STW corpses LBM file

I took a look at the deadpage.lbm file in Shogun with Ultimate Paint, and it certainly would be nice to use those corpses in STWmod, but Shogun doesn't have the deadpagecoord.txt file used in MTW/VI. The coord file which seems to be an index into the lbm file is quite complex with 4 lines of 6 numbers for each corpse, so I don't think a trial and error method would work to figure this out. The 4 lines might be 4 different orientations of the corpse, but I'm not sure. Transfering the corpse images into the main MTW/VI lbm also would be a problem because the STW corpses have a larger image size than MTW corpses. However, there is a smaller deadpage2.lbm which is the same size and has nearly the same layout as the deadpage2.lbm introduced in STW/MI which I'll try to utilize if I can figure out which deadpage coordinates access it.

Before I forget this idea I'll post it.
Yuuki, can we perhaps create a new deadpage.lbm which contains only the dead images of the units we use? And can we import those images from Shogun?

I'll put this on the todo list for beta_8.


R'as

Quote:

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Originally Posted by R'as al Ghul

Before I forget this idea I'll post it.
Yuuki, can we perhaps create a new deadpage.lbm which contains only the dead images of the units we use? And can we import those images from Shogun?

I'll put this on the todo list for beta_8.

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Yes we could use the STW deadpage.lbm, but we would have to figure out the indexing to each corpse image within that file, and make a new deadpagecoord.txt file. STW doesn't have a deadpagecoord.txt file.

Yuuki,

your inbox is full.

I dug up this old post by Wellington:
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showp...9&postcount=36

There should be all the info we need to make a new deadpage. It seems that the size of the lbm is not fixed. The coordinates can be adjusted. We'd have to create an lbm with all the "die" pics for our units and then adjust the coordinates.
Looks promising. :2thumbsup:
We'll probably end up with a "most beautiful dead" award. :laugh4:

R'as

Thanks R'as. I wasn't aware of that post by Wellington. It does explain how the system works, and I have Ultimate Paint which can handle LBM files. So we can certainly fix all the corpses to match the death animations and have them be the proper size as well. I don't plan on working on this until we have a couple of sets of maps (a small set and a large set) with which to play the campaign.

In the original game there were pools of blood with the dead bodies.
These went away at some point, most likely to allow sales to younger players.

I was just wondering if you remembered, and if you had considered replicating that early game?

Not that I am necessarily recommending the above, but somehow feel that something important was lost in the sanitizing.
So just thought I’d ask :book:

I agree Tomi and I also would like to see them back.
No need for discussion here, we're all adults.
(Besides, what's rated PG13 nowadays surely has more blood than STW?)

I just checked, the bif animation files we use now include the die animation + blood. I'll check this out at home again to see if there's a pool of blood around the dead. If we don't have that right now, I vote to put it back in, at least for the deadpage.

:bow:

Tomi, it seems we're wrong.

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In the original game there were pools of blood with the dead bodies.
These went away at some point, most likely to allow sales to younger players.

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I checked all deadpage files there are in Shogun and in Medieval.
All files have little pools of blood around the dead soldiers.
However, the Shogun corpses are slightly bigger, about 10 pixels in Height, depending on the perspective the body is shown in (4 each). Plus the Shogun corpses have a blood pool that is more star-shaped, while Medieval ones are oval and can be mistaken as Shadows. Also Shogun blood is more red than the Medieval one more brown.
Perhaps that's the reason why we thought there's no blood at all in Medieval?
Anyway, we'll do this right and import the corpses from Shogun, getting rid of all Medieval corpses. I need to figure out what size looks good and if they have to be scaled at all.

R'as

I'll pick this up later when more pressing issues have been solved.

:bow:

Original MTW deadpage: (256*256)

Resized STW corpses:

https://img267.imageshack.us/img267/4669/dead256gg7.gif https://img127.imageshack.us/img127/...ge4copycw3.jpg

Original size Shogun corpses from last animation frame: (512*512)

https://img127.imageshack.us/img127/...ge3copydv6.jpg

Edit: Explanation:

Okay, Ive been spending some time on the deadpage again.
I've figured out all the coordinates and stuff but ran into a problem.
Imho, the deadpage is the single most messed up part of MTW.
If you look at the pics above you'll realise that the original Shogun corpses are many times larger than what we have in MTW. They also look better.
If we want to implement them into MTW they need to be scaled down to fi the 256*256 deadpage. Not only that, but the original MTW deadpage is scaled up ingame by a factor of ca. 1.3. This scaling is hardcoded, meaning that our Shogun corpses need to be scaled down only to be scaled up again.
The second picture provides an impression on how far they'd need to be scaled down. To be honest, I don't think it's worth it because the original beauty is hardly recognisable anymore.
A dead No-Dachi in its original size measures ca. 106*36 pixels.
This image needs to be downscaled to 40*15.
Anyone who has worked with pics of this small size can tell that, no matter what algorithm you use to resize the image, it will loose detail. Add to that the fact that you need to fit everything into a colour table of 256 colours, of which 33 are fixed, you can imagine the loss in detail.

It's sad but I don't think we gain anything by making this change.
I don't see that new corpses could look much better than the old ones.
I would love to see the last animation frame as corpse but there seems no way of getting them as they are.

R'as

I hope it's ok for me to contribute something to this...

I managed to figure out the coords (x,y origin not so exact though) of the original STW Deadpage.lbm and I got them into the game. (I also edited fac-specific sashimono into the image, but I couldn't export it as an .lbm. Haven't figured out ultimate paint's palette system yet.) Anyway, when viewed in game, the dead bodies definitely look too big. I reckon they would need to be scaled down by about 30%.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by aokubi

I hope it's ok for me to contribute something to this...

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Please, you're always welcome to contribute.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by aokubi

I managed to figure out the coords (x,y origin not so exact though) of the original STW Deadpage.lbm and I got them into the game. (I also edited fac-specific sashimono into the image, but I couldn't export it as an .lbm. Haven't figured out ultimate paint's palette system yet.) Anyway, when viewed in game, the dead bodies definitely look too big. I reckon they would need to be scaled down by about 30%.

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Converting to LBM can be done with CA's bif buf utilities.
Editing in a sashimono would be nice, could you mail me your deadpage?
As said above the corpses in MTW's deadpage are being scaled up by a factor of 1.3 ingame that's why when you take the original STW corpses, they are to
big.

R'as

Quote:

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Originally Posted by R'as al Ghul

Please, you're always welcome to contribute.

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Thanks R'as,

[QUOTE=Converting to LBM can be done with CA's bif buf utilities.
Editing in a sashimono would be nice, could you mail me your deadpage?
As said above the corpses in MTW's deadpage are being scaled up by a factor of 1.3 ingame that's why when you take the original STW corpses, they are to
big.[/QUOTE]

Yeah, I understand about the scaling thing (that's how I plotted the coords), but it was just in answer to your earlier statement about deciding how much they would need to be scaled if at all. Well, after reading the edit on your last post, it seems that this is all a bit of a moot point anyway, but I've sent my deadpages anyway.

If I could offer an opinion on the matter, I think it's certainly true that the corpses would look pretty ugly, making a lot of work for little apparent gain, but I also think it's pretty cool to be able to see a visual representation on the field of which units have been lost/killed while a battle is still in progress.
Although I do realise that 'pretty cool' isn't a very good justification for the extra work that would be involved.


Aokubi.

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Originally Posted by aokubi

If I could offer an opinion on the matter, I think it's certainly true that the corpses would look pretty ugly, making a lot of work for little apparent gain, but I also think it's pretty cool to be able to see a visual representation on the field of which units have been lost/killed while a battle is still in progress.

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We have that now with the infantry corpses. The faction color is retained on the corpse, so you can see where each faction lost their men. That info can help in post battle analysis. It would be nice to retain the faction color on the corpse, but probably not worth doing if it's a huge amount of work to impliment.