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Considering how often people don't hit anything at all the concern about overpenetration is just silly. Why would the bullets hitting the target be any more dangerous than the ones sprayed around the neighborhood?Quote:
Originally Posted by ceasar010
The reason for using HP ammo is that it gives a slightly better chance of hitting a blood vessel or something on it's way through your body. It's not usually the little bullet hole itself that kills you, it's the blood loss.
Like I said, all bullets are designed to do maximum damage. For hollow points, its the expansion after entering the body. For FMJs, its penetration. There are no 'armor piercing' rounds for pistols, unless you count FMJ, which has been around for hundreds of years.Quote:
I thought cop killer rounds was armor piercing ammo? Police often remember to wear body armor, so something designed to go through armor would be a cop killer.
And yet, as always, the 'total sense' of anti-gunners is soundly defeated by the facts of reality. I will not bother quoting what has already been posted, that you, coincidentally, so neatly ignored, that sundered his position from any logic it could ever have hoped to contain.Quote:
My friend, as ever you speak total sense.
Crazed Rabbit
The Russians have several specific AP rounds for pistols since the 90s.Quote:
Originally Posted by Crazed Rabbit
I always thought "cop killers" were originally in reference to teflon coated bullets. A quick google search yields this.Quote:
Originally Posted by Spetulhu
But basically, yes the term is all hype.The gun grabbers sure think of great buzzwords don't they?Quote:
Some anti-gun members of Congress saw the light too. Here was an opportunity to get all sorts of free personal publicity in all sorts of media. All they had to do was introduce a bill with a catchy title to outlaw the import, manufacture of sale of..of what? The title, having been stolen from NBC, was easy: "A bill to stop the proliferation of 'cop-killer' bullets." "Cop-Killer" was the most exciting label to come along since "Saturday Night Special" and just as vague.
If you're going to wait for a gunshot to bleed someone to death, it'd be useless for defense. I'm not an expert by any means, but I think the idea is that JHP can deliver more of the bullets force into what its hitting, creating a larger temporary cavity. Im sure you could find a better explanation on Google if you really want it- but its not about bleeding to death.Quote:
Originally Posted by Spetulhu
I'm not going to justify Rasafaros' post with an answer. When I see some intelligence on this issue on his part, I will. Jag cheering him on just proves my point.
Spethelu: Some brief explanations of ammunition type:
-Bullet: Technically speaking, the lead (or other material) slug only. The casing, the powder and the bullet together form a cartridge.
-Casing: the usually brass base of a cartridge (frequently referred to as simply brass) Holds the elements of the cartridge together.
-Powder: Main projectile mechanism, a volatile mixture of gunpowder that when lit by the primer, explodes, forcing the bullet out of the casing and down the barrel.
-Primer: A small, impact-driven charge inserted into the bottom of the casing. When the firing hammer of the gun strikes the casing, it detonates, igniting the main powder load.
-Bullet types: Regular (just an aerodynamically shaped chunk of lead, cheapest and hence most common) full metal jacket (the bullet is sheathed in copper, tin or some other metal to help the lead to maintain it's shape at impact) hollow point(no jacket, as the name implies, the center of the bullet is hollow, as though somebody drilled out the center of the bullet, weak structure that collapses at impact) tipped (the tip of the bullet is tipped with silicon or some other substance)
Why to use the above:
Regular: cheap, easy to reload.
Jacketed: More penetrating power, but mostly because if you shoot a lot, it makes it easier to clean your gun (lead isn't scraping along the inside of the barrel)
Hollow point: More stopping power, less penetrating power. Won't go through walls or bodies.
Tipped: Designed specifically to go through a bulletproof vest. The tip allows the bullet to penetrate most forms of body armor before it starts to flatten & deform.
Tipped bullets are illegal for anybody but the police to carry in all 50 states.
The media can't even keep it's 'scare vocabulary' correct. The correct anti-gun term for a hollow-point bullet is "surgeons' nightmares" due to fragmenting. The correct anti-gun term for full metal jackets is 'neighborhood killers' due to the continued striking range of stray bullets.
At some point, you have to understand the media has negative spin on every firearm related piece of equipment or supply out there. I don't know what it is, but I'm sure they have a story to tell over why black-powder rifles should be illegal (the muzzle loaders).
I may be wrong, but arn't hollowpoints banned in warfare by the Geneva Convention?
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Originally Posted by bmolsson
If you smoke it is harmful... shooting up paper is not harmful
I would say this decision is sensible whereever you stand on gun bans. If society allows the ownership of guns, it would obviously be unfair to punish those make them available.
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Originally Posted by Grey_Fox
No its the houge convention that did it. I wish the USA didnt sign that thing :embarassed:
If you don't light it, just keep it in your mouth and look cool, then it's not harmful...... ~;)Quote:
Originally Posted by ceasar010
~:confused: So what you want me to keep my gun unloaded and stand there ~:confused:
Why is the antis here hate me going to the range aiming at a human like paper target and shooting it.
Are you some how offended ~:confused:
PS I dont want cigarettes banned if people want to put that !@#$ in their bodies go ahead its their choice.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ceasar010
hey....if guns came equiped with some gadget so that you could only shoot yourself i´d be all for them.
unfortunatelly you can use them not only to put lead into yourself..you can do it to other people too....
not really much of a paralell there.
Just because you have something that could be used like that doesn't mean you will.
A guns main function is not killing in the US and they are a vital tool.
Guns are used for defense 2.5 million times a year. And there are around (I am not sure i think this is the number) 30,000 accidents.
These numbers are not that far-fetched.... if you look at them because depending on how biased the source you look at is there are 60 to 80 million gun owners in america.
You also need to defend from critters too, there are some wild dog packs where I live and they will tear you up. What do you want people to do.... wave a stick at them and get killed.
PS dont go to the brady campaign and cite numbers of kids getting killed... they count gang members in there plus they also count 18 and 19 year olds.