by midnight tomorrow

AggonyDuck

01-23-2007, 23:16

Looks, like we still have someone left to lynch. Atleast we will have one less option for the next lynch.

Husar

01-24-2007, 00:05

Atleast we will have one less option for the next lynch.
How relieving.:sweatdrop:

Csargo

01-24-2007, 00:07

I've said so myself repeatedly, why do I feel like you want me to say it yet again?:dizzy2:

@Disco: What Aero? Aero Glass? Aero Glass is cool. As a nick it's not bad either.

That's nice.

AggonyDuck

01-24-2007, 02:12

How relieving.:sweatdrop:

The not so relieving part about it is that it will be our last chance to get it right.

:help:

Csargo

01-24-2007, 02:38

Well we have two chances if we've atleast gotten one mafia if not then were screwed.

Husar

01-24-2007, 09:52

Well we have two chances if we've atleast gotten one mafia if not then were screwed.
Exactly.
Makes me speculate whether the Duck has some insider info that we don't have?:inquisitive:

AggonyDuck

01-24-2007, 11:03

Simple maths dear friends. We will be six for the next lynch. After the lynch we will be down to five and if we fail to lynch the mafioso, we will be down to four guys due to the kill. If that situation arises we will have two villagers and disco+remaining mafioso. That means that we will have a natural tie and afaik the usually the mafia wins in such situations. That means that we have one lynching opportunity after the coming kill or we can choose to No Lynch now and get the lynch situation later on with only four options. That would mean that we have a 20% chance of lynching the mafioso this round and a 25% chance if we save up our lynching opportunity.

If I've misunderstood this, then I ask Sasaki to correct me.

Husar

01-24-2007, 14:10

Csargo

01-24-2007, 21:07

Csargo

01-25-2007, 02:16

Sasaki post the kills already!! please.

Seamus Fermanagh

01-25-2007, 05:13

"kills"

If you're correct in that plural you naughty little fellow, then this town is T-O-A-S-T.

Csargo

01-25-2007, 05:16

"kills"

If you're correct in that plural you naughty little fellow, then this town is T-O-A-S-T.

Heat of the moment thing. I know there's only going to be one kill cause GH admitted to me in the chat that he was mafia.

Sasaki Kojiro

01-25-2007, 05:38

By the time darkness fell, Redleg was safely at home with all the doors and windows locked. The town's population was declining rapidly and there was no way he was going to be caught outside after dark. After retrieving and loading his trusty shotgun, Redleg settled into his easy chair for what was promising to be an all-night vigil... However, as Redleg leaned into his chair he was suprised to hear a loud drawn out raspberry eminating from underneath him. Startled, he quickly jumped up and removed the seat cushion, revealing what looked like an enormous whoopie cushion. His confusion quickly turned to alarm when he recognized the faint scent of almonds that was now in the air. Horrified, Redleg grabbed his shotgun and ran for his front door.

Already beginning to feel dizzy and breathless from the effects of the cyanide gas, he flung open the door and ran outside desperate for fresh air. In his panicked state, he didn't even notice the jump rope tied tightly across the bottom of his doorway. Redleg stumbled and fell hard on the sidewalk, his shotgun landing a few feet in front of him. With his vision beginning to blur, he stretched out an arm to reach for his weapon only to have his hand promptly stepped on by a foot shod in a giant red clown shoe. Immediately after this, he was kicked hard in the head by what he could only assume was the assailant's other foot.

The last sound Redleg heard as he lost consciousness was that of a horn... *honka!*honka!*

Redleg's body was found the next morning in a dumpster, his hands bound behind him with a jumprope and a whoopie cushion crammed into his mouth.

***

Killed (10):

Caius Flaminius
Kagemusha
Sigurd Fafnesbane
Warluster
Masy
Don Corleone
Sir Boo
Jimbob
pevergreen
Redleg

Lynched(6):
Reenk Roink
GeneralHankerchief
Dutch_guy
Kommodus
Ichigo
Seamus Fermanagh

WoG(5):
Divine Wind
Proletariat
Ultrawar
Peasant Phill
Sir Moody

Alive: (6):

discovery1
Xiahou
AggonyDuck
Ituralde
Husar
doc_bean

With 6 alive, it's 4 to lynch. As soon as the 4th vote on someone is cast, the game is over, even if someone unvotes afterwards. You may not vote for no lynch this round.

Csargo

01-25-2007, 06:40

I'm pretty sure of Husar's guilt and I hope you all are also. Though you can choose not to take my advice I strongly advise you to lynch Husar.

Redleg

01-25-2007, 07:23

What a shame, only lived to vote once. Oh well

Sigurd

01-25-2007, 09:53

Well well, townies… It seems I have at least been wrong about one of the players I have been pushing towards the gallows. Worst case scenario is two Mafiosi left and that will spell VICTORY to the Mafia. Alas, no mafia is here to gloat so I believe there is still one chance to win this for the townies.

One thing has been buggering me a little and that is:

If the rest of the town wants to lynch the only person to have definitively caught a mafioso, that's their business- but I don't know that we have enough time remaining for such nonsense. Personally, I think that Seamus is still our best bet- although Husar's behavior might run him a close second.

Now this seems to me like a cooked up alibi. He claims to be the only one who caught GH’s “mistake”… but there were many more of the players in this game there catching the same mistake and voiced it too. But as me and Husar have found out we can’t recreate that quit event. The only way is if we write a quit message. This could be the case here; a sacrifice of one of their own to establish an alibi for a later time. A time such as this.

Now the removal of Redleg was a good move as he was probably the least suspicious here. AggonyDuck is playing the typical townie role and it might as well be a cover for a more sinister role. He has the experience to pull this off. I was his Godfather in an earlier game and he is acting very similar, always eager to listen to advice as long as they draw away any suspicion from him.

Husar is acting the same way as he did in the endgame of GF2… trying to stay a little suspicious to keep from getting nailed by the mafia and ensuring that a more suspicious player stays ahead of him on the voting tally. This round he would be the most suspicious… let’s see what he will do.

doc_bean has been lurking a lot in this game… with only 3 more posts than Ignoramus tells a tale of not being too involved in this game. If he is not Mafiosi… the town will need his vote. Maybe he is the wild card… the one that the mafia keeps under the radar?

Ituralde is the Soothsayer… but he wasted his question on the obvious. As we were told by Sasaki… the mafia were picked before the soothsayer was chosen. There is a remote chance that Ituralde already was in the mafia gang when getting his pm from Sasaki.

Discovery1… sits on the key to all this.
It is he who chose the mafia in this game. Considering the problems I faced when having henchmen in other timezones when I was GF, I would think that he has chosen his henchmen close to him… GH, Kommodus and Seamus are all Americans are they not?
Doc_bean is Belgian, Husar and Ituralde are German and Aggony is Finnish.
That leaves only Xiahou… I am thinking American, but I can’t be sure.
Would Discovery1 be as the stereotype American and only play with fellow Americans?

I leave you to your voting villagers…

doc_bean

01-25-2007, 11:37

doc_bean has been lurking a lot in this game… with only 3 more posts than Ignoramus tells a tale of not being too involved in this game. If he is not Mafiosi… the town will need his vote. Maybe he is the wild card… the one that the mafia keeps under the radar?

I've already said I wasn't paying too much attention to this game (and apologized already), I'm in the middle of my mid terms and involved in the other mafia game (breaking my rule of never participating in two games at once, I swear I tried to resist... )

I find your time zone idea intriguing, it's definitely been a problem in other mafia games I've played. I'm naturally suspicious of Xiahou since he's the type that flies under the radar, even if he doesn't lurk. But then I don't have anything solid on him.

Husar has been accused since the start, but never lynched, could this have been a vital mistake ? It's rare that someone manages to survive suspicion that long. perhaps a few tactical kills and some strategic voting by his fellow mafiosi helped a bit ? Though lynching someone for surviving hardly seems like a good reason.

AgonnyDuck and Ithuralde then, also two people who don't tend to draw much suspicion. I don't have much on them.

This is a difficult choice, and I'd like to hear all your opinions before committing to a vote. :bow:

Ituralde

01-25-2007, 11:47

Beside from my own innocence I'm convinced of nothing in this game. Looking at the list of players that remain no one of them has acted outright suspicious making this a really difficult choice. Anyone of them could be a mafioso that has just hidden himself very well. I already applaud your playing skills, I don't know if I had managed to stay inconspicious for so long.

My sensible choice in this situation would be to vote Husar. It's just that when we consider this game in retrospective we would bite our own arses if Husar really turned out to be Mafia after all the clues handed to us. He has been alligning with discovery1 from the beginning. So either he was just fooling around acting on the Mafia graffitti or he just took the chance to play with our minds a little bit, making himself so obvious, that he can't possibly be Mafia.
So my main reason for lynching Husar is to not look dumb afterwards. :sweatdrop:

While not a very good reason I have even less on the other players. Maybe if I reread the entire thread once again I might come to different conclusions. Frankly, I can't find the time for that right now.

So my vote stays.

Vote: Husar

Husar

01-25-2007, 13:51

Quotation marathon:

I'm pretty sure of Husar's guilt and I hope you all are also. Though you can choose not to take my advice I strongly advise you to lynch Husar.
I'm also sure of my guilt which adds up to maybe 20% for acting so suspisious as to lead the town astray. I would have really accepted my lynch if I knew the others had another chance but as this is the last voting round, I can only advise to choose someone else, I'm just going to say that once and if you decide to lynch me still, well...

Now this seems to me like a cooked up alibi. He claims to be the only one who caught GH’s “mistake”… but there were many more of the players in this game there catching the same mistake and voiced it too. But as me and Husar have found out we can’t recreate that quit event. The only way is if we write a quit message. This could be the case here; a sacrifice of one of their own to establish an alibi for a later time. A time such as this.
You have a point there.
Just yesterday I was talking to Csar in the chat that I was positive about Xiahou being not guilty because he seemed to put forth "strong" evidence against GH but he may have done it to create an alibi. It might also explain why Gh repeatedly admitted to be a mafioso so that everyone shall know Xiahou was an opponent to a known mafioso...

Husar is acting the same way as he did in the endgame of GF2… trying to stay a little suspicious to keep from getting nailed by the mafia and ensuring that a more suspicious player stays ahead of him on the voting tally. This round he would be the most suspicious… let’s see what he will do.
You're right, I should change my profile a bit.
What I'm doing is this quotation mess in order to correct a bit of my wrongly established suspiciousness. We'll see what the others will do now.:juggle2:

Discovery1… sits on the key to all this.
It is he who chose the mafia in this game. Considering the problems I faced when having henchmen in other timezones when I was GF, I would think that he has chosen his henchmen close to him… GH, Kommodus and Seamus are all Americans are they not?
Doc_bean is Belgian, Husar and Ituralde are German and Aggony is Finnish.
That leaves only Xiahou… I am thinking American, but I can’t be sure.
Would Discovery1 be as the stereotype American and only play with fellow Americans?
Well, didn't think about the timezones before, since I often am in the chat when disco is, you might want to add me as a likely choice as well.
But also keep in mind that disco may be doing all the work on his own because that lowers the chances of one of his henchmen getting caught.

I find your time zone idea intriguing, it's definitely been a problem in other mafia games I've played. I'm naturally suspicious of Xiahou since he's the type that flies under the radar, even if he doesn't lurk. But then I don't have anything solid on him.
Agreed.

Husar has been accused since the start, but never lynched, could this have been a vital mistake ?
No.

It's rare that someone manages to survive suspicion that long.
Really?

perhaps a few tactical kills and some strategic voting by his fellow mafiosi helped a bit ? Though lynching someone for surviving hardly seems like a good reason.
Well, you might want to show some examples for thinking that supportive kills helped me stay alive. Apart from that, I wouldn't know of any fellow mafiosi.:sweatdrop:

This is a difficult choice, and I'd like to hear all your opinions before committing to a vote. :bow:
I agree and here is mine.:2thumbsup:

Beside from my own innocence I'm convinced of nothing in this game.
A classical sentence which I try to avoid myself since it is rather pointless and doesn't help anyone, does it?

[...]we would bite our own arses[...]
You can still do that after lynching me.:2thumbsup:

So my main reason for lynching Husar is to not look dumb afterwards. :sweatdrop:
Aha, makes me special in the sense that other people being mafiosi would not make you look dumb afterwards?

Maybe if I reread the entire thread once again I might come to different conclusions.
Maybe, maybe not.

Vote: Husar
I would applaud you now for consistency if this wasn't the last round and if I didn't know the outcome of this.

Now I'm going to wait for Csar to tell everyone how suspicious this post makes me with my pseudo-defense and intelligent mafia tricks.
Oh noes, repeating myself I think, over and out.:sweatdrop:

AggonyDuck

01-25-2007, 15:51

Sasaki, why can't we vote No Lynch?

discovery1

01-25-2007, 17:22

Sasaki, why can't we vote No Lynch?

Cuz I won't kill anyone if you do, getting you nowhere.

Sasaki Kojiro

01-25-2007, 17:23

And this game would last for all eternity.

Husar

01-25-2007, 17:39

Cuz I won't kill anyone if you do, getting you nowhere.
I knew it.:furious3:

Csargo

01-25-2007, 20:51

Quotation marathon:

I'm also sure of my guilt which adds up to maybe 20% for acting so suspisious as to lead the town astray. I would have really accepted my lynch if I knew the others had another chance but as this is the last voting round, I can only advise to choose someone else, I'm just going to say that once and if you decide to lynch me still, well...

You have a point there.
Just yesterday I was talking to Csar in the chat that I was positive about Xiahou being not guilty because he seemed to put forth "strong" evidence against GH but he may have done it to create an alibi. It might also explain why Gh repeatedly admitted to be a mafioso so that everyone shall know Xiahou was an opponent to a known mafioso...

You're right, I should change my profile a bit.
What I'm doing is this quotation mess in order to correct a bit of my wrongly established suspiciousness. We'll see what the others will do now.:juggle2:

Well, didn't think about the timezones before, since I often am in the chat when disco is, you might want to add me as a likely choice as well.
But also keep in mind that disco may be doing all the work on his own because that lowers the chances of one of his henchmen getting caught.

Agreed.

No.

Really?

Well, you might want to show some examples for thinking that supportive kills helped me stay alive. Apart from that, I wouldn't know of any fellow mafiosi.:sweatdrop:

I agree and here is mine.:2thumbsup:

A classical sentence which I try to avoid myself since it is rather pointless and doesn't help anyone, does it?

You can still do that after lynching me.:2thumbsup:

Aha, makes me special in the sense that other people being mafiosi would not make you look dumb afterwards?

Maybe, maybe not.

I would applaud you now for consistency if this wasn't the last round and if I didn't know the outcome of this.

Now I'm going to wait for Csar to tell everyone how suspicious this post makes me with my pseudo-defense and intelligent mafia tricks.
Oh noes, repeating myself I think, over and out.:sweatdrop:

No I won't I'm just waiting to see the outcome of this game.

While Sigurd brings up a valid point about the same timezone's thing there is one flaw if it is true. If Disco really is sending in all the kills to Sasaki then there wouldn't really be a need to keep in contact with your mafioso besides to tell them who you plan on killing. So it would be less likely for them to get caught PMing each other.

GH said the chat incident was a noob mistake on his part, but if this was really all a ploy then I think we've already lost and there is not way to win at this point. Sad really I was hoping this would turn out a Townie win.

Xiahou

01-25-2007, 21:23

Now this seems to me like a cooked up alibi. He claims to be the only one who caught GH’s “mistake”… but there were many more of the players in this game there catching the same mistake and voiced it too. But as me and Husar have found out we can’t recreate that quit event. The only way is if we write a quit message. This could be the case here; a sacrifice of one of their own to establish an alibi for a later time. A time such as this. I wasn't claiming that I was the only one to catch his mistake- I'm claiming that I was the one who got him lynched for it.

Husar is acting the same way as he did in the endgame of GF2… trying to stay a little suspicious to keep from getting nailed by the mafia and ensuring that a more suspicious player stays ahead of him on the voting tally. This round he would be the most suspicious… let’s see what he will do.

doc_bean has been lurking a lot in this game… with only 3 more posts than Ignoramus tells a tale of not being too involved in this game. If he is not Mafiosi… the town will need his vote. Maybe he is the wild card… the one that the mafia keeps under the radar?

Ituralde is the Soothsayer… but he wasted his question on the obvious. As we were told by Sasaki… the mafia were picked before the soothsayer was chosen. There is a remote chance that Ituralde already was in the mafia gang when getting his pm from Sasaki. ATM, Husar and Doc are still my most suspicious characters. Husar could be trying the 'hiding in plain sight' tactic- looking suspicious while staying very vocal and very active. He's been under suspicion almost the entire game, yet here he still is. Doc, is suspicious primarily for his lurker status- he claims to have an excuse for it, but how are we to know?

That leaves only Xiahou… I am thinking American, but I can’t be sure.
Would Discovery1 be as the stereotype American and only play with fellow Americans? I'm American, but I'm pretty sure disco lives on the other side of the country from me. Not that it matters- I'm not working for him.

Sigurd

01-25-2007, 21:29

Be mindful when placing a vote this round. It only takes 4 to lynch… Remember there are two Mafiosi left in this game; Discovery1 and our unknown Mafioso.
It only takes two townies voting for the wrong person to end this game as Discovery and his henchman will surely bandwagon and end this.

I propose a serious discussion between the remaining players is in order before placing any votes. Use this advantage townies… there will be no lynching unless there is a majority of votes. You have the power to stall this… night will not come unless a lynch has taken place. The Devil is bound. Use it to root out the last Mafioso.

Husar

01-25-2007, 21:53

I propose a serious discussion between the remaining players is in order before placing any votes. Use this advantage townies… there will be no lynching unless there is a majority of votes. You have the power to stall this… night will not come unless a lynch has taken place. The Devil is bound. Use it to root out the last Mafioso.
Very nice speech, are you the corrupt politician?~;)
You're right of course, we shouldn't vote until we have slept at least 100 times over it.
This also gives doc_bean and Ituralde time to read the topic and give us their educated views on the matter at hand.:juggle2:

Csargo

01-25-2007, 22:07

*removed vote for disco--dead can't vote (sasaki)*

He's obviously guilty

AggonyDuck

01-25-2007, 22:39

I'm torn at the moment between the obvious choice of Husar andthe not so obvious other choices. Of the remaining players, he is the one who I find the most suspicious. In fact I have problems finding anything suspicious about the others, which might be a bit suspicious too when you think about it.

But I'm going to go with my suspicions. If I voted for the wrong guy, then I applaud the remaining mafioso, because he has completely avoided my suspicions. Thus:

Vote: Husar

doc_bean

01-25-2007, 22:39

Ugh, I just reread the entire thread and i'm not much wiser.

I *think* it's AggonyDuck based on his voting record (no lynch first round, bandwagoned at times, kept going after Seamus, perhaps trying not to offend too many other players ?)

AggonyDuck

01-25-2007, 22:43

Cuz I won't kill anyone if you do, getting you nowhere.

Isn't that actually a good thing for us? A mafia not killing anyone is the same as no mafia. You'd actually be forced to kill us to actually win the game, while an peaceful coexistence is nothing negative for the villagers.

AggonyDuck

01-25-2007, 22:50

Unvote: Husar
Vote: Abstain

I want to hold up with my vote a bit longer. Gonna check the thread...again...:book:

AggonyDuck

01-25-2007, 22:59

Something I noticed when re-reading the thread:

I took a leap of faith and had a go at following the mafias pattern - Dutch_Guy defended my brother while i defended someone newish(Itrulde) and Warluster protected a veteran(not sure who).

As we now know thanks to timmy this paid off someone tried to kill Itrulde and i blocked it - result only 1 death (kage)

The mafia tried to kill Ituralde, making him innocent. That cuts our options down a bit, which is atleast something.

discovery1

01-25-2007, 23:21

GO FASTER!

And I'm sure you want a never ending mafia game Duck.

Husar

01-26-2007, 00:35

Now:

Xiahou says it's me or doc.
doc_bean says it may be Duck.
Ituralde thinks it's me(voted already).
AggonyDuck excludes Ituralde(voted me but took it back).
Husar thinks it's one of the four above but would exclude Ituralde because he seemed to be the soothsayer and Duck raised a good defense.
discovery1 wants this to end and is definitely guilty.

Now I just realized that if disco and his mafioso had jumped onto those two votes, I would be dead already, except if either I or one of the two voting for me were mafiosi.
Does all that get us anywhere?

doc_bean

01-26-2007, 00:46

Csargo

01-26-2007, 04:18

Ah man when will this game end!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Xiahou

01-26-2007, 05:56

How did we end up with so many suspicious people left? :help:

I could see Husar, Doc, or AD as mafia and unsurprisingly, there's been scant little discussion. I've got to follow my gut and vote Husar- here's hoping I'm right. :sweatdrop:

vote: Husar

The more I look, the more it comes back to Husar- he's been playing through the game like he has a role to protect. We know who the soothsayer was, we know who the masons were... what's that leave?

discovery1

01-26-2007, 08:24

Vote Faster!!!!

doc_bean

01-26-2007, 11:35

vote: AggonyDuck

Sigurd

01-26-2007, 11:42

Hold your horses on:

I took a leap of faith and had a go at following the mafias pattern - Dutch_Guy defended my brother while i defended someone newish(Itrulde) and Warluster protected a veteran(not sure who).
As we now know thanks to timmy this paid off someone tried to kill Itrulde and i blocked it - result only 1 death (kage)

Sir Moody is merely making a guess here. Who is to say that Ituralde was the one attacked in that round?
True Little Timmy had sent a note to a possible Mafioso about Ituralde, but it has been disputed how that mechanic works. It was Ichigo who got the note with Ituralde on it.
It could very well be Sir Boo or that other “veteran” who was attacked and was saved by the masons.

I also note that Husar has received 2 votes but not another 2 quick ones from the mafia.
I see two possibilities from this:
Either Xiahou missed the unvote from Aggony and thought that Discovery1 would follow up with a quick finish.
OR
Husar is our last Mafioso and hence the mafia is waiting for another Bandwagon.

Husar

01-26-2007, 12:11

Either Xiahou missed the unvote from Aggony and thought that Discovery1 would follow up with a quick finish.
OR
Husar is our last Mafioso and hence the mafia is waiting for another Bandwagon.
OR
AggonyDuck hasn't been here since Xiahou voted and will jump onto it once he comes
OR
Ituralde is the mafioso for some weird reason.

But I already see this as a townie loss with my death.

And for the little hope there is:
I don't think Xiahou missed anything because he tried to give a reason for his vote, if he thought disco would finish me off anyway, he could have just voted, especially at a time where we europeans are asleep.

doc_bean strengthens my believe a bit that the duck may well be responsible for this.
Duck joined Ituralde, maybe in an attempt to get another townie to join in, then took back the vote to not look like he was defending a lost cause.
OR doc_bean is waiting for disco to come back and will then suddenly switch his vote over to me.

I don't believe it's Ituralde or Xiahou but I don't want to take chances yet so I will not vote for the Duck yet.

Ituralde

01-26-2007, 12:13

Having read all posts so far, my vote stays. I'm not yet fully convinced of Husars guilt, but for me he's the most suspicious.
And as stated before I'd rather lose to a Mafia that hides cunningly than to one that tries to hide in plain sight.

Edit: Posted at the same time as Husar. Really all those possibilities remain. For me this game has turned into a Lottery and I've placed my bet.

doc_bean

01-26-2007, 12:28

OR doc_bean is waiting for disco to come back and will then suddenly switch his vote over to me.

I think i could have done that last night if I had wanted to. I feel that either AggonyDuck or Ithuralde wanted a bandwagon against you. So for now Xiahou is off the hook, at least for me.

I don't believe it's Ituralde or Xiahou but I don't want to take chances yet so I will not vote for the Duck yet.

Well, AgonnyDuck and Discovery had a little debate going this last day, but that could have been done to throw us off. Ithurlade started the whole *won't we feel dumb if Husar really was mafia* thing, now that's a very good attempt at starting a bandwagon, I felt tempted to jump.

ARGH!!!

AggonyDuck

01-26-2007, 12:47

Well as you may all have noticed I went to bed after my last vote; before it I did read the thread, but I didn't get any smarter from it. As to why I withdrew my vote; I wanted to get time for more discussion and thinking.

I'm going to have to assume that GH was guilty. That excludes Xiahou from my suspects list. Also Ituralde was the target of an attempted murder, excluding him.

That leaves me with two options, Doc or Husar. Of the two, Husar has been the more active and also the more suspicious one. Doc again has managed to play through the game with lots of lurking. Both have played with two very different styles and thus makes comparison bloody hard. But I'm going to go with my suspicions, choose Husar and hope that I've made the right decision.

Vote: Husar

Husar

01-26-2007, 13:17

DISCO!
Finish it!
Well, he may be asleep...

Vote: Ituralde

Wouldn't it be a bit weird if Duck gave such a long reasoning if he knew Disco will come and finish me anyway?
Ituralde is also a bit insisting on this. only doc or disco to finish it now, I can only hold my breath concerning doc, then again, it's about the whole town, not me alone...

Oh and with Ituralde insisting on a vote he is blocking the process a little bit becauseif he is a townie and say, Duck is a mafioso, we cannot win as long as he insists on his vote, I would see that as a bit counter-productive. You might want to count into that that he would prefer to lose to a mafioso who hid well.:dizzy2: Maybe he was hiding well.
It's a good thing that disco is sleeping though...

Ituralde

01-26-2007, 13:55

Nah... I just want this game to be over, one way or another. We could talk for ages and hope for a slip-up from some Mafioso but that's a rather poor strategy. So I've placed my bet and no one has yet convinced me of anything else.
Someone amongst us is lying, and so far has lied well. I see no angle of attack for me, so I have essentially given up and tried my best educated guess.

doc_bean

01-26-2007, 13:55

Wouldn't it be a bit weird if Duck gave such a long reasoning if he knew Disco will come and finish me anyway?
Ituralde is also a bit insisting on this. only doc or disco to finish it now, I can only hold my breath concerning doc, then again, it's about the whole town, not me alone...

I have no reason to finish it now, Disco can kill you if he wants, if he skips the opportunity that means you're probably mafia, and I'll just finsih you off tomorrow.

discovery1

01-26-2007, 16:18

Let's end this shall we?

Vote: Husar

Since I clearly can't stop you from killing my guy I might as well bandwagon.

doc_bean

01-26-2007, 16:26

Well, I guess it's over then.

Husar

01-26-2007, 17:49

Yes, and I'm not his guy, btw.

doc_bean

01-26-2007, 17:51

Currently I suspect it's Ituralde, but voting for him wouldn't have made a difference.

AggonyDuck

01-26-2007, 18:03

In that case it was either Xiahou or Ituralde, both whom I excluded as possible suspects.:shame:

Kommodus

01-26-2007, 18:19

I have no reason to finish it now, Disco can kill you if he wants, if he skips the opportunity that means you're probably mafia, and I'll just finsih you off tomorrow.

:wall:

"Let's throw her into the pond - if she floats it means she's a witch!"

I wish I'd have paid attention to the end of this game... :shame:

Sasaki Kojiro

01-26-2007, 18:21

Husar has been lynched. As the townies stand around the courthouse wondering about their fate, they notice that Xiahou is crouched behind one of the pillars. They have only a few seconds to wonder why before a black mercedes drives by and AggonyDuck, Ituralde, and doce_bean and killed in a rain of bullets from the discovery1's tommy gun.

Killed (13):

Caius Flaminius
Kagemusha
Sigurd Fafnesbane
Warluster-Mason/doctor
Masy
Don Corleone-Amnesiac roleblocker
Sir Boo
Jimbob-little timmy
pevergreen
Redleg
AggonyDuck
Ituralde-Soothsayer
doc_bean

Lynched(7):
Reenk Roink
GeneralHankerchief-Mafioso
Dutch_guy-Mason/doctor
Kommodus-Mafioso
Ichigo
Seamus Fermanagh
Husar

WoG(5):
Divine Wind
Proletariat
Ultrawar
Peasant Phill
Sir Moody-Mason/doctor

Alive: (2):

discovery1-Godfather
Xiahou-Mafia Roleblocker

Mafia Win!

Good game everybody. Write up to follow.

doc_bean

01-26-2007, 18:22

:wall:

"Let's throw her into the pond - if she floats it means she's a witch!"

I wish I'd have paid attention to the end of this game... :shame:

Err...Kommodus, honey, there wasn't anything *I* could do about it at this point, except hope someone else would withdraw their vote.

GeneralHankerchief

01-26-2007, 18:22

Ah, that was satisfying. More than makes up for Godfather 2.

:evil:

Sasaki Kojiro

01-26-2007, 18:23

An evil, sinister laugh is heard throughout the town with the fourth vote on Husar. Experts at vocal analysis place it as the late GeneralHankerchief's, but they are uncertain exactly why. Perhaps time will tell.

Perhaps time already has :bounce:

ninja edit!

GeneralHankerchief

01-26-2007, 18:24

Yeah, notice the edit.

Husar

01-26-2007, 18:45

Does roleblocker mean that the person could block someone else's role?

After talking to Sigurd this morning I was about to change my vote to Xiahous, but that hadn't really helped anyway, took four townies(or just all remining townies) to win this.

So, nicely done Disco!:2thumbsup:

Kommodus

01-26-2007, 18:45

Mafia Win!

Yay! Excellent game by my co-conspirators Xiahou, GeneralHankerchief, and discovery1! Xiahou in particular deserves a round of applause IMO.

:balloon2: :balloon2: :balloon2:

For all my skill as a townsperson, I clearly make a terrible mafioso. I made it pretty far in Mafia III simply because I was still unknown just enough to fly under the radar.

Disco picked me this time simply to disarm my method; I was apparently more useful to him as a dead mafioso than as an easy-lynch villager. We all thought in the beginning that I'd be the first to go, and I certainly would've been if not for the nastiness that took place with GeneralH in the chatroom.

Everyone can now enjoy a hearty laugh at the expense of me and my suspicious posts and feeble arguments! :laugh4: :laugh4: :laugh4:

Now back to being a simple townsperson, which I much prefer. Disco, I'm honored that you chose me, but I still wish you hadn't. Your selections were so obvious that GeneralH and I were suspected from the first turn. :no:

Good game to all! Sir Moody and the masonic crew: you sure pwn'd me! Did I make it too easy for you? You also did a fine job of blocking our kills for a long time. GeneralH and Xiahou: your fine strategy paid off in the end, delivering victory to the team!

Have a nice day, and happy mafia-ing! :2thumbsup:

Sasaki Kojiro

01-26-2007, 18:45

Ah, well this was an interesting game. With three hand picked mafia I knew the town would have a hard time, but I don't like detectives much, the town tends to rely on them too much. So I included a soothsayer role instead. Masons with out roles aren't very useful so I gave them all doctor ability, figuring they could save a few lives (they saved masy one round). I gave xiahou roleblocker ability to prevent Ituralde or anyone from claiming and asking to be protected. Don C was the amnesiac roleblocker, in his pm he was told he had a role but had forgotten what it was. He sent me names and I responded with "yes" if he blocked someone and "no" if he didn't. He blocked sir moody one round and prevented a kill from GH one round. He probably would have been able to figure out what had happened and that GH was guilty, but he died that round I think and GH was revealed with the chat error. Jimbob had a semi-information finding ability. It was made rather weak by the way the mafia kills were done though. He sent it to kommodus once but kommo just had X and GH send in the kills. If he had sent it to X when X was the only one left he could have learned something though.

The mafia started off doing really well. The town was completely confused by the the graffiti messages (which were rather slanted in favor of the mafia to be honest, given that the masons had no detective roles) and there were several no lynches. Then GH got caught in the chatroom (apparently he meant to type /leave Lenin to leave private chat but typed /quit lenin instead). They immediately figured out it would be a good idea to have Xiahou post an incriminating screenshot. This "proof" of Xiahou's innocence and the early graffiti messages naming Husar are what eventually won the game for them. Kommodus went down soon after, when it was pointed out he would be a good choice for mafioso and he roleclaimed a little hastily. Besides the GH chat thing, I think the biggest mistake the mafia made was in killing off Sigurd, he was a thorn in their side the rest of the game. Xiahou slipped quietly under the radar though, and won the game in the end.