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Sorry for double posting :)
@Galvanised iron
I think there definitely needs to be some message system, or event to pop up and at least tell you of Ceasar's uprising before hand, i think it definitely needs to be looked into closely, if it is not possible its not possible, however it would be something which could compliment the gameplay at the time. Just a thought
@Paedric - I'm not sure what you've done to the launcher but it's just stopped working properly and is clearly trying to load into the wrong .exe (giving a mount database error) or something on the default campaign....did you remove the -mod: bit from the command line? Roman campaign is loading fine.
Excuse the double post. Just increased Roman rebel core income to2500 which looks about right in an AI campaign as Rome
I've not touch it for something like a week, and I've never change the things you are referring to.
I've just tried it with all exe, and everything is alright. Also no one has complained.
Which exe were you using? Have you tried to delete/update both files?
The only way I can think of to trigger an event that would 'announce' the rebellion would be to have the script, at whatever point it triggers the rebellion itself, trigger an 'advice' thread that would pop up and tell you what's going on.
I think that's the way EB did it with some of their events. But you can't trigger events based on how many regions you own. The normal RTW event is triggered by number of turns...which would be useless for the rebellion.
To Paedric, new update and bug fix posted
Still, it might be good to announce the rebellion when it appears, so the player is not at loss, and understand who he is. I'm pretty sure it is possible to use the script to trigger a message when the rebellion occurs.Quote:
The only way I can think of to trigger an event that would 'announce' the rebellion would be to have the script, at whatever point it triggers the rebellion itself, trigger an 'advice' thread that would pop up and tell you what's going on.
I think that's the way EB did it with some of their events. But you can't trigger events based on how many regions you own. The normal RTW event is triggered by number of turns...which would be useless for the rebellion.
I'll take a look as well....I think you can trigger an event, but as far as I'm aware it has to be the next event in the list...I'll look.
In the meantime, I've updated the Roman script with named characters for the levy armies for all factions (with some basic traits - some command stars, culture traits, and non-adoptible) - also done the same for the Roman rebel armies. Please let me know if you get any unexplained CTDs at the start of the Roman rebellion....also could one or two people run it a few times and post screenshots of the different patterns of regions (will be different each time) together with the rebel legions that get created please?
About to roll out the script changes for all campaigns.
3000 core income looks right for the Roman rebels.
@tone
Quote:
Originally Posted by me
Tried deleting then reupdating - all seems to be fine again now. Thanks......the only thing that's strange though is that I don't see s aselection box for multiplayer on the launcher, which I'm sure I've seen in a screenshot somewhere.
A few people complain, so I put it in the scroll list at the bottom. It's cool everything is working.
Here is an update of what happened with TWC.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Simetrical
Quote:
Originally Posted by GrnEyedDvl
OK, it seems you can make the script advance an advice thread....something like this in the background_script at the correct line where for example the capua rebellion is triggered:
and have an entry in the export_descr_advice.txt file that looks like:Quote:
advance_advice_thread Capua_Rebellion_Thread
with an entry in export_advice.txt something like this:Quote:
AdviceThread Capua_Rebellion_Thread
GameArea Campaign
Item Capua_Rebellion_Text_01
Uninhibitable
Verbosity 0
Threshold 1
MaxRepeats 0
RepeatInterval 1
Attitude Normal
Presentation Default
Title Capua_Rebellion_Text_01_Title
Text Capua_Rebellion_Text_01_Text1
Quote:
{Capua_Rebellion_Text_01_Title}Socii Rebellion
{Capua_Rebellion_Text_01_Text1}
Our Italian allies, encouraged by Hannibal's advances.....bla...bla...bla
Okay, I'm going to post a quick post and then a longer post later. I want to comment on the in-game "notice" issue. First, I don't think this is a secure thread so anything we post here is going to hit the WWW anyway. Most players will probably know about this "event" before it happens in-game, not posting a notice for surprise value is pointless, I think.
I also think an in-game could end up as a warning. "This is going to happen," gives the player a chance to prepare.
IMO, just talk it up on the forum, put it in the readme, the FAQ, and so on. A little suspense is not a bad thing.
However, having stayed up all night last night playing this rebellion, I have to say: Some notice is necessary. All joking aside, I'm not one of the RSFs (Roma Surrectum Fanatics). If this happened to me and I didn't know why, I'd be pretty pissed off. I'd probably be "I'm done with this game."
Think about it: a player fights, what, maybe 200-300 battles to get this point? 300 x 20 minutes a battle (assuming they're not auto-resolving) is 100 hours of time. At 10 hours a week, that's 10 weeks of my life. I'm close enough to victory that I can see it in the headlights, but every turn now takes an hour because I have to fight three or four battles a turn. And then . . .
This happens.
In one test last night, I went from 85 regions to 28. I lost all of the Italian peninsula, all of Greece, all of Eurasia, all of North Africa. I was left with Gaul and part of the Iberian peninsula. My treasury dropped to -112,000. (This was after midnight, so it would be after Tone's latest update, install 1855, I think).
The turn itself takes forever. What makes it hard is not necessarily the money or the units, it's the endurance test that is this turn (assuming you're fighting battles on map). I mean, if I wasn't autoresolving, it would easily take over two hours playing with large units. It isn't just the rebellion, its the attack on your armies by the now huge Roman rebel stacks. You lose your cities, you lose your armies. Your economy goes to hell.
What made this particular test so problematic is the only city I had to recruit units in, post-event, was Massila. And what happens? One of those full stacks of rebels, armed with silver weapons and shields and double chevrons, comes over the hills and lays siege to the city. Three turns later, I'd lost two more stacks and Massila was gone. Now I had nowhere to recruit units. To the west, I'm fighting tough Gauls in Spain. To the east, I've now lost everything and have a huge empire to contend with.
I'm like a big-talking teenager. I've got nothing.
So, I'm off to work with Starbucks and no sleep. I do want to be clear. The event is a beautiful thing. But it might be a deal-breaker, if I don't know its happening.
~ Dani ~
Detailed post. I hope these posts (this one and my previous one) are helpful. Just so you know, I'm reluctant to post pictures since I'm not sure how much info you want released on this forum. I can post pictures if you want them.
Playtest Report - Rome Rebellion Script
RTW BI. Playing as Rome. H/H. Small units. 603 to around 610 AUC. Using BW's saved game.
Pre-rebellion holdings: All of Italy, Greece, Bzyantium, part of Eurasia, North Africa (but not Egypt), north into Germany and Gaul. At war with everyone, but currently facing heavy fighting in Spain. Obviously, 85 territories.
"@Dani:
Thanks.....I think the main thing with the rebellion is to do three things:
1) Check the number and strength of initial rebel legions is right - are there enough armies and are they strong enough opposition?
2) Are the settlement garrisons strong enough?
3) Are the finances right for a) the player and b) the rebels? - do the rebels start spawning further legions? is it financially right - not too much into debt and not too much money...ideally the player should have very limited resources to see them through the crisis."
"First, the number and strength of the initial rebel legions is right. Are there enough armies and are they strong enough?"
Yes and yes.
You noted the rebellion was "random." I tested random last night with eight starts using BW's (Beast Within) saved game. The game is two turns out from the rebellion. Of the eight games:
- Six times the rebellion included Rome. Twice it did not (Italy didn't rebel).
- North Africa rebelled every time.
- Twice the empire slip roughly down the middle, with the Rebels to the east and my Rome to the west. (I'll call this an east-west split.)
- Three times the rebellion occurred in Greece, Italy and some random areas. (I'll call this a random split).
- Twice the rebellion include the lands to the North, parts of Eurasia (north of Byzantium) and North Africa. (I'll call this a northern split).
- Once only three territories rebelled. That may be been because I somehow didn't have the script running.
Obviously, a lot will depend upon how the player has progressed, what cities they've developed as recruiting cities, how much they've spent on armies versus economic development. In this saved game, most of economic development has occurred in Italy and Greece. Very little economic development has occurred in Spain, Gaul (western France), and Germany. I believe the only place I can recruit legions in these three areas is Massila.
At the inception of the rebellion, the Rebel stacks and units will attack the Roman player's armies. Most of these battles are pretty one sided, in favor of the Rebels. If you auto-resolve, you're going to loose a lot of armies. If you don't, you'll lose less, but you'll still lose some armies. So the practical effect of the rebellion is threefold: (1) remove regions from the player's control, (2) reduce the player's income, and (3) destroy the player's standing armies. Now, I've only my Roman History seminar, so I'm no expert on Roman history, but these feels very realistic to me.
Because of (3), I think the number and strength of the initial Rebel armies is sufficient. Specifically, I mean some expert players who arrive at this point with fully developed economies and by a slower growth rate (maybe arriving at 85 regions at around 700 or 750 AUC) will probably find the rebellion a bit easier. God help players who rush into it. I cannot imagine not having a fully developed economy on the other side of this rebellion. Well, actually, I can (see below).
One final note: random works nicely. I cannot predict where the rebellion occur so I cannot prepare for it - except to play cautiously and thoroughly.
Are the settlement garrisons strong enough?
If you mean the settlement garrisons for the Rebel Romans (and you must), then yes. One problem you're going to have is the AI will take units from the garrisons to attack the player. So the rebellion occurs, the player loses a lot of her standing armies, then has to scramble a bit to recover while the AI pulls units from the cities to reinforce. I've actually seen that happen in game at least twice.
Again, though, it depends on the size and strength of the rebellion. Here is where "random" comes in. Smaller rebellions, not centralized, will be easier to defeat than an east-west split.
This is why it's hard to say: "Tone, everything's perfect." With the right rebellion and the right economic/military development, this could be a problem, but not a huge one. With no planning and an east-west split, I'd have to think it's game over.
So, yes, a player could lose this game after rebellion.
Are the finances right for a) the player and b) the rebels? - do the rebels start spawning further legions? is it financially right - not too much into debt and not too much money...ideally the player should have very limited resources to see them through the crisis.
The player.
Again, it depends. If I'm still holding Rome and Italy, I'm bring in 30-60k a turn. If I've got an east-west slip, with the Rebels in Italy, I've got a treasury in negative numbers. In one game, I dropped to -112,000. Again, it will depend on how I develop my empire.
Maybe the better question is "Is it historically realistic?" I'd say yes. If I'm a Roman leader and Rome rebels against me, it should hurt and a lot. I should have to make hard choices, new allies. I might even have to run for a bit.
If I lose all my money, and drop to -112,000, then what would I do in real life. Stop paying soldiers, some would leave. Steal gold from the temples and buildings (destroy them).
If I've made wise economic choices, I may survive, but with the an east-west split, I'm more than likely going to be kicking cohorts to the curb and ripping down temples.
The Rebels.
I haven't tested the very latest, but the after midnight version (update 1855) seemed a bit more balanced. Again, though, it depends on the rebellion, who the Rebels are fighting, and so on. It's also hard to see if the Rebels are respawning since they're pulling from city garrisons, too.
I did notice it ever being easy or the Rebels not attacking me because they didn't have armies. Nope, that was not a problem.
I think in any case - maybe it's just play style, recovering from a rebellion will take a while - maybe 20 turns, at least? I didn't go into that much depth, but I can.
Other considerations:
Difficulty.
Yeah, it's hard. The randomness is sweet, because if I develop my cities, then, sure, I might be better prepared or I might just hand a nice, well-developed city to the enemy. Even if I luck out and end up with most of Italy or Greece, I'm still fighting one more, strong, enemy.
I'd be interested in trying to reach the rebellion myself, even on auto-resolve, just to see if I can prepare for it. Of course, that would probably take more time than you have before release.
Game performance.
I don't where to put this so I'll just toss this here. Graphics are up on highest settings but not running bloom lighting. Performance (frame rate) is in double digits both on battle maps and game map. Script runs smoothly with only occasional hesitation. I'm running the anti-ailising through my ATI card and have it shut off in-game.
The only time I drop to single digits is during night battles when I'm trying to operate at triple speed. In fact, I avoid the 3x speed button for RSII.
By the way, did you know that the sun shader (?) still glows at night? There's the moon over the mountains and, across from it, is the glow of an absent sun.
Okay, not sure what else to post. Hope all this was helpful.
~ Dani ~
:jawdrop:
Remeber me never to ask you to write something long for me, I'd probably have to read it for the rest of my life.
I think the only thing that is lacking is your own appreciation : is it fun, did you like it? Is the dificulty rather hard, yet fun, or just too hard?
By the way guys, I think you now know what we expect of you.
Sigh. I wasn't sure how much detail to put in or how much would be useful. The last time I playtested, I saw Tone take people to task for writing something like: "I'm 80 years in and it looks good." Sorry if I went too far in the other direction.Quote:
Originally Posted by Paedric
As for appreciation ... I like hard. I thought the rebellion was fun, overall. It was certainly challenging. I'd like to have a go at it with an empire I developed, since I like to grow slow and build a very strong economic base.~
~ Dani ~
Trust me more details are always better than none, especially when they're good details.
I feel so guilty now for not posting as detailed!
Yeah, that's why I'm here ... guilt and awe. It's like shock and awe, only your Mom wields it.
Okay, one day soon I'll be able to edit my posts and my life will be complete. Until then, sorry for the double post.
Tone: I was studying Irishguy's rebellion map in Post 5 of this thread - in which he said the rebellion was easy. If you notice, when he went through the rebellion, he did not lose either Italy or lower Greece. This is consistent with my testing. If the Rebels do a northern split, as they did in his game, leaving the player with the southern regions, then the rebellion will be easier.
If set difficulty based on the player keeping Rome, Italy and Greece, it'll be much more difficult for the player who, in a random rebellion, loses these territories. The combined loss of income and places to recruit legions will make a dramatic difference.
Not saying you should change anything, just pointing out that this is going to be a factor in a random rebellion.
~ Dani ~
THAT is one heck of a detailed bunch of feedback!! Great job, Dani. As Squid says, the more details the better we can see what's going on and how people perceive all of this. Thank you. :)
I second want dani has said to be honest i agree with everything.
When the rebellion suddenly happened i was shocked, i had shot down to -150k in one turn, i had lost all of italy and gaul. What remained were undeveloped settlements as i had only just took them. When i had come to the 85 settlement point i had actually stopped expanding in the east and decided to begin to provide them with some attention. However i obviously didnt get given the time.
I could of took the route of selling many of my troops, but i went for desperation, and a quick counterattack, i sent everything to the eastern coast, i rushed back several legions from gaul. Some of which had been destroyed. I had 10 fleets on the coast of greece, each sending a army over to italy. I decided that without Italy i didnt have a choice and that had to be my first priority.
I even brought back several legions from egypt and africa. It was a real struggle and half of my units were weak, such as levy pikeman and the like. Then the other lot were mainly older republican legions. I did have about 4 named legions moving into italy. Therefore i outnumbered the rebellion units in Italy probably 3 to 1. I probably lost 2 men for every one of theres, but even so my gamble payed off and i managed to regain, sicily, italy and some of africa. Financially i began gaining 80k per turn. I had reached -350k at my lowest point financially, however i plundered the settlements i took and brought this up to -200k which then inturn i was out of debt within about 3 turns later as a result of beginning to gain some money.
I think i will definitely try and push on too late game, it will probably take a good 15 years before my empire is even close to what it use to be, maybe even more, but currently it is stable, however the rebels are very strong in gaul and will take some beating. Cimbri have pushed me completely out of germany, boii and dacia have started to push down into my north east provinces. I have been completely pushed out of egypt by the ptolemaics and totally pushed out of iberia by the galleci.
Overall i think this rebellion is all about sacrifice. it is all about what you as a player are willing to sacrifice, no matter what i think every player, no matter how good the player is, will have to sacrifice something. My gamble payed off, but even so i had to sacrifice a good 10-15 settlements to other people beside the rebels.
If the player is given italy and greece, victory i think would certainly be easy. If not then the player will struggle, losing both greece and italy would be tragic i should think for the player, how ever losing one of the both, would probably be the ideal scenario for the player as for difficulty.
So i will try and push on past the late rebellion, see how the rebels perform later on, when they will have to produce their own troops and keep a close eye on unit production. Once done i will begin to start playing from 85 turns again, but right now my main priotity is:
To see how long it takes to regain the empire i had before hand
To see what troops the rebels produce
So i will keep you posted i have a lot of playing time on my hands, as college is finished, just the gf who gets in the way now haha :)
Hey I finally found you guys here and realized I had gotten a membership here before I'd even heard of TWC. I'm gonna leave on a 2-3 week vacation/college search on Saturday and as I won't have a laptop till next year and my parents would never let me use theirs, I'll post my almost finished Pergamon camp. up here. All I need in it is 5 territories so if you want me to start testing other things I'd be glad to start up a new camp.
Thanks
Thanks Dani and BeastWithin, all really helpful stuff. It sounds like we've hit just about the right balance then. I guess the big question....do we remove the random factor from losing Rome seeing that keeping it seems to make such a big difference? (For starters there are the two praetorian legions to contend with when you do lose it).
I've set up the first of the advice pop-ups (for the Socii rebellion) but for some reason at the moment I'm not getting advice pop-ups to stay in view.....they disappear straight away.
@tonyw
well on my campaign i have only seen one preatorian legion wich was definitely a problem to get past, i lost 2 of my named legions tackling with it.
However in my game they made arretium their capital and that is where i found the preatorian legion.
So i think rome should definitely be lost. I havent tested it several times like dani, but going off her results i think we can safely presume that losing italy is probably a must, and would make the game ideally difficult, and would definitely hit the difficulty sweet spot if you ask me, i will look more closer into it was i have finally destroyed the rebellion, as it would seem no one has got too far into the rebellion, hopefully will be able to post some information on it tomorrow for you guys.
And good i think the advice thing is really a good idea and a good way to get round the events hope it works out, it will definitely be a good feature for both rebellions, as players may want to know, but also it is still realistic as the senate/people of rome would know of this unrest before a full scale rebellion takes place.
You misunderstood me, that's awesome, just have a look at Beast Within report (:tongue2: just kidding here).Quote:
Sigh. I wasn't sure how much detail to put in or how much would be useful. The last time I playtested, I saw Tone take people to task for writing something like: "I'm 80 years in and it looks good." Sorry if I went too far in the other direction.
Since you are paying attention to details, what do you think of the launcher, and the menu; well all the way from clicking on the icon to starting the campaign? Is it user-friendly? Could it better (how)?
That's also for the others, but I've lost hope with them.~:mecry:
@ tone, maybe add something like pause/wait/sleep, well whatever makes the thing stop for a time.
You're welcome. :happy: Very glad to be help.Quote:
Originally Posted by tonyw
DO NOT remove the random factor from Rome. PLEASE leave it random.
One of the key principles of game design (like I know a lot about it) is suspense and playability. What keeps me playing a game, tho, is the likelihood that something "different" will happen. If I know how it's going to end, and I've beaten the game before, then why play again?
I think the player should have a chance of getting a truly difficult and challenging rebellion or something easier, or something in-between.
Remember ... this is not a strategy game. It's a role-playing game. :yes:
~ Dani ~
Here is that Pergamon save I spoke of.
http://www.megaupload.com/?d=A67PNFYE
@dani
i agree with your point but surely, having this massive rebellion too easy is just as bad as it being random.
Irish guy seemed to touch upon his campaign being to easy, and the common link seems not loosing either Italy or Greece, if it could be scripted that it is more likely to loose these areas or make it certain that one of these areas is lost then it is a most.
Just i would hate the fact that i was playing up to this rebellion looking forward to a real challenge, and then i get the easy route out, which could just be as bad, as having no randomness, however i get your point and i think your right, but if we dont make it certain to be difficult in this way, then what way could we look at to make sure that there is no 'easy' rebellion to squash?
Your launcher is great. It's intuitive and easy to use. Only a Luddite wouldn't like it. And a Luddite wouldn't play RSII.Quote:
Originally Posted by Paedric
It's all good now. I was overjoyed to see the return of No Battle Timeclock or whatever it's called - it was missing from the early play-testing menus. All the words on the launcher appear now, both on my Windows machine and my MacBook. The screens are visually appealing - stunning even - and Apple's music is a joy to listen to. I think the drop down menu is great.
I admire the way the team designed this game. RSII is most organized mod I've every seen for any game. The separate folders and free-standing launcher allow for easy future modification, even allowing players (I assume) to mod existing directories without damaging the original folder (by merely copying the folder and adding it to the drop-down menu. Future mods will be easy (okay, easier) to design and implement because you can draw from existing resources while creating an entirely different game or gaming experience.
Serious game designers could learn a thing or two from studying this layout.
~ Dani ~
As for the layout, i love it. I aint completely in the know when it comes to the computer coding and so on. But just from a general person who knows a little and loves to play the game i would say it is amazing. The design is sleek, it looks professional in my opinion, i have always wondered why sega havent came along given you a bucket load of money and took it all off you, it is honestly that good. As a package it is easily 10 times better then the original, even if you released it now without all the finishing touches.
As for the look:
stunning, i love it all, it just looks professional, nothing seems out of place, or looks too blocky, i love the images and i also love the new introduction to the faction before you choose your difficulty options. That was a really nice touch.
The launcher was a big surprise, i liked it lots, it made the game great both for the player and for designers to make the most of each faction and create the best game for each, it was a really intuitive design.
The music:
Creates real atmosphere, which is waht you want as music, i have quite often waited to listen to the song at the launcher menu and at the start of battles to the end, just waiting for it to finish before i began the battle of launched the faction i was running. I am a drummer and in a low key band, i also did music at GCSE and i know just how hard it is to make songs. Apple and the other cmposers have done a brilliant job.
Graphically:
Just amazing is all i can say in complete honesty. The only way you could make it better is having the ability to have different looking men within the troop like in MTW2.
Like i have said it is a total professional package, which could even be sold, it is just amazing. I love it and havent been able to play any other mods of games because i get bored, or annoyed when the water doesnt glimmer, frustrated when i dont see real sky, or real looking troops, all real music in the background, or when it is a pain to install.
Its a brilliant piece of work and you should all be really proud of it.
Remember Tone has increased the Rebel's income since Irishguy's campaign was posted. All circumstances being equal, that same campaign should be harder than it was before.Quote:
Originally Posted by Beast Within
I see your point, too, but not everyone is going to "look forward" to the rebellion, either literally or figuratively. When it hits, some people are simply going to freak. They're going to want to "go back and do it over" or somehow try to get an advantage. If I got to the rebellion and drew an east-west split with the Rebels controlling Rome and myself in control of a bunch of undeveloped regions, I might be tempted to go back to an earlier save and play through again.
Which reminds me of a loading screen that appears in Bethesda Softwork's Oblivion game. The team could create their own loading screen:
"Save often. The ancient world is a dangerous place."
~ Dani ~
i see your point, im just looking at how i play, and i dont like to go back, i will tackle the probalem and make the most of it like i did with the campaign i had when i had that split, i understand that some players may not enjoy it and some might not, overall it will have to come down to what the developers are prepared to sacrifice, difficulty or the randomness. But i think we could make a nice compromise with the money issues.
@tone
would there be a way to script it so if the rebellion splits it so Rome and Greece are kept then the player looses more money in that event, and if the player looses them, then they loose less money. Is that possible or can you only set it so the player looses said amount of money, no matter what land they keep?
Sorry fpor the double post
But dont think i explained myself properly there.....but what i mean to say is it is ok increasing the rebels income, but all that does it make everything harder, so still having rome and greece will be harder, but still far easier then losing them. It just makes any scenario for the rebellion harder, so to make each case even then you would have to some how financially aid the player when he is given the less productive areas.
Unless leaving it to player luck might be better, simply saying that is just your luck and leaving the player to get out of it would be good, i do love the randomness of it and i want to keep that, but i just think that maybe loosing rome and greece, would leave the player in a impossible situation.
One thing to take in consideration is that the rebellion is late game. There are some hardcore players that will try to hold all the settlements, and whatever else they like to do.
But most people stop before because it is too easy, repetitive, ... This is somewhat less of a problem here due to the special economy, and the fact that people knows of the rebellion that is coming.
Yet, let's face it, a 80+ empire has almost nothing to fear, it might takes a few beatings here and there, lose a few settlements, but nothings life threatening. However, dvk and tone wanted (well still want) that the player have a chance to lose the campaign. In my sens, the rebellion is that chance. If you are under-developed, you lose the important money-making part of your empire, and your neighbours are restless, you might lose. On the other side, a well-developed empire should have almost nothing to fear, since most of its provinces are the same.
Thank you, this is really nice to hear, although I'm just a small part of this wonderful project.
Yes. There was a thread on the TWCenter forum before it went down on that very topic. A lot of people just play through for about 100 years or so. Only the completely committed will get to 85 territories, although, the thought of a rebellion may keep them going.Quote:
Originally Posted by Paedric
If that's the case, if the goal is to make the campaign a serious challenge with a serious chance for the player to lose the campaign, then by all means make Rome part of every rebellion. That's the only way every game will be tough for as many players as possible. But it'll have to more than just Rome. Rome, surrounded on all sides by my well-developed regions, will fall quickly, even with two Praetorian legions. It'll have to be a regional rebellion. And it will lose some of its randomness.Quote:
Originally Posted by Paedric
~ Dani ~
Hi Guys
Well its good to be posting updates somewhere and totalar.org seems to be a pretty nice site too.
I've been ploughing along with my Macedon campaign and I've had a several crashes right in the middle of a battle. I'll post the crash dump info for each of them and screenshots of the armies and untis involved.
@Tone/DVK - I built the necessary building in Pellas for the level 2/3 barracks and that was fine. So tanks for the headsup on that. However, the merc building just refuses to appear. I'm going to go back to a previous save and see if i create the other buildings first and then build the mercs to see if it still occurs.
On another note, I kicked off a Selecuids campaign as I didn;t see anyone really playing them as a faction. I'd like to post my thoughts on that and some unit descriptions that aren;t correct and also an app crash consistently within one battle against the Parthians. So far that campaign's going good - although all of the Selecuid family members except for the faction leader seem to be just a bunch of crooks! Corruption is just so rampant that I had I had to start over and change my usual strategy in building up the economy which works perefectly for Macedon but not for the Selecuids. The new strategy is working fine... apprx 25k-35k profit per turn .. where as the first time around .. it nose dived to less than 3k and then into the negatives. I've been giving the Parthian's a good pasting... a wee bit of their own medicine and thats such a nice feeling!
TTRouble
:earmuffs:
All great input. Thanks.....
I'm having some problems trying to get the Advice threads to appear.
That's the way things are set up at the moment....for each of the core settlements in Italy and Sicily the script provides about 15-30000 income of support if the rebels are holding them.....we could of course make it the other way round as well that you lose money if you hold those regions.Quote:
would there be a way to script it so if the rebellion splits it so Rome and Greece are kept then the player looses more money in that event, and if the player looses them, then they loose less money. Is that possible or can you only set it so the player looses said amount of money, no matter what land they keep?
Another thing I forgot to ask is about the traits that come into play.....at the time of the rebellion your faction leader should get the Dictator then Dictator for Life traits. Once you capture Rome again his heir will become the first emperor (epithet = Imperator Caesar) and his successor will have the Caesar epithet.
Oh, and the way things are organised the random regions that rebel are grouped to try and represent Roman provinces...as things stand there's a 50% chance of each province that has enough settlements in it that are occupied by Rome to rebel apart from Italy which has a 75% chance of rebelling....maybe 75% needs to be 80-85%?
Crash part of the way through battle is likely to be graphics card overheating, I should think...there's no real reason for that to happen otherwise. Do post your saves though...presumably BI.exe?
By the way is everyone seeing the new named characters coming up with the spawned armies and are there any problems with those?
Oh and fine to post screenshots here.
By the way, the TWC forum is back up and running again.
Seems to be down again
I've made the changes suggested by Chernish at TWC, which is down again, in the Parthian Campaign. However, all campaigns ongoing there will be broken, as I had to update the names files as well. Chernish, if you see this here, could you upload your descr_strat.txt so I can see how you changed the Seleucid armies, as I'm uncertain which troops you added.
Egghh. Okay, I hope my CTD post last night @ 4:00 a.m. doesn't get deleted.
Also, as of this morning's update, I no longer have sound on the campaign (World) map. I checked under audio options and Music is set to 50% and is not muted. I get music on the loading screen when the game starts. I get music on the internet.
Am I the only one without music?
I wonder if this has anything to do with the CTDs?
~ Dani ~
error again on twcenter...
@ Padric, I sent you an update on the Celts.
Any progress on fixing the broken legion?
Yes, there is definitely a sound issue. I just opened the battle deployment screen and the sound came on. So the background sound on the world map seems to be gone.
~ Dani ~
Is it not? I thought I had fixed it.Quote:
Any progress on fixing the broken legion?
Which campaign please, play_roma?Quote:
Yes, there is definitely a sound issue. I just opened the battle deployment screen and the sound came on. So the background sound on the world map seems to be gone.
Sorry about that. Yes. Or I'm selecting Rome from the drop-down menu, so the Roman campaign map.Quote:
Originally Posted by Paedric
~ Dani ~
is it doing the same in the other campaigns?
if you revert the script to the previous version (right click on Play_Rome/data/scripts/show_me/background_script.txt and do SVN ---> Update to revision then select revision 1851 in the dialog box that comes up), does it still do the same?
I can test this is about an hour or so.Quote:
Originally Posted by tonyw
~ D ~
OK, I've just updated the script again. It seems likely that part if not all of the CTD issue was some Scythian / Sarmatian character names which have been removed recently and were still present in the script. This is something to bear in mind if we do any more name changes, that the spawned characters in the script will need changing too.
Please try reloading the Roman campaign and see whether you still get a CTD.
DVK, also are you planning to update the other campaigns to use the same set of names that are in the Roman campaign before release? If so we'll need to make sure that the script gets changed when that happens too as, the default campaign script uses different Scythian/Sarmatian names now from the Roman one.
Roam are still unable to play the Romans, becuase everytime he zooms in on a Roman infantry unit the game crashes. It doesn't seem to be graphics related, becuase he had settings turned down and it still happends. Also tried in custom battle and zooming in on an infantry unit makes it crash for him even on lowest possible settings. Problem only occurs with Legionaries.
At update 1870, loaded a moment ago.Quote:
Originally Posted by tonyw
Music Issue:
Tested Carthage, Free Greeks, (beautiful UI textures, BTW - but you probably get sick of hearing that), Scythia and the music works on all of those. I did not test every single campaign (from the launcher menu). Rome does not work after update listed above. On to step 2.
Oh! And you know what else isn't working? The sounds when you click on links. The little arrow at the bottom when you start a campaign, and so on. Oddly enough, the music is playing in the background as the text scrolls. Oh ....
I just clicked on Mute SFX and unclicked it ... now the sound is working ... okay this is weird ... I'm on the campaign map and now have two songs playing at once. I clicked and unclicked on the Mute SFX and music twice. Also,when I got to audio options and click mute music, it still plays . . . maybe it finishes the sound file before it stops??
Reverting scripts ... okay seems to work fine at 1851. Back to 1870 and it seems to work again. I'll play some more; maybe it's a ReakTek (yeah, I know, I've got a great sound system) issue or just glitch. If I have any problems, I'll let you know.
CTDs:
Okay, it won't load my last save from last night (following a CTD), so I'll go back to an earlier one. Luckily, I save just before I end every turn, with a rolling series of 15 saves.
~ Dani ~
Music seems to be working again, too.
~ Dani ~
Dang, I keep forgetting that script. Sorry. Glad you mentioned that, because that will be all wrong in the installer as well.
Do you you want me to just update ALL the other campaigns? So far, the Roman campaign, the Scythian and Sarmatian campaigns, and now the Parthian campaign have the new names.
Nobody knows what this can be? It occurs for Roam in Singleplayer also, Polybian legionaries seem okay tho.Quote:
Originally Posted by Galvanized Iron
Hallo guys! :) Its nice to see you again.
I see... you´re still testing. Great and good luck.
So are those saves he posted on TWC confirmed for the Play_Test folder only? If so, that sucks cause I've been using it in the Play_Rome folder. Is this a big deal or should I just continue testing the big rebellion as-is?Quote:
Originally Posted by Irishguy
@Galvanized Iron - sounds like he may need to have unit shaders turned on - sometimes this can cause a CTD issue when zooming. It's certainly not an issue with the units or sprites as they've been tested to death.
Are you serious? We told people to stop using that one a good few weeks ago!!! Grrrr..Quote:
Please note though that Super newbie Pro's save is in the test campaign, have you updated this one too?
Presumably if we do this we'll kill all the other campaigns? I'll just update the script in those campaigns and then it's easy to copy over.Quote:
Do you you want me to just update ALL the other campaigns? So far, the Roman campaign, the Scythian and Sarmatian campaigns, and now the Parthian campaign have the new names.
Right i have carried on my game and i few issues have seemed to arise in the late rebellion....
The most simple way to put it is i walked all over the rebels. Financially and Militarily wise they never really got going. I have about 20 images of graphs for the last 3 or 4 turns which i thought you should take a look at.
I dont think they have spawned any new units to be completely honest, i have been checking and nothing new has arisen, maybe because they were in debt, i am not sure but there definitely is a problem with it in the late phase. I will start the rebellion again tomorrow and re run it and see how i go again, but in this campaign they were definitely not working. It was difficult at the beginning as they had lots of troops but late in the rebellion they have nothing, no garrisons and i only found 2 legions waiting for me in gaul.
Do you want me to put all my images up on here, could take a while, photobucket takes all day to upload, or would it not be easy to just said you a email with them attached, i understand if you prefer not to give me your address, and if so i will post the images up in the morning for you to look at, i took pics of all the graphs for at leats 4 turns maybe 5 and images of all the legions i have come up against in the late phase of the rebellion.
Hope this all helps.
Just tell me what happens - you're saying their economy nosedives? Any idea by how much? and with which settlements?
OK, just adjusted the scripting conditions - is this the Play_Rome folder by the way? - to keep the rebel treasury between about 120,000 and 200,000.....or at least it should be!!
Right well yes it does, but it never seemed to get going in the first place, i think mainly because i took rome, just like me as the player, if i loose rome i was doen fore financially, they lost rome and now they have no money so therefore no troops, that is where the problem lies tbh.
You could leave it, as i would of been in the same position. Italy seems to make or break the rebellion, whoever can keep hold of Italy seems to win, i managed to over power it wihtin 2 years, so financially i didnt have too much damage, but now i have held Italy for a good 6 years and it would seem the rebels cash has simply fallen away, because the gaul provinces economically are weak.
So you could decide to give them extra funds to keep them going, or you could just leave it, as the player would of been in the same position, or you would have to make it more difficult at the beginning of the campaign so it makes it harder for the player to regain there former lands.
But as i said it would really seem that Italy is the deal breaker in the rebellion, who ever holds it can win, as long as they hold it for long enough.
So maybe the way we should be looking at this is to make it harder for the player to regain Italy/Greece rather then give the rebels extra funds, maybe add more legions, stronger legions and give the rebels more funds from the beginning.
And yes i am using play_rome folder
Just so you can get an idea of how they are getting on financially and militarily ingame compared to me:
https://i263.photobucket.com/albums/...2-34-31-93.jpg
https://i263.photobucket.com/albums/...2-34-45-12.jpg
https://i263.photobucket.com/albums/...3-27-38-92.jpg
https://i263.photobucket.com/albums/...3-27-43-38.jpg
This is how i am getting on financially:
https://i263.photobucket.com/albums/...3-35-26-93.jpg
Wow that was it, I was finally able to reproduce Roam's crash by turning off the unit shaders. Thanks a lot! Now we can finally balance test the Romans also.Quote:
Originally Posted by tonyw
Any chance you could run a few turns with the script update I've just made and see whether the rebels are remaining in credit now?
Yep give me half an hour
Right turns out i need to be up early tomorrow morning so cant do much, i went on in did a couple of turns and financially the rebels have risen but it is too little too late as they have only 5 settlements, so tomorrow i will begin from the start of the rebellion and try it all again and see the outcome
Well looks like those were hours wasted away then... : ( I'm going to continue my game with the Play_Rome campaign I started personally a while back. This means I won't be able to test the big rebellion for you however. My beta testing time is in a crunch unfortunately (I have limited time now).Quote:
Originally Posted by Irishguy
One thing to note is the unit sizes and play style. Have you taken into consideration that the Rome players should follow a perticular set of house rules when playing that faction? I mainly play with Huge unit settings. Does it matter for campaign balance, battles? Supernewbie's saved game was set on Large unit size and I read another person on here uses small unit size. That's drastic change.
Forum is up and running again.
No data lost, yay.
well I just dumped Super Newbie Pro's save in the Play_Rome folder and it worked fine!
but I'm off now so no long post!
Sites down again, they're probably having more hard drive problems as usual.
Right-O, TWC not responding again.