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But a nation with a "back to the wall" has a flank they never have to protect, even during the late game. With a "back to the wall" they can allocate troops in a historically inauthentic fashion, i.e. completely ignore protection for that border of their territory.
Thats a good point. Requiring them to move their front to their southern front. Also Will make the swebos move their front to the north.Quote:
Originally Posted by SouthernTrendKill
Fearing I didn't quite elucidate my point: It is an unfair advantage from a gameplay perspective and it is unrealistic from a historical perspective.
Despite being a bunch of pussies, they've controlled the world forever!Quote:
Originally Posted by Bootsiuv
(Yes, quite the Greg-like pun, I feel filthy)
Ethiopia would be a fun faction and add lots of variety!
An Irish faction... never. Not at this time.
True - it would be like using the corner in a battlefield, except on the campaign map (and unintentionally).Quote:
Originally Posted by Rundownloser
Well it would be nice to give the Casse someone to fight, and not let them build forces up in Britain at their own pace and then D-Day Aedui + Arverni, taking out half of France in one go (well, it's what I do :beam:).Quote:
Originally Posted by IrishArmenian
Italian:
Rome
Hellenistic:
Epirote Kingdom
Aetolian League
Achaen League
Makedonia
Ptolemaic Empire
Seleucid Kingdom
Baktria
Bosporos
African:
Carthage
Numidia
Aksumite Kingdom
Barbarian:
Celtiiberians (Spanish)
Lusitanians (Spanish)
Audui (Gallic)
Arverni (Gallic)
Sweboz (Germanic)
Chatti (Germanic)
Frissii (Holland region)
Casse (British)
Getae (Dacian)
Ardiaei (Illyrian)
Nomadic:
Sarmations
Sakae
Eastern:
Nabatea
Sabae
Pontus
Armenia
Parthia
Persian Rebels (Emerges for Seleucids or Parthians)
Something the AI does too (in EB1 anyway) There needs to be some competition there, either in the form of another British Isles faction (may as well be the Erainn, if the comments in the other thread about the scope of their activities are accepted) or having something like the Belgae in Gaul. Personally I'd like both, but the latter if I had to choose.Quote:
Well it would be nice to give the Casse someone to fight, and not let them build forces up in Britain at their own pace and then D-Day Aedui + Arverni, taking out half of France in one go (well, it's what I do ).
Antagonist
To be honest I would prefer fewer new factions and more units for the factions. But I was not asked about it.:laugh4:
My new factions would be:
1. Belgae and/or
2. Boii
Good to restrain the Sweboz + there is some place left in middle Europe. No new Germanic faction cause I have already difficulties with one mighty Germanic tribe league at that early time. Of course it is a bit of a waste not to use the existing Germanic units for another contender but...
3. Masaesulii
A Numidian faction to keep the Carthaginians busy from the beginning. Although I don't like the appearance of the actual Numidian units in EB entirely it would be fun to play the skirmisher style. Units could also be used by the Carthaginians. A bit critical: I would never have thought of Numidia as a potential world ruler, esp. at this early date. But this is true for some other factions too.
4. "Irish"
Of course not the Irish but one of the tribes who lived in later Ireland. Nice units and a counter to the Casse.
5. Bosphorian Kingdom
Long lasting, nice units possibly and in a room able to cope with a new faction
6. Massilia or Syracuse
I would rather like to have Rhodes as a faction, similar to Venice in M2TW. Ok, the Rhodians unlike Venice formed no empire, but were a very important trade nation and played some part in the Epigone wars, f.e. in the naval defeat of Philipp V. at Chios 201. But I read that KH will not be divided, so I would opt for Massilia (or Syracuse) for trade factions. Massilia could be defended very easily. With the M2TW merchant wars some new playing experience could be within.
Hmmm, my ideas left me...:sweatdrop:
Perhaps:
- Meroe/Ethiopia: already dismissed, I see the reasons but it hurts
- Cyrene: a lot of free room in Africa?
- Galatians and/or Pergamon: both useful as competitors for Asia Minor? Both were not entirely in the place in 272 however (but the same for Baktria) and easily crushed by the other powers, or not?
- Atlantis: there are rumours of a mighty empire just in the middle of the sea in the west: interesting units with laser weapons and flying devices
No:clown: :thumbsdown: :
Germanic tribe in today Germany: reason see above
Bastarnae: please no fantasy units (not much known about them, or not?)
Illyria: no potential strong candidate (but what about the Germanic tribes?...öhm) and I need room for my Epiros campaigns
I really want to see Illyria included!
some good points Geala. As you noted, the Bastarnoz seem a rather poor choice because of the low level of archaeological evidence needed to reconstruct them. At the moment, we're trying hard enough just to put together the information for a single Bastarnoz unit--I'd rather not imagine trying to reconstruct the whole faction.
What about having a gallic , celtic faction instead of an "irish". But still in Britain, to give the Casse a good fight about the british isles.Quote:
Originally Posted by I Am Herenow
Anthony mentioned the Erain on page 1, a Celtic people in today Ireland becoming later the Goidils. I find that fascinating. And is it not a good reason for a big reform? Just another British Celtic faction would be not so interesting for me.
Rebel Faction
1 Roman Rebel Faction
2 Ptolemaic Rebel Faction (Hellenistic)
3 Seleucid Rebel Faction (Hellenistic)
4 Roxolani Rebel Faction
New Faction
5 Illyria
6 Bosphoran Kingdom
7 Pergamon
8 Numidians
9 Thracian
Emerging Faction
10 Yuezhi
I would like to see another African faction, preferably kingdom of Meroe or Aksum.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tominokar
That list is right on IMO, except for two things.
1. Take out Persian Rebels, and add the Attalids' Pergamon.
2. Take out Nabatea, and add the Kingdom of Kyrene.
Just my two cents. :2thumbsup:
I agree with Pergamon actually, but not sure why you would prefer Kyrene to Nabatea- it would probably be my next choice if there was a 31st faction slot though :yes: But Nabatea would do a lot more to challenge both the Ptolemies and Seleucids.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bootsiuv
What kind of historical research has been done on the Nabateans? I wasn't aware that they were important enough to be their own faction. Honestly, Nabatea would be cool. I'm just not familiar with any of their history. They would probably be quite similiar to the Sab'yn, yes. Oh well, as long as Pergamon gets thrown in their somewhere, I'll be happy. I really have no idea why that faction seems so appealing, it just does.
Yeah, Pergamon has to be in there as it was a noticeable check to Seleucid power in Asia Minor. I also think that Galatia would be a great addition (along with Pergamon and the Bosporan Kingdom) that would really spice up the area around the Black Sea, which at the moment I honestly believe is a little sparse at present.
P.S. I am allowed to be needlessly redundant and repeats things, reiterating things as I deem necessary, which is within my rights.:laugh4:
is ther not a real duuplicity between this thread and the other "factions" thread"
If there were to be a syracuse faction ( i think it would be very poular as most eb fans are veteran now and would love the challenge!),
what would be there unique units?
I am imagining they would have a fairly similar rostar to the KH?
Which is in a way a good thing, as M2TW's unit and model cap is the same as RTW's so a faction sharing lots of units with another would save some precious model space.Quote:
Originally Posted by KARTLOS
yes i agree, but to make them a truly worthwhile/intersting faction it would be useful if they had some unique units.Quote:
Originally Posted by Puupertti Ruma
Well the unit limit may be the same, but I heard some happy news concerning the model limit. Wasn't it, just about every unit its own?
...
...
Um, we have never tried to imitate the way history went. If the Gauls finish their civil war early, then you as Rome will have to deal with their new found strength. Sometimes I see the Aedui and Arverni sit in a stalemate for decades. Give up on following history, and try to play historically.
Foot
The AI is hardcoded to go after the 'rebels' first and ignore other factions until they no longer border 'rebels'. This is why they always expand strangely. If they border a rebel province, they will put it as the priority target. The AI also seems incapible of fighting a war on multiple fronts, that is why you often see AS 'abandon' Antioch.
While I'm at it I will add that the AI is piroritized to attack you, so they will do things like conquer worthless provinces just so that they can get near you. And they will gang up on you. Peoples that should be enemies will be best friends if they are both at war with you. And the AI seems reluctant to attack your enemies, even if they share the enemy and are allied to you.
...
Well, Dumatha is gone for the next version, and Gerrha doesn't seem to appeal to the Seleucids, so you won't have them wandering the desert as much (from what I've seen on the internal versions). Though, they are still incapable of fighting on two fronts. In the last game I played, they were doing well against the Ptolemai, then Pahlav attacked them and they shifted all their effort eastward, losing Antioch, Damascus, & Edessa (and I took Asia Minor from them).
From what I've seen the AI still can't fight too well on multiple fronts in M2TW either. Sometimes they even choose the stupidest front to dedicate themselves too, as well. One time I saw England put all of its effort into defending Oslo. France and HRE took their continental holdings and Scotland took nearly the whole British Isles, but Oslo was well defended. :sweatdrop:
I wish, for example, the AI couldn't change their capital and they would put all their effort into defending their capital to the death.
Actually I'd rather wish we could somehow designate "priority cities" for the different factions. If they have the city under control they will focus on defending it, but if the enemy has it they will focus on reclaiming it.Quote:
Originally Posted by MarcusAureliusAntoninus
Seleukids would be Antioch, Seleukeia at least and probably Ekbatana & Susa as well.
Second!
In my Mak-campaign of which I'm sure I told everybody so far, the dirty Romans betrayed me, and I decided to punish them. For that purpose I had a full stack of mostly Celtic mercenaries with whom I rampaged through all of northern Italy, sacking Mediolanum, Segesta, Bononia, Ariminum and Arretium. Arretium was their capital at this time because Roma was once taken by the Epeirotes after I drove them out of Hellas and thus Arretium stayed place of the Senate although Roma was reconquered.
Well, after sacking Arretium, their new Capital was now... no, not Roma, Rhegion! In the meanwhile I landed a full professional Royal Army plus Reserve Division in Southern Italy, and I conquered Taras, and Arpi with the Celtic remnants, and then my Kleronomos Basileios conquered Rhegion. And guess where the honorable Senate decided to meet from then on? No, not Roma... Segesta! That means when I finally conquer Roma, it'll be just another Italian city...
In reality, Rome as a faction could barely survive if Rome would have been taken.
I think the AI unit feature I'd like to see is "don't start a war with another faction voluntarily if you're already at war within five provinces in any direction".
From 272 to 125BC, Massilia (not Massila !!!!) was a regional power of importance, both economically and culturally. The greeks of that city had alliances with both Emporion and Sagunta in Spain, while establishing good relations with Rome.
We have only sources for the Roman point of view on this Alliance, but archeologists I met in Emporion stressed that Massilian influence is much more visible in "Greek Spain" than Roman. (founded on 3rd century coinage and ceramics)
Hannibal wisely chose to bypass Massilia by the North before crossing the alps.
For all these reasons, Massilia (or Western Mediterranean Greek) faction could be an interesting challenge.
Massilia is a pretty bad choice compared to many other factions in terms of military, influence and importance, so the EB team scrapped it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Philip of Massalia
This might be interesting when it comes to influencing expansion directions, but I don't know how much was coincidence.
to add to the current faction list?
I would say something to give the Carthaginians and Egyptains to fight in Africa, perhaps another eastern faction, and someone to stop the Sweboz from overrunning everyone else. Also the Illyrians seem to be a very interesting group, i think it'd be worth looking into that...
perhaps...
Chatti / Chasuarii = Germanic rival faction to Sweboz
Illyria / Dalmatae / Scodrans = Illyrian faction to pose problems for later Romans and Eporite expansion
Cyrenaica / Libya = pose commercial and military rival of Kart-hadast and Ptolemaioi
Chandraguptan /NW India = pose a problem for Sleucids and Baktrians trying to expand into India, but they should beware of potential Saka or Parthian invasion
These will probably be small factions so some perks should be considered...
perhaps the Chatti can have a slightly different set of units from the Sweboz, and as their military organization was known so perhaps this can be shown through increase discipline and better supplying of armies?Illyria can perhaps have the best (cheapest?) navy of all barbarian factions and make use of the Thracian peltasti style of warfare, the Greek style of hoplites, as well as their own? They will of course begin somewhat weak, like the Getai.
Cyrenaica can be a greek influenced trade-power. With a unique blend of many native libyans auxiliaries and greeks.Chandraguptans will have the great repetoire of Indian armies and can have a homeland arrangement where they get missions and bonuses from the off-map capital of Pataliputra
looking back in this thread I have foudn that these 4 have been mentioned but I don't know how well they will be recieved... but thats another vote for Indian, Chatti, Illyria, and Cyrene! :yes:
Cyrene wouldn't be a very good choice due to gameplay factors. They would have one rebel town to take (and if we need a new province somewhere Augilia is the first to go, so they would have nothing to take), then they would be sandwiched between two huge empires and would be a small bump in the road.
"Due to gameplay factors?" If they're imported enough to be considered (and I'll admit I don't know if they are) then that shouldn't be a reason. They would be playable by humans, which would be enough I would have thought.
The important thing to remember at this point is that there is very little between the factions when it gets to this point, if judging on the normal factors; gameplay must become a factor to decide between them.
Foot
True; I guess after the first few new factions are added the most important ones are included, and the rest is almost filler.
It is. Most of the remaining factions can be portrayed very nearly as well through eleutheroi assistance methods we've been developing. The main reason for making them factions is to add some flavor to your gameplay options, and get a little bit more AI versatility out of their regions, compared to what we'd get from eleutheroi mini-factions.
That said, gameplay reasons are still one of the last things we consider. So say we're talking about two factions, if they get through a whole gauntlet of historical considerations without a clear winner, only then does gameplay really become a relevant concern. That's pretty much what happened with a faction like Kyrenaia, which technically still has a shot at making EB2. By our consideration, Kyrenaia had similar economic, cultural, and military power to some other potential factions, though it historically lacked the staying power of any of our other factions (being absorbed into the Ptolemaic kingdom a few decades into the game). That last aspect was already weakening them, but when we considered that they would have little to no expansion options outside of war with juggernaut factions to the east and west...well, the odds got pretty bad for dear ol Kyrenaia.
But then, wouldn't it be feasible to include the Yuezhi as an emerging faction in the East? I can understand the reluctance to use such a feature anywhere else on the map, since the history leading to a potential emergence is totally different after the first few turns. But the Yuezhi emerging hinges on factors outside the campaign map and anything happening there, and they did play a massive role in the east of the map.
Just my thoughts. I know EB isn't planning to include emerging factions, but in this case I think an exception would be worthwhile. definitely if a number of other possible contenders may as well be portrayed by (assisted) rebels.
if gameplay factors come into consideration, would you consider a public vote to gauge popularity of some of the factions, taken from a shorltlist which you guys have already drawn up based on what is historically feasible. (i.e from the sounds of it a scandinavian faction + extra german faction, despite being popular would most likely not make the shortlist due to historical and/or map considerations)Quote:
Originally Posted by paullus
If we were to do such a thing, it would need to be a poll where the public couldn't see the results, so as to fit with our modus operandi. ;)
The Yuezhi are an interesting case.
After playing a string of European campaigns, I'd like to add a third faction suggestion after the Helleno-Skythians and Syracuse: the Boii.
Based on their EB1 incarnation: their military mix is different from existing factions, they have numbers and wealth (mines), and they have a defensible capital. I've seen the Romani, Sweboz, Epeirotes, and Getai hit their borders or their walls at roughly the same time, which is a good mix of opposition (sword and spear infantry, skirmishers, light and heavy cavalry, sarissa phalanxes, horse archers...).
So they look like a pretty interesting faction to play, with their own military and multiple styles of opposition, and some room to expand and prosper. They bring something new to the mod, unlike say Pergamon which is pretty much KH2 (classical Greek military hemmed in by successor types). And as an AI faction they'd provide the oft-requested check on the Sweboz.
Also, I think I remember some of the EB team saying that there's relatively good historical information on them, and that they were more unified/organised than most candidates in that area at the start date.
Excellent find Geof, but will it work in MIITW?Quote:
Originally Posted by Geoffrey S
R
I'm thinking;
Bastarnoz
Kimbrioz
Gotanoz
Brigantae
Boii
Syracuse
Galatia
Bosphorus
That's probably 2 too many Germanic factions, but one can dream.
It's more of a nightmare, isn't it? ~;)
It's a pity that Massilia is dismissed, I understand your reasons but on the map it would be a so easily defendable merchant city. Perhaps Rhodos could be a faction...? Ok, I'm already quiet.:tomato2:
I think the EB team should reconsider factions like Massillia, Syracuse, and Cyrene.
If the main reasons are lack of historical evidence, fine.
But the gameplay reasons you speak of....being a small hemmed-in faction with 1 or 2 provinces before you meet a superpower.
Those are often the funnest factions to play. I used to love Serbia in the XL mod of M:TW simply for that reason!
Personally, I think factions like Ptolemaioi and Arche Seleukiea can be harder than smaller factions....there's so much to do and take in right from the first turn of the game, it can almost feel a little overwhelming (so much so that I haven't even seriously tackled an AS campaign).
I just hope you'll remember that many of us are R:TW veterans at this point, who have lurked on these boards for years now. I think most of us will be able to take a small faction and do good things.
But if not playing as them, it might be a bit strange - especially for a player who's new to EB - to see "Faction Destroyed" after two turns. Moreover, it will ruin all the work that goes into creating that faction if the player never really has an opportunity to fight it unless he is bordering it. Not to mention that if the player were to go to war with a one-province faction, it would all be over in a turn or two, again wasting much of the team's effort as the player can't fully appreciate that faction's strengths and weaknesses.
I understand what you're saying, but I have to disagree.
I think having a faction like Syracuse (Has that ever been a playable faction in ANY mod for RTW?) would be somewhat exotic, and fail to see why Syrakousai would be so utterly defeated so quickly.
Historically, Syrakousai held out for quite some time against Carthaginian advances, although I'm not 100% on Syracusean history, I know they were a big pain in the ass for them.
Qarthadastim starts out relatively weak in Sicilia, and I fail to see why Syrakousai wouldn't have just as good of a chance of pushing them off of the island, especially if they start out with a decent field army.
I know it's really not viable, but I'd like to see a faction in Ireland. What I know of the anchient Irish is so interesting, but then I don't think they invaded other people, or had much of an army - at least not one that could compete with certain other factions.
Anyway, if you could make an Irish faction, I think the whole island would be one faction. There were different tribes, but from what I've read, it seems like Ireland was pretty unified until whatever happened in the north.
I really didn't know Syrakousai had been dismissed? Where did that happen? :inquisitive:
Someone said it in here, I assumed he was part of the team. I didn't pay much attention, but he seemed to know what he was talking about. If they haven't been dismissed, awesome. Please include them....they would probably end up being one of my favorite factions.
Numidian and Syracuse are the ones I would like to see included and I dont know you guys but I really think another roman faction would be great, missing the civil wars
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tellos Athenaios
I think this is the post. Maybe there was some confussion. I do hope Bosphorean Kingdom and Caucasian Iberia is added to make the Black Sea region a little more interesting.Quote:
Originally Posted by Krusader
Still, Massilia and Syrakousai are two completely different powers.
#148
Son of Perun
Junior Member
Junior Member
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 17 Re: New factions?
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This was the post. It was in the other faction thread right under this one. I didn't pay much attention to the poster, and I have all sigs turned off to speed things up because I have dial-up on this computer, but I do have access to high-speed to dl stuff like EB :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Son of Perun
Anyways, everyone started talking like it was the truth, so I just assumed he was a member and knew what he was talking about. It's all good though, just give me Syrakousai, and I will crush the carthaginian scum.:smash: :2thumbsup:
BTW, I agree that Syrakousai and Massilia are two completely different powers.
If you include Massilia, then arguments could be made for any greek colony....How about Emporion as a faction? :P
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bootsiuv
Errm. Krusader is a member, so Massilia is quite definitely not going to be in EB II. Fortunately no member has said anything about Syracuse so we can still continue to speculate their inclusion.Quote:
Originally Posted by Krusader
:edit: Corrected the quote.
emporion would be part othe massilia kingdom perhaps ...Quote:
Originally Posted by Bootsiuv
anyway i don´t see why a western mediterranean greek kingdom would be so far fetched an alliance beteween massilia and syracuse to reconquer sardinia and corsica back from the poenii
since the 6th century bc greeks and poenii had a standing war wich was what allowed carthage to become the poenii superpower by being the defender of punic interests against the greek expansionists (peace treaties beteween massilia and carthage interests are well know the same for the wars beteween carthage and syracuse)
the 1st punic war happened to stop the poenii from cutting of the mediterrenean in two (conquering messina would mean there was no available passage beteween the western and eastern mediterranean unleass you bowed down to the poenii since the other passage was beteween lilibeo and carthage itself)
probably that can be the syracusean victory conditions to reconquer all the greek lands stolen by the poenii (the islands my friends the islands)
Why on earth did you respond to a two-year old post? The discussion has moved on since then in other threads.
Might I politely suggest that if the forum moderators do not like old threads being responded to that they consider "closing" them.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ludens
What's the point? It's like answering a question about two weeks after someone has asked it to you.
Refer to this thread.Quote:
probably that can be the syracusean victory conditions to reconquer all the greek lands stolen by the poenii (the islands my friends the islands)
This is most unfortunate.Quote:
Originally Posted by Krusader
Unless there are free unit slots available, there shouldn't be any new factions then, because it would take away units from existing factions.
Is there a way to mod the .exe so that more than 500 units can be memorized by the game?
This, after all, is a mod and no profit is made with it, only fun with history.
- My first suggestion of a faction is the Gladiator uprising of Spartacus.
The faction-specific infantry would be perhaps 5 different types of gladiators, maybe 7 ?
You'd get more advanced units as gladiator schools are upgraded.
Gladiator training would only take one round, but their combat statistics can be upgraded by retraining them in buildings.
You'd also get to train existing Celtic units, Thraikian units and some Germanic units, since those races were the main components of gladiators.
Other than that, units would come from mercenaries.
Also, Spartacus and his generals would be able to persuade units to defect from the enemy army (either the entire army, or some units from the enemy army). I have no idea how this could be implemented, it can certainly be done with some programming. So the Spartacus and his generals would have a charisma level, and the opposing army would have a charisma level, and then some random flips of coin.
The campaign would start in 73 BC, with Rome already expanded in Hispania in the West (Sertorius has a split-away kingdom in Iberia), and Pontos in the East (Rome at war with Mithridates). Spartacus' faction would start as a horde outside Capua. (is hording possible in M2TW?)
Maybe this could be made into a separate provincial campaign, a specially-designed campaign (maybe even with a different map, more zoomed in?). That way, some far-away factions can be eliminated, so that the Spartacus faction would have more faction-specific units.- My other suggestion is, the Palmyrene Empire in 260 AD.
- My third suggestion is, a second Germanic faction, or a second Iberian faction (see the mod "Iberia Total War" for detailed Iberian factions, there are 4 or 5).
If so, then they need different campaign music, to show that they are from a different faction.- My 4th suggestion is the Numidians.
- My 5th suggestion is, the Galatians. However, this doesn't have to be in the grand campaign. This could also be a separate, provincial campaign. Otherwise, there would be 3 Gallic factions, and it would occupy a precious faction slot. In a separate, provincial campaign, you could start as the Galatians in Galatia, and the Aedui and the Arverni can be combined into one "Gaul" faction (with an option of permanent alliance, so that if you wiped out all the other factions on the map, except that other Gaul faction, then your campaign is victorious, and you don't have to go to war against the last faction.)
- My 6th suggestion is, Illyria. The faction should start with a fleet of pirate ships, carrying troops. That way, you can raid the coast of Italy, or other places. The faction should have rapid and cheap construction of ships.
- My 7th suggestion is, a separate provincial campaign starting in a year when there were more than one faction ruling Roman territories, like Sertorius in Iberia in 73 BC, or "the year of 4 emperors" in 69 AD.
As far as I know, that would be illegal (hence some things are described as "hardcoded").Quote:
Originally Posted by ThePianist
Also, EB [II] depicts the world as it was in 272BC and they have decided against (iirc) the use of emergent factions.
I prefer to keep old threads open so that people can present new information or perspectives on old discussions. That helps keep the information in one place. However, in this case there are two newer threads on the subject, so I want to know why moonburn posted here.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gray_Lensman
Correct on both counts, although, to be stricly correct, you cannot mod the .exe. Modding is changing the data files; changing the .exe falls under programming. Also, changing the .exe file is not in itself illegal, but distributing altered copies (or unaltered ones for that matter) is, as you are giving away free copies of SEGA's program.Quote:
Originally Posted by The General
Med2 allows 31 factions... Also i think it's enought to represent all the ancient powers of this time.
I'm right when I say Parthia will be included ?
The Partians (Pahlavans) are already in EB1, and all EB1 factions will be included (although I think some may be given an overhaul). Keep in mind that one of those 31 factions is going to be the "rebel" faction.Quote:
Originally Posted by Caulaincourt
EB1 factions are thus:
1. Lusotann
2. Kart-Hadast
3. Romani
4. Aedui
5. Arverni
6. Casse
7. Sweboz
8. Getai
9. Epirotes
10. Koinon Hellenon
11. Makedonia
12. Ptolemaioi
13. Arche Seleukia
14. Pontos
15. Sauromatae
16. Saka
17. Pahlava
18. Baktria
19. Hayasdan
20. Saba
Next is Rebel Faction
21. Rebels
Next are two confirmed factions
22. Massaelyian (sp?) Numidians
23. Pergamon
That leaves 8 slots to fill
Some logical ones would be:
Boii
Belgae tribe, dont know which
Brigantes
Arevaci or another Celt-Iberian tribe
Syracuse
Chatti, Churusci, Marcomanni or some other Germanic tribe
Caucasian Iberia
Atropatene
Galatian tribe
Out of all those I would guess Brigantes probably the least likely to get in just because of limited knowledge of warfare and culture in the British Isles at the time. Which leaves...8! Im gonna guess at least 4 are right. :)
Atropatene'd be killed in 2 turns by either the Seleukids or the hay
From my poll a while ago,
One of the team members (Moros) said that five of these are factions in EBII, I've also crossed off other factions that were discounted in other threads.Quote:
Arevaci - A celtiberian tribe
Érainn - A Goidelic (irish) tribe
Aquitanians/Vascones - Non Celtic speaking peoples of southwestern france and northeastern iberia, ancestors of the Basques.
Illegert - a heavily celticised iberian tribe from north eastern iberia (around emporion)
Nervii - A belgic tribe with germannic influences
Brigantes - Powerful british tribe residing in northern england.
Helvetii - Celtic tribe from the alps
Massalia - Greek city state in southern france (modern day marseille)
Ligures - A highly celticised italic people in north west italia
Syracuse - A greek city state in sicily
Boii - A Powerful celtic tribe in eastern central europe (modern day Bohemia)
Lugii - Germanic or slavic tribe in eastern central europe (modern day poland and germany)
Dalmatae - Illyrian tribe
Skordiskoi - Powerful celtic tribe in the balkans (modern day serbia and surrounding areas)
Rhaetians - Alpine tribe with either Celtic or Etruscan roots, or both
Tylis - Celtic kingdom ruling over majority thracian population in southeast balkans.
Bosporan Kingdom - Hellenic kingdom on the north coast of the black sea (modern day Crimea)
Galatia/Bythinia - Celtic kingdom in union with hellenic kingdom (modern day turkey)
Kappadoika - Persian sucessor kingdom, Rebelious satrap of the seleukids(eastern anatolia)
Kartli - Also know as Caucasian Iberia, main rival for the Hai, native Caucasus people, ancestors of modern day georgians.
Atropatene - Persian sucessor kingdom, eastern caucasuses (modern day Azerbaijan)
Nabateans - Semitic Arab Kingdom in the Sinai
Palmyrae - Arab kingdom in modern day syria
Massaesylians - Main rival of the Masaesyli and other major tribal power in numidia
Maures - African kingdom in modern day Mauritania. Ancestors of the Moors
Qataban - Southern arabian state in modern day yemen.
Hadrumaut - Another southern arabian state in modern day yemen.
Massagetae - powerful nomadic tribe in central asia, lie north of the Pahlava.
Kamboja's - Iranian people in northwestern india/hindu kush
If i was to hazard a guess the five from here would be: Arevaci, Boii, Bosporan Kingdom, Kartli and Nabataeans.
My hopes would be Boii and Lugii, because some activity is badly needed east of Sweboz. Illegert would add some action between Gaul and Lusota/Carthage, whilst fusing Gallic and Iberian troops without requiring much unique. Bosphoron Kingdom would also add some interest to the north of the Black Sea. I'd prefer something more south-east in the Selucid region, but of all the choices there Atropatene sounds the most promising in that region.
I really dont like the look of any of the others; they're generally adding nothing to already crowded areas. The addition of Pergamon doesnt fill me with confidence on this point unfortunately; nations should only be added if they fill a genuinly useful game niche, not simply because they historically existed.
The Boii and Lugii seems very possible, would like a Batavian unit though, seeing how specific units are mostly given to units who did or had something special they may be more worthy then a Chauci unit.
Yeah thats why Galatia or Kappadoika aren't very likely in my eyes as Anatolia is crowded enough as it is (5 factions, 6 if you count KH as well) Mind you the criteria for becoming a faction involves things such as expansionistic tendencies, good historical information etc which means we're unlikely to see factions in some of the more empty parts of the map (like the baltic region).Quote:
Originally Posted by WarpGhost
I know I talk about this all the time and I've brought it up before, but what is the reason for keeping the Casse? I really don't remember.
As far as I understand (and I may be wrong, feel free to correct me) but not only were the Isles not unified politically, but they didn't do much of anything off of their island.
If you have a Casse faction, the first thing the player will do is unify the island, probably conquer Ireland. Then we're left with essentially a colonial-era Great Britain, earning piles of dough, and sending military excursions over the channel to conquer Europe. Doesn't that seem weird/wrong to anyone else?
I don't understand how you can consider any political institution in Britain at the time significant enough to warrant a faction. Anyone want to clear this up for me? (again...?)
You could argue the same thing for Hay or Baktria. Both stuck between Seleucids and another faction. (Sauromatae and Saka respectively)Quote:
Originally Posted by Skullheadhq
I suppose Atropatene would have less room to expand however.
Oops I forogot to mention Bosporans in my first post. Oh well, maybe scratching Atropatene wouldnt be such a bad idea.:dizzy2:
In terms of keeping the Casse, it ensures that Britain is not a joke to take as the Sweboz or Gallic factions. Historically, you are correct, no tribe united the isle before the Romans arrived. However its addition imo is merited both to make the isle harder to take and also because British tribes did lend money and possibly troops to help their Gallic and Belgic allies during Caesars wars in Gaul.
Also, remember the game is about presenting the situation at 272 and letting everything go from there. What did or didn't happen makes no difference.
Well then cut britain out? Leaves more provinces for the rest.Quote:
Originally Posted by Brave Brave Sir Robin
Andis not entirely true. The importance of a faction after 272 does influence the consideration wether a faction is included or not.Quote:
Originally Posted by Brave Brave Sir Robin
Well, Epeiros was largely gone after 272BC....Quote:
Originally Posted by ziegenpeter
Eh? The Aiakid line lasted until 231bc, then the Eproite League until 167bc thats hardly "largely gone"