The Emperor has married a horse.

Well, given that the amount of lead in our diet and water has increased dramatically in the past century, I don't think we have much reason to feel superior to the Romans. At least they didn't know it was toxic.

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Originally Posted by Ludens

Well, given that the amount of lead in our diet and water has increased dramatically in the past century, I don't think we have much reason to feel superior to the Romans. At least they didn't know it was toxic.

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I believe we are superior to the Romans in several respects. With the exception of the "Toys being bigger and better" I can see no real functional difference in how the worlds major factions get run today.

Any impartial psycological appraisal of any of the worlds present crop of "leaders" can only return a result of clinical psycopathic behavior. Anyone found any large stockpiles of WMD's outside the USA lately for an example.

Your right at least there was a certain basic frankness about the inherent psychopathy of the Claudian dynasty, with most of them doing a lot of their own dirty work in the front lines so to speak, that would seem refreshing by todays standards.

Maybe we should bring back the public Equine Copulation rituals. Personally with John Howard in power I like this reform before the next rigged Australian federal election.

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Originally Posted by Ludens

Well, given that the amount of lead in our diet and water has increased dramatically in the past century, I don't think we have much reason to feel superior to the Romans. At least they didn't know it was toxic.

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I pretty much second this statement. Their a many things today that widely are used because of their advantages despite possible negative, largely unresearched effects on the human body, for example various EM radiation from the devices we use or genetically engineered crops.

However, the romans didn't know for sure that lead was toxic, and why it was unhealthy, but at least some suspected it. Vitrivus, in the only work about roman engineering and architecture that survived completly, warns explicitly to use lead pipes instead of clay pipes, that are also easier to manufacture and repair.


Marcus Vitruvius Pollio:
de Architectura, Book VIII

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10. Water conducted through earthen pipes is more wholesome than that through lead; indeed that conveyed in lead must be injurious, because from it white lead is obtained, and this is said to be injurious to the human system. Hence, if what is generated from it is pernicious, there can be no doubt that itself cannot be a wholesome body.

11. This may be verified by observing the workers in lead, who are of a pallid colour; for in casting lead, the fumes from it fixing on the different members, and daily burning them, destroy the vigour of the blood; water should therefore on no account be conducted in leaden pipes if we are desirous that it should be wholesome. That the flavour of that conveyed in earthen pipes is better, is shewn at our daily meals, for all those whose tables are furnished with silver vessels, nevertheless use those made of earth, from the purity of the flavour being preserved in them.

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Originally Posted by cunctator

Marcus Vitruvius Pollio:
de Architectura, Book VIII
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10. Water conducted through earthen pipes is more wholesome than that through lead; indeed that conveyed in lead must be injurious, because from it white lead is obtained, and this is said to be injurious to the human system. Hence, if what is generated from it is pernicious, there can be no doubt that itself cannot be a wholesome body.

11. This may be verified by observing the workers in lead, who are of a pallid colour; for in casting lead, the fumes from it fixing on the different members, and daily burning them, destroy the vigour of the blood; water should therefore on no account be conducted in leaden pipes if we are desirous that it should be wholesome. That the flavour of that conveyed in earthen pipes is better, is shewn at our daily meals, for all those whose tables are furnished with silver vessels, nevertheless use those made of earth, from the purity of the flavour being preserved in them.

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Facinating stuff.

I can remember a TV documenmtry, the name of which I completely forget, based on the level of tocxic chemicals polutants produced from Roman iron smeltering opperations in Spain and the effects it would of had on the workers and local residents.

It would be interesting to know how much the Romans actually did know about the effects of harmfull chemicals and envioronmental degredation. Your Marcus Vitruvius Pollio quopte shows they were being warned, at least of the dangers of some of them. I wonder how much the Roman governmental hierachy did ignore such warnings in light of the economic impact of actually doing anything about them?

Ah Vitruvius, Caesar's brilliant engineer and siege engineer.


About the horse.. I believe the story is that Caligula got his horse into the Senate, but he also attempted to appoint it to CONSUL.

Wikipedia suggests that this may be a myth.

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Originally Posted by wikipedia

The Roman historian Suetonius referred to Caligula as a "monster", and the surviving sources are universal in their condemnation. One popular tale, often cited as an example of his insanity and tyranny, is that Caligula appointed his favourite horse, Incitatus, to a seat on the senate and attempted to appoint it to the position of consul. The story, however, owes its unrelenting currency to its charm: it is based on a single misunderstood near-contemporary reference, in which Suetonius merely repeats an unattributed rumour that Caligula was thinking about doing it (Suet. Cal. 55.3). Caligula is often alleged to have had incestuous relationships with his sisters, most notably his younger sister Drusilla, but there is no credible evidence to support such claims either. In short, the surviving sources are filled with anecdotes of Caligula's cruelty and insanity rather than an actual account of his reign, making any reconstruction of his time as Princeps nearly impossible.

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Originally Posted by We all need someone

I think plague already has a higher chance of happening during a long siege. I was besieging some Indian city as Baktria for like 10 turns, and I wondered why so many of their soldiers were dying. When they surrendered the town, the pride and joy of my army discovered this "gamplay element".

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Ouch. You'd think the people inside the city would being lofting the bodies out into the besieging army....

Wow 1,280 views and well over 30 comments this is my largest thread.