Will cutting out client rulers make the game more stable?

I'm just about to re-install the game after hitting another fatal CTD related to AI faction client ruler-clones. So my question is simple; if I remove all the parts of the script relating to client rulers, as per that thread in the mods subfolder, am I less likely to get bugs?

The major game-killing one is related to AI faction FMs with the same name as their client rulers and generals, being adopted, I think. Manifests itself as a banner-less stack that vanishes when you mouseover it, and if you attack it CTDs come.

There's also some strangeness going on with capitals becoming bugged such that you get CTDs if you try to look in them, which is irrecoverable.

Will getting rid of client rulers reduce the likelihood of these ones? Much as I do love them, I'd rather have a game that doesn't require regular restarts because of whatever's going wrong with them.

Will I still be able to recruit generals with a top-tier regional barracks without the client ruler script, or are they part of it too?

I want to test that myself. I had 3 clones this last time :clown: then the loading CTD upon reloading the save.

I am pretty sure it won't get rid of random RTW hardcoded weirdness, but that isn't the same as some of this stuff.

Indeed, we can't do anything about RTW-related weirdness, but I figure all the stuff attached to client rulers can be resolved. There was a thread on it, which eventually evolved into the optimised script, which was a less severe method of doing it.

Seems simple enough to do; literally delete that entire section, and modify one line in the EDCT around interlopers.

Is it really that simple?

Can I still recruit generals?

yes, recruitable mercenary generals are unrelated.. and in-fact can somewhat make up for any loss of the client rulers, imo. I am thinking i won't remove 'interloper' because that sort of signifies that a local ruler is there who you can't control directly, so you should have a garrison or whatnot, and you can't put your own people to govern without pissing off the people... pretty cool in theory

I thought the AI couldn't get client rulers because the script automatically placed the best government possible in AI Provinces, which is always a type 3?

Eh, no. In fact you can obtain client rulers throught bribing Eleutheroi settlements. Which, talking about my own Casse save, I'm pretty sure the Romans must've done with ... Bononia! :inquisitive: (Found an Amicvs Popvlvs Romanvs (as opposed to Provincia), as well as some characters called "Sextvs" which is the name of the Bononia-Client.)

What actually causes the client ruler crash? is it because a client ruler is generated with the same internal name as a proper family member?

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Originally Posted by Spizania

What actually causes the client ruler crash? is it because a client ruler is generated with the same internal name as a proper family member?

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We don't know. The idea is that when client rulers are married/adopted into the family tree, the game runs amok. The client ruler is "cloned", where one unit will have his old bodyguard (e.g. Babylonian spearmen) and the other will have his new one, conform to the regular bodyguards of the faction (e.g. Hetairoi). Now when this cloning happens, it may be fine, or it may not. Crashes may occur at any time with this stack.

That's what I know of it, which isn't very much.

Cant we have a trait which makes it impossible for him to get married or be adopted? :inquisitive:

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Originally Posted by Spizania

Cant we have a trait which makes it impossible for him to get married or be adopted?

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No, that's not possible.

Contrary to the above- the answer is an emphatic YES.

I deleted the entire client ruler script when I installed EB on the 30th of April and have been playing without a single ctd since then. However I must state at this point that manually deleting the script took me upwards of 2 hours- the sheer magnitude of the script is amazing, of your 12mb scripts file nearly 6mb or 50% is the client script: a sure recipe for carpal tunnel syndrome when deleting.
:laugh4:

Also since I have no use for type 4 gov, I modded the gov+mic system as the following:
gov1: native5 + regional3
gov2: native4 + regional4
gov3: native3 + regional5.

This was done on a version of EB that was then heavily modded, including new units, new ZOR, the usuals as one might say with no decrease in stability.

Though I might add that I was heavily impressed by the coding used in the client script and intend to create faction specific client ruler scripts- i.e 20 seperate scripts in which on installing the client ruler will be spawned with a garrison.


Eh, no. In fact you can obtain client rulers throught bribing Eleutheroi settlements. Which, talking about my own Casse save, I'm pretty sure the Romans must've done with ... Bononia! (Found an Amicvs Popvlvs Romanvs (as opposed to Provincia), as well as some characters called "Sextvs" which is the name of the Bononia-Client.)

Yes that is true only in case of the AI, in case of the human player the building of the provisional govt kills off all such bribed client rulers.

Furthermore it is of interest that bribed eleutheretoi generals(not client rulers) retain their command star bonus against the AI.

Took me about two minutes to delete the client ruler script; between line 175 and line 175000-ish, between the two commented titles. All I did was put the cursor at the top of the section, scroll down the sidebar with my mouse til I got to the bottom of the section, held down shift, clicked and pressed backspace. All gone.

I haven't altered the EDCT to remove the Interloper trait, because that looked far too involved and prone to human error (as in me making a mistake).

But so far things are not only faster (I can't see how even the super-optimised client ruler script can be faster than it not being there at all), but I've not had a single CTD in 80 turns so far. Touch wood.

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Originally Posted by amritochates

Contrary to the above- the answer is an emphatic YES.

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Contrary to what? Nobody claimed you couldn't delete it. In fact, several months ago, we released a version of the EB script with the client ruler script removed to speed things up for people with slow machines. I'm sort of surprised this thread even exists.

All I did was put the cursor at the top of the section, scroll down the sidebar with my mouse til I got to the bottom of the section, held down shift, clicked and pressed backspace

Thats fantastic- I never knew that, I deleted the bloody thing by highlighting the first line with my mouse and then continuing down till my wrist gave way, thats why it took me all that time.

Well you learn something new everyday.


Contrary to what? Nobody claimed you couldn't delete it. Poetic license :2thumbsup:

needed a snazzy sentence to start up my post, also which version are you talking about, the only version I knew that exists is one for 1.0 that was then not updated.

This is the one I am talking about:
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=96967

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Originally Posted by Atilius

Contrary to what? Nobody claimed you couldn't delete it. In fact, several months ago, we released a version of the EB script with the client ruler script removed to speed things up for people with slow machines. I'm sort of surprised this thread even exists.

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It's not asking whether it'll be faster, that's a given. I was asking whether the game will be more stable, ie have fewer CTDs and other issues like clones.

Yes. But the initial client rulers will still crash the game if they become cloned through adoption/marriage.

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Originally Posted by bovi

Yes. But the initial client rulers will still crash the game if they become cloned through adoption/marriage.

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They don't live longer than 40 years from the game's start do they? I ask because I've just passed 232BC seemingly without any clones appearing.

That's right, if you've got past that you should be safe. Then again, "should be" and "are" are not the same.

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Originally Posted by bovi

That's right, if you've got past that you should be safe. Then again, "should be" and "are" are not the same.

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Granted. :laugh4:

225BC in my game, and still no fatal errors of any description, or even more than a handful of CTDs in total.

looks like the republic can't trust in client rulers nor those mercenary generals anymore....:shifty:

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Originally Posted by ||Lz3||

looks like the republic can't trust in client rulers nor those mercenary generals anymore....:shifty:

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Merc generals you can still recruit with a tier 5 regional barracks, but that might mean a turn or two with a type IV government in place and no governor, or Interloping.

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Originally Posted by bovi

Yes. But the initial client rulers will still crash the game if they become cloned through adoption/marriage.

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Searching and removing the "Type4Governor" trait from descr_strat file will fix that.