OK, to be more specific: the English Scientific Revolution was pretty much Puritans with state backing.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhyfelwyr
Printable View
OK, to be more specific: the English Scientific Revolution was pretty much Puritans with state backing.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhyfelwyr
“Lol at how you've switched from "they get in the way and suppress things!" to "where is the active support?".” YOU switch from Middle-Ages’ Churches policies towards Sciences to Modern Church and sciences approach new policies. When PVC is saying that the Church was the last refuge for Sciences and Discoveries, and even was the engine of it, I, with fact and dates, said no. Then YOU come up with the Moon Landing (which by the way is not a scientific discovery but the result of a lot of them)... You tried, you failed, recognise it.
“Or is disagreement now considered oppression?” Well, when based on your disagreement you suppressed the freedom to do researches or to publish them, or to tell them, well, yes.
“I have no idea what your issue is here” Agree.
“would not stand up to scrutiny.” Funny, as you gave a list of facts proving my point, thanks. All the factors can be linked with the decline of Religion. The fact than you can contest a Religious point of view (Reformation) opened the gate of free-thinking, that lead to the questioning of the Social Order claimed as Holly (St Augustine) by the Church. Parliaments are against the God intended Natural Order, so is surgery, medicine and others sciences that try to explain the world.
And the Scottish Enlightenment and when a Church did accept the result of Enlightenment, finally realising it was a losing battle. Now, of course Churches did adapt, and when even for the most Conservative Popes or Clergyman facts are so obvious that there is no other option, the Clergy’s objections just vanished. Just take few centuries. Note: vanished.
“they are a well known spoof site.” By whom? Not by me, obviously. “one that demonstrates just how little you know about Christian doctrine”.
How? To ignore the fact that a site is a spoof proves that I have no idea of the Christian Doctrine… I can see you point of view.:yes:
Err, do you know there are other sources of knowledge called Universities, and in there, there things named Books, and some are written by specialists in Christianity and Middle-Ages (Dumezil, le Goff, Duby).
“how on earth you could get that to be my argument, only you know.” And all people who read your sentence. It is what you wrote. To be fair, I knew it was not what you intent to say, but I couldn’t resist.
“I think you are just like an atheist version of total relism” You think what suits you in order to be happy. You do like to debate with ones agreeing with you, you don’t like that facts go against what you think, and you are not ready to change what you think against facts and reality. It is not an un-common behaviour in believers, religious, political or others..
“This despite the Church having allowed human dissection”: Nope. The Church was against; I even gave you the name of a Pope making the thing clear. The penalty to do so was excommunication. “The popes who acted most against dissection were Innocent III, Gregory IX, Sixtus VI, and Bonifatius VIII. Some of them acted on the threat to "excommunicate anybody who dissected a human body or cooked out human bones." Additionally, "a kind of inquisition resulted in which anyone found guilty of molesting the dead was burned at the stake or otherwise severely punished" (Kevorkian 34).”
Of course, as the Popes were as well Rulers, they allowed some exceptions, but for theses exceptions you try to make it as the rules. "Although necropsy would not necessarily be implied in such cases, a certain amount of anatomic probing would have to be done" (Kevorkian 35).”
In http://www.maggietron.com
“that I'm an academic” I was not aware and congratulation.
I have DEA (PHD?) in History and I recognise that my field of research was the French/US Vietnam Wars, and the re-writing of History. But I studied History of Religions in the University Lyon II/Lumière in Bron/Lyon. I am certainly not a specialist in this field, however I developed a good knowledge of Middle-Ages (reason why I do not employed the word Dark-Ages) due to 2 great Professors who took great pain to explain the mentality and the symbolism used at theses times. Thanks to them I visited the Primatiale des Gaules St Jean (Created by St Irenee and St Pothin), first Cathedral (Lyon) built in France, and what left of the Abbey of Cluny.
So, I feel quite comfortable in challenging others people views about facts and opinions.
Yes, due to my own lack of beliefs, I tent to reduce the Churches as Political Powers fighting to keep it. And the Churches had interests in keeping the masses in ignorance and submission. It is in fact the proper meaning of Islam (submission) to God.
Long post, sorry.