StarWars: Return of the Sith [Concluded]

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Originally Posted by Chaotix

But either way, I think we've got the mafia cornered now. They can't even kill right.

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Says you!

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Originally Posted by TinCow

The entire 'attack never happened' PM doesn't make sense. Like I said, all that occurred after the deadline for submitting orders, so it couldn't have been an order change. Sigurd would have known that DE was going to be blocked, so why would he have sent the first attack notification PM out to pever in the first place?

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I think the entire round was late and given an extension. I got my message at Yesterday 16:43 which was after the deadline as well, I think. Then I would have had to submit orders to defend myself, and then the writeup was posted a couple hours later.


(my time)

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05-07-2010 20:08

Night time ends 23:00 GMT+1 (in about 21 hours) orders in by 22:00 GMT+1 (20 hours)

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Would be 16:00 my time.

And I got my message way after that.

I think pevergreen's story at least checks out for now. And if we make the assumption that it's possible there is still only one Sith... he cannot be the original.

Unvote, Vote: Subotan

For now. This is much too confusing. We should have gotten rid of all these people 10 rounds ago.

I have a couple requests:

To Diamondeye/TinCow-
1. Why didn't I even know about your vigilante powers until today?
2. Why is this the first night either of you have tried to use them? We just about proved vigilantism had little to do with conversion back when I investigated Beskar.

To Psychonaut-
1. Give me a full list of your abilities, please
2. You have Force Healing, right? Who have you been using it on since you exposed yourself?

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Originally Posted by Chaotix

2. Why is this the first night either of you have tried to use them? We just about proved vigilantism had little to do with conversion back when I investigated Beskar.

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I completely agree with this. Hence I said rounds ago.

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Originally Posted by TinCow

pevergreen is lying, he was never attacked by anyone... no one even attempted to attack him. He and ATPG are fabricating PMs from Sigurd.

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Originally Posted by TinCow

Well, to be fair there are two options as I see it. #1) pever got the PM from you, yes. #2) pever is telling the truth, but the person who attacked him was DE.

Neither of those scenarios clears him. Far from it, actually.

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Originally Posted by Sasaki Kojiro

So the sith are supposed to have blocked DE in between when sigurd sent the message to pever and the end of the phase? I guess DE can tell us whether he attacked pever.

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I attempted to attack pevergreen, yes, and I was blocked.

As to why i didn't use the ability until before; a succesful vigilante kill makes you susceptible to the Dark Side.

Still, I think vote:pevergreen is in order. ATPG being a close second in scumminess (especially standing up for pever so much).

HoS: ATPG

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Originally Posted by Chaotix

To Psychonaut-
1. Give me a full list of your abilities, please
2. You have Force Healing, right? Who have you been using it on since you exposed yourself?

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Already posted earlier:

Edit - Probably should have PMed you the above and below. My sleeping patterns are playing havoc on my mind. I had 4 hours from 7am-11am on Saturday morning, 4am-9am this morning and then I slept on my lawn most of the afternoon 2pm-5pm. My weekend was quite ridiculous.

I've been protecting ----.

I'm withholding my vote until I sleep, I've only skimmed from the write-up onwards, so I can't really participate fully currently. I had a rather hectic weekend, so I'm going to crash soon. Will be back later, once refreshed. :bow:

How does pevergreen being (nearly) attacked by a vig kill make him innocent? It doesn't do anything to prove or absolve him of guilt.

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Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

Just thinking aloud:

If pevergreen were Sith, and he blocked Diamondeye, then: Why would he get a message about choosing his defense? The block would have stopped all that, and it did stop all that. So the block defeats the kill attempt. There's no way pever would have gotten the message about choosing the defense IF he were the one blocking Diamondeye, because there would have been no need. The block move prevents the kill move.

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This assumes that the block order was sent in before the kill order. pever might have had no idea about who was attacking him, and sent in the DE block as a random throw of the dice.

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Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

Hmm.... okay [The Sith having defences] is a loophole and an outside chance of being true.

I see what you're saying, but I feel that isn't the case. In a judgment call I say it isn't true.

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Seeing as we've seen the Sith kill with lightning , and have other Jedi abilities (Such as force breath), it stands to reason that they are able to acquire our defensive abilities.

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Why has the case against Centurion disappeared? (Along with Centurion himself) I thought the whole point of lynching him yesterday was that it was so that we could lynch him today.

The town as a whole need to make a clear decision about whether we lynch pevergreen or Centurion1 today. If there's just one Sith left, then the worst possible outcome that can occur is for a tie to develop, and for Niklas to cast the deciding vote in his favour. Admittedly, although I find both scummy (And it is possible that one could be a recruit; if that's the case then we're probably screwed), I think Centurion is more likely to be Sith, given his behaviour in thread (Update since my last list; OTT confusion at night results, half-hearted "analysis"), but it is crucial we get unanimity on this.

If the town does not lynch either centurion or pevergreen today, I will be disappointed :shame:

For now, I am tilting towards pever.

Woe and behold, I grew smarter:

unvote; vote: Cent1

Everyone should follow this vote

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Originally Posted by Diamondeye

Woe and behold, I grew smarter:

unvote; vote: Cent1

Everyone should follow this vote

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As you command.

Unvote: TinCow, Vote: Centurion1

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Originally Posted by Diamondeye

Woe and behold, I grew smarter:

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Bit of a Freudian slip there, eh Diamondeye?

But if that's what we're going to do

Vote:Centurion1

And Diamondeye has convinced me as well.

unvote, vote: Centurion1

Subotan lives another day.

Pizza are you still a knight? How'd you get to use two defenses?

I agree with DE as well.

Unvote; Vote: Centurion1

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Originally Posted by Chaotix

To Diamondeye/TinCow-
1. Why didn't I even know about your vigilante powers until today?
2. Why is this the first night either of you have tried to use them? We just about proved vigilantism had little to do with conversion back when I investigated Beskar.

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1) I like to keep some surprises in my pocket, for a rainy day. Besides, I told Beskar about it when I got it, and I told Psychonaut about it a couple days later.
2) Two reasons. First, it does say I become susceptible to conversion. I really, really do not want to be a Sith in this game because I've put too much effort into a town victory. I would seem cheap to me to switch sides. Second, I have a general hesitation towards vigilanteism. I'm not entirely convinced its always in the town's interests to kill and I don't trust my own judgment on targets. It took a brief PM to Sasaki to overcome my hesitation in this game.

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Originally Posted by Renata

Pizza are you still a knight? How'd you get to use two defenses?

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One is active, the other is passive and is a "choose your defense".

Force barrier protects me from several things, and if I am to choose a night action, that's the one I could choose besides Stealth. If I do that I can't do other things.

However, if I get attacked, I can also select from Force Speed and Force Blinding to defend myself; standard procedure for anyone with those abilities. Diana can confirm, Tincow I believe has some of the same powers.

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Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

That part doesn't, that's not what I am arguing.

Sorry I have way too many IM windows and other things going on, I am not making myself very clear.

The proof that I have is proof only I would have, but to a lesser extent, yourself. pevergreen's message from Sigurd is formatted exactly, word for word, with my own results from last night where you attacked me. Which means DE was to attack him but it failed due to Sith interference.

That means pevergreen was going to be attacked and did get that message, and that message does match mine exactly. And, he also got the message that the attack failed, because it did fail. At some point a Sith Lord blocked Diamondeye.

The only way pevergreen is guilty is if I am guilty, or someone else who was attacked (i.e. You) sent him the message. You probably didn't or this attack on pevergreen today makes no sense.

Basically, if Askthepizzaguy is innocent, pevergreen is, or he guessed the exact correct format and wording. I can vouch for him.

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No.

Pevergreen could have blocked DE himself, being the sith lord himself. If block attempts always take priority over kill attempts then he would have basically saved himself by blocking DE.

As for

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Originally Posted by TinCow

The entire 'attack never happened' PM doesn't make sense. Like I said, all that occurred after the deadline for submitting orders, so it couldn't have been an order change. Sigurd would have known that DE was going to be blocked, so why would he have sent the first attack notification PM out to pever in the first place?

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I suppose Sigurd sent the defend-PM earlier, after that he received the block-PM and as a night result notified pever that the attacker never showed up.
Or pever made it up as you say but then how did he get a perfect PM? From ATPG?

edit: Forgot to read the last page before replying, some of this has already been said, but I'll keep it anyway.

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Originally Posted by Husar

Pevergreen could have blocked DE himself, being the sith lord himself. If block attempts always take priority over kill attempts then he would have basically saved himself by blocking DE.

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• The Sith Lord would have been blocking Diamondeye anyway.
• As soon as he sends in that block, there's no need to ever get a message from Sigurd saying "choose your defense"
• His pm format was exactly the same as mine without error
• Tincow and I were the only ones to survive being attacked, iirc. I didn't send pever the pm, Tincow didn't because he got attacked by Sith, so he's not doing that as it makes no sense.
• pevergreen could be Sith, but he cannot be the Sith lord due to the mechanics of the block and the vig kill, plus the PM evidence.
• On the round Niklas and pever were tied, Niklas was already semi-exposed as scum. There's no way he allows pevergreen to almost get lynched instead, if pever is the other Sith Lord. One vote would have ruined their entire chances, because after pever goes Niklas, who knew he was caught.
• pevergreen doesn't care about these games enough to murder Beefy187 on night one. pever and Beefy are basically conjoined twins.
• pevergreen isn't the Sith lord. He can be the recruit, but not the lord.

As for me, I cannot be the Sith lord as I was scanned as Sith-recruitable before I ever got force stealth, by Beskar.
Then I offered to die in Chaotix's place and nearly did, too.
I can only be the recruit, not the lord.

For what it's worth, I do currently believe that pever got those PMs from Sigurd. I just don't understand why he got them.

A stab at an explanation:

Sith Lord blocks Diamondeye but does it quite late in the round. (while it is still a legal action)
Sigurd is absent until after the round ends, can't send the defend yourself messages until he gets online.
Sigurd reads attack from Diamondeye first, sends pevergreen the notification he's being attacked. He sends me the same, at around the same time (about 10-15 minutes difference)
Sigurd continues reading and sees that Diamondeye is blocked, so the whole choose your defense thing doesn't matter anymore.
Sigurd issues a small clarification that the attack never happened, but leaves the reasons ambiguous.

That fits what happened, and is one explanation. However, this may not be what happened, there may be other options. But this is the only one I can think of which explains everything.

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Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

• pevergreen doesn't care about these games enough to murder Beefy187 on night one. pever and Beefy are basically conjoined twins.

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We're just friends, and I deny all the allegations stemming from a certain video on facebook.

Only RR & I are that close.

I haven't seen beefy in...quite a while. 17 months!

pevergreen would actually kill beefy187 and husar in night one. Just for the kicks.

Also, pever, it is Pokémon, not poke-him-one. :no:

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Originally Posted by TinCow

I really, really do not want to be a Sith in this game because I've put too much effort into a town victory. I would seem cheap to me to switch sides.

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I don't believe this part of your story, actually Tincow.

I believe you're town and I believe you're working for a townie victory. But I also believe that you would do whatever it takes to win, and if the Jedi get stomped, your backup plan is to become convert-able so you can win anyway. That also explains why you targeted me and not Centurion1.

I am more of a liability to the Sith than Centurion1 is, so the best way to hedge your bet is to attack me. If I am Sith, you become a town hero. If I am not, one less annoyance when you become Sith later.

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Originally Posted by Beskar

pevergreen would actually kill beefy172 and husar in night one. Just for the kicks.

Also, pever, it is Pokémon, not poke-him-one. :no:

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Grrrrr.

Vote: Centurion1

will be back to catch up later.

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Originally Posted by Askthepizzaguy

I don't believe this part of your story, actually Tincow.

I believe you're town and I believe you're working for a townie victory. But I also believe that you would do whatever it takes to win, and if the Jedi get stomped, your backup plan is to become convert-able so you can win anyway. That also explains why you targeted me and not Centurion1.

I am more of a liability to the Sith than Centurion1 is, so the best way to hedge your bet is to attack me. If I am Sith, you become a town hero. If I am not, one less annoyance when you become Sith later.

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Well, you're totally wrong. I'm telling the truth about not wanting to be Sith. In addition, I did not give any serious consideration to attacking Cent1 because he claimed to have a night attack deflection ability, and I believed him. The choice was between you and pever. I chose you, because I knew I'd get a major headache trying to get you lynched. It was a lazy-man choice.

I feel insulted.

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Originally Posted by pevergreen

I feel insulted.

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:shrug:

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Who Posted?

* Posts 407 Askthepizzaguy
* Posts 83 pevergreen

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I'd make quantity vs quality, but his quality is above mine.

I know, I'd rather try to get me lynched than ATPG. I don't blame my insultedness on you TC.

Though sigurd telling me off didn't help. :laugh4:

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Originally Posted by pevergreen

I'd make quantity vs quality, but his quality is above mine.

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If quality is arguing with a known townie for pages regarding how guilty the town doctor is, I suppose I have quality.

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Originally Posted by TinCow

Well, you're totally wrong. I'm telling the truth about not wanting to be Sith. In addition, I did not give any serious consideration to attacking Cent1 because he claimed to have a night attack deflection ability, and I believed him. The choice was between you and pever. I chose you, because I knew I'd get a major headache trying to get you lynched. It was a lazy-man choice.

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Interesting is I told Chaotix I had night attack deflection powers. He still let you attack me?

Derp I am stupid. You don't even have to explain why that question is dumb, I already know.

Wow, in before it even says "edit".

Okay now it says edit.